Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

Opinium: Apart from vaccines more think LAB would be doing better – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 8,489
edited October 17 in General
imageOpinium: Apart from vaccines more think LAB would be doing better – politicalbetting.com

An interesting new polling approach from Opinium features in its latest poll and in the chart above. The sample was asked: Please imagine Labour had been in government for the last couple of years instead of the Conservatives. Do you think they would have done a better or worse job in each of the following areas?

Read the full story here

«134

Comments

  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 11,996
    edited October 17
    Is blue Labour better and red Tories better!??

    Tories are in the minority so perhaps this is to be expected. It is just the non Tory majority is very divided and less efficiently distributed by constituency.
  • The question arises then why are labour not well ahead in the polls

    Today's quite extensive poll in the mail is actually quite reasonable for HMG
  • LeonLeon Posts: 13,090
    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 2,874

    Is blue Labour better and red Tories better!??

    Yep. But then, we all know Starmer is a Tory and Johnson is spending like Corbyn. Labour hold blue seats and the Conservatives red ones... So, why not? :wink:
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 90,523
    It was of course the vaccines which played the biggest part both in reducing the death rate and getting the economy going again.

    Opinium would still give Boris a majority of about 30
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 38,637
    edited October 17

    Is blue Labour better and red Tories better!??

    Tories are in the minority so perhaps this is to be expected. It is just the non Tory majority is very divided and less efficiently distributed by constituency.

    In the US, it's red for GOP and blue for Dems :lol:
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 44,652
    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 3,702

    The question arises then why are labour not well ahead in the polls

    Today's quite extensive poll in the mail is actually quite reasonable for HMG

    Very unscientific but a sense test would tell you that the idea SKS is anywhere near power is laughable. Even in North London, it is difficult to find anyone with a good way to say about him. And the only ones who are consistently negative about the Government are the Remain fanatics who bang on about everything being the fault of Brexit in the same way the Qanon loons bang on about Biden being a Chinese spy.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 9,837
    Lou Reed regarded the Beatles as garbage.

    On the one hand, Heroin.

    On the other, Lucy in the tralalala.Sky with fucking Diamonds.

    Who is to say who was right?
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 15,356
    Labour better at tackling crime? Clearly the voters have forgotten who would have been Labour's Home Secretary.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 3,702
    FPT - @Foxy, FYI, I criticised the ones attacking Congress so no suggestions I did the opposite please. I’m sure you don’t mean to mislabel.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 38,755
    Michael Gove is to overrule Sadiq Khan and allow a 1,000ft viewing tower in the City to be built. It’s called ‘the tulip’

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1449845803506356234
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 90,523

    Is blue Labour better and red Tories better!??

    Tories are in the minority so perhaps this is to be expected. It is just the non Tory majority is very divided and less efficiently distributed by constituency.

    You cannot classify the LDs as automatically part of the non Tory majority given they chose to go into government with the Tories from 2010-2015
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 21,319

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    There was a service a lot like this during the first dot com bubble. Would deliver a Twix to your desk. But obviously they lost massive amounts of money on it Forgotten it's name.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 13,866
    "Politics For All
    @PoliticsForAlI
    NEW: Forcing GPs to do more face-to-face appointments is ‘harassment’ and ‘discrimination’, the head of the British Medical Association has said

    Via @Telegraph
    7:30 PM · Oct 17, 2021"
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 31,871

    Michael Gove is to overrule Sadiq Khan and allow a 1,000ft viewing tower in the City to be built. It’s called ‘the tulip’

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1449845803506356234

    That looks awful.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 11,996
    HYUFD said:

    Is blue Labour better and red Tories better!??

    Tories are in the minority so perhaps this is to be expected. It is just the non Tory majority is very divided and less efficiently distributed by constituency.

    You cannot classify the LDs as automatically part of the non Tory majority given they chose to go into government with the Tories from 2010-2015
    Do you know what non Tory means? It does not mean Labour, or even left wing. It means non Tory.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 38,637
    HYUFD said:

    Is blue Labour better and red Tories better!??

    Tories are in the minority so perhaps this is to be expected. It is just the non Tory majority is very divided and less efficiently distributed by constituency.

    You cannot classify the LDs as automatically part of the non Tory majority given they chose to go into government with the Tories from 2010-2015
    Hardly likely in 2024, given the LDs are Remainers!
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 3,702

    Labour better at tackling crime? Clearly the voters have forgotten who would have been Labour's Home Secretary.

    I think someone did a forensic taking apart of those numbers and found they didn’t make sense.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 38,637
    edited October 17
    MaxPB said:

    Michael Gove is to overrule Sadiq Khan and allow a 1,000ft viewing tower in the City to be built. It’s called ‘the tulip’

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1449845803506356234

    That looks awful.
    The Square Mile, honestly, has too many skyscrapers nowadays.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 27,622
    MrEd said:

    FPT - @Foxy, FYI, I criticised the ones attacking Congress so no suggestions I did the opposite please. I’m sure you don’t mean to mislabel.

    No but plenty of US Republicans see them as martyrs.

    It is not a matter of competition, both Right wing terrorism and Islamist terror are real threats.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 13,090

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 27,622
    HYUFD said:

    Is blue Labour better and red Tories better!??

