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My last bet was stupid – Win or lose – politicalbetting.com

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  • AslanAslan Posts: 922
    kinabalu said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    .

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    If you think either the A40 or the M40 go anywhere near Cambridge (or even in its direction) then your geographic knowledge is… what I would expect from someone who had to settle for Cambridge.
    Reread what I wrote, it is accurate.

    The A40 comes out of Oxford if you want to come out of Oxford and go towards Cambridge.

    The same way I have to take the M67 out of Manchester when I drive to Sheffield even if most of my journey is on the A57, A616, and A628.
    If you are heading north then you use the A34.
    Google route planner goes my way, via the A40.

    I am right as always.


    Interesting: on Google maps the A34 route is both the fastest and the shortest. Your route takes ten minutes more than it does on your version.

    I wonder why different versions of Google produce different results?
    Apple gives 2 & 1/2 hours via the A421.
    *Opens PB*

    *Sees detailed discussion of how different online maps route Oxford to Cambridge*

    *Closes PB*
    Keep your energy and focus for tomorrow.

    Tomorrow afternoon’s thread is about Scottish independence.
    Irrelevant as long as we have a Tory government as it will refuse indyref2 and Sturgeon has ruled out UDI
    Not according to ScreamingEagles. Apparently Dominic Cummings is going to fell PM Johnson and install PM Gove as his replacement; and then Gove is going to concede IndyRef2.

    You read it here first.
    Wrong, even Gove has made clear there will be no indyref2 allowed before the next general election and he will be long retired before one is

    https://www.scotsman.com/news/uk-news/indyref2-michael-gove-says-boris-johnson-will-not-grant-referendum-on-scottish-independence-before-next-general-election-3283019

    https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/politics/uk-politics/3326218/michael-gove-ill-be-enjoying-my-retirement-before-indyref2/
    Gove also ruled out running for Tory leader, then ran for Tory leader the next month, and three years later as well.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/05/06/michael-gove-rules-out-running-for-tory-leader-and-says-his-frie/

    Gove also ruled out vaxports then well you know the rest

    https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-michael-gove-rules-out-vaccine-passports-for-pub-theatre-and-sport-stadium-visits-12147819
    Gove also failed to become Tory leader coming 3rd and has near zero chance of becoming Tory leader now.

    There will never be an indyref2 allowed while we have a Tory government
    Yes FUDHY, we know what *you* think. But last I heard there were in fact other strands of thought within your political party.
    There aren't, we will just say No and anyone who wants a chance of becoming Tory leader will also have to say No.

    The most important task of any Tory PM for the foreseeable future is saying no to indyref2
    You're out of synch with that poll the other day when it was furriners that were the biggest worry of Tory voters. Unless you accept that Scots are already furriners?
    That poll presents a thorny problem. OTOH, whilst a concern about immigration is in no way indicative of racism, having it as your NUMBER ONE concern (esp now Brexit is done) quite possibly is. BOTOH, one doesn't want to think that a large proportion of Tory voters are racist. What to do?
    If it is possible to have concerns about immigration on non-racist grounds, it is possible for those biggest concerns to be about immigration on non-racist grounds. Especially when immigration is running close to all time highs. But of course left wingers just can't help themselves in accusing those who disagree with them in being racist. It makes them feel better about themselves when they keep losing elections. You might be out of power but at least you are morally superior. Of course, they never stop to think how this attitude might be playing a major part in why they lose elections. Or if they do occasionally stumble across this truth in a moment of clarity, they quickly dust themselves off and keep on walking.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 68,333
    edited July 2021
    BBC still f##king wittering....can I just see the live athletics please...anytime...no rush...

    Jesus christ, they now missed the 100m heats....CJ Ujah has qualified apparently, not that we saw it on the BBC, too busy talking, then going to the news, then back to more talking.

    Literally WTF are they playing at.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 34,991

    kinabalu said:

    I wonder if the ennobled bloater has been similarly critical of Priti’s dropped ‘g’s?

    https://twitter.com/grumpy_uncle/status/1421345806804787200?s=21

    Interesting tweet. Not the content but that he did it. It's telling the world he's the sort of chap who is extremely irritated by this sort of thing. It's a public statement of who and what he is. He's Lord Digby Jones and very comfortable with this.
    I came across Digby Jones in a professional capacity a few years back. Suffice to say he was the most obnoxious, repulsive person I ever came across through work, and there was some stiff competition.
    I’m slightly ashamed to admit that I use Desert Island Discs as a measure of character, though eight fave records and a book isn’t bad evidence. it does throw you curveballs (Tim Martin, excellent musical taste, Judy Murray, anodyne pish).
    Digby’s choices were exactly what I’d expect of a culture free, vacuous bag of wind.
    TUD , you compliment him with that very favourable description , he is way worse than that.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 3,855
    I see some great political analysis and debate is going on at the moment over whether Jacob Rees Mogg is thick. Or a twat?

    Come on guys this site used to be better than this
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 46,287
    "How on earth did this Government allow itself to be outflanked by Labour on full reopening, and outflanked by a less vaccinated Europe in taking full economic advantage of vaccination protection?

    They have thrown away their own success."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2021/07/30/refuse-imprisoned-incompetent-government-invoking-bogus-science/
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 21,225
    edited July 2021

    BBC still f##king wittering....can I just see the 100m heats please...

    They missed CJ Ujah qualify from his heat.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 39,105

    I see some great political analysis and debate is going on at the moment over whether Jacob Rees Mogg is thick. Or a twat?

    Come on guys this site used to be better than this

    He speaks like a twat! His sister, who, presumably, was brought up in the same household, speaks with a much more "normal" accent!
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 17,848



    I can say things in French. But if I ask a question and receive a reply, usually I have no idea what the other person has said.

    We should just teach kids how to order a coffee, order a beer and say 'I love you' in a dozen languages and settle for that.

    My father said wryly that he learned French for 6 years at Winchester, and then took a trip to Paris;he found he was unable to ask the inspector when they would arrive.

    He took corrective action - stayed with a family in the Loire valley for a year and fell in love with France forever, and became a professional translator. But he did wish his school had given him a better start.

    One trend that seems to me wholly positive is universities having campuses in other countries. In Nottingham, you can do a course involving 2 years in Nottingham and 1 year in Ningbo, China, while Chinese students can do the reverse. Everyone I met who had done it thought it was fantastic, both as preparation for life but also just as fun.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 92,816
    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    I wonder if the ennobled bloater has been similarly critical of Priti’s dropped ‘g’s?

    https://twitter.com/grumpy_uncle/status/1421345806804787200?s=21

    Interesting tweet. Not the content but that he did it. It's telling the world he's the sort of chap who is extremely irritated by this sort of thing. It's a public statement of who and what he is. He's Lord Digby Jones and very comfortable with this.
    Don’t most people get annoyed by the way some others speak/pronounce words? Priti Patel gets a lot of stick for the exact same thing, from people who are now sticking up for Alex Scott! Posh people get mocked for their pronounciations by working class types, I don’t see it as a punching down thing
    When posh accents are being mocked it is their accent and poshness being mocked.
    When working class accents of politicians are being mocked, it is often mixed with an attack on their intellect and/or education.
    Posh but dim gets mocked as well...Tim nice but dim being a long running character from Harry Enfield.
    There are a lot of over promoted Tim nice but dims in middle management, not sure about in front line politics though. I think Tim nice but dims are actually very clever at maximising their career if helped too much by the system.
    Jacob Ress Mogg.....and he gets loads of stick.
    He is certainly both posh and a twat, but not sure anyone thinks he is dim?
    JRM has a history degree from Trinity College Oxford and a net worth of £150 million, he is certainly not dim
    I have a history degree from Trinity College Oxford and so am well placed to tell you that it’s no marker of intelligence. I’m as thick as mince, As for the £150m…
    If you have an Oxford degree you are likely to be more intelligent than the average man in the street and no you do not have £150 m either
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 68,333
    edited July 2021
    tlg86 said:

    BBC still f##king wittering....can I just see the 100m heats please...

    They missed CJ Ujah win his heat.
    Can you imagine BT Sport or Sky Sports saying here is the quarterfinals of the Champions League, we will get to the game in a minute, but we are going to have a chat for 30 mins first, then take the news, then some more chatting, oh we missed the first half of the game, nevermind, we will show it later.

    What a shit show.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 3,855

    I see some great political analysis and debate is going on at the moment over whether Jacob Rees Mogg is thick. Or a twat?

    Come on guys this site used to be better than this

    He speaks like a twat! His sister, who, presumably, was brought up in the same household, speaks with a much more "normal" accent!
    Right - great insight.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 92,816
    edited July 2021

    I see some great political analysis and debate is going on at the moment over whether Jacob Rees Mogg is thick. Or a twat?

    Come on guys this site used to be better than this

    Leftwingers and Remainers tend to hate him but the vast majority of Tories love the Mogg.

