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First!0
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Leader net well/badly ratings among VI (2013 vs Nov 2 2012)
Cameron: +84 (+15)
Miliband: +44 (-1)
Progress, huh?0 -
Good afternoon, everyone.
Might watch the highlights before writing the post-race piece.
FPT: Mr. G, thanks, I'm glad you enjoyed it. What did you make of the Goat?0 -
Yes indeed - hard for Dave's to increase any more among the diehards. Which highlights why +44 is still poor!
Maybe it's related to the guff-like announcements such as today's on the living wage we get so often from all politicians (not just Miliband). It's an odd one. If the living wage is such a good thing why not just increase the minimum wage to the right level?
Instead we get this one-year-only post-election bribe - after which benefits will catch up with incomes and the worker will be only marginally better off (if at all), and the employer will be saddled with the full cost of the increased salary and tax/NI.
It just seems like another compromised muddle. Contrast with the energy price freeze, which is no nonsense and had the desired effect on party supporters!0 -
He led last year too - and his lead has narrowed by 8 points....tim said:More importantly Ed now has a lead among 2010 Lib Dems on this YouGov question
Among Lib Dem 2010 Net well (vs 2012)
Cameron: -31 (+2)
Miliband: -22 (-6)
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All within MOE of the current poll.tim said:
The Tories were on 35% in that pollCarlottaVance said:Leader net well/badly ratings among VI (2013 vs Nov 2 2012)
Cameron: +84 (+15)
Miliband: +44 (-1)
Progress, huh?
The facts are Cameron has progressed among his supporters, Miliband is nearly back to where he was - and he's gone backwards among 2010 Lib Dems....
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0
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F1: Williams may ask Brawn to join them:
http://www1.skysports.com/f1/news/12472/9006876/sir-frank-williams-will-approach-ross-brawn-about-joining-the-team-if-he-is-available0 -
He was a real bad one , surprised he lastedMorris_Dancer said:Good afternoon, everyone.
Might watch the highlights before writing the post-race piece.
FPT: Mr. G, thanks, I'm glad you enjoyed it. What did you make of the Goat?0 -
Ot and sorry if it's been posted already but i just saw David Milliband on News 24. tell Marr about his reaction to the Mail's attack on his father. In a way it showed what Labour missed out on. It was sincere without being sentimental or mawkish yet it was surprisingly moving. Without being cynical my friend Bruno would have given it an 80
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Did anyone watch Marr interviewing Maria Miller this morning?
I do get the feeling with Marr that he doesn't understand pretty basic stuff. Surely the point is that Ipso could request recognition from the Recognition body under the Royal Charter if it wanted to.
Marr didn't seem to get that. He didn't understand that even under the Royal Charter that it is for the press to set up their OWN body that then applies for recognition. So Ipso can be the press body just as equally as any other body.
All that isn't happening is that Ipso isn't applying for recognition (yet).0 -
I wonder who he could have meant:Plato said:This is brilliant Self v Littlejohn
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1390395.stm
".....the man who called Two Jags, that's a name you coined: "He's a chimp, a pustulating boil of resentment and class hatred, a chippy, thin-skinned puffed up laughing stock, an ocean-going tub of lard, groaning with arrogance, ego, hypocrisy, and inferiority, he's an inadequate, inarticulate embarrassment, a disgrace to Britain at home and abroad."
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Andrea should look away:
"International Development Minister Alan Duncan claimed £2,750 for electricity bills and £1,250 in heating oil for his home in Rutland, Leicestershire..."
http://www.channel4.com/news/mps-expenses-energy-bills-home-heating-nadhim-zahawi0 -
Combined Con/Lab/LD target list for the next election:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0At91c3wX1Wu5dHNjRUpXY2ZYamVrVlJPbmRNdzNTd0E#gid=00 -
One of the few things that get cross party support , supping at the trough. These clowns should be tarred and feathered and run out of townCarlottaVance said:Andrea should look away:
"International Development Minister Alan Duncan claimed £2,750 for electricity bills and £1,250 in heating oil for his home in Rutland, Leicestershire..."
http://www.channel4.com/news/mps-expenses-energy-bills-home-heating-nadhim-zahawi0 -
Plato
"This is brilliant Self v Littlejohn"
It's 12 years old.0 -
CarlottaVance said:
Andrea should look away:
"International Development Minister Alan Duncan claimed £2,750 for electricity bills and £1,250 in heating oil for his home in Rutland, Leicestershire..."
http://www.channel4.com/news/mps-expenses-energy-bills-home-heating-nadhim-zahawi
Conservative MP Nadhim Zahawi, founder of market research firm YouGov, claimed the most with a bill of £5,822.27 covering electricity and heating oil for his Warwickshire estate.
That's just plain nuts. Why the feck do we have to pay for him to live on an estate anyway? That's his choice, he should pay for his own energy use, over and above the national average.0 -
I loved the last couple of paras - I was LOL throughout.CarlottaVance said:
I wonder who he could have meant:Plato said:This is brilliant Self v Littlejohn
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1390395.stm
".....the man who called Two Jags, that's a name you coined: "He's a chimp, a pustulating boil of resentment and class hatred, a chippy, thin-skinned puffed up laughing stock, an ocean-going tub of lard, groaning with arrogance, ego, hypocrisy, and inferiority, he's an inadequate, inarticulate embarrassment, a disgrace to Britain at home and abroad."
" SELF: Well he doesn't say he's a human being, does he? He uses the classic form of demonisation which is to say he's a chimp, in other words he's bestial. So he's actually dehumanised the subject of his abuse before he even moves on to piling on the pejoratives, and I think that's very psychologically interesting, of course we're all familiar with the kind of people who demonise other human beings by turning them into bestiary...we all know who does that.