    Tories are in the minority so perhaps this is to be expected. It is just the non Tory majority is very divided and less efficiently distributed by constituency.

    You cannot classify the LDs as automatically part of the non Tory majority given they chose to go into government with the Tories from 2010-2015
    It is very clear that the LDs won't be supporting a Tory party in its current form.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 90,523
    edited October 17
    Foxy said:

    MrEd said:

    FPT - @Foxy, FYI, I criticised the ones attacking Congress so no suggestions I did the opposite please. I’m sure you don’t mean to mislabel.

    No but plenty of US Republicans see them as martyrs.

    It is not a matter of competition, both Right wing terrorism and Islamist terror are real threats.
    And the longer both are ignored the more we head to a final clash between the two, the left in particular could do with treating jihadis as as big a risk as it treats the far right.

    Already Trump is on 46%, Le Pen is on 45% in some polls next year, still not enough to win at the moment but in a decade?
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 2,874

    Labour better at tackling crime? Clearly the voters have forgotten who would have been Labour's Home Secretary.

    I had forgotten, to be fair.

    Crime figures would have been entertaining though - or, at least, any interview in which the Home Secretary was asked to quote them.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 31,871
    edited October 17
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    Nah, they're absolutely burning through cash. It's their startup funding to try and buy market share from Uber eats and getir, the latter of which is likely to also not do very well given the cash burn rate.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 27,622
    HYUFD said:

    Foxy said:

    MrEd said:

    FPT - @Foxy, FYI, I criticised the ones attacking Congress so no suggestions I did the opposite please. I’m sure you don’t mean to mislabel.

    No but plenty of US Republicans see them as martyrs.

    It is not a matter of competition, both Right wing terrorism and Islamist terror are real threats.
    And the longer both are ignored the more we head to a final clash between the two
    Nah. We don't need to choose sides, there are other options.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 4,654
    I cannot believe PB has sunk as low as the equivalent of Dixons subsample extrapolations. Anything to diss the Tories will do.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 44,652
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    I assume your original message should read £1.80 delivery.

    That does not seem sustainable to me. As the guy said, people start rushing around when the order comes in. People starting to rush around costs money.
  • TazTaz Posts: 2,477
    Of course on HGV drivers labour can be seen to do better. starmer says he would allow 100,000 in to alleviate the shortage. But nothing on where we would get them from in a world where many nations has a shortage of HGV drivers. It’s a free, unchallenged, hit.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 27,622
    Selebian said:

    Labour better at tackling crime? Clearly the voters have forgotten who would have been Labour's Home Secretary.

    I had forgotten, to be fair.

    Crime figures would have been entertaining though - or, at least, any interview in which the Home Secretary was asked to quote them.
    Yes, Priti has bungled a few numbers too as I recall.



  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 3,702
    Foxy said:

    MrEd said:

    FPT - @Foxy, FYI, I criticised the ones attacking Congress so no suggestions I did the opposite please. I’m sure you don’t mean to mislabel.

    No but plenty of US Republicans see them as martyrs.

    It is not a matter of competition, both Right wing terrorism and Islamist terror are real threats.
    Agreed. Timothy McVey caused one of the worst instances of domestic terrorism in the US.
    There is no “either / or”, it is both.

    However, my concerns are the same as I posted yesterday namely that when it is right wing terrorism it rightly gets called out but when it is Islamic radicalist terrorism, there is a defensive reflex on a good swathe of the commentariat to try and do everything to deflect from the issue. That means the underlying problems just get swept under the carpet.

    Which doesn’t help because, to put it bluntly, terrorism from radical Islamic fundamentalists is killing a lot more people than right wing terrorism. Both are threats but we can’t dispute the numbers.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 24,572

    I cannot believe PB has sunk as low as the equivalent of Dixons subsample extrapolations. Anything to diss the Tories will do.

    Er these are not subsamples. This is a poll just like any other but one which asks different questions. As far as I can see this poll has just as much validity as any other as far as the numbers go.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 13,090
    MaxPB said:

    Michael Gove is to overrule Sadiq Khan and allow a 1,000ft viewing tower in the City to be built. It’s called ‘the tulip’

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1449845803506356234

    That looks awful.
    The problem with the City cluster is not this building, it is the density: the towers are all packed together in an insanely tight pattern. This is a result of two things: the preserved sightlines of St Paul's Cathedral, meaning nothing can get too close and skyscrapers must bend back awkwardly in places (see the Cheesegrater) and also the height limit imposed by the proximity of City Airport and LHR, they mean nothing much over 1000 feet, so towers can't go higher - like the supertalls in NYC and you get a boxy, tabletop effect, now visible in the Wharf as well as the City

    This new density also means the loveliest tower of all, the Gherkin, is about to disappear from view entirely. IT will be completely surrounded

    On the other hand, London will have an entirely unique skyline. It might look like an ugly Satanic splodge of steel and glass, but it will be very different to anywhere else
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 2,874
    Foxy said:

    Selebian said:

    Labour better at tackling crime? Clearly the voters have forgotten who would have been Labour's Home Secretary.

    I had forgotten, to be fair.