    He is as popular with Tory members as Corbyn was with Labour members
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 34,991
    HYUFD said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    I wonder if the ennobled bloater has been similarly critical of Priti’s dropped ‘g’s?

    https://twitter.com/grumpy_uncle/status/1421345806804787200?s=21

    Interesting tweet. Not the content but that he did it. It's telling the world he's the sort of chap who is extremely irritated by this sort of thing. It's a public statement of who and what he is. He's Lord Digby Jones and very comfortable with this.
    Don’t most people get annoyed by the way some others speak/pronounce words? Priti Patel gets a lot of stick for the exact same thing, from people who are now sticking up for Alex Scott! Posh people get mocked for their pronounciations by working class types, I don’t see it as a punching down thing
    When posh accents are being mocked it is their accent and poshness being mocked.
    When working class accents of politicians are being mocked, it is often mixed with an attack on their intellect and/or education.
    Posh but dim gets mocked as well...Tim nice but dim being a long running character from Harry Enfield.
    There are a lot of over promoted Tim nice but dims in middle management, not sure about in front line politics though. I think Tim nice but dims are actually very clever at maximising their career if helped too much by the system.
    Jacob Ress Mogg.....and he gets loads of stick.
    He is certainly both posh and a twat, but not sure anyone thinks he is dim?
    JRM has a history degree from Trinity College Oxford and a net worth of £150 million, he is certainly not dim
    The toffs get degrees from Oxford just for turning up once or twice, endowments are everything. When you start with a silver spoon in your mouth and work in the Tory laundry , making money is very easy.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 4,634
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tres said:

    HYUFD said:

    Gavin Williamson thinks teaching Latin will improve maths and modern foreign language learning (and by coincidence, Boris is a keen classicist so that would be a reason to keep Williamson on).

    Latin will be taught in state schools to end its ‘elitist’ status
    Officials believe subject will help pupils learn modern foreign languages and could bring improvements in English and maths

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/07/30/latin-will-taught-state-schools-end-elitist-status/ (£££)

    Excellent, restoring a subject of intellectual rigour and which is the foundation for most European languages
    Actually teaching modern foreign languages would be of more benefit. Typical Tory party obsessed with looking backwards rather than forwards.
    It already is taught, modern foreign languages are compulsory to 14
    It's in the national curriculum, sure.

    But academies and free schools don't have to teach the NC, which makes that a bit moot;

    https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-7388/CBP-7388.pdf
    It is part of the EBacc though, alongside English, Maths, Science and History or Geography
    True, though the government's attempts to make EBacc a standard offering have hit something of a wall. Very roughly, there's a tension between EBacc and Progress 8, because grades in GCSE languages tend to come out a bit lower than in other subjects. So for academically marginal pupils, it's tactically better for them to drop MFL (or never really start them) and do more of something else where they will get a higher grade.
  • AslanAslan Posts: 922
    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    I wonder if the ennobled bloater has been similarly critical of Priti’s dropped ‘g’s?

    https://twitter.com/grumpy_uncle/status/1421345806804787200?s=21

    Interesting tweet. Not the content but that he did it. It's telling the world he's the sort of chap who is extremely irritated by this sort of thing. It's a public statement of who and what he is. He's Lord Digby Jones and very comfortable with this.
    Don’t most people get annoyed by the way some others speak/pronounce words? Priti Patel gets a lot of stick for the exact same thing, from people who are now sticking up for Alex Scott! Posh people get mocked for their pronounciations by working class types, I don’t see it as a punching down thing
    When posh accents are being mocked it is their accent and poshness being mocked.
    When working class accents of politicians are being mocked, it is often mixed with an attack on their intellect and/or education.
    That's right imo. It depends on the context but the 'punching up vs down' point is often relevant when discussing the mocking or dissing of dominant groups.
    Or maybe people are individuals and should be treated as such, regardless of their broader group.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 21,225
    The Scottish girl in the 800m looked decent. Maybe an outside chance of a medal.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 68,333
    Doubt there is going to be any Team GB in the final of the 100m.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 11,338
    edited July 2021
    HYUFD said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    I wonder if the ennobled bloater has been similarly critical of Priti’s dropped ‘g’s?

    https://twitter.com/grumpy_uncle/status/1421345806804787200?s=21

    Interesting tweet. Not the content but that he did it. It's telling the world he's the sort of chap who is extremely irritated by this sort of thing. It's a public statement of who and what he is. He's Lord Digby Jones and very comfortable with this.
    Don’t most people get annoyed by the way some others speak/pronounce words? Priti Patel gets a lot of stick for the exact same thing, from people who are now sticking up for Alex Scott! Posh people get mocked for their pronounciations by working class types, I don’t see it as a punching down thing
    When posh accents are being mocked it is their accent and poshness being mocked.
    When working class accents of politicians are being mocked, it is often mixed with an attack on their intellect and/or education.
    Posh but dim gets mocked as well...Tim nice but dim being a long running character from Harry Enfield.
    There are a lot of over promoted Tim nice but dims in middle management, not sure about in front line politics though. I think Tim nice but dims are actually very clever at maximising their career if helped too much by the system.
    Jacob Ress Mogg.....and he gets loads of stick.
    He is certainly both posh and a twat, but not sure anyone thinks he is dim?
    JRM has a history degree from Trinity College Oxford and a net worth of £150 million, he is certainly not dim
    One vaguely amusing fact about JRM is he got his break into finance literally because his father knew Lloyd George. (William RM was a friend of the chap who ran Lloyd George Management which hired Jacob.)

    ETA now I'm going to have that song in my head for the rest of the day.

  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 6,947

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    The A40/M40 goes to Cambridge? I think you meant the M11!
    Does the M11 come out directly from Oxford?

    It didn't when I was a student.
    You wrote: "Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge"

    The A40/M40 route goes from London towards Oxford, NOT Cambridge.
    Read the rest of the sentence you incel virgin.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford
    The A40/M40 does not go TOWARDS Cambridge, you Northern twit! It goes towards LONDON!
    It’s debate of this quality that keeps me coming back to PB. There’s been nothing like it since Socrates.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 34,991

    I see some great political analysis and debate is going on at the moment over whether Jacob Rees Mogg is thick. Or a twat?

    Come on guys this site used to be better than this

    He fits easily in both corners as well, an absolute thick twat posho.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 8,184



    I can say things in French. But if I ask a question and receive a reply, usually I have no idea what the other person has said.

    We should just teach kids how to order a coffee, order a beer and say 'I love you' in a dozen languages and settle for that.

    My father said wryly that he learned French for 6 years at Winchester, and then took a trip to Paris;he found he was unable to ask the inspector when they would arrive.


    I was educated in French only until I was 12 and couldn't really write English at that age. When I got to English speaking schools in the US and UK I was amazed at how little grammar was taught compared to my Francophone education.

    Now that I'm a language tutor I see the same situation among British students. Teaching Latin would help slightly as they would be exposed to grammatical concepts like declension. There is almost no declension in English but it's very important in other languages. I regularly see anglophone students struggle with it in Russian.

    It could be fixed much more effectively by teaching Linguistics rather than Latin but that would not stimulate the desiccated G spots of Telegraph readers with type 2 diabetes in the same way so the tories won't do it.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 12,520
    edited July 2021

    I see some great political analysis and debate is going on at the moment over whether Jacob Rees Mogg is thick. Or a twat?

    Come on guys this site used to be better than this

    No-one has suggested JRM is thick and he clearly is not. The discussion is whether his accent has led to others to label him as thick. I concur that there is no point debating whether he is a twat, that is a given, and no-one has attempted to put up a defence.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 33,346

    Doubt there is going to be any Team GB in the final of the 100m.

    Possibly Zharnel Hughes, he looked like he still has something in the tank.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Tres said:

    HYUFD said:

    Gavin Williamson thinks teaching Latin will improve maths and modern foreign language learning (and by coincidence, Boris is a keen classicist so that would be a reason to keep Williamson on).

    Latin will be taught in state schools to end its ‘elitist’ status
    Officials believe subject will help pupils learn modern foreign languages and could bring improvements in English and maths

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/07/30/latin-will-taught-state-schools-end-elitist-status/ (£££)

    Excellent, restoring a subject of intellectual rigour and which is the foundation for most European languages
    Actually teaching modern foreign languages would be of more benefit. Typical Tory party obsessed with looking backwards rather than forwards.
    That depends: teaching enough of a modern language to be any good takes a lot of time and effort. How many people with a GCSE or O-level language qualification can actually hold a conversation with someone in that language? A small bit of Latin or even Greek can be useful in helping to understand quite a lot of technical vocabulary.
    I can say things in French. But if I ask a question and receive a reply, usually I have no idea what the other person has said.

    We should just teach kids how to order a coffee, order a beer and say 'I love you' in a dozen languages and settle for that.
    The mindset that sees “settling” and “just” as acceptable when it comes to education is rather disappointing
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 1,575
    malcolmg said:

    pigeon said:

    If we excluded any sport that involves water from Team GB medal haul it would be a disastrous Olympics.

    Triathlon (only partially water-based, so not too much of a cheat) has done very well. Boxing (four guaranteed medals and counting) is having a good games. Taekwondo (three medals from five entrants) delivered. There's been success on bikes. The horsey team has a couple of bronzes already and those events are always unpredictable. The individual competitions in gymnastics are yet to come. Golf might come good.

    All that said, especially with the athletics looking poor, much depends on the velodrome. If track cycling undergoes an implosion similar to rowing then the overall performance will probably be towards the bottom end of expectations. If it holds up well things should be better. But in medal table terms this is probably a competition for fifth place with the Australians, and an overall finish in that ballpark would still be very credible.
    Most of the winners will have had to scrimp and scrape for funds or paid it themselves. All the effete overpaid hooray Henry's that got splurged with funding are doing square root of F all and then whine and whinge about all the reasons why it was down to being bullied , pronouns wokism , etc.
    That's uncharitable. There are some sports that have done poorly or look like they will that have had a lot of cash thrown at them, but others that have done well or look like they will that have benefitted, too.