[long pause]
LITTLEJOHN: In the Psychiatrist's Chair with Nicky Campbell
CAMPBELL: Caroline Feraday has the travel.0 -
Mr. G, and great fun to write, he was.
Incidentally, I've just got a new one out, a shorti(ish) comedy called Sir Edric's Temple. It's up on Amazon, or you can get it for 2/3 off with code KF49K here: https://www.smashwords.com/books/view/3730770 -
I'll put up the post-race piece shortly after the highlights. Another race where the sharp end was relatively dull, but there was quite a bit of entertainment in the midfield.0
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This came up annoyingly on the doorstep today:TwistedFireStopper said:CarlottaVance said:Andrea should look away:
"International Development Minister Alan Duncan claimed £2,750 for electricity bills and £1,250 in heating oil for his home in Rutland, Leicestershire..."
http://www.channel4.com/news/mps-expenses-energy-bills-home-heating-nadhim-zahawi
Conservative MP Nadhim Zahawi, founder of market research firm YouGov, claimed the most with a bill of £5,822.27 covering electricity and heating oil for his Warwickshire estate.
That's just plain nuts. Why the feck do we have to pay for him to live on an estate anyway? That's his choice, he should pay for his own energy use, over and above the national average.
"I'm not voting for any of you! The Mail says you're all living on estates and claiming thousands in fuel bills?"
"I'm not an MP. When I was my fuel bill wasn't anything like that."
"Huh! I'm not voting for any of you!"
"But..."
(door slams)
(sigh)
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There is a case that could be made for paying energy cost for required second homes despite their (by most people's standards) very generous salaries.TwistedFireStopper said:CarlottaVance said:Andrea should look away:
"International Development Minister Alan Duncan claimed £2,750 for electricity bills and £1,250 in heating oil for his home in Rutland, Leicestershire..."
http://www.channel4.com/news/mps-expenses-energy-bills-home-heating-nadhim-zahawi
Conservative MP Nadhim Zahawi, founder of market research firm YouGov, claimed the most with a bill of £5,822.27 covering electricity and heating oil for his Warwickshire estate.
That's just plain nuts. Why the feck do we have to pay for him to live on an estate anyway? That's his choice, he should pay for his own energy use, over and above the national average.
But claiming three or four times what the average household uses seems excessive - and, with a bit of luck - politically damaging....0 -
On topic, I think that Labour supporters overwhelmingly mean by "doing well" "beating the Tories by a large margin". It's a trailing indicator of Labour success rather than a leading one.0
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He does have a point though - did you not claim £1 million in expenses during your 8 years as an MP?NickPalmer said:
This came up annoyingly on the doorstep today:TwistedFireStopper said:CarlottaVance said:Andrea should look away:
"International Development Minister Alan Duncan claimed £2,750 for electricity bills and £1,250 in heating oil for his home in Rutland, Leicestershire..."
http://www.channel4.com/news/mps-expenses-energy-bills-home-heating-nadhim-zahawi
Conservative MP Nadhim Zahawi, founder of market research firm YouGov, claimed the most with a bill of £5,822.27 covering electricity and heating oil for his Warwickshire estate.
That's just plain nuts. Why the feck do we have to pay for him to live on an estate anyway? That's his choice, he should pay for his own energy use, over and above the national average.
"I'm not voting for any of you! The Mail says you're all living on estates and claiming thousands in fuel bills?"
"I'm not an MP. When I was my fuel bill wasn't anything like that."
"Huh! I'm not voting for any of you!"
"But..."
(door slams)
(sigh)
What exactly did you ever pay for out of your own pocket?0 -
F1: the Lotus/Quantum deal is finally done:
http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2013/11/03/quantum-deal-is-completed/
This may mean that Hulkenberg will go there after all. Let's hope so.
I'll get cracking with the post-race piece and get it up shortly.0 -
Has that bloke got a heated moat?0
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F1: post-race analysis is up here:
http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.co.uk/2013/11/abu-dhabi-post-race-analysis.html
Weird fact: this is the first race this season where my profit has been between £1 and £40.0 -
Miss Carola, of course. You don't want the salmon to get chilly, do you?0
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The renewed expenses scandal shows again why we need OFPOL. We need regulatory oversight of politicians' honesty and competence, with sweeping powers to intervene.0
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I've read Guido piece in today's Sun.
Might be worth putting some money on Ed Davey as next out of the cabinet at 33/1 with Ladbrokes.
I get the feeling that's one that's going to get very very messy.
It is expenses and he's renting from the local Lib Dem party (and his wife is a director of the company that owns the property) at what appears to be twice the local going rate.
This one of those where the perceptions matter more than the facts.0 -
LOL
RT @Millie_77: Tory MP Nadhim Zahawi claimed nearly £6k on expenses for his energy bill. £6K!! Is he running a cannabis farm?0 -
That's ten grand each and every month, pray do tell us what you spent it onSimonStClare said:
He does have a point though - did you not claim £1 million in expenses during your 8 years as an MP?NickPalmer said:
This came up annoyingly on the doorstep today:TwistedFireStopper said:CarlottaVance said:Andrea should look away:
"International Development Minister Alan Duncan claimed £2,750 for electricity bills and £1,250 in heating oil for his home in Rutland, Leicestershire..."
http://www.channel4.com/news/mps-expenses-energy-bills-home-heating-nadhim-zahawi
Conservative MP Nadhim Zahawi, founder of market research firm YouGov, claimed the most with a bill of £5,822.27 covering electricity and heating oil for his Warwickshire estate.
That's just plain nuts. Why the feck do we have to pay for him to live on an estate anyway? That's his choice, he should pay for his own energy use, over and above the national average.
"I'm not voting for any of you! The Mail says you're all living on estates and claiming thousands in fuel bills?"
"I'm not an MP. When I was my fuel bill wasn't anything like that."
"Huh! I'm not voting for any of you!"
"But..."
