politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Analysing Labour’s rise in the polls

Scott_P said:

Chris said:

You see? You can't bring yourself to say he wanted more terrorist attacks! It's just too silly. :-)

That isn't the question.

Did he want the perpetrators of the attacks to win?

You can't honestly say no.

ThreeQuidder said:

TMA1 said:

Chris said:

Ishmael_Z said:

Chris said:

SeanT said:

Chris said:

SeanT said:

Try this quiz. Who said these various quotes, Jeremy Corbyn's Stop the War Coalition, or ISIS?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/islamic-state/12036681/Who-said-it-Stop-the-War-Coalition-or-Isil.html

Sorry, no time for a quiz. Please just quote the incriminating stuff, if there is any.

K, here's an actual video of Corbyn saying the beheading of poor Alan Henning, by ISIS, was the result of OUR jingoism.

https://twitter.com/bernerlap/status/868752282871111680

In a way, perhaps the most remarkable thing about that, is that the word that you've put into upper-case letters is one that Jeremy Corbyn didn't even utter in the video. (Who knows, perhaps that's why you put it into upper-case.)

But what I've been asking is whether Corbyn has actually expressed support for terrorism in a speech, rather than expressing opinions about the causes of terrorism. You do see that there's a difference, don't you?

He has said what he says at the start of the tory attack video - "I have been voting against anti-terrorist legislation since 1983". Boasting of opposing anti-terror legislation *in principle* (rather than specific bits of legislation on specific grounds) is about as close as you can realistically get to expressing support for terrorism.

I think I agree that if he had boasted of opposing anti-terror legislation in principle, that would come quite close to support for terrorism (provided the principle in question was opposition to anti-terror legislation, anyway).

But I don't see the words "in principle" in your quotation from Corbyn. Did he say that, or does it come from you?

How many angels are dancing on the top of your pin head?
lets keep it simple
Did Corbyn vote for or against the Good Friday Agreement?

Neither, as far as I can tell - there doesn't seem to have been a vote in the Commons as to whether the GFA should be signed.

But he certainly voted against the Anglo-Irish agreement on the grounds that it wasn;'t a capitulation to the IRA's demands for a united Ireland.

rkrkrk said:

TMA1 said:

<

How many angels are dancing on the top of your pin head?
lets keep it simple
Did Corbyn vote for or against the Good Friday Agreement?

He voted for the Good Friday Agreement.

http://www.publicwhip.org.uk/division.php?date=1998-07-20&number=340&mpn=Jeremy_Corbyn&mpc=Islington_North&house=commons

You might want to ask yourself why you thought he didn't. It might just be that the diet of news and information you consume is not very accurate when it comes to Jeremy Corbyn?

ThreeQuidder said:

TMA1 said:

Chris said:

Ishmael_Z said:

Chris said:

SeanT said:

Chris said:

SeanT said:

Try this quiz. Who said these various quotes, Jeremy Corbyn's Stop the War Coalition, or ISIS?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/islamic-state/12036681/Who-said-it-Stop-the-War-Coalition-or-Isil.html

Sorry, no time for a quiz. Please just quote the incriminating stuff, if there is any.

K, here's an actual video of Corbyn saying the beheading of poor Alan Henning, by ISIS, was the result of OUR jingoism.

https://twitter.com/bernerlap/status/868752282871111680

In a way, perhaps the most remarkable thing about that, is that the word that you've put into upper-case letters is one that Jeremy Corbyn didn't even utter in the video. (Who knows, perhaps that's why you put it into upper-case.)

But what I've been asking is whether Corbyn has actually expressed support for terrorism in a speech, rather than expressing opinions about the causes of terrorism. You do see that there's a difference, don't you?

He has said what he says at the start of the tory attack video - "I have been voting against anti-terrorist legislation since 1983". Boasting of opposing anti-terror legislation *in principle* (rather than specific bits of legislation on specific grounds) is about as close as you can realistically get to expressing support for terrorism.

I think I agree that if he had boasted of opposing anti-terror legislation in principle, that would come quite close to support for terrorism (provided the principle in question was opposition to anti-terror legislation, anyway).

