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To you lurkers, why not take the final few Steps to delurking? I’m sure your contributions won’t be Better Best Forgotten. It’ll be a Tragedy if 5,6.7,8 lurkers don’t delurk.
Comments
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I was about to have another drink: Maybe not....
:yawn:0 -
Good evening, everyone.
It's interesting how certain Roman chaps (Mark Anthony, Pompey) still have, effectively, Anglicised names (in common usage).
I wonder if Miliband could be a modern day Jovian. In Ammianus Marcellinus' history, Jovian is emperor just long enough to concede a cowardly and ruinous treaty with Sapor (reasonably sure that's more commonly written Shapur) before dying of unexplained causes.0 -
David Cameron: We are still a green government.
Yeh, green, like mouldy cheese; the spores are spreading.
Why does Cammo keep declaiming inanities?0 -
3. Young whippersnapper forgetting 1929.0
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So who will be the Ramsay MacDonald de nos jours in 2017?EPG said:3. Young whippersnapper forgetting 1929.
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More likely to be 1974. Unpopular Tory ousted by Labour party short on ideas.EPG said:
3. Young whippersnapper forgetting 1929.
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Ahem. Mark Antony. No h. Anthony is a Greek bastardisation on the mistaken etymology that it has something to do with the Greek ἄνθος, "flower".Morris_Dancer said:Good evening, everyone.
It's interesting how certain Roman chaps (Mark Anthony, Pompey) still have, effectively, Anglicised names (in common usage).0 -
Sorry, Mr. Lilburne. It's a bit on the recent side (that said, I'm aware that Marcellinus' history covers the 4th century, which is practically modern).
Those pesky Greeks.0 -
I feel unpatriotic for link 7.0
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I was in the Cambridge Union a few weeks ago for a Christmas party. The place was bedecked as Hogwarts, complete with 'floating' candles and owls delivering letters. Oh, and we were sorted into houses using a talking hat.
Russell Brand would definitely be a Slytherin. He has the look. In fact, he does look rather like the illegitimate love-child of Gregory Goyle and Hestia Carrow.0 -
First post off my iphone after downloading google.
The combined scores for the leaders is quite funny. Is it so surprising even an absurd party like UKIP is doing so well at the moment?0 -
One anglicisation of a Roman name that has gone out of favour is that of Marcus Tullius Cicero, who was known to our ancestors, rather cutely, as Tully. But maybe it is too cute a name for someone who, as consul, was a bit of a bastard when it came to putting down the Catiline conspiracy (and was himself proscribed and murdered by the Second Triumvirate)Morris_Dancer said:Sorry, Mr. Lilburne. It's a bit on the recent side (that said, I'm aware that Marcellinus' history covers the 4th century, which is practically modern).
Those pesky Greeks.
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What does she see in him? The first mistress and the mother of his kids are fairly easy on the eye too. He may be completely useless at running a country but he has some talents.TheScreamingEagles said:I feel unpatriotic for link 7.
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Mr. Lilburne, I knew Tully rang a bell (it's a House in A Song of Ice and Fire).
Alas, the end of the republic found a great many chaps who were a bit of a bastard. Not a Camillus in sight.0 -
So Julie Gayet, what first attracted to you to the President of France?DavidL said:
What does she see in him? The first mistress and the mother of his kids are fairly easy on the eye too. He may be completely useless at running a country but he has some talents.TheScreamingEagles said:I feel unpatriotic for link 7.
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It's a legitimate question. His polling makes Ed's look good.TheScreamingEagles said:
So Julie Gayet, what first attracted to you to the President of France?DavidL said:
What does she see in him? The first mistress and the mother of his kids are fairly easy on the eye too. He may be completely useless at running a country but he has some talents.TheScreamingEagles said:I feel unpatriotic for link 7.
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Not to mention completely off their trollies, like the aforementioned Marcus Antonius. The fact that he named his children Alexander Helios and Cleopatra Selene is an example of how far he had wandered off the path of Roman republican righteousness.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Lilburne, I knew Tully rang a bell (it's a House in A Song of Ice and Fire).
Alas, the end of the republic found a great many chaps who were a bit of a bastard. Not a Camillus in sight.
