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SystemSystem Posts: 12,598
edited June 2017 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » We could find out how good Corbyn is at herding chickens

“That would be like herding chickens,” was how a member of the Shadow Cabinet responded when I suggested Labour’s leading campaigners should all be using the “weak and wobbly” counter to the Tory “strong and stable” slogan.

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • TypoTypo Posts: 195
    So we can confirm that Labour still lost the election?
  • waitingfortonightwaitingfortonight Posts: 54
    Everyone lost
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Second like Jezza!
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 55,316
    Second like Corbyn
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 60,838
    TGOHF said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    rcs1000 said:


    €40bn for payments due in 2019 and 2020 after we leave but in the budget cycle that we approved. (I.e., we signed off on the plans to have certain spending in 2019 and 2020, and just because we've left doesn't get us off the hook for having agreed it.)

    So that's €40bn for the twenty months after April 2019 when we leave - which works out at £35 billion for 20 months or £1.75 billion a month which they claim we should be paying. Rather more than the £350 million a week number that the Remoaners were complaining about.

    So given this arithmetic - if we had stayed then what would our annual payments be to the EU in say 2020 or 2021 ?

    Nearly £20Bn per year ?

    Eyewatering.
    I think you're reading too much into my top of the head recollection of the FT article...
  • kurtjesterkurtjester Posts: 121
    It was very touching to see Corbyn wiping tears from otherwise dry eyes in the Evening Standard today. Give the man an Oscar.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    What if my auntie had baws ?

  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,776
    The thought of that far left lunatic in power is alarming.

    And you can't allocate all non-Conservative votes to Labour any more than you can allocate all non-Labour votes to the Conservatives.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,022
    edited June 2017
    TGOHF said:

    What if my auntie had baws ?

    Then it would be a nightmare filling in forms for them,
  • Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928
    Hot in London today (32c) but nothing that unusual for mid June.

    The place to watch is Bristol on Wednesday.

    They could break the all-time June record - set in the iconic summer of 1976.

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 79,874
    "But fewer than 14 million voters, just over 43 % backed the Tories and the DUP, whereas 17 million voters — 52.5% backed Labour and the other four parties. "

    How very dare Don assign all those non Labour, non Tory votes over to Labour.
  • calumcalum Posts: 3,046
    https://twitter.com/EU_Commission/status/876863502924775425
  • isamisam Posts: 42,271
    Kurt Cobain wrote "In Bloom" about people singing his songs with no idea what they meant...

    https://twitter.com/i_dont_know_her/status/876483993109180417
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    TGOHF said:

    What if my auntie had baws ?

    Then it would be a nightmare filling in forms for them,
    And arrangements for ablutions may be difficult in red states of the USA.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,940
    Pulpstar said:

    "But fewer than 14 million voters, just over 43 % backed the Tories and the DUP, whereas 17 million voters — 52.5% backed Labour and the other four parties. "

    How very dare Don assign all those non Labour, non Tory votes over to Labour.

    ask him if the same rule applied between 1997 and 2010
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 33,486
    Poor old Don. Wrong on so many levels.

    Corbyn will never be able to walk into No 10 unless he can show he has the numbers of seats to be allowed to. That means he would have to show that he had the direct support of the DUP because without that he doesn't have the numbers.

    Pigs will grow wings before the DUP agree to support Corbyn.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,422
    foxinsoxuk said:

    Second like Jezza!

    Sunil_Prasannan said:

    Second like Corbyn

    Which of you is Diane Abbott?
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    kurtjester said:

    It was very touching to see Corbyn wiping tears from otherwise dry eyes in the Evening Standard today. Give the man an Oscar.

    I doubt he's been so distressed since the 9th of November 1989 - or perhaps as far back as June 10th 1967.
  • isamisam Posts: 42,271
    edited June 2017
    PM Corbyn seems good at 'counting' chickens, but isn't the phrase 'herding cats' when meaning 'getting difficult people to work as a team'?
  • nunununu Posts: 6,024
    Mr Osborne was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder and later further arrested over alleged terror offences.

    Police are carrying out searches at an address in the Cardiff area.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,776
    Alarming news from Syria as well. We'll see what happens west of the Euphrates.

    Anyway, time for me to sod off again.
  • NorthofStokeNorthofStoke Posts: 1,758
    We now have an unprecedented situation for Britain and possibly for any Western democracy with a first past the post system. The main opposition party has a leadership that is clearly within the tradition of 20th century Marxism and the party organisation is in the control of an organisation, Momentum, that is a mixtur of leftist sub-currents some of whom are revolutionary in intent. Corbyn only makes sense if he is understood as being a poor man's Lenin, supporting any movement or group that opposes "capitalist imperialism". Many who vote for him have incorrectly interpreted him as a semi-pacifist. (I was active in the Marxist left in the seventies and I note that Corbyn's support of the IRA was opposed by Militant who always opposed terrorism.) An astonishing situation has arisen that is a reversal of normality. Left wing factions within the Labour party were historically resisted by a seasoned bureaucracy and kept away from the levers of power even when they had built up a fair bit of support. Now, thanks to the idiotic £3 membership scheme and the nomination of Corbyn, the Labour Party is under the control of Marxists (Corbyn, McDonell, Milne) without an effective revolutionary mass movement behind them. The manifesto is left Social Democrat and although fiscally irresponsible is not revolutionary. But there is another way of looking at it. The manifesto represents transitional demands delivering political power it can't really be implemented sucessfully under capitalism but it can be the focus of agitation for a mass movement that is extra-parliamentary and which can deliver the socialist transformation. They know their history and are desperate to build that movement. I strongly suspect that the young Corbynistas are not the right material and that there will be a backlash against Corbyn even if he fails to gain power in a minority government - but it could take months of aggro. I hope young idealists are not lead into unpleasant situations, I would have been one of them. We do live in disturbing times and many are in denial about the state of Labour including much of the Labour Party and millions of Labour voters. Tragedy and farce.
  • nunununu Posts: 6,024
    What do the lyrics of "smells like teen spirit" mean anyway?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,022
    nunu said:

    Mr Osborne was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder and later further arrested over alleged terror offences.