But I don't see the words "in principle" in your quotation from Corbyn. Did he say that, or does it come from you?

How many angels are dancing on the top of your pin head?
lets keep it simple
Did Corbyn vote for or against the Good Friday Agreement?

Neither, as far as I can tell - there doesn't seem to have been a vote in the Commons as to whether the GFA should be signed.

But he certainly voted against the Anglo-Irish agreement on the grounds that it wasn;'t a capitulation to the IRA's demands for a united Ireland.

aschamberlain said:

peter_from_putney said:

peter_from_putney said:

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As ever, DYOR

Oops sorry, that should read a 10% profit on your combined stake - still not a bad return though for a risk free combination bet.

Good spot! I shall raise a glass of whatever whisky I buy with the winnings in your honour.

AlsoIndigo said:

rkrkrk said:

TMA1 said:

<

How many angels are dancing on the top of your pin head?
lets keep it simple
Did Corbyn vote for or against the Good Friday Agreement?

He voted for the Good Friday Agreement.

http://www.publicwhip.org.uk/division.php?date=1998-07-20&number=340&mpn=Jeremy_Corbyn&mpc=Islington_North&house=commons

You might want to ask yourself why you thought he didn't. It might just be that the diet of news and information you consume is not very accurate when it comes to Jeremy Corbyn?

Not in 1998 he didnt. The Anglo-Irish Agreement was in 1985.

ThreeQuidder said:

Chris said:

Scott_P said:

Chris said:

You see? You can't bring yourself to say he wanted more terrorist attacks! It's just too silly. :-)

That isn't the question.

Did he want the perpetrators of the attacks to win?

You can't honestly say no.

No, sorry, we did that in the other thread earlier. Wanting a united Ireland isn't the same as supporting terrorism.

Obviously the strategy is to find something that Corbyn did support, which people can be hoodwinked into thinking is somehow equivalent to supporting terrorism. The more people do that, the more obvious it is that they can't point to any actual expression of support by Corbyn for terrorism.

Are you seriously expecting people to find a direct quote of Corbyn saying "I support the IRA"?

logical_song said:

How much did outsourcing save/cost British Airway?
The GMB union has suggested the BA computer systems failure was "another example of the shortcomings of BA IT systems since they made a number of staff redundant, and outsourced their work to India in 2016."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40075721

malcolmg said:

HYUFD said:

SeanT said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

SeanT said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

kle4 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RoyalBlue said:

kle4 said:

It is worth noting that even when people do recall policies, they are not necessarily what they base their vote on. Ballot box behaviour is much more about the broader perceptions of the parties
Yep. Tories took a hit, but started well in front so should still win. Their manifesto was deliberately a more sober affair and was never going to be as popular, but they need to limit any further damage - a proposed relaunch is a very bad idea, as it will just make matters more complicated with little guarantee it will fix the perception of their plans.

You say they should limit further damage, but a relaunch is a bad idea. What should they do?

Well they've made a positive start by castrating Nick Timothy and giving Sir Lynton Crosby complete control of the campaign.

If he's so great why didn't they from the start, if you are serious?

Apparently Mrs May is a control freak and she and Nick Timothy thought they knew better than Sir Lynton Crosby when it comes to winning general elections.

https://twitter.com/MsHelicat/status/868572170099752961

If Ruth Davidson was Tory leader they'd still be 20 points ahead. Why can't TMay be like this? - coherent, smart, lucid, persuasive, and nailing her points without sounding like a robot.

https://twitter.com/RidgeOnSunday/status/868755755716837376

I live in hope Ruth Davidson might be the Tory leader/PM for the 2022 general election.

She's the best candidate by miles. I can't think of anyone close. She personally turned around the SCONES. She's a proven winner.

I'm With You: Davidson for '22.