    Of the top five recipients of lottery funding, swimming has done well and sailing looks likely to do so; rowing has done badly and athletics doesn't look too hopeful at the moment; and the jury's out on cycling (good on the chunky tyre events, nothing on the road, track hasn't started yet.)

    Beth Shriever is the exception not the rule.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 68,333
    MaxPB said:

    Doubt there is going to be any Team GB in the final of the 100m.

    Possibly Zharnel Hughes, he looked like he still has something in the tank.
    We will probably have to wait until an hour after the semi finals are actually run to find out on the BBC...
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 38,790
    Dura_Ace said:

    It could be fixed much more effectively by teaching Linguistics rather than Latin but that would not stimulate the desiccated G spots of Telegraph readers with type 2 diabetes in the same way so the tories won't do it.

    I'm not sure that's true. Grammar needs to be hard-wired into the brain, and you can't do that just by teaching the theory.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 92,816
    edited July 2021

    Doubt there is going to be any Team GB in the final of the 100m.

    Well we have not had even a medal in the men's 100m since Linford Christie in 1992 so no change there
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    kle4 said:

    O/t but.
    According to a Sky newsflash on my phone a 'US electric vehicle maker, backed by Amazon and Ford, is in talks about building a giant factory in UK.'

    I don't think we have a shortage of giants, do we?
    Angel of the North, the bloke with his todger on the side of a hill, not thinking of many more.
    The Cerne Abbas Giant deserves more attention. It may not be an ancient monument, but it may even be better as a centuries old practical joke.
    I fell into Wikipedia and found that there's a giant George III cut into the side of a hill somewhere. Lose America, sabotage the Union with Ireland, and gain a massive chalk monument. Might be a more appealing precedent for Johnson than Lord North.

    Perhaps if the SNP youth wing offer to trade the creation of a massive monument of Johnson with his Johnson, in return for IndyRef 2, and it might happen?
    I think they would see him in rather different terms. Perhaps they'd agree to his semi(arf)-mythical tunnel to NI being named after him?


    That must be the first time Boris has ever been described as “pure”…

    He’ll be right chuffed!
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 21,940
    Aslan said:

    kinabalu said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    .

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    If you think either the A40 or the M40 go anywhere near Cambridge (or even in its direction) then your geographic knowledge is… what I would expect from someone who had to settle for Cambridge.
    Reread what I wrote, it is accurate.

    The A40 comes out of Oxford if you want to come out of Oxford and go towards Cambridge.

    The same way I have to take the M67 out of Manchester when I drive to Sheffield even if most of my journey is on the A57, A616, and A628.
    If you are heading north then you use the A34.
    Google route planner goes my way, via the A40.

    I am right as always.


    Interesting: on Google maps the A34 route is both the fastest and the shortest. Your route takes ten minutes more than it does on your version.

    I wonder why different versions of Google produce different results?
    Apple gives 2 & 1/2 hours via the A421.
    *Opens PB*

    *Sees detailed discussion of how different online maps route Oxford to Cambridge*

    *Closes PB*
    Keep your energy and focus for tomorrow.

    Tomorrow afternoon’s thread is about Scottish independence.
    Irrelevant as long as we have a Tory government as it will refuse indyref2 and Sturgeon has ruled out UDI
    Not according to ScreamingEagles. Apparently Dominic Cummings is going to fell PM Johnson and install PM Gove as his replacement; and then Gove is going to concede IndyRef2.

    You read it here first.
    Wrong, even Gove has made clear there will be no indyref2 allowed before the next general election and he will be long retired before one is

    https://www.scotsman.com/news/uk-news/indyref2-michael-gove-says-boris-johnson-will-not-grant-referendum-on-scottish-independence-before-next-general-election-3283019

    https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/politics/uk-politics/3326218/michael-gove-ill-be-enjoying-my-retirement-before-indyref2/
    Gove also ruled out running for Tory leader, then ran for Tory leader the next month, and three years later as well.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/05/06/michael-gove-rules-out-running-for-tory-leader-and-says-his-frie/

    Gove also ruled out vaxports then well you know the rest

    https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-michael-gove-rules-out-vaccine-passports-for-pub-theatre-and-sport-stadium-visits-12147819
    Gove also failed to become Tory leader coming 3rd and has near zero chance of becoming Tory leader now.

    There will never be an indyref2 allowed while we have a Tory government
    Yes FUDHY, we know what *you* think. But last I heard there were in fact other strands of thought within your political party.
    There aren't, we will just say No and anyone who wants a chance of becoming Tory leader will also have to say No.

    The most important task of any Tory PM for the foreseeable future is saying no to indyref2
    You're out of synch with that poll the other day when it was furriners that were the biggest worry of Tory voters. Unless you accept that Scots are already furriners?
    That poll presents a thorny problem. OTOH, whilst a concern about immigration is in no way indicative of racism, having it as your NUMBER ONE concern (esp now Brexit is done) quite possibly is. BOTOH, one doesn't want to think that a large proportion of Tory voters are racist. What to do?
    If it is possible to have concerns about immigration on non-racist grounds, it is possible for those biggest concerns to be about immigration on non-racist grounds. Especially when immigration is running close to all time highs. But of course left wingers just can't help themselves in accusing those who disagree with them in being racist. It makes them feel better about themselves when they keep losing elections. You might be out of power but at least you are morally superior. Of course, they never stop to think how this attitude might be playing a major part in why they lose elections. Or if they do occasionally stumble across this truth in a moment of clarity, they quickly dust themselves off and keep on walking.
    It is interesting to compare the reasoning for mass immigration with that advanced by the upper class in late 19th Cent Peru, where they imported a large number of Japanese workers....

    - They would work harder than the indolent Peruvian lower class
    - They would work for decent wages. Not those ridiculous inflated demands.
    - There was a shortage of labour. Mechanisation isn't possible.
    - They have a nice polite culture. Unlike the rough shits from the hills.

    Of course, once the Japanese were actually *in* Peru, the upper class treated them as replacement serfs....
  • AslanAslan Posts: 922
    DougSeal said:

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    The A40/M40 goes to Cambridge? I think you meant the M11!
    Does the M11 come out directly from Oxford?

    It didn't when I was a student.
    You wrote: "Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge"

    The A40/M40 route goes from London towards Oxford, NOT Cambridge.
    Read the rest of the sentence you incel virgin.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford
    The A40/M40 does not go TOWARDS Cambridge, you Northern twit! It goes towards LONDON!
    It’s debate of this quality that keeps me coming back to PB. There’s been nothing like it since Socrates.
    Was Socrates another one of Sean's aliases?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 92,816

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tres said:

    HYUFD said:

    Gavin Williamson thinks teaching Latin will improve maths and modern foreign language learning (and by coincidence, Boris is a keen classicist so that would be a reason to keep Williamson on).

    Latin will be taught in state schools to end its ‘elitist’ status
    Officials believe subject will help pupils learn modern foreign languages and could bring improvements in English and maths

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/07/30/latin-will-taught-state-schools-end-elitist-status/ (£££)

    Excellent, restoring a subject of intellectual rigour and which is the foundation for most European languages
    Actually teaching modern foreign languages would be of more benefit. Typical Tory party obsessed with looking backwards rather than forwards.
    It already is taught, modern foreign languages are compulsory to 14
    It's in the national curriculum, sure.

    But academies and free schools don't have to teach the NC, which makes that a bit moot;

    https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-7388/CBP-7388.pdf
    It is part of the EBacc though, alongside English, Maths, Science and History or Geography
    True, though the government's attempts to make EBacc a standard offering have hit something of a wall. Very roughly, there's a tension between EBacc and Progress 8, because grades in GCSE languages tend to come out a bit lower than in other subjects. So for academically marginal pupils, it's tactically better for them to drop MFL (or never really start them) and do more of something else where they will get a higher grade.
    EBacc scores have been added to league tables though which is something
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 12,520
    pigeon said:

    malcolmg said:

    pigeon said:

    If we excluded any sport that involves water from Team GB medal haul it would be a disastrous Olympics.

    Triathlon (only partially water-based, so not too much of a cheat) has done very well. Boxing (four guaranteed medals and counting) is having a good games. Taekwondo (three medals from five entrants) delivered. There's been success on bikes. The horsey team has a couple of bronzes already and those events are always unpredictable. The individual competitions in gymnastics are yet to come. Golf might come good.

    All that said, especially with the athletics looking poor, much depends on the velodrome. If track cycling undergoes an implosion similar to rowing then the overall performance will probably be towards the bottom end of expectations. If it holds up well things should be better. But in medal table terms this is probably a competition for fifth place with the Australians, and an overall finish in that ballpark would still be very credible.
    Most of the winners will have had to scrimp and scrape for funds or paid it themselves. All the effete overpaid hooray Henry's that got splurged with funding are doing square root of F all and then whine and whinge about all the reasons why it was down to being bullied , pronouns wokism , etc.
    That's uncharitable. There are some sports that have done poorly or look like they will that have had a lot of cash thrown at them, but others that have done well or look like they will that have benefitted, too.