(door slams)
(sigh)
What exactly did you ever pay for out of your own pocket?0 -
Move along, nothing to see, nothing for you here.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24794093
Odd non story in Falkirk for SLab. Deans steps down as chairman.0 -
Thanks. I've put him in a double with Defy Logic for the Arkle.TheScreamingEagles said:I've read Guido piece in today's Sun.
Might be worth putting some money on Ed Davey as next out of the cabinet at 33/1 with Ladbrokes.
I get the feeling that's one that's going to get very very messy.
It is expenses and he's renting from the local Lib Dem party (and his wife is a director of the company that owns the property) at what appears to be twice the local going rate.
This one of those where the perceptions matter more than the facts.0 -
Judging by here most of it staffing costs and office rent, which appears to be the normnigel4england said:
That's ten grand each and every month, pray do tell us what you spent it onSimonStClare said:
He does have a point though - did you not claim £1 million in expenses during your 8 years as an MP?NickPalmer said:
This came up annoyingly on the doorstep today:TwistedFireStopper said:CarlottaVance said:Andrea should look away:
"International Development Minister Alan Duncan claimed £2,750 for electricity bills and £1,250 in heating oil for his home in Rutland, Leicestershire..."
http://www.channel4.com/news/mps-expenses-energy-bills-home-heating-nadhim-zahawi
Conservative MP Nadhim Zahawi, founder of market research firm YouGov, claimed the most with a bill of £5,822.27 covering electricity and heating oil for his Warwickshire estate.
That's just plain nuts. Why the feck do we have to pay for him to live on an estate anyway? That's his choice, he should pay for his own energy use, over and above the national average.
"I'm not voting for any of you! The Mail says you're all living on estates and claiming thousands in fuel bills?"
"I'm not an MP. When I was my fuel bill wasn't anything like that."
"Huh! I'm not voting for any of you!"
"But..."
(door slams)
(sigh)
What exactly did you ever pay for out of your own pocket?
http://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/10472/nick_palmer/broxtowe#expenses
IIRC Nick Palmer wasn't asked to repay anything back/had no issues when Sir Thomas Legg investigated his expenses in 2009.
Edit: Just wanted to clarify, Sir Thomas Legg didn't solely investigate Nick Palmer, he investigated every MPs expenses when the expenses scandal broke.
Which puts him in a good light when it comes to expenses0 -
No, it puts him in a very bad light, along with many others, for taking the piss out of the system.TheScreamingEagles said:
Which puts him in a good light when it comes to expenses
Legg merely found no reason to add Palmer and others to the list of Labour MPs who ended up in court.
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Errr, lots of MPs were forced to repay money backGeoffM said:
No, it puts him in a very bad light, along with many others, for taking the piss out of the system.TheScreamingEagles said:
Which puts him in a good light when it comes to expenses
Legg merely found no reason to add Palmer and others to the list of Labour MPs who ended up in court.
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200910/cmselect/cmmemest/348/348.pdf0 -
Did you buy drinks for both of them?SeanT said:I can see a zebra next to the fat American tourist, both apparently drunk.
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I don't see why MP's should claim for any of their staff. As they can only claim for employees doing constituency business i.e. non party work, then staff could be provided by the civil service and paid centrally. This would also stop the dubious practice of employing family members!0
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Yes, indeed. Some were told to paid back money, some were not, some (not enough) went to jail. Many of those who paid back no money were still taking the piss.TheScreamingEagles said:
Errr, lots of MPs were forced to repay money backGeoffM said:
No, it puts him in a very bad light, along with many others, for taking the piss out of the system.TheScreamingEagles said:
Which puts him in a good light when it comes to expenses
Legg merely found no reason to add Palmer and others to the list of Labour MPs who ended up in court.
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200910/cmselect/cmmemest/348/348.pdf
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A friend of mine was due to go there for Xmas with his family, but BA have just shut the route down and have cancelled his flights. Apoplectic is the word, I think.SeanT said:Bwanji.
I am writing this from the Royal Livingstone Hotel, on the very riverbanks of the Zambesi. With a massive gin and tonic to hand.
Zambia!!
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1983 Nato war games almost brought the world to a nuclear war http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/articles/519129/20131103/nuclear-war-archer-secret-documents-ussr-usa.htm0
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Good to see OGH picked up on D'Ancona's article on Umunna and Hunt, as shown above Miliband's ratings still lag Cameron's despite improvement and both these two figures, particularly Umunna, are potential successors0
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I was just thinking exactly the same thing. This should be tied with set expenses for travel and a government provided flat in London in which they can live when on Parliamentary business, with all bills paid for centrally. A set per diem for sustenance and that is about it.Blue_rog said:I don't see why MP's should claim for any of their staff. As they can only claim for employees doing constituency business i.e. non party work, then staff could be provided by the civil service and paid centrally. This would also stop the dubious practice of employing family members!
With very few exceptions (and there were some honourable exceptions who were claiming almost nothing) even those MPs who were claiming what they were legally entitled to were helping to propagate a dishonest system.0 -
That's a bit OTT even for you Sean. I don't think ethnicity has any bearing on the propensity for an MP to 'fiddle' the system.SeanT said:
I'd be interested to know the proportion of Asian MPs/Peers who have been caught fiddling, in relation to the total number of Asian MPs/Peers.Plato said:LOL
RT @Millie_77: Tory MP Nadhim Zahawi claimed nearly £6k on expenses for his energy bill. £6K!! Is he running a cannabis farm?
I suspect it is higher than for whites. However this might reflect the fact that it is harder for Asians to reach the Lords and Commons, in a largely white country, so only the very ambitious, egotistic and amorally self-serving Asians are likely to progress to the stage where they CAN rip us off.