Davidson has got a 15% swing from the SNP with Comres yesterday and a 12.5% swing from the SNP with Yougov in Scotland, May by contrast has got a 2.5% swing from Labour with Comres UK wide and virtually no swing at all with Yougov. Albeit May starts from a much higher base

You are off your rocker, Trump gives more honest numbers than you are peddling. I know you are used to writing fantasy but for god's sake get a grip.

foxinsoxuk said:

malcolmg said:

AlsoIndigo said:

Chris said:

Scott_P said:

Chris said:

But what do you really think? That he voted against the legislation because he wanted to see more terrorist attacks?

I think it may be reasonable to assume he wanted to see fewer terrorists locked up

You see? You can't bring yourself to say he wanted more terrorist attacks! It's just too silly. :-)

So what do you think is the natural consequence of locking up less terrorists ?

May signed of for all those Libyans to get passports back and MI5 muppets helped them go back and forth, that worked well did it not.

Anti terrorist legislation has also been used and abused in a number of ways to target legitimate protests. There are many who are cautious of increasing the power of the state to supress dissent.

Opposing Mrs May's plans to control the internet, for example, or opposing the collaboration with torturing regimes, does not mean standing up for terrorism, it means standing up for freedom.

Virtually the entirety of the Conservative Party (presumably including TM) opposed Blairs 2006 Terrorism bill. Are they all traitors and appeasers?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4422086.stm

Chris said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Chris said:

Scott_P said:

Chris said:

You see? You can't bring yourself to say he wanted more terrorist attacks! It's just too silly. :-)

That isn't the question.

Did he want the perpetrators of the attacks to win?

You can't honestly say no.

No, sorry, we did that in the other thread earlier. Wanting a united Ireland isn't the same as supporting terrorism.

Obviously the strategy is to find something that Corbyn did support, which people can be hoodwinked into thinking is somehow equivalent to supporting terrorism. The more people do that, the more obvious it is that they can't point to any actual expression of support by Corbyn for terrorism.

Are you seriously expecting people to find a direct quote of Corbyn saying "I support the IRA"?

Yes please.

Chris said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Chris said:

Scott_P said:

Chris said:

You see? You can't bring yourself to say he wanted more terrorist attacks! It's just too silly. :-)

That isn't the question.

Did he want the perpetrators of the attacks to win?

You can't honestly say no.

No, sorry, we did that in the other thread earlier. Wanting a united Ireland isn't the same as supporting terrorism.

Obviously the strategy is to find something that Corbyn did support, which people can be hoodwinked into thinking is somehow equivalent to supporting terrorism. The more people do that, the more obvious it is that they can't point to any actual expression of support by Corbyn for terrorism.

Are you seriously expecting people to find a direct quote of Corbyn saying "I support the IRA"?

Yes please.

SeanT said:

DecrepitJohnL said:

SeanT said:

K, here's an actual video of Corbyn saying the beheading of poor Alan Henning, by ISIS, was the result of OUR jingoism.

https://twitter.com/bernerlap/status/868752282871111680

Out of context much? The whole quotation seems more reasonable, even if you do not agree with it. Corbyn said in that clip: the price of war, the price of intervention, the price of jingoism is somebody else's son, and somebody else's daughter, being killed.

He's just despicable. Jingoism??? We intervened in Iraq and Libya for good reasons - to prevent genocides, topple horrible dictators, encourage democracy. Yes, it turned out those interventions went horribly wrong, were stupidly handled and badly misguided, but we expended much blood and treasure with good intent.

Other interventions, e.g. Kosovo, Sierra Leone, went much better and we saved many many lives.

We didn't go in to these places in a spirit of extreme nationalist swaggering - i.e. from "jingoism" - to prove how great and tough we are. It's a fucking ludicrous word to use; it's a poisonous lie.

And when we DON'T intervene - Syria - we still get blamed anyway. For not intervening.

Face it, Corbyn despises America, Britain, Israel and capitalism, probably in that order, and anyone that attacks America and Britain and Israel is good in his eyes, and he is more than happy to blame the deaths of innocent aid workers on us, using any rhetorical device possible, for that same reason.

