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20% seems unlikely in such short order but is likely long term.rcs1000 said:
Absent a collapse, I think that's wishful thinking. The impact of distance on manufacturing has barely budged over time, as lean supply chains have become more important. Not an issue for services, of course.BigRich said:
This will not totals die for a long time, look at Norway many/most of the political class want to Join as do a good minority of the people, (I think 30-40%) but not majority and this has gone on for some time, I think Switzerland is the same, or simmiler. But it may get talked about a bit less,.ydoethur said:
The problem is short of a total collapse (which would be orders of magnitude worse for us) the EU is still going to be there, a massive part of our lives and dominating our economic activity through the simple geographical fact that it's an economic superpower bang next to us. So the join/stay out issue will remain (no pun intended).AlastairMeeks said:Have you noticed passions cooling? Leavers seem to be getting steadily more deranged. On this thread Leavers have been speculating without foundation that Remain-leaning statisticians have been conspiring to show Britain in its worst light.
And 100,000 Remainers have marched today in pursuit of an entirely forlorn cause.
Just as the continued pit closure programme and economic devastation of mining areas that followed have allowed no time for passions to cool.
If we had remained it is possible we could have wrested control from the Junckers, Selmayrs, Barniers and Giscards. By leaving, we hand it to them. Their mendacity in negotiations has already shown with brutal clarity where that is likely to lead.
Passions cooling? Not for decades.
However I think you may be less accurate about the importance, the EU is 7% of would population and 14% of GDP, both of tese % as decreasing, and distance is becoming less important as Planes get faster, ships get bigger broadband internet gets Broader(?) new harbors roads railways and airports are opening up the would would so quickly.
I can see trade with the EU falling below 20% in the next 10 - 15 years.
In the last decade the share of trade has fallen from ~54% to ~43% and is still falling (and that happened pre-referendum). Even without any Brexit-related effects its entirely possible that the trend continues and it falls to 1/3rd EU to 2/3rds non-EU within the next 10-15 years.0 -
Red card!! Come on!!0
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German red card!
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Boateng off to spend more time with his shoes.0
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I think distance probably is an issue for services. You have traveling time.and timezones to factor in. Immigration tends to be easier for neighbouring countries than for further away ones. Language skills tend to be localised too. Regulation has a better chance of standardisation with the next door country, although that's by no means guaranteed.rcs1000 said:
Absent a collapse, I think that's wishful thinking. The impact of distance on manufacturing has barely budged over time, as lean supply chains have become more important. Not an issue for services, of course.BigRich said:
This will not totals die for a long time, look at Norway many/most of the political class want to Join as do a good minority of the people, (I think 30-40%) but not majority and this has gone on for some time, I think Switzerland is the same, or simmiler. But it may get talked about a bit less,.ydoethur said:
The problem is short of a total collapse (which would be orders of magnitude worse for us) the EU is still going to be there, a massive part of our lives and dominating our economic activity through the simple geographical fact that it's an economic superpower bang next to us. So the join/stay out issue will remain (no pun intended).AlastairMeeks said:Have you noticed passions cooling? Leavers seem to be getting steadily more deranged. On this thread Leavers have been speculating without foundation that Remain-leaning statisticians have been conspiring to show Britain in its worst light.
And 100,000 Remainers have marched today in pursuit of an entirely forlorn cause.
Just as the continued pit closure programme and economic devastation of mining areas that followed have allowed no time for passions to cool.
If we had remained it is possible we could have wrested control from the Junckers, Selmayrs, Barniers and Giscards. By leaving, we hand it to them. Their mendacity in negotiations has already shown with brutal clarity where that is likely to lead.
Passions cooling? Not for decades.
However I think you may be less accurate about the importance, the EU is 7% of would population and 14% of GDP, both of tese % as decreasing, and distance is becoming less important as Planes get faster, ships get bigger broadband internet gets Broader(?) new harbors roads railways and airports are opening up the would would so quickly.
I can see trade with the EU falling below 20% in the next 10 - 15 years.0 -
That could do for VAR.0
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Language skills may be localised for continental European nations but not for us. Ours is the global language (let alone the fact that the biggest English as a first language speaking nations aren't on our continent).FF43 said:
I think distance probably is an issue for services. You have traveling time.and timezones to factor in. Immigration tends to be easier for neighbouring countries than for further away ones. Language skills tend to be localised too. Regulation has a better chance of standardisation with the next door country, although that's by no means guaranteed.rcs1000 said:
Absent a collapse, I think that's wishful thinking. The impact of distance on manufacturing has barely budged over time, as lean supply chains have become more important. Not an issue for services, of course.BigRich said:
This will not totals die for a long time, look at Norway many/most of the political class want to Join as do a good minority of the people, (I think 30-40%) but not majority and this has gone on for some time, I think Switzerland is the same, or simmiler. But it may get talked about a bit less,.ydoethur said:
The problem is short of a total collapse (which would be orders of magnitude worse for us) the EU is still going to be there, a massive part of our lives and dominating our economic activity through the simple geographical fact that it's an economic superpower bang next to us. So the join/stay out issue will remain (no pun intended).AlastairMeeks said:Have you noticed passions cooling? Leavers seem to be getting steadily more deranged. On this thread Leavers have been speculating without foundation that Remain-leaning statisticians have been conspiring to show Britain in its worst light.
And 100,000 Remainers have marched today in pursuit of an entirely forlorn cause.
Just as the continued pit closure programme and economic devastation of mining areas that followed have allowed no time for passions to cool.
If we had remained it is possible we could have wrested control from the Junckers, Selmayrs, Barniers and Giscards. By leaving, we hand it to them. Their mendacity in negotiations has already shown with brutal clarity where that is likely to lead.
Passions cooling? Not for decades.
However I think you may be less accurate about the importance, the EU is 7% of would population and 14% of GDP, both of tese % as decreasing, and distance is becoming less important as Planes get faster, ships get bigger broadband internet gets Broader(?) new harbors roads railways and airports are opening up the would would so quickly.
I can see trade with the EU falling below 20% in the next 10 - 15 years.0 -
Germany will still sneak the win, you see......0
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VAR is here to stay. Pandora's box is open we'll never go back.tlg86 said:That could do for VAR.
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I would also point out that a huge amount of Britain's existing business is built around serving the EU. Our financial services industry was built to be the hub for the EU, connecting those who want capital in Europe, with those who have savings. Simply, it is not going to be the hub for connecting Chinese savings with American need for capital.ydoethur said:
Who do I get on with best - my next door neighbour or my friends in Cardiff? Easily the latter.BigRich said:However I think you may be less accurate about the importance, the EU is 7% of would population and 14% of GDP, both of tese % as decreasing, and distance is becoming less important as Planes get faster, ships get bigger broadband internet gets Broader(?) new harbors roads railways and airports are opening up the would would so quickly.