Such are the glories of democracy.0 -
Sounds like a very big G&T.SeanT said:
I'd be interested to know the proportion of Asian MPs/Peers who have been caught fiddling, in relation to the total number of Asian MPs/Peers.Plato said:LOL
RT @Millie_77: Tory MP Nadhim Zahawi claimed nearly £6k on expenses for his energy bill. £6K!! Is he running a cannabis farm?
I suspect it is higher than for whites. However this might reflect the fact that it is harder for Asians to reach the Lords and Commons, in a largely white country, so only the very ambitious, egotistic and amorally self-serving Asians are likely to progress to the stage where they CAN rip us off.
Such are the glories of democracy.
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A slur of which the Met would be proud, and no one else should be.GeoffM said:TheScreamingEagles said:
Which puts him in a good light when it comes to expenses
Legg merely found no reason to add Palmer and others to the list of Labour MPs who ended up in court.
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IIRC no Asian MP or peer has been imprisoned for dodgy expenses.SeanT said:
I'd be interested to know the proportion of Asian MPs/Peers who have been caught fiddling, in relation to the total number of Asian MPs/Peers.Plato said:LOL
RT @Millie_77: Tory MP Nadhim Zahawi claimed nearly £6k on expenses for his energy bill. £6K!! Is he running a cannabis farm?
I suspect it is higher than for whites. However this might reflect the fact that it is harder for Asians to reach the Lords and Commons, in a largely white country, so only the very ambitious, egotistic and amorally self-serving Asians are likely to progress to the stage where they CAN rip us off.
Such are the glories of democracy.0 -
Tim 'Dave Appeals to the core' That is precisely the point, Dave does not appeal to the core, right-wing Tories hate him as much as leftwingers do, which is why UKIP are rising so high in the polls and why he has had to bring Crosby back to shore up his base (many Tories who voted for Hague and IDS are now voting UKIP). Cameron appeals to centre-right liberals and the upper middle class privately educated posh, he does not appeal to anyone else, certainly not skilled blue collar workers and the lower middle class, whereas Boris does appeal to that group. The average Briton may think he looks more like a PM than Ed Miliband but that does not mean he appeals to them!0
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Seems like my post was deleted, I'm quite happy to be sued if the post is considered libellousSeanT said:Mark Senior, -
Surely calling a Lib Dem MP "dishonest" is not libellous - it is tautologous.
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Extremely funny. My daughter introduced me to this tonight. http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/science_of_longevity/2013/09/tim_minchin_s_storm_critique_of_alternative_medicine_and_defense_of_reason.htmlPlato said:
I loved the last couple of paras - I was LOL throughout.CarlottaVance said:
I wonder who he could have meant:Plato said:This is brilliant Self v Littlejohn
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1390395.stm
".....the man who called Two Jags, that's a name you coined: "He's a chimp, a pustulating boil of resentment and class hatred, a chippy, thin-skinned puffed up laughing stock, an ocean-going tub of lard, groaning with arrogance, ego, hypocrisy, and inferiority, he's an inadequate, inarticulate embarrassment, a disgrace to Britain at home and abroad."
" SELF: Well he doesn't say he's a human being, does he? He uses the classic form of demonisation which is to say he's a chimp, in other words he's bestial. So he's actually dehumanised the subject of his abuse before he even moves on to piling on the pejoratives, and I think that's very psychologically interesting, of course we're all familiar with the kind of people who demonise other human beings by turning them into bestiary...we all know who does that.
[long pause]
LITTLEJOHN: In the Psychiatrist's Chair with Nicky Campbell
CAMPBELL: Caroline Feraday has the travel.
Definitely one for Tim to enjoy re alternative medicine.
"Do you know what you call alternative medicine that works? it's called medicine."
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More likely they're flying via Dubai. I work in Africa, and do that. Don't go via London unless someone else is paying for it, and insisting I go that way.SeanT said:
Yup. You now have to go via Nairobi, Schiphol, Joburg, etc - with KLM, Air France, SAA &c - and I can't help thinking this is perhaps a sign of our Total F*ck Up in regard to London airports. Is it really not profitable for BA to fly to Lusaka direct 3 times a week (Lusaka being the capital of an ex British colony) but it IS profitable for KLM?
Or is this just because there are so few free slots at Heathrow BA will sacrifice feebler African links in favour of Chinese links, thus detaching London from important parts of the world economy?
BUILD THE THIRD RUNWAY, OR BUILD BORIS AIRPORT. Just Get On With It.0 -
Has he switched suppliers?
Name: Doncaster North MP: Ed Miliband Party: Labour Claim (£): 403.59 Fuel type: Electricity.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/your-mp-claim-energy-bills-26716850 -
Did he get any free coal?dr_spyn said:Has he switched suppliers?
Name: Doncaster North MP: Ed Miliband Party: Labour Claim (£): 403.59 Fuel type: Electricity.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/your-mp-claim-energy-bills-26716850 -
It seems to me that three things need to happen for the Tories to have a realistic chance of winning the next General Election:
Firstly and probably most importantly the LibDems need to increase their share of the vote from approx 10% currently to at least 16%, with two thirds of this increased share coming from Labour.
Secondly UKIP's share of the vote needs to fall from approx 12% currently to 6% with at least two thirds of those switching opting for the Tories.
Thirdly there has to be a straight switch of at least 3% from Labour to the Tories.
Assuming Labour currently has a 5% lead over the Tories, with these parties holding 38% and 33% of the vote respectively, the above movements I have suggested would result in each of their shares becoming:
Labour 38% - 4% +2% - 3% = 33%
Tories 33% - 2% +4% +3% =38%
LibDems 10% + 6% = 16%
UKIP 12% - 6% = 6%
Others 7%
Probably sufficient to result in the Tories winning the most seats without necessarily winning an overall majority. This looks like a very big ask to me on all three counts.0 -
Whilst your offer is generous, the site doesn't allow defamatory comments, it will be the site owner who will be sued, and I suspect, when that moment comes, you will be nowhere to be seen.nigel4england said:
Seems like my post was deleted, I'm quite happy to be sued if the post is considered libellousSeanT said:Mark Senior, -
Surely calling a Lib Dem MP "dishonest" is not libellous - it is tautologous.