    Police are carrying out searches at an address in the Cardiff area.

    https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/876853028233654272
  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    "IF"

    let's hope it never becomes a 'WHEN'
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    typical Mr Brind

    The left always wants power no matter what.

  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,940
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    nunu said:

    Mr Osborne was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder and later further arrested over alleged terror offences.

    Police are carrying out searches at an address in the Cardiff area.

    https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/876853028233654272
    they must now close the london evening standard as a precaution
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,822
    edited June 2017
    Well that's a good laugh. This is the same Don Brind that has been telling us for months that Corbyn is an absolute liability who couldn't run a whelk stall and should be defenestrated as soon as possible, right?

    He was right the first time. Corbyn in government would set back Labour for years, perhaps decades. It would also be extremely damaging to the country, of course, which is why David Herdson's 'give him enough rope to hang himself' strategy is not a goer, especially given the Article 50 clock.
  • alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    Richard_Tyndall said:

    Poor old Don. Wrong on so many levels.

    Corbyn will never be able to walk into No 10 unless he can show he has the numbers of seats to be allowed to. That means he would have to show that he had the direct support of the DUP because without that he doesn't have the numbers.

    Pigs will grow wings before the DUP agree to support Corbyn.

    Has anyone actually asked all these Labour MPs pontificating about how an agreement with the DUP would "put at risk the NI peace process", because it would apparently destroy the faith of the Nationalists in the position of the UK Govt as a "neutral arbiter", why they think the Unionists would ever trust a Corbyn led Govt as the same?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,998
    edited June 2017
    Pulpstar said:

    "But fewer than 14 million voters, just over 43 % backed the Tories and the DUP, whereas 17 million voters — 52.5% backed Labour and the other four parties. "

    How very dare Don assign all those non Labour, non Tory votes over to Labour.

    Sorry, but you're a member of a party that would jump into bed with Jezza as soon as the chance came along.
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    edited June 2017
    nunu said:

    What do the lyrics of "smells like teen spirit" mean anyway?

    Never mind.
  • alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    nunu said:

    Mr Osborne was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder and later further arrested over alleged terror offences.

    Police are carrying out searches at an address in the Cardiff area.

    https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/876853028233654272
    I'm not sure that the *** is appropriate here, because the two obvious substitutes for them give very different meanings.



  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,998
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    nunu said:

    Mr Osborne was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder and later further arrested over alleged terror offences.

    Police are carrying out searches at an address in the Cardiff area.

    https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/876853028233654272
    Should you be posting that on here?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 60,838
    Ishmael_Z said:

    nunu said:

    What do the lyrics of "smells like teen spirit" mean anyway?

    Never mind.
    Brilliant!
  • Old_HandOld_Hand Posts: 51
    Donald Brind needs to do the arithmetic. Excluding the Speaker and his Deputies, Conservatives have 316 seats, Labour 260, SNP 34, Lib Dems 12, PC 4, Green 1 and 18 from Northern Ireland. Assuming that Corbyn herds Labour, SNP, Lib Dems, PC and Green into the same lobby, that is 311, five less than the Conservatives. If the 10 DUP back the Conservatives, that is insurance. On these figures Corbyn cannot form a Government with any real prospect of getting anything through the House of Commons. Labour need a reality check - the Conservatives majority is fragile, but it is still a majority in practice.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,629
    tlg86 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    nunu said:

    Mr Osborne was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder and later further arrested over alleged terror offences.

    Police are carrying out searches at an address in the Cardiff area.

    https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/876853028233654272
    Should you be posting that on here?
    What's the worry?
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    CarlottaVance said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    Second like Jezza!

    Sunil_Prasannan said:

    Second like Corbyn

    Which of you is Diane Abbott?
    I was second until ursurped by the vanilla gremlins.
  • nunununu Posts: 6,024
    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 63,862
    Richard_Nabavi said:

    Well that's a good laugh. This is the same Don Brind that has been telling us for months that Corbyn is an absolute liability who couldn't run a whelk stall and should be defenestrated as soon as possible, right?

    He was right the first time. Corbyn in government would set back Labour for years, perhaps decades. It would also be extremely damaging to the country, of course, which is why David Herdson's 'give him enough rope to hang himself' strategy is not a goer, especially given the Article 50 clock.

    All is forgiven, Richard, because he wears the red rosette and nearly won.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,998
    RobD said:

    tlg86 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    nunu said:

    Mr Osborne was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder and later further arrested over alleged terror offences.

    Police are carrying out searches at an address in the Cardiff area.

    https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/876853028233654272
    Should you be posting that on here?
    What's the worry?
    I was thinking fair trial bla bla bla, but now I remember that the rule is, if it's reported by the MSM then we're fine to talk about it.

    That's why we were allowed to name someone who didn't commit the terrorist attack on Westminster Bridge.
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    NorthofStoke said:

    We now have an unprecedented situation for Britain and possibly for any Western democracy with a first past the post system. [snip]

    In the nicest possible way, without any spacing or basic layout that is unreadable.

    Slightly less nicely, I ploughed through it anyway and it was unreadable for other reasons too.
  • nunununu Posts: 6,024
    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Is it too much to ask for Corbyn to tell his mob to calm down?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 63,862
    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    For now.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,629
    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,629
    tlg86 said:

    RobD said:

    tlg86 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    nunu said:

    Mr Osborne was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder and later further arrested over alleged terror offences.

