politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Poll boost for TMay as she struggles to hang on at Number 10
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We have had a lot of immigration also from western Europe. Plenty of French, Germans, Spanish, Italians, Swedes etc here. And there is also a fair amount of British emigration to those countries.brendan16 said:
Most of our EU migration has come from Eastern European nations which are of course about 99.5 per cent white and not exactly tolerant of diversity. So as you say it's an odd response.TGOHF said:
Everyone in Canada, NZ and Aus is white ?AlastairMeeks said:Ah, Canzuk. The freedom of movement movement for people who don't mind immigration from countries that are white and English-speaking.
How racist of you to ignore their immigrants and indigenous peoples.
Canada, NZ and Australia are progressive multi cultural societies with which we share common legal systems, a common language, a common head of state, historic cultural and sporting links, common parliamentary systems and strong family ties. When people are asked in the UK where they would like to emigrate too those three countries top the list. Wouldn't it be quite useful to have freedom of movement with nations you might actually want to move to - barely 14000 Brits have moved to Eastern Europe since 2004.
Freedom of movement is only productive if it is two way - it's not much use when as we have it's totally one way with the vast majority of EU members.
Nothing racist about Canzuk - as for Eastern European attitudes no comment! Canzuk won't happen though - half the country would I be on the first plane to Sydney, Vancouver and Auckland!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1275878/Three-quarters-Britons-want-emigrate-Australia-popular-destination.html
There's absolutely zero chance of Australia, Canada and New Zealand agreeing "free movement of people" with the UK.
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And how does that work? Do we set up an automatic bribe payment system or do we instead show them how we do it in splendid ol' Blighty, capital of civilisation? :rollseyes:Sandpit said:
No, it’s so that we can get around some of their red tape.williamglenn said:
So that we can import more of those practices into the UK?Sandpit said:
Yup, the place is full of stupid red tape that gets in the way of doing business there, especially for foreigners. Which is why it would be a good place to start with a trade deal.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, Indian bureaucratic bullshit is why F1 stopped going there. Which is good, because they had the worst circuit I've ever seen.
The Indians have already stated what they want for a deal - the ability to export more Indians to the UK. I thought Brexit was about reducing immigration?0 -
Gardenwalker said:
Leave it Barnesian, it’s not worth it.
Brexiters are able to simultaneously believe that they’ll be better off outside the EU and that all facts are essentially unknowable except as personally divined.
Brexistentialism.
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They wanted faster business visas. Not the same as what you claimedBeverley_C said:
And how does that work? Do we set up an automatic bribe payment system or do we instead show them how we do it in splendid ol' Blighty, capital of civilisation? :rollseyes:Sandpit said:
No, it’s so that we can get around some of their red tape.williamglenn said:
So that we can import more of those practices into the UK?Sandpit said:
Yup, the place is full of stupid red tape that gets in the way of doing business there, especially for foreigners. Which is why it would be a good place to start with a trade deal.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, Indian bureaucratic bullshit is why F1 stopped going there. Which is good, because they had the worst circuit I've ever seen.
The Indians have already stated what they want for a deal - the ability to export more Indians to the UK. I thought Brexit was about reducing immigration?0 -
You of course rarely find that the condemnatory liberal elites who use such terms actually choose to live in the most multi cultural areas of London like Newham or Ilford (like our resident Brexiteer Sunil) or Hounslow or Lewisham where they could get bigger houses for their money. No it's the wealthy enclaves like Hampstead and Richmond for them - shopping at Watirose and the local charcuterie rather than Iceland and Aldi where the plebs they look down on shop at and objecting to every new housing development that might bring in a poorer or more diverse population to their exclusive enclaves - as any regular read of papers like the Camden New journal will testify.YBarddCwsc said:
I was in Budapest the other day, at a charming restaurant in Buda.SandyRentool said:
How much ethnic diversity is there in Hungary? A fair bit more in Canada.AlastairMeeks said:Ah, Canzuk. The freedom of movement movement for people who don't mind immigration from countries that are white and English-speaking.
I complimented the waitress on the food and the surroundings. "Yes, it is nice in Buda by the castle. But in Pest there are many dirty Roma."
I thought of Meeks in the Land of the Xenophobes, as I withheld my tip.
They are often the biggest hypocrites of all - judge them not by what they say but what they do and where they choose to live.0 -
Brexit is more akin to us being The Crimson Permanent Assurance Company, straining to set sail on the wild open seas of buccaneering free trade.Beverley_C said:
And how does that work? Do we set up an automatic bribe payment system or do we instead show them how we do it in splendid ol' Blighty, capital of civilisation? :rollseyes:Sandpit said:
No, it’s so that we can get around some of their red tape.williamglenn said:
So that we can import more of those practices into the UK?Sandpit said:
Yup, the place is full of stupid red tape that gets in the way of doing business there, especially for foreigners. Which is why it would be a good place to start with a trade deal.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, Indian bureaucratic bullshit is why F1 stopped going there. Which is good, because they had the worst circuit I've ever seen.
The Indians have already stated what they want for a deal - the ability to export more Indians to the UK. I thought Brexit was about reducing immigration?
https://vimeo.com/111458975
The EU is, of course, in the role of the Very Big Corporation of America.0 -
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.0 -
I brexit therefore I exist (although on 5% to 8% less money).Gardenwalker said:
Leave it Barnesian, it’s not worth it.Barnesian said:
The decision on the third runway at Heathrow has been made on a 40 year projection of the economic benefit compared with Gatwick and it is finely balanced.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, I'm not sure how much a 15 year forecast is worth given most people got their recent 1 year forecast somewhere between wrong and very wrong.
Oil and Pharmaceutical companies routinely do thirty year projections because of the long term nature of their investments. The decsion on the EU is long term
The alternative is to guess or follow your prejudice.
Brexiters are able to simultaneously believe that they’ll be better off outside the EU and that all facts are essentially unknowable except as personally divined.
Brexistentialism.0 -
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..0 -
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/11/23/britain-must-accept-immigrants-wants-free-trade-deal-warns-senior/Charles said:
They wanted faster business visas. Not the same as what you claimedBeverley_C said:
And how does that work? Do we set up an automatic bribe payment system or do we instead show them how we do it in splendid ol' Blighty, capital of civilisation? :rollseyes:Sandpit said:
No, it’s so that we can get around some of their red tape.williamglenn said:
So that we can import more of those practices into the UK?Sandpit said:
Yup, the place is full of stupid red tape that gets in the way of doing business there, especially for foreigners. Which is why it would be a good place to start with a trade deal.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, Indian bureaucratic bullshit is why F1 stopped going there. Which is good, because they had the worst circuit I've ever seen.
