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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » New adventures in electoral systems. Approval voting

This is an intriguing experiment. The winner should be the candidate who most voters approve of. So it encourages centrism and hardliners to be flexible.
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It begs another question too, in assuming the highest approval ratings accrue to centrists. Isn't Jeremy Corbyn the most popular Labour figure, while Boris and JRM are prominent in the Tory lists?
Although in a very red or blue constituency this presumably would also have the effect of forcing the people representing that area to move left or right if they are more centrist than their electorate.
The problem is when people say centrist they are often imagine a set of policies and particular people that don't necessarily represent the centre ground of politics or what the voters actually want, just what some people imagine to be a moderate middle path between competing options.
So whilst a system like this could produce representation closer to what the centre of opinion is within individual constituencies it might not produce what a lot of people talk of as centrism.
Whatever our political differences, and whatever our personal view on war, we should all take a moment today to remember the stories of those who went to serve their country and didn’t make it home. They made the ultimate sacrifice so that we could be free. Lest we forget.
Requiescat in pace.
If they decide to vote only for the ideologically pure, they could well see their vote rendered irrelevant by more flexible citizens. So they might need to hold their noses and give the nod to other candidates in order to try to exclude the really unacceptable choices.
I suspect it's the opposite of what Alastair suggests. Let's suppose the candidates were as follows:
Left
Centre
Centre
Centre
Centre
Right
Very simplistic, I know, but it's the centrists who will have to compromise. It's the centrists who have unacceptable choices. To the Left and Right, the Centrists are just as unacceptable.
I can't see it going far, Fargo.
The re-unification of Germany was a tragic error, in fact the 3 occupation zones of Germany post WW2 controlled by the Western allies should have been re-constituted as 3 separate states, rather than being amalgamated into the single state of West Germany.
Europe's highest court will decide this month whether the UK has the power to reverse Article 50, its notice of intention to leave the EU.
Theresa May could be handed the power to unilaterally reverse Brexit after a court refused an appeal by her government to block a landmark case on the issue being referred to European courts.
"The government must now focus on meeting the promises made to voters in the Referendum campaign. If it cannot deliver that deal the people must be asked again because it has no mandate to drive the country off a cliff."
http://uk.businessinsider.com/theresa-may-fails-block-case-allow-uk-to-stop-brexit-50-article-2018-11?utm_source=quora&utm_medium=referral&r=US&IR=T
Mr. JohnL, quite.
F1: will check shortly to see what penalties have been dished out.
All-parish elections where the whole council is elected at once are closest to operating this way - often there is only one or two more candidates than places (such as ten candidates for eight places), and voters have eight votes. Although it's FPTP, voters aren't obliged to use all eight votes and often don't, if they don't know all the individuals. Indeed if you want a particular person elected the optimum strategy is to use just one of your votes.
I guess you could also have disapproval voting, where voters mark anyone they don't want, and those with the least disapproval are elected?
The point about the party machine doesn't really make sense - popular local candidates can stand as independents against their party now; what stops them is the tendency of voters to use the party label as a substitute in the absence of knowing the individual. The same could happen in approval voting.
You still have the EU backwards. The Germans are so enthusiastic about it because it means they cannot dominate the continent on their own. This is also why they are adhering to rigid processes and stupid judgements rather than real life and common sense.
I'm also surprised after Alistair's comments on the last thread that he went with a Superheros voting page. Or was that the good Mr Eagles' contribution?
.....
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!?
My gast is flabbered.
Which is why I suspect the Eurojudges will decide it is a one-off notice that cannot be universally withdrawn.
Nothing at all for Hamilton either.
What's going on? Is the Illumanti involved?
So their actions seem likely to bring about the very things they claim to detest. I am probably missing something though .........
A thank you to Mr Meeks for his article. I rather feel though that the method of voting is rather less important than the abysmal quality of politicians we have to vote for.
They are also probably calculating that it is unlikely an election under such circumstances would see Corbyn come to power.
These are both - courageous - assumptions, but then we are talking about Arlene Foster here.
Yes the DUP are rolling the dice but it doesn't necessarily lead to Corbyn
However, I can no longer see how May brings the 50-odd hardline ERGers and Determined Remainers on board for the vote.
So as things stand, May will lose the vote.
What can she offer to get it through?
A referendum promise would bring the Determined Remainers on side, peel off some Labour votes (the Chukas), and even the LDs too.
I can’t see a realistic route to another election, and perhaps the DUP cannot either.