    Crime figures would have been entertaining though - or, at least, any interview in which the Home Secretary was asked to quote them.
    Yes, Priti has bungled a few numbers too as I recall.
    To be fair, I'd be happy to have a home secretary who wasn't good at on-air maths if she/he was good at other things. Patel has bungled more than a few numbers in her time.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 44,652

    MrEd said:

    The question arises then why are labour not well ahead in the polls

    Today's quite extensive poll in the mail is actually quite reasonable for HMG

    Very unscientific but a sense test would tell you that the idea SKS is anywhere near power is laughable. Even in North London, it is difficult to find anyone with a good way to say about him. And the only ones who are consistently negative about the Government are the Remain fanatics who bang on about everything being the fault of Brexit in the same way the Qanon loons bang on about Biden being a Chinese spy.
    I know quite a lot of non-Labour voters (this is Surrey...) who are consistently negative about the Government, none of them talking about Brexit. They feel there's one crisis after another while the Government absent-mindedly drifts along. This week's main theme is that the upward trend in Covid is being simply ignored, with no clear message in any direction.

    They aren't showing any particular interest in Labour. They're just fed up and probably wouldn't vote if the election was tomorrow. But you'd be mistaken to think that only Remain fanatics feel like that.
    imho the context of the next GE has not been defined/framed, so Sir K still has a chance of depriving a johnson majority. Johnson tried at his conference speech to frame the next GE as being basically 'Brexit caused all sorts of transition problems, but it was worth it because your wages went up and that's because migration is down'.

    But that could easily go pear shaped if inflation runs away.

    Sir K need to try and frame it as "Are you better off than when you voted to leave in 2016?"

    He also needs to clear the barnacles as Lynton would say e.g. ditch the identity stuff. It's the economy stupid. Ignore the culture war. But that is very hard for Labour - possibly impossible with current membership.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 24,572
    MaxPB said:

    Michael Gove is to overrule Sadiq Khan and allow a 1,000ft viewing tower in the City to be built. It’s called ‘the tulip’

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1449845803506356234

    That looks awful.
    I have to disagree. I think it looks really good.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 3,702

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    I assume your original message should read £1.80 delivery.

    That does not seem sustainable to me. As the guy said, people start rushing around when the order comes in. People starting to rush around costs money.
    It’s a massive land grab. All the players know it is unsustainable, the aim is to be amongst the biggest, force the weaker players to exit and then grow margins over the long term. That’s the theory.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 30,260
    The BJ regime foretold on BBC2 in 5.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 90,523
    Spain's Socialist PM promises to abolish prostitution

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-58947172
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 27,622
    MrEd said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    I assume your original message should read £1.80 delivery.

    That does not seem sustainable to me. As the guy said, people start rushing around when the order comes in. People starting to rush around costs money.
    It’s a massive land grab. All the players know it is unsustainable, the aim is to be amongst the biggest, force the weaker players to exit and then grow margins over the long term. That’s the theory.
    Presumably the delivery company also gets the retail mark up on the wine.

    Not sure this is really a way to get high wage, high skill employment improving our productivity.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 44,652
    MrEd said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    I assume your original message should read £1.80 delivery.

    That does not seem sustainable to me. As the guy said, people start rushing around when the order comes in. People starting to rush around costs money.
    It’s a massive land grab. All the players know it is unsustainable, the aim is to be amongst the biggest, force the weaker players to exit and then grow margins over the long term. That’s the theory.
    Amazon redux.

    Not convinced someone can pull it off a second time.

    If products can be delivered at such notice for so little, then Amazon will do it eventually, and the rest are dead.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 3,702

    MrEd said:

    The question arises then why are labour not well ahead in the polls

    Today's quite extensive poll in the mail is actually quite reasonable for HMG

    Very unscientific but a sense test would tell you that the idea SKS is anywhere near power is laughable. Even in North London, it is difficult to find anyone with a good way to say about him. And the only ones who are consistently negative about the Government are the Remain fanatics who bang on about everything being the fault of Brexit in the same way the Qanon loons bang on about Biden being a Chinese spy.
    I know quite a lot of non-Labour voters (this is Surrey...) who are consistently negative about the Government, none of them talking about Brexit. They feel there's one crisis after another while the Government absent-mindedly drifts along. This week's main theme is that the upward trend in Covid is being simply ignored, with no clear message in any direction.

    They aren't showing any particular interest in Labour. They're just fed up and probably wouldn't vote if the election was tomorrow. But you'd be mistaken to think that only Remain fanatics feel like that.
    Don’t get me wrong, people are not saying this is a wonderful Government but there is not much bitching and moaning going on.

    I find a good test is whether people bring up a topic automatically and / or as a non-sequitur as it shows it’s on their mind and they are passionate. The only ones who do are the devout Remainers. The supply chain issues have got traction but there is a general acceptance it’s a global issue.

    There are several years to go and SKS may hit it out of the park but it doesn’t feel like it now and many people look to have made their mind up about him.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 3,702

    MrEd said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    I assume your original message should read £1.80 delivery.

    That does not seem sustainable to me. As the guy said, people start rushing around when the order comes in. People starting to rush around costs money.
    It’s a massive land grab. All the players know it is unsustainable, the aim is to be amongst the biggest, force the weaker players to exit and then grow margins over the long term. That’s the theory.
    Amazon redux.

    Not convinced someone can pull it off a second time.