    Of the top five recipients of lottery funding, swimming has done well and sailing looks likely to do so; rowing has done badly and athletics doesn't look too hopeful at the moment; and the jury's out on cycling (good on the chunky tyre events, nothing on the road, track hasn't started yet.)

    Beth Shriever is the exception not the rule.
    And Tom Pidcock! Not to mention Kye White.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 6,947
    Aslan said:

    DougSeal said:

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    The A40/M40 goes to Cambridge? I think you meant the M11!
    Does the M11 come out directly from Oxford?

    It didn't when I was a student.
    You wrote: "Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge"

    The A40/M40 route goes from London towards Oxford, NOT Cambridge.
    Read the rest of the sentence you incel virgin.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford
    The A40/M40 does not go TOWARDS Cambridge, you Northern twit! It goes towards LONDON!
    It’s debate of this quality that keeps me coming back to PB. There’s been nothing like it since Socrates.
    Was Socrates another one of Sean's aliases?
    We think so.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 33,346
    pigeon said:

    malcolmg said:

    pigeon said:

    If we excluded any sport that involves water from Team GB medal haul it would be a disastrous Olympics.

    Triathlon (only partially water-based, so not too much of a cheat) has done very well. Boxing (four guaranteed medals and counting) is having a good games. Taekwondo (three medals from five entrants) delivered. There's been success on bikes. The horsey team has a couple of bronzes already and those events are always unpredictable. The individual competitions in gymnastics are yet to come. Golf might come good.

    All that said, especially with the athletics looking poor, much depends on the velodrome. If track cycling undergoes an implosion similar to rowing then the overall performance will probably be towards the bottom end of expectations. If it holds up well things should be better. But in medal table terms this is probably a competition for fifth place with the Australians, and an overall finish in that ballpark would still be very credible.
    Most of the winners will have had to scrimp and scrape for funds or paid it themselves. All the effete overpaid hooray Henry's that got splurged with funding are doing square root of F all and then whine and whinge about all the reasons why it was down to being bullied , pronouns wokism , etc.
    That's uncharitable. There are some sports that have done poorly or look like they will that have had a lot of cash thrown at them, but others that have done well or look like they will that have benefitted, too.

    Of the top five recipients of lottery funding, swimming has done well and sailing looks likely to do so; rowing has done badly and athletics doesn't look too hopeful at the moment; and the jury's out on cycling (good on the chunky tyre events, nothing on the road, track hasn't started yet.)

    Beth Shriever is the exception not the rule.
    Even the latter was due to badly designed funding formula that doesn't take junior tournament performances into account. I think that's fixed for Paris so younger medal prospects in unfunded sports are able to get funding individually.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 68,333
    edited July 2021
    HYUFD said:

    Doubt there is going to be any Team GB in the final of the 100m.

    Well we have not had even a medal in the men's 100m since Linford Christie in 1992 so no change there
    A number of British 100m talent over the past 20 years has never managed to transition from being exceptional at junior level to senior.

    Mark Lewis-Francis, Harry Aikines-Aryeetey, CJ Ujah, and Gemilli runs 200m now
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    O/t but.
    According to a Sky newsflash on my phone a 'US electric vehicle maker, backed by Amazon and Ford, is in talks about building a giant factory in UK.'

    I don't think we have a shortage of giants, do we?
    Angel of the North, the bloke with his todger on the side of a hill, not thinking of many more.
    The Cerne Abbas Giant deserves more attention. It may not be an ancient monument, but it may even be better as a centuries old practical joke.
    I fell into Wikipedia and found that there's a giant George III cut into the side of a hill somewhere. Lose America, sabotage the Union with Ireland, and gain a massive chalk monument. Might be a more appealing precedent for Johnson than Lord North.

    Perhaps if the SNP youth wing offer to trade the creation of a massive monument of Johnson with his Johnson, in return for IndyRef 2, and it might happen?
    We beat Napoleon under George IIIrd and started to discover and colonise Australia and New Zealand and expanded our presence in India.

    The Union with Ireland also came about in George III's reign in 1801. So the British Empire really grew dramatically under him.

    Though as Hamilton showed he is equally still remembered for the loss of the American colonies

    Ireland had been an English colony since 1177, so longer than Wales. To say it joined the Union in 1801 is a little “creative”.
    It was upgraded to being an equal partner alongside Scotland and England
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 5,857

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    The A40/M40 goes to Cambridge? I think you meant the M11!
    Does the M11 come out directly from Oxford?

    It didn't when I was a student.
    You wrote: "Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge"

    The A40/M40 route goes from London towards Oxford, NOT Cambridge.
    Read the rest of the sentence you incel virgin.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford
    The A40/M40 does not go TOWARDS Cambridge, you Northern twit! It goes towards LONDON!
    At the point at which the A40 leaves Oxford, by the Thornhill Park and Ride, the road is heading in a direction North of East. The direction of Cambridge from Oxford is East of North-East.

    It seems reasonable to say that the A40 is heading towards Cambridge at the point at which it leaves Oxford.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 21,940
    Charles said:

    Tres said:

    HYUFD said:

    Gavin Williamson thinks teaching Latin will improve maths and modern foreign language learning (and by coincidence, Boris is a keen classicist so that would be a reason to keep Williamson on).

    Latin will be taught in state schools to end its ‘elitist’ status
    Officials believe subject will help pupils learn modern foreign languages and could bring improvements in English and maths

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/07/30/latin-will-taught-state-schools-end-elitist-status/ (£££)

    Excellent, restoring a subject of intellectual rigour and which is the foundation for most European languages
    Actually teaching modern foreign languages would be of more benefit. Typical Tory party obsessed with looking backwards rather than forwards.
    That depends: teaching enough of a modern language to be any good takes a lot of time and effort. How many people with a GCSE or O-level language qualification can actually hold a conversation with someone in that language? A small bit of Latin or even Greek can be useful in helping to understand quite a lot of technical vocabulary.
    I can say things in French. But if I ask a question and receive a reply, usually I have no idea what the other person has said.

    We should just teach kids how to order a coffee, order a beer and say 'I love you' in a dozen languages and settle for that.
    The mindset that sees “settling” and “just” as acceptable when it comes to education is rather disappointing
    A friend who meant through the very finest education*, suggested that he learnt the most on a gap year he took, travelling around Europe, working small jobs, to pay for wandering around museums by day and partying by night.

    He said that he learnt more Spanish, Italian etc faster by working as a waiter, chatting up the pretty girls and partying with them later, than multiple years of study. And far more of the culture, ancient and modern, of those countries.

    His thought was that a Grand Tour degree, in the old style, would be an interesting idea.

    *Ivy league followed by a PhD in the UK and several years research
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 17,057
    Surely they should do both. Latin and Ballroom.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    O/t but.
    According to a Sky newsflash on my phone a 'US electric vehicle maker, backed by Amazon and Ford, is in talks about building a giant factory in UK.'

    I don't think we have a shortage of giants, do we?
    Angel of the North, the bloke with his todger on the side of a hill, not thinking of many more.
    The Cerne Abbas Giant deserves more attention. It may not be an ancient monument, but it may even be better as a centuries old practical joke.
    I fell into Wikipedia and found that there's a giant George III cut into the side of a hill somewhere. Lose America, sabotage the Union with Ireland, and gain a massive chalk monument. Might be a more appealing precedent for Johnson than Lord North.

    Perhaps if the SNP youth wing offer to trade the creation of a massive monument of Johnson with his Johnson, in return for IndyRef 2, and it might happen?
    We beat Napoleon under George IIIrd and started to discover and colonise Australia and New Zealand and expanded our presence in India.

    The Union with Ireland also came about in George III's reign in 1801. So the British Empire really grew dramatically under him.

    Though as Hamilton showed he is equally still remembered for the loss of the American colonies
    He vetoed Catholic Emancipation and so doomed the Union with Ireland from the off.
    It was George IVth who was most adamantly anti Catholic Emancipation but Wellington, in a rare reformist move, managed to push it through.

    However remember there was still a lot of anti Catholic sentiment in George III's reign, the Gordon riots in London in 1780 and Presbyterian riots in Scotland in 1779 occurred because of the Relief Act of 1778 which allowed Roman Catholics to inherit property and own land. George was no different to the mood of his time and feared Catholic emancipation would violate his coronation oath.

    It also remains the fact the Union with Ireland, or at least southern Ireland, was lost in the reign of George Vth, it was George IIIrd 's PM Pitt who started the Irish Union in the first place

    George IVth? George Vth?

    I'm sorry you cannot abuse Roman numerals and the English language like that.
    Ayre, right, my favourite bar (before it closed, and not due to covid) was on George IVth Bridge in Edinburgh, of course not.

    And the union with Ireland was arguably lost in the reigns of Victoria Ith and Edward VIIth. George Vth just tidied up.
    I know your trolling… but Ith not Ist takes real creativity. Bravo!
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 30,825
    edited July 2021
    DougSeal said:

    Aslan said:

    DougSeal said:

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    The A40/M40 goes to Cambridge? I think you meant the M11!
    Does the M11 come out directly from Oxford?