    Police are carrying out searches at an address in the Cardiff area.

    https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/876853028233654272
    Should you be posting that on here?
    What's the worry?
    I was thinking fair trial bla bla bla, but now I remember that the rule is, if it's reported by the MSM then we're fine to talk about it.

    That's why we were allowed to name someone who didn't commit the terrorist attack on Westminster Bridge.
    Have C4 news faced any charges on that front? :D
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    alex. said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    nunu said:

    Mr Osborne was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder and later further arrested over alleged terror offences.

    Police are carrying out searches at an address in the Cardiff area.

    twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/876853028233654272
    I'm not sure that the *** is appropriate here, because the two obvious substitutes for them give very different meanings.



    Interesting psychology exercise for the reader, then, as I auto-filled one option in my head without hesitation
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,998
    RobD said:

    tlg86 said:

    RobD said:

    tlg86 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    nunu said:

    Mr Osborne was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder and later further arrested over alleged terror offences.

    Police are carrying out searches at an address in the Cardiff area.

    https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/876853028233654272
    Should you be posting that on here?
    What's the worry?
    I was thinking fair trial bla bla bla, but now I remember that the rule is, if it's reported by the MSM then we're fine to talk about it.

    That's why we were allowed to name someone who didn't commit the terrorist attack on Westminster Bridge.
    Have C4 news faced any charges on that front? :D
    There's an OFCOM investigation:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-39479808
  • nunununu Posts: 6,024
    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    The media are acting as a pack as well. They sense blood.
  • Bobajob_PBBobajob_PB Posts: 928
    GeoffM said:

    alex. said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    nunu said:

    Mr Osborne was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder and later further arrested over alleged terror offences.

    Police are carrying out searches at an address in the Cardiff area.

    twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/876853028233654272
    I'm not sure that the *** is appropriate here, because the two obvious substitutes for them give very different meanings.



    Interesting psychology exercise for the reader, then, as I auto-filled one option in my head without hesitation
    Yes, me too. It involved a meeting tomorrow week.
  • isamisam Posts: 42,271
    edited June 2017
    SeanT said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    Jeremy's apotheosis is extraordinary. It is Diana-like. As with Diana, I predict we will look back on it with bemusement, quite soon.
    More like Boaty McBoatface

    Vote Me I'll volte-face!
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    nunu said:

    What do the lyrics of "smells like teen spirit" mean anyway?

    Much as Ishmael's answer is sooo much funnier, this is a more useful and less teenager-ish response:

    https://www.upvenue.com/article/1467-the-story-behind-smells-like-teen-spirit.html
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,627
    alex. said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    Poor old Don. Wrong on so many levels.

    Corbyn will never be able to walk into No 10 unless he can show he has the numbers of seats to be allowed to. That means he would have to show that he had the direct support of the DUP because without that he doesn't have the numbers.

    Pigs will grow wings before the DUP agree to support Corbyn.

    Has anyone actually asked all these Labour MPs pontificating about how an agreement with the DUP would "put at risk the NI peace process", because it would apparently destroy the faith of the Nationalists in the position of the UK Govt as a "neutral arbiter", why they think the Unionists would ever trust a Corbyn led Govt as the same?
    I think this response is coming at it from the wrong perspective and that Don has a point. Corbyn wouldn't need to rely on the DUP - he could present popular (to voters) legislative proposals and dare tory MPs to reject them. If they did reject them, it's another election as no party can form a government. I suspect there are enough tory MPs in marginals who would quitely abstain rather than cause anther electtion.

    All of this pre-supposes, of course, that a) the tories do not cut a deal with the DUP and b) they are not able to run as a minority administration. I think that's an unlikely double tbf.
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    Is there ant evidence that the tories have looked at the reults of the GE and learnt any lessons? They might think thier leader was a problem, they might think the dementia tax was a problem as was WFA but if they fail to address the issues of the future they will continue to lose support in the under 40's
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,629
    nichomar said:

    Is there ant evidence that the tories have looked at the reults of the GE and learnt any lessons? They might think thier leader was a problem, they might think the dementia tax was a problem as was WFA but if they fail to address the issues of the future they will continue to lose support in the under 40's

    Undoubtedly. Why would they not try to learn lessons from it?
  • nunuonenunuone Posts: 1,138
    SeanT said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    Jeremy's apotheosis is extraordinary. It is Diana-like. As with Diana, I predict we will look back on it with bemusement, quite soon.
    As Jason said, he has become Diana with a beard. He must want an autumn election badly, he would win it easily.
  • SirNorfolkPassmoreSirNorfolkPassmore Posts: 7,379
    There's no real possibility of Jeremy Corbyn "walking into Downing Street" without a further election, and the fact it has gained any credence arises from a misunderstanding of the constitutional position.

    If May was defeated in a vote of confidence, she would not pack her bags and leave immediately. Rather, she would remain (as Brown did in May 2010 while the Coalition was being formed) until somebody was in a position to go to the Queen with a realistic offer to form a Government commanding the confidence of the House. The strong likelihood would be that the someone would be a new Tory leader who could do a deal as necessary to pass a confidence motion. Or it might be May herself. If 14 days passed following a no confidence vote with no subsequent, successful confidence vote, there would be an election.

    Crucially, Corbyn doesn't get to walk into Downing Street on the off-chance he may be able to form a Government from there just because he's leader of the Official Opposition. He has to actually be able to do it to get the keys. The only way for that to happen would be would be (i) if he had either formed a coalition deal with the SNP, Greens, Lib Dems and DUP; or (ii) if the Tories confirmed they'd abstain in a confidence motion effectively handing in the keys.