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I would guess money and/or power, although he might just have a big one.TheScreamingEagles said:
So Julie Gayet, what first attracted to you to the President of France?DavidL said:
What does she see in him? The first mistress and the mother of his kids are fairly easy on the eye too. He may be completely useless at running a country but he has some talents.TheScreamingEagles said:I feel unpatriotic for link 7.
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DavidL/JohnLilburne
It could always be down to charm, charisma and a sense of humour.0 -
Mr. Lilburne, I was unaware of his children's names. He was rather besotted, if memory serves.
I do admire the pathological patriotism of the earlier republican Romans. One wonders what a modern country with that kind of brutal selflessness could achieve. It's just one of many reasons I like reading about the Second Punic War so much. The Romans were crazy to continue. I calculated once that Cannae was the equivalent of a battle outside London killing 200 MPs or so and the PM or monarch (one consul died). One battle, after being butchered at Trasimene and losing at Trebia and Ticinus.
I think we can learn a huge amount from that period, not least the difference between the state as an instrument of civilising influence, and as an overmighty and intrusive force. The divergence between the Rome of the Second Punic War and the one infested with delators (informers) for Tiberius and Sejanus was stark.
Bit rambly. Sorry.0 -
I know, I'm a cynic. I shouldn't be as I recently had a relationship with a woman 29 years my junior, and it certainly wasn't due to money or power.TheScreamingEagles said:DavidL/JohnLilburne
It could always be down to charm, charisma and a sense of humour.
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Sun Politics @Sun_Politics 52s
YouGov/Sun poll tonight: Labour lead falls to three points: CON 34%, LAB 37%, LD 9%, UKIP 13%0 -
Mr. Lilburne, you silver fox, you!0
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As someone who is no oil painting, but convinced far too many beautiful women to date me, it's my charm and sense of humour that always works.JohnLilburne said:
I know, I'm a cynic. I shouldn't be as I recently had a relationship with a woman 29 years my junior, and it certainly wasn't due to money or power.TheScreamingEagles said:DavidL/JohnLilburne
It could always be down to charm, charisma and a sense of humour.
And my sense of humour that has occasionally got me dumped.0 -
His economic policies are pretty funny. Unless you are French obviously0
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He does give hope to ageing, balding, podgy, politically obsessed men everywhere, if not to the people of France!TheScreamingEagles said:
DavidL/JohnLilburne
It could always be down to charm, charisma and a sense of humour.0 -
His economic policies are great.DavidL said:His economic policies are pretty funny. Unless you are French on obviously.
I read somewhere a few weeks ago, that more and French people are coming over here to avoid his tax policies.
This invasion could have the same effect upon as the Norman Invasion.0 -
Anyway, I'm off for the night. Hmm. Maybe in the future I should see about reading up more on the decline of the republic.0
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How long before the first drone appears to claim the PB Tories are getting over excited?TheScreamingEagles said:Sun Politics @Sun_Politics 52s
YouGov/Sun poll tonight: Labour lead falls to three points: CON 34%, LAB 37%, LD 9%, UKIP 13%
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There was a journalist called Mark Tully, presumably named by a fervent classicist.JohnLilburne said:
One anglicisation of a Roman name that has gone out of favour is that of Marcus Tullius Cicero, who was known to our ancestors, rather cutely, as Tully. But maybe it is too cute a name for someone who, as consul, was a bit of a bastard when it came to putting down the Catiline conspiracy (and was himself proscribed and murdered by the Second Triumvirate)Morris_Dancer said:Sorry, Mr. Lilburne. It's a bit on the recent side (that said, I'm aware that Marcellinus' history covers the 4th century, which is practically modern).
Those pesky Greeks.
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Alas, I have never been very good at the chatting up or dating game. It's always been a bit hit or miss for me, mostly miss.TheScreamingEagles said:
As someone who is no oil painting, but convinced far too many beautiful women to date me, it's my charm and sense of humour that always works.JohnLilburne said:
I know, I'm a cynic. I shouldn't be as I recently had a relationship with a woman 29 years my junior, and it certainly wasn't due to money or power.TheScreamingEagles said:DavidL/JohnLilburne
It could always be down to charm, charisma and a sense of humour.
And my sense of humour that has occasionally got me dumped.
Back to politics... I see the UKIP lead over the LDs is back up to 4%, today's poll had it down to 1% but recently the difference has been growing in YouGov polls. and it certainly looks like the Labour 9% lead in the Sunday Times was an outlier.