    If products can be delivered at such notice for so little, then Amazon will do it eventually, and the rest are dead.
    I tend to agree. The problem with the delivery model is it is not scaleable. The more business you get, the more costs you incur. Look at Uber (same goes for rides). Struggling to get profitable (even on EBITDA).
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 2,332
    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 13,866
    HYUFD said:

    Spain's Socialist PM promises to abolish prostitution

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-58947172

    Does this include the online variety?
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 3,702
    Foxy said:

    MrEd said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    I assume your original message should read £1.80 delivery.

    That does not seem sustainable to me. As the guy said, people start rushing around when the order comes in. People starting to rush around costs money.
    It’s a massive land grab. All the players know it is unsustainable, the aim is to be amongst the biggest, force the weaker players to exit and then grow margins over the long term. That’s the theory.
    Presumably the delivery company also gets the retail mark up on the wine.

    Not sure this is really a way to get high wage, high skill employment improving our productivity.
    Not at all but it’s one of the reasons why, for example, wait times for Uber drivers is going higher because the delivery companies are poaching available talent.

    The concern is that people get locked into these jobs when they are young, thinking it’s decent wages and a free lifestyle. Then, before you know it, you are 30+ and you have no skills. And your job has been automated.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 13,090
    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    Nah, they're absolutely burning through cash. It's their startup funding to try and buy market share from Uber eats and getir, the latter of which is likely to also not do very well given the cash burn rate.
    I bet one survives. A network of ebikers who can deliver groceries ~10minutes. And that is all that matters. They are fighting to be that one

    Same with Deliveroo, Uber Eats, and so on. One of them will become the amazon of meal delivery.

    Unless, of course, amazon take over Gorillas AND Deliveroo and Uber and become the amazon of EVERYTHING

  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 17,460
    edited October 17
    German update: the SPD/Green/FDP talks are proceeding amicably with no public signs of dissent, though there is clearly going to be difficulty about economic policy, with the FDP keen on austerity and wanting the Finance Ministry. A poll just out shows that voters want Scholz to be Chancellor, by 72-19%, including a majority (55%) of CDU voters and even 48% of AfD voters, and the trio are strongly favoured for government. Alternative coalition possibilities (SPD/CDU or CDU/Green/FDP) are rejected by large majorities. Current voting intention remains much as at the election, except that the CDU have drifted back to 19% (their lowest poll rating ever), with everyone else slightly up.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 13,866
    Leon said:

    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    Nah, they're absolutely burning through cash. It's their startup funding to try and buy market share from Uber eats and getir, the latter of which is likely to also not do very well given the cash burn rate.
    I bet one survives. A network of ebikers who can deliver groceries ~10minutes. And that is all that matters. They are fighting to be that one

    Same with Deliveroo, Uber Eats, and so on. One of them will become the amazon of meal delivery.

    Unless, of course, amazon take over Gorillas AND Deliveroo and Uber and become the amazon of EVERYTHING

    What happens if someone on Shetland uses this service? Does it say "arriving in 10 days"...
  • isamisam Posts: 38,550
    If we took away the best pollster for the Conservatives, and the best one for Labour, the Tories would be walking it - basically Opinium are out on a limb for Sir Keir and Labour and that’s pretty much all we hear about
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 15,524
    edited October 17
    IshmaelZ said:

    Lou Reed regarded the Beatles as garbage.

    On the one hand, Heroin.

    On the other, Lucy in the tralalala.Sky with fucking Diamonds.

    Who is to say who was right?

    Me.
    Everyone was right except you and Lou Reed.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 31,871
    Foxy said:

    MrEd said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    I assume your original message should read £1.80 delivery.

    That does not seem sustainable to me. As the guy said, people start rushing around when the order comes in. People starting to rush around costs money.
    It’s a massive land grab. All the players know it is unsustainable, the aim is to be amongst the biggest, force the weaker players to exit and then grow margins over the long term. That’s the theory.
    Presumably the delivery company also gets the retail mark up on the wine.

    Not sure this is really a way to get high wage, high skill employment improving our productivity.
    It depends on the deal with Sainsbury's. Aiui Uber has got some of the margin but that's Uber. I doubt smaller players will get that deal, if they're price matching then they are simply making the £1.80, if they're marking up Sainsbury's prices then it will be the markup plus £1.80, it's a company that's going to keep going back to investors for money and hope they become too big to fail.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 13,090
    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 13,866
    edited October 17
    Paywalled Telegraph article.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/10/17/sir-david-amess-murder-suspect-had-considered-killing-mps-telegraph/

    "Sir David Amess murder suspect had considered killing other MPs, the Telegraph understands

    The investigation into the tragic death of the MP suggests he was not specifically targeted, but may have been picked at random"
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 2,332
    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    Yeah, and honestly from my quiet corner of rural Aberdeenshire, I wouldn't swap. But things like this get me all excited and a part of me yearns to have anything even vaguely approaching that.
    Consider me low-key jealous.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 15,524
    edited October 17
    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    Won't work outside the big cities. At all. We don't have Ocado either.
    But then we don't have shops open. Or trains before 10:30am or after 9pm either.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 9,837
    dixiedean said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Lou Reed regarded the Beatles as garbage.

    On the one hand, Heroin.

    On the other, Lucy in the tralalala.Sky with fucking Diamonds.