I can see trade with the EU falling below 20% in the next 10 - 15 years.
Who do I speak to more often? Definitely the former, because they live next door.
While the trade issue may become less pressing, it's not going to vanish and geography will dictate that Europe, as it has for three millennia, will continue to be vital to us and central to our interests.
Likewise, a great deal of our manufacturing, in areas such as automotive or aerospace is part of pan-EU supply chains. That can't be quickly pivoted towards the rest of the world.
I would be surprised if - assuming the EU doesn't collapse - the proportion of our trade with it falls by more than 0.5-1% per year. (And I suspect in the next three years, and as the Eurozone recovers and as it will take time to replicate the EU's existing arrangements, it may go in the opposite direction.)0 -
With a dodgy penalty?MarqueeMark said:Germany will still sneak the win, you see......
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VAR strikes again....0
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The same is true for Spanish and Portuguese.Philip_Thompson said:
Language skills may be localised for continental European nations but not for us. Ours is the global language (let alone the fact that the biggest English as a first language speaking nations aren't on our continent).FF43 said:
I think distance probably is an issue for services. You have traveling time.and timezones to factor in. Immigration tends to be easier for neighbouring countries than for further away ones. Language skills tend to be localised too. Regulation has a better chance of standardisation with the next door country, although that's by no means guaranteed.rcs1000 said:
Absent a collapse, I think that's wishful thinking. The impact of distance on manufacturing has barely budged over time, as lean supply chains have become more important. Not an issue for services, of course.BigRich said:
This will not totals die for a long time, look at Norway many/most of the political class want to Join as do a good minority of the people, (I think 30-40%) but not majority and this has gone on for some time, I think Switzerland is the same, or simmiler. But it may get talked about a bit less,.ydoethur said:
The problem is short of a total collapse (which would be orders of magnitude worse for us) the EU is still going to be there, a massive part of our lives and dominating our economic activity through the simple geographical fact that it's an economic superpower bang next to us. So the join/stay out issue will remain (no pun intended).AlastairMeeks said:Have you noticed passions cooling? Leavers seem to be getting steadily more deranged. On this thread Leavers have been speculating without foundation that Remain-leaning statisticians have been conspiring to show Britain in its worst light.
And 100,000 Remainers have marched today in pursuit of an entirely forlorn cause.
Just as the continued pit closure programme and economic devastation of mining areas that followed have allowed no time for passions to cool.
If we had remained it is possible we could have wrested control from the Junckers, Selmayrs, Barniers and Giscards. By leaving, we hand it to them. Their mendacity in negotiations has already shown with brutal clarity where that is likely to lead.
Passions cooling? Not for decades.
However I think you may be less accurate about the importance, the EU is 7% of would population and 14% of GDP, both of tese % as decreasing, and distance is becoming less important as Planes get faster, ships get bigger broadband internet gets Broader(?) new harbors roads railways and airports are opening up the would would so quickly.
I can see trade with the EU falling below 20% in the next 10 - 15 years.0 -
The last time our trade with the EU was below 20% was in the late 60's. It would be quite a contraction to drop that far, not least becaise I think our taste for European products is likely to be undiminished.Philip_Thompson said:
20% seems unlikely in such short order but is likely long term.rcs1000 said:
Absent a collapse, I think that's wishful thinking. The impact of distance on manufacturing has barely budged over time, as lean supply chains have become more important. Not an issue for services, of course.BigRich said:
This will not totals die for a long time, look at Norway many/most of the political class want to Join as do a good minority of the people, (I think 30-40%) but not majority and this has gone on for some time, I think Switzerland is the same, or simmiler. But it may get talked about a bit less,.ydoethur said:
The problem is short of a total collapse (which would be orders of magnitude worse for us) the EU is still going to be there, a massive part of our lives and dominating our economic activity through the simple geographical fact that it's an economic superpower bang next to us. So the join/stay out issue will remain (no pun intended).AlastairMeeks said:Have you noticed passions cooling? Leavers seem to be getting steadily more deranged. On this thread Leavers have been speculating without foundation that Remain-leaning statisticians have been conspiring to show Britain in its worst light.
And 100,000 Remainers have marched today in pursuit of an entirely forlorn cause.
Just as the continued pit closure programme and economic devastation of mining areas that followed have allowed no time for passions to cool.
If we had remained it is possible we could have wrested control from the Junckers, Selmayrs, Barniers and Giscards. By leaving, we hand it to them. Their mendacity in negotiations has already shown with brutal clarity where that is likely to lead.
Passions cooling? Not for decades.
However I think you may be less accurate about the importance, the EU is 7% of would population and 14% of GDP, both of tese % as decreasing, and distance is becoming less important as Planes get faster, ships get bigger broadband internet gets Broader(?) new harbors roads railways and airports are opening up the would would so quickly.
I can see trade with the EU falling below 20% in the next 10 - 15 years.
In the last decade the share of trade has fallen from ~54% to ~43% and is still falling (and that happened pre-referendum). Even without any Brexit-related effects its entirely possible that the trend continues and it falls to 1/3rd EU to 2/3rds non-EU within the next 10-15 years.
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I agree distance still matters for services, in particular regarding time zones. But there is no issue with inventories, and language (English) matters.FF43 said:
I think distance probably is an issue for services. You have traveling time.and timezones to factor in. Immigration tends to be easier for neighbouring countries than for further away ones. Language skills tend to be localised too. Regulation has a better chance of standardisation with the next door country, although that's by no means guaranteed.rcs1000 said:
Absent a collapse, I think that's wishful thinking. The impact of distance on manufacturing has barely budged over time, as lean supply chains have become more important. Not an issue for services, of course.BigRich said:
This will not totals die for a long time, look at Norway many/most of the political class want to Join as do a good minority of the people, (I think 30-40%) but not majority and this has gone on for some time, I think Switzerland is the same, or simmiler. But it may get talked about a bit less,.ydoethur said:
The problem is short of a total collapse (which would be orders of magnitude worse for us) the EU is still going to be there, a massive part of our lives and dominating our economic activity through the simple geographical fact that it's an economic superpower bang next to us. So the join/stay out issue will remain (no pun intended).AlastairMeeks said:Have you noticed passions cooling? Leavers seem to be getting steadily more deranged. On this thread Leavers have been speculating without foundation that Remain-leaning statisticians have been conspiring to show Britain in its worst light.
And 100,000 Remainers have marched today in pursuit of an entirely forlorn cause.
Just as the continued pit closure programme and economic devastation of mining areas that followed have allowed no time for passions to cool.
If we had remained it is possible we could have wrested control from the Junckers, Selmayrs, Barniers and Giscards. By leaving, we hand it to them. Their mendacity in negotiations has already shown with brutal clarity where that is likely to lead.