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Much as I enjoy the series, I thought it rather sad that last year, 146 Americans named their daughter Khaleesi.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Lilburne, I knew Tully rang a bell (it's a House in A Song of Ice and Fire).
Alas, the end of the republic found a great many chaps who were a bit of a bastard. Not a Camillus in sight.0 -
Lab poll leads:
Last week:
YouGov (average of 5 polls) - 6.8%
Populus - 7%
This week:
YouGov (average of 2 polls) - 4%
Populus - 5%
ICM - 3%
OK, it's only a few polls and there is always some random variation. But even so, it has to be at least somewhat encouraging for the Conservatives.0 -
Tom Newton Dunn @tnewtondunn 42s
YouGov/Sun poll tonight: Immigration now just 1 point behind the economy as the most important issue facing the country - 60% v 61%...
.only a matter of time before immigration comes top as the economy improves. MPs from all parties take note.0 -
Blinking hell, Miliband on Friday will call for a cap on the size of banks.0
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"Why does Cammo keep declaiming inanities?"
Because nobody, nobody, would want to hear what he really thinks or believes. So he has two choices talk in platitudes A level rubbish or stay silent. Unwisely in my view, he chooses the former. After all if he stopped gobbing off people could at least pretend to themselves he was a man of morals, courage and wisdom rather than having the fact that he is an amoral, vacuous PR spiv shoved down their throats.0 -
Ok this made me laugh
Dan Hodges @DPJHodges 59s
When the Tories get a poll lead the Labour Party will resemble that 'Airplane' scene when Julie Haggerty asks if there's a pilot on board...0 -
Not his fault necessarily, but French labour laws are somewhat interesting as well:DavidL said:His economic policies are pretty funny. Unless you are French obviously
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/08/business/international/french-workers-hold-goodyear-managers-over-jobs.html?pagewanted=1&src=recg&_r=0
http://www.ngrguardiannews.com/index.php/news/world-news/142856-goodyear-managers-freed-at-french-plant
I mean, haven't we all felt like kidnapping our bosses at one time or other?0 -
Rubicon, by Tom Holland, is very good.Morris_Dancer said:Anyway, I'm off for the night. Hmm. Maybe in the future I should see about reading up more on the decline of the republic.
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Well that's that then. Miliband has wiped out the City of London.TheScreamingEagles said:Blinking hell, Miliband on Friday will call for a cap on the size of banks.
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Tom Newton Dunn @tnewtondunn 2m
Ed's new big play? RT @maitlis: We understand cap on market share will be proposed around 25 percent - ed mil to say on Friday #newsnight0 -
I dont think a bit of competition between banks will wipe out the City of London.Stark_Dawning said:
Well that's that then. Miliband has wiped out the City of London.TheScreamingEagles said:Blinking hell, Miliband on Friday will call for a cap on the size of banks.
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And what will happen if a bank goes overt the 25%? The government will seize their assets? This is madness!TheScreamingEagles said:Tom Newton Dunn @tnewtondunn 2m
Ed's new big play? RT @maitlis: We understand cap on market share will be proposed around 25 percent - ed mil to say on Friday #newsnight0 -
Don't worry, Labour and Ed Balls in particular have a great record in designing a system that regulates the banking sector brilliantly.Stark_Dawning said:
And what will happen if a bank goes overt the 25%? The government will seize their assets? This is madness!TheScreamingEagles said:Tom Newton Dunn @tnewtondunn 2m
Ed's new big play? RT @maitlis: We understand cap on market share will be proposed around 25 percent - ed mil to say on Friday #newsnight0 -
Been away.. Just watching BBC and ITV on Hollande.. Oh dear bit of a car crash.. and to think ED nailed his colours to Hollande's mast.
Chortles..0 -
So Gordon saved HBOS by merging it with a reluctant Lloyds, with the promise that it could retain market share.
Now Ed wants to downsize Lloyds HBOS.
Who can say that Ed has not broken with the past?TheScreamingEagles said:Tom Newton Dunn @tnewtondunn 2m
Ed's new big play? RT @maitlis: We understand cap on market share will be proposed around 25 percent - ed mil to say on Friday #newsnight0 -
Yeah: lots of second and third tier banks (like the Co-op, the Britannia, Bradford & Bingley, Northern Rock) will do wonders for us all. Still, at least there won't be lots of bankers' bonuses for him to tax. Who else is going to pay up? Oh yes: all of us.Neil said:
I dont think a bit of competition between banks will wipe out the City of London.Stark_Dawning said:
Well that's that then. Miliband has wiped out the City of London.TheScreamingEagles said:Blinking hell, Miliband on Friday will call for a cap on the size of banks.