    Neither of these are even remotely plausible. There are dangers for the SNP in a flaky coalition, the Lib Dems have already said "no", and the DUP practically invented the word "NO" for people like JC. Meanwhile, for the Tories it would mean going back on everything they've said about the dangers of Corbyn.

    So it's either a fresh election or nothing - it's fantasy land to think Labour could form any sort of government on the June result.

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,022
    https://twitter.com/yashar/status/876863474113970176
  • isamisam Posts: 42,271
    edited June 2017
    I think @Casino_Royale asked for something nice to dilute the constant sad news? Happy to oblige

    https://twitter.com/phil500/status/876424981206454272
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    View_From_Cumbria said:

    At the moment she is being blamed for everything. How can this be reasonable ? It is like blaming President Bush for the Louisiana Hurricane or the Queen for Princess Diana's choice of chauffeur. There is something quite revolting about second and third rate journalists jumping on to bandwagons. Crick is not alone although he is undoubtably the worst.

    It looks to me as if Theresa will survive this artificial storm of faux outrage and when people look back in ten years time they might well think she was actually pretty good at the PM lark.

    The "artificial outrage" is so full of "faux outrage" that even the Prime Minister said the response had been inadequate which is code for so piss poor you couldn't make it up.

    Theresa May is Prime Minister not fifth choice goal scorer for the Maidenhead Senior Ladies Netball Team who's slightly off her game.
  • ArtistArtist Posts: 1,893
    On the point of getting in and fixing things, the majority of Labour's Shadow Cabinet has been in their brief for less than a year. Ashworth has been Shadow Health for eight months. Labour aren't ready for government, even if they had the seats for it.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    RobD said:

    nichomar said:

    Is there ant evidence that the tories have looked at the reults of the GE and learnt any lessons? They might think thier leader was a problem, they might think the dementia tax was a problem as was WFA but if they fail to address the issues of the future they will continue to lose support in the under 40's

    Undoubtedly. Why would they not try to learn lessons from it?
    Well, PBTories seriously floating Philip Hammond's name (who has all of May's weaknesses and none of her strengths) suggests they're not doing much learning yet.
  • TudorRoseTudorRose Posts: 1,683
    Benpointer said:

    alex. said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    Poor old Don. Wrong on so many levels.

    Corbyn will never be able to walk into No 10 unless he can show he has the numbers of seats to be allowed to. That means he would have to show that he had the direct support of the DUP because without that he doesn't have the numbers.

    Pigs will grow wings before the DUP agree to support Corbyn.

    Has anyone actually asked all these Labour MPs pontificating about how an agreement with the DUP would "put at risk the NI peace process", because it would apparently destroy the faith of the Nationalists in the position of the UK Govt as a "neutral arbiter", why they think the Unionists would ever trust a Corbyn led Govt as the same?
    I think this response is coming at it from the wrong perspective and that Don has a point. Corbyn wouldn't need to rely on the DUP - he could present popular (to voters) legislative proposals and dare tory MPs to reject them. If they did reject them, it's another election as no party can form a government. I suspect there are enough tory MPs in marginals who would quitely abstain rather than cause anther electtion.

    All of this pre-supposes, of course, that a) the tories do not cut a deal with the DUP and b) they are not able to run as a minority administration. I think that's an unlikely double tbf.
    I don't think you can abstain 'quietly' these days.
  • nunuonenunuone Posts: 1,138
    edited June 2017
    SeanT said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    Jeremy's apotheosis is extraordinary. It is Diana-like. As with Diana, I predict we will look back on it with bemusement, quite soon.
    I've come to realisation after speaking with many people who are normally very intelligent, that only after Corbyn is in government will they understand why his philosophy is so dangerous. And so I am mentally preparing myself for PM Corbyn.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,022
    Danny565 said:

    RobD said:

    nichomar said:

    Is there ant evidence that the tories have looked at the reults of the GE and learnt any lessons? They might think thier leader was a problem, they might think the dementia tax was a problem as was WFA but if they fail to address the issues of the future they will continue to lose support in the under 40's

    Undoubtedly. Why would they not try to learn lessons from it?
    Well, PBTories seriously floating Philip Hammond's name (who has all of May's weaknesses and none of her strengths) suggests they're not doing much learning yet.
    Since when has Alastair Meeks been a PB Tory?
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 22,107
    Danny565 said:

    RobD said:

    nichomar said:

    Is there ant evidence that the tories have looked at the reults of the GE and learnt any lessons? They might think thier leader was a problem, they might think the dementia tax was a problem as was WFA but if they fail to address the issues of the future they will continue to lose support in the under 40's

    Undoubtedly. Why would they not try to learn lessons from it?
    Well, PBTories seriously floating Philip Hammond's name (who has all of May's weaknesses and none of her strengths) suggests they're not doing much learning yet.
    Those that hoped May would be Thatcher are now hoping that Hammond will be Major.

  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,629
    Danny565 said:

    RobD said:

    nichomar said:

    Is there ant evidence that the tories have looked at the reults of the GE and learnt any lessons? They might think thier leader was a problem, they might think the dementia tax was a problem as was WFA but if they fail to address the issues of the future they will continue to lose support in the under 40's

    Undoubtedly. Why would they not try to learn lessons from it?
    Well, PBTories seriously floating Philip Hammond's name (who has all of May's weaknesses and none of her strengths) suggests they're not doing much learning yet.
    Must have missed that.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    JackW said:

    View_From_Cumbria said:

    At the moment she is being blamed for everything. How can this be reasonable ? It is like blaming President Bush for the Louisiana Hurricane or the Queen for Princess Diana's choice of chauffeur. There is something quite revolting about second and third rate journalists jumping on to bandwagons. Crick is not alone although he is undoubtably the worst.