So if you wish to continue posting on here, you will desist with your approach0 -
@Squareroot Both Balls and Osborne haven't made claims if the Mirror's list is correct.0
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I agree they need to do three things:peter_from_putney said:It seems to me that three things need to happen for the Tories to have a realistic chance of winning the next General Election:
Firstly and probably most importantly the LibDems need to increase their share of the vote from approx 10% currently to at least 16%, with two thirds of this increased share coming from Labour.
Secondly UKIP's share of the vote needs to fall from approx 12% currently to 6% with at least two thirds of those switching opting for the Tories.
Thirdly there has to be a straight switch of at least 3% from Labour to the Tories.
Assuming Labour currently has a 5% lead over the Tories, with these parties holding 38% and 33% of the vote respectively, the above movements I have suggested would result in each of their shares becoming:
Labour 38% - 4% +2% - 3% = 33%
Tories 33% - 2% +4% +3% =38%
LibDems 10% + 6% = 16%
UKIP 12% - 6% = 6%
Others 7%
Probably sufficient to result in the Tories winning the most seats without necessarily winning an overall majority. This looks like a very big ask to me on all three counts.
1. Enshrine in law an EU referendum will take place in 2015 regardless of who is in power.
2. Repeal the climate change act
3. Start fracking now.0 -
There should certainly be a change to the rule that says you choose which home to claim expenses for, you should be able to claim no more than the cost of a one bed pied a terre either in London or in your constituency. MPs living close enough to London to commute should be paid the cost of a second class season ticket and if they choose to maintain a second home, it's at their own expense.CarlottaVance said:
There is a case that could be made for paying energy cost for required second homes despite their (by most people's standards) very generous salaries.TwistedFireStopper said:CarlottaVance said:Andrea should look away:
"International Development Minister Alan Duncan claimed £2,750 for electricity bills and £1,250 in heating oil for his home in Rutland, Leicestershire..."
http://www.channel4.com/news/mps-expenses-energy-bills-home-heating-nadhim-zahawi
Conservative MP Nadhim Zahawi, founder of market research firm YouGov, claimed the most with a bill of £5,822.27 covering electricity and heating oil for his Warwickshire estate.
That's just plain nuts. Why the feck do we have to pay for him to live on an estate anyway? That's his choice, he should pay for his own energy use, over and above the national average.
But claiming three or four times what the average household uses seems excessive - and, with a bit of luck - politically damaging....
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I would take responsibility and would not expect anyone to take blame on my behalf, nevertheless I will agree to your requestPBModerator said:
Whilst your offer is generous, the site doesn't allow defamatory comments, it will be the site owner who will be sued, and I suspect, when that moment comes, you will be nowhere to be seen.nigel4england said:
Seems like my post was deleted, I'm quite happy to be sued if the post is considered libellousSeanT said:Mark Senior, -
Surely calling a Lib Dem MP "dishonest" is not libellous - it is tautologous.
So if you wish to continue posting on here, you will desist with your approach0 -
Two LD selections from September which I think were missed at the time:
Hugo Miéville, North Dorset:
http://www.blackmorevale.co.uk/Liberal-Democrats-select-North-Dorset-candidate/story-19806154-detail/story.html
Sam Phripp, North East Somerset:
http://theweekin.co.uk/uncategorized/lib-dems-elect-their-candidate-to-fight-2015-general-election-in-north-east-somerset/0 -
Which Tory do you think would would do best for the party at the next election as leader?tim said:@Peter
At some point the Tories are going to have to confront the issue of Cameron and Osborne being unable to attract the voters they need.
Cameron is likely to put Osborne before winning elections as he did last time, and I'm pleased about that, but the obvious move this time is to replace Osborne with Theresa May, as he should have replaced him with Phil Hammond last time.
It would be quite an achievement for Cameron to fail to get a majority against Brown, lose the boundary changes, split the right and oppose AV then fail to gain from an economic recovery because he and Osborne are seen as being too out of touch,but he could feasibly achieve it.0 -
PeterthePunter The Tories could still win a majority with the LDs on 10% as they would win a large number of LD seats on such a low LD total. They do need to win back large numbers of voters lost to UKIP though as you correctly point out so their vote holds up in Tory v Labour marginals. The Labour vote is likely to be about 35/36% whatever happens so a 3% gain from a Labour total of about 38/39% at present is about the best the Tories can hope for0
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For me it would be David Davies but I doubt many would agree with meAndyJS said:
Which Tory do you think would would do best for the party at the next election as leader?tim said:@Peter
At some point the Tories are going to have to confront the issue of Cameron and Osborne being unable to attract the voters they need.
Cameron is likely to put Osborne before winning elections as he did last time, and I'm pleased about that, but the obvious move this time is to replace Osborne with Theresa May, as he should have replaced him with Phil Hammond last time.
It would be quite an achievement for Cameron to fail to get a majority against Brown, lose the boundary changes, split the right and oppose AV then fail to gain from an economic recovery because he and Osborne are seen as being too out of touch,but he could feasibly achieve it.0 -
David Davies is past it unfortunately.He would have done OK in 2010,probably got the same number of votes as Cameron.nigel4england said:
For me it would be David Davies but I doubt many would agree with meAndyJS said:
Which Tory do you think would would do best for the party at the next election as leader?tim said:@Peter
At some point the Tories are going to have to confront the issue of Cameron and Osborne being unable to attract the voters they need.
Cameron is likely to put Osborne before winning elections as he did last time, and I'm pleased about that, but the obvious move this time is to replace Osborne with Theresa May, as he should have replaced him with Phil Hammond last time.