    Who is to say who was right?

    Me.
    Everyone was right except you and Lou Reed.
    Sure.

    Tralalalala.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 11,996
    MrEd said:

    Foxy said:

    MrEd said:

    FPT - @Foxy, FYI, I criticised the ones attacking Congress so no suggestions I did the opposite please. I’m sure you don’t mean to mislabel.

    No but plenty of US Republicans see them as martyrs.

    It is not a matter of competition, both Right wing terrorism and Islamist terror are real threats.
    Agreed. Timothy McVey caused one of the worst instances of domestic terrorism in the US.
    There is no “either / or”, it is both.

    However, my concerns are the same as I posted yesterday namely that when it is right wing terrorism it rightly gets called out but when it is Islamic radicalist terrorism, there is a defensive reflex on a good swathe of the commentariat to try and do everything to deflect from the issue. That means the underlying problems just get swept under the carpet.

    Which doesn’t help because, to put it bluntly, terrorism from radical Islamic fundamentalists is killing a lot more people than right wing terrorism. Both are threats but we can’t dispute the numbers.
    If we actually look at the numbers 2.5 times more people were killed by terrorism in the UK in1988 alone than all years combined from 2000-now. Yet most people are far more scared of terrorism than they were back then.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_in_the_United_Kingdom
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 44,652
    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    Won't work outside the big cities. At all. We don't have Ocado either.
    But then we don't have shops open. Or trains before 10:30am or after 9pm either.
    Gorillas has raised a total of $1.3B in funding over 4 rounds.

    :lol:
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 224
    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    If you pay Deliveroo a subscription of £13 a month, you can have unlimited free deliveries with minimum order each time of £10.
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 2,332
    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    Won't work outside the big cities. At all. We don't have Ocado either.
    But then we don't have shops open. Or trains before 10:30am or after 9pm either.
    We don't even have a train station.
    Anywhere. In my whole constituency.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 16,787
    Good to see hope for a change of government.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 5,281
    MrEd said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    I assume your original message should read £1.80 delivery.

    That does not seem sustainable to me. As the guy said, people start rushing around when the order comes in. People starting to rush around costs money.
    It’s a massive land grab. All the players know it is unsustainable, the aim is to be amongst the biggest, force the weaker players to exit and then grow margins over the long term. That’s the theory.
    It's interesting, but my guess is that they will have peak demand at the same times as takeaways, and they already suffer from extended delivery timescales when demand is high. I would have thought that one time when you have to wait half an hour for something you've ordered - and could have had it in half the time if you'd popped out to the local shop - will be the death of them. There's something maddening about having to wait for longer than expected. That's why waiting for the bus can be so frustrating.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 13,866
    carnforth said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    If you pay Deliveroo a subscription of £13 a month, you can have unlimited free deliveries with minimum order each time of £10.
    How can they afford to pay the people who deliver the goods?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 38,637
    Farooq said:

    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    Won't work outside the big cities. At all. We don't have Ocado either.
    But then we don't have shops open. Or trains before 10:30am or after 9pm either.
    We don't even have a train station.
    Anywhere. In my whole constituency.
    Oh, Doctor Beeching!
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 5,611
    edited October 17
    IshmaelZ said:

    dixiedean said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Lou Reed regarded the Beatles as garbage.

    On the one hand, Heroin.

    On the other, Lucy in the tralalala.Sky with fucking Diamonds.

    Who is to say who was right?

    Me.
    Everyone was right except you and Lou Reed.
    Sure.

    Tralalalala.
    That’s from the Mikado, isn’t it? “The Flowers that Bloom in the Spring”?

    Edit: though I think you are missing the final “la”.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 38,755
    Apparently the suspect went on a deradicalisation course.

    image
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 224
    Andy_JS said:

    carnforth said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    If you pay Deliveroo a subscription of £13 a month, you can have unlimited free deliveries with minimum order each time of £10.
    How can they afford to pay the people who deliver the goods?
    I presume they (deliveroo) get a cut of the total bill. Some grocers (like Aldi) don’t mark things up at all. Some mark up considerably, especially on booze. My local garage sells £5-in-store wine on deliveroo for £9.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 13,866

    Farooq said:

    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    Won't work outside the big cities. At all. We don't have Ocado either.
    But then we don't have shops open. Or trains before 10:30am or after 9pm either.
    We don't even have a train station.
    Anywhere. In my whole constituency.
    Oh, Doctor Beeching!
    I wonder which constituency closest to London doesn't have any trains stations.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 3,684

    Apparently the suspect went on a deradicalisation course.

    image

    Really work then dont they?
  • FarooqFarooq Posts: 2,332
    Andy_JS said:

    Farooq said:

    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    Won't work outside the big cities. At all. We don't have Ocado either.
    But then we don't have shops open. Or trains before 10:30am or after 9pm either.
    We don't even have a train station.
    Anywhere. In my whole constituency.
    Oh, Doctor Beeching!
    I wonder which constituency closest to London doesn't have any trains stations.
    Oxford East?
  • Will someone please order Sunil his favorite veggie pizza from Sainsbury's and have it delivered pronto?!?!
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 21,319
    Andy_JS said:

    carnforth said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    If you pay Deliveroo a subscription of £13 a month, you can have unlimited free deliveries with minimum order each time of £10.
    How can they afford to pay the people who deliver the goods?
    It's subsidised by VC cash.

