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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Javid goes on the offensive at cabinet over cannabis for medic

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  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,150

    It seems Tunisia have taken the Republic of Ireland under Jack Charlton's approach to international football.

    Anyone in France with a pair of boots and a Tunisian grandmother?
    It appears to be yes. Its a bonus if you once went on holiday there.
  • StereotomyStereotomy Posts: 4,092

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    What about that suggests it might not still be a winner? If people want more money for the NHS we will have to pay for it, whoever is offering it. We all know politicians promise more for less, but there has to be an element of public skepticism in such claims, and yet we still accept some policies as worth it.
    I think increasing funding almost certainly is a winner. The question is, given that they were going to increase funding, should May have tried to link it to the Brexit dividend? There's two apsects to that- internal party politics and national politics. And I don't think it's unambiguous, I can see arguments both ways.

    But on the national politics front, it does seem that she's needlessly alienating Remainers, and that the prospect this will significantly help her with Leavers is a bit dubious. What's the latest polling we have on how many Leavers actually believe in a Brexit dividend big enough to cover this funding increase?
    To be fair she never said it would cover the whole funding increase and that is why she has said taxes will rise
    Ah, fair enough. Then I should say believe in it at all. From what I remember, it is a pretty high proportion who think it'll help national finances in the long term, but I'm not convinced it'll outweigh the amount it'll piss off remainers
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,648

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    What about that suggests it might not still be a winner? If people want more money for the NHS we will have to pay for it, whoever is offering it. We all know politicians promise more for less, but there has to be an element of public skepticism in such claims, and yet we still accept some policies as worth it.
    I think increasing funding almost certainly is a winner. The question is, given that they were going to increase funding, should May have tried to link it to the Brexit dividend? There's two apsects to that- internal party politics and national politics. And I don't think it's unambiguous, I can see arguments both ways.

    But on the national politics front, it does seem that she's needlessly alienating Remainers, and that the prospect this will significantly help her with Leavers is a bit dubious. What's the latest polling we have on how many Leavers actually believe in a Brexit dividend big enough to cover this funding increase?
    The trouble is you can't reverse thirty or more years of conditioning with a single gesture. The Labour line, throughout my lifetime, has been one of Tories bad, want to dismantle the NHS. A single gesture looks tokenistic and will be unlikely to to break the widely held perception, particularly if it becomes a bidding war - what's to stop Labour pledging to spend even more?

    The Tories' USP is that of a low tax party, by stealing Labour's clothes on the NHS they also open themselves to their own attack line that public services have to be paid for somehow. Most people recognise there's no such thing as a free lunch, even if it's written on the side of a bus.
  • BromptonautBromptonaut Posts: 1,113

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    What about that suggests it might not still be a winner? If people want more money for the NHS we will have to pay for it, whoever is offering it. We all know politicians promise more for less, but there has to be an element of public skepticism in such claims, and yet we still accept some policies as worth it.
    I think increasing funding almost certainly is a winner. The question is, given that they were going to increase funding, should May have tried to link it to the Brexit dividend? There's two apsects to that- internal party politics and national politics. And I don't think it's unambiguous, I can see arguments both ways.

    But on the national politics front, it does seem that she's needlessly alienating Remainers, and that the prospect this will significantly help her with Leavers is a bit dubious. What's the latest polling we have on how many Leavers actually believe in a Brexit dividend big enough to cover this funding increase?
    To be fair she never said it would cover the whole funding increase and that is why she has said taxes will rise
    There. Is. No. Brexit. Dividend.
  • justin124justin124 Posts: 11,527
    HYUFD said:

    justin124 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Government defeated in the Lords on a meaningful vote by a bigger majority than last time.

    So what, the elected Commons has already backed the government and ultimately the unelected Lords can only delay not block
    Delay for 12 months!
    As I have already pointed out the Commons could even amend the Parliament Act to reduce that time if it really wanted as in 1911 it forced the Lords to become a delaying not a blocking body.

    May could even appoint 200 Leaver peers if she wanted as well even if the Lords then became standing room only I doubt she would care
    How likely is the Lords to agree to that? As for flooding the Lords with Tory Peers, George V only agreed to Asquith's request for such peers - should they have proved necessary - after the holding of a second General Election in December 1910.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    What about that suggests it might not still be a winner? If people want more money for the NHS we will have to pay for it, whoever is offering it. We all know politicians promise more for less, but there has to be an element of public skepticism in such claims, and yet we still accept some policies as worth it.
    I think increasing funding almost certainly is a winner. The question is, given that they were going to increase funding, should May have tried to link it to the Brexit dividend? There's two apsects to that- internal party politics and national politics. And I don't think it's unambiguous, I can see arguments both ways.