It would be quite an achievement for Cameron to fail to get a majority against Brown, lose the boundary changes, split the right and oppose AV then fail to gain from an economic recovery because he and Osborne are seen as being too out of touch,but he could feasibly achieve it.0 -
Like ButtonRoger said:@Ishmael
"A slur of which the Met would be proud, and no one else should be."
Well said. There are some really nasty pieces of work posting here. GeoffM just being one of several these days.
Being disliked by the hilarious self-parody Roger is as much a badge of distinction as getting a "Troll" on here from Hortence Wittering. I'd be concerned it it were any other way.
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Did you mean David Davis?SMukesh said:
David Davies is past it unfortunately.He would have done OK in 2010,probably got the same number of votes as Cameron.nigel4england said:
For me it would be David Davies but I doubt many would agree with meAndyJS said:
Which Tory do you think would would do best for the party at the next election as leader?tim said:@Peter
At some point the Tories are going to have to confront the issue of Cameron and Osborne being unable to attract the voters they need.
Cameron is likely to put Osborne before winning elections as he did last time, and I'm pleased about that, but the obvious move this time is to replace Osborne with Theresa May, as he should have replaced him with Phil Hammond last time.
It would be quite an achievement for Cameron to fail to get a majority against Brown, lose the boundary changes, split the right and oppose AV then fail to gain from an economic recovery because he and Osborne are seen as being too out of touch,but he could feasibly achieve it.
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HYUFD - I'm sorry to inform you that you owe the PB.com Social Fund the princely sum of £1.0
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He's 64 and seems younger, hardly past it. St Vince still has ambitions and he's 70 (ish)SMukesh said:
David Davies is past it unfortunately.He would have done OK in 2010,probably got the same number of votes as Cameron without getting into the pickle that Cameron has got into with Coulson.nigel4england said:
For me it would be David Davies but I doubt many would agree with meAndyJS said:
Which Tory do you think would would do best for the party at the next election as leader?tim said:@Peter
At some point the Tories are going to have to confront the issue of Cameron and Osborne being unable to attract the voters they need.
Cameron is likely to put Osborne before winning elections as he did last time, and I'm pleased about that, but the obvious move this time is to replace Osborne with Theresa May, as he should have replaced him with Phil Hammond last time.
It would be quite an achievement for Cameron to fail to get a majority against Brown, lose the boundary changes, split the right and oppose AV then fail to gain from an economic recovery because he and Osborne are seen as being too out of touch,but he could feasibly achieve it.0 -
Legg was looking at who had made unwarranted claims. He found that I hadn't made any. I don't think you can reasonably describe that as putting me "in a very bad light" or "taking the piss".GeoffM said:
No, it puts him in a very bad light, along with many others, for taking the piss out of the system.TheScreamingEagles said:
Which puts him in a good light when it comes to expenses
Legg merely found no reason to add Palmer and others to the list of Labour MPs who ended up in court.
You're of course entitled to a view on what MPs should be allowed to claim for (in my case 3 FTE staff and a one-bedroom flat rented near Parliament - fuel costs were pretty small), but I don't think most people would think it odd to use the staff allowance for staff and the rental allowance for rent. If an allowance is too generous, cut it, but don't take a sinister view when people use an allowance in accordance with both the letter and the spirit of its purpose. Isn't that what you do in your job?
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That sort of age seems to be a negative factor these days.Vince is not trying to be PM of this country.nigel4england said:
He's 64 and seems younger, hardly past it. St Vince still has ambitions and he's 70 (ish)SMukesh said:
David Davies is past it unfortunately.He would have done OK in 2010,probably got the same number of votes as Cameron without getting into the pickle that Cameron has got into with Coulson.nigel4england said:
For me it would be David Davies but I doubt many would agree with meAndyJS said:
Which Tory do you think would would do best for the party at the next election as leader?tim said:@Peter
At some point the Tories are going to have to confront the issue of Cameron and Osborne being unable to attract the voters they need.
Cameron is likely to put Osborne before winning elections as he did last time, and I'm pleased about that, but the obvious move this time is to replace Osborne with Theresa May, as he should have replaced him with Phil Hammond last time.
It would be quite an achievement for Cameron to fail to get a majority against Brown, lose the boundary changes, split the right and oppose AV then fail to gain from an economic recovery because he and Osborne are seen as being too out of touch,but he could feasibly achieve it.
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What could possibly motivate the politicians to want to muzzle the press?
I cannot think of any reasons, any suggestions?antifrank said:The renewed expenses scandal shows again why we need OFPOL. We need regulatory oversight of politicians' honesty and competence, with sweeping powers to intervene.
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Nigel4England Davis would probably have not got as many swing voters who voted for Blair switching to the Tories as Cameron got, they would instead have gone to Clegg, so the Tory share would likely have been a little lower and the LD vote slightly higher. A Davis led Tory party would probably have got about 33/34%, not much different from what Michael Howard got, Labour would probably have been unchanged on 29%, but the LDs would likely have been higher on about 25/26%. As Clegg would never have formed a coalition with Davis, who he has much less in common with ideologically than Cameron, the likely result would either have been a Tory minority government or a Labour-LD coalition, with either Alan Johnson or David Miliband succeeding Brown as PM as the price for Clegg's support. However, Davis would not have lost the votes Cameron now has to UKIP0
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PeterthePunter Must have missed that?0
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That's where we part company, I think. The (allowed) allowances were within the letter of the agreement - certainly when the agreement was precisely drafted. There were examples (in the Lords especially) where the wording was vague enough that claims were made of a sort unintended by the drafters.NickPalmer said:If an allowance is too generous, cut it, but don't take a sinister view when people use an allowance in accordance with both the letter and the spirit of its purpose. Isn't that what you do in your job?
