Would you have been this blasé about Russian meddling it Remain had won 52/48 and it later transpired Putin’s troll army had been backing Remain ?
a) Everybody meddled. The UK Govt. meddled. The EU meddled. Obama meddled. The Establishment meddled. Seems the only people who weren't meddling were those lazy Remainers, sat on their big fat complacent arses.
b) You think we didn't meddle in USSR politics? Paybacks a bitch, as Mr Putin might say.
c) You REALLY think Putin influenced the final result?
d) Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.......
Confirms you’re a traitor to the UK.
When the trials come you will be exiled to Twatt or Middlesbrough.
Oh the irony.
Man who wants foreign powers to rule our country calls those who oppose it traitors.
You should be fucking ashamed you Quisling.
No I don't.
Leavers are not only traitors and Putin's useful idiots, Leavers are the modern day Vichyists, but you're too thick to realise it.
You're beyond parody today. Liquid breakfast?
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
Would you have been this blasé about Russian meddling it Remain had won 52/48 and it later transpired Putin’s troll army had been backing Remain ?
a) Everybody meddled. The UK Govt. meddled. The EU meddled. Obama meddled. The Establishment meddled. Seems the only people who weren't meddling were those lazy Remainers, sat on their big fat complacent arses.
b) You think we didn't meddle in USSR politics? Paybacks a bitch, as Mr Putin might say.
c) You REALLY think Putin influenced the final result?
d) Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.......
Confirms you’re a traitor to the UK.
When the trials come you will be exiled to Twatt or Middlesbrough.
Oh the irony.
Man who wants foreign powers to rule our country calls those who oppose it traitors.
You should be fucking ashamed you Quisling.
No I don't.
Leavers are not only traitors and Putin's useful idiots, Leavers are the modern day Vichyists, but you're too thick to realise it.
You're beyond parody today. Liquid breakfast?
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
Why is that Comrade Tyndall?
The ironic thing is if Cameron and Osborne had come out for Leave you'd be calling Remainers traitors and Vichyists now.
“I am working with children,” Wonder Woman (Gal Gadot) sighs in mock exasperation toward the end of Zack Snyder’s Justice League. She has a point. This is surely the most infantile of recent superhero yarns - a film that squanders the talents of an impressive ensemble cast and eschews any meaningful characterisation in favour of ever more overblown special effects.
It's really amazing how DC continually try to match Marvel but continually fail to spot the reason why Marvel films are successful. Hint: it's not the special effects.
Would you have been this blasé about Russian meddling it Remain had won 52/48 and it later transpired Putin’s troll army had been backing Remain ?
a) Everybody meddled. The UK Govt. meddled. The EU meddled. Obama meddled. The Establishment meddled. Seems the only people who weren't meddling were those lazy Remainers, sat on their big fat complacent arses.
b) You think we didn't meddle in USSR politics? Paybacks a bitch, as Mr Putin might say.
c) You REALLY think Putin influenced the final result?
d) Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.......
Confirms you’re a traitor to the UK.
When the trials come you will be exiled to Twatt or Middlesbrough.
Oh the irony.
Man who wants foreign powers to rule our country calls those who oppose it traitors.
You should be fucking ashamed you Quisling.
No I don't.
Leavers are not only traitors and Putin's useful idiots, Leavers are the modern day Vichyists, but you're too thick to realise it.
You're beyond parody today. Liquid breakfast?
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
Why is that Comrade Tyndall?
The ironic thing is if Cameron and Osborne had come out for Leave you'd be calling Remainers traitors and Vichyists now.
Nah. I opposed Dave and George on AV, I would have opposed them on this too.
Would you have been this blasé about Russian meddling it Remain had won 52/48 and it later transpired Putin’s troll army had been backing Remain ?
a) Everybody meddled. The UK Govt. meddled. The EU meddled. Obama meddled. The Establishment meddled. Seems the only people who weren't meddling were those lazy Remainers, sat on their big fat complacent arses.
b) You think we didn't meddle in USSR politics? Paybacks a bitch, as Mr Putin might say.
c) You REALLY think Putin influenced the final result?
d) Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.......
Confirms you’re a traitor to the UK.
When the trials come you will be exiled to Twatt or Middlesbrough.
Oh the irony.
Man who wants foreign powers to rule our country calls those who oppose it traitors.
You should be fucking ashamed you Quisling.
No I don't.
Leavers are not only traitors and Putin's useful idiots, Leavers are the modern day Vichyists, but you're too thick to realise it.
You're beyond parody today. Liquid breakfast?
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
Why is that Comrade Tyndall?
The ironic thing is if Cameron and Osborne had come out for Leave you'd be calling Remainers traitors and Vichyists now.
Yep. Party before country as far as TSE is concerned. He is more Petain than Putin.
“I am working with children,” Wonder Woman (Gal Gadot) sighs in mock exasperation toward the end of Zack Snyder’s Justice League. She has a point. This is surely the most infantile of recent superhero yarns - a film that squanders the talents of an impressive ensemble cast and eschews any meaningful characterisation in favour of ever more overblown special effects.
It's really amazing how DC continually try to match Marvel but continually fail to spot the reason why Marvel films are successful. Hint: it's not the special effects.
Characterisation.
The funniest scene in cinematic history was in Avengers: Assemble and The Hulk interacted with the God that is Loki.
Would you have been this blasé about Russian meddling it Remain had won 52/48 and it later transpired Putin’s troll army had been backing Remain ?
a) Everybody meddled. The UK Govt. meddled. The EU meddled. Obama meddled. The Establishment meddled. Seems the only people who weren't meddling were those lazy Remainers, sat on their big fat complacent arses.
b) You think we didn't meddle in USSR politics? Paybacks a bitch, as Mr Putin might say.
c) You REALLY think Putin influenced the final result?
d) Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.......
Confirms you’re a traitor to the UK.
When the trials come you will be exiled to Twatt or Middlesbrough.