There is a damn good report on Banking Standards by Tyrie's Parliamentary Commission. Why doesn't he read and understand that if he wants to do something sensible.
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I tutored Mark Tully's granddaughters and met him a few times. One of very few people to get a KBE and the Padma Bhushan. I found his view on Amritsar interesting http://www.newstrackindia.com/newsdetails/2014/01/14/309--I-doubt-Thatcher-played-a-role-in-Operation-Bluestar-Mark-Tully.htmlSean_F said:
There was a journalist called Mark Tully, presumably named by a fervent classicist.JohnLilburne said:
One anglicisation of a Roman name that has gone out of favour is that of Marcus Tullius Cicero, who was known to our ancestors, rather cutely, as Tully. But maybe it is too cute a name for someone who, as consul, was a bit of a bastard when it came to putting down the Catiline conspiracy (and was himself proscribed and murdered by the Second Triumvirate)Morris_Dancer said:Sorry, Mr. Lilburne. It's a bit on the recent side (that said, I'm aware that Marcellinus' history covers the 4th century, which is practically modern).
Those pesky Greeks.
Edit: and an Old Marlburian too!0 -
Did we learn nothing at all from TBTF then? Or should we all bend over and prepare to be shafted again like good little plebs?Stark_Dawning said:
Well that's that then. Miliband has wiped out the City of London.TheScreamingEagles said:Blinking hell, Miliband on Friday will call for a cap on the size of banks.
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I don't think anyone posted an answer to my political cryptic clue earlier so I'll try again..
Yes man is Scottish nut (7)0 -
TBTF?
Is that Tony Blair, Total Fail?
If so, we have learnt.Monksfield said:
Did we learn nothing at all from TBTF then? Or should we all bend over and prepare to be shafted again like good little plebs?Stark_Dawning said:
Well that's that then. Miliband has wiped out the City of London.TheScreamingEagles said:Blinking hell, Miliband on Friday will call for a cap on the size of banks.
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There have been plenty of reports bemoaning overconcentration in the banking industry and barriers to entry. Competition authorities all agree that competition is not working well for consumers. If Miliband wants to take that on then I'm sure a lot of people will be interested to hear what he has to say.Cyclefree said:
Yeah: lots of second and third tier banks (like the Co-op, the Britannia, Bradford & Bingley, Northern Rock) will do wonders for us all. Still, at least there won't be lots of bankers' bonuses for him to tax. Who else is going to pay up? Oh yes: all of us.Neil said:
I dont think a bit of competition between banks will wipe out the City of London.Stark_Dawning said:
Well that's that then. Miliband has wiped out the City of London.TheScreamingEagles said:Blinking hell, Miliband on Friday will call for a cap on the size of banks.
There is a damn good report on Banking Standards by Tyrie's Parliamentary Commission. Why doesn't he read and understand that if he wants to do something sensible.0 -
Foxinsox Although if Hollande was not president of France, his actress wife may not have found him quite as attractive!0
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Simple, good banks will be forbidden from expanding and will be forced to sell branches and transfer customers to bad banks.Stark_Dawning said:And what will happen if a bank goes overt the 25%? The government will seize their assets? This is madness!
25% market share is clearly the most any bank should have, it's not at all a number plucked out of the air without any reasonable justification.
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Too Big To Fail. As you well know. The moment that Capitalism was exposed.foxinsoxuk said:TBTF?
Is that Tony Blair, Total Fail?
If so, we have learnt.Monksfield said:
Did we learn nothing at all from TBTF then? Or should we all bend over and prepare to be shafted again like good little plebs?Stark_Dawning said:
Well that's that then. Miliband has wiped out the City of London.TheScreamingEagles said:Blinking hell, Miliband on Friday will call for a cap on the size of banks.
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Quite a lot of small banks got into trouble and needed bailing out, and quite a few big banks didn't. The size is not really the issue, it is how they are run and who is in charge that matters, as Labour's pals at the Co-op have demonstrated.Monksfield said:Too Big To Fail. As you well know. The moment that Capitalism was exposed.