    It didn't when I was a student.
    You wrote: "Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge"

    The A40/M40 route goes from London towards Oxford, NOT Cambridge.
    Read the rest of the sentence you incel virgin.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford
    The A40/M40 does not go TOWARDS Cambridge, you Northern twit! It goes towards LONDON!
    It’s debate of this quality that keeps me coming back to PB. There’s been nothing like it since Socrates.
    Was Socrates another one of Sean's aliases?
    We think so.
    There was actually a prolific poster on here called Socrates, dunno what happened to him. Think he predated the great multiple personality disorder explosion though.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 12,520
    tlg86 said:

    The Scottish girl in the 800m looked decent. Maybe an outside chance of a medal.

    Mu very impressive! Think one of the Brits gets the bronze.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    O/t but.
    According to a Sky newsflash on my phone a 'US electric vehicle maker, backed by Amazon and Ford, is in talks about building a giant factory in UK.'

    I don't think we have a shortage of giants, do we?
    Angel of the North, the bloke with his todger on the side of a hill, not thinking of many more.
    The Cerne Abbas Giant deserves more attention. It may not be an ancient monument, but it may even be better as a centuries old practical joke.
    I fell into Wikipedia and found that there's a giant George III cut into the side of a hill somewhere. Lose America, sabotage the Union with Ireland, and gain a massive chalk monument. Might be a more appealing precedent for Johnson than Lord North.

    Perhaps if the SNP youth wing offer to trade the creation of a massive monument of Johnson with his Johnson, in return for IndyRef 2, and it might happen?
    We beat Napoleon under George IIIrd and started to discover and colonise Australia and New Zealand and expanded our presence in India.

    The Union with Ireland also came about in George III's reign in 1801. So the British Empire really grew dramatically under him.

    Though as Hamilton showed he is equally still remembered for the loss of the American colonies

    Ireland had been an English colony since 1177, so longer than Wales. To say it joined the Union in 1801 is a little “creative”.
    It was Anglo-Norman Welsh Marcher Lords who were the first to go across to Ireland, so if they conquered Ireland for the English Crown then you can't argue they hadn't already done so for Wales.
    Our lot were Flemish mercenaries
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,056
    Dura_Ace said:



    I can say things in French. But if I ask a question and receive a reply, usually I have no idea what the other person has said.

    We should just teach kids how to order a coffee, order a beer and say 'I love you' in a dozen languages and settle for that.

    My father said wryly that he learned French for 6 years at Winchester, and then took a trip to Paris;he found he was unable to ask the inspector when they would arrive.


    I was educated in French only until I was 12 and couldn't really write English at that age. When I got to English speaking schools in the US and UK I was amazed at how little grammar was taught compared to my Francophone education.

    Now that I'm a language tutor I see the same situation among British students. Teaching Latin would help slightly as they would be exposed to grammatical concepts like declension. There is almost no declension in English but it's very important in other languages. I regularly see anglophone students struggle with it in Russian.

    It could be fixed much more effectively by teaching Linguistics rather than Latin but that would not stimulate the desiccated G spots of Telegraph readers with type 2 diabetes in the same way so the tories won't do it.
    The one thing that should be taught is a how to say "the bill please" in a wide number of languages.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 21,225

    tlg86 said:

    The Scottish girl in the 800m looked decent. Maybe an outside chance of a medal.

    Mu very impressive! Think one of the Brits gets the bronze.
    Hodgkinson ran a very mature race. A very bright future for that 19 year old.
  • TresTres Posts: 673

    HYUFD said:

    Doubt there is going to be any Team GB in the final of the 100m.

    Well we have not had even a medal in the men's 100m since Linford Christie in 1992 so no change there
    A number of British 100m talent over the past 20 years has never managed to transition from being exceptional at junior level to senior.

    Mark Lewis-Francis, Harry Aikines-Aryeetey, CJ Ujah, and Gemilli runs 200m now
    Darren Campbell medalled in the Worlds, but Olympic wise only won silver in the 200m and gold in the relay.
  • AslanAslan Posts: 922
    Charles said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    O/t but.
    According to a Sky newsflash on my phone a 'US electric vehicle maker, backed by Amazon and Ford, is in talks about building a giant factory in UK.'

    I don't think we have a shortage of giants, do we?
    Angel of the North, the bloke with his todger on the side of a hill, not thinking of many more.
    The Cerne Abbas Giant deserves more attention. It may not be an ancient monument, but it may even be better as a centuries old practical joke.
    I fell into Wikipedia and found that there's a giant George III cut into the side of a hill somewhere. Lose America, sabotage the Union with Ireland, and gain a massive chalk monument. Might be a more appealing precedent for Johnson than Lord North.

    Perhaps if the SNP youth wing offer to trade the creation of a massive monument of Johnson with his Johnson, in return for IndyRef 2, and it might happen?
    We beat Napoleon under George IIIrd and started to discover and colonise Australia and New Zealand and expanded our presence in India.

    The Union with Ireland also came about in George III's reign in 1801. So the British Empire really grew dramatically under him.

    Though as Hamilton showed he is equally still remembered for the loss of the American colonies

    Ireland had been an English colony since 1177, so longer than Wales. To say it joined the Union in 1801 is a little “creative”.
    It was upgraded to being an equal partner alongside Scotland and England
    That wasn't the case until at least Catholic Emancipation was passed. And the treatment of the place during the Famine shows it wasn't really an equal partner.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 12,520
    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    The Scottish girl in the 800m looked decent. Maybe an outside chance of a medal.

    Mu very impressive! Think one of the Brits gets the bronze.
    Hodgkinson ran a very mature race. A very bright future for that 19 year old.
    Not ideal that Mu is also 19 but yes, also very impressive.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 5,450

    One false start and you are out seem very unfair. Seems would be fairer allowed one false start throughout the competition.

    It might seem harsh but it has worked really well since brought in. It used to be tedious, with endless false starts. Now very few. There used to be some who would try to go early to get an advantage by getting lucky. Not any more...
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 39,105
    edited July 2021

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    The A40/M40 goes to Cambridge? I think you meant the M11!
    Does the M11 come out directly from Oxford?

    It didn't when I was a student.
    You wrote: "Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge"

    The A40/M40 route goes from London towards Oxford, NOT Cambridge.
    Read the rest of the sentence you incel virgin.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford
    The A40/M40 does not go TOWARDS Cambridge, you Northern twit! It goes towards LONDON!
    At the point at which the A40 leaves Oxford, by the Thornhill Park and Ride, the road is heading in a direction North of East. The direction of Cambridge from Oxford is East of North-East.

    It seems reasonable to say that the A40 is heading towards Cambridge at the point at which it leaves Oxford.
    Nah, it's more due east than anything near Thornhills!

    Google's preferred route from Cambridge to Oxford doesn't even go via Thornhills!
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 21,225
    Tres said:

    HYUFD said:

    Doubt there is going to be any Team GB in the final of the 100m.

    Well we have not had even a medal in the men's 100m since Linford Christie in 1992 so no change there
    A number of British 100m talent over the past 20 years has never managed to transition from being exceptional at junior level to senior.

    Mark Lewis-Francis, Harry Aikines-Aryeetey, CJ Ujah, and Gemilli runs 200m now
    Darren Campbell medalled in the Worlds, but Olympic wise only won silver in the 200m and gold in the relay.
    Campbell was beaten by that Greek who faked a motorcycle crash to dodge a drugs test.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 5,450

    Tres said:

    isam said:

    Thinking about FOM, and my view that it failed when countries that had nothing to entice British people to live there joined, couldn’t the EU have pumped money into projects that meant it was attractive to live in Romania or Bulgaria? I was thinking building/part funding luxury holiday resorts in the warm parts of their coasts and hoping British tourist would holiday there/the youngsters could work the season for instance

    For all my posts criticising it, FOM is a nice idea that could work if participating countries were able to offer something other than cheap Labour for rich corporations

    2008 killed the appetite for Brit/Irish investment in central/east Europe property. Before that things were moving quite rapidly in that direction.
    Also, a number of countries that started to acquire immigration of the retired are putting limits on this, around the world.

    New Zealand and Australia are the most conspicuous on this list, but a lot of other places have tried (and are trying) to avoid a large number of rich (relatively), elderly foreigners turning up and buying the place...

    On a train from Wellington to Auckland a few years ago I met several retired people who were spending 6 months in NZ and 6 in UK. TBH I thought about doing that, although Thailand, not NZ, for family reasons, although increasing age and decreasing mobility has put an end to that idea..
    This is where delta came from in the U.K. lots of Indian extraction spend the U.K. winter in India. When they returned, they did not come back empty handed...
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 6,947

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    The A40/M40 goes to Cambridge? I think you meant the M11!
    Does the M11 come out directly from Oxford?

    It didn't when I was a student.
    You wrote: "Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge"

    The A40/M40 route goes from London towards Oxford, NOT Cambridge.
    Read the rest of the sentence you incel virgin.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford
    The A40/M40 does not go TOWARDS Cambridge, you Northern twit! It goes towards LONDON!
    At the point at which the A40 leaves Oxford, by the Thornhill Park and Ride, the road is heading in a direction North of East. The direction of Cambridge from Oxford is East of North-East.

    It seems reasonable to say that the A40 is heading towards Cambridge at the point at which it leaves Oxford.
    Nah, it's more due east than anything near Thornhills!