    But on the national politics front, it does seem that she's needlessly alienating Remainers, and that the prospect this will significantly help her with Leavers is a bit dubious. What's the latest polling we have on how many Leavers actually believe in a Brexit dividend big enough to cover this funding increase?
    To be fair she never said it would cover the whole funding increase and that is why she has said taxes will rise
    There. Is. No. Brexit. Dividend.
    Of course there will be. Explain how between 2025 and 2030 we will still be paying into the EU as now
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    What about that suggests it might not still be a winner? If people want more money for the NHS we will have to pay for it, whoever is offering it. We all know politicians promise more for less, but there has to be an element of public skepticism in such claims, and yet we still accept some policies as worth it.
    I think increasing funding almost certainly is a winner. The question is, given that they were going to increase funding, should May have tried to link it to the Brexit dividend? There's two apsects to that- internal party politics and national politics. And I don't think it's unambiguous, I can see arguments both ways.

    But on the national politics front, it does seem that she's needlessly alienating Remainers, and that the prospect this will significantly help her with Leavers is a bit dubious. What's the latest polling we have on how many Leavers actually believe in a Brexit dividend big enough to cover this funding increase?
    To be fair she never said it would cover the whole funding increase and that is why she has said taxes will rise
    Ah, fair enough. Then I should say believe in it at all. From what I remember, it is a pretty high proportion who think it'll help national finances in the long term, but I'm not convinced it'll outweigh the amount it'll piss off remainers
    Remainers are in full attack at present as they cannot allow even the slightest idea that some of the money we stop sending the EU in time may just justify the bus.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,150
    Hopefully all these misses aren't going to cost England.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,631
    Smart chap is Sajid Javid (its being from Rochdale...). He can see that the ZombieMay head might get lopped off any week now. He has an issue that has mass appeal inside the party and out. And knew that May would be unable to do human and respond at a suitable pace - the Hunt car crash interview with Humphreys this morning didn't do him any good either.

    So he sets out his stall so that should the boss fall over he has momentum to launch straight into a leadership bid. And if she doesn't he still scores points ready for when it does happen. As it will.

    And the best news of all. A Sajid Javid premiership would force the MoFuckingMentum to respond. The Tories have had two female leaders and now a BAME leader. Which means there is only one obvious candidate to allow the party to catch up with the 21st Century. Step forward Diane Abbot. At which point Mr Eagles can donate 5% of his mahoosive winnings off my Abbot tip to a charity of my choosing...
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,307

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    What about that suggests it might not still be a winner? If people want more money for the NHS we will have to pay for it, whoever is offering it. We all know politicians promise more for less, but there has to be an element of public skepticism in such claims, and yet we still accept some policies as worth it.
    I think increasing funding almost certainly is a winner. The question is, given that they were going to increase funding, should May have tried to link it to the Brexit dividend? There's two apsects to that- internal party politics and national politics. And I don't think it's unambiguous, I can see arguments both ways.

    But on the national politics front, it does seem that she's needlessly alienating Remainers, and that the prospect this will significantly help her with Leavers is a bit dubious. What's the latest polling we have on how many Leavers actually believe in a Brexit dividend big enough to cover this funding increase?
    To be fair she never said it would cover the whole funding increase and that is why she has said taxes will rise
    There. Is. No. Brexit. Dividend.
    Of course there will be. Explain how between 2025 and 2030 we will still be paying into the EU as now
    We'll be still paying in substantial sums for access to the CU and SM and our economy, and therefore the government's tax take, will be substantially lower than if we had stayed in the EU.

    There is no Brexit dividend. It is negative.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830

    Hopefully all these misses aren't going to cost England.

    Tunisia misses even !!!
  • PClippPClipp Posts: 2,138
    HYUFD said:

    Government defeated in the Lords on a meaningful vote by a bigger majority than last time.