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Nah. Its impossible to write on fag packets nowadays.
To get such a policy you need to use the random policy generator.
http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2007-07-13/Scott_P said:
25% of which market?glw said:
25% market share is clearly the most any bank should have, it's not at all a number plucked out of the air without any reasonable justification.
Fag packet policy. Again.0 -
Yes, HSBC didn't fail. Lloyd's wouldn't have "failed" of they hadn't been asked to buy HBOS. Barclay's never took government money.glw said:
Quite a lot of small banks got into trouble and needed bailing out, and quite a few big banks didn't. The size is not really the issue, it is how they are run and who is in charge that matters, as Labour's pals at the Co-op have demonstrated.Monksfield said:Too Big To Fail. As you well know. The moment that Capitalism was exposed.
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Maybe he wears a Chelsea strip.JohnLilburne said:
I would guess money and/or power, although he might just have a big one.TheScreamingEagles said:
So Julie Gayet, what first attracted to you to the President of France?DavidL said:
What does she see in him? The first mistress and the mother of his kids are fairly easy on the eye too. He may be completely useless at running a country but he has some talents.TheScreamingEagles said:I feel unpatriotic for link 7.
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BBC News right now has a discussion going through the newspapers. Both guests having a go at Osborne's call for EU reform as "pandering to the Right", and then agreeing that leaving the EU would be a "catastrophe". Host nods along.
Given that the British public is roughly evenly divided between eurosceptics and europhiles, has there ever, in the entire history of the BBC, been a segment where both guests agreed it was a mistake to stay in the EU, let alone a "catastrophe"?0 -
Would you mind awfully, if my account isn't one of those transferred to a bad bank.glw said:
Simple, good banks will be forbidden from expanding and will be forced to sell branches and transfer customers to bad banks.Stark_Dawning said:And what will happen if a bank goes overt the 25%? The government will seize their assets? This is madness!
25% market share is clearly the most any bank should have, it's not at all a number plucked out of the air without any reasonable justification.
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It's hardly the point is it? If RBS had been allowed to go under, the rest would have followed like a pack of cards. Let's not pretend that all banks weren't ultimately propped up by the taxpayer.rcs1000 said:
Yes, HSBC didn't fail. Lloyd's wouldn't have "failed" of they hadn't been asked to buy HBOS. Barclay's never took government money.glw said:
Quite a lot of small banks got into trouble and needed bailing out, and quite a few big banks didn't. The size is not really the issue, it is how they are run and who is in charge that matters, as Labour's pals at the Co-op have demonstrated.Monksfield said:Too Big To Fail. As you well know. The moment that Capitalism was exposed.
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There have been a lot of drivers for changes to polling since conference season. What we can say about that policy announcement (which was absolutely ridiculed here before responses in the real world started to intrude) was that (a) it set the agenda for weeks / months (b) it left the Tories struggling for a reponse and (c) it was very popular. These are maybe things we might want to bear in mind before ridiculing his latest reported announcement (before we even know what any of the details are).Scott_P said:
Yup, propelled him all the way to a 3% lead in the polls. Awesome.Neil said:
Didnt you say as much about the energy price freeze? That didnt turn out so badly for him.
Labour majority nailed on...0 -
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What we can say is that it has fundamentally had no effect whatsoever on Ed's chances of becoming PM.Neil said:
There have been a lot of drivers for changes to polling since conference season. What we can say about that policy announcement (which was absolutely ridiculed here before responses in the real world started to intrude) was that (a) it set the agenda for weeks / months (b) it left the Tories struggling for a reponse and (c) it was very popular. These are maybe things we might want to bear in mind before ridiculing his latest reported announcement (before we even know what any of the details are).
The people who ridiculed it were right.0 -
They were never ambiguous!Scott_P said:
Have you worked out the terms yet?isam said:
Are we on this Farage bet or not???!!!
Farage to appear on at least one of the leader debates I want £100 at 9/4.. I'm not a snide, I don't want paying out if he is in the audience or in the pub via video link etc
This doesn't have to be so difficult, you can say no if you like0 -
You will have to ask nicely. It is policy to transfer accounts whether you like it or not.
http://www.theguardian.com/money/2013/jun/15/lloyds-dumps-customers-tsb
One of my uncles has been forced to transfer his account, and cannot transfer it back.