    Google's preferred route from Cambridge to Oxford doesn't even go via Thornhills!
    Is this Oxford to Cambridge route discussion still a thing? If it were a human I’d shoot it in the face by now.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 17,582
    Charles said:

    kle4 said:

    O/t but.
    According to a Sky newsflash on my phone a 'US electric vehicle maker, backed by Amazon and Ford, is in talks about building a giant factory in UK.'

    I don't think we have a shortage of giants, do we?
    Angel of the North, the bloke with his todger on the side of a hill, not thinking of many more.
    The Cerne Abbas Giant deserves more attention. It may not be an ancient monument, but it may even be better as a centuries old practical joke.
    I fell into Wikipedia and found that there's a giant George III cut into the side of a hill somewhere. Lose America, sabotage the Union with Ireland, and gain a massive chalk monument. Might be a more appealing precedent for Johnson than Lord North.

    Perhaps if the SNP youth wing offer to trade the creation of a massive monument of Johnson with his Johnson, in return for IndyRef 2, and it might happen?
    I think they would see him in rather different terms. Perhaps they'd agree to his semi(arf)-mythical tunnel to NI being named after him?


    That must be the first time Boris has ever been described as “pure”…

    He’ll be right chuffed!
    I wouldn't be entirely confident if I were you, given at least one meaning of the word.

    https://www.vettimes.co.uk/app/uploads/wp-post-to-pdf-enhanced-cache/1/a-dirty-job-but-not-to-be-sniffed-at.pdf
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 21,225
    NEW THREAD
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 92,816
    edited July 2021

    Tres said:

    isam said:

    Thinking about FOM, and my view that it failed when countries that had nothing to entice British people to live there joined, couldn’t the EU have pumped money into projects that meant it was attractive to live in Romania or Bulgaria? I was thinking building/part funding luxury holiday resorts in the warm parts of their coasts and hoping British tourist would holiday there/the youngsters could work the season for instance

    For all my posts criticising it, FOM is a nice idea that could work if participating countries were able to offer something other than cheap Labour for rich corporations

    2008 killed the appetite for Brit/Irish investment in central/east Europe property. Before that things were moving quite rapidly in that direction.
    Also, a number of countries that started to acquire immigration of the retired are putting limits on this, around the world.

    New Zealand and Australia are the most conspicuous on this list, but a lot of other places have tried (and are trying) to avoid a large number of rich (relatively), elderly foreigners turning up and buying the place...

    On a train from Wellington to Auckland a few years ago I met several retired people who were spending 6 months in NZ and 6 in UK. TBH I thought about doing that, although Thailand, not NZ, for family reasons, although increasing age and decreasing mobility has put an end to that idea..
    This is where delta came from in the U.K. lots of Indian extraction spend the U.K. winter in India. When they returned, they did not come back empty handed...
    My cousin's husbands parents normally winter in India with family and summer on the Kent coast, although they have only just been allowed back because of Covid restrictions
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 17,582
    Charles said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    O/t but.
    According to a Sky newsflash on my phone a 'US electric vehicle maker, backed by Amazon and Ford, is in talks about building a giant factory in UK.'

    I don't think we have a shortage of giants, do we?
    Angel of the North, the bloke with his todger on the side of a hill, not thinking of many more.
    The Cerne Abbas Giant deserves more attention. It may not be an ancient monument, but it may even be better as a centuries old practical joke.
    I fell into Wikipedia and found that there's a giant George III cut into the side of a hill somewhere. Lose America, sabotage the Union with Ireland, and gain a massive chalk monument. Might be a more appealing precedent for Johnson than Lord North.

    Perhaps if the SNP youth wing offer to trade the creation of a massive monument of Johnson with his Johnson, in return for IndyRef 2, and it might happen?
    We beat Napoleon under George IIIrd and started to discover and colonise Australia and New Zealand and expanded our presence in India.

    The Union with Ireland also came about in George III's reign in 1801. So the British Empire really grew dramatically under him.

    Though as Hamilton showed he is equally still remembered for the loss of the American colonies
    He vetoed Catholic Emancipation and so doomed the Union with Ireland from the off.
    It was George IVth who was most adamantly anti Catholic Emancipation but Wellington, in a rare reformist move, managed to push it through.

    However remember there was still a lot of anti Catholic sentiment in George III's reign, the Gordon riots in London in 1780 and Presbyterian riots in Scotland in 1779 occurred because of the Relief Act of 1778 which allowed Roman Catholics to inherit property and own land. George was no different to the mood of his time and feared Catholic emancipation would violate his coronation oath.

    It also remains the fact the Union with Ireland, or at least southern Ireland, was lost in the reign of George Vth, it was George IIIrd 's PM Pitt who started the Irish Union in the first place

    George IVth? George Vth?

    I'm sorry you cannot abuse Roman numerals and the English language like that.
    Ayre, right, my favourite bar (before it closed, and not due to covid) was on George IVth Bridge in Edinburgh, of course not.

    And the union with Ireland was arguably lost in the reigns of Victoria Ith and Edward VIIth. George Vth just tidied up.
    I know your trolling… but Ith not Ist takes real creativity. Bravo!
    Not trolling re the second sentence! It was a serious point.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 21,211

    Superb from Sir Ed Davey this morning. Superb.

    The new battle lines in politics are shifting away from class vs class and towards liberty vs control.

    After more than a century in the political wilderness, could the liberals have found an issue on which to become really relevant and appealing to a big chunk of the electorate again?

    In the quiet of the Downing Street staircase, does the likeness of William Ewart Gladstone have a gleam in its eye?

    What has he said / done?


  • AslanAslan Posts: 922
    DougSeal said:

    Aslan said:

    DougSeal said:

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    The A40/M40 goes to Cambridge? I think you meant the M11!
    Does the M11 come out directly from Oxford?

    It didn't when I was a student.
    You wrote: "Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge"

    The A40/M40 route goes from London towards Oxford, NOT Cambridge.
    Read the rest of the sentence you incel virgin.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford
    The A40/M40 does not go TOWARDS Cambridge, you Northern twit! It goes towards LONDON!
    It’s debate of this quality that keeps me coming back to PB. There’s been nothing like it since Socrates.
    Was Socrates another one of Sean's aliases?
    We think so.
    Just how many times has the feller been banned?
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 1,575

    HYUFD said:

    Doubt there is going to be any Team GB in the final of the 100m.

    Well we have not had even a medal in the men's 100m since Linford Christie in 1992 so no change there
    A number of British 100m talent over the past 20 years has never managed to transition from being exceptional at junior level to senior.
    As I remarked earlier in this thread, all of the British sprint records for men were set in the 1990s.

    Beyond that, Britain's entire haul of men's Olympic golds in track and field athletics, in the 29 years and six Games that have elapsed since Linford Christie won in Barcelona, consists of Jonathan Edwards in Sydney, the 4x100m relay team in Athens, Greg Rutherford in London, and Mo Farah's double-double. Seven titles in three decades, four of which were the work of one bloke.

    Especially given the injury issues that have beset Dina Asher-Smith and KJT, the GB Athletics team as a whole is now pretty short of prospects (although the three finalists who've just qualified for the women's 800m offer some hope.) If they can get one medal then that would equal or surpass the solitary bronze that athletics came away with from Montreal in 1976. After that we'll see what else they can pull out of the bag.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 92,816
    edited July 2021
    Tres said:

    HYUFD said:

    Doubt there is going to be any Team GB in the final of the 100m.

    Well we have not had even a medal in the men's 100m since Linford Christie in 1992 so no change there
    A number of British 100m talent over the past 20 years has never managed to transition from being exceptional at junior level to senior.

    Mark Lewis-Francis, Harry Aikines-Aryeetey, CJ Ujah, and Gemilli runs 200m now
    Darren Campbell medalled in the Worlds, but Olympic wise only won silver in the 200m and gold in the relay.
    Dina Asher-Smith had a chance of gold in the women's 200m for GB pre injury.

    Laura Muir still has a chance in the 1500m and Holly Bradshaw in the pole vault
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 39,105

    This Thread has become a fastest loser

  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    HYUFD said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    I wonder if the ennobled bloater has been similarly critical of Priti’s dropped ‘g’s?

    https://twitter.com/grumpy_uncle/status/1421345806804787200?s=21

    Interesting tweet. Not the content but that he did it. It's telling the world he's the sort of chap who is extremely irritated by this sort of thing. It's a public statement of who and what he is. He's Lord Digby Jones and very comfortable with this.
    Don’t most people get annoyed by the way some others speak/pronounce words? Priti Patel gets a lot of stick for the exact same thing, from people who are now sticking up for Alex Scott! Posh people get mocked for their pronounciations by working class types, I don’t see it as a punching down thing
    When posh accents are being mocked it is their accent and poshness being mocked.
    When working class accents of politicians are being mocked, it is often mixed with an attack on their intellect and/or education.
    Posh but dim gets mocked as well...Tim nice but dim being a long running character from Harry Enfield.
    There are a lot of over promoted Tim nice but dims in middle management, not sure about in front line politics though. I think Tim nice but dims are actually very clever at maximising their career if helped too much by the system.
    Jacob Ress Mogg.....and he gets loads of stick.
    He is certainly both posh and a twat, but not sure anyone thinks he is dim?
    JRM has a history degree from Trinity College Oxford and a net worth of £150 million, he is certainly not dim
    According to wiki £55-150m including £45m of anticipated inheritance that his wife might receive when her mother passes away

    Somerset is a decent firm but not that big. There was a suggestion pre-Brexit that Rees-Mogg’s shares were worth £15m but the sales fell though. By 2027!he will only have 5% of the company
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 38,177

    I see some great political analysis and debate is going on at the moment over whether Jacob Rees Mogg is thick. Or a twat?