He is a c*nt of the first water and anyone who votes for him - and Abbott and McDonnell, who are possibly worse - should be doing it with their eyes open. And they should accept the moral consequences.

malcolmg said:

SeanT said:

Chris said:

SeanT said:

Chris said:

SeanT said:

Chris said:

But having wasted some time today looking into two other stories about how "disgusting" Jeremy Corbyn is, which turned out not to be what they seemed, I can't help wondering whether that is entirely accurate and fair. Are those words "show solidarity ..." a quotation from Corbyn, as you seem to imply? I don't think they are. If they aren't, how do you know why he was there or what he was trying to do? Did Corbyn call it a "show trial"? I looked at an online report in the Times, and although that phrase was in quotation marks, it was very difficult to tell where it came from. Not from Corbyn, I suspect.

In response to this story, Corbyn's spokesperson said he was lobbying for a fair trial. Some people may think the idea that alleged terrorists wouldn't get a fair trial is ridiculous and "disgusting". But is it really, viewed in the context of the serious miscarriages of justice that are known to have taken place?

I don't understand why, if Corbyn really expressed clear support for terrorism in his speeches, those speeches can't just be quoted, and then there would be no question about it.

Try this quiz. Who said these various quotes, Jeremy Corbyn's Stop the War Coalition, or ISIS?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/islamic-state/12036681/Who-said-it-Stop-the-War-Coalition-or-Isil.html

Sorry, no time for a quiz. Please just quote the incriminating stuff, if there is any.

K, here's an actual video of Corbyn saying the beheading of poor Alan Henning, by ISIS, was the result of OUR jingoism.

https://twitter.com/bernerlap/status/868752282871111680

In a way, perhaps the most remarkable thing about that, is that the word that you've put into upper-case letters is one that Jeremy Corbyn didn't even utter in the video. (Who knows, perhaps that's why you put it into upper-case.)

But what I've been asking is whether Corbyn has actually expressed support for terrorism in a speech, rather than expressing opinions about the causes of terrorism. You do see that there's a difference, don't you?

I really don't give a fuck what you think. If you want to support this nasty, querulous, IRA-loving, terrorist-appeasing old fool, go ahead, knock yourself out. Endex.

I

Sean, flapping again, two weeks in a row, how much trouble are the Tories in.

BannedInParis said:

Chris said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Chris said:

Scott_P said:

Chris said:

You see? You can't bring yourself to say he wanted more terrorist attacks! It's just too silly. :-)

That isn't the question.

Did he want the perpetrators of the attacks to win?

You can't honestly say no.

No, sorry, we did that in the other thread earlier. Wanting a united Ireland isn't the same as supporting terrorism.

Obviously the strategy is to find something that Corbyn did support, which people can be hoodwinked into thinking is somehow equivalent to supporting terrorism. The more people do that, the more obvious it is that they can't point to any actual expression of support by Corbyn for terrorism.

Are you seriously expecting people to find a direct quote of Corbyn saying "I support the IRA"?

Yes please.

christ.

Recidivist said:

This election is proving to be full of surprises. The Lib Dems are not getting the Brexit boost from remainers I thought they would. If anything they are going backwards - a direction whose possibilities I had imagined wrongly that they had already fully exploited.

Ishmael_Z said:

Tory attack video getting >1,000 views a minute. I think Jezza's goose is cooked.

https://order-order.com/2017/05/27/corbyn-ira-attack-ad-hits-1-million-views/

Chris said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Chris said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Chris said:

Scott_P said:

Chris said:

You see? You can't bring yourself to say he wanted more terrorist attacks! It's just too silly. :-)

That isn't the question.

Did he want the perpetrators of the attacks to win?

You can't honestly say no.

No, sorry, we did that in the other thread earlier. Wanting a united Ireland isn't the same as supporting terrorism.

Obviously the strategy is to find something that Corbyn did support, which people can be hoodwinked into thinking is somehow equivalent to supporting terrorism. The more people do that, the more obvious it is that they can't point to any actual expression of support by Corbyn for terrorism.

Are you seriously expecting people to find a direct quote of Corbyn saying "I support the IRA"?