Welcome to the wonderful world of banking competition.saddened said:
Would you mind awfully, if my account isn't one of those transferred to a bad bank.glw said:
Simple, good banks will be forbidden from expanding and will be forced to sell branches and transfer customers to bad banks.Stark_Dawning said:And what will happen if a bank goes overt the 25%? The government will seize their assets? This is madness!
25% market share is clearly the most any bank should have, it's not at all a number plucked out of the air without any reasonable justification.0 -
Really? Has he implemented it yet then?Neil said:
Didnt you say as much about the energy price freeze? That didnt turn out so badly for him.Scott_P said:
25% of which market?
Fag packet policy. Again.
Every stupid fad he runs with blows up in his face:
too far too fast? That went well
Cost of living crisis? Inflation 2% and average wage rises on the up
The man is an opportunist, but all the bandwagons he jumps on have already passed by.0 -
Although I think it's unfair to tar HSBC with that brushSocrates said:@Monksfield
And, of course, the emergency liquidity provided by the Bank of England...
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Except the boost he got for his energy prices move has dissipated in the polls now/within 3 months of his policy announcement,Neil said:
No doubt Labour supporters will hail this as a great strategic move like Caesar crossing the Rubicon meets Eisenhower launching Operation Overlord.
Just like they did with the energy prices cap0 -
I think you mean "the depositors of the bank were ultimately propped up by the taxpayer"Monksfield said:
It's hardly the point is it? If RBS had been allowed to go under, the rest would have followed like a pack of cards. Let's not pretend that all banks weren't ultimately propped up by the taxpayer.rcs1000 said:
Yes, HSBC didn't fail. Lloyd's wouldn't have "failed" of they hadn't been asked to buy HBOS. Barclay's never took government money.glw said:
Quite a lot of small banks got into trouble and needed bailing out, and quite a few big banks didn't. The size is not really the issue, it is how they are run and who is in charge that matters, as Labour's pals at the Co-op have demonstrated.Monksfield said:Too Big To Fail. As you well know. The moment that Capitalism was exposed.
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Yes, it will be interesting to see how the government decides which customers to move to the failing banks when their good bank breaks through the threshold. Names out of a hat perhaps. Also, what happens if your new bank account isn't so advantageous to your finances? Will Ed be doing an Obama-esque 'If you like your account you can keep your account' proclamation?glw said:Simple, good banks will be forbidden from expanding and will be forced to sell branches and transfer customers to bad banks.
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RCS 1000 But RBS was at one stage the biggest bank in the world and failed, Lehmans failed and had a branch in London and of course Barclays got bailed out by some Middle East investors. It was still Lloyds' decision to but HBOS, and HBOS was a big bank too. Of the big banks only really HSBC of the British banks got through without really needing a bail out (and of course both it and Standard Chartered got accused of some dodgy practises later on). A few smaller banks or building societies also were largely unhit, most notably Nationwide.0
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You have no idea what polls would look like if he hadnt announced a very popular, agenda-setting policy in his conference speech. Indeed I distinctly remember increased murmurings about his leadership last summer that his speech helped put to bed. I think it had a discernible positive impact on his chances of becoming PM.Scott_P said:
What we can say is that it has fundamentally had no effect whatsoever on Ed's chances of becoming PM.Neil said:
There have been a lot of drivers for changes to polling since conference season. What we can say about that policy announcement (which was absolutely ridiculed here before responses in the real world started to intrude) was that (a) it set the agenda for weeks / months (b) it left the Tories struggling for a reponse and (c) it was very popular. These are maybe things we might want to bear in mind before ridiculing his latest reported announcement (before we even know what any of the details are).
The people who ridiculed it were right.0 -
He appears to be intent on proving that Gordon Brown wasn't that bad. God help us all.nigel4england said:The man is an opportunist, but all the bandwagons he jumps on have already passed by.
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SalmondJonnyJimmy said:I don't think anyone posted an answer to my political cryptic clue earlier so I'll try again..
Yes man is Scottish nut (7)
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That's largely fair. I would point out that Barclay's did nevertheless survive without the British taxpayer spending a single pound.HYUFD said:RCS 1000 But RBS was at one stage the biggest bank in the world and failed, Lehmans failed and had a branch in London and of course Barclays got bailed out by some Middle East investors. It was still Lloyds' decision to but HBOS, and HBOS was a big bank too. Of the big banks only really HSBC of the British banks that got through without really needing a bail out (and of course both it and Standard Chartered got accused of some dodgy practises later on). A few smaller banks or building societies also were largely unhit, most notably Nationwide.