Oh the irony.
Man who wants foreign powers to rule our country calls those who oppose it traitors.
You should be fucking ashamed you Quisling.
No I don't.
Leavers are not only traitors and Putin's useful idiots, Leavers are the modern day Vichyists, but you're too thick to realise it.
You're beyond parody today. Liquid breakfast?
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
The UK unemployment rate decreased by 0.2 percentage points to 4.3% in the three months to September 2017, compared with the three months to June 2017.
Real wages decreased by 0.5% (excluding bonuses) and by 0.4% (including bonuses) in the three months to September 2017 compared with a year earlier. An examination of the relationship between wages and industrial composition shows that between 2016 and 2017, two service sectors: accommodation and food (I) and transport and storage (H), were major contributors to employee jobs, but both were associated with relatively weak performance in median wage.
Would you have been this blasé about Russian meddling it Remain had won 52/48 and it later transpired Putin’s troll army had been backing Remain ?
a) Everybody meddled. The UK Govt. meddled. The EU meddled. Obama meddled. The Establishment meddled. Seems the only people who weren't meddling were those lazy Remainers, sat on their big fat complacent arses.
b) You think we didn't meddle in USSR politics? Paybacks a bitch, as Mr Putin might say.
c) You REALLY think Putin influenced the final result?
d) Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.......
Confirms you’re a traitor to the UK.
When the trials come you will be exiled to Twatt or Middlesbrough.
Oh the irony.
Man who wants foreign powers to rule our country calls those who oppose it traitors.
You should be fucking ashamed you Quisling.
No I don't.
Leavers are not only traitors and Putin's useful idiots, Leavers are the modern day Vichyists, but you're too thick to realise it.
You're beyond parody today. Liquid breakfast?
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
Why is that Comrade Tyndall?
The ironic thing is if Cameron and Osborne had come out for Leave you'd be calling Remainers traitors and Vichyists now.
Nah. I opposed Dave and George on AV, I would have opposed them on this too.
I do recall you saying on here that you intended to vote Leave right at the start of the referendum campaign.
Philip SimVerified account @BBCPhilipSim 4m4 minutes ago More Supreme Court justices unanimously reject challenge to ScotGov's alcohol minimum pricing scheme - a "proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim"
I wonder what the ECJ will say. It will be amusing if it strikes the Supreme Court's decision down.
SCOTLAND has become the first country in the world to introduce a minimum price for alcohol after a Supreme Court ruling that the controversial plan did not break EU guidelines.
It would be richly ironic if the SNP government were to lose an appeal taken to the ECJ!
Not sure if its a good idea or not - but its absolutely right that Scotland's government should be given the opportunity t find out. Best news for Offies in Berwick for many a year!
Would you have been this blasé about Russian meddling it Remain had won 52/48 and it later transpired Putin’s troll army had been backing Remain ?
a) Everybody meddled. The UK Govt. meddled. The EU meddled. Obama meddled. The Establishment meddled. Seems the only people who weren't meddling were those lazy Remainers, sat on their big fat complacent arses.
b) You think we didn't meddle in USSR politics? Paybacks a bitch, as Mr Putin might say.
c) You REALLY think Putin influenced the final result?
d) Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.......
Confirms you’re a traitor to the UK.
When the trials come you will be exiled to Twatt or Middlesbrough.
Oh the irony.
Man who wants foreign powers to rule our country calls those who oppose it traitors.
You should be fucking ashamed you Quisling.
No I don't.
Leavers are not only traitors and Putin's useful idiots, Leavers are the modern day Vichyists, but you're too thick to realise it.
You're beyond parody today. Liquid breakfast?
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
Why is that Comrade Tyndall?
The ironic thing is if Cameron and Osborne had come out for Leave you'd be calling Remainers traitors and Vichyists now.
Nah. I opposed Dave and George on AV, I would have opposed them on this too.
I do recall you saying on here that you intended to vote Leave right at the start of the referendum campaign.
No I said I might consider depending on what Leave were proposing.
Would you have been this blasé about Russian meddling it Remain had won 52/48 and it later transpired Putin’s troll army had been backing Remain ?
a) Everybody meddled. The UK Govt. meddled. The EU meddled. Obama meddled. The Establishment meddled. Seems the only people who weren't meddling were those lazy Remainers, sat on their big fat complacent arses.
b) You think we didn't meddle in USSR politics? Paybacks a bitch, as Mr Putin might say.
c) You REALLY think Putin influenced the final result?
d) Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.......
Confirms you’re a traitor to the UK.
When the trials come you will be exiled to Twatt or Middlesbrough.
Oh the irony.
Man who wants foreign powers to rule our country calls those who oppose it traitors.
You should be fucking ashamed you Quisling.
No I don't.
Leavers are not only traitors and Putin's useful idiots, Leavers are the modern day Vichyists, but you're too thick to realise it.
You're beyond parody today. Liquid breakfast?
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
Why is that Comrade Tyndall?
The ironic thing is if Cameron and Osborne had come out for Leave you'd be calling Remainers traitors and Vichyists now.
Nah. I opposed Dave and George on AV, I would have opposed them on this too.
I do recall you saying on here that you intended to vote Leave right at the start of the referendum campaign.
Now in fairness this is before Dave came back from Brussels having heroically negotiated Britain a special status in a reformed Europe.
Bromwich Ham became Brumagem and then gentrified to Birmingham.
West Bromwich stayed West Bromwich. Up the Albion.
I didn't know that. I've learned something today, so thank you.
Careful, could be fake news :-) The more commonly accepted origin of the name of England's second city is that it is based on the name of its supposed Anglo-Saxon founder, Beorma. Beorma-inga-ham apparently means "the homestead of the tribe or people of Beorma".
I'd imagine the US was in a bit of a "people who live in glass houses" situation when it came to foreign countries trying to influence who governed Ukraine.