    It is not remotely sustainable.
  • isamisam Posts: 38,550

    Apparently the suspect went on a deradicalisation course.

    image

    Really work then dont they?
    Shamima Begum said sorry and put on some make up, so let her back
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 15,524

    Apparently the suspect went on a deradicalisation course.

    image

    Really work then dont they?
    One of the problems with Prevent is the numbers of folk reported to them. If the threshold is low, you simply can't monitor everyone.
    Unless a UK Stasi comes about.
    And even then...
  • Jonathan said:

    Good to see hope for a change of government.

    The worry for Labour has to be that, despite the nibbles they're able to take out of Conservative support, and the surprisingly strong internals, something is preventing the necessary joining of dots in the public mind. I don't think anyone knows what for sure, hence the temptation to find a simple theory.

    The worry for the Conservatives has to be that political winter is coming, the lead they have in the barn might not be huge- can it survive a couple of years of tax rises and spending restraint with an election shortly after?

    (That's BoJo's biggest problem. The winning strategy tends to be to be Scrooge in the aftermath of the election, so you can be Santa as the next election approaches. Covid has blown that one out of the water, rather.)
  • Alistair said:

    Andy_JS said:

    carnforth said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    If you pay Deliveroo a subscription of £13 a month, you can have unlimited free deliveries with minimum order each time of £10.
    How can they afford to pay the people who deliver the goods?
    It's subsidised by VC cash.

    It is not remotely sustainable.
    Believe (based on grapevine & media reports) that many delivery-service drivers depend on tips, esp. as delivery companies have tendency to nickel & dime them (don't know UK equivalent!) on the apps, by deductions & other dodges?

    So I hear.
  • AslanAslan Posts: 734

    Apparently the suspect went on a deradicalisation course.

    image

    No deradicalising course can work as long as they go on believing the Koran is the literal word of God. Because the extremists they are in touch with can just point them back to the relevant passages.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,606
    Alistair said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    There was a service a lot like this during the first dot com bubble. Would deliver a Twix to your desk. But obviously they lost massive amounts of money on it Forgotten it's name.
    Urban fetch
  • theProletheProle Posts: 553

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    I assume your original message should read £1.80 delivery.

    That does not seem sustainable to me. As the guy said, people start rushing around when the order comes in. People starting to rush around costs money.
    Lad on bycycle is 5 mins away from you at Sainsburys. He spends 5 mins in store, 5 mins cycling to you, 5 mins back. For £1.80.

    If he's operating solidly on this basis all night, that's £7.20 an hour. Before any costs.

    It's kind of the investors to fund your wine ordering habits like this, but the idea that this sort of thing is in any way sustainable at this sort of rate is for the birds. I doubt its profitable at £5 a delivery.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 15,624
    Aslan said:

    Apparently the suspect went on a deradicalisation course.

    image

    No deradicalising course can work as long as they go on believing the Koran is the literal word of God. Because the extremists they are in touch with can just point them back to the relevant passages.
    Do you have data for this? Because there are millions of people in the world who believe the Koran is the literal word of God and also have the internet so presumably they're exposed to people pointing out the relevant passages, but they don't go around stabbing people.

    Religion is very weird and disassociative, for instance the Christian texts are extremely clear that believers need to sell all their stuff and give the money to the poor, but there are millions of believers who apparently take the texts very seriously, yet never once do that, even though they would only have to take what they claim to believe seriously for a couple of minutes to do it. So it's not implausible the right intervention can increase the probability that someone acts on the non-homicidal part of their chosen book of holy stupid bullshit, while avoiding the homicidal parts.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,606

    MaxPB said:

    Michael Gove is to overrule Sadiq Khan and allow a 1,000ft viewing tower in the City to be built. It’s called ‘the tulip’

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1449845803506356234

    That looks awful.
    The Square Mile, honestly, has too many skyscrapers nowadays.
    Ummm... What are you proposing?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 38,637
    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    Michael Gove is to overrule Sadiq Khan and allow a 1,000ft viewing tower in the City to be built. It’s called ‘the tulip’

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1449845803506356234

    That looks awful.
    The Square Mile, honestly, has too many skyscrapers nowadays.
    Ummm... What are you proposing?
    Ummm.... no new skyscrapers might be an idea.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,606

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    Michael Gove is to overrule Sadiq Khan and allow a 1,000ft viewing tower in the City to be built. It’s called ‘the tulip’

    https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1449845803506356234

    That looks awful.
    The Square Mile, honestly, has too many skyscrapers nowadays.
    Ummm... What are you proposing?
    Ummm.... no new skyscrapers might be an idea.
    "Too many" indicated a desire to... demolish... some.

    You'll excuse my concern.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,606
    theProle said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    I assume your original message should read £1.80 delivery.

    That does not seem sustainable to me. As the guy said, people start rushing around when the order comes in. People starting to rush around costs money.
    Lad on bycycle is 5 mins away from you at Sainsburys. He spends 5 mins in store, 5 mins cycling to you, 5 mins back. For £1.80.

    If he's operating solidly on this basis all night, that's £7.20 an hour. Before any costs.