The Indians have already stated what they want for a deal - the ability to export more Indians to the UK. I thought Brexit was about reducing immigration?
"Britain must accept higher levels of immigration from India if it hopes to sign a free trade agreement after Brexit, a senior Indian diplomat has warned, as he predicted it could take up to a decade to secure the deal."
There are dozens more like that out there. 20 seconds Googling should dig them up because they are not hard to find and the Indians seem quite clear about what they want. It is not exactly a secret...0 -
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..0 -
Oh shush. Don't you realise that they're all pining for empire 2.0?Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.0 -
Richmond is increasingly too expensive for the "liberal elite" these days as evidenced by its big shift to the Tories pre-Brexit. Perhaps the banking and hedge fund elite would be a better description for the population there. This largely applies to Hampstead proper as well. You're more likely to find the media elite types in places like Highgate these days.brendan16 said:
You of course rarely find that the condemnatory liberal elites who use such terms actually choose to live in the most multi cultural areas of London like Newham or Ilford or Hounslow or Lewisham where they coukd get bigger houses for their money. No it's the wealthy white wealthy enclaves like Hampstead and Richmond for them - shopping at Watirose and the local charcuterie rather than Iceland and Aldi where the plebs they look down on shop at and objecting to every new housing development that might bring in a poorer or more diverse population to their exclusive enclaves as any regular read of papers like the Camden New journal will testify.YBarddCwsc said:
I was in Budapest the other day, at a charming restaurant in Buda.SandyRentool said:
How much ethnic diversity is there in Hungary? A fair bit more in Canada.AlastairMeeks said:Ah, Canzuk. The freedom of movement movement for people who don't mind immigration from countries that are white and English-speaking.
I complimented the waitress on the food and the surroundings. "Yes, it is nice in Buda by the castle. But in Pest there are many dirty Roma."
I thought of Meeks in the Land of the Xenophobes, as I withheld my tip.
They are often the biggest hypocrites of all - judge them not by what they say but what they do and choose to live.0 -
Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.0
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Business visas are a huge NTB to trade, it’s not difficult to set up some sort of pre-approval scheme and make the necessary process as simple as possible, especially for frequent travellers.Charles said:
They wanted faster business visas. Not the same as what you claimedBeverley_C said:
And how does that work? Do we set up an automatic bribe payment system or do we instead show them how we do it in splendid ol' Blighty, capital of civilisation? :rollseyes:Sandpit said:
No, it’s so that we can get around some of their red tape.williamglenn said:
So that we can import more of those practices into the UK?Sandpit said:
Yup, the place is full of stupid red tape that gets in the way of doing business there, especially for foreigners. Which is why it would be a good place to start with a trade deal.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, Indian bureaucratic bullshit is why F1 stopped going there. Which is good, because they had the worst circuit I've ever seen.
The Indians have already stated what they want for a deal - the ability to export more Indians to the UK. I thought Brexit was about reducing immigration?0 -
AlastairMeeks said:
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..
Again highlighting the untapped markets out there..Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.0 -
I'm an inverted snob.brendan16 said:
You of course rarely find that the condemnatory liberal elites who use such terms actually choose to live in the most multi cultural areas of London like Newham or Ilford or Hounslow or Lewisham where they coukd get bigger houses for their money. No it's the wealthy white wealthy enclaves like Hampstead and Richmond for them - shopping at Watirose and the local charcuterie rather than Iceland and Aldi where the plebs they look down on shop at and objecting to every new housing development that might bring in a poorer or more diverse population to their exclusive enclaves as any regular read of papers like the Camden New journal will testify.YBarddCwsc said:
I was in Budapest the other day, at a charming restaurant in Buda.SandyRentool said:
How much ethnic diversity is there in Hungary? A fair bit more in Canada.AlastairMeeks said:Ah, Canzuk. The freedom of movement movement for people who don't mind immigration from countries that are white and English-speaking.
I complimented the waitress on the food and the surroundings. "Yes, it is nice in Buda by the castle. But in Pest there are many dirty Roma."
I thought of Meeks in the Land of the Xenophobes, as I withheld my tip.
They are often the biggest hypocrites of all - judge them not by what they say but what they do and choose to live.
I choose to live in the valleys. Whenever I'm in Chelsea or the leafier parts of sophisticated London I pine for my friendlier and happier, down-at-heel area. I love it here and can't understand why anyone would choose to live in London, whether in a nice part or posh part.
It's nothing to do with multi-cultures. London is just a busy, stressful, unfriendly rat racing arena.
Each to their own of course.
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There seems to be a fair number of Leavers on here who all live abroad and tell us all how great the UK will be post-Brexit whilst they live the ex-pat life.brendan16 said:
You of course rarely find that the condemnatory liberal elites who use such terms actually choose to live in the most multi cultural areas of London like Newham or IlfordYBarddCwsc said:
I was in Budapest the other day, at a charming restaurant in Buda.SandyRentool said:
How much ethnic diversity is there in Hungary? A fair bit more in Canada.AlastairMeeks said:Ah, Canzuk. The freedom of movement movement for people who don't mind immigration from countries that are white and English-speaking.
I complimented the waitress on the food and the surroundings. "Yes, it is nice in Buda by the castle. But in Pest there are many dirty Roma."
I thought of Meeks in the Land of the Xenophobes, as I withheld my tip.
I refer the Honourable Gentleman to my previous answer .....brendan16 said:They are often the biggest hypocrites of all - judge them not by what they say but what they do and where they choose to live.
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It's like a Cathy Newman interviewMorris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
"It is possible we could trade more with Canada ..."
"So you are saying you want to hark back to the Empire and only integrate with white people ?????"
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Driverless taxis in Singapore within four years ?
https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Companies/Ride-hailing-app-Grab-to-launch-autonomous-taxis-before-20220 -
Actually, the more multicultural the area, the more likely to vote (edit) Remain.brendan16 said:
You of course rarely find that the condemnatory liberal elites who use such terms actually choose to live in the most multi cultural areas of London like Newham or Ilford (like our resident Brexiteer Sunil) or Hounslow or Lewisham where they could get bigger houses for their money. No it's the wealthy enclaves like Hampstead and Richmond for them - shopping at Watirose and the local charcuterie rather than Iceland and Aldi where the plebs they look down on shop at and objecting to every new housing development that might bring in a poorer or more diverse population to their exclusive enclaves - as any regular read of papers like the Camden New journal will testify.YBarddCwsc said:
I was in Budapest the other day, at a charming restaurant in Buda.SandyRentool said:
How much ethnic diversity is there in Hungary? A fair bit more in Canada.AlastairMeeks said:Ah, Canzuk. The freedom of movement movement for people who don't mind immigration from countries that are white and English-speaking.