    So what, the elected Commons has already backed the government and ultimately the unelected Lords can only delay not block
    Don`t Mrs May`s false promises come into play somewhere there?
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,269
    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea. And, yes, I know we do it with alcohol. But just because we do does not mean that we should double up. After all, heroin and cocaine were (may well still be) used for pain relief (the Brompton cocktail) but that doesn’t mean we should decriminalise those.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830
    Barnesian said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    What about that suggests it might not still be a winner? If people want more money for the NHS we will have to pay for it, whoever is offering it. We all know politicians promise more for less, but there has to be an element of public skepticism in such claims, and yet we still accept some policies as worth it.
    I think increasing funding almost certainly is a winner. The question is, given that they were going to increase funding, should May have tried to link it to the Brexit dividend? There's two apsects to that- internal party politics and national politics. And I don't think it's unambiguous, I can see arguments both ways.

    But on the national politics front, it does seem that she's needlessly alienating Remainers, and that the prospect this will significantly help her with Leavers is a bit dubious. What's the latest polling we have on how many Leavers actually believe in a Brexit dividend big enough to cover this funding increase?
    To be fair she never said it would cover the whole funding increase and that is why she has said taxes will rise
    There. Is. No. Brexit. Dividend.
    Of course there will be. Explain how between 2025 and 2030 we will still be paying into the EU as now
    We'll be still paying in substantial sums for access to the CU and SM and our economy, and therefore the government's tax take, will be substantially lower than if we had stayed in the EU.

    There is no Brexit dividend. It is negative.
    You are following the dodgy forecasts on economic activity post Brexit which are guesswork and to date have been very, very wrong
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830

    Smart chap is Sajid Javid (its being from Rochdale...). He can see that the ZombieMay head might get lopped off any week now. He has an issue that has mass appeal inside the party and out. And knew that May would be unable to do human and respond at a suitable pace - the Hunt car crash interview with Humphreys this morning didn't do him any good either.

    So he sets out his stall so that should the boss fall over he has momentum to launch straight into a leadership bid. And if she doesn't he still scores points ready for when it does happen. As it will.

    And the best news of all. A Sajid Javid premiership would force the MoFuckingMentum to respond. The Tories have had two female leaders and now a BAME leader. Which means there is only one obvious candidate to allow the party to catch up with the 21st Century. Step forward Diane Abbot. At which point Mr Eagles can donate 5% of his mahoosive winnings off my Abbot tip to a charity of my choosing...

    Sajid has my vote ( and I have one)
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830
    Penalty to Tunisia
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    You can tell Kyle Walker is a former Spurs player.

    Bloody tosser.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,266

    Penalty to Tunisia

    It was going so well...
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830

    Penalty to Tunisia

    That is so funny
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 21,845

    Hopefully all these misses aren't going to cost England.

    I'm sure they won't...oh!
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,631

    Penalty to Tunisia

    I have completely lost interest in Association Football. Have no idea who most of our players are
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    TGOHF said:

    LOLZA - another chance to laugh at yesterday's thread header.

    https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1008751906842464256

    I realise you struggle with dates more recent than 1690 but that poll was taken before the events of last Wednesday, so quite how you tie it into my thread header is beyond me.

    TGOHF said:

    LOLZA - another chance to laugh at yesterday's thread header.

    https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1008751906842464256

    I realise you struggle with dates more recent than 1690 but that poll was taken before the events of last Wednesday, so quite how you tie it into my thread header is beyond me.
    A staunch No voter of my acquaintance just had a conversion moment post Wednesday and now believes, with regret, that Independence may be the only answer.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,135

    You can tell Kyle Walker is a former Spurs player.

    Bloody tosser.

    Not to defend the Man City player, but he's being played out of position by Southgate. Would have preferred Cahill to start.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,415
    Cyclefree said:

    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea....
    Why does legalisation imply selling cannabis to the young ?
    A similar regulatory regime to tobacco (perhaps more stringent) ought to deal with that objection.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    MaxPB said:

    You can tell Kyle Walker is a former Spurs player.

    Bloody tosser.

    Not to defend the Man City player, but he's being played out of position by Southgate. Would have preferred Cahill to start.
    Cahill's legs have gone.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,914
    edited June 2018
    Cyclefree said:

    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea. And, yes, I know we do it with alcohol. But just because we do does not mean that we should double up. After all, heroin and cocaine were (may well still be) used for pain relief (the Brompton cocktail) but that doesn’t mean we should decriminalise those.
    Not that we should just do what other countries are doing, but an increasing number are moving that way, it clearly isn't regarded as as horrendous as it once was, and the problem for those who are against legalisation is they still overdo the shock claims like we're living in the world of Reefer Madness.