The UK unemployment rate for July to September 2017 was 4.3% – the joint lowest rate since 1975 http://ow.ly/nnVM30gAAuw
A tribute to the magnificent stewardship of the economy by George Osborne and Phil Hammond. .
George and Phil are responsible you say ?
ONSVerified account @ONS 6m6 minutes ago More Replying to @ONS Jul-Sep 2017 was the sixth three-month period in a row where earnings including bonuses fell in real terms http://ow.ly/nnVM30gAAuw
That's because of Brexit/the fear of Brexit/The vote to Leave.
No wonder the EU are saying no cherry picking..
No cherry picking without East European workers.
In fairness there's no reason why we should struggle to recruit seasonal fruit and vegetable pickers. The gov't just needs to introduce a new seasonal workers scheme for workers outside the EU e.g Ukraine or Serbia. They used to have one for Bulgarians and Romanians before they full members of the EU.
Doesn't everything we've seen in the last year scream out that we need to re run the referendum? It was prejudiced from day one when the BBC and other news outlets were required to give equal weight to both sides. The result was that an ignorant public were convinced that expert opinion was equally divided when of course the true picture was overwhelmingly that leaving would be catastrophic.
No Roger - we need the politicians to grow up and support a great deal.
The Telegraph last night were outrageous and did not do leave any good.
Also TM has made a big error over the date and needs to reflect on how she resolves it.
TM is causing me concern, and this from a relative loyal conservative, and she needs to step up to the plate, increase the offer, and get on with it.
If and when we are ex EU and it does indeed prove a failure then there will be moves to seek a better deal with the EU or even re-join but I do not see how we get there wothout leaving
That will lead to decades of internal division while the country slowly goes down the drain. Unfortunately this just hasn't been thought through and things will never be the same again. And as the EU closes ranks it will get even worse.
When we could see the spivs who were behind the Leave campaign it's a mystery to me why no one bothered to join the dots.
Brexit is like a jenga tower - you can pull a lot of bits out of it without any obvious effect but eventually the whole thing comes crashing down.
A number of bricks have already gone - the theory that negotiations would be easy and the UK would get a good exit deal, the theory that the EU would break up, the theory that the referendum would unite the Tory Party and the country, the idea that "no deal is better then a bad deal", the idea that other countries would queue up to make trade deals with the UK and, of course, the infamous £350m for the NHS.
Two more bricks have gone today - the Telegraph front page is both bullying and slightly desperate and now these stories about Russian involvement cast further doubt into the mix.
The crash will come when the economic consequences, as set out by the car manufacturers yesterday, really start to hit. I guess that will be sometime toward the middle of next year.
So what happens if I post a bottle of gin to my mother in the highlands from here in England - will McCustoms and Exise demand proof of pricing at the border ?
What if she mail orders beer from Adnams in Suffolk ?
Should I open off licences in Gretna and Berwick ?
More importantly - will the price of mail order beer/Harris Gin from Scotland to the south increase ?
“I am working with children,” Wonder Woman (Gal Gadot) sighs in mock exasperation toward the end of Zack Snyder’s Justice League. She has a point. This is surely the most infantile of recent superhero yarns - a film that squanders the talents of an impressive ensemble cast and eschews any meaningful characterisation in favour of ever more overblown special effects.
It's really amazing how DC continually try to match Marvel but continually fail to spot the reason why Marvel films are successful. Hint: it's not the special effects.
Characterisation.
The funniest scene in cinematic history was in Avengers: Assemble and The Hulk interacted with the God that is Loki.
Mr. Jonathan, then we get into quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Lack of trust in the police and politicians means people will just believe what they want anyway, and screenshotting and the like, as well as the rapid pace of the internet, means the regulators will always be slower than their quarry.
Not necessarily. It takes time to gain followers. Once an account is labelled as fake it becomes useless.
Not hard to create a bot to reply to fake news calling it out.
That depends on how effective the bots are. A 'good' picture could gain tens of thousands of retweets virally before it's established that it's fake - and who's going to check the validity of a string of retweets or cut-and-pastes, even if it's possible?
As ever, the only true guard is the common sense of the people. If they need guarding from their lack of it, then we cease to be a functioning democracy.
So apparently Facebook now integrates fact- We can also develop better social defences; One that springs to mind is relentlessly taking the piss out of gullible friends and relatives who spread bullshit. It's one thing this site is actually quite good at; With a few mysteriously obtuse exceptions, people who post here generally get better at posting stuff that's at least vaguely grounded in fact, because that's what the social dynamics encourage.
Doesn't everything we've seen in the last year scream out that we need to re run the referendum? It was prejudiced from day one when the BBC and other news outlets were required to give equal weight to both sides. The result was that an ignorant public were convinced that expert opinion was equally divided when of course the true picture was overwhelmingly that leaving would be catastrophic.
No Roger - we need the politicians to grow up and support a great deal.
The Telegraph last night were outrageous and did not do leave any good.
Also TM has made a big error over the date and needs to reflect on how she resolves it.
TM is causing me concern, and this from a relative loyal conservative, and she needs to step up to the plate, increase the offer, and get on with it.
If and when we are ex EU and it does indeed prove a failure then there will be moves to seek a better deal with the EU or even re-join but I do not see how we get there wothout leaving
That will lead to decades of internal division while the country slowly goes down the drain. Unfortunately this just hasn't been thought through and things will never be the same again. And as the EU closes ranks it will get even worse.
When we could see the spivs who were behind the Leave campaign it's a mystery to me why no one bothered to join the dots.
Brexit is like a jenga tower - you can pull a lot of bits out of it without any obvious effect but eventually the whole thing comes crashing down.
A number of bricks have already gone - the theory that negotiations would be easy and the UK would get a good exit deal, the theory that the EU would break up, the theory that the referendum would unite the Tory Party and the country, the idea that "no deal is better then a bad deal", the idea that other countries would queue up to make trade deals with the UK and, of course, the infamous £350m for the NHS.