I complimented the waitress on the food and the surroundings. "Yes, it is nice in Buda by the castle. But in Pest there are many dirty Roma."
I thought of Meeks in the Land of the Xenophobes, as I withheld my tip.
They are often the biggest hypocrites of all - judge them not by what they say but what they do and where they choose to live.
Another pile of cack from the race-baiting Brexiters.0 -
TBF India does have a PTA with Japan. Japan wanted sensible import tariffs on their cars and were prepared to offer access on services. Expect India to push us very hard on services, particularly Mode 4 (presence of natural persons) ie wholesale import of cheap IT staff. For our part we compete on services too and don't export a lot of cars to India.Beverley_C said:
And how does that work? Do we set up an automatic bribe payment system or do we instead show them how we do it in splendid ol' Blighty, capital of civilisation? :rollseyes:Sandpit said:
No, it’s so that we can get around some of their red tape.williamglenn said:
So that we can import more of those practices into the UK?Sandpit said:
Yup, the place is full of stupid red tape that gets in the way of doing business there, especially for foreigners. Which is why it would be a good place to start with a trade deal.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, Indian bureaucratic bullshit is why F1 stopped going there. Which is good, because they had the worst circuit I've ever seen.
The Indians have already stated what they want for a deal - the ability to export more Indians to the UK. I thought Brexit was about reducing immigration?0 -
It's the same mad logic that screeches with horror about gentrification.Beverley_C said:
There seems to be a fair number of Leavers on here who all live abroad and tell us all how great the UK will be post-Brexit whilst they live the ex-pat life.brendan16 said:
You of course rarely find that the condemnatory liberal elites who use such terms actually choose to live in the most multi cultural areas of London like Newham or IlfordYBarddCwsc said:
I was in Budapest the other day, at a charming restaurant in Buda.SandyRentool said:
How much ethnic diversity is there in Hungary? A fair bit more in Canada.AlastairMeeks said:Ah, Canzuk. The freedom of movement movement for people who don't mind immigration from countries that are white and English-speaking.
I complimented the waitress on the food and the surroundings. "Yes, it is nice in Buda by the castle. But in Pest there are many dirty Roma."
I thought of Meeks in the Land of the Xenophobes, as I withheld my tip.
I refer the Honourable Gentleman to my previous answer .....brendan16 said:They are often the biggest hypocrites of all - judge them not by what they say but what they do and where they choose to live.
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If New Zealand sourced 100% of their imports from us that would increase our overall exports by 6%.TGOHF said:AlastairMeeks said:
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..
Again highlighting the untapped markets out there..Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.0 -
Never mind Brexit. They are talking about railways in the HoC right now.0
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Excellent comment.Beverley_C said:
There seems to be a fair number of Leavers on here who all live abroad and tell us all how great the UK will be post-Brexit whilst they live the ex-pat life.brendan16 said:
You of course rarely find that the condemnatory liberal elites who use such terms actually choose to live in the most multi cultural areas of London like Newham or IlfordYBarddCwsc said:
I was in Budapest the other day, at a charming restaurant in Buda.SandyRentool said:
How much ethnic diversity is there in Hungary? A fair bit more in Canada.AlastairMeeks said:Ah, Canzuk. The freedom of movement movement for people who don't mind immigration from countries that are white and English-speaking.
I complimented the waitress on the food and the surroundings. "Yes, it is nice in Buda by the castle. But in Pest there are many dirty Roma."
I thought of Meeks in the Land of the Xenophobes, as I withheld my tip.
I refer the Honourable Gentleman to my previous answer .....brendan16 said:They are often the biggest hypocrites of all - judge them not by what they say but what they do and where they choose to live.
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So you are saying it may be better to focus on trade with a larger number of countries than just a few ?TOPPING said:
If New Zealand sourced 100% of their imports from us that would increase our overall exports by 6%.TGOHF said:AlastairMeeks said:
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..
Again highlighting the untapped markets out there..Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Again you make an excellent case for looking beyond the narrow target of the EU.0 -
Some of us prefer to look outwards and seek out opportunities around the world, rather than keep looking inwards towards the diminishing proportion of world trade within the EU.TGOHF said:AlastairMeeks said:
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..
Again highlighting the untapped markets out there..Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.0 -
Or could it be that logistics and transport costs make exporting goods around the world uneconomic. Sadly as an exporter of brain power and software solutions I can't really comment on transportation costs of physical products.TGOHF said:AlastairMeeks said:
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..
Again highlighting the untapped markets out there..Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.0 -
No not untapped, it just means they source their imports from elsewhere. Its not like they ride around in horse and cart because they can't buy cars from the UK - they just buy their cars from Japan, Korea, China... Its called gravity.TGOHF said:AlastairMeeks said:
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..
Again highlighting the untapped markets out there..Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.0 -
After today, I think I’ve realised that Brexit vs Remain is a good interview question.
Answering Brexit implies a lack of basic mathematics and logical ability which means you’d be pretty useless at my workplace. Nadine Dorries (it’s too complex, let’s leave!) is the poster child.
I wonder what Nadine does when she needs specialist medical help? Presumably she’s into self-medicating.0 -
Of course you may put off the best candidates by being narrow minded.Gardenwalker said:After today, I think I’ve realised that Brexit vs Remain is a good interview question.
Answering Brexit implies a lack of basic mathematics and logical ability which means you’d be pretty useless at my workplace.
0 -
If it is not bogus, then please provide some examples of verifiable predictions.FF43 said:
Not bogus. You can either make decisions based on pure prejudice or on fact based reasoning, even if those facts are not fully understood. Which is the purpose of this analysis. It was never intended to be leaked. It was there to inform politicians' decisions, where those decisions have consequences.YBarddCwsc said:
The analogy between predictions in physics and predictions in economics is bogus.FF43 said:
Because forecasting of any kind is an inexact science, but it doesn't mean the Met Office should be shut down when it gets a forecast wrong. People should understand the data, the models, the assumptions and the confidence levels, even if it's a bit intuitive. This report on the DIRECT costs of Brexit comes with a reasonably high confidence because the variables are reasonably well understood. It also matches Treasury and third party analysis.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, I'm not sure how much a 15 year forecast is worth given most people got their recent 1 year forecast somewhere between wrong and very wrong.
Provide one prediction in economics with the phenomenal accuracy of the prediction of the Lamb shift or the spectrum of fluctuations in the microwave background.