    Come on guys this site used to be better than this

    We certainly didn’t waste time debating things that were self evident, like that last.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 42,445

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    I wonder if the ennobled bloater has been similarly critical of Priti’s dropped ‘g’s?

    https://twitter.com/grumpy_uncle/status/1421345806804787200?s=21

    Interesting tweet. Not the content but that he did it. It's telling the world he's the sort of chap who is extremely irritated by this sort of thing. It's a public statement of who and what he is. He's Lord Digby Jones and very comfortable with this.
    I came across Digby Jones in a professional capacity a few years back. Suffice to say he was the most obnoxious, repulsive person I ever came across through work, and there was some stiff competition.
    That's good to know. I'd have been a bit flummoxed to hear otherwise. Likewise, a mate of mine has met Prince Andrew. Did he confound expectations? Nope, he very much did not.
    I've met Katie Hopkins in passing twice, and she was actually lovely.
    Did you read the surprisingly sympathetic Jon Ronson piece on her - https://www.theguardian.com/media/2015/jul/18/katie-hopkins-jon-ronson-interview ?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 28,708
    Dura_Ace said:



    I can say things in French. But if I ask a question and receive a reply, usually I have no idea what the other person has said.

    We should just teach kids how to order a coffee, order a beer and say 'I love you' in a dozen languages and settle for that.

    My father said wryly that he learned French for 6 years at Winchester, and then took a trip to Paris;he found he was unable to ask the inspector when they would arrive.


    I was educated in French only until I was 12 and couldn't really write English at that age. When I got to English speaking schools in the US and UK I was amazed at how little grammar was taught compared to my Francophone education.

    Now that I'm a language tutor I see the same situation among British students. Teaching Latin would help slightly as they would be exposed to grammatical concepts like declension. There is almost no declension in English but it's very important in other languages. I regularly see anglophone students struggle with it in Russian.

    It could be fixed much more effectively by teaching Linguistics rather than Latin but that would not stimulate the desiccated G spots of Telegraph readers with type 2 diabetes in the same way so the tories won't do it.
    I went to school in Atlanta for 5 years, from age 10. I had had very little English grammar taught at primary school, but it was certainly taught very intensively at Elementary school and High School in Georgia. Subject, object, indirect object, tenses, participle phrases, subjunctive clauses etc etc, and endless sentence analysis and sentence trees. I caught up quickly.

    Mind you coming back to O levels was a bit of a shock in other subjects, notably the sciences, languages and geography.

  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 42,445

    DougSeal said:

    Double Pfizered as of this morning. How long does it take for the superpowers to kick in?

    In a couple of days - it all depends on 5G coverage in your area. After a week you’ll have Bill Gates giving you instructions in your ear. After a month saying anything derogatory about Microsoft results in you pissing yourself.
    The main sign is when you have an overwhelming desire to buy a Zune player. When you are buying them once an hour on eBay, you're good.

    https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/8/16112330/guardians-of-the-galaxy-vol-2-zune-deleted-scene
    There is a very active Zune community on Reddit.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 70,010
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    O/t but.
    According to a Sky newsflash on my phone a 'US electric vehicle maker, backed by Amazon and Ford, is in talks about building a giant factory in UK.'

    I don't think we have a shortage of giants, do we?
    Angel of the North, the bloke with his todger on the side of a hill, not thinking of many more.
    The Cerne Abbas Giant deserves more attention. It may not be an ancient monument, but it may even be better as a centuries old practical joke.
    I fell into Wikipedia and found that there's a giant George III cut into the side of a hill somewhere. Lose America, sabotage the Union with Ireland, and gain a massive chalk monument. Might be a more appealing precedent for Johnson than Lord North.

    Perhaps if the SNP youth wing offer to trade the creation of a massive monument of Johnson with his Johnson, in return for IndyRef 2, and it might happen?
    We beat Napoleon under George IIIrd and started to discover and colonise Australia and New Zealand and expanded our presence in India.

    The Union with Ireland also came about in George III's reign in 1801. So the British Empire really grew dramatically under him.

    Though as Hamilton showed he is equally still remembered for the loss of the American colonies

    Ireland had been an English colony since 1177, so longer than Wales. To say it joined the Union in 1801 is a little “creative”.
    Now, now, you'll only upset the PBUnionists.
    No, that point was true. That's why there's no need to embellish details about other nations in the Union.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 70,010
    DougSeal said:

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    The A40/M40 goes to Cambridge? I think you meant the M11!
    Does the M11 come out directly from Oxford?

    It didn't when I was a student.
    You wrote: "Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge"

    The A40/M40 route goes from London towards Oxford, NOT Cambridge.
    Read the rest of the sentence you incel virgin.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford
    The A40/M40 does not go TOWARDS Cambridge, you Northern twit! It goes towards LONDON!
    At the point at which the A40 leaves Oxford, by the Thornhill Park and Ride, the road is heading in a direction North of East. The direction of Cambridge from Oxford is East of North-East.

    It seems reasonable to say that the A40 is heading towards Cambridge at the point at which it leaves Oxford.
    Nah, it's more due east than anything near Thornhills!

    Google's preferred route from Cambridge to Oxford doesn't even go via Thornhills!
    Is this Oxford to Cambridge route discussion still a thing? If it were a human I’d shoot it in the face by now.
    People get really invested in Oxford and Cambridge and assume everyone else must be too.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 5,857
    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    I wonder if the ennobled bloater has been similarly critical of Priti’s dropped ‘g’s?

    https://twitter.com/grumpy_uncle/status/1421345806804787200?s=21

    Interesting tweet. Not the content but that he did it. It's telling the world he's the sort of chap who is extremely irritated by this sort of thing. It's a public statement of who and what he is. He's Lord Digby Jones and very comfortable with this.
    I came across Digby Jones in a professional capacity a few years back. Suffice to say he was the most obnoxious, repulsive person I ever came across through work, and there was some stiff competition.
    That's good to know. I'd have been a bit flummoxed to hear otherwise. Likewise, a mate of mine has met Prince Andrew. Did he confound expectations? Nope, he very much did not.
    I've met Katie Hopkins in passing twice, and she was actually lovely.
    Did you read the surprisingly sympathetic Jon Ronson piece on her - https://www.theguardian.com/media/2015/jul/18/katie-hopkins-jon-ronson-interview ?
    I did, yes, though that was after the two times I met her.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 26,500
    Aslan said:

    kinabalu said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    .

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    If you think either the A40 or the M40 go anywhere near Cambridge (or even in its direction) then your geographic knowledge is… what I would expect from someone who had to settle for Cambridge.
    Reread what I wrote, it is accurate.

    The A40 comes out of Oxford if you want to come out of Oxford and go towards Cambridge.

    The same way I have to take the M67 out of Manchester when I drive to Sheffield even if most of my journey is on the A57, A616, and A628.
    If you are heading north then you use the A34.
    Google route planner goes my way, via the A40.

    I am right as always.


    Interesting: on Google maps the A34 route is both the fastest and the shortest. Your route takes ten minutes more than it does on your version.

    I wonder why different versions of Google produce different results?
    Apple gives 2 & 1/2 hours via the A421.
    *Opens PB*

    *Sees detailed discussion of how different online maps route Oxford to Cambridge*

    *Closes PB*
    Keep your energy and focus for tomorrow.

    Tomorrow afternoon’s thread is about Scottish independence.
    Irrelevant as long as we have a Tory government as it will refuse indyref2 and Sturgeon has ruled out UDI
    Not according to ScreamingEagles. Apparently Dominic Cummings is going to fell PM Johnson and install PM Gove as his replacement; and then Gove is going to concede IndyRef2.

    You read it here first.
    Wrong, even Gove has made clear there will be no indyref2 allowed before the next general election and he will be long retired before one is

    https://www.scotsman.com/news/uk-news/indyref2-michael-gove-says-boris-johnson-will-not-grant-referendum-on-scottish-independence-before-next-general-election-3283019

    https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/politics/uk-politics/3326218/michael-gove-ill-be-enjoying-my-retirement-before-indyref2/
    Gove also ruled out running for Tory leader, then ran for Tory leader the next month, and three years later as well.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/05/06/michael-gove-rules-out-running-for-tory-leader-and-says-his-frie/

    Gove also ruled out vaxports then well you know the rest

    https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-michael-gove-rules-out-vaccine-passports-for-pub-theatre-and-sport-stadium-visits-12147819
    Gove also failed to become Tory leader coming 3rd and has near zero chance of becoming Tory leader now.

    There will never be an indyref2 allowed while we have a Tory government
    Yes FUDHY, we know what *you* think. But last I heard there were in fact other strands of thought within your political party.
    There aren't, we will just say No and anyone who wants a chance of becoming Tory leader will also have to say No.