Two more bricks have gone today - the Telegraph front page is both bullying and slightly desperate and now these stories about Russian involvement cast further doubt into the mix.
The crash will come when the economic consequences, as set out by the car manufacturers yesterday, really start to hit. I guess that will be sometime toward the middle of next year.
The image that "The Brexit Mutineers" conjured up for me was Theresa May, Boris Johnson and Liam Fox cast adrift in a life raft thousands of miles from land while the rest of the country hightails it to somewhere more promising.
Mr. Jonathan, then we get into quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Lack of trust in the police and politicians means people will just believe what they want anyway, and screenshotting and the like, as well as the rapid pace of the internet, means the regulators will always be slower than their quarry.
Not necessarily. It takes time to gain followers. Once an account is labelled as fake it becomes useless.
Not hard to create a bot to reply to fake news calling it out.
That depends on how effective the bots are. A 'good' picture could gain tens of thousands of retweets virally before it's established that it's fake - and who's going to check the validity of a string of retweets or cut-and-pastes, even if it's possible?
As ever, the only true guard is the common sense of the people. If they need guarding from their lack of it, then we cease to be a functioning democracy.
So apparently Facebook now integrates fact- We can also develop better social defences; One that springs to mind is relentlessly taking the piss out of gullible friends and relatives who spread bullshit. It's one thing this site is actually quite good at; With a few mysteriously obtuse exceptions, people who post here generally get better at posting stuff that's at least vaguely grounded in fact, because that's what the social dynamics encourage.
So what happens if I post a bottle of gin to my mother in the highlands from here in England - will McCustoms and Exise demand proof of pricing at the border ?
What if she mail orders beer from Adnams in Suffolk ?
Should I open off licences in Gretna and Berwick ?
More importantly - will the price of mail order beer/Harris Gin from Scotland to the south increase ?
The way the trend is going your mother will shortly open an artisan gin distillery of her own. Everyone else seems to be.
Would you have been this blasé about Russian meddling it Remain had won 52/48 and it later transpired Putin’s troll army had been backing Remain ?
a) Everybody meddled. The UK Govt. meddled. The EU meddled. Obama meddled. The Establishment meddled. Seems the only people who weren't meddling were those lazy Remainers, sat on their big fat complacent arses.
b) You think we didn't meddle in USSR politics? Paybacks a bitch, as Mr Putin might say.
c) You REALLY think Putin influenced the final result?
d) Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.......
Confirms you’re a traitor to the UK.
When the trials come you will be exiled to Twatt or Middlesbrough.
Oh the irony.
Man who wants foreign powers to rule our country calls those who oppose it traitors.
You should be fucking ashamed you Quisling.
No I don't.
Leavers are not only traitors and Putin's useful idiots, Leavers are the modern day Vichyists, but you're too thick to realise it.
You're beyond parody today. Liquid breakfast?
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
Why is that Comrade Tyndall?
The ironic thing is if Cameron and Osborne had come out for Leave you'd be calling Remainers traitors and Vichyists now.
Nah. I opposed Dave and George on AV, I would have opposed them on this too.
I do recall you saying on here that you intended to vote Leave right at the start of the referendum campaign.
No I said I might consider depending on what Leave were proposing.
But the fact that you were supposedly wavering but then able to immerse yourself in the Remain campaign just a few weeks later and now calling Leavers traitors etc does suggest a certain shallowness and lack of firm principles. As a staunch Remainer and Remoaner I'm sorry to say this, and it's nothing personal, but our side of the argument would probably have done better without people like you dominating it.
The impact of Russian meddling on Twitter isn’t restricted to under 25s as some are claiming. Many of the fake news/memes postings end up on Facebook which has a surprisingly high number of users in their 30s and 40s. And of course the lies can be spread by word of mouth in the pub etc, not just online.
I'd imagine the US was in a bit of a "people who live in glass houses" situation when it came to foreign countries trying to influence who governed Ukraine.
So what happens if I post a bottle of gin to my mother in the highlands from here in England - will McCustoms and Exise demand proof of pricing at the border ?
What if she mail orders beer from Adnams in Suffolk ?
Should I open off licences in Gretna and Berwick ?
More importantly - will the price of mail order beer/Harris Gin from Scotland to the south increase ?
The way the trend is going your mother will shortly open an artisan gin distillery of her own. Everyone else seems to be.
Bromwich Ham became Brumagem and then gentrified to Birmingham.
West Bromwich stayed West Bromwich. Up the Albion.
I didn't know that. I've learned something today, so thank you.
Careful, could be fake news :-) The more commonly accepted origin of the name of England's second city is that it is based on the name of its supposed Anglo-Saxon founder, Beorma. Beorma-inga-ham apparently means "the homestead of the tribe or people of Beorma".
So what happens if I post a bottle of gin to my mother in the highlands from here in England - will McCustoms and Exise demand proof of pricing at the border ?
What if she mail orders beer from Adnams in Suffolk ?
Should I open off licences in Gretna and Berwick ?
More importantly - will the price of mail order beer/Harris Gin from Scotland to the south increase ?
The minimum unit price of 50p per unit will mostly affect cheap white ciders and value spirits with high alcohol content
I'd imagine the US was in a bit of a "people who live in glass houses" situation when it came to foreign countries trying to influence who governed Ukraine.
Yes, it's not like the US ever tries to influence what is going on in other countries. Oh no, Sirree.
When the trials come you will be exiled to Twatt or Middlesbrough.
Oh the irony.
Man who wants foreign powers to rule our country calls those who oppose it traitors.
You should be fucking ashamed you Quisling.
No I don't.
Leavers are not only traitors and Putin's useful idiots, Leavers are the modern day Vichyists, but you're too thick to realise it.
You're beyond parody today. Liquid breakfast?
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
Why is that Comrade Tyndall?
