The_Apocalypse said:

Happy birthday @HYUFD I have to say I would never have thought you’d be a millennial (I thought you were older!)

TheScreamingEagles said:

ydoethur said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

CarlottaVance said:

Surely a member of the Conservative and Unionist Party would look forward to King Henry I?

I thought the convention was from Union of the Crowns/The Act of the Union we'd go for whatever the highest number the Regnal name had been used before by either Crown.

A more difficult question might be whether he would be Henry IX or Henry X. Just as Charles seeems to be dodging questions about being Charles III or Charles IV by saying he'll be George VII.

Perhaps Harry could honour his father and go for King James?

Wouldn't help - James III or James IV?

In fact though he would be James VIII or IX following that custom.

Perhaps it would be easier to be David III?

How about choosing a name that reflects the UK.

King Mohammed I.

It would meets with the approval of Prince Charles who wants to be Defender of Faith.

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

CarlottaVance said:

Casino_Royale said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

HYUFD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

I reckon Mrs Thatcher was a closet Republican too.

"The problem is, [Thatcher] lamented, the Queen is the kind of woman who could vote SDP.”

Actually she treated the Queen with reverence and always gave a deep curtsy to her.

The Queen Mother though was a staunch Thatcherite and anti EU.

So our Monarchy is deeply political.

It is meant to be apolitical.

Abolish it now.

No true Tory would write this.

TINO....

A true Tory would arrange a different monarch......its been done before....

Yup, I want King Henry IX and Queen Meghan.

Surely he would be the first of his name in the house of Windsor?

TheScreamingEagles said:

ydoethur said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

CarlottaVance said:

Surely a member of the Conservative and Unionist Party would look forward to King Henry I?

I thought the convention was from Union of the Crowns/The Act of the Union we'd go for whatever the highest number the Regnal name had been used before by either Crown.

A more difficult question might be whether he would be Henry IX or Henry X. Just as Charles seeems to be dodging questions about being Charles III or Charles IV by saying he'll be George VII.

Perhaps Harry could honour his father and go for King James?

Wouldn't help - James III or James IV?

In fact though he would be James VIII or IX following that custom.

Perhaps it would be easier to be David III?

How about choosing a name that reflects the UK.

King Mohammed I.

It would meets with the approval of Prince Charles who wants to be Defender of Faith.

PClipp said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

(...)Do you think the Daily Mail are Lib Dems too? Because they encouraged Tory voters in Sheffield Hallam to vote Lib Dem in June.

They produced a guide of where Tory voters should vote tactically and Hallam was one of the top suggestions.

The kiss of death for Nick Clegg?

TheScreamingEagles said:

I've stayed at this hotel, wonderful hotel and wonderful area.

Two people have died after a fire at the Cameron House Hotel beside Loch Lomond.

More than 200 guests were evacuated from the hotel after the alarm was raised at about 06.40.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-42392459

TheScreamingEagles said:

Fishing said:

I'd personally slice the great coalition that is the Conservative Party slightly differently. I'd identify four components:

- business friendly (Nigel Lawson)
- socially conservative (TMay)
- One Nation (Ken Clarke)
- libertarian (Dan Hannan).

As with any coalition, successful leaders must straddle divides within the party, offering bribes to each, while disappointing them in equal measure. So Margaret offered:

- the business friendly trade union reform, etc.
- the socially conservative clause 28
- the one Nationers the continuation of the welfare state
- the libertarians market liberalisation (also a boon to the business friendly).

Indeed when a government has a tiny majority (Major in the 90s and TMay now), British political history comprises little else besides this balancing act.

Of course, one can identify components (sometimes parallel, sometimes opposite) amongst the Socialists.

Mrs May isn't a social conservative.

A social conservative wouldn't have championed same sex marriage.

TheScreamingEagles said:

Fishing said:

I'd personally slice the great coalition that is the Conservative Party slightly differently. I'd identify four components:

- business friendly (Nigel Lawson)
- socially conservative (TMay)
- One Nation (Ken Clarke)
- libertarian (Dan Hannan).

As with any coalition, successful leaders must straddle divides within the party, offering bribes to each, while disappointing them in equal measure. So Margaret offered:

- the business friendly trade union reform, etc.
- the socially conservative clause 28
- the one Nationers the continuation of the welfare state
- the libertarians market liberalisation (also a boon to the business friendly).

Indeed when a government has a tiny majority (Major in the 90s and TMay now), British political history comprises little else besides this balancing act.

Of course, one can identify components (sometimes parallel, sometimes opposite) amongst the Socialists.

Mrs May isn't a social conservative.

A social conservative wouldn't have championed same sex marriage.

Sunil_Prasannan said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Fishing said:

I'd personally slice the great coalition that is the Conservative Party slightly differently. I'd identify four components:

- business friendly (Nigel Lawson)
- socially conservative (TMay)
- One Nation (Ken Clarke)
- libertarian (Dan Hannan).

As with any coalition, successful leaders must straddle divides within the party, offering bribes to each, while disappointing them in equal measure. So Margaret offered:

- the business friendly trade union reform, etc.
- the socially conservative clause 28
- the one Nationers the continuation of the welfare state
- the libertarians market liberalisation (also a boon to the business friendly).

Indeed when a government has a tiny majority (Major in the 90s and TMay now), British political history comprises little else besides this balancing act.

Of course, one can identify components (sometimes parallel, sometimes opposite) amongst the Socialists.