    And if it is a question of it being dangerous for the young, prohibit them from buying it until they are 21 or something. Sure they'll get hold of it anyway to some extent, but if anyone thinks a 21 year cannot get hold of weed right now they are kidding themselves.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830
    John Stones with a fresh air shot with the goal wide open
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    How has VAR missed that?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,995
    VAR really is a total joke.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830

    MaxPB said:

    You can tell Kyle Walker is a former Spurs player.

    Bloody tosser.

    Not to defend the Man City player, but he's being played out of position by Southgate. Would have preferred Cahill to start.
    Cahill's legs have gone.
    Was that in the warm up !!!
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830
    tlg86 said:

    VAR really is a total joke.

    That is a pen - no ifs no buts
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917
  • Torby_FennelTorby_Fennel Posts: 438


    This Government is being led from the bottom up.

    Gove on the environment, Hunt on Health, and Javid now on migration and law & order.

    Theresa May is providing no leadership whatsoever.

    I'm certainly no fan of this government but it seems to me that cabinet ministers leading on the policies and issues of their respective departments is a pretty good thing - regardless of whether or not I agree with the actual policies. And cabinet level is hardly "bottom up".

  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,648
    Cyclefree said:

    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea. And, yes, I know we do it with alcohol. But just because we do does not mean that we should double up. After all, heroin and cocaine were (may well still be) used for pain relief (the Brompton cocktail) but that doesn’t mean we should decriminalise those.
    We try to rationalise it with arguments about reducing harm or reducing crime, the medicinal benefits or the old "prohibition doesn't work" line when what it all comes down to is one simple thing: my body, my choice.

    If tomorrow I decided to commit suicide, take heroin, etc, so be it. It's when I decide to off myself by driving my car in front of a train, or snatch an old lady's purse to buy heroin that it becomes society's problem. It should never be the government's role to police what we can and can't do with our own bodies.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    True Unionism there TSE. Shameful exclusionary thinking from you.

    Deffo not a cock up by Corbyn.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Corbyn is hopeless
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 51,575

    How has VAR missed that?

    Told you - gonna be the new penalty shoot-out in England's misery!!
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,150

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    I wonder how much Jezza actually controls his tw@tter and how much it is others.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830


    This Government is being led from the bottom up.

    Gove on the environment, Hunt on Health, and Javid now on migration and law & order.

    Theresa May is providing no leadership whatsoever.

    I'm certainly no fan of this government but it seems to me that cabinet ministers leading on the policies and issues of their respective departments is a pretty good thing - regardless of whether or not I agree with the actual policies. And cabinet level is hardly "bottom up".

    I would be delighted if TM let her cabinet members lead on issues generally
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,150
    I can't believe that if Alli had to go off Southgate was going to send on Delph.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,475

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,150

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    "They say Rome wasn't built in a day, but I wasn't on that particular job."
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    Alistair said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    True Unionism there TSE. Shameful exclusionary thinking from you.

    Deffo not a cock up by Corbyn.
    Nah, this is up there with Gordon Brown saying his favourite ever goal was Gazza's goal against Scotland at Euro 96.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Surprised he didn't quote Fergie
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,995

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,497

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    I would personally have thought anyone quoting Brian Clough would almost inevitably make a fool of themselves.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,475
    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
    Ha, I didn't until I Googled it.
    Aposite!
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,150
    What's the point of VAR if you miss the rugby tackle on Harry Kane?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,150
    Jesus Christ, 34,000 tweets from Tim and he only has 1500 followers.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,995

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
    Ha, I didn't until I Googled it.
    Aposite!
    So, annoyingly, the Americans are right to say soccer. The word football belongs to none of the sports that claim to be it.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,411
    Decent tackle by the Tunisian lad, more worries for Eddie Jones ?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,150
    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
    Ha, I didn't until I Googled it.
    Aposite!
    So, annoyingly, the Americans are right to say soccer. The word football belongs to none of the sports that claim to be it.
    There are quite a few things that Americans say / spell that we mock, but aren't as wrong as most people think. Often it comes back to the what were the norms when many left the British Isles to emigrate there.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,150
    edited June 2018
    Jermaine Jenas looks like he is wearing his Dad's suit jacket and his mum told him he would grow into it.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,505
    Midges!
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,415