The ironic thing is if Cameron and Osborne had come out for Leave you'd be calling Remainers traitors and Vichyists now.
Nah. I opposed Dave and George on AV, I would have opposed them on this too.
I do recall you saying on here that you intended to vote Leave right at the start of the referendum campaign.
No I said I might consider depending on what Leave were proposing.
But the fact that you were supposedly wavering but then able to immerse yourself in the Remain campaign just a few weeks later and now calling Leavers traitors etc does suggest a certain shallowness and lack of firm principles. As a staunch Remainer and Remoaner I'm sorry to say this, and it's nothing personal, but our side of the argument would probably have done better without people like you dominating it.
Nah.
Many people were on the fence previously, mainly as a function of not giving too much of a fuck about it.
But the subsequent briefest, most cursory investigation and analysis showed that it was unambiguously in the UK's best interests to stay in, that to Leave would seriously harm the people of this country, and that the Leave argument was almost wholly fallacious (nothing to do with the £350m).
But the fact that you were supposedly wavering but then able to immerse yourself in the Remain campaign just a few weeks later and now calling Leavers traitors etc does suggest a certain shallowness and lack of firm principles. As a staunch Remainer and Remoaner I'm sorry to say this, and it's nothing personal, but our side of the argument would probably have done better without people like you dominating it.
I’m not sure me delivering leaflets and canvassing in Sheffield and West Yorkshire for Remain counts me as dominating the Remain campaign.
So what happens if I post a bottle of gin to my mother in the highlands from here in England - will McCustoms and Exise demand proof of pricing at the border ?
What if she mail orders beer from Adnams in Suffolk ?
Should I open off licences in Gretna and Berwick ?
More importantly - will the price of mail order beer/Harris Gin from Scotland to the south increase ?
The way the trend is going your mother will shortly open an artisan gin distillery of her own. Everyone else seems to be.
Another Archers listener?
Actually no but I have several friends who have done or are planning to do so.
If the referendum result had been within a couple of hundred - or even thousand - votes - there might some grounds for questioning its validity - but not when the gap is nearly 1.3 million.
In any case the greatest users of Twitter - the young - were least likely to vote for Brexit.
Did Russian meddling play a role? Possibly, but its unmeasurably small. Things like no temporary control on immigration from the A8 (however beneficial it was) will have been many orders of magnitude more important...and then there's the bus, the losers unaccountably keep drawing attention to....
Will some claim this invalidates the result?
Quite likely, nearer the event, as one by one their Firewalls crumble.....
Straw clutching I suggest.
Yes it is - rather sad. One wonders what they'll try to undermine the result next.
I doubt Putin won the Brexit vote, although I believe the Russian inspired Comey intervention did swing it for Trump.
Russia's aims are to destabilise Britain, the EU and the US and to some extent it has succeeded. For someone on the other side of those battles it doesn't make me feel good.
Regular update on butter prices.Trigger warning-could increase blood pressure.Prior to Brexit a 250 mgs block butter at Tesco was 96p.It is now £1.60.Mrs Volcano's coffee has also risen from £4 to £5 for 200 gms.Lurpak 500 gms was available at 2 for a fiver not so long back and it's now 2 for six quid. Lidl's has become my second home.
Bromwich Ham became Brumagem and then gentrified to Birmingham.
West Bromwich stayed West Bromwich. Up the Albion.
I didn't know that. I've learned something today, so thank you.
Careful, could be fake news :-) The more commonly accepted origin of the name of England's second city is that it is based on the name of its supposed Anglo-Saxon founder, Beorma. Beorma-inga-ham apparently means "the homestead of the tribe or people of Beorma".
But did Bromwich derive from Beorma?
A local historian, William Hamper compiled a list of spellings of Birmingham from contemporary documents which he published in 1880:
But the fact that you were supposedly wavering but then able to immerse yourself in the Remain campaign just a few weeks later and now calling Leavers traitors etc does suggest a certain shallowness and lack of firm principles. As a staunch Remainer and Remoaner I'm sorry to say this, and it's nothing personal, but our side of the argument would probably have done better without people like you dominating it.
I’m not sure me delivering leaflets and canvassing in Sheffield and West Yorkshire for Remain counts me as dominating the Remain campaign.
"People like you" includes Cameron and Osborne. Neither of whom had a good word to say about the EU in their entire political career until the Remain campaign.
I'd imagine the US was in a bit of a "people who live in glass houses" situation when it came to foreign countries trying to influence who governed Ukraine.
Yes, it's not like the US ever tries to influence what is going on in other countries. Oh no, Sirree.
Ahem.
Did they not in fact try to influence the EUref result? Repeatedly?
I'd imagine the US was in a bit of a "people who live in glass houses" situation when it came to foreign countries trying to influence who governed Ukraine.
Yes, it's not like the US ever tries to influence what is going on in other countries. Oh no, Sirree.
Ahem.
Did they not in fact try to influence the EUref result? Repeatedly?
Did they pretend to be Bob from Lancashire as they did so?
Many people were on the fence previously, mainly as a function of not giving too much of a fuck about it.
Which is why a reversal of the process, if and when it happens, will not cause the sky to fall in or threaten the future of democracy - most people do not feel strongly about the issue either way. I work in a non-political environment and it hardly ever comes up in office conversation. At board level people are very worried but everyone else is much more interested in Strictly. Brexit has not impacted. Yet.
When the trials come you will be exiled to Twatt or Middlesbrough.
Oh the irony.
Man who wants foreign powers to rule our country calls those who oppose it traitors.
You should be fucking ashamed you Quisling.
No I don't.
Leavers are not only traitors and Putin's useful idiots, Leavers are the modern day Vichyists, but you're too thick to realise it.
You're beyond parody today. Liquid breakfast?
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
Why is that Comrade Tyndall?
The ironic thing is if Cameron and Osborne had come out for Leave you'd be calling Remainers traitors and Vichyists now.