    It looks to me as if Theresa will survive this artificial storm of faux outrage and when people look back in ten years time they might well think she was actually pretty good at the PM lark.

    The "artificial outrage" is so full of "faux outrage" that even the Prime Minister said the response had been inadequate which is code for so piss poor you couldn't make it up.

    Theresa May is Prime Minister not fifth choice goal scorer for the Maidenhead Senior Ladies Netball Team who's slightly off her game.
    Whilst I think some of the comments about May with regards to Grenfell have been unfair, I do have to wonder if some of the outraged PB commentators were stopping themselves jumping on the "bandwagons" when all the media were slamming Brown for everything.

    He was criticised for not writing letters to soldiers' relatives in neat enough handwriting FFS....
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Danny565 said:

    RobD said:

    nichomar said:

    Is there ant evidence that the tories have looked at the reults of the GE and learnt any lessons? They might think thier leader was a problem, they might think the dementia tax was a problem as was WFA but if they fail to address the issues of the future they will continue to lose support in the under 40's

    Undoubtedly. Why would they not try to learn lessons from it?
    Well, PBTories seriously floating Philip Hammond's name (who has all of May's weaknesses and none of her strengths) suggests they're not doing much learning yet.
    Since when has Alastair Meeks been a PB Tory?
    HYUFD was the first one that came to mind actually :D

  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    SirNorfolkPassmore said:

    There's no real possibility of Jeremy Corbyn "walking into Downing Street" without a further election, and the fact it has gained any credence arises from a misunderstanding of the constitutional position.

    If May was defeated in a vote of confidence, she would not pack her bags and leave immediately. Rather, she would remain (as Brown did in May 2010 while the Coalition was being formed) until somebody was in a position to go to the Queen with a realistic offer to form a Government commanding the confidence of the House. The strong likelihood would be that the someone would be a new Tory leader who could do a deal as necessary to pass a confidence motion. Or it might be May herself. If 14 days passed following a no confidence vote with no subsequent, successful confidence vote, there would be an election.

    Crucially, Corbyn doesn't get to walk into Downing Street on the off-chance he may be able to form a Government from there just because he's leader of the Official Opposition. He has to actually be able to do it to get the keys. The only way for that to happen would be would be (i) if he had either formed a coalition deal with the SNP, Greens, Lib Dems and DUP; or (ii) if the Tories confirmed they'd abstain in a confidence motion effectively handing in the keys.

    Neither of these are even remotely plausible. There are dangers for the SNP in a flaky coalition, the Lib Dems have already said "no", and the DUP practically invented the word "NO" for people like JC. Meanwhile, for the Tories it would mean going back on everything they've said about the dangers of Corbyn.

    So it's either a fresh election or nothing - it's fantasy land to think Labour could form any sort of government on the June result.

    It can only happen if sufficient tory MP's felt so stongly that their reasons for defecting or voting againstthe QS outwieghed thier party loyalty. I cant envisage any circumstaces short of a "Suez" type debaclewhich could bring it about, it makes a thread like this good for entertainment but off the scale in probability. Evan if Rees Mogg and co dont get they want they wont let corbyn in.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 22,107
    Tories banging on about the dangers of Corbyn need to reflect on the clusterfuck they themselves have created.
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    TudorRose said:

    Benpointer said:

    alex. said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    Poor old Don. Wrong on so many levels.

    Corbyn will never be able to walk into No 10 unless he can show he has the numbers of seats to be allowed to. That means he would have to show that he had the direct support of the DUP because without that he doesn't have the numbers.

    Pigs will grow wings before the DUP agree to support Corbyn.

    Has anyone actually asked all these Labour MPs pontificating about how an agreement with the DUP would "put at risk the NI peace process", because it would apparently destroy the faith of the Nationalists in the position of the UK Govt as a "neutral arbiter", why they think the Unionists would ever trust a Corbyn led Govt as the same?
    I think this response is coming at it from the wrong perspective and that Don has a point. Corbyn wouldn't need to rely on the DUP - he could present popular (to voters) legislative proposals and dare tory MPs to reject them. If they did reject them, it's another election as no party can form a government. I suspect there are enough tory MPs in marginals who would quitely abstain rather than cause anther electtion.

    All of this pre-supposes, of course, that a) the tories do not cut a deal with the DUP and b) they are not able to run as a minority administration. I think that's an unlikely double tbf.
    I don't think you can abstain 'quietly' these days.
    The instinct to virtue signal these days is overwhelming.
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    I am beginning to think that the outlook for the Tories is not quite as bad as it might be. Corbyn has star quality - the IRA attack video which I stupidly touted as the Tory secret weapon was watchable because of this - the way he came across in the clips made you think Sean Bean would play him in the biopic. The fact remains though that he is as mad as a meat axe and his cronies are worse, and unless the present big moderate beasts of labour can do a very tricky Vicar of Bray realignment over the summer the party is going to be a very obvious mess by conference time. We know some very useful things from the ge, not least that the young have stopped not voting, and that some pork in the shape of university fee reductions needs directing their way, and that t may makes chocolate fireguards look sternly utilitarian. Fix those points and we are back in business.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,422
    foxinsoxuk said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    Second like Jezza!