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This may have passed you by but he is still Leader of the Opposition rater than PM. You're too impatient! Give it time.nigel4england said:0 -
It kind of has turned out badly for Miliband, hence the way that this issue has evaporated now winter is upon us and its not turned out to be the lefty anticipated 2nd ice age. Despite last year's mild winter, I saw a big jump in my energy bill for both oil and electricity on the back of the two severe winters previously. But just before Christmas this year I got a vert nice and unexpected rebate from the electricity company, and I think this is the longest I have gone over the winter without having to top up the oil tank due to the fact that I have often not even bothered or needed to put the heating on during the day over the holidays or at weekends. And I doubt I am alone in noticing that my energy bills are in fact lower than I had planned for or expected them to be this year.Neil said:
Didnt you say as much about the energy price freeze? That didnt turn out so badly for him.Scott_P said:
25% of which market?
Fag packet policy. Again.0 -
Although you can always close down tour account and start a new one. This may not be possible, of course, if you are a creditor of the bankfoxinsoxuk said:You will have to ask nicely. It is policy to transfer accounts whether you like it or not.
http://www.theguardian.com/money/2013/jun/15/lloyds-dumps-customers-tsb
One of my uncles has been forced to transfer his account, and cannot transfer it back.
Welcome to the wonderful world of banking competition.saddened said:
Would you mind awfully, if my account isn't one of those transferred to a bad bank.glw said:
Simple, good banks will be forbidden from expanding and will be forced to sell branches and transfer customers to bad banks.Stark_Dawning said:And what will happen if a bank goes overt the 25%? The government will seize their assets? This is madness!
25% market share is clearly the most any bank should have, it's not at all a number plucked out of the air without any reasonable justification.
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Explain to me how it will work then.Neil said:
This may have passed you by but he is still Leader of the Opposition rater than PM. You're too impatient! Give it time.nigel4england said:0 -
Apparently he has to tranfer away from Lloyds to do so, despite having banked with Lloyds for decades.rcs1000 said:
Although you can always close down tour account and start a new one. This may not be possible, of course, if you are a creditor of the bankfoxinsoxuk said:You will have to ask nicely. It is policy to transfer accounts whether you like it or not.
http://www.theguardian.com/money/2013/jun/15/lloyds-dumps-customers-tsb
One of my uncles has been forced to transfer his account, and cannot transfer it back.
Welcome to the wonderful world of banking competition.saddened said:
Would you mind awfully, if my account isn't one of those transferred to a bad bank.glw said:
Simple, good banks will be forbidden from expanding and will be forced to sell branches and transfer customers to bad banks.Stark_Dawning said:And what will happen if a bank goes overt the 25%? The government will seize their assets? This is madness!
25% market share is clearly the most any bank should have, it's not at all a number plucked out of the air without any reasonable justification.0 -
Entirely reasonable, and a sensible way for banking to be run. Not at all bonkers and a waste of time and money.foxinsoxuk said:Apparently he has to tranfer away from Lloyds to do so, despite having banked with Lloyds for decades.
I wonder what other areas Ed will impose caps on?Stark_Dawning said:Yes, it will be interesting to see how the government decides which customers to move to the failing banks when their good bank breaks through the threshold. Names out of a hat perhaps.
Will Ford have a quota of cars to sell? Will Tesco's be forced to close their doors after serving a certain number of customers? Will TVs automatically tune to another channel if too many people are watching a certain programme? Will Liverpool have to transfer fans to Everton? Will the Conservative Party have a voter limit imposed upon it?
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Yes, HSBC was doing just fine with the funds coming in from money laundering for rogue states and drug cartels.rcs1000 said:
Although I think it's unfair to tar HSBC with that brushSocrates said:@Monksfield
And, of course, the emergency liquidity provided by the Bank of England...0 -
Neil: if Milliband is really interested in a competitive banking sector he would pay attention to what the Competition authorities have to say on the matter. It was Labour who allowed Lloyds to take on HBOS without the competition authorities being involved which resulted in the catastrophic destruction of Lloyds. As a result of that and the measures then taken to sort out the mess created, account holders and shareholders in Lloyds have lost out.