Nah. I opposed Dave and George on AV, I would have opposed them on this too.
I do recall you saying on here that you intended to vote Leave right at the start of the referendum campaign.
No I said I might consider depending on what Leave were proposing.
Nah.
Many people were on the fence previously, mainly as a function of not giving too much of a fuck about it.
But the subsequent briefest, most cursory investigation and analysis showed that it was unambiguously in the UK's best interests to stay in, that to Leave would seriously harm the people of this country, and that the Leave argument was almost wholly fallacious (nothing to do with the £350m).
That's all true IMO, but with a few exceptions like Clarke and Heseltine, no top-level Tory has had anything positive to say about the EU since circa 1990. When 70% of them were suddenly broadcasting the virtues of Remaining in the EU after a political lifetime of highlighting their Euroscepticism, it's hardly surprising in retrospect that they all looked like shallow careerists.
Many people were on the fence previously, mainly as a function of not giving too much of a fuck about it.
People who don't give a feck typically stay at home and don't vote, which is somewhat at odds with the record turnout for the referendum.
All those men in white vans that came to polling stations asking what to do because they had never voted before ? The obvious reaction of someone that doesnt give a feck I am sure.
I'd imagine the US was in a bit of a "people who live in glass houses" situation when it came to foreign countries trying to influence who governed Ukraine.
Yes, it's not like the US ever tries to influence what is going on in other countries. Oh no, Sirree.
Ahem.
Did they not in fact try to influence the EUref result? Repeatedly?
"Back of the queue".
That was one of the key moments that swayed my vote. It wasn't a subtle, covert attempt at manipulating the vote by a hostile power. It was an overt threat from a supposedly friendly power.
Of course, the behaviour of the hostile foreign power that had the greatest influence on my vote was... the EU. As far as I'm concerned they've dedicated more time to undermining democracy in this country than Putin has.
Regular update on butter prices.Trigger warning-could increase blood pressure.Prior to Brexit a 250 mgs block butter at Tesco was 96p.It is now £1.60.Mrs Volcano's coffee has also risen from £4 to £5 for 200 gms.Lurpak 500 gms was available at 2 for a fiver not so long back and it's now 2 for six quid. Lidl's has become my second home.
Europe is in the throes of a butter shortage.
Rising demand and a decline in milk production has led to a doubling in the price of the dairy spread this year. French bakeries want to raise the price of pastries, brioches and croissants that are dependent on butter, while the chief executive of Arla, the company behind the Anchor and Lurpak dairy brands, last week warned UK consumers that there would not be enough butter at Christmas.
The strains in Europe have global origins. The combination of falling milk output in key producing countries and adverse weather sent the international butter price to a record high in June, according to the UN Food and Agricultural Organization.
“Limited export availabilities of dairy products in all major producing countries” led to significant rises in dairy prices, including butter, the FAO said this month.
Yet you do didn't get outraged by a Leaver calling me a Quisling.
That speaks volumes about you.
You are the one who started throwing the word traitor around. If you can't take the responses then fuck.off and sulk elsewhere.
You never get this outraged when SeanT uses the word traitor at Remainers.
Why is that Comrade Tyndall?
The ironic thing is if Cameron and Osborne had come out for Leave you'd be calling Remainers traitors and Vichyists now.
Nah. I opposed Dave and George on AV, I would have opposed them on this too.
I do recall you saying on here that you intended to vote Leave right at the start of the referendum campaign.
No I said I might consider depending on what Leave were proposing.
Nah.
Many people were on the fence previously, mainly as a function of not giving too much of a fuck about it.
But the subsequent briefest, most cursory investigation and analysis showed that it was unambiguously in the UK's best interests to stay in, that to Leave would seriously harm the people of this country, and that the Leave argument was almost wholly fallacious (nothing to do with the £350m).
That's all true IMO, but with a few exceptions like Clarke and Heseltine, no top-level Tory has had anything positive to say about the EU since circa 1990. When 70% of them were suddenly broadcasting the virtues of Remaining in the EU after a political lifetime of highlighting their Euroscepticism, it's hardly surprising in retrospect that they all looked like shallow careerists.
I hear that but many people, myself included, believe that the EU is far from perfect. But criticising the EU for this or that is a world away from actually deciding to leave the thing.
Many people were on the fence previously, mainly as a function of not giving too much of a fuck about it.
People who don't give a feck typically stay at home and don't vote, which is somewhat at odds with the record turnout for the referendum.
All those men in white vans that came to polling stations asking what to do because they had never voted before ? The obvious reaction of someone that doesnt give a feck I am sure.
huh? It was an election, a referendum with all the attendant hype. It is perfectly possible for someone not to have given a fuck about it previously but to go out and vote on it, come the day.
I'd imagine the US was in a bit of a "people who live in glass houses" situation when it came to foreign countries trying to influence who governed Ukraine.
Yes, it's not like the US ever tries to influence what is going on in other countries. Oh no, Sirree.
Ahem.
Did they not in fact try to influence the EUref result? Repeatedly?
Did they pretend to be Bob from Lancashire as they did so?
Since 'troll factories' aren't (surprisingly enough) a Russian invention, they may well have. As may have our own intelligence services. All of which is hardly the point. Blatant or subtle, it's still foreign interference. If you're theoretically factoring in Putins tweetbots, how many votes do you knock off Remain's total for America's manifold interventions?
Many people were on the fence previously, mainly as a function of not giving too much of a fuck about it.
People who don't give a feck typically stay at home and don't vote, which is somewhat at odds with the record turnout for the referendum.
All those men in white vans that came to polling stations asking what to do because they had never voted before ? The obvious reaction of someone that doesnt give a feck I am sure.
huh? It was an election, a referendum with all the attendant hype. It is perfectly possible for someone not to have given a fuck about it previously but to go out and vote on it, come the day.