    Sunil_Prasannan said:

    Second like Corbyn

    Which of you is Diane Abbott?
    I was second until ursurped by the vanilla gremlins.
    Incompetence and innumeracy hiding behind an alleged medical condition ("vanilla gremlins" indeed!) - it's you!
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,629
    Ishmael_Z said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    I am beginning to think that the outlook for the Tories is not quite as bad as it might be. Corbyn has star quality - the IRA attack video which I stupidly touted as the Tory secret weapon was watchable because of this - the way he came across in the clips made you think Sean Bean would play him in the biopic. The fact remains though that he is as mad as a meat axe and his cronies are worse, and unless the present big moderate beasts of labour can do a very tricky Vicar of Bray realignment over the summer the party is going to be a very obvious mess by conference time. We know some very useful things from the ge, not least that the young have stopped not voting, and that some pork in the shape of university fee reductions needs directing their way, and that t may makes chocolate fireguards look sternly utilitarian. Fix those points and we are back in business.
    Was there really a surge of youth turnout? I thought it was due to middle aged and older people swinging Labour more than usual?
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    RobD said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    I am beginning to think that the outlook for the Tories is not quite as bad as it might be. Corbyn has star quality - the IRA attack video which I stupidly touted as the Tory secret weapon was watchable because of this - the way he came across in the clips made you think Sean Bean would play him in the biopic. The fact remains though that he is as mad as a meat axe and his cronies are worse, and unless the present big moderate beasts of labour can do a very tricky Vicar of Bray realignment over the summer the party is going to be a very obvious mess by conference time. We know some very useful things from the ge, not least that the young have stopped not voting, and that some pork in the shape of university fee reductions needs directing their way, and that t may makes chocolate fireguards look sternly utilitarian. Fix those points and we are back in business.
    Was there really a surge of youth turnout? I thought it was due to middle aged and older people swinging Labour more than usual?
    I thought there was but not sure why I thought that. But the anecdotal evidence was that if the middle aged were swinging leftward it was on behalf of their children.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,736
    Benpointer said:



    I think this response is coming at it from the wrong perspective and that Don has a point. Corbyn wouldn't need to rely on the DUP - he could present popular (to voters) legislative proposals and dare tory MPs to reject them. If they did reject them, it's another election as no party can form a government. I suspect there are enough tory MPs in marginals who would quitely abstain rather than cause anther electtion.

    All of this pre-supposes, of course, that a) the tories do not cut a deal with the DUP and b) they are not able to run as a minority administration. I think that's an unlikely double tbf.

    That's right, on all three points.

    On Corbyn's welcome at the mosque, to be fair, virtually everyone in the constituency thinks he's been a good local MP for decades, including befriending every group in the mutlifaceted community. It's not surprising that they appreciate him at such a nasty moment. As for the heckling of Theresa, it sounds as though it was just two people, and I heard others on the radio saying they didn't support her but they thought she'd done a good job today.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,736
    edited June 2017
    By the way, what is the relationship between nunu and nunuone?
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 30,655
    edited June 2017
    The mission isn't get Corbyn into number 10 with 260 seats - that's madness*

    The mission is to bring down the government which Brexit means Brexit Tory MPs will do by themselves. There is no Tory majority regardless of the DUP because there are sizeable factions on both wings who will vote against the other. Yes they'll support confidence motions. But I suspect theyll support little else.

    And the same goes for a very Minority Corbyn260 government. It'll be an early election

    *This is politics. Mad things happen. Just because it's crazy doesn't mean it impossible
  • TudorRoseTudorRose Posts: 1,683
    Ishmael_Z said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    I am beginning to think that the outlook for the Tories is not quite as bad as it might be. Corbyn has star quality - the IRA attack video which I stupidly touted as the Tory secret weapon was watchable because of this - the way he came across in the clips made you think Sean Bean would play him in the biopic. The fact remains though that he is as mad as a meat axe and his cronies are worse, and unless the present big moderate beasts of labour can do a very tricky Vicar of Bray realignment over the summer the party is going to be a very obvious mess by conference time. We know some very useful things from the ge, not least that the young have stopped not voting, and that some pork in the shape of university fee reductions needs directing their way, and that t may makes chocolate fireguards look sternly utilitarian. Fix those points and we are back in business.
    I'm not convinced - in the short term Socialism could be very attractive. Here's my take on the seven ages of Corbynism;
    1; Isn’t it great that everything is free?
    2; Why weren’t we always socialists?
    3; Where have all the rich people gone? And all the wealth creators?
    4; Why are mortgages so expensive? When did the pound drop to below 50 cents?
    5; Why is everyone always on strike? And why is inflation so high?
    6; Where did all those students who got free tuition fees go to? Why is the IMF running the place?
    7; Where’s Maggie?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited June 2017
    According to the Sunday Times, Julian Brazier spent about a third of the election campaign in the Eltham constituency which the Tories were hoping to win from Labour. The Labour majority went up massively there, and he also lost his own seat in Canterbury by a tiny margin.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 52,530
    If Don Brind is suggesting it, we can at least rest easy that it is most unlikely to happen.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Danny565 said:

    JackW said:

    View_From_Cumbria said:

    At the moment she is being blamed for everything. How can this be reasonable ? It is like blaming President Bush for the Louisiana Hurricane or the Queen for Princess Diana's choice of chauffeur. There is something quite revolting about second and third rate journalists jumping on to bandwagons. Crick is not alone although he is undoubtably the worst.

    It looks to me as if Theresa will survive this artificial storm of faux outrage and when people look back in ten years time they might well think she was actually pretty good at the PM lark.

    The "artificial storm" is so full of "faux outrage" that even the Prime Minister said the response had been inadequate which is code for so piss poor you couldn't make it up.

    Theresa May is Prime Minister not fifth choice goal scorer for the Maidenhead Senior Ladies Netball Team who's slightly off her game.
    Whilst I think some of the comments about May with regards to Grenfell have been unfair, I do have to wonder if some of the outraged PB commentators were stopping themselves jumping on the "bandwagons" when all the media were slamming Brown for everything.

    He was criticised for not writing letters to soldiers' relatives in neat enough handwriting FFS....
    In fairness many PB Tories recognize the PM hasn't turned in a stellar performance over the past few weeks to put it at its most charitable.