I know lots of economists. They don't take their predictions as seriously as you do.
And, of course, to suggest the choice is between "pure prejudice" and "fact based reasoning" is a classic straw man argument,0 -
At what point did looking outwards and seeking out opportunities around the world make you think that severing your most important political and economic alliances close to home was a good idea? That's some leap of logic.Sandpit said:
Some of us prefer to look outwards and seek out opportunities around the world, rather than keep looking inwards towards the diminishing proportion of world trade within the EU.TGOHF said:AlastairMeeks said:
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..
Again highlighting the untapped markets out there..Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.0 -
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.0 -
You are a funny guy. We currently export $240bn to the EU. Can you please let me know which countries (in order if you like) we could increase our exports to so as to make up for any shortfall.TGOHF said:
So you are saying it may be better to focus on trade with a larger number of countries than just a few ?TOPPING said:
If New Zealand sourced 100% of their imports from us that would increase our overall exports by 6%.TGOHF said:AlastairMeeks said:
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..
Again highlighting the untapped markets out there..Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Again you make an excellent case for looking beyond the narrow target of the EU.
I know you are probably a numbers guy but increasing our exports to the EU by 3% would account for all of NZ's imports.0 -
What shortfalls are you expecting in imports and exports to the EU because of Brexit ?TOPPING said:
we could increase our exports to so as to make up for any shortfall.TGOHF said:
So you are saying it may be better to focus on trade with a larger number of countries than just a few ?TOPPING said:
If New Zealand sourced 100% of their imports from us that would increase our overall exports by 6%.TGOHF said:AlastairMeeks said:
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..
Again highlighting the untapped markets out there..Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Again you make an excellent case for looking beyond the narrow target of the EU.
0 -
Not really. I need people who can add, prepare business plans (including, shock horror, with financial forecasting) and who can work well in diverse teams.TGOHF said:
Of course you may put off the best candidates by being narrow minded.Gardenwalker said:After today, I think I’ve realised that Brexit vs Remain is a good interview question.
Answering Brexit implies a lack of basic mathematics and logical ability which means you’d be pretty useless at my workplace.
Brexiters need not apply.0 -
Mr. Meeks, EU countries are also mostly white. The only imperial fantasy is that projected by some who wish us to remain on those with whom they disagree.0
-
India also owns most of our steel industry and some of our car production. A free trade agreement would enable them to easily close down their steel and car plants here and move production to India. Many in international business regard the Indians as the world's most horrible customers and only export there if absolutely forced to do so by lack of alternatives elsewhere. In terms of FTAs I wouldn't put India at the top of the list.FF43 said:
TBF India does have a PTA with Japan. Japan wanted sensible import tariffs on their cars and were prepared to offer access on services. Expect India to push us very hard on services, particularly Mode 4 (presence of natural persons) ie wholesale import of cheap IT staff. For our part we compete on services too and don't export a lot of cars to India.Beverley_C said:
And how does that work? Do we set up an automatic bribe payment system or do we instead show them how we do it in splendid ol' Blighty, capital of civilisation? :rollseyes:Sandpit said:
No, it’s so that we can get around some of their red tape.williamglenn said:
So that we can import more of those practices into the UK?Sandpit said:
Yup, the place is full of stupid red tape that gets in the way of doing business there, especially for foreigners. Which is why it would be a good place to start with a trade deal.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, Indian bureaucratic bullshit is why F1 stopped going there. Which is good, because they had the worst circuit I've ever seen.
The Indians have already stated what they want for a deal - the ability to export more Indians to the UK. I thought Brexit was about reducing immigration?0 -
Is Canada more or less white than the EU27?AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.0 -
Nothing to do with common language, common legal systems, same head of state and many Brits with relations in all of them then? (I've got close relations in two and more distant in all three).AlastairMeeks said:
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
0 -
Quebec speaks French and uses civil law. Will they be expelled from the CANZUK union?CarlottaVance said:
Nothing to do with common language, common legal systems, same head of state and many Brits with relations in all of them then? (I've got close relations in two and more distant in all three).AlastairMeeks said:
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
0 -
This is a bizarre post. Those countries have moved on since the 1970's, in particular in becoming more multi-ethnic, but so has Britain. We already have special ties with them, in history, politics, various international alliances, and the 5-eyes intelligence agreements. And they have similar income levels to us, which is what matters when immigration agreements are concerned - why nobody seriously proposes freedom of movement with Kenya or Bangladesh.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
So your post is wrong in every respect.0 -
We export more to "geographically remote" Singapore each year than we do to Romania, Malta, Cyprus, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Lithuania, Slovenia, Latvia , Estonia and Croatia.AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.
Combined.
0 -
When your current alliances are dragging you down and preventing progress, sometimes its necessary to cut the old ones and make new ones elsewhere.williamglenn said:
At what point did looking outwards and seeking out opportunities around the world make you think that severing your most important political and economic alliances close to home was a good idea? That's some leap of logic.Sandpit said:
Some of us prefer to look outwards and seek out opportunities around the world, rather than keep looking inwards towards the diminishing proportion of world trade within the EU.TGOHF said:AlastairMeeks said:
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..
Again highlighting the untapped markets out there..Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
It’s like any major decision in life, be it a new job, moving house, getting married or divorced. It’s easy to be complacent with life as it is, but to improve and progress sometimes a change is needed.0 -
Yet you leave Singapore out of Canzuk. Poor Singapore. Obviously it isn't white enough for the Brexiters.TGOHF said:
We export more to "geographically remote" Singapore each year than we do to Romania, Malta, Cyprus, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Lithuania, Slovenia, Latvia , Estonia and Croatia.AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.
Combined.0 -
And thus you would be breaking EU laws on employment rights...Gardenwalker said:
Brexiters need not apply.0 -
We are making it more difficult to trade with the EU. Do you suppose there will be no change in trade flows between us and them?TGOHF said:
What shortfalls are you expecting in imports and exports to the EU because of Brexit ?TOPPING said:
we could increase our exports to so as to make up for any shortfall.TGOHF said:
So you are saying it may be better to focus on trade with a larger number of countries than just a few ?TOPPING said:
If New Zealand sourced 100% of their imports from us that would increase our overall exports by 6%.TGOHF said:AlastairMeeks said:
Ah, the illogic of the Brexiteer in full flight. Having been completely proved wrong in his previous airy assertion, he moves on to another one.TGOHF said:
So you are saying that the NZ market is bigger and relatively untapped ?AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Sounds like we need to look beyond these small parochial markets of the EU..