You mean like a General Election that typically has just over half the level of turnout ?
Many people were on the fence previously, mainly as a function of not giving too much of a fuck about it.
Which is why a reversal of the process, if and when it happens, will not cause the sky to fall in or threaten the future of democracy - most people do not feel strongly about the issue either way. I work in a non-political environment and it hardly ever comes up in office conversation. At board level people are very worried but everyone else is much more interested in Strictly. Brexit has not impacted. Yet.
I had a meeting with the European Commission in Brussels on Monday. Though about a dry and mostly unrelated issue (future framework for assessing dumping of steel), it was with officials from the trade directorate who are therefore probably quite clued up about what's going on in Brexit talks. The overwhelming sense I got was that there's no expectation of Brexit happening in any meaningful sense. If not a total reversal then they may be expecting some kind of Brexit in name only. Much as William Glenn is ridiculed on here, it suggests he may be correct that the government in private is preparing for the mother of all back tracks.
So what happens if I post a bottle of gin to my mother in the highlands from here in England - will McCustoms and Exise demand proof of pricing at the border ?
What if she mail orders beer from Adnams in Suffolk ?
Should I open off licences in Gretna and Berwick ?
More importantly - will the price of mail order beer/Harris Gin from Scotland to the south increase ?
The minimum unit price of 50p per unit will mostly affect cheap white ciders and value spirits with high alcohol content
“The Supreme Court’s decision today is disappointing, but we should be thankful that the legal action has delayed the implementation of this pernicious policy by five years, thereby saving Scottish drinkers hundreds of millions of pounds.
“Minimum alcohol pricing is a policy that clobbers the poor and exempts the rich. Most of the beer, cider and spirits sold in the off trade will become more expensive under a 50p minimum price, but doctors and politicians can relax. The champagne at their Christmas parties will not be affected.”
– Chris Snowdon, Head of Lifestyle Economics at the Institute of Economic Affairs
Bromwich Ham became Brumagem and then gentrified to Birmingham.
West Bromwich stayed West Bromwich. Up the Albion.
I didn't know that. I've learned something today, so thank you.
Careful, could be fake news :-) The more commonly accepted origin of the name of England's second city is that it is based on the name of its supposed Anglo-Saxon founder, Beorma. Beorma-inga-ham apparently means "the homestead of the tribe or people of Beorma".
But did Bromwich derive from Beorma?
A local historian, William Hamper compiled a list of spellings of Birmingham from contemporary documents which he published in 1880:
According to Wikipedia, West Bromwich was first mentioned as Bromwic ('broom village') in the Domesday Book of 1086, with the "West" added later to distinguish it from Castle Bromwich to the east of Birmingham. So the Domesday Bromwic doesn't appear to be etymologically related to the contemporaneous Bermingeham. To me, it looks more at though its name perhaps become confused with those of its neighbouring villages by some authors writing later in the middle ages.
Philip SimVerified account @BBCPhilipSim 4m4 minutes ago More Supreme Court justices unanimously reject challenge to ScotGov's alcohol minimum pricing scheme - a "proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim"
I wonder what the ECJ will say. It will be amusing if it strikes the Supreme Court's decision down.
SCOTLAND has become the first country in the world to introduce a minimum price for alcohol after a Supreme Court ruling that the controversial plan did not break EU guidelines.
It would be richly ironic if the SNP government were to lose an appeal taken to the ECJ!
Not sure if its a good idea or not - but its absolutely right that Scotland's government should be given the opportunity t find out. Best news for Offies in Berwick for many a year!
My childhood and teenage home town now a tax haven for Scots !!!!!
Labour and Tories both on 41% in latest Guardian/ICM poll
And here are the latest ICM state-of-the-party polling figures.
Labour: 41% (down 1 from Guardian/ICM three weeks ago)
Conservatives: 41% (down 1)
Lib Dems: 7% (no change)
Ukip: 4% (up 1)
Greens: 2% (no change)
Guardian
Thats a terrible result for Labour. Miliband was 12 points ahead. No opposition that wasnt 15 points ahead between elections ever won the ensuing election. If Labour cant be 20 points ahead now, it never will be.
Comments
I know symbols like ampersands confuse Wordpress and they occasionally turn out as upside down question marks.
The funniest scene in cinematic history was in Avengers: Assemble and The Hulk interacted with the God that is Loki.
https://youtu.be/31ZjnrHR8EA
Not what you’d think really.
#uselesfact
The UK unemployment rate decreased by 0.2 percentage points to 4.3% in the three months to September 2017, compared with the three months to June 2017.
Real wages decreased by 0.5% (excluding bonuses) and by 0.4% (including bonuses) in the three months to September 2017 compared with a year earlier. An examination of the relationship between wages and industrial composition shows that between 2016 and 2017, two service sectors: accommodation and food (I) and transport and storage (H), were major contributors to employee jobs, but both were associated with relatively weak performance in median wage.
http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15662045.Scotland_becomes_first_country_in_the_world_to_introduce_minimum_pricing_for_alcohol/?ref=twtrec
It would be richly ironic if the SNP government were to lose an appeal taken to the ECJ!
Not sure if its a good idea or not - but its absolutely right that Scotland's government should be given the opportunity t find out. Best news for Offies in Berwick for many a year!
Russian disinformation around Ukraine set the stage for the Kremlin’s election meddling here. Clinton saw it coming, but couldn't stop it.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/11/15/hillary-clinton-putin-russia-propaganda-election-215826
https://twitter.com/LordAshcroft/status/930746842731728896
A number of bricks have already gone - the theory that negotiations would be easy and the UK would get a good exit deal, the theory that the EU would break up, the theory that the referendum would unite the Tory Party and the country, the idea that "no deal is better then a bad deal", the idea that other countries would queue up to make trade deals with the UK and, of course, the infamous £350m for the NHS.