Passions cooling? Not for decades.
However I think you may be less accurate about the importance, the EU is 7% of would population and 14% of GDP, both of tese % as decreasing, and distance is becoming less important as Planes get faster, ships get bigger broadband internet gets Broader(?) new harbors roads railways and airports are opening up the would would so quickly.
I can see trade with the EU falling below 20% in the next 10 - 15 years.0 -
Helluva save!
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What a save!0
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Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.Philip_Thompson said:
20% seems unlikely in such short order but is likely long term.rcs1000 said:
Absent a collapse, I think that's wishful thinking. The impact of distance on manufacturing has barely budged over time, as lean supply chains have become more important. Not an issue for services, of course.BigRich said:
This will not totals die for a long time, look at Norway many/most of the political class want to Join as do a good minority of the people, (I think 30-40%) but not majority and this has gone on for some time, I think Switzerland is the same, or simmiler. But it may get talked about a bit less,.ydoethur said:
The problem is short of a total collapse (which would be orders of magnitude worse for us) the EU is still going to be there, a massive part of our lives and dominating our economic activity through the simple geographical fact that it's an economic superpower bang next to us. So the join/stay out issue will remain (no pun intended).AlastairMeeks said:Have you noticed passions cooling? Leavers seem to be getting steadily more deranged. On this thread Leavers have been speculating without foundation that Remain-leaning statisticians have been conspiring to show Britain in its worst light.
And 100,000 Remainers have marched today in pursuit of an entirely forlorn cause.
Just as the continued pit closure programme and economic devastation of mining areas that followed have allowed no time for passions to cool.
If we had remained it is possible we could have wrested control from the Junckers, Selmayrs, Barniers and Giscards. By leaving, we hand it to them. Their mendacity in negotiations has already shown with brutal clarity where that is likely to lead.
Passions cooling? Not for decades.
However I think you may be less accurate about the importance, the EU is 7% of would population and 14% of GDP, both of tese % as decreasing, and distance is becoming less important as Planes get faster, ships get bigger broadband internet gets Broader(?) new harbors roads railways and airports are opening up the would would so quickly.
I can see trade with the EU falling below 20% in the next 10 - 15 years.
In the last decade the share of trade has fallen from ~54% to ~43% and is still falling (and that happened pre-referendum). Even without any Brexit-related effects its entirely possible that the trend continues and it falls to 1/3rd EU to 2/3rds non-EU within the next 10-15 years.0 -
English is official or national language in far more countries than those two combinedwilliamglenn said:
The same is true for Spanish and Portuguese.Philip_Thompson said:
Language skills may be localised for continental European nations but not for us. Ours is the global language (let alone the fact that the biggest English as a first language speaking nations aren't on our continent).FF43 said:
I think distance probably is an issue for services. You have traveling time.and timezones to factor in. Immigration tends to be easier for neighbouring countries than for further away ones. Language skills tend to be localised too. Regulation has a better chance of standardisation with the next door country, although that's by no means guaranteed.rcs1000 said:
Absent a collapse, I think that's wishful thinking. The impact of distance on manufacturing has barely budged over time, as lean supply chains have become more important. Not an issue for services, of course.BigRich said:
This will not totals die for a long time, look at Norway many/most of the political class want to Join aailways and airports are opening up the would would so quickly.ydoethur said:
The problem is short of a total collapse (which would be orders of magnitude worse for us) the EU is still going to be there, a massive part of our lives and dominating our economic activity through the simple geographical fact that it's an economic superpower bang next to us. So the join/stay out issue will remain (no pun intended).AlastairMeeks said:Have you noticed passions cooling? Leavers seem to be getting steadily more deranged. On this thread Leavers have been speculating without foundation that Remain-leaning statisticians have been conspiring to show Britain in its worst light.
And 100,000 Remainers have marched today in pursuit of an entirely forlorn cause.
Just as the continued pit closure programme and economic devastation of mining areas that followed have allowed no time for passions to cool.
If we had remained it is possible we could have wrested control from the Junckers, Selmayrs, Barniers and Giscards. By leaving, we hand it to them. Their mendacity in negotiations has already shown with brutal clarity where that is likely to lead.
Passions cooling? Not for decades.
I can see trade with the EU falling below 20% in the next 10 - 15 years.0 -
5 mins....is fergie doing the timing?0
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OMG. This is extraordinary.0
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I Loew this game
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Indeed, in what areas has our EU share of trade dropped? is it the decline in North Sea oil?rcs1000 said:
Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.Philip_Thompson said:
20% seems unlikely in such short order but is likely long term.rcs1000 said:
Absent a collapse, I think that's wishful thinking. The impact of distance on manufacturing has barely budged over time, as lean supply chains have become more important. Not an issue for services, of course.BigRich said:
This will not totals die for a long time, look at Norway many/most of the political class want to Join as do a good minority of the people, (I think 30-40%) but not majority and this has gone on for some time, I think Switzerland is the same, or simmiler. But it may get talked about a bit less,.ydoethur said:
The problem is short of a total collapse (which would be orders of magnitude worse for us) the EU is still going to be there, a massive part of our lives and dominating our economic activity through the simple geographical fact that it's an economic superpower bang next to us. So the join/stay out issue will remain (no pun intended).AlastairMeeks said:Have you noticed passions cooling? Leavers seem to be getting steadily more deranged. On this thread Leavers have been speculating without foundation that Remain-leaning statisticians have been conspiring to show Britain in its worst light.
And 100,000 Remainers have marched today in pursuit of an entirely forlorn cause.
Just as the continued pit closure programme and economic devastation of mining areas that followed have allowed no time for passions to cool.
If we had remained it is possible we could have wrested control from the Junckers, Selmayrs, Barniers and Giscards. By leaving, we hand it to them. Their mendacity in negotiations has already shown with brutal clarity where that is likely to lead.
Passions cooling? Not for decades.
However I think you may be less accurate about the importance, the EU is 7% of would population and 14% of GDP, both of tese % as decreasing, and distance is becoming less important as Planes get faster, ships get bigger broadband internet gets Broader(?) new harbors roads railways and airports are opening up the would would so quickly.
I can see trade with the EU falling below 20% in the next 10 - 15 years.
In the last decade the share of trade has fallen from ~54% to ~43% and is still falling (and that happened pre-referendum). Even without any Brexit-related effects its entirely possible that the trend continues and it falls to 1/3rd EU to 2/3rds non-EU within the next 10-15 years.0 -
That was a stupid foul.0
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Bugger0
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2-1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!0
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Told yer!0
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I'm streaming and it hasn't haappened yet.Sunil_Prasannan said:2-1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Cracking free kick!
Germans break through...-1 -
Incredible, fair play, pressure on, he stepped up, world class.0
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Nope - FIFA!FrancisUrquhart said:5 mins....is fergie doing the timing?
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When Germany end up winning the World Cup....0
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Never right them off, etc. etc.0
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You have to hand it to the Germans.
Never give up.0 -
I hope you're using Kleenexrcs1000 said:
I'm streamingSunil_Prasannan said:2-1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Amusing though it would be to see Germany or Argentina go out early, the tournament would be much better with them still in.0
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They deserved that win by not going defensive after the sending off.Tykejohnno said:You have to hand it to the Germans.
Never give up.
Sweden got what they deserved to for not attempting to take advantage.0 -
MarqueeMark said:
Germany will still sneak the win, you see......
Looks like PB calls it right againPulpstar said:
Shouldn't affect Germany too much, he was anonymous in defence.welshowl said:Boateng off to spend more time with his shoes.
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This has been an incredible World Cup so far in terms of games, best one I've watched, loads of cracking games and late goals.
Also I'd rather Germany go out so we don't face them and I like cheering on underdogs.0 -
If you hadn't mentioned Argentina I might have thought we were still on Brexit.AlastairMeeks said:Amusing though it would be to see Germany or Argentina go out early, the tournament would be much better with them still in.
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So does population and wealth. The EU is losing both at quite a rate. Currently it forms 7% of global population but that is falling annually. It will before too long be 6% at which point even if we do three times the trade per capita with Europeans as we do non-Europeans it still gets us to below 20%.rcs1000 said:Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.
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After the 3rd matches, it could be 6-6-6 points.0
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Certainly that goal makes the final games in Group F interesting. But I don’t think Argentina are a great loss. I hope Nigeria go through as they played some good stuff against Iceland.AlastairMeeks said:Amusing though it would be to see Germany or Argentina go out early, the tournament would be much better with them still in.
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Brazil are not home and dry yet either.tlg86 said:
Certainly that goal makes the final games in Group F interesting. But I don’t think Argentina are a great loss. I hope Nigeria go through as they played some good stuff against Iceland.AlastairMeeks said:Amusing though it would be to see Germany or Argentina go out early, the tournament would be much better with them still in.
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Nigeria are the most Leicester team. They started 3 Foxes yesterday, including Musa, who got a brace and Ndidi who hit the bar with a cracking long shot.tlg86 said:
Certainly that goal makes the final games in Group F interesting. But I don’t think Argentina are a great loss. I hope Nigeria go through as they played some good stuff against Iceland.AlastairMeeks said:Amusing though it would be to see Germany or Argentina go out early, the tournament would be much better with them still in.
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Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105671250759393290 -
No it looks like they had a photographer who can frame a camera angle.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105220457576898590 -
FF43, Thanks for going to the trouble of replying, I think overall looking a the start of this chat, there is a lot that we can agree on, and I am glad we have been able to keep this friendly.FF43 said:
In general international trade comes with costs applied: compliance with regulation, certification, national treatment, import duties, quotas etc. Then you try to facilitate trade with preferential trade agreements, customs unions, common regulatory systems, supranational legal systems to enforce a level playing field and the like. In the world trade system only the European Union combines all four pillars, although Australia / New Zealand trade gets closest.
Through the EU, the UK benefits from the most comprehensive set of preferential trade agreements anywhere in the world. The UK will aim to retain as much of that system of existing PTAs as it can, but it will do so from a position of weakness with partners that will look to squeeze concessions out of the UK and get more access to UK markets while giving away less access to their own. Again it's about the extent of the downside. The only possible upside is if the UK negotiates trade deals with countries that don't currently have one with the EU. While this is certainly possible (I expect one with China), the potential upside is a lot smaller than the downsides I have already mentioned. In practice these deals will be very one sided in favour of the other party.
But for the record, I think we disagree on the benefits and limitations of free triad and FTAs.
Its a lot easier for a small entity to negotiate trade agreements which is why Iceland has fare more and better FTAs that the EU, to take one example,or why Singapore has more that the US. FTAs are simple in theory but special interests make them complex and less good, big contrary have more and provoke more on the other side, drowing out long negotiations and complex exemptions. Not sure why you think the EUs are unickly good, that's just not the case Iceland, Switzerland, Singapore, new Zealand all do better.
But then I also believe all the academic theory and all the empirical eve-dance which alien to say that allowing imports tariff free is far more important than getting tariff free access to the other side, if you want to grow Living standards and GDP. so a unilateral doping of all tariffs would be best and dropping all tariffs on things not made in the UK would be a good second best if option one is political not possible.
'The singal market' is grate for good, because of the reasons you mention, and as some of the EU FTA show that can be extended outside the EU, but less good on services, if we did not have the woulds most incompetent PM its a least conceivable that a UK-EU FTA could be used to finally open up the EU to services, which would in theory be an improvement. but as stated above the overall additional benefit to the UK would be small.0 -
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105671250759393290 -
Whoever was singing the New Zealand national anthem before the rugby, that was embarrassing. Didn't know the words, couldn't pitch the note and was late on every entry. Didn't even seem to have read over it still less practised it.
I could have picked 30 teenage girls at my school who could have done much better, for free.0 -
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Looks like at least a few thousand, though of course both marches were dwarfed by the actual vote which Leave won by over a million votes, more than ten times the size of the anti and pro Brexit marches combinedFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105671250759393290 -
And.....???Philip_Thompson said:
So does population and wealth. The EU is losing both at quite a rate. Currently it forms 7% of global population but that is falling annually. It will before too long be 6% at which point even if we do three times the trade per capita with Europeans as we do non-Europeans it still gets us to below 20%.rcs1000 said:Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.
Seriously, the Brexit population argument is bobbins
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The argument isn't about population its about opportunities. Are you familiar with the concept of Opportunity Cost?tyson said:
And.....???Philip_Thompson said:
So does population and wealth. The EU is losing both at quite a rate. Currently it forms 7% of global population but that is falling annually. It will before too long be 6% at which point even if we do three times the trade per capita with Europeans as we do non-Europeans it still gets us to below 20%.rcs1000 said:Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.
Seriously, the Brexit population argument is bobbins0 -
I'm a very proud remainer and Europhile...but the last thing I could be arsed doing today is hoofing around London on a march.HYUFD said:
Looks like at least a few thousandFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010567125075939329
0 -
Surely, the correct Tory line is "tens of thousands"HYUFD said:
Looks like at least a few thousandFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105671250759393290 -
If Germany beat S Korea by 2 goals or more then I think they're through.Philip_Thompson said:
Sweden need a better result than Germany. I think if Germany wins by 1 then Sweden winning by 2 gets them and Germany through.
A draw is good enough for Mexico.0 -
One million, one hundred and sixty thousand, one hundred and sixty-three.surby said:
Surely, the correct Tory line is "tens of thousands"HYUFD said:
Looks like at least a few thousandFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010567125075939329
(That's for Sunil, btw.)0 -
Mate...I live in Europe..my wife's Italian, my nephew is married to a Greek, I have business stuff in Italy, my wife works for a European firm, I go to holiday in Europe mostly and need to buy shed loads of Euoros regularly...I really don't give a flying fuck if the population of Africa is growing exponentially....Philip_Thompson said:
The argument isn't about population its about opportunities. Are you familiar with the concept of Opportunity Cost?tyson said:
And.....???Philip_Thompson said:
So does population and wealth. The EU is losing both at quite a rate. Currently it forms 7% of global population but that is falling annually. It will before too long be 6% at which point even if we do three times the trade per capita with Europeans as we do non-Europeans it still gets us to below 20%.rcs1000 said:Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.
Seriously, the Brexit population argument is bobbins
0 -
Very sensible of you, rather than joining 100 000 people who had already voted Remain in central London, the heart of Remainier, would make more sense to spend the day in a high street in the Home Counties where the Leave vote margin was almost exactly the same as the UK averagetyson said:
I'm a very proud remainer and Europhile...but the last thing I could be arsed doing today is hoofing around London on a march.HYUFD said:
Looks like at least a few thousandFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010567125075939329
0 -
My brother was there, but shares my scepticism about a second referendum. Pushing the government to BINO was his aim.tyson said:
I'm a very proud remainer and Europhile...but the last thing I could be arsed doing today is hoofing around London on a march.HYUFD said:
Looks like at least a few thousandFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105671250759393290 -
I had taken it for granted that South Korea were out of the competition but in fact they can still qualify if they win and both Germany and Sweden lose.Pulpstar said:
If Germany beat S Korea by 2 goals or more then I think they're through.Philip_Thompson said:
Sweden need a better result than Germany. I think if Germany wins by 1 then Sweden winning by 2 gets them and Germany through.
A draw is good enough for Mexico.0 -
Someone must have read the small print in PB. If Sweden beats Mexico 1-0 and Germany beats S Korea 1-0, I make it:
6-6-6 and 3-2 in goals for and against for all three.0 -
It was on ITV too. GerardBatten and his puny rally just aren't important enough to be interviewed.Foxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105671250759393290 -
Bully for you. I do.tyson said:
Mate...I live in Europe..my wife's Italian, my nephew is married to a Greek, I have business stuff in Italy, my wife works for a European firm, I go to holiday in Europe mostly and need to buy shed loads of Euoros regularly...I really don't give a flying fuck if the population of Africa is growing exponentially....Philip_Thompson said:
The argument isn't about population its about opportunities. Are you familiar with the concept of Opportunity Cost?tyson said:
And.....???Philip_Thompson said:
So does population and wealth. The EU is losing both at quite a rate. Currently it forms 7% of global population but that is falling annually. It will before too long be 6% at which point even if we do three times the trade per capita with Europeans as we do non-Europeans it still gets us to below 20%.rcs1000 said:Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.
Seriously, the Brexit population argument is bobbins
My wife's [dual citizen] South African, I grew up in Australia, my in-laws are Canadian. I really don't give a flying fuck if you don't care about outside Europe.0 -
They have to win 2-0.AndyJS said:
I had taken it for granted that South Korea were out of the competition but in fact they can still qualify if they win and both Germany and Sweden lose.Pulpstar said:
If Germany beat S Korea by 2 goals or more then I think they're through.Philip_Thompson said:
Sweden need a better result than Germany. I think if Germany wins by 1 then Sweden winning by 2 gets them and Germany through.
A draw is good enough for Mexico.0 -
This could get really weird ( I think). I think if Sweden and Germany with their next games one nil Sweden, Germany, and Mexico have identical points, goal difference, goals scored, and would each have beaten one of the other two and lost to the other one. I think we then get down to number of red and yellow cards in a fair play points league.Pulpstar said:
If Germany beat S Korea by 2 goals or more then I think they're through.Philip_Thompson said:
Sweden need a better result than Germany. I think if Germany wins by 1 then Sweden winning by 2 gets them and Germany through.
A draw is good enough for Mexico.
I think.
Of course S Korea could thrash Germany four nil and still qualify if Mexico beat Sweden. But we’d all be on tranquilizers by then anyway and probably oxygen.0 -
That march was no better.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105671250759393290 -
Do they?surby said:
They have to win 2-0.AndyJS said:
I had taken it for granted that South Korea were out of the competition but in fact they can still qualify if they win and both Germany and Sweden lose.Pulpstar said:
If Germany beat S Korea by 2 goals or more then I think they're through.Philip_Thompson said:
Sweden need a better result than Germany. I think if Germany wins by 1 then Sweden winning by 2 gets them and Germany through.
A draw is good enough for Mexico.
If they win 1-0 and Mexico win 1-0 too then surely they'll be drawing lots with Germany and Sweden as they'd be tied on 2 For and 3 Against each.0 -
Actually a tiebreaker before fair play is goals for excluding the team they're not tied with.welshowl said:
This could get really weird ( I think). I think if Sweden and Germany with their next games one nil Sweden, Germany, and Mexico have identical points, goal difference, goals scored, and would each have beaten one of the other two and lost to the other one. I think we then get down to number of red and yellow cards in a fair play points league.Pulpstar said:
If Germany beat S Korea by 2 goals or more then I think they're through.Philip_Thompson said:
Sweden need a better result than Germany. I think if Germany wins by 1 then Sweden winning by 2 gets them and Germany through.
A draw is good enough for Mexico.
I think.
Of course S Korea could thrash Germany four nil and still qualify if Mexico beat Sweden. But we’d all be on tranquilizers by then anyway and probably oxygen.0 -
Has anybody ever not qualified in a four team tournament league on 6 points before?0
-
Foxy said:
My brother was there, but shares my scepticism about a second referendum. Pushing the government to BINO was his aim.tyson said:
I'm a very proud remainer and Europhile...but the last thing I could be arsed doing today is hoofing around London on a march.HYUFD said:
Looks like at least a few thousandFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010567125075939329
I've really lost the will on the Brexit thing...I've kind of filed it in the same place as climate change, badger culling, Japanese whaling, Trump (anything to do with), the ivory trade, the Mexico cartels, Jeremy Corbyn, Boris Johnson, JRM, Venezuela..you know the file marked as "shit..and better left alone".........
Anyway, headsup Foxy to your bro for giving a fuck still because I don't0 -
I am familiar with the concept of opportunity cost, but it would be helpful if you could explain how losing European markets helps us win markets in Africa.Philip_Thompson said:
The argument isn't about population its about opportunities. Are you familiar with the concept of Opportunity Cost?tyson said:
And.....???Philip_Thompson said:
So does population and wealth. The EU is losing both at quite a rate. Currently it forms 7% of global population but that is falling annually. It will before too long be 6% at which point even if we do three times the trade per capita with Europeans as we do non-Europeans it still gets us to below 20%.rcs1000 said:Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.
Seriously, the Brexit population argument is bobbins
Much as I love Africa, surely smaller sales of Mini 's or Range Rovers to the EU pushes up unit costs, thereby making them more expensive elsewhere?0 -
But if there are three on six points in a round robin tie?Philip_Thompson said:
Actually a tiebreaker before fair play is goals for excluding the team they're not tied with.welshowl said:
This could get really weird ( I think). I think if Sweden and Germany with their next games one nil Sweden, Germany, and Mexico have identical points, goal difference, goals scored, and would each have beaten one of the other two and lost to the other one. I think we then get down to number of red and yellow cards in a fair play points league.Pulpstar said:
If Germany beat S Korea by 2 goals or more then I think they're through.Philip_Thompson said:
Sweden need a better result than Germany. I think if Germany wins by 1 then Sweden winning by 2 gets them and Germany through.
A draw is good enough for Mexico.
I think.
Of course S Korea could thrash Germany four nil and still qualify if Mexico beat Sweden. But we’d all be on tranquilizers by then anyway and probably oxygen.0 -
Philip_Thompson said:
Bully for you. I do.tyson said:
Mate...I live in Europe..my wife's Italian, my nephew is married to a Greek, I have business stuff in Italy, my wife works for a European firm, I go to holiday in Europe mostly and need to buy shed loads of Euoros regularly...I really don't give a flying fuck if the population of Africa is growing exponentially....Philip_Thompson said:
The argument isn't about population its about opportunities. Are you familiar with the concept of Opportunity Cost?tyson said:
And.....???Philip_Thompson said:
So does population and wealth. The EU is losing both at quite a rate. Currently it forms 7% of global population but that is falling annually. It will before too long be 6% at which point even if we do three times the trade per capita with Europeans as we do non-Europeans it still gets us to below 20%.rcs1000 said:Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.
Seriously, the Brexit population argument is bobbins
My wife's [dual citizen] South African, I grew up in Australia, my in-laws are Canadian. I really don't give a flying fuck if you don't care about outside Europe.
Good for you comrade
0 -
I wonder why RT wanted an interview?Philip_Thompson said:
It was on ITV too. GerardBatten and his puny rally just aren't important enough to be interviewed.Foxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105671250759393290 -
Its not about losing European markets its about the fact that Europe is falling in significance on its own accord.Foxy said:
I am familiar with the concept of opportunity cost, but it would be helpful if you could explain how losing European markets helps us win markets in Africa.Philip_Thompson said:
The argument isn't about population its about opportunities. Are you familiar with the concept of Opportunity Cost?tyson said:
And.....???Philip_Thompson said:
So does population and wealth. The EU is losing both at quite a rate. Currently it forms 7% of global population but that is falling annually. It will before too long be 6% at which point even if we do three times the trade per capita with Europeans as we do non-Europeans it still gets us to below 20%.rcs1000 said:Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.
Seriously, the Brexit population argument is bobbins
Much as I love Africa, surely smaller sales of Mini 's or Range Rogers to the EU pushes up unit costs, thereby making them more expensive elsewhere?
We will long-term (even if we leave without a deal) get a deal with Europe. We're not guaranteed a deal with the rest of the world. If we can seek a better deal with the rest of the world outside the EU then that becomes progressively more valuable as the rest of the world inevitably grows better than the EU will.0 -
Yes, the Russians did a good job for you there.HYUFD said:
Looks like at least a few thousand, though of course both marches were dwarfed by the actual vote which Leave won by over a million votes, more than ten times the size of the anti and pro Brexit marches combinedFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105671250759393290 -
I am largely on the same place. I have arranged my affairs to do well in any outcome from A50 repeal to car crash Brexit. Now I just need to watch.tyson said:Foxy said:
My brother was there, but shares my scepticism about a second referendum. Pushing the government to BINO was his aim.tyson said:
I'm a very proud remainer and Europhile...but the last thing I could be arsed doing today is hoofing around London on a march.HYUFD said:
Looks like at least a few thousandFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010567125075939329
I've really lost the will on the Brexit thing...I've kind of filed it in the same place as climate change, badger culling, Japanese whaling, Trump (anything to do with), the ivory trade, the Mexico cartels, Jeremy Corbyn, Boris Johnson, JRM, Venezuela..you know the file marked as "shit..and better left alone".........
Anyway, headsup Foxy to your bro for giving a fuck still because I don't
Mine is a job that is in demand throughout the world, independent of the economy. If I were an auto worker then I might have trouble sleeping, but I am not.0 -
It seams My 20% of trade projection in 10-15 years is getting some push back, faire enough, it sounds dramatic, but the % of traide with the EU has been falling by almost 1% a year in resent years, not become overall trade with the EU is falling, its not its still growing just slower , a lot slower than trade with the rest of the would. so I was postulating that FTAs with the rest of the would and some possible herdels with the EU could double that to say 2% so to go down from 43% to 20% would be 11 and a half years, so say 10-15 to recognize the very approximation way this was done.rcs1000 said:
I would also point out that a huge amount of Britain's existing business is built around serving the EU. Our financial services industry was built to be the hub for the EU, connecting those who want capital in Europe, with those who have savings. Simply, it is not going to be the hub for connecting Chinese savings with American need for capital.ydoethur said:
Who do I get on with best - my next door neighbour or my friends in Cardiff? Easily the latter.BigRich said:However I think you may be less accurate about the importance, the EU is 7% of would population and 14% of GDP, both of tese % as decreasing, and distance is becoming less important as Planes get faster, ships get bigger broadband internet gets Broader(?) new harbors roads railways and airports are opening up the would would so quickly.
I can see trade with the EU falling below 20% in the next 10 - 15 years.
Who do I speak to more often? Definitely the former, because they live next door.
While the trade issue may become less pressing, it's not going to vanish and geography will dictate that Europe, as it has for three millennia, will continue to be vital to us and central to our interests.
Likewise, a great deal of our manufacturing, in areas such as automotive or aerospace is part of pan-EU supply chains. That can't be quickly pivoted towards the rest of the world.
I would be surprised if - assuming the EU doesn't collapse - the proportion of our trade with it falls by more than 0.5-1% per year. (And I suspect in the next three years, and as the Eurozone recovers and as it will take time to replicate the EU's existing arrangements, it may go in the opposite direction.)
Who knows! I respect those who disagree, but its only an guesstimate/, and )still a significant change if it is 25% or 30%) so i'm sticking with it
0 -
Lord "Tribble" is a Tory now isn't he?ydoethur said:
One million, one hundred and sixty thousand, one hundred and sixty-three.surby said:
Surely, the correct Tory line is "tens of thousands"HYUFD said:
Looks like at least a few thousandFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010567125075939329
(That's for Sunil, btw.)0 -
Looks like the Jerries and Frogs are coming up with a piece of kit that makes the F35 look like a US overpriced underpowered bit of shit. Ah! the wonders of Brexit....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9IE8WIvfFY&feature=push-fr&attr_tag=Ur7AU82ZTLTsvcnB-60 -
From memory:welshowl said:
But if there are three on six points in a round robin tie?Philip_Thompson said:
Actually a tiebreaker before fair play is goals for excluding the team they're not tied with.welshowl said:
This could get really weird ( I think). I think if Sweden and Germany with their next games one nil Sweden, Germany, and Mexico have identical points, goal difference, goals scored, and would each have beaten one of the other two and lost to the other one. I think we then get down to number of red and yellow cards in a fair play points league.Pulpstar said:
If Germany beat S Korea by 2 goals or more then I think they're through.Philip_Thompson said:
Sweden need a better result than Germany. I think if Germany wins by 1 then Sweden winning by 2 gets them and Germany through.
A draw is good enough for Mexico.
I think.
Of course S Korea could thrash Germany four nil and still qualify if Mexico beat Sweden. But we’d all be on tranquilizers by then anyway and probably oxygen.
Points in group > Goal Difference in Group > Goals For in Group >
Goal Difference in Tied Teams > Goals For in Tied Teams >
Fair Play > Drawing of Lots
In your example although they have identical goal difference once you exclude the South Korean results the goals for changes (Sweden beat SK 1-0, Mexico 2-1).0 -
But you agree that losing export markets to the EU pushes up unit costs. Thereby making our exports less competetive?Philip_Thompson said:
Its not about losing European markets its about the fact that Europe is falling in significance on its own accord.Foxy said:
I am familiar with the concept of opportunity cost, but it would be helpful if you could explain how losing European markets helps us win markets in Africa.Philip_Thompson said:
The argument isn't about population its about opportunities. Are you familiar with the concept of Opportunity Cost?tyson said:
And.....???Philip_Thompson said:
So does population and wealth. The EU is losing both at quite a rate. Currently it forms 7% of global population but that is falling annually. It will before too long be 6% at which point even if we do three times the trade per capita with Europeans as we do non-Europeans it still gets us to below 20%.rcs1000 said:Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.
Seriously, the Brexit population argument is bobbins
Much as I love Africa, surely smaller sales of Mini 's or Range Rogers to the EU pushes up unit costs, thereby making them more expensive elsewhere?
We will long-term (even if we leave without a deal) get a deal with Europe. We're not guaranteed a deal with the rest of the world. If we can seek a better deal with the rest of the world outside the EU then that becomes progressively more valuable as the rest of the world inevitably grows better than the EU will.
And surely losing existing EU FTAs worsens terms of trade initially?
0 -
Over two years? No. But, these days, former NUM strongholds are returning 40% + vote shares for the Tories. These were people who thought the Conservatives were destroying their way of life. People who strongly object to Brexit hardly have to worry about that.AlastairMeeks said:
Have you noticed passions cooling? Leavers seem to be getting steadily more deranged. On this thread Leavers have been speculating without foundation that Remain-leaning statisticians have been conspiring to show Britain in its worst light.Sean_F said:
The Miners' Strike was far more bitter and divisive than Brexit, but over time, passions cooled.AlastairMeeks said:
Brexit is already a disaster because those people who hated the EU passionately decided that it was worth pandering to xenophobia to win the referendum. The country has not recovered from that, nor will it till that is acknowledged. The divisions will endure indefinitely.BigRich said:
Please don't use personal insults towards people who you disagree with.Casino_Royale said:What a bunch of sad naive losers on the pro-EU march in London.
Willing to march for a foreign anti-democratic unaccountable and dismissive bureaucracy, rather than to enhance the democracy and freedom of themselves and their own country.
Disgraceful.
I may support BREXIT, but I also respect peoples right to protest, which is all they are doing.
You and I may disagree with the Remain supporters on here, but they are not Sad, or Naive or Losers. They are people who see things differently to us, and tha'ts fine we both what this to be a free country.
I hope that hope that one day this division will be behind us and they change their mind and see that BREXIT has been a big success, (I hope) perhaps you agree with that. But insulted are a counter productive means of perspiration I know, think of Hillary Basket of deplorables comment.
And 100,000 Remainers have marched today in pursuit of an entirely forlorn cause.0 -
So they have a cartoon.OchEye said:Looks like the Jerries and Frogs are coming up with a piece of kit that makes the F35 look like a US overpriced underpowered bit of shit. Ah! the wonders of Brexit....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9IE8WIvfFY&feature=push-fr&attr_tag=Ur7AU82ZTLTsvcnB-60 -
If we lose export markets to the EU then yes, but I'm expecting a deal which makes it nul.Foxy said:
But you agree that losing export markets to the EU pushes up unit costs. Thereby making our exports less competetive?Philip_Thompson said:
Its not about losing European markets its about the fact that Europe is falling in significance on its own accord.Foxy said:
I am familiar with the concept of opportunity cost, but it would be helpful if you could explain how losing European markets helps us win markets in Africa.Philip_Thompson said:
The argument isn't about population its about opportunities. Are you familiar with the concept of Opportunity Cost?tyson said:
And.....???Philip_Thompson said:
So does population and wealth. The EU is losing both at quite a rate. Currently it forms 7% of global population but that is falling annually. It will before too long be 6% at which point even if we do three times the trade per capita with Europeans as we do non-Europeans it still gets us to below 20%.rcs1000 said:Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.
Seriously, the Brexit population argument is bobbins
Much as I love Africa, surely smaller sales of Mini 's or Range Rogers to the EU pushes up unit costs, thereby making them more expensive elsewhere?
We will long-term (even if we leave without a deal) get a deal with Europe. We're not guaranteed a deal with the rest of the world. If we can seek a better deal with the rest of the world outside the EU then that becomes progressively more valuable as the rest of the world inevitably grows better than the EU will.
And surely losing existing EU FTAs worsens terms of trade initially?
I'm also expecting (though losing confidence in Fox) all existing FTAs rolling over.0 -
"According to the German Defense Ministry factsheet, this plane does not yet have a name, and is only referred to as a Next Generation Weapons System (NGWS). Nor are many other details known about the aircraft, other than that it will carry both air-to-air and air-to-ground missiles."OchEye said:Looks like the Jerries and Frogs are coming up with a piece of kit that makes the F35 look like a US overpriced underpowered bit of shit. Ah! the wonders of Brexit....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9IE8WIvfFY&feature=push-fr&attr_tag=Ur7AU82ZTLTsvcnB-6
http://www.dw.com/en/germany-france-present-new-military-aircraft-plans-in-berlin/a-43554242
"coming up with" == initial stages of new project; they will probably fall out (see projects passim), and the aircraft will only be in squadron service well beyond the current 2040 date ...0 -
BTW Unleaded is down to £1.227 at Asda.
Its rise didn't seem to affect the Conservative poll rating so I doubt its fall will.
But its good news all the same.0 -
The evidence of the last 2 years is that neither of your expectations is grounded in experience.Philip_Thompson said:
If we lose export markets to the EU then yes, but I'm expecting a deal which makes it nul.Foxy said:
But you agree that losing export markets to the EU pushes up unit costs. Thereby making our exports less competetive?Philip_Thompson said:
Its not about losing European markets its about the fact that Europe is falling in significance on its own accord.Foxy said:
I am familiar with the concept of opportunity cost, but it would be helpful if you could explain how losing European markets helps us win markets in Africa.Philip_Thompson said:
The argument isn't about population its about opportunities. Are you familiar with the concept of Opportunity Cost?tyson said:
And.....???Philip_Thompson said:
So does population and wealth. The EU is losing both at quite a rate. Currently it forms 7% of global population but that is falling annually. It will before too long be 6% at which point even if we do three times the trade per capita with Europeans as we do non-Europeans it still gets us to below 20%.rcs1000 said:Personally, I would be staggered if it ever fell below 20%. Time zones and distance matter.
Seriously, the Brexit population argument is bobbins
Much as I love Africa, surely smaller sales of Mini 's or Range Rogers to the EU pushes up unit costs, thereby making them more expensive elsewhere?
We will long-term (even if we leave without a deal) get a deal with Europe. We're not guaranteed a deal with the rest of the world. If we can seek a better deal with the rest of the world outside the EU then that becomes progressively more valuable as the rest of the world inevitably grows better than the EU will.
And surely losing existing EU FTAs worsens terms of trade initially?
I'm also expecting (though losing confidence in Fox) all existing FTAs rolling over.
Unless we stay in Customs Union etc.0 -
I see. Thanks.Philip_Thompson said:
From memory:welshowl said:
But if there are three on six points in a round robin tie?Philip_Thompson said:
Actually a tiebreaker before fair play is goals for excluding the team they're not tied with.welshowl said:
This could get really weird ( I think). I think if Sweden and Germany with their next games one nil Sweden, Germany, and Mexico have identical points, goal difference, goals scored, and would each have beaten one of the other two and lost to the other one. I think we then get down to number of red and yellow cards in a fair play points league.Pulpstar said:
If Germany beat S Korea by 2 goals or more then I think they're through.Philip_Thompson said:
Sweden need a better result than Germany. I think if Germany wins by 1 then Sweden winning by 2 gets them and Germany through.
A draw is good enough for Mexico.
I think.
Of course S Korea could thrash Germany four nil and still qualify if Mexico beat Sweden. But we’d all be on tranquilizers by then anyway and probably oxygen.
Points in group > Goal Difference in Group > Goals For in Group >
Goal Difference in Tied Teams > Goals For in Tied Teams >
Fair Play > Drawing of Lots
In your example although they have identical goal difference once you exclude the South Korean results the goals for changes (Sweden beat SK 1-0, Mexico 2-1).
0 -
I kind have disengaged from Brexit until from time to time I come on here read to some some Numpty, Dumpty ideological bullshit from the likes of Philip Thompson talking up some Liam Fox nonsense crap...Foxy said:
I am largely on the same place. I have arranged my affairs to do well in any outcome from A50 repeal to car crash Brexit. Now I just need to watch.tyson said:Foxy said:
My brother was there, but shares my scepticism about a second referendum. Pushing the government to BINO was his aim.tyson said:
I'm a very proud remainer and Europhile...but the last thing I could be arsed doing today is hoofing around London on a march.HYUFD said:
Looks like at least a few thousandFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010567125075939329
I've really lost the will on the Brexit thing...I've kind of filed it in the same place as climate change, badger culling, Japanese whaling, Trump (anything to do with), the ivory trade, the Mexico cartels, Jeremy Corbyn, Boris Johnson, JRM, Venezuela..you know the file marked as "shit..and better left alone".........
Anyway, headsup Foxy to your bro for giving a fuck still because I don't
Mine is a job that is in demand throughout the world, independent of the economy. If I were an auto worker then I might have trouble sleeping, but I am not.
For some reason I have never found building up significant amounts of wealth that difficult whatever decisions I make, Brexit or no Brexit...but I drive a car worth about 100 quid at a stretch, so I'm probably unusual....
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Because he is on Russian "support" ?rottenborough said:
I wonder why RT wanted an interview?Philip_Thompson said:
It was on ITV too. GerardBatten and his puny rally just aren't important enough to be interviewed.Foxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105671250759393290 -
I drive a 10 year old Fiat 500. It is a great little car.tyson said:
I kind have disengaged from Brexit until from time to time I come on here read to some some Numpty, Dumpty ideological bullshit from the likes of Philip Thompson talking up some Liam Fox nonsense crap...Foxy said:
I am largely on the same place. I have arranged my affairs to do well in any outcome from A50 repeal to car crash Brexit. Now I just need to watch.tyson said:Foxy said:
My brother was there, but shares my scepticism about a second referendum. Pushing the government to BINO was his aim.tyson said:
I'm a very proud remainer and Europhile...but the last thing I could be arsed doing today is hoofing around London on a march.HYUFD said:
Looks like at least a few thousandFoxy said:
It was on Channel 4 news, looked a couple of hundred.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010567125075939329
I've really lost the will on the Brexit thing...I've kind of filed it in the same place as climate change, badger culling, Japanese whaling, Trump (anything to do with), the ivory trade, the Mexico cartels, Jeremy Corbyn, Boris Johnson, JRM, Venezuela..you know the file marked as "shit..and better left alone".........
Anyway, headsup Foxy to your bro for giving a fuck still because I don't
Mine is a job that is in demand throughout the world, independent of the economy. If I were an auto worker then I might have trouble sleeping, but I am not.
For some reason I have never found building up significant amounts of wealth that difficult whatever decisions I make, Brexit or no Brexit...but I drive a car worth about 100 quid at a stretch, so I'm probably unusual....
Perhaps the secret of acquiring money is not spending much
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I don't see the 100,000 people number on the BBC website, doe anybody know were it came from?
Not saying it is wrong, just want to know0 -
What's that black flag with a yellow triangle in it ?Casino_Royale said:
That march was no better.HYUFD said:Looks like the pro Leave rally today had a few along too
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/1010522045757689859
https://twitter.com/GerardBattenMEP/status/10105671250759393290
This discussion has been closed.