Again highlighting the untapped markets out there..Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Maltaeconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
Again you make an excellent case for looking beyond the narrow target of the EU.0 -
If you think Australia, Canada and New Zealand are going to agree to free movement of people with the UK, or indeed any significant change from current arrangements, you are deluded. What's in it for them?Fishing said:
This is a bizarre post. Those countries have moved on since the 1970's, in particular in becoming more multi-ethnic, but so has Britain. We already have special ties with them, in history, politics, various international alliances, and the 5-eyes intelligence agreements. And they have similar income levels to us, which is what matters when immigration agreements are concerned - why nobody seriously proposes freedom of movement with Kenya or Bangladesh.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
So your post is wrong in every respect.0 -
That could be an argument to join the Euro. The indecision of sitting on the fence for 20 years was clearly dragging us down, if only psychologically.Sandpit said:
When your current alliances are dragging you down and preventing progress, sometimes its necessary to cut the old ones and make new ones elsewhere.williamglenn said:At what point did looking outwards and seeking out opportunities around the world make you think that severing your most important political and economic alliances close to home was a good idea? That's some leap of logic.
It’s like any major decision in life, be it a new job, moving house, getting married or divorced. It’s easy to be complacent with life as it is, but to improve and progress sometimes a change is needed.0 -
I only want to break them.TGOHF said:
And thus you would be breaking EU laws on employment rights...Gardenwalker said:
Brexiters need not apply.
You want to get rid of them altogether.0 -
Perhaps they might hold another Quexit referendum?williamglenn said:
Quebec speaks French and uses civil law. Will they be expelled from the CANZUK union?CarlottaVance said:
Nothing to do with common language, common legal systems, same head of state and many Brits with relations in all of them then? (I've got close relations in two and more distant in all three).AlastairMeeks said:
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
0 -
Given we have a negative balance of trade with them I agree they would be daft to insert some friction in the arrangements. But apparently it is about politics not commerce.TOPPING said:
We are making it more difficult to trade with the EU. Do you suppose there will be no change in trade flows between us and them?
0 -
Another straw man - there are 200+ countries in the world - focusing on 3 or 27 is for the narrow minded.AlastairMeeks said:
Yet you leave Singapore out of Canzuk. Poor Singapore. Obviously it isn't white enough for the Brexiters.TGOHF said:
We export more to "geographically remote" Singapore each year than we do to Romania, Malta, Cyprus, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Lithuania, Slovenia, Latvia , Estonia and Croatia.AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.
Combined.0 -
You can tell when Brexiters get all frothed up - blockquoting goes out of the window.0
-
“Freer movement of people and professionals” is not the same as immigrationBeverley_C said:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/11/23/britain-must-accept-immigrants-wants-free-trade-deal-warns-senior/Charles said:
They wanted faster business visas. Not the same as what you claimedBeverley_C said:
And how does that work? Do we set up an automatic bribe payment system or do we instead show them how we do it in splendid ol' Blighty, capital of civilisation? :rollseyes:Sandpit said:
No, it’s so that we can get around some of their red tape.williamglenn said:
So that we can import more of those practices into the UK?Sandpit said:
Yup, the place is full of stupid red tape that gets in the way of doing business there, especially for foreigners. Which is why it would be a good place to start with a trade deal.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, Indian bureaucratic bullshit is why F1 stopped going there. Which is good, because they had the worst circuit I've ever seen.
The Indians have already stated what they want for a deal - the ability to export more Indians to the UK. I thought Brexit was about reducing immigration?
"Britain must accept higher levels of immigration from India if it hopes to sign a free trade agreement after Brexit, a senior Indian diplomat has warned, as he predicted it could take up to a decade to secure the deal."
There are dozens more like that out there. 20 seconds Googling should dig them up because they are not hard to find and the Indians seem quite clear about what they want. It is not exactly a secret...
The issue with the EU is not FOM per se but the interplay with EU citizenship/right of residence and equal treatment0 -
It could be an argument for joining the euro, yes.williamglenn said:
That could be an argument to join the Euro. The indecision of sitting on the fence for 20 years was clearly dragging us down, if only psychologically.Sandpit said:
When your current alliances are dragging you down and preventing progress, sometimes its necessary to cut the old ones and make new ones elsewhere.williamglenn said:At what point did looking outwards and seeking out opportunities around the world make you think that severing your most important political and economic alliances close to home was a good idea? That's some leap of logic.
It’s like any major decision in life, be it a new job, moving house, getting married or divorced. It’s easy to be complacent with life as it is, but to improve and progress sometimes a change is needed.
Not an argument I’d support of course, IMO a country with such a large financial services sector would be hamstrung by a lack of monetary policy levers, it would have made the problems of a decade ago much worse both for the UK and the Eurozone.0 -
Mr. Topping, sir, art thou suggesting that I am *always* frothed up?
0 -
What an insufferable level of debate we've reached.AlastairMeeks said:
Yet you leave Singapore out of Canzuk. Poor Singapore. Obviously it isn't white enough for the Brexiters.TGOHF said:
We export more to "geographically remote" Singapore each year than we do to Romania, Malta, Cyprus, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Lithuania, Slovenia, Latvia , Estonia and Croatia.AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.
Combined.0 -
Not at all Morris - you don't get involved to start with. It's those that try and fail that I am talking aboutMorris_Dancer said:Mr. Topping, sir, art thou suggesting that I am *always* frothed up?
0 -
Straw men is all remain have left.Razedabode said:
What an insufferable level of debate we've reached.AlastairMeeks said:
Yet you leave Singapore out of Canzuk. Poor Singapore. Obviously it isn't white enough for the Brexiters.TGOHF said:
We export more to "geographically remote" Singapore each year than we do to Romania, Malta, Cyprus, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Lithuania, Slovenia, Latvia , Estonia and Croatia.AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.
Combined.
0 -
And that's my point. Canzuk has been selected by the nut-nut Leavers as a new union. Why the Canzuk countries? It's not economics. Singapore would certainly qualify. It's not "shared heritage". Again, Singapore would certainly qualify. But there's something that differentiates Australia, New Zealand and Canada from the rest.TGOHF said:
Another straw man - there are 200+ countries in the world - focusing on 3 or 27 is for the narrow minded.AlastairMeeks said:
Yet you leave Singapore out of Canzuk. Poor Singapore. Obviously it isn't white enough for the Brexiters.TGOHF said:
We export more to "geographically remote" Singapore each year than we do to Romania, Malta, Cyprus, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Lithuania, Slovenia, Latvia , Estonia and Croatia.AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.
Combined.