Two more bricks have gone today - the Telegraph front page is both bullying and slightly desperate and now these stories about Russian involvement cast further doubt into the mix.
The crash will come when the economic consequences, as set out by the car manufacturers yesterday, really start to hit. I guess that will be sometime toward the middle of next year.
What if she mail orders beer from Adnams in Suffolk ?
Should I open off licences in Gretna and Berwick ?
More importantly - will the price of mail order beer/Harris Gin from Scotland to the south increase ?
Making the Hulk, the ultimate one-dimensional hero, into such a complex and fascinating character is genius.
https://twitter.com/bopanc/status/930746648761946114
https://twitter.com/stephenkb/status/930749069416427520
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/apr/30/russia-ukraine-war-kiev-conflict
Frankly I'm far more worried about him having any influence after the next election, than any meddling Russia may have done in the last...
Farfetched? Perhaps, but easier to explain than a row with literally no other benefits to Theresa May.
His argument is that doing this is so stupid, Mrs May can't possibly be genuine. I think she's genuine.
But did Bromwich derive from Beorma?
http://www.gov.scot/Topics/Health/Services/Alcohol/minimum-pricing
So minimum retail price for a 750ml 40% bottle of gin will be £15. So some of the cheaper Aldi gins will have to go up, for example:
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/aldi-selling-8-types-of-gin-ready-for-christmas-and-theyre-all-under-20_uk_59bbae84e4b0edff971b2acb
Ahem.
Many people were on the fence previously, mainly as a function of not giving too much of a fuck about it.
But the subsequent briefest, most cursory investigation and analysis showed that it was unambiguously in the UK's best interests to stay in, that to Leave would seriously harm the people of this country, and that the Leave argument was almost wholly fallacious (nothing to do with the £350m).
Russia's aims are to destabilise Britain, the EU and the US and to some extent it has succeeded. For someone on the other side of those battles it doesn't make me feel good.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZLr0TtPjUc
Lidl's has become my second home.
1086 Birmingeha; 1189 Brumingeham;
1200 Brimingham; 1214 Birminggeham; 1221 Burmingeham; 1227 Birmingham; 1227 Byrmyngham;
1235 Burmingham; 1245 Bermincham; 1247 Bermigham; 1248 Bermingham; 1256 Bremingeham;
1260 Burmincham; 1262 Burmigham; 1262 Burmungeham; 1285 Bernigeham; 1282 Byrmychiham;
1292 Birmyngham; 1292 Burmegham; 1297 Burmynchham; 1297 Bermygham;
1317 Burmicham; 1320 Birmyncham; 1320 Byrmincham; 1326 Bermyncham; 1330 Birmincham;
1332 Burmyncham; 1354 Burmincheham; 1337 Brimygham; 1377 Brymygham; 1387 Burmyngham;
1398 Bremyngeham;
1402 Brymecham; 1421 Birmyncham; 1421 Birmicham; 1424 Brymmyngham; 1438 Burmyngeham;
1440 Byrmyncham; 1457 Byrmycham; 1460 Brymygeham; 1469 Brymycham; 1476 Birmyngeham;
1486 Brimyncham; 1489 Birmycham;
1500 Brymyngham; 1504 Bromechham; 1506 Brymyscham; 1514 Brymingham; 1519 Brymmncham;
1520 Bormycham; 1520 Brymyngiam; 1522 Bremygiam; 1529 Bremycham; 1535 Bermegam;
1535 Brymmyngeham; 1537 Bremmycham; 1537 Brymedgham; 1538 Bromycheham; 1548 Bremyngham;
1549 Brymyncham; 1550 Burmycheham; 1553 Brimincham; 1573 Breemejam; 1576 Bromwicham;
1586 Bryngham; 1590 Brymicham; 1591 Bromecham; 1591 Brymigham;
1603 Bermicham; 1603 Bromicham; 1650 Bromegem; 1675 Bromwichham; 1679 Bromwicham;
1686 Brymmyngiam.
All those men in white vans that came to polling stations asking what to do because they had never voted before ? The obvious reaction of someone that doesnt give a feck I am sure.
That was one of the key moments that swayed my vote. It wasn't a subtle, covert attempt at manipulating the vote by a hostile power. It was an overt threat from a supposedly friendly power.
Of course, the behaviour of the hostile foreign power that had the greatest influence on my vote was... the EU. As far as I'm concerned they've dedicated more time to undermining democracy in this country than Putin has.
Europe is in the throes of a butter shortage.
Rising demand and a decline in milk production has led to a doubling in the price of the dairy spread this year. French bakeries want to raise the price of pastries, brioches and croissants that are dependent on butter, while the chief executive of Arla, the company behind the Anchor and Lurpak dairy brands, last week warned UK consumers that there would not be enough butter at Christmas.
The strains in Europe have global origins. The combination of falling milk output in key producing countries and adverse weather sent the international butter price to a record high in June, according to the UN Food and Agricultural Organization.
“Limited export availabilities of dairy products in all major producing countries” led to significant rises in dairy prices, including butter, the FAO said this month.
https://www.ft.com/content/8550f05a-6649-11e7-8526-7b38dcaef614
And here are the latest ICM state-of-the-party polling figures.
Labour: 41% (down 1 from Guardian/ICM three weeks ago)
Conservatives: 41% (down 1)
Lib Dems: 7% (no change)
Ukip: 4% (up 1)
Greens: 2% (no change)
Guardian
NEW THREAD
“Minimum alcohol pricing is a policy that clobbers the poor and exempts the rich. Most of the beer, cider and spirits sold in the off trade will become more expensive under a 50p minimum price, but doctors and politicians can relax. The champagne at their Christmas parties will not be affected.”
– Chris Snowdon, Head of Lifestyle Economics at the Institute of Economic Affairs
But presumably Russia also interfered in the British general election to get Jeremy Corbyn elected?
Does that invalidate the fact that he did better than expected?
Whats good for the goose............