Yes please.

Ah, so you are trolling. I thought so.

Thanks, Edmund!

Not at all. I just think if people are going to accuse Corbyn of supporting the IRA, they need to produce some clear evidence that he did.

It's telling that you find the suggestion so ridiculous.

IanB2 said:

Alanbrooke said:

logical_song said:

foxinsoxuk said:

peter_from_putney said:

SeanT said:

DecrepitJohnL said:

SeanT said:

K, here's an actual video of Corbyn saying the beheading of poor Alan Henning, by ISIS, was the result of OUR jingoism.

https://twitter.com/bernerlap/status/868752282871111680

Out of context much? The whole quotation seems more reasonable, even if you do not agree with it. Corbyn said in that clip: the price of war, the price of intervention, the price of jingoism is somebody else's son, and somebody else's daughter, being killed.

He's just despicable. Jingoism??? We intervened in Iraq and Libya for good reasons - to prevent genocides, topple horrible dictators, encourage democracy. Yes, it turned out those interventions went horribly wrong, were stupidly handled and badly misguided, but we expended much blood and treasure with good intent.

Other interventions, e.g. Kosovo, Sierra Leone, went much better and we saved many many lives.

We didn't go in to these places in a spirit of extreme nationalist swaggering - i.e. from "jingoism" - to prove how great and tough we are. It's a fucking ludicrous word to use; it's a poisonous lie.

And when we DON'T intervene - Syria - we still get blamed anyway. For not intervening.

Face it, Corbyn despises America, Britain, Israel and capitalism, probably in that order, and anyone that attacks America and Britain and Israel is good in his eyes, and he is more than happy to blame the deaths of innocent aid workers on us, using any rhetorical device possible, for that same reason.

He is a c*nt of the first water and anyone who votes for him - and Abbott and McDonnell, who are possibly worse - should be doing it with their eyes open. And they should accept the moral consequences.

But didn't you only very recently admit to having considered voting for him?

Are you suggesting that SeanT is inconsistent? an extraordinary accusation!

Pure fantasy.

sean is consistent in his inconsistency

Nevertheless he deserves a small piece of chicken whenever he posts anything that isn't another brainless rant against Muslims.

Alanbrooke said:

IanB2 said:

Alanbrooke said:

logical_song said:

foxinsoxuk said:

peter_from_putney said:

SeanT said:

DecrepitJohnL said:

SeanT said:

K, here's an actual video of Corbyn saying the beheading of poor Alan Henning, by ISIS, was the result of OUR jingoism.

https://twitter.com/bernerlap/status/868752282871111680

Out of context much? The whole quotation seems more reasonable, even if you do not agree with it. Corbyn said in that clip: the price of war, the price of intervention, the price of jingoism is somebody else's son, and somebody else's daughter, being killed.

He's just despicable. Jingoism??? We intervened in Iraq and Libya for good reasons - to prevent genocides, topple horrible dictators, encourage democracy. Yes, it turned out those interventions went horribly wrong, were stupidly handled and badly misguided, but we expended much blood and treasure with good intent.

Other interventions, e.g. Kosovo, Sierra Leone, went much better and we saved many many lives.

We didn't go in to these places in a spirit of extreme nationalist swaggering - i.e. from "jingoism" - to prove how great and tough we are. It's a fucking ludicrous word to use; it's a poisonous lie.

And when we DON'T intervene - Syria - we still get blamed anyway. For not intervening.

Face it, Corbyn despises America, Britain, Israel and capitalism, probably in that order, and anyone that attacks America and Britain and Israel is good in his eyes, and he is more than happy to blame the deaths of innocent aid workers on us, using any rhetorical device possible, for that same reason.

He is a c*nt of the first water and anyone who votes for him - and Abbott and McDonnell, who are possibly worse - should be doing it with their eyes open. And they should accept the moral consequences.

But didn't you only very recently admit to having considered voting for him?

Are you suggesting that SeanT is inconsistent? an extraordinary accusation!