It is of course race.0 -
Shrinking trade!TGOHF said:
Given we have a negative balance of trade with them I agree they would be daft to insert some friction in the arrangements. But apparently it is about politics not commerce.TOPPING said:
We are making it more difficult to trade with the EU. Do you suppose there will be no change in trade flows between us and them?
Didn't see that on the side of the bus.0 -
Mr. Topping, huzzah!0
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It's also often proposed by people who say you don't need the politics in order to have the benefits of economic integration. Yet the first alternative they come up with is to start planning alliances and mapping out their fantasy game of Diplomacy to get one over on the French and Germans...AlastairMeeks said:
And that's my point. Canzuk has been selected by the nut-nut Leavers as a new union. Why the Canzuk countries? It's not economics. Singapore would certainly qualify. It's not "shared heritage". Again, Singapore would certainly qualify. But there's something that differentiates Australia, New Zealand and Canada from the rest.TGOHF said:
Another straw man - there are 200+ countries in the world - focusing on 3 or 27 is for the narrow minded.AlastairMeeks said:
Yet you leave Singapore out of Canzuk. Poor Singapore. Obviously it isn't white enough for the Brexiters.TGOHF said:
We export more to "geographically remote" Singapore each year than we do to Romania, Malta, Cyprus, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Lithuania, Slovenia, Latvia , Estonia and Croatia.AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.
Combined.
It is of course race.0 -
Shrinking trade is up there with a hard border in Ireland and Unicorn races.TOPPING said:
Shrinking trade!TGOHF said:
Given we have a negative balance of trade with them I agree they would be daft to insert some friction in the arrangements. But apparently it is about politics not commerce.TOPPING said:
We are making it more difficult to trade with the EU. Do you suppose there will be no change in trade flows between us and them?
Didn't see that on the side of the bus.
0 -
No problem with Singapore joining in if they wish - full of hard working people who would contribute to society and improve trade between the countries.AlastairMeeks said:
And that's my point. Canzuk has been selected by the nut-nut Leavers as a new union. Why the Canzuk countries? It's not economics. Singapore would certainly qualify. It's not "shared heritage". Again, Singapore would certainly qualify. But there's something that differentiates Australia, New Zealand and Canada from the rest.TGOHF said:
Another straw man - there are 200+ countries in the world - focusing on 3 or 27 is for the narrow minded.AlastairMeeks said:
Yet you leave Singapore out of Canzuk. Poor Singapore. Obviously it isn't white enough for the Brexiters.TGOHF said:
We export more to "geographically remote" Singapore each year than we do to Romania, Malta, Cyprus, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Lithuania, Slovenia, Latvia , Estonia and Croatia.AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.
Combined.
It is of course race.
Contrary to what you may wish to believe, not all Leave voters are little Nick Griffins.0 -
Don't take that away from them - it's all they have left..Sandpit said:
Contrary to what you may wish to believe, not all Leave voters are little Nick Griffins.AlastairMeeks said:
And that's my point. Canzuk has been selected by the nut-nut Leavers as a new union. Why the Canzuk countries? It's not economics. Singapore would certainly qualify. It's not "shared heritage". Again, Singapore would certainly qualify. But there's something that differentiates Australia, New Zealand and Canada from the rest.TGOHF said:
Another straw man - there are 200+ countries in the world - focusing on 3 or 27 is for the narrow minded.AlastairMeeks said:
Yet you leave Singapore out of Canzuk. Poor Singapore. Obviously it isn't white enough for the Brexiters.TGOHF said:
We export more to "geographically remote" Singapore each year than we do to Romania, Malta, Cyprus, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Lithuania, Slovenia, Latvia , Estonia and Croatia.AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.
Combined.
It is of course race.0 -
The Euro could be a global currency to rival the dollar but the pound never will be again. The UK would have more control of the global monetary policy levers that matter if we were at the heart of the EU, with its biggest financial centre in London.Sandpit said:
It could be an argument for joining the euro, yes.williamglenn said:
That could be an argument to join the Euro. The indecision of sitting on the fence for 20 years was clearly dragging us down, if only psychologically.Sandpit said:
When your current alliances are dragging you down and preventing progress, sometimes its necessary to cut the old ones and make new ones elsewhere.williamglenn said:At what point did looking outwards and seeking out opportunities around the world make you think that severing your most important political and economic alliances close to home was a good idea? That's some leap of logic.
It’s like any major decision in life, be it a new job, moving house, getting married or divorced. It’s easy to be complacent with life as it is, but to improve and progress sometimes a change is needed.
Not an argument I’d support of course, IMO a country with such a large financial services sector would be hamstrung by a lack of monetary policy levers, it would have made the problems of a decade ago much worse both for the UK and the Eurozone.
If the UK decided to join the Euro, the world would pay attention to us in a way that Brexit is failing to achieve.0 -
Mr. Glenn, how do we have more control of monetary policy if it's set in Frankfurt and the decision has to take account of 27 other economies? That's nonsensical (or Lib Dem policy, as I believe it's also known).0
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Try reading what the "senior Indian diplomat" said - here it is again so you cannot miss it and I will even bold the crucial bitCharles said:
“Freer movement of people and professionals” is not the same as immigrationBeverley_C said:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/11/23/britain-must-accept-immigrants-wants-free-trade-deal-warns-senior/Charles said:
They wanted faster business visas. Not the same as what you claimedBeverley_C said:
And how does that work? Do we set up an automatic bribe payment system or do we instead show them how we do it in splendid ol' Blighty, capital of civilisation? :rollseyes:Sandpit said:
No, it’s so that we can get around some of their red tape.williamglenn said:
So that we can import more of those practices into the UK?Sandpit said:
Yup, the place is full of stupid red tape that gets in the way of doing business there, especially for foreigners. Which is why it would be a good place to start with a trade deal.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, Indian bureaucratic bullshit is why F1 stopped going there. Which is good, because they had the worst circuit I've ever seen.
The Indians have already stated what they want for a deal - the ability to export more Indians to the UK. I thought Brexit was about reducing immigration?
"Britain must accept higher levels of immigration from India if it hopes to sign a free trade agreement after Brexit, a senior Indian diplomat has warned, as he predicted it could take up to a decade to secure the deal."
There are dozens more like that out there. 20 seconds Googling should dig them up because they are not hard to find and the Indians seem quite clear about what they want. It is not exactly a secret...
"... Britain must accept higher levels of immigration from India if it hopes to sign a free trade agreement after Brexit ..."