    Of course there are the usual suspects for whom Mrs May BBQing babies in the rose garden of 10 Downing Street would be seen as a wonderful example of a mixture of Masterchef and Gardeners World.

  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    nunuone said:

    SeanT said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    Jeremy's apotheosis is extraordinary. It is Diana-like. As with Diana, I predict we will look back on it with bemusement, quite soon.
    I've come to realisation after speaking with many people who are normally very intelligent, that only after Corbyn is in government will they understand why his philosophy is so dangerous. And so I am mentally preparing myself for PM Corbyn.
    Will Jeremy still be leader in May 2022?
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 52,530
    NickPalmer said:

    By the way, what is the relationship between nunu and nunuone?

    separated only by a small lapse in memory
  • RoyalBlueRoyalBlue Posts: 3,223
    RochdalePioneers said:

    The mission isn't get Corbyn into number 10 with 260 seats - that's madness*

    The mission is to bring down the government which Brexit means Brexit Tory MPs will do by themselves. There is no Tory majority regardless of the DUP because there are sizeable factions on both wings who will vote against the other. Yes they'll support confidence motions. But I suspect theyll support little else.

    And the same goes for a very Minority Corbyn260 government. It'll be an early election

    *This is politics. Mad things happen. Just because it's crazy doesn't mean it impossible

    You're contradicting yourself. If Tories will support confidence motions, then there'll be no early election.

    I know wishful thinking is the left's stock in trade, but this really is getting boring. There will be no early election.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,422
    I wonder if Southern train drivers who've turned down £75,000 will be in favour of socialism?
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    Ishmael_Z said:

    RobD said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    I am beginning to think that the outlook for the Tories is not quite as bad as it might be. Corbyn has star quality - the IRA attack video which I stupidly touted as the Tory secret weapon was watchable because of this - the way he came across in the clips made you think Sean Bean would play him in the biopic. The fact remains though that he is as mad as a meat axe and his cronies are worse, and unless the present big moderate beasts of labour can do a very tricky Vicar of Bray realignment over the summer the party is going to be a very obvious mess by conference time. We know some very useful things from the ge, not least that the young have stopped not voting, and that some pork in the shape of university fee reductions needs directing their way, and that t may makes chocolate fireguards look sternly utilitarian. Fix those points and we are back in business.
    Was there really a surge of youth turnout? I thought it was due to middle aged and older people swinging Labour more than usual?
    I thought there was but not sure why I thought that. But the anecdotal evidence was that if the middle aged were swinging leftward it was on behalf of their children.
    Ironically swinging leftward is the best way to ruin the future of their children.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 52,530
    RobD said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    I am beginning to think that the outlook for the Tories is not quite as bad as it might be. Corbyn has star quality - the IRA attack video which I stupidly touted as the Tory secret weapon was watchable because of this - the way he came across in the clips made you think Sean Bean would play him in the biopic. The fact remains though that he is as mad as a meat axe and his cronies are worse, and unless the present big moderate beasts of labour can do a very tricky Vicar of Bray realignment over the summer the party is going to be a very obvious mess by conference time. We know some very useful things from the ge, not least that the young have stopped not voting, and that some pork in the shape of university fee reductions needs directing their way, and that t may makes chocolate fireguards look sternly utilitarian. Fix those points and we are back in business.
    Was there really a surge of youth turnout? I thought it was due to middle aged and older people swinging Labour more than usual?
    Younger voter turnout rose, but not to spectacular levels. As the guy from Survation said, their NOM forecast didn't rely on turnout in order to be accurate.

    Which does raise the question what it was that ICM and ComRes got so wrong with their sample, if it wasn't (only) the turnout model?
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    RoyalBlue said:

    RochdalePioneers said:

    The mission isn't get Corbyn into number 10 with 260 seats - that's madness*

    The mission is to bring down the government which Brexit means Brexit Tory MPs will do by themselves. There is no Tory majority regardless of the DUP because there are sizeable factions on both wings who will vote against the other. Yes they'll support confidence motions. But I suspect theyll support little else.

    And the same goes for a very Minority Corbyn260 government. It'll be an early election

    *This is politics. Mad things happen. Just because it's crazy doesn't mean it impossible

    You're contradicting yourself. If Tories will support confidence motions, then there'll be no early election.

    I know wishful thinking is the left's stock in trade, but this really is getting boring. There will be no early election.
    Tories voting that they do have confidence in Jezza would be hilarious though!
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,740
    AndyJS said:

    According to the Sunday Times, Julian Brazier spent about a third of the election campaign in the Eltham constituency which the Tories were hoping to win from Labour. The Labour majority went up massively there, and he also lost his own seat in Canterbury by a tiny margin.