    It's kind of the investors to fund your wine ordering habits like this, but the idea that this sort of thing is in any way sustainable at this sort of rate is for the birds. I doubt its profitable at £5 a delivery.
    Urban Fetch did it first in 1999 / 2000. It burned through quite a lot of money in its 18 month life.
  • theProletheProle Posts: 553

    Aslan said:

    Apparently the suspect went on a deradicalisation course.

    image

    No deradicalising course can work as long as they go on believing the Koran is the literal word of God. Because the extremists they are in touch with can just point them back to the relevant passages.
    Do you have data for this? Because there are millions of people in the world who believe the Koran is the literal word of God and also have the internet so presumably they're exposed to people pointing out the relevant passages, but they don't go around stabbing people.

    Religion is very weird and disassociative, for instance the Christian texts are extremely clear that believers need to sell all their stuff and give the money to the poor, but there are millions of believers who apparently take the texts very seriously, yet never once do that, even though they would only have to take what they claim to believe seriously for a couple of minutes to do it. So it's not implausible the right intervention can increase the probability that someone acts on the non-homicidal part of their chosen book of holy stupid bullshit, while avoiding the homicidal parts.
    The idea that all Christians are commanded to sell everything and give the proceeds to the poor isn't supported by anything more than a very casual (mis)reading of passages where specific people are given that sort of instruction. The classic case is the rich young ruler who comes to Christ and asks him what he needs to do to be saved. (Mark 10 v17-31). He thinks he's perfect - and so he's told to sell everything, not because that's necessary to follow Christ, but to reveal he actually cares more about his wealth than following the God he apparently "loves with all his heart, mind and strength".

    In Acts, some believers sold their possessions and held everything in common, but that clearly wasn't universal - Ananias and Sapphira sin and die in Acts 5 because they sell land and supposedly give the money over in this way - but actually hold a lot of money back. Its made very clear that they were free to have not sold the land - their sin is lying to Peter that they were giving over all the money.

    It's fairly clear in some of the letters that many New Testament Christians retained property - even in one case (Philemon) the owner of a slave who runs away.

    This isn't to say that many western Christians today aren't far too materialistic, but it's very unfair to say that any Christian who hasn't sold everything and given it away to the poor is ignoring some sort of biblical instruction.

  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,606
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    There is a model that makes sense - but I doubt it involves just a £2/fee per delivery.

    Let's be optimistic, and say that a cyclist can make four deliveries an hour. Let's pay him £10/hour. That means that just the labour cost of delivery is £2.50. And that's before any other costs whatsoever.

    Now, it may be possible with a sufficiently dense network, electric bikes, and multiple stops per trip, to get up to six deliveries an hour (although that seems hellafast to me). That's still a delivery labour component of around £1.70-80. Based on some very aggressive assumptions.

    Now. Can it be made to work? Yes, probably. But you need to spend a *lot* of money on hyperlocal distribution centres, and you need to charge decent markups on everything. (I.e. retail margins 15% above your local corner store plus a £2.50 charge.)
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 15,624
    theProle said:

    Aslan said:

    Apparently the suspect went on a deradicalisation course.

    image

    No deradicalising course can work as long as they go on believing the Koran is the literal word of God. Because the extremists they are in touch with can just point them back to the relevant passages.
    Do you have data for this? Because there are millions of people in the world who believe the Koran is the literal word of God and also have the internet so presumably they're exposed to people pointing out the relevant passages, but they don't go around stabbing people.

    Religion is very weird and disassociative, for instance the Christian texts are extremely clear that believers need to sell all their stuff and give the money to the poor, but there are millions of believers who apparently take the texts very seriously, yet never once do that, even though they would only have to take what they claim to believe seriously for a couple of minutes to do it. So it's not implausible the right intervention can increase the probability that someone acts on the non-homicidal part of their chosen book of holy stupid bullshit, while avoiding the homicidal parts.
    The idea that all Christians are commanded to sell everything and give the proceeds to the poor isn't supported by anything more than a very casual (mis)reading of passages where specific people are given that sort of instruction. The classic case is the rich young ruler who comes to Christ and asks him what he needs to do to be saved. (Mark 10 v17-31). He thinks he's perfect - and so he's told to sell everything, not because that's necessary to follow Christ, but to reveal he actually cares more about his wealth than following the God he apparently "loves with all his heart, mind and strength".

    In Acts, some believers sold their possessions and held everything in common, but that clearly wasn't universal - Ananias and Sapphira sin and die in Acts 5 because they sell land and supposedly give the money over in this way - but actually hold a lot of money back. Its made very clear that they were free to have not sold the land - their sin is lying to Peter that they were giving over all the money.

    It's fairly clear in some of the letters that many New Testament Christians retained property - even in one case (Philemon) the owner of a slave who runs away.

    This isn't to say that many western Christians today aren't far too materialistic, but it's very unfair to say that any Christian who hasn't sold everything and given it away to the poor is ignoring some sort of biblical instruction.

    So this is the other part of what deradicalization can do, ie if the scripture says "Go stab the member of parliament for Southend West, your wise-looking bearded guy can say, "this was an instruction the prophet gave to this particular follower, because he knew that he was greatly attached to the member of parliament for Southend West and could not devote his life to Allah until he had stabbed him, but it is not a general commandment on all Muslims to stab the member of parliament for Southend West".
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,606
    MrEd said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Make the most of it. These services will close when the runway money runs out.
    Will they?