Yes- it would never do to treat everyone the same, would it? Darned Forriners!Charles said:The issue with the EU is not FOM per se but the interplay with EU citizenship/right of residence and equal treatment
0 -
I'd have no problem with free movement with Singapore if they have any interest. The income levels are similar enough and they are fairly civilised and pseudo-democratic.AlastairMeeks said:And that's my point. Canzuk has been selected by the nut-nut Leavers as a new union. Why the Canzuk countries? It's not economics. Singapore would certainly qualify. It's not "shared heritage". Again, Singapore would certainly qualify. But there's something that differentiates Australia, New Zealand and Canada from the rest.
It is of course race.
So that is yet another argument without any merit. Any more?0 -
Does Wall Street have no control over monetary policy set in Washington and tailored to take account of 50 states?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Glenn, how do we have more control of monetary policy if it's set in Frankfurt and the decision has to take account of 27 other economies? That's nonsensical (or Lib Dem policy, as I believe it's also known).
0 -
Mr. Glenn, Wall Street is part of a country that sets a national monetary policy, as London is with the UK. The EU is not a country. Those who want it to have the trappings of one are wronger than the Thirteenth Earl of Wrongcaster.0
-
-
It’s selected in public discussion - not as a sole objective of policy. I would suggest shared heritage is most important: the sense of kinship (no matter how remote) makes the concept easier to sell to the general publicAlastairMeeks said:
And that's my point. Canzuk has been selected by the nut-nut Leavers as a new union. Why the Canzuk countries? It's not economics. Singapore would certainly qualify. It's not "shared heritage". Again, Singapore would certainly qualify. But there's something that differentiates Australia, New Zealand and Canada from the rest.TGOHF said:
Another straw man - there are 200+ countries in the world - focusing on 3 or 27 is for the narrow minded.AlastairMeeks said:
Yet you leave Singapore out of Canzuk. Poor Singapore. Obviously it isn't white enough for the Brexiters.TGOHF said:
We export more to "geographically remote" Singapore each year than we do to Romania, Malta, Cyprus, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Lithuania, Slovenia, Latvia , Estonia and Croatia.AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.
Combined.
It is of course race.0 -
Thank you. In the interests of full disclosure, I should point out that, as an arch-Remoaner, I still reside in the UK although a fair portion of my assets have moved abroad for the purposes of Brexit-proofing.HHemmelig said:
Excellent comment.Beverley_C said:
There seems to be a fair number of Leavers on here who all live abroad and tell us all how great the UK will be post-Brexit whilst they live the ex-pat life.brendan16 said:
You of course rarely find that the condemnatory liberal elites who use such terms actually choose to live in the most multi cultural areas of London like Newham or IlfordYBarddCwsc said:
I was in Budapest the other day, at a charming restaurant in Buda.SandyRentool said:
How much ethnic diversity is there in Hungary? A fair bit more in Canada.AlastairMeeks said:Ah, Canzuk. The freedom of movement movement for people who don't mind immigration from countries that are white and English-speaking.
I complimented the waitress on the food and the surroundings. "Yes, it is nice in Buda by the castle. But in Pest there are many dirty Roma."
I thought of Meeks in the Land of the Xenophobes, as I withheld my tip.
I refer the Honourable Gentleman to my previous answer .....brendan16 said:They are often the biggest hypocrites of all - judge them not by what they say but what they do and where they choose to live.
0 -
CarlottaVance said:
https://twitter.com/NCPoliticsUK/status/958379424440815624?ref_src=twcamp^share|twsrc^m5|twgr^email|twcon^7046|twterm^1</blockquote
A function of age? Like to see the figures on daily newspaper (of all political stripes) readership, Reckon that would reflect their age profile too.0 -
Yes I do realise that Alistair - that is why the FTA with India is so important, we need it to bootstrap the Raj 2.0 into lifeAlastairMeeks said:
Oh shush. Don't you realise that they're all pining for empire 2.0?Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
1857, here we come........ Vrrroommmm!!!!!0 -
You often talk about the importance of England, but you're happy for it to be subsumed into a larger union. There's a contradiction there.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Glenn, Wall Street is part of a country that sets a national monetary policy, as London is with the UK. The EU is not a country. Those who want it to have the trappings of one are wronger than the Thirteenth Earl of Wrongcaster.
0 -
I focused on the bit in quote marks - what the diplomat actually said. You chose to focus on the Telegraph’s interpretation.Beverley_C said:
Try reading what the "senior Indian diplomat" said - here it is again so you cannot miss it and I will even bold the crucial bitCharles said:
“Freer movement of people and professionals” is not the same as immigrationBeverley_C said:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/11/23/britain-must-accept-immigrants-wants-free-trade-deal-warns-senior/Charles said:
They wanted faster business visas. Not the same as what you claimedBeverley_C said:
The Indians have already stated what they want for a deal - the ability to export more Indians to the UK. I thought Brexit was about reducing immigration?Sandpit said:
No, it’s so that we can get around some of their red tape.williamglenn said:
So that we can import more of those practices into the UK?Sandpit said:
Yup, the place is full of stupid red tape that gets in the way of doing business there, especially for foreigners. Which is why it would be a good place to start with a trade deal.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. 43, Indian bureaucratic bullshit is why F1 stopped going there. Which is good, because they had the worst circuit I've ever seen.
"Britain must accept higher levels of immigration from India if it hopes to sign a free trade agreement after Brexit, a senior Indian diplomat has warned, as he predicted it could take up to a decade to secure the deal."
There are dozens more like that out there. 20 seconds Googling should dig them up because they are not hard to find and the Indians seem quite clear about what they want. It is not exactly a secret...
"... Britain must accept higher levels of immigration from India if it hopes to sign a free trade agreement after Brexit ..."
Yes- it would never do to treat everyone the same, would it? Darned Forriners!Charles said:The issue with the EU is not FOM per se but the interplay with EU citizenship/right of residence and equal treatment
I think it’s sweet that you rate the Telegraph so highly
As for your second point: we have a non contributory welfare system. I like that any UK citizen can rely (to some degree) on the state as a safety net. But we can’t afford to extend that largesse to everyone.
If FoM was the right to come without a visa and look for a job but “without recourse to public funds” then it would have been much less of an issue0 -
I imagine it is an age thing, with figures the opposite way for say mainstream newspaper readership.CarlottaVance said:0 -
It's an age thing but also a maturity thing. A lot of people don't feel the need to get all shouty about politics with strangers. Many will consign politician opinions to the home, the pub and the ballot box, which in the most part is a good thing.TheJezziah said:
I imagine it is an age thing, with figures the opposite way for say mainstream newspaper readership.CarlottaVance said:0 -
A further reason why the work of Tory leaning groups like Activate in developing a Tory presence on Twitter is importantTGOHF said:0 -
The NY Fed, as a proxy for Wall Street, has one vote (out of twelve).williamglenn said:
Does Wall Street have no control over monetary policy set in Washington and tailored to take account of 50 states?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Glenn, how do we have more control of monetary policy if it's set in Frankfurt and the decision has to take account of 27 other economies? That's nonsensical (or Lib Dem policy, as I believe it's also known).