    Then I don't think Jim Messina's alleged final prediction of c. 300 seats was taken very seriously, if it indeed existed.
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    GeoffM said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    RobD said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    I am beginning to think that the outlook for the Tories is not quite as bad as it might be. Corbyn has star quality - the IRA attack video which I stupidly touted as the Tory secret weapon was watchable because of this - the way he came across in the clips made you think Sean Bean would play him in the biopic. The fact remains though that he is as mad as a meat axe and his cronies are worse, and unless the present big moderate beasts of labour can do a very tricky Vicar of Bray realignment over the summer the party is going to be a very obvious mess by conference time. We know some very useful things from the ge, not least that the young have stopped not voting, and that some pork in the shape of university fee reductions needs directing their way, and that t may makes chocolate fireguards look sternly utilitarian. Fix those points and we are back in business.
    Was there really a surge of youth turnout? I thought it was due to middle aged and older people swinging Labour more than usual?
    I thought there was but not sure why I thought that. But the anecdotal evidence was that if the middle aged were swinging leftward it was on behalf of their children.
    Ironically swinging leftward is the best way to ruin the future of their children.
    You know that and I know that....
  • nunuonenunuone Posts: 1,138
    RobD said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    I am beginning to think that the outlook for the Tories is not quite as bad as it might be. Corbyn has star quality - the IRA attack video which I stupidly touted as the Tory secret weapon was watchable because of this - the way he came across in the clips made you think Sean Bean would play him in the biopic. The fact remains though that he is as mad as a meat axe and his cronies are worse, and unless the present big moderate beasts of labour can do a very tricky Vicar of Bray realignment over the summer the party is going to be a very obvious mess by conference time. We know some very useful things from the ge, not least that the young have stopped not voting, and that some pork in the shape of university fee reductions needs directing their way, and that t may makes chocolate fireguards look sternly utilitarian. Fix those points and we are back in business.
    Was there really a surge of youth turnout? I thought it was due to middle aged and older people swinging Labour more than usual?
    Youth turnout rose from 43% to 57% according to the eerily accurate YouGov model. I'd call that a surge.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 63,862
    NickPalmer said:

    By the way, what is the relationship between nunu and nunuone?

    It's complicated.
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    Having just watched Rees Mogg on skt news he believes leaving the EU is easy and not at all complicated so there's no need toworry or be concerned. I must have missed something along the way or he just has a superior intellect to my meagre brain.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Final French Parliamentary Results - ERM Maj 123 - Full Results :

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-40178118
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    nichomar said:

    Having just watched Rees Mogg on skt news he believes leaving the EU is easy and not at all complicated so there's no need toworry or be concerned. I must have missed something along the way or he just has a superior intellect to my meagre brain.

    Yes
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    Ishmael_Z said:

    GeoffM said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    RobD said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    RobD said:

    nunu said:

    Corbyn is the hero now and May the villain. No matter what she does it will be wrong. Damaged beyond repair.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/london-mosque-attack-jeremy-corbyn-and-theresa-may-address-worshippers-at-finsbury-park-mosque-a3568306.html

    Personality cult.
    I am beginning to think that the outlook for the Tories is not quite as bad as it might be. Corbyn has star quality - the IRA attack video which I stupidly touted as the Tory secret weapon was watchable because of this - the way he came across in the clips made you think Sean Bean would play him in the biopic. The fact remains though that he is as mad as a meat axe and his cronies are worse, and unless the present big moderate beasts of labour can do a very tricky Vicar of Bray realignment over the summer the party is going to be a very obvious mess by conference time. We know some very useful things from the ge, not least that the young have stopped not voting, and that some pork in the shape of university fee reductions needs directing their way, and that t may makes chocolate fireguards look sternly utilitarian. Fix those points and we are back in business.
    Was there really a surge of youth turnout? I thought it was due to middle aged and older people swinging Labour more than usual?
    I thought there was but not sure why I thought that. But the anecdotal evidence was that if the middle aged were swinging leftward it was on behalf of their children.
    Ironically swinging leftward is the best way to ruin the future of their children.
    You know that and I know that....
    But actually ... I was talking to an undergraduate the other day who said all her friends envied her for being an only child because it meant she might one day own a house. I found that tragic, and if we were to undergo the mother of all recessions it would arguably be a net benefit to that generation, if it came with the mother of all house price crashes
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,422
    Pop quiz.....which (non trivial) bits of Barnier's remarks did Laura K leave out?

    "The UK has decided to leave the EU - it's not the other way round….the consequences are substantial…

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/40335399
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    GeoffM said:

    nichomar said:

    Having just watched Rees Mogg on skt news he believes leaving the EU is easy and not at all complicated so there's no need toworry or be concerned. I must have missed something along the way or he just has a superior intellect to my meagre brain.

    Yes
    GeoffM said:

    nichomar said:

    Having just watched Rees Mogg on skt news he believes leaving the EU is easy and not at all complicated so there's no need toworry or be concerned. I must have missed something along the way or he just has a superior intellect to my meagre brain.

    Yes
    I would beg to differ but it will never be put to the test but i agree he is superior to the likes of me.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 33,486
    edited June 2017
    Benpointer said:

    alex. said:

    Richard_Tyndall said:

    Poor old Don. Wrong on so many levels.

    Corbyn will never be able to walk into No 10 unless he can show he has the numbers of seats to be allowed to. That means he would have to show that he had the direct support of the DUP because without that he doesn't have the numbers.

    Pigs will grow wings before the DUP agree to support Corbyn.

    Has anyone actually asked all these Labour MPs pontificating about how an agreement with the DUP would "put at risk the NI peace process", because it would apparently destroy the faith of the Nationalists in the position of the UK Govt as a "neutral arbiter", why they think the Unionists would ever trust a Corbyn led Govt as the same?
    I think this response is coming at it from the wrong perspective and that Don has a point. Corbyn wouldn't need to rely on the DUP - he could present popular (to voters) legislative proposals and dare tory MPs to reject them. If they did reject them, it's another election as no party can form a government. I suspect there are enough tory MPs in marginals who would quitely abstain rather than cause anther electtion.

    All of this pre-supposes, of course, that a) the tories do not cut a deal with the DUP and b) they are not able to run as a minority administration. I think that's an unlikely double tbf.
    Not a chance. Corbyn already has all the voters he is going to get as far as his moronic policies are concerned. Anyone on the Tory benches who voted for him would be almost 100% guaranteeing they would be deselected before any future election, not by the party hierarchy but by their own constituency parties.

    If Corbyn cannot persuade the DUP to support him he will never make it inside the doors of Number 10 except as a guest of the PM.
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