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
    Ha, I didn't until I Googled it.
    Aposite!
    So, annoyingly, the Americans are right to say soccer. The word football belongs to none of the sports that claim to be it.
    There are quite a few things that Americans say / spell that we mock, but aren't as wrong as most people think. Often it comes back to the what were the norms when many left the British Isles to emigrate there.
    Many of them aren’t wrong at all - particularly as US English is more widely taught and spoken in the world than English English...
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,497
    Nigelb said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
    Ha, I didn't until I Googled it.
    Aposite!
    So, annoyingly, the Americans are right to say soccer. The word football belongs to none of the sports that claim to be it.
    There are quite a few things that Americans say / spell that we mock, but aren't as wrong as most people think. Often it comes back to the what were the norms when many left the British Isles to emigrate there.
    Many of them aren’t wrong at all - particularly as US English is more widely taught and spoken in the world than real English...
    Fixed it for you.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,415
    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
    Ha, I didn't until I Googled it.
    Aposite!
    So, annoyingly, the Americans are right to say soccer. The word football belongs to none of the sports that claim to be it.
    There are quite a few things that Americans say / spell that we mock, but aren't as wrong as most people think. Often it comes back to the what were the norms when many left the British Isles to emigrate there.
    Many of them aren’t wrong at all - particularly as US English is more widely taught and spoken in the world than real English...
    Fixed it for you.
    LOL.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,475
    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
    Ha, I didn't until I Googled it.
    Aposite!
    So, annoyingly, the Americans are right to say soccer. The word football belongs to none of the sports that claim to be it.
    I was thinking more of this.

    'THE WORD "soccer" is simply a diminutive of association, as in As-soc-iation Football, with "er" added. It was, apparently, all the rage among public schoolboys in the mid to late nineteenth century to bung "er" on the end of a butchered word. '
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Tunisia are 13.5 to win with Betfair Exchange. Does anyone think that's value?

    https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/football/market/1.137597359
  • Torby_FennelTorby_Fennel Posts: 438



    I would be delighted if TM let her cabinet members lead on issues generally

    Indeed, I think that would be healthier for the whole country and should be the norm whoever is Prime Minister. Prime Ministers need to choose the right people to think and lead their respective departments not try to be across everything themselves.

    At the last GE the only two Conservatives who had any reasonable level of public profile were Theresa May and Amber Rudd - and we only saw Rudd because of May's refusal to debate.

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    VAR is as useful as tits on a fish
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    That was the worst back-pass I've ever seen.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,995
    AndyJS said:

    That was the worst back-pass I've ever seen.

    Lee Dixon says hello...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpSo1aciPqU
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    How many times does Harry Kane have to be wrestled to the ground before a penalty is awarded?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,497

    VAR is as useful as tits on a fish

    Are you suggesting that the system sucks?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,411
    Some choice wrestling moves being performed on Kane
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,995

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
    Ha, I didn't until I Googled it.
    Aposite!
    So, annoyingly, the Americans are right to say soccer. The word football belongs to none of the sports that claim to be it.
    I was thinking more of this.

    'THE WORD "soccer" is simply a diminutive of association, as in As-soc-iation Football, with "er" added. It was, apparently, all the rage among public schoolboys in the mid to late nineteenth century to bung "er" on the end of a butchered word. '
    I didn't realise that it was posh boys who came up with this and, presumably, rugger.
  • StereotomyStereotomy Posts: 4,092
    Cyclefree said:

    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea. And, yes, I know we do it with alcohol. But just because we do does not mean that we should double up. After all, heroin and cocaine were (may well still be) used for pain relief (the Brompton cocktail) but that doesn’t mean we should decriminalise those.
    So you'd support making alcohol illegal?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited June 2018
    ydoethur said:

    VAR is as useful as tits on a fish

    Are you suggesting that the system sucks?
    Each team should have one appeal available to the TV replays, like cricket. You lose it if it turns out to have been unjustified.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,150
    edited June 2018
    Get Rashford on.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,497
    AndyJS said:

    ydoethur said:

    VAR is as useful as tits on a fish

    Are you suggesting that the system sucks?
    Each team should have one appeal available to the TV replays, like cricket. You lose it if it turns out to have been unjustified.
    I misread that at first. I thought you said, 'You lose if it turns out to have been unjustified,' which seemed excessive.
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651
    edited June 2018
    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
    Ha, I didn't until I Googled it.
    Aposite!
    So, annoyingly, the Americans are right to say soccer. The word football belongs to none of the sports that claim to be it.
    I was thinking more of this.