But the spirit of allowances? Not at all. I don't think that the spirit extended to bathplugs and biscuits and renting skin-flicks and a Tom Watson all-you-can-eat food allowance and renting offices to yourselves and employing swathes of your families to lick envelopes. Home flipping, especially when it allowed London MPs to have second homes was all within the letter of the allowances but within the spirit? Pull the other one and listen to the bells.
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Guardian help for Huhne day.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/03/press-self-regulation-leveson-censorship?CMP=twt_gu0 -
I'm thinking of now.
Davis would certainly bring many UKIP voters back into the fold at the GE, Crosby is as arrogant as Cameron and just assumes UKIP voters will return forthwith.
He is wrong.0 -
Osborne has done well in a very difficult position.
However he is viewed as a person is immaterial, he has managed to turn a catostrophic situation around without relating mass unemployment and deserves huge credit for that.
And I am not a Tory"0 -
Oh David Davis would have found something to resign about - even as Leader - before 2010, having knifed his colleagues beforehand.HYUFD said:Nigel4England Davis would probably have not got as many swing voters who voted for Blair switching to the Tories as Cameron got, they would instead have gone to Clegg, so the Tory share would likely have been a little lower and the LD vote slightly higher. A Davis led Tory party would probably have got about 33/34%, not much different from what Michael Howard got, Labour would probably have been unchanged on 29%, but the LDs would likely have been higher on about 25/26%. As Clegg would never have formed a coalition with Davis, who he has much less in common with ideologically than Cameron, the likely result would either have been a Tory minority government or a Labour-LD coalition, with either Alan Johnson or David Miliband succeeding Brown as PM as the price for Clegg's support. However, Davis would not have lost the votes Cameron now has to UKIP
Ghastly, ghastly man. For once, the Tories elected the right person in 2005. And he's still the best. By far.0 -
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Great to see Huhne back. The sharpest brain in British politicsdr_spyn said:Guardian help for Huhne day.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/03/press-self-regulation-leveson-censorship?CMP=twt_gu
If the numbers had been right Clegg would have formed a coalition with David DavisHYUFD said:Nigel4England Davis would probably have not got as many swing voters who voted for Blair switching to the Tories as Cameron got, they would instead have gone to Clegg, so the Tory share would likely have been a little lower and the LD vote slightly higher. A Davis led Tory party would probably have got about 33/34%, not much different from what Michael Howard got, Labour would probably have been unchanged on 29%, but the LDs would likely have been higher on about 25/26%. As Clegg would never have formed a coalition with Davis, who he has much less in common with ideologically than Cameron, the likely result would either have been a Tory minority government or a Labour-LD coalition, with either Alan Johnson or David Miliband succeeding Brown as PM as the price for Clegg's support. However, Davis would not have lost the votes Cameron now has to UKIP
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David Davis as Tory leader would have made most Tories yearn for the the Halcyon days of IDS' leadership.
Even Gordon Brown would have defeated him 2007.0 -
Blimey Mike, give the Huhne hero worship a rest, it's become embarassingMikeSmithson said:
Great to see Huhne back. The sharpest brain in British politicsdr_spyn said:Guardian help for Huhne day.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/03/press-self-regulation-leveson-censorship?CMP=twt_gu
If the numbers had been right Clegg would have formed a coalition with David DavisHYUFD said:Nigel4England Davis would probably have not got as many swing voters who voted for Blair switching to the Tories as Cameron got, they would instead have gone to Clegg, so the Tory share would likely have been a little lower and the LD vote slightly higher. A Davis led Tory party would probably have got about 33/34%, not much different from what Michael Howard got, Labour would probably have been unchanged on 29%, but the LDs would likely have been higher on about 25/26%. As Clegg would never have formed a coalition with Davis, who he has much less in common with ideologically than Cameron, the likely result would either have been a Tory minority government or a Labour-LD coalition, with either Alan Johnson or David Miliband succeeding Brown as PM as the price for Clegg's support. However, Davis would not have lost the votes Cameron now has to UKIP
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Just a pity his brains were in his trousers in 2010.MikeSmithson said:
Great to see Huhne back. The sharpest brain in British politicsdr_spyn said:Guardian help for Huhne day.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/03/press-self-regulation-leveson-censorship?CMP=twt_gu0 -
Sure. I'm saying that if people did follow the letter AND spirit (and I'd claim I did) then there isn't really anything to debate. If I'd rented skin-flicks or bought stuff to keep after I left Parliament it'd be different. But your original post suggested I was shown in a bad light and taking the piss without pointing to anything that you actually felt I'd done that wasn't in the spirit of the allowances. I think that's falling into the "they're all the same" generalisation. In particular, I didn't use the housing allowance to help buy property in any way: I rented a small flat with it, and when I left Parliament I left the flat, without any profit in any form. Why is that taking the piss?GeoffM said:
That's where we part company, I think. The allowances were within the letter of the purpose when the letter was precisely drafted. There were examples (in the Lords especially) where the wording was vague enough that claims were made of a sort unintended by the drafters.NickPalmer said:If an allowance is too generous, cut it, but don't take a sinister view when people use an allowance in accordance with both the letter and the spirit of its purpose. Isn't that what you do in your job?
But the spirit of allowances? Not at all. I don't think that the spirit extended to bathplugs and biscuits and renting skin-flicks and a Tom Watson all-you-can-eat food allowance and renting offices to yourselves and employing swathes of your families to lick envelopes. Home flipping, especially when it allowed London MPs to have second homes was all within the letter of the allowances but within the spirit? Pull the other one and listen to the bells.
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Osborne was never handed down a catastrophic situation though the coalition like to pretend that he was.The real catastrophe was in 2007/8 when queues were forming in front of Northern Rock but luckily we had a steady hand at the time to negotiate the situation.Not that Brown will get any credit on here.nigel4england said:Osborne has done well in a very difficult position.