0 -
Are the changes reflecting the changes in the Twitter user base, or are they a measure of changing opinion in a static user base?TGOHF said:0 -
Mr. Glenn, I've long advocated an English Parliament to have a fairer political settlement...
Edited extra bit: not to mention, nobody ever wanted the EU to be a country except bureaucratic ideologues who think centuries of identity can be steamrollered by their nonsense.0 -
No one has any interest in this idea apart from a few reactionary weirdos.Fishing said:
I'd have no problem with free movement with Singapore if they have any interest. The income levels are similar enough and they are fairly civilised and pseudo-democratic.AlastairMeeks said:And that's my point. Canzuk has been selected by the nut-nut Leavers as a new union. Why the Canzuk countries? It's not economics. Singapore would certainly qualify. It's not "shared heritage". Again, Singapore would certainly qualify. But there's something that differentiates Australia, New Zealand and Canada from the rest.
It is of course race.
So that is yet another argument without any merit. Any more?0 -
Likewise, perhaps important to also note that not all remainers are like Alistair meeks.Sandpit said:
No problem with Singapore joining in if they wish - full of hard working people who would contribute to society and improve trade between the countries.AlastairMeeks said:
And that's my point. Canzuk has been selected by the nut-nut Leavers as a new union. Why the Canzuk countries? It's not economics. Singapore would certainly qualify. It's not "shared heritage". Again, Singapore would certainly qualify. But there's something that differentiates Australia, New Zealand and Canada from the rest.TGOHF said:
Another straw man - there are 200+ countries in the world - focusing on 3 or 27 is for the narrow minded.AlastairMeeks said:
Yet you leave Singapore out of Canzuk. Poor Singapore. Obviously it isn't white enough for the Brexiters.TGOHF said:
We export more to "geographically remote" Singapore each year than we do to Romania, Malta, Cyprus, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Lithuania, Slovenia, Latvia , Estonia and Croatia.AlastairMeeks said:
For some reason, some really weird Leavers have plucked New Zealand, Canada and Australia as countries to forge a new close relationship with. They are all three geographically remote from us. Canada is geographically remote from the other two. All three have high levels of immigration, something that normally makes Leavers reach for the sal volatile. All three to a far higher extent than Britain are resources economies, with very different needs. None, given their size, are particularly close trading partners at present.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Meeks, once again, the only people banging on about the Empire are those who wish to remain and are busy constructing a fictional argument to attack.
In fact, the only reasons that these countries seem to have been chosen for courting is that they are predominantly white and were once part of the empire.
Combined.
It is of course race.
Contrary to what you may wish to believe, not all Leave voters are little Nick Griffins.0 -
I've always maintained the BBC should rely 99% less on twitter for news stories due to the huge liberal bias in attitudes, subject matter and outrage.This study (if true) backs that up, and tbf Matt Singh usually isn't far off the mark.
If Tory MPs used facebook instead they could still get their message out, it might seem as a retreat if many turned their back on twitter, but realistically what percentage of their constituents or the electorate are reading what they post anyway? 10% tops? It doesn't seem worth it for the anonymous abuse, foreign interference and general dimwit standard of debate.0 -
If it hadn’t been for India you wouldn’t have had the University of WestminsterBeverley_C said:
Yes I do realise that Alistair - that is why the FTA with India is so important, we need it to bootstrap the Raj 2.0 into lifeAlastairMeeks said:
Oh shush. Don't you realise that they're all pining for empire 2.0?Beverley_C said:
We do more trade with Belgium than we do with Canada, Australia and New Zealand combined.AlastairMeeks said:
Britain's trade with Malta is only marginally less than that with New Zealand, though New Zealand has ten times the population of Malta. As I thought, you're dealing off out of date preconceptions.TGOHF said:
Yes - Britain's economy is far more aligned to Greece, Malta and Latvia.AlastairMeeks said:Of course Canzuk is designed to apply to the backward-looking imperialists who can't imagine that those three countries have long moved on since the 1970s. Quite why Britain would otherwise have any special tie-up with those countries, none of whose economies have much in common with Britain's, is otherwise inexplicable.
Sounds like an excellent lunch was had.
1857, here we come........ Vrrroommmm!!!!!0 -
The pub in this example is the older persons twitter. Plenty of political related things to criticise Twitter for but political discussion seems a strange one.Brom said:
It's an age thing but also a maturity thing. A lot of people don't feel the need to get all shouty about politics with strangers. Many will consign politician opinions to the home, the pub and the ballot box, which in the most part is a good thing.TheJezziah said:
I imagine it is an age thing, with figures the opposite way for say mainstream newspaper readership.CarlottaVance said:0 -
Most sensible Tory MPs post on both Facebook and Twitter and maybe even Instagram tooBrom said:I've always maintained the BBC should rely 99% less on twitter for news stories due to the huge liberal bias in attitudes, subject matter and outrage.This study (if true) backs that up, and tbf Matt Singh usually isn't far off the mark.
If Tory MPs used facebook instead they could still get their message out, it might seem as a retreat if many turned their back on twitter, but realistically what percentage of their constituents or the electorate are reading what they post anyway? 10% tops? It doesn't seem worth it for the anonymous abuse, foreign interference and general dimwit standard of debate.0 -
Brom said:
I've always maintained the BBC should rely 99% less on twitter for news stories due to the huge liberal bias in attitudes, subject matter and outrage.This study (if true) backs that up, and tbf Matt Singh usually isn't far off the mark.
You could make a similar argument for the printed press as well though. Wouldn't it be better for the BBC to still use both to an extent whilst trying to maintain a fair stance as much as possible?0 -
Most of the non-sensible ones do too.HYUFD said:
Most sensible Tory MPs post on both Facebook and Twitter and maybe even Instagram tooBrom said:I've always maintained the BBC should rely 99% less on twitter for news stories due to the huge liberal bias in attitudes, subject matter and outrage.This study (if true) backs that up, and tbf Matt Singh usually isn't far off the mark.
If Tory MPs used facebook instead they could still get their message out, it might seem as a retreat if many turned their back on twitter, but realistically what percentage of their constituents or the electorate are reading what they post anyway? 10% tops? It doesn't seem worth it for the anonymous abuse, foreign interference and general dimwit standard of debate.0 -