Pure fantasy.

sean is consistent in his inconsistency

Nevertheless he deserves a small piece of chicken whenever he posts anything that isn't another brainless rant against Muslims.

Ah - diversity of view is bad then ?

malcolmg said:

My my look at this and surprise surprise it is not you know who:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAUdupZlzwo&feature=youtu.be

Ishmael_Z said:

surbiton said:

There seems to be a Trump like insistence amongst the Alt-Right in PB to deliberately ignore the fact that Corbyn DID vote in favour of the Good Friday Agreement.

So did everyone else. Why would he not? What does it prove?

kle4 said:

Ok, this has been bugging me - are Nemtynakht's posts showing up against a yellow background for everyone, or just me?

kle4 said:

SandyRentool said:

kle4 said:

Ishmael_Z said:

Tory attack video getting >1,000 views a minute. I think Jezza's goose is cooked.

https://order-order.com/2017/05/27/corbyn-ira-attack-ad-hits-1-million-views/

Well maybe, although why would you assume for sure that anyone who was considering voting for Corbynite Labour is among those watching it?

After watching the video then clearly I am totally misguided in voting for Hilary Benn.

Honestly, if anyone is swayed by that pastiche I'd like to sell them Tower Bridge.

I don't think anyone is ever swayed by a single thing (well, rarely, at any rate). It's more about cumulative impact, which is one reason I think such attacks are priced in already, although it at least has been watched more than most such things.

Casino_Royale said:

So, I just got back from a lovely 10-day holiday in northern Portugal.

Did I miss anything?

surbiton said:

Supporting the unity of Ireland is not endorsing violence.

Sean_F said:

kle4 said:

SandyRentool said:

kle4 said:

Ishmael_Z said:

Tory attack video getting >1,000 views a minute. I think Jezza's goose is cooked.

https://order-order.com/2017/05/27/corbyn-ira-attack-ad-hits-1-million-views/

Well maybe, although why would you assume for sure that anyone who was considering voting for Corbynite Labour is among those watching it?

After watching the video then clearly I am totally misguided in voting for Hilary Benn.

Honestly, if anyone is swayed by that pastiche I'd like to sell them Tower Bridge.

I don't think anyone is ever swayed by a single thing (well, rarely, at any rate). It's more about cumulative impact, which is one reason I think such attacks are priced in already, although it at least has been watched more than most such things.

It's more about ensuring that the 43-46% turn out for the Tories.

kle4 said:

Sean_F said:

Anecdote alert.

I've been canvassing for the past two days in Sundon Park, a split Labour/Lib. Dem ward. Corbyn is being raised unprompted on the doorsteps, and not in ways that are complimentary. There's a by-election for the council, and several people have emphasised that they'll vote Labour locally, but can't support them nationally.

It's what we've been hearing for weeks. Not reflected in any way by polling, which is an interesting occurrence.

Essexit said:

surbiton said:

Supporting the unity of Ireland is not endorsing violence.

Agreed. However, supporting the Republican movement that tried to bomb Britain into submission (Sinn Fein/IRA) rather than the one that tried to win the argument peacefully and democratically (SDLP) categorically is endorsing violence.

kle4 said:

Yorkcity said:

HYUFD said:

peter_from_putney said:

HYUFD - "My mother by contrast voted Tory last time and hated Clegg but thinks Corbyn is a genuine, nice man"

Shouldn't you remind your mum of the company he keeps?

I think she knows, hence she said 'but he does not live in the real world' though she sees him as naive rather than evil. I think a lot of mildly Tory women actually quite like Corbyn on a personal level, certainly more than Blair or Brown even though they still probably won't vote for him. May does much better with men than women hence my father's hostility to Corbyn is probably not unrepresentative

I think your mother is correct .My mother thinks the same .If I were the conservatives I would go on the naivety angle rather than the evil .As evil does not resonate

It's the struggle between choosing the 'useless' vs 'dangerous' attack lines. Now, the argument might be he is so useless he is dangerous, but that's harder to sell, and he does sound reasonable a lot of the time, so the 'evil' attacks are harder to make stick. Naivety seems an easier sell, without making people uncomfortable that the attack is going too far.