    'THE WORD "soccer" is simply a diminutive of association, as in As-soc-iation Football, with "er" added. It was, apparently, all the rage among public schoolboys in the mid to late nineteenth century to bung "er" on the end of a butchered word. '
    I didn't realise that it was posh boys who came up with this and, presumably, rugger.
    C.f. “rugger” (for rugby), “Twickers” (Twickenham), “Singers” (Singapore), the naval game of “uckers“. In fact quite a lot of naval slang does the -er or -ers thing: icers [cold, superlative "harry icers"], redders [hot], roughers, shippers, four [or nine] O’clockers, sippers, gulpers, homeward bounders, limers, snorkers.
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,648

    Cyclefree said:

    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea. And, yes, I know we do it with alcohol. But just because we do does not mean that we should double up. After all, heroin and cocaine were (may well still be) used for pain relief (the Brompton cocktail) but that doesn’t mean we should decriminalise those.
    So you'd support making alcohol illegal?
    Or cheeseburgers or fizzy drinks, for that matter. Once you accept it's OK to police what people do or don't do with their bodies, it's just a matter of where you draw the arbitrary line.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,411
    Alistair said:

    TGOHF said:

    LOLZA - another chance to laugh at yesterday's thread header.

    https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1008751906842464256

    I realise you struggle with dates more recent than 1690 but that poll was taken before the events of last Wednesday, so quite how you tie it into my thread header is beyond me.

    TGOHF said:

    LOLZA - another chance to laugh at yesterday's thread header.

    https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1008751906842464256

    I realise you struggle with dates more recent than 1690 but that poll was taken before the events of last Wednesday, so quite how you tie it into my thread header is beyond me.
    A staunch No voter of my acquaintance just had a conversion moment post Wednesday and now believes, with regret, that Independence may be the only answer.
    It'd create a big majority for a hardish Brexit too which is clearly what most of England wants.
    Keep Corbyn out too.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,497
    kyf_100 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea. And, yes, I know we do it with alcohol. But just because we do does not mean that we should double up. After all, heroin and cocaine were (may well still be) used for pain relief (the Brompton cocktail) but that doesn’t mean we should decriminalise those.
    So you'd support making alcohol illegal?
    Or cheeseburgers or fizzy drinks, for that matter. Once you accept it's OK to police what people do or don't do with their bodies, it's just a matter of where you draw the arbitrary line.
    We could definitely ban pineapple on pizza to advantage.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,150
    This ref is as dodgy as they come.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,475
    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
    Ha, I didn't until I Googled it.
    Aposite!
    So, annoyingly, the Americans are right to say soccer. The word football belongs to none of the sports that claim to be it.
    I was thinking more of this.

    'THE WORD "soccer" is simply a diminutive of association, as in As-soc-iation Football, with "er" added. It was, apparently, all the rage among public schoolboys in the mid to late nineteenth century to bung "er" on the end of a butchered word. '
    I didn't realise that it was posh boys who came up with this and, presumably, rugger.
    Footer for the real poshos, eg JRM and Seumas Milne.
  • StereotomyStereotomy Posts: 4,092
    kyf_100 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea. And, yes, I know we do it with alcohol. But just because we do does not mean that we should double up. After all, heroin and cocaine were (may well still be) used for pain relief (the Brompton cocktail) but that doesn’t mean we should decriminalise those.
    So you'd support making alcohol illegal?
    Or cheeseburgers or fizzy drinks, for that matter. Once you accept it's OK to police what people do or don't do with their bodies, it's just a matter of where you draw the arbitrary line.
    Well I am in favour of drawing that line somewhere. But I'd at least try to make it a straight line rather than one that has to go through the contortions required to make alcohol and tobacco legal and cannabis, ecstacy and LSD illegal
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651
    edited June 2018

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, Bill Shankly was born in Scotland

    https://twitter.com/jeremycorbyn/status/1008759999688998917

    Catnip for Tim.

    https://twitter.com/GOsborneGenius/status/1008770019705094144

    At least Jez/the posh boys didn't call it soccer.
    Without Googling it, I assume you know the origin of the word soccer?
    Ha, I didn't until I Googled it.
    Aposite!
    So, annoyingly, the Americans are right to say soccer. The word football belongs to none of the sports that claim to be it.
    I was thinking more of this.