    The most important task of any Tory PM for the foreseeable future is saying no to indyref2
    You're out of synch with that poll the other day when it was furriners that were the biggest worry of Tory voters. Unless you accept that Scots are already furriners?
    That poll presents a thorny problem. OTOH, whilst a concern about immigration is in no way indicative of racism, having it as your NUMBER ONE concern (esp now Brexit is done) quite possibly is. BOTOH, one doesn't want to think that a large proportion of Tory voters are racist. What to do?
    If it is possible to have concerns about immigration on non-racist grounds, it is possible for those biggest concerns to be about immigration on non-racist grounds. Especially when immigration is running close to all time highs. But of course left wingers just can't help themselves in accusing those who disagree with them in being racist. It makes them feel better about themselves when they keep losing elections. You might be out of power but at least you are morally superior. Of course, they never stop to think how this attitude might be playing a major part in why they lose elections. Or if they do occasionally stumble across this truth in a moment of clarity, they quickly dust themselves off and keep on walking.
    It is possible, yes. That's exactly what I said. Stressed it, in fact.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 26,500

    Aslan said:

    kinabalu said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    .

    I'd also make English lessons teach the Oxford comma.

    I know I hide it well, but I love the Oxford comma.

    Apart from the A40/M40 towards Cambridge the Oxford Comma is the only decent thing to come out of Oxford.

    If you think either the A40 or the M40 go anywhere near Cambridge (or even in its direction) then your geographic knowledge is… what I would expect from someone who had to settle for Cambridge.
    Reread what I wrote, it is accurate.

    The A40 comes out of Oxford if you want to come out of Oxford and go towards Cambridge.

    The same way I have to take the M67 out of Manchester when I drive to Sheffield even if most of my journey is on the A57, A616, and A628.
    If you are heading north then you use the A34.
    Google route planner goes my way, via the A40.

    I am right as always.


    Interesting: on Google maps the A34 route is both the fastest and the shortest. Your route takes ten minutes more than it does on your version.

    I wonder why different versions of Google produce different results?
    Apple gives 2 & 1/2 hours via the A421.
    *Opens PB*

    *Sees detailed discussion of how different online maps route Oxford to Cambridge*

    *Closes PB*
    Keep your energy and focus for tomorrow.

    Tomorrow afternoon’s thread is about Scottish independence.
    Irrelevant as long as we have a Tory government as it will refuse indyref2 and Sturgeon has ruled out UDI
    Not according to ScreamingEagles. Apparently Dominic Cummings is going to fell PM Johnson and install PM Gove as his replacement; and then Gove is going to concede IndyRef2.

    You read it here first.
    Wrong, even Gove has made clear there will be no indyref2 allowed before the next general election and he will be long retired before one is

    https://www.scotsman.com/news/uk-news/indyref2-michael-gove-says-boris-johnson-will-not-grant-referendum-on-scottish-independence-before-next-general-election-3283019

    https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/politics/uk-politics/3326218/michael-gove-ill-be-enjoying-my-retirement-before-indyref2/
    Gove also ruled out running for Tory leader, then ran for Tory leader the next month, and three years later as well.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/05/06/michael-gove-rules-out-running-for-tory-leader-and-says-his-frie/

    Gove also ruled out vaxports then well you know the rest

    https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-michael-gove-rules-out-vaccine-passports-for-pub-theatre-and-sport-stadium-visits-12147819
    Gove also failed to become Tory leader coming 3rd and has near zero chance of becoming Tory leader now.

    There will never be an indyref2 allowed while we have a Tory government
    Yes FUDHY, we know what *you* think. But last I heard there were in fact other strands of thought within your political party.
    There aren't, we will just say No and anyone who wants a chance of becoming Tory leader will also have to say No.

    The most important task of any Tory PM for the foreseeable future is saying no to indyref2
    You're out of synch with that poll the other day when it was furriners that were the biggest worry of Tory voters. Unless you accept that Scots are already furriners?
    That poll presents a thorny problem. OTOH, whilst a concern about immigration is in no way indicative of racism, having it as your NUMBER ONE concern (esp now Brexit is done) quite possibly is. BOTOH, one doesn't want to think that a large proportion of Tory voters are racist. What to do?
    If it is possible to have concerns about immigration on non-racist grounds, it is possible for those biggest concerns to be about immigration on non-racist grounds. Especially when immigration is running close to all time highs. But of course left wingers just can't help themselves in accusing those who disagree with them in being racist. It makes them feel better about themselves when they keep losing elections. You might be out of power but at least you are morally superior. Of course, they never stop to think how this attitude might be playing a major part in why they lose elections. Or if they do occasionally stumble across this truth in a moment of clarity, they quickly dust themselves off and keep on walking.
    It is interesting to compare the reasoning for mass immigration with that advanced by the upper class in late 19th Cent Peru, where they imported a large number of Japanese workers....

    - They would work harder than the indolent Peruvian lower class
    - They would work for decent wages. Not those ridiculous inflated demands.
    - There was a shortage of labour. Mechanisation isn't possible.
    - They have a nice polite culture. Unlike the rough shits from the hills.

    Of course, once the Japanese were actually *in* Peru, the upper class treated them as replacement serfs....
    Yes, interesting, but not especially relevant to the question of whether a continuing obsession with immigration post Brexit is indicative of racism.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 26,500
    Aslan said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    I wonder if the ennobled bloater has been similarly critical of Priti’s dropped ‘g’s?

    https://twitter.com/grumpy_uncle/status/1421345806804787200?s=21

    Interesting tweet. Not the content but that he did it. It's telling the world he's the sort of chap who is extremely irritated by this sort of thing. It's a public statement of who and what he is. He's Lord Digby Jones and very comfortable with this.
    Don’t most people get annoyed by the way some others speak/pronounce words? Priti Patel gets a lot of stick for the exact same thing, from people who are now sticking up for Alex Scott! Posh people get mocked for their pronounciations by working class types, I don’t see it as a punching down thing
    When posh accents are being mocked it is their accent and poshness being mocked.
    When working class accents of politicians are being mocked, it is often mixed with an attack on their intellect and/or education.
    That's right imo. It depends on the context but the 'punching up vs down' point is often relevant when discussing the mocking or dissing of dominant groups.
    Or maybe people are individuals and should be treated as such, regardless of their broader group.
    Do you like motherhood and apple pie?
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    Look at labour's results this week in Bassetlaw and Basildon and convince me the party is coming back in the south or anywhere else. Not just beaten, hammered.

    In real elections its the lib dems, not labour, who are landing punches on the tories. And that makes me wonder if some polls underestimate the LDs and overestimate labour.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 1,831
    edited July 2021

    HYUFD said:

    If we excluded any sport that involves water from Team GB medal haul it would be a disastrous Olympics.

    Most of the first week is water, swimming, diving, rowing, canoeing etc. The athletics only starts today
    I was half joking, but the athletics Team GB has hardly any medal hopes.
    Ah, but we'll be pulling out the Lotus ( / Hope) for the track cycling soon...

    Seriously, there's has been some engineering going on. Front forks are now splayed right out so that they sit in front of the riders leg to improve the aerodynamics. Same with the seat stay.

    Not quite as good as Boardman's Lotus, but still quite radical.

    Not sure the riders are quite up to previous standards though (or perhaps the competition have caught up).
  • RobDRobD Posts: 56,604
    kinabalu said:

    Aslan said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    I wonder if the ennobled bloater has been similarly critical of Priti’s dropped ‘g’s?

    https://twitter.com/grumpy_uncle/status/1421345806804787200?s=21

    Interesting tweet. Not the content but that he did it. It's telling the world he's the sort of chap who is extremely irritated by this sort of thing. It's a public statement of who and what he is. He's Lord Digby Jones and very comfortable with this.
    Don’t most people get annoyed by the way some others speak/pronounce words? Priti Patel gets a lot of stick for the exact same thing, from people who are now sticking up for Alex Scott! Posh people get mocked for their pronounciations by working class types, I don’t see it as a punching down thing
    When posh accents are being mocked it is their accent and poshness being mocked.
    When working class accents of politicians are being mocked, it is often mixed with an attack on their intellect and/or education.
    That's right imo. It depends on the context but the 'punching up vs down' point is often relevant when discussing the mocking or dissing of dominant groups.
    Or maybe people are individuals and should be treated as such, regardless of their broader group.
    Do you like motherhood and apple pie?
    Motherhood? Off to the reeducation camp with you.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 26,500
    RobD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Aslan said:

    kinabalu said:

    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    I wonder if the ennobled bloater has been similarly critical of Priti’s dropped ‘g’s?

    https://twitter.com/grumpy_uncle/status/1421345806804787200?s=21

    Interesting tweet. Not the content but that he did it. It's telling the world he's the sort of chap who is extremely irritated by this sort of thing. It's a public statement of who and what he is. He's Lord Digby Jones and very comfortable with this.
    Don’t most people get annoyed by the way some others speak/pronounce words? Priti Patel gets a lot of stick for the exact same thing, from people who are now sticking up for Alex Scott! Posh people get mocked for their pronounciations by working class types, I don’t see it as a punching down thing
    When posh accents are being mocked it is their accent and poshness being mocked.
    When working class accents of politicians are being mocked, it is often mixed with an attack on their intellect and/or education.
    That's right imo. It depends on the context but the 'punching up vs down' point is often relevant when discussing the mocking or dissing of dominant groups.
    Or maybe people are individuals and should be treated as such, regardless of their broader group.
    Do you like motherhood and apple pie?
    Motherhood? Off to the reeducation camp with you.
    Rob.
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