Yorkcity said:

kle4 said:

Yorkcity said:

HYUFD said:

peter_from_putney said:

HYUFD - "My mother by contrast voted Tory last time and hated Clegg but thinks Corbyn is a genuine, nice man"

Shouldn't you remind your mum of the company he keeps?

I think she knows, hence she said 'but he does not live in the real world' though she sees him as naive rather than evil. I think a lot of mildly Tory women actually quite like Corbyn on a personal level, certainly more than Blair or Brown even though they still probably won't vote for him. May does much better with men than women hence my father's hostility to Corbyn is probably not unrepresentative

I think your mother is correct .My mother thinks the same .If I were the conservatives I would go on the naivety angle rather than the evil .As evil does not resonate

It's the struggle between choosing the 'useless' vs 'dangerous' attack lines. Now, the argument might be he is so useless he is dangerous, but that's harder to sell, and he does sound reasonable a lot of the time, so the 'evil' attacks are harder to make stick. Naivety seems an easier sell, without making people uncomfortable that the attack is going too far.

Yes but mockery hurts look at May when she tells us she had not u turned and everyone present laughs as it is a straight line.Even Peston was mocking Fallon today over saying he a greed with Boris comments but did not when the same comment was uttered by Corbyn risible.

Casino_Royale said:

kle4 said:

Casino_Royale said:

So, I just got back from a lovely 10-day holiday in northern Portugal.

Did I miss anything?

A lot of bedwetting as Labour get within 5 points of the Tories (myself included in the wetting).

Ah. Well, that was bound to happen sooner or later. Elections campaigns are unpredictable.

But I can't deny having had several 'WTF?' moments as I caught up on the news today.

Sean_F said:

Anecdote alert.

I've been canvassing for the past two days in Sundon Park, a split Labour/Lib. Dem ward. Corbyn is being raised unprompted on the doorsteps, and not in ways that are complimentary. There's a by-election for the council, and several people have emphasised that they'll vote Labour locally, but can't support them nationally.

rottenborough said:

Casino_Royale said:

kle4 said:

Casino_Royale said:

So, I just got back from a lovely 10-day holiday in northern Portugal.

Did I miss anything?

A lot of bedwetting as Labour get within 5 points of the Tories (myself included in the wetting).

Ah. Well, that was bound to happen sooner or later. Elections campaigns are unpredictable.

But I can't deny having had several 'WTF?' moments as I caught up on the news today.

You may have also missed 'Mrs May, house snatcher'.

She is after Granny's house.

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

Anecdote alert.

I've been canvassing for the past two days in Sundon Park, a split Labour/Lib. Dem ward. Corbyn is being raised unprompted on the doorsteps, and not in ways that are complimentary. There's a by-election for the council, and several people have emphasised that they'll vote Labour locally, but can't support them nationally.

If that's true, then the Labour brand is just as strong as it's ever been and Theresa May has merely united the Right, rather than chiselling lumps off Labour for good, and Labour's present predicament is largely down to their leader alone.

rottenborough said:

Casino_Royale said:

kle4 said:

Casino_Royale said:

So, I just got back from a lovely 10-day holiday in northern Portugal.

Did I miss anything?

A lot of bedwetting as Labour get within 5 points of the Tories (myself included in the wetting).

Ah. Well, that was bound to happen sooner or later. Elections campaigns are unpredictable.

But I can't deny having had several 'WTF?' moments as I caught up on the news today.

You may have also missed 'Mrs May, house snatcher'.

She is after Granny's house.

Yorkcity said:

kle4 said:

Yorkcity said:

HYUFD said:

peter_from_putney said:

HYUFD - "My mother by contrast voted Tory last time and hated Clegg but thinks Corbyn is a genuine, nice man"

Shouldn't you remind your mum of the company he keeps?