Mrs May isn't a social conservative.

A social conservative wouldn't have championed same sex marriage.

Is it possible to be a "conservative socialist"?

HYUFD said:

I was born 36 years ago today and attended my first Tory rally in 1992 for John Major and canvassed in Tonbridge for the Tories in 1997

TheScreamingEagles said:

Charles said:

Mortimer said:

Top thread Charles.

I hope this might stop Tories on here telling other Tories (or potential voters) that they aren't Tories...

Apparently Wellington isn't a Tory...

You can't get more Tory than giving the French a good shoeing.

Sunil_Prasannan said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

CarlottaVance said:

Surely a member of the Conservative and Unionist Party would look forward to King Henry I?

I thought the convention was from Union of the Crowns/The Act of the Union we'd go for whatever the highest number the Regnal name had been used before by either Crown.

A more difficult question might be whether he would be Henry IX or Henry X. Just as Charles seeems to be dodging questions about being Charles III or Charles IV by saying he'll be George VII.

Perhaps Harry could honour his father and go for King James?

Wouldn't help - James III or James IV?

James III.

William III and Mary II succeeded James II.

Sunil_Prasannan said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Charles said:

Mortimer said:

Top thread Charles.

I hope this might stop Tories on here telling other Tories (or potential voters) that they aren't Tories...

Apparently Wellington isn't a Tory...

You can't get more Tory than giving the French a good shoeing.

Yet you want us to be in political union with the French!

Tissue_Price said:

HYUFD said:

I was born 36 years ago today and attended my first Tory rally in 1992 for John Major and canvassed in Tonbridge for the Tories in 1997

Happy birthday @HYUFD! Polling of pb.com has determined that you are in fact 62. Perhaps there is a lesson in that

AlastairMeeks said:

Happy birthday HYUFD.

Mortimer said:

HYUFD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MarqueeMark said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

CarlottaVance said:

HYUFD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

HYUFD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

I reckon Mrs Thatcher was a closet Republican too.

"The problem is, [Thatcher] lamented, the Queen is the kind of woman who could vote SDP.”

Actually she treated the Queen with reverence and always gave a deep curtsy to her.

The Queen Mother though was a staunch Thatcherite and anti EU.

So our Monarchy is deeply political.

It is meant to be apolitical.

Abolish it now.

The Queen is apolitical completely, the Queen Mother was never sovereign, your Republicanism of course tips you from being a Radical Tory to an Orange Book Liberal.

TINO.......

How many Tory MPs have you helped elect?

I've been pounding the pavements since the days of William Hague.

I dunno, these Johnny-Come-Lately's......

I was properly blooded in pavement-pounding at the Ashfied by-election in 1977. Where we got a Tory MP in a mining seat, on a swing of over 20%.

I wasn't even born in 1977.

I would have campaigned for the Tories in 1997 but I was doing my A-Levels then, I was under a lot of pressure and I don't think my Mum would have allowed it.

I was born 36 years ago today and attended my first Tory rally in 1992 for John Major and canvassed in Tonbridge for the Tories in 1997

HB HYUFD!

ydoethur said:

HYUFD said:

Charles said:

HYUFD said:

Charles said:

"Ulster will fight and Ulster will be right" was Randolph Churchill, not Carson. Carson was a far more sophisticated man than Churchill - and hated the dismemberment of his beloved homeland. For him Ulster was just a tool to try and prevent the dissolution of the Union - but he was then betrayed by James Craig.

Wellington was not an Ultra (he pushed Catholic Emancipation through Parliament) and nor was Bonar Law - he was a bridge between Walter Long and the protectionists and Austen Chamberlain. IDS is more of a Radical than anything else: just look at his reforms to the welfare state.

Apologies, it was Churchill but Carson did certainly organise the 'Solemn League and Covenant' of half a million to use all means necessary to resist Home Rule.

Wellington opposed the Great Reform Act of 1832 and the expansion of the franchise which would suggest he was an Ultra. IDS voted against gay marriage and withdrew the whip from those who supported gay adoption and is a hard Brexiteer.

For what it's worth, I wrote my thesis on Carson... The Covenant was simply political theatre in the tradition of the Ulstermen. As with Larne and Curragh, Carson never intended the UVF to actually fight (he was a former Solicitor General, Cabinet member, lawyer, politician and a member of one of the most prominent Ascendancy families). If he had really taken "the high road to treason and despair" do you think he would have been given a UK state funeral?

As for Wellington:

the Ultra-Tories were united in their antipathy towards the Duke of Wellington and Sir Robert Peel for what they saw as a betrayal of Tory political and religious principle on the issue of Catholic Emancipation

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra-Tories

Carson represented much of Tory opinion at the time and indeed that in the country which was why Bonar Law almost won the 1910 elections on an anti Home Rule ticket.

Peel was a Radical not an Ultra no but Wellington led Ultra resistance to the Great Reform Act

At risk of sounding like Justin, Bonar Law was not Unionist leader until 1911 and Home Rule was not an issue in either election of 1910. The first was primarily about the budget, the second about the constitution. Secondary issues included tariffs and education, rather than Ireland.

Afterwards, because the Liberals had no overall majority and swiftly became the second largest party due to by-election losses leaving them once again dependent on Irish support, it became an issue. It was also, helpfully, an issue on which the entire Unionist party was united while the Liberals were quite badly split.

And happy birthday, have a good one.