I'm an account holder in RBS and did not want to be moved against my will to Santander and nor do I want anything like that to happen in future just because of some arbitrary government decision.
There is much to be done to create a viable financial services industry but I absolutely do not trust Labour to do it, given the heavy responsibility they bear for the banking culture which was allowed to flourish for 13 years under them and the largely useless regulatory system they put in place. Labour were too in love with bankers' bonuses as a source of revenue for them to do anything effective either to protect consumers or encourage a worthwhile financial sector.
No reason to believe they have understood any of the lessons. Or that they won't make the same or equally stupid mistakes again.0 -
RCS1000 True, on that basis only Barclays and HSBC did not take government bailout money of the larger banks0
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There used to be a right to refer any company to the Monopolies and Mergers Commission if it held more than a 25% share of a defined industry, even if there was no prima facie evidence of the referred company abusing its 'monopoly' position in the marketplace.Neil said:
Didnt you say as much about the energy price freeze? That didnt turn out so badly for him.Scott_P said:
25% of which market?
Fag packet policy. Again.
The problem with banks is that they aren't, for good reason, like other competitive industries operating in a free market. If Woolworths stops selling product that people are willing to buy it goes out of business. A few commentators get nostalgic but the general public doesn't suffer. Bankruptcy or liquidation is regarded as a sign of a functioning market.
If a bank fails then the entire life savings of voters are put at risk; corporate customers stop functioning; and the markets and population panic leading to a crash in property and other asset prices.
The need to protect banks from failure means that risk management and adequate capitalisation is far more important than enforcing a highly competitive market. This has led to banking sectors becoming highly concentrated in all global markets. US banks, once restricted in function and territory, can now open branches across states and carry out a full range of banking functions. Throughout Europe, the distinction between Savings Banks, Co-operative Banks and Commercial Banks have become eroded as banks from different sectors merge and restructure.
The first priority for the UK is to stabilise our banking sector through adequate capitalisation, balance sheet restructuring where necessary, better prudential and conduct supervision, improved risk management and funding support which allows lending to industry. Much work has been done in these priority tasks but we still don't have a fully functioning industry of privately owned banks. At least another two years is needed to return the banking sector to full health.
Simply slicing up the Royal Bank of Scotland and Lloyds Banking Groups on the grounds that they hold too high a share of say, the domestic mortgage market, will not result in any improvement of services to UK customers or even increase the volume or lower the cost of credit supplied to industry.
All Miliband's proposal will do is frighten investors and knock billions off the share prices of the large groups, frustrating the timing of the sale of government shares and lowering taxpayer value.
It is a highly irresponsible and ignorant proposal which will be dressed up under a false cloak of populist consumerism. Miliband is a truly dangerous politician.
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Re: IPSOS leader ratings.
Is Mr Farage still the most popular?
The Mail have an article covering 2013, and he's doing better than the -13 attributed to Mr Cameron in the IPSOS link.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2525968/Have-voters-fallen-love-Nigel-Farage-Collapse-ratings-UKIP-leader-seen-style-substance.html0 -
This is true; if he becomes PM, Ed Miliband's political epitaph will be: 'Even worse than Gordon Brown'. He's François Hollande without the sex appeal.glw said:
He appears to be intent on proving that Gordon Brown wasn't that bad. God help us all.nigel4england said:The man is an opportunist, but all the bandwagons he jumps on have already passed by.
Presumably this explains why the Brownites supported his leadership bid; certainly there seems no other possible explanation.0 -
I have spent my career dealing with wrongdoing in the City and know a lot about this particular subject. Milliband may think - probably rightly - that he can win without the votes of those with some knowledge of such matters but to govern well he needs to listen to people who know what they are talking about and who are well disposed to the idea of creating a viable and honest and trustworthy financial sector.Neil said:
I suspect he's going to pitch this more to the proportion of the population that is prepared to consider voting for him.Cyclefree said:
There is much to be done to create a viable financial services industry but I absolutely do not trust Labour to do it
Otherwise he will be in office but not in power and he will achieve nothing or make things worse for those who do vote for him - not to mention everyone else.
There is a difference between striking attitudes and achieving real worthwhile change. Does Milliband understand that? All he's done so far is the former. Any fool can do that.
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