I think she knows, hence she said 'but he does not live in the real world' though she sees him as naive rather than evil. I think a lot of mildly Tory women actually quite like Corbyn on a personal level, certainly more than Blair or Brown even though they still probably won't vote for him. May does much better with men than women hence my father's hostility to Corbyn is probably not unrepresentative

I think your mother is correct .My mother thinks the same .If I were the conservatives I would go on the naivety angle rather than the evil .As evil does not resonate

It's the struggle between choosing the 'useless' vs 'dangerous' attack lines. Now, the argument might be he is so useless he is dangerous, but that's harder to sell, and he does sound reasonable a lot of the time, so the 'evil' attacks are harder to make stick. Naivety seems an easier sell, without making people uncomfortable that the attack is going too far.

Yes but mockery hurts look at May when she tells us she had not u turned and everyone present laughs as it is a straight line.Even Peston was mocking Fallon today over saying he a greed with Boris comments but did not when the same comment was uttered by Corbyn risible.

RobD said:

rottenborough said:

Casino_Royale said:

kle4 said:

Casino_Royale said:

So, I just got back from a lovely 10-day holiday in northern Portugal.

Did I miss anything?

A lot of bedwetting as Labour get within 5 points of the Tories (myself included in the wetting).

Ah. Well, that was bound to happen sooner or later. Elections campaigns are unpredictable.

But I can't deny having had several 'WTF?' moments as I caught up on the news today.

You may have also missed 'Mrs May, house snatcher'.

She is after Granny's house.

Shouldn't that be after the kid's inheritance?

ThreeQuidder said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

kle4 said:

SandyRentool said:

kle4 said:

Ishmael_Z said:

Tory attack video getting >1,000 views a minute. I think Jezza's goose is cooked.

https://order-order.com/2017/05/27/corbyn-ira-attack-ad-hits-1-million-views/

Well maybe, although why would you assume for sure that anyone who was considering voting for Corbynite Labour is among those watching it?

After watching the video then clearly I am totally misguided in voting for Hilary Benn.

Honestly, if anyone is swayed by that pastiche I'd like to sell them Tower Bridge.

I don't think anyone is ever swayed by a single thing (well, rarely, at any rate). It's more about cumulative impact, which is one reason I think such attacks are priced in already, although it at least has been watched more than most such things.

It's more about ensuring that the 43-46% turn out for the Tories.

I'm only half-joking, but one wonders whether Theresa May might have done much better to just promise the voters nothing more than blood, tears, toil and sweat.

She could have had a bigger majority with that, but no actual mandate to do anything in particular.

Alanbrooke said:

malcolmg said:

logical_song said:

How much did outsourcing save/cost British Airway?
The GMB union has suggested the BA computer systems failure was "another example of the shortcomings of BA IT systems since they made a number of staff redundant, and outsourced their work to India in 2016."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40075721

Cheapskates , penny pinching to try and increase profits and influence their massive bonuses. Will be a real ding dong as they try to pin the tail on the donkey who gets the blame.

Roll on Eckageddon

pay up

TheScreamingEagles said:

Casino_Royale said:

So, I just got back from a lovely 10-day holiday in northern Portugal.

Did I miss anything?

SeanT regretting sending in his postal vote for the Tories and wishing he had voted for Corbyn's Labour instead.

surbiton said:

kle4 said:

Casino_Royale said:

Sean_F said:

Anecdote alert.

I've been canvassing for the past two days in Sundon Park, a split Labour/Lib. Dem ward. Corbyn is being raised unprompted on the doorsteps, and not in ways that are complimentary. There's a by-election for the council, and several people have emphasised that they'll vote Labour locally, but can't support them nationally.

If that's true, then the Labour brand is just as strong as it's ever been and Theresa May has merely united the Right, rather than chiselling lumps off Labour for good, and Labour's present predicament is largely down to their leader alone.

Given the Labour rise, that does seem plausible. The Tories had dreams of conquering in places they have rarely or never competed in before, but that may be more difficult than thought as the brand of Labour is it turns out too strong. Though I do think Corbyn has turned out less of a turnoff than people think, even as there are too many anecdotal examples to suggest he doesn't turn off anyone.

It appears that the doorstep anecdotes have become fewer and fewer !!