However he is viewed as a person is immaterial, he has managed to turn a catostrophic situation around without relating mass unemployment and deserves huge credit for that.
And I am not a Tory"
Osborne has had some successes but he`s nowhere done as well as the right would like to think he has.He has continued to miss the targets he had set for himself and by some margin.
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I remember back in 2007, someone on here said that Northern Rock would be forgotten by next weekend.SMukesh said:
Osborne was never handed down a catastrophic situation though the coalition like to pretend that he was.The real catastrophe was in 2007/8 when queues were forming in front of Northern Rock but luckily we had a steady hand at the time to negotiate the situation.Not that Brown will get any credit on here.nigel4england said:Osborne has done well in a very difficult position.
However he is viewed as a person is immaterial, he has managed to turn a catostrophic situation around without relating mass unemployment and deserves huge credit for that.
And I am not a Tory"
Osborne has had some successes but he`s nowhere done as well as the right would like to think he has.He has continued to miss the targets he had set for himself and by some margin.0 -
OGH Clegg would never have got a coalition with Davis through his party, the most he would have done is promise not to vote down a Davis minority Tory government in a vote of confidence0
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And brought the Tories back to within hailing distance (5-6%) with 18 months to go. Not even I thought that was likely this far out from the election.tim said:
Osbornes 2010 election campaign cost the Tories 5%, Osbornes Omnishambles 2012 cost them another 5%nigel4england said:Osborne has done well in a very difficult position.
However he is viewed as a person is immaterial, he has managed to turn a catostrophic situation around without relating mass unemployment and deserves huge credit for that.
And I am not a Tory"
They are the two biggest poll movements of the last five years
Poor you.
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Tim In many ways May is a Merkel to Cameron's Blair and Boris's Berlusconi0
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The fact that it`s nearly forgotten is a tribute to the way it was dealt with.TheScreamingEagles said:
I remember back in 2007, someone on here said that Northern Rock would be forgotten by next weekend.SMukesh said:
Osborne was never handed down a catastrophic situation though the coalition like to pretend that he was.The real catastrophe was in 2007/8 when queues were forming in front of Northern Rock but luckily we had a steady hand at the time to negotiate the situation.Not that Brown will get any credit on here.nigel4england said:Osborne has done well in a very difficult position.
However he is viewed as a person is immaterial, he has managed to turn a catostrophic situation around without relating mass unemployment and deserves huge credit for that.
And I am not a Tory"
Osborne has had some successes but he`s nowhere done as well as the right would like to think he has.He has continued to miss the targets he had set for himself and by some margin.0 -
JohnO I never sad he was a nice man and even Davis would not resign as leader. TSE Brown would still have bottled a 2007 election0
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Unfortunately it is RBS that everyone remembers and the one we're still dealing with.SMukesh said:
The fact that it`s nearly forgotten is a tribute to the way it was dealt with.TheScreamingEagles said:
I remember back in 2007, someone on here said that Northern Rock would be forgotten by next weekend.SMukesh said:
Osborne was never handed down a catastrophic situation though the coalition like to pretend that he was.The real catastrophe was in 2007/8 when queues were forming in front of Northern Rock but luckily we had a steady hand at the time to negotiate the situation.Not that Brown will get any credit on here.nigel4england said:Osborne has done well in a very difficult position.
However he is viewed as a person is immaterial, he has managed to turn a catostrophic situation around without relating mass unemployment and deserves huge credit for that.
And I am not a Tory"
Osborne has had some successes but he`s nowhere done as well as the right would like to think he has.He has continued to miss the targets he had set for himself and by some margin.0 -
I'm not sure.HYUFD said:JohnO I never sad he was a nice man and even Davis would not resign as leader. TSE Brown would still have bottled a 2007 election
I know a Davis led Tory party would never been able to perform the way Dave and George did in 2007, which altered the narrative and the polls, and made Brown and Darling look like amateurs.0 -
I'd agree with the assessment of what needs to happen.peter_from_putney said:It seems to me that three things need to happen for the Tories to have a realistic chance of winning the next General Election:
Firstly and probably most importantly the LibDems need to increase their share of the vote from approx 10% currently to at least 16%, with two thirds of this increased share coming from Labour.
Secondly UKIP's share of the vote needs to fall from approx 12% currently to 6% with at least two thirds of those switching opting for the Tories.
Thirdly there has to be a straight switch of at least 3% from Labour to the Tories.
Assuming Labour currently has a 5% lead over the Tories, with these parties holding 38% and 33% of the vote respectively, the above movements I have suggested would result in each of their shares becoming:
Labour 38% - 4% +2% - 3% = 33%
Tories 33% - 2% +4% +3% =38%
LibDems 10% + 6% = 16%
UKIP 12% - 6% = 6%
Others 7%
Probably sufficient to result in the Tories winning the most seats without necessarily winning an overall majority. This looks like a very big ask to me on all three counts.
However, I think that both the LibDems and the UKIP shifts are more likely than not to happen.
The Tory/Labour split I reckon will remain very similar: the electorate will view the question as essentially the same as last time (a gentle squeeze vs profligacy), so I don't see a reason for much direct shifting.
As I've posted before, though, where that could shift is in Scotland - where the SNP not the Tories will benefit in vote share, but which represents downside to Labour (and possibly - I think - the Tories winning 1 or two seats by sneaking through the middle?)
edit: but my outcome assessment is Tories largest party in a hung parliament. It may be hope though - perhaps more realistic is Labour largest in a hung parliament0 -
As it's all counter-factual stuff we'll never know. But I seriously doubt whether a Davis led Tory party would have produced even a hung Parliament. Brown would now be well into his second term.HYUFD said:JohnO I never sad he was a nice man and even Davis would not resign as leader. TSE Brown would still have bottled a 2007 election
In almost every sense, Davis was unsuited to be a party leader.
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