    'THE WORD "soccer" is simply a diminutive of association, as in As-soc-iation Football, with "er" added. It was, apparently, all the rage among public schoolboys in the mid to late nineteenth century to bung "er" on the end of a butchered word. '
    I didn't realise that it was posh boys who came up with this and, presumably, rugger.
    C.f. “rugger” (for rugby), “Twickers” (Twickenham), “Singers” (Singapore), the naval game of “uckers“. In fact quite a lot of naval slang does the -er or -ers thing: icers [cold, superlative "harry icers"], redders [hot], roughers, shippers, four [or nine] O’clockers, sippers, gulpers, homeward bounders, limers, snorkers.
    Also: Honkers (Hong Kong), neaters, planters, up homers (some quite fun ones on that page, I like "Yodel in a bucket"/"Pavement pizza"/"dockyard omelette"/"technicolor yawn")
  • DeanoDeano Posts: 9
    May will fall if she loses a parliamentary vote. But the new leader is likely to be a Brexiteer. Good. Grieve is "unprintable" words.

    One of Tory rebels is my MP. Lot of phone calls to Chairman about de-selecting him. Remainer MPs will be sacrificed on Tory and Labour side.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,026


    This Government is being led from the bottom up.

    Gove on the environment, Hunt on Health, and Javid now on migration and law & order.

    Theresa May is providing no leadership whatsoever.

    I'm certainly no fan of this government but it seems to me that cabinet ministers leading on the policies and issues of their respective departments is a pretty good thing - regardless of whether or not I agree with the actual policies. And cabinet level is hardly "bottom up".

    I have no problem with cabinet ministers taking the initiative and implementing/developing policy in their own departments, that’s what happened under Cameron too, but I do expect it to be done within an overarching framework with strong leadership on the Government’s political priorities.

    Theresa May may as well be a fly on the wall.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    ydoethur said:

    AndyJS said:

    ydoethur said:

    VAR is as useful as tits on a fish

    Are you suggesting that the system sucks?
    Each team should have one appeal available to the TV replays, like cricket. You lose it if it turns out to have been unjustified.
    I misread that at first. I thought you said, 'You lose if it turns out to have been unjustified,' which seemed excessive.
    Did I get it the wrong way round? You know what I mean anyway.
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704

    Get Rashford on.

    You Gareth?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,026

    I doubt this is going to go down well with the scorched earth school of Brexit:

    https://twitter.com/nick_gutteridge/status/1008688962486132737?s=21

    I’m not happy about it, but I note the document is full of grammar and spelling mistakes.

    I suspect it’s being pushed out publicly for some anchoring and to shape the negotiating agenda.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,269
    kyf_100 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea. And, yes, I know we do it with alcohol. But just because we do does not mean that we should double up. After all, heroin and cocaine were (may well still be) used for pain relief (the Brompton cocktail) but that doesn’t mean we should decriminalise those.
    We try to rationalise it with arguments about reducing harm or reducing crime, the medicinal benefits or the old "prohibition doesn't work" line when what it all comes down to is one simple thing: my body, my choice.

    If tomorrow I decided to commit suicide, take heroin, etc, so be it. It's when I decide to off myself by driving my car in front of a train, or snatch an old lady's purse to buy heroin that it becomes society's problem. It should never be the government's role to police what we can and can't do with our own bodies.
    Given the concern there rightly is about mental health problems in the young I am not as sanguine as you about legalising a substance where there is credible evidence linking it to very serious - and lifelong - mental illnesses when it is consumed by the young.

    Saying that the government should not police what we do with our own bodies is a slogan. Not an argument. We strongly discourage smoking because of its long term harm. Why then introduce another substance which causes just as much harm?

    The drug laws are a mess and inconsistent. A proper study is needed. But the effect of drugs on the young brain are pretty harmful - not just some youth being a bit spaced out at a party. And that harm needs to be taken pretty seriously, not dismissed or minimised just because decriminalisation is now the coming fashionable option.
  • StereotomyStereotomy Posts: 4,092
    Deano said:

    May will fall if she loses a parliamentary vote. But the new leader is likely to be a Brexiteer. Good. Grieