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Do they this time, and if so how come we start geting results a midnight?rcs1000 said:
They has Monday voting as well in '08 and '13 so the numbers are directly comparablethecommissioner said:Europe Elects
@EuropeElects
Italy, General Election:
Turnout 19:00 CET
2018: 58.4%
2013: 46.6%
2008: 49.1%
#ElezioniPolitiche2018 #elezioni #Elezioni4Marzo2018 #ItalyElection20180 -
Midnightish, Andrea said. But nobody's going to have an overall majority so we won't know the government yet.FrancisUrquhart said:When we do expect to get a good idea how the criminal, the comedian, etc have got on in the italian election?
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Is it possible to watch the Italian election night programme online?0
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RAI is online in Italian, coverage in 35 minsAndyJS said:Is it possible to watch the Italian election night programme online?
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On the contrary, Disraeli was defeated on a franchise he himself had created to make it easier for the Conservatives to win an election, and Gladstone was not merely heavily defeated twice - 1874 and 1886 - on the first occasion he resigned in a huff and on the second occasion he split his party in two (including a former leader deciding to leave).OldKingCole said:
I don't think they were humiliated to the same extent though.David_Evershed said:
Didn't either Gladstone or Disraeli or both make a come back as PM after defeat?TheScreamingEagles said:
BecauseDavid_Evershed said:
Because ?TheScreamingEagles said:
No.David_Evershed said:
Could Cameron come back as Conservative leader after May?TheScreamingEagles said:
Especially in the absence of other suitable candidates.
1) He doesn't want to come back, he thinks once a PM has lost a general election/nation changing referendum then it's sine die for their political career.
2) A significant chunk of the Parliamentary Party wouldn't let him back, the ones that miss the halcyon days of the leadership of IDS, and twatbadgers like Andrew Bridgen who on June 24th 2016 would have triggered a confidence vote in David Cameron no matter the referendum result, even if Remain had won 90% to 10%.
Churchill suffered the second-worst defeat of any Conservative leader since 1832 in 1945 (the worst of course being 1906 - not counting later worse defeats 1997-2005). Wilson had been planning his weekend at Chequers when he learned Heath had won.
I think the crucial difference however is that now we have a concept of shelf life. In the 1930s there was nothing unusual (for example) about headmasters staying in post for forty years. You had a job, you did it. Now there is the idea that you seek 'fresh challenges' and anyone who stays too long in the same job is lacking in ambition/breadth/etc. So a party leader was a party leader until he quit (cf Derby - five general election defeats, 22 years in post).0 -
Yes, but that's not so bad. After all, the EU regulations are quite sensible and few if any Leavers can name any that they disagree with.Gardenwalker said:This article sums up my concerns with where we are on Brexit, better than I can manage.
https://t.co/LJF0ltXBly
The key point is that we are headed toward an illusory sovereignty. No say in the rules, in exchange for the theoretical - but not practical or realistic - ability to diverge.
We are headed for a regulatory vassalage.0 -
They need to get the EU to let them pretend to be taking back control first, and that doesn't seem likely.Foxy said:
Yes, but that's not so bad. After all, the EU regulations are quite sensible and few if any Leavers can name any that they disagree with.Gardenwalker said:This article sums up my concerns with where we are on Brexit, better than I can manage.
https://t.co/LJF0ltXBly
The key point is that we are headed toward an illusory sovereignty. No say in the rules, in exchange for the theoretical - but not practical or realistic - ability to diverge.
We are headed for a regulatory vassalage.
https://twitter.com/piris_jc/status/9703386169238405130 -
Because they make products that other countries want to buy, particularly pharmaceuticals?rcs1000 said:
The question Wilbur Ross (and Donald Trump) need to answer is this:williamglenn said:"Concessions that were perfectly reasonable to make to Germany in 1945 don't make sense anymore."
https://twitter.com/ABCPolitics/status/970317392743096320
Why does Switzerland, with the strongest currency in the world, with some of the highest costs in the world, and with FTAs with both the EU and China, run a large trade surplus (including in manufactured goods), while the US runs a large deficit?
(and of course their saving ratio)
Automation means that labour cost is less relevant to production cost than it once was, just look at automotive manufacturing.0 -
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Exit poll in 25 minutes (consume wih caution). There's a summary of the (populist) policies of the three main alliances here:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2018/mar/04/italy-goes-to-the-polls-general-election-live
Interesting that 5 stars wants to warm relations wih Russia. I wonder if the sockpuppets have been active.0 -
I like the slogan of the 'Free and Equal Party':GIN1138 said:
I've just been having a look at the 2018 Italian General Election page on Wiki;Slackbladder said:So, how's things looking in Italy?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_general_election,_2018
Looks like pretty much anything could happen!
Per i molti, non per i pochi - "For the many, not the few"
Very catchy. I'm surprised no UK party has used it.0 -
BTW, the letter T on my keyboard is only intermittently working - I generally have to press the key hard to make it register. What does that signify - loose wire, accumulated dust...?0
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I suppose Clem Attlee was the longest serving Party leader of 20th Century, at a little over 20 years, fighting as party leader in 4 General Elections, gaining seats in 2 and shedding them in 2.ydoethur said:
On the contrary, Disraeli was defeated on a franchise he himself had created to make it easier for the Conservatives to win an election, and Gladstone was not merely heavily defeated twice - 1874 and 1886 - on the first occasion he resigned in a huff and on the second occasion he split his party in two (including a former leader deciding to leave).OldKingCole said:
I don't think they were humiliated to the same extent though.David_Evershed said:
Didn't either Gladstone or Disraeli or both make a come back as PM after defeat?TheScreamingEagles said:
BecauseDavid_Evershed said:
Because ?TheScreamingEagles said:
No.David_Evershed said:
Could Cameron come back as Conservative leader after May?TheScreamingEagles said:
Especially in the absence of other suitable candidates.
1) He doesn't want to come back, he thinks once a PM has lost a general election/nation changing referendum then it's sine die for their political career.
2) A significant chunk of the Parliamentary Party wouldn't let him back, the ones that miss the halcyon days of the leadership of IDS, and twatbadgers like Andrew Bridgen who on June 24th 2016 would have triggered a confidence vote in David Cameron no matter the referendum result, even if Remain had won 90% to 10%.
Churchill suffered the second-worst defeat of any Conservative leader since 1832 in 1945 (the worst of course being 1906 - not counting later worse defeats 1997-2005). Wilson had been planning his weekend at Chequers when he learned Heath had won.
I think the crucial difference however is that now we have a concept of shelf life. In the 1930s there was nothing unusual (for example) about headmasters staying in post for forty years. You had a job, you did it. Now there is the idea that you seek 'fresh challenges' and anyone who stays too long in the same job is lacking in ambition/breadth/etc. So a party leader was a party leader until he quit (cf Derby - five general election defeats, 22 years in post).
I do think that the modern pracice of resigning within days of losing an election is to be deplored. It means that the replacement is chosen at haste, and often a bit more reflection on what went wrong before picking the next would be a wiser course of action.0 -
Could be all sorts of things and dependent on the actual type of keybaord i.e. standard vs mechanical.NickPalmer said:BTW, the letter T on my keyboard is only intermittently working - I generally have to press the key hard to make it register. What does that signify - loose wire, accumulated dust...?
Can you remove the keycaps on your keyboard? If not, do you have compressed air, if you do try blowing it into the gaps near the key and see if dust / hair moves.0 -
It would take a total idiot in government to get into bother over pasties.TheScreamingEagles said:To be filed under Brexit bonus?
https://twitter.com/MsHelicat/status/9704116282347929600 -
All proper T is theft?NickPalmer said:BTW, the letter T on my keyboard is only intermittently working - I generally have to press the key hard to make it register. What does that signify - loose wire, accumulated dust...?
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This has Cameron comeback media strategy written all over it. He's going to ride to the rescue to stop Brexit and save his beloved Cornish pasties.TheScreamingEagles said:To be filed under Brexit bonus?
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Thanks.TheWhiteRabbit said:
RAI is online in Italian, coverage in 35 minsAndyJS said:Is it possible to watch the Italian election night programme online?
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Or to try some cringe PR stunt by a politician to go to a Greggs for the first time in their life for their lunch...SandyRentool said:
It would take a total idiot in government to get into bother over pasties.TheScreamingEagles said:To be filed under Brexit bonus?
https://twitter.com/MsHelicat/status/9704116282347929600 -
Thanks! (and lol Foxy) Don't think they're removable (just a laptop keboard) bu will try a freh blast...FrancisUrquhart said:
Could be all sorts of things and dependent on the actual type of keybaord i.e. standard vs mechanical.NickPalmer said:BTW, the letter T on my keyboard is only intermittently working - I generally have to press the key hard to make it register. What does that signify - loose wire, accumulated dust...?
Can you remove the keycaps on your keyboard? If not, do you have compressed air, if you do try blowing it into the gaps near the key and see if dust / hair moves.0 -
SandyRentool said:
It would take a total idiot in government to get into bother over pasties.TheScreamingEagles said:To be filed under Brexit bonus?
https://twitter.com/MsHelicat/status/970411628234792960 0 -
You could always try adding some coffee to lubricate the keys. Doesn't seem to have done my laptop any permanent harm.NickPalmer said:
Thanks! (and lol Foxy) Don't think they're removable (just a laptop keboard) bu will try a freh blast...FrancisUrquhart said:
Could be all sorts of things and dependent on the actual type of keybaord i.e. standard vs mechanical.NickPalmer said:BTW, the letter T on my keyboard is only intermittently working - I generally have to press the key hard to make it register. What does that signify - loose wire, accumulated dust...?
Can you remove the keycaps on your keyboard? If not, do you have compressed air, if you do try blowing it into the gaps near the key and see if dust / hair moves.0 -
Is there any language that does not borrow "exit poll" from the English??0
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Election night shows, (thanks to Andrea for the links on the VoteUK forum):
https://www.raiplay.it/dirette/rai1
http://www.la7.it/dirette-tv0 -
NickPalmer said:
BTW, the letter T on my keyboard is only intermittently working - I generally have to press the key hard to make it register. What does that signify - loose wire, accumulated dust...?
It's a _ory plot.
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TheWhiteRabbit said:
Is there any language that does not borrow "exit poll" from the English??
English.
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Dominic Raab coming across extremely well in a tough interview on Sky News. Seems on top of his brief, non waffly and yet never got pinned down.0
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Oh I walked into that!!MarkHopkins said:TheWhiteRabbit said:Is there any language that does not borrow "exit poll" from the English??
English.0 -
David Dimbleby is waving a calculator.
I assume it's a metaphor for the electoral calculus...0 -
£5 on Tajani, he's the proxy for a strong Forza showing I think. God only knows though.0
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Nah, the Cornish voted Leave, this is what they voted for.williamglenn said:
This has Cameron comeback media strategy written all over it. He's going to ride to the rescue to stop Brexit and save his beloved Cornish pasties.TheScreamingEagles said:To be filed under Brexit bonus?
We need to respect the vote.
#LifeComesAtYouFast0 -
Italy exit poll
https://twitter.com/EuropeElects/status/970419023350521856
5*projected to be comfortably largest party, could be touch and go whether Berlusconi's coalition or 5* will have more seats but the governing Democratic Party's centre left coalition has clearly lost0 -
5 star - 48%0
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I would say you're right about Attlee, then I think it would be Asquith (Salisbury although hardly any of that was in the twentieth century) Thatcher, Churchill.Foxy said:I suppose Clem Attlee was the longest serving Party leader of 20th Century, at a little over 20 years, fighting as party leader in 4 General Elections, gaining seats in 2 and shedding them in 2.
I do think that the modern pracice of resigning within days of losing an election is to be deplored. It means that the replacement is chosen at haste, and often a bit more reflection on what went wrong before picking the next would be a wiser course of action.
Not totally sure I agree about the second. Surely the issue is not a failed leader resigning but the over-hasty election of a replacement - which hasn't really been an issue since Hague in 1997 due to the wider membership now having a vote in all parties (not that either point has stopped some turkeys being elected).0 -
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Sky cock up - 29%Big_G_NorthWales said:5 star - 48%
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The one on RAI very slightly different but same arithmaticHYUFD said:Italy exit poll
https://twitter.com/EuropeElects/status/970419023350521856
5*projected to be comfortably largest party0 -
Clearly nonsense, whoever typed that in.Big_G_NorthWales said:5 star - 48%
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OGH style typo from Sky...Big_G_NorthWales said:5 star - 48%
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RAI says
M5S-EFDD: 29-32%
PD-S&D: 20.5-22.5%
FI-EPP: 13-16%
Lega-ENF: 13-16%
LeU-S&D:3-5%
FdI-*: 4-6%
+E-*: 2.5-4.5%
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Has Sterling just moved?FrancisUrquhart said:
OGH style typo from Sky...Big_G_NorthWales said:5 star - 48%
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Italy exit polls
(mind you, they have often been wrong...)
RAI
FI, Lega, FdI, etc 33-37% (Lega and Forza Italia tied)
5 Stars 29-32%
PD and friends 25-28%
Free and Equals 3-5%0 -
Pretty much in line with the polls, but 5 stars doing a bit better than predicted, the cenre-right marginally less well. All MOE though.HYUFD said:Italy exit poll
https://twitter.com/EuropeElects/status/970419023350521856
5*projected to be comfortably largest party, could be touch and go whether Berlusconi's coalition or 5* will have more seats but the governing Democratic Party's centre left coalition has clearly lost0 -
One thing you can say for Italian politics, they certainly aren't all the same and you have some serious choice...even if that choice includes openly neo fascists and communists...0
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Mortimer said:
Has Sterling just moved?FrancisUrquhart said:
OGH style typo from Sky...Big_G_NorthWales said:5 star - 48%
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I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?0 -
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?0 -
Indeed. Maybe @TheScreamingEagles may gift us with an article about alternate voting systems...FrancisUrquhart said:One thing you can say for Italian politics, they certainly aren't all the same and you have some serious choice...even if that choice includes openly neo fascists and communists...
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Centro Desta block ahead on RAI's summed up exit poll0
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They do - rain or shinebrendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?0 -
OT Winston Churchill -- earlier I quoted from Nicholas Shakespeare's book on the Norway campaign and its aftermath -- Six Minutes in May: How Churchill Unexpectedly Became Prime Minister.
I've just noticed it was the subject of this evening's BBC Book Talk, on iplayer at:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b09wj4xt/booktalk-nicholas-shakespeare0 -
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0
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0
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Blimey! Just been looking at the promises made by LN FI and 5 Star.
Cut retirement age, double pensions and a miimum income of 1000 Euro a month amongst others.
Cue outrage from those who thought the Labour Manifesto was extreme.0 -
Given Romford voted 75 per cent leave it would be a good opportunity for some remainers on here to enjoy a whole new experience without having to venture outside the M25!FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?0 -
Must surely be a chance on these numbers Di Maio becomes PM if he can do a deal with Berlusconi, Silvio might be tempted if LN comes ahead of FI and the alternative is PM Salvini0
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Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.0 -
Considering the vast choice of parties, Italy does seem rather short of credible governments.dixiedean said:Blimey! Just been looking at the promises made by LN FI and 5 Star.
Cut retirement age, double pensions and a miimum income of 1000 Euro a month amongst others.
Cue outrage from those who thought the Labour Manifesto was extreme.
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And what did the socialists promise - even more? The centre left had also proposed changes to the way Italian citizenship was granted - moving to the US jus soli model - birth not parentage.dixiedean said:Blimey! Just been looking at the promises made by LN FI and 5 Star.
Cut retirement age, double pensions and a miimum income of 1000 Euro a month amongst others.
Cue outrage from those who thought the Labour Manifesto was extreme.0 -
Are you sure you are into women? Combined with your love of Steps and the Vengaboys, your gig list sounds like a G.A.Y. greatest hits night.TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.0 -
I've clocked off and am watching Supermodels of Shield on E4, but will check it out afterwards, thank you.DecrepitJohnL said:OT Winston Churchill -- earlier I quoted from Nicholas Shakespeare's book on the Norway campaign and its aftermath -- Six Minutes in May: How Churchill Unexpectedly Became Prime Minister.
I've just noticed it was the subject of this evening's BBC Book Talk, on iplayer at:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b09wj4xt/booktalk-nicholas-shakespeare0 -
I agree. May and Corbyn both bucked that trend last year though.Foxy said:
I suppose Clem Attlee was the longest serving Party leader of 20th Century, at a little over 20 years, fighting as party leader in 4 General Elections, gaining seats in 2 and shedding them in 2.ydoethur said:
On the contrary, Disraeli was defeated on a franchise he himself had created to make it easier for the Conservatives to win an election, and Gladstone was not merely heavily defeated twice - 1874 and 1886 - on the first occasion he resigned in a huff and on the second occasion he split his party in two (including a former leader deciding to leave).OldKingCole said:
I don't think they were humiliated to the same extent though.David_Evershed said:
Didn't either Gladstone or Disraeli or both make a come back as PM after defeat?TheScreamingEagles said:
BecauseDavid_Evershed said:
Because ?TheScreamingEagles said:
1) He doesn't want to come back, he thinks once a PM has lost a general election/nation changing referendum then it's sine die for their political career.
2) A significant chunk of the Parliamentary Party wouldn't let him back, the ones that miss the halcyon days of the leadership of IDS, and twatbadgers like Andrew Bridgen who on June 24th 2016 would have triggered a confidence vote in David Cameron no matter the referendum result, even if Remain had won 90% to 10%.
Churchill suffered the second-worst defeat of any Conservative leader since 1832 in 1945 (the worst of course being 1906 - not counting later worse defeats 1997-2005). Wilson had been planning his weekend at Chequers when he learned Heath had won.
I think the crucial difference however is that now we have a concept of shelf life. In the 1930s there was nothing unusual (for example) about headmasters staying in post for forty years. You had a job, you did it. Now there is the idea that you seek 'fresh challenges' and anyone who stays too long in the same job is lacking in ambition/breadth/etc. So a party leader was a party leader until he quit (cf Derby - five general election defeats, 22 years in post).
I do think that the modern pracice of resigning within days of losing an election is to be deplored. It means that the replacement is chosen at haste, and often a bit more reflection on what went wrong before picking the next would be a wiser course of action.
Also to be deplored is the going off in a huff to half a dozen other lucrative jobs just because you don't win the leadership race (GO).0 -
Garbage?TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.0 -
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FrancisUrquhart said:
Are you sure you are into women? Combined with your love of Steps and the Vengaboys, your gig list sounds like a G.A.Y. greatest hits night.TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music. 0 -
I didn't choose to go see the Vengaboys, they were the support act for Steps.FrancisUrquhart said:
Are you sure you are into women? Combined with your love of Steps and the Vengaboys, your gig list sounds like a G.A.Y. greatest hits night.TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.
Shirley Manson of Garbage is the reason I have a weakness for redheads.0 -
I wonder whyHYUFD said:0 -
In voteshare terms looks like the biggest gainers in Italy are the anti immigration Lega Nord
https://twitter.com/EuropeElects/status/9704242013656064000 -
I saw the Vengaboys at a university may ball (we weren't a classy place!). They got the giggles in the middle of one of the songs and had to restart the verse.TheScreamingEagles said:
I didn't choose to go see the Vengaboys, they were the support act for Steps.FrancisUrquhart said:
Are you sure you are into women? Combined with your love of Steps and the Vengaboys, your gig list sounds like a G.A.Y. greatest hits night.TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.
Shirley Manson of Garbage is the reason I have a weakness for redheads.0 -
There is clearly a significant proportion of the population that isn't willing to accept reality. Not sure how long that will remain feasible as move more and more to AI / high tech / globalized world, I always fear Italy becoming another Greece.dixiedean said:Blimey! Just been looking at the promises made by LN FI and 5 Star.
Cut retirement age, double pensions and a miimum income of 1000 Euro a month amongst others.
Cue outrage from those who thought the Labour Manifesto was extreme.0 -
Just called Lega now and not just in the North. Inf act their hardhitting anti-immigration stance goes down well down South...HYUFD said:In voteshare terms looks like the biggest gainers in Italy are the anti immigration Lega Nord
https://twitter.com/EuropeElects/status/9704242013656064000 -
Watch, listen, and enjoy.GIN1138 said:
Garbage?TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpBFOJ3R0M4
and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypr18UmxOas0 -
One of the exit polls is saying the Democratic Party could go as low as 17.5%.0
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But did he see Erasure in February? That's the acid test.FrancisUrquhart said:
Are you sure you are into women? Combined with your love of Steps and the Vengaboys, your gig list sounds like a G.A.Y. greatest hits night.TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.0 -
No. They promised less economically.brendan16 said:
And what did the socialists promise - even more? The centre left had also proposed changes to the way Italian citizenship was granted - moving to the US jus soli model - birth not parentage.dixiedean said:Blimey! Just been looking at the promises made by LN FI and 5 Star.
Cut retirement age, double pensions and a miimum income of 1000 Euro a month amongst others.
Cue outrage from those who thought the Labour Manifesto was extreme.
Are you suggesting fiscal irresponsibility is OK if it is done by the Right?
0 -
Excellent time to be jumping out of the EU single market and making our own way in the world as it enters a period of trade wars.TheScreamingEagles said:
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One advantage of having so many parties is that no one gets to implement their manifesto, so any absurdity is fine!FrancisUrquhart said:
There is clearly a significant proportion of the population that isn't willing to accept reality. Not sure how long that will remain feasible as move more and more to AI / high tech / globalized world, I always fear Italy becoming another Greece.dixiedean said:Blimey! Just been looking at the promises made by LN FI and 5 Star.
Cut retirement age, double pensions and a miimum income of 1000 Euro a month amongst others.
Cue outrage from those who thought the Labour Manifesto was extreme.0 -
I'm not keen on Erasure, saw them live years ago and they murdered the ABBA song they were trying to cover.Ishmael_Z said:
But did he see Erasure in February? That's the acid test.FrancisUrquhart said:
Are you sure you are into women? Combined with your love of Steps and the Vengaboys, your gig list sounds like a G.A.Y. greatest hits night.TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.0 -
If we move more and more to AI/high tech/globalized world such populist policies will become the norm in most developed countries as voters have nothing to lose, if for most people beyond those with the highest tech skills and most creativity the jobs on offer are insecure and temporary and relatively low paid what do they have to lose from seeking promises of a guaranteed minimum universal income whether in employment or not and an early and well funded retirement?FrancisUrquhart said:
There is clearly a significant proportion of the population that isn't willing to accept reality. Not sure how long that will remain feasible as move more and more to AI / high tech / globalized world, I always fear Italy becoming another Greece.dixiedean said:Blimey! Just been looking at the promises made by LN FI and 5 Star.
Cut retirement age, double pensions and a miimum income of 1000 Euro a month amongst others.
Cue outrage from those who thought the Labour Manifesto was extreme.0 -
North of the M25 is going to get a tad busier...
Five new garden towns could be built between Oxford and Cambridge bringing thousands of new homes
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5460799/Five-new-garden-towns-built-Oxford-Cambridge.html0 -
0
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Agree entirely.FrancisUrquhart said:
There is clearly a significant proportion of the population that isn't willing to accept reality. Not sure how long that will remain feasible as move more and more to AI / high tech / globalized world, I always fear Italy becoming another Greece.dixiedean said:Blimey! Just been looking at the promises made by LN FI and 5 Star.
Cut retirement age, double pensions and a miimum income of 1000 Euro a month amongst others.
Cue outrage from those who thought the Labour Manifesto was extreme.0 -
TheScreamingEagles said:
Watch, listen, and enjoy.GIN1138 said:
Garbage?TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpBFOJ3R0M4
and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypr18UmxOas
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But unlike the UK, Italy remains highly unreformed, so can least afford to entertain the idea of supporting something like UBI. France under Macron has recognized they have to get their shit together.HYUFD said:
If we move more and more to AI/high tech/globalized world such populist policies will become the norm in most developed countries as voters have nothing to lose, if for most people beyond those with the highest tech skills and most creativity the jobs on offer are insecure and temporary what do they have to lose from seeking a guaranteed minimum universal income whether in employment or not?FrancisUrquhart said:
There is clearly a significant proportion of the population that isn't willing to accept reality. Not sure how long that will remain feasible as move more and more to AI / high tech / globalized world, I always fear Italy becoming another Greece.dixiedean said:Blimey! Just been looking at the promises made by LN FI and 5 Star.
Cut retirement age, double pensions and a miimum income of 1000 Euro a month amongst others.
Cue outrage from those who thought the Labour Manifesto was extreme.0 -
I'd be happy to go but £43 a ticket...TheScreamingEagles said:
Watch, listen, and enjoy.GIN1138 said:
Garbage?TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpBFOJ3R0M4
and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypr18UmxOas0 -
This is all getting a bit nasty...
The BBC is lying about its tax affairs, according to 170 presenters who have produced emails they say prove the corporation pressured them to set up personal service companies or risk losing their jobs.
The group, which includes some of Britain's best-known broadcasters in news, sport and entertainment and describes itself as "the faces and voices of the BBC", said the corporation is attempting to shift "the moral and financial burden" of its mismanagement onto presenters.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/03/04/bbc-lying-tax-affairs-have-emails-prove-170-presenters-say/0 -
Take a Chance on Me? I bloody love that; esp. the demented rap section.TheScreamingEagles said:
I'm not keen on Erasure, saw them live years ago and they murdered the ABBA song they were trying to cover.Ishmael_Z said:
But did he see Erasure in February? That's the acid test.FrancisUrquhart said:
Are you sure you are into women? Combined with your love of Steps and the Vengaboys, your gig list sounds like a G.A.Y. greatest hits night.TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.0 -
No doubt Labour will have a lot to say about this....FrancisUrquhart said:This is all getting a bit nasty...
The BBC is lying about its tax affairs, according to 170 presenters who have produced emails they say prove the corporation pressured them to set up personal service companies or risk losing their jobs.
The group, which includes some of Britain's best-known broadcasters in news, sport and entertainment and describes itself as "the faces and voices of the BBC", said the corporation is attempting to shift "the moral and financial burden" of its mismanagement onto presenters.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/03/04/bbc-lying-tax-affairs-have-emails-prove-170-presenters-say/0 -
The 5 star movement does seem to now have a fairly mainstream manifesto:
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-italy-election-5star/italys-5-star-presents-election-programme-with-no-euro-referendum-idUKKBN1FB1LG0 -
UBI may have to come though, for reasons you alluded to earlier. It is also not necessarily a Left issue. Milton Friedman was a proponent.FrancisUrquhart said:
But unlike the UK, Italy remains highly unreformed, so can least afford to entertain the idea of supporting something like UBI. France under Macron has recognized they have to get their shit together.HYUFD said:
If we move more and more to AI/high tech/globalized world such populist policies will become the norm in most developed countries as voters have nothing to lose, if for most people beyond those with the highest tech skills and most creativity the jobs on offer are insecure and temporary what do they have to lose from seeking a guaranteed minimum universal income whether in employment or not?FrancisUrquhart said:
There is clearly a significant proportion of the population that isn't willing to accept reality. Not sure how long that will remain feasible as move more and more to AI / high tech / globalized world, I always fear Italy becoming another Greece.dixiedean said:Blimey! Just been looking at the promises made by LN FI and 5 Star.
Cut retirement age, double pensions and a miimum income of 1000 Euro a month amongst others.
Cue outrage from those who thought the Labour Manifesto was extreme.0 -
Dancing Queen.Ishmael_Z said:
Take a Chance on Me? I bloody love that; esp. the demented rap section.TheScreamingEagles said:
I'm not keen on Erasure, saw them live years ago and they murdered the ABBA song they were trying to cover.Ishmael_Z said:
But did he see Erasure in February? That's the acid test.FrancisUrquhart said:
Are you sure you are into women? Combined with your love of Steps and the Vengaboys, your gig list sounds like a G.A.Y. greatest hits night.TheScreamingEagles said:
Gigs I'm going to this year are The Rolling Stones, Kylie, Justin Timberlake, Garbage, and A-Ha.FrancisUrquhart said:
According to wikipedia, apparently 5* still perform as a 4-piece....its the sort of gigs we will find TSE going to.brendan16 said:I am afraid when I think of 5 star I think of the pop group from Romford.
Still sounds like FI and Lega Nord will be the largest grouping so presumably will pick the PM. How can the group which came third - the centre left - hold the premiership?
Do 5 star even want to be in government?
I have excellent taste in music.0 -
Where are Oscar’s Roger Tips?0