Good - Kills tired old electoral arguments such as "don't split the vote" or "only x can beat y in z-ville". Stops party machines blocking genuinely popular local candidates, or small well-organised sects from seizing control of party machines and imposing their ideology on candidates.
Bad - System rewards tactical voting. Encourages negative campaigning and divisions. Inaccurately reflects voter preferences.
Approval isn't a binary metric, but will lie on a scale. So a voter might prefer the Left Party, and then second the Centre Party. If they live in a Left stronghold then they should vote only for the Left Party. Voting for the Left and the Centre gives the Centre a chance to beat the Left with the votes of Right Party voters too. In a constituency that leans Right the Left voter should probably vote Centre to have the greatest chance of beating the Right, but that would also stymie the chance of the Left winning the seat in a strong year for the Left.
The voter has to guess what other voters will do to make the choice that will result in their preferred outcome.
I think Approval Voting is one of those rare electoral systems that is worse than the Alternative Vote, where the voter can give their preference vote and so can vote for who they prefer to win any two candidate run-off.
I'm still a Single Stochastic Vote supporter.
Naturally the DUP is repelled by Corbyn's sympathy for a united Ireland. But that's not currently on the agenda, whereas a potential GB/NI split very much is. I can't see them voting for a Corbyn government, but avoiding it is only a second-order objective for them.
If Corbyn becomes PM, there will be a border poll in the same term.
DUP will not countenance a Corbyn-led Labour government.
Mind you, I'm not sure it's the job of the electoral system to promote centrism per se. As Alastair points out, this can promote mediocrity disguised as inoffensiveness. Polite radicals can be a good thing.
https://twitter.com/johnsimpsonnews/status/1061312163703328768?s=21
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/nov/11/brexit-whistleblower-shahmir-sanni-taxpayers-alliance-concedes-it-launched-smears
https://twitter.com/jonswaine/status/1061020792618696709?s=21
There are some seriously odd posts on this thread this morning.
https://www.iam-media.com/law-policy/acting-attorney-general-sat-board-florida-company-ran-patent-filing-scam
Should help the Lib Dems immensely
I see the anti -German loons are out this morning. If there is one thing that we have learnt in the last 2years it is that German car makers do not pull the strings. The Brexiteers have a rather odd idea of a schrodingers Germany, simultaneously all powerful and united in neocoloniaism, and bitterly divided with no sense of national purpose. The reality is simpler, Germany is merely a successful economy interested only in peace and sound economies.
Still, I think that the fact that you have to start in politics at about the age of 13 to get on is the political equivalent of the Law Society dullards you describe. Anyone with a bit of liveliness and individualism is doing other things and by the time they have something to offer, they are seen as too old or unbiddable to be put forward as people worth voting for.
“It is incredibly unusual for a respondent to make a complete concession on liability as the respondent has here. To wave a white flag to avoid disclosing documents and giving evidence in court is really unusual. They conceded everything. How does an ostensibly private company come to be working with Downing Street? What is their relationship? Who are their funders?
“If this had been fully ventilated in a public trial we could have found these things out.
Betting Post
F1: pre-race ramble up:
http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.com/2018/11/brazil-pre-race-2018.html
Nothing caught my eye, really. But I've offered tips on every race since late 2009, so...
Backed Magnussen at 7.5 to be winner without the top 6 (each way, third the odds top 2). He had the pace for Q3, it was misjudgement to sit in the garage that stopped him reaching it. As it stands, he'll get choice of tyre, in a car that's at the sharp end of the midfield.
Must admit, I forgot until fairly late on that the Ferraris start on the soft tyres. Might've paid more attention to Raikkonen each way at 13 had I remembered.
The weaker party gets none of the credit and all of the blame in a Coalition.
I'm not a fan of the TPA or the Adam Smith Institute, but have always been willing to give the IEA a hearing. The extent of coordination between these groups was altogether news to me, especially in what seems to have been a very disturbing enterprise.
It has often been remarked that the Germans and the British are squabbling cousins - it is the French who are the real enemy of both
Have a good morning.
I have an eight foot horn with my name on it. TTFN.
For example Fascist, Conservative, Liberal, Social Democrat, Socialist, Communist
The government won't challenge voters' on this. Hence the unrealistic negotiating position. This will go to a crisis IMO.
https://twitter.com/DavidHenigUK/status/1061557213918060544
https://twitter.com/DavidHenigUK/status/1061557601241124864
https://twitter.com/DavidHenigUK/status/1061558166742274050
In fact Sky News has just showed him arriving by the Arc de Triomphe