    They are sustainable - they use bicycles. They have darkstores across London, ready to go

    I asked my bicycle guy how come it was so fast. He said "as soon we get your order people start rushing around in Kentish Town, fulfilling your order, and that means we can get it to you in ten minutes, as we promise"

    It would be interesting to see how they cope with an order of 30 items rather than 1. Can they do this in 10 minutes? But who knows. Maybe they can

    They are apparently German, and they also have vigorous competitors, already

    I don't see why their model should fail, it does not have the intrinsic flaws of Uber. And the convenience is insane. You've forgotten a few items from your shop, and you're about to cook? Don't go back to the supermarket, use Gorillas, it will be there in 10 minutes. Ditto late night groceries
    I assume your original message should read £1.80 delivery.

    That does not seem sustainable to me. As the guy said, people start rushing around when the order comes in. People starting to rush around costs money.
    It’s a massive land grab. All the players know it is unsustainable, the aim is to be amongst the biggest, force the weaker players to exit and then grow margins over the long term. That’s the theory.
    Of course.

    There were a dozen Uber-type businesses - some sold to Uber/Lyft, some closed down, and Uber was Uber...

    The question is whether there is a sustainable business model at the end of it, with positive unit economics. And the answer to that is maybe.

    As far as I can tell, you need a lot more infrastructure and capital than Uber, and therefore your cash burn will be horrendous. Even once you reach scale, you'll also be pretty low margin: ultimately, people will pay £10 to £100 of groceries delivered (and where drivers don't have to return to the depot between deliveries). But will they be prepared to pay £4 to get a £10 bottle of wine delivered? Maybe. I can certainly see it working in Manhattan and Camden and Chelsea. But I struggle to see it working once the population density thins out.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,606
    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    The thing is that going to Tesco Metro and back is 25 minutes of your time. That's 25 minutes of labour that you were previously expending, that someone else will have to to do, and they will have to be appropriately compensated.
  • AslanAslan Posts: 734
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    The thing is that going to Tesco Metro and back is 25 minutes of your time. That's 25 minutes of labour that you were previously expending, that someone else will have to to do, and they will have to be appropriately compensated.
    Not if they are delivering to a bunch of other people on the same route.
  • AslanAslan Posts: 734

    Aslan said:

    Apparently the suspect went on a deradicalisation course.

    image

    No deradicalising course can work as long as they go on believing the Koran is the literal word of God. Because the extremists they are in touch with can just point them back to the relevant passages.
    Do you have data for this? Because there are millions of people in the world who believe the Koran is the literal word of God and also have the internet so presumably they're exposed to people pointing out the relevant passages, but they don't go around stabbing people.

    Religion is very weird and disassociative, for instance the Christian texts are extremely clear that believers need to sell all their stuff and give the money to the poor, but there are millions of believers who apparently take the texts very seriously, yet never once do that, even though they would only have to take what they claim to believe seriously for a couple of minutes to do it. So it's not implausible the right intervention can increase the probability that someone acts on the non-homicidal part of their chosen book of holy stupid bullshit, while avoiding the homicidal parts.
    The difference is of course that the people that have to attend deradicalization courses are in contact with people who are good at pointing out the violent parts of their scripture. And once you accept the Koran is the word of God, the extremist view is not an unreasonable interpretation. It isn't the only reasonable interpretation, but it is certainly as plausible as the stretch one that says "this violent warmongering and slave taking is only ok when endorsed by a legitimate Muslim shariah government". The reason the vast majority of Muslims don't consider this is view is that most of them don't identify with being devout followers of scripture and probably aren't even aware of the dark passages.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,606
    Aslan said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    That's amazing. You can easily wait longer than that at a bar.
    I am surrounded by decent or very good shops that open late. Within 5-7 minutes walk of me there is a Co-op, a Tesco Extra, a Whole Foods, M&S Foods, and an Aldi. Within 10 minutes walk is a big Sainsburys and a very big Morrisons

    Even on a Sunday the Co=op and Whole Foods are open until 9 or 11pm. And there are dodgy tiny stores which sell basic stuff 24/7/356, on my streetcorners

    Yet none of them can match the convenience of this. I can order a rather decent bottle of red at 10pm on Sunday and it is here in 9 minutes? Even if Tesco Extra is open this late on Sunday AND it has that nice red it would take me 25 minutes to complete the process of walking down, finding it, buying it, coming back

    It is quite revolutionary IF IT IS SUSTAINABLE
    The thing is that going to Tesco Metro and back is 25 minutes of your time. That's 25 minutes of labour that you were previously expending, that someone else will have to to do, and they will have to be appropriately compensated.
    Not if they are delivering to a bunch of other people on the same route.
    Good luck with 15 minute deliveries and more than two delivery locations per trip.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 10,757
    Deliveroo charges me £13.25 for the same medium cod and chips that costs £9.90 in-store so that is their mark-up. On top of that is a service charge of £1.65 and a delivery charge of £1.49 (which in fact I do not pay as a subscriber) for a one mile trip.

    As an aside, I've just looked at their site now that most eateries are closed and highlighted are several alcohol delivery services.
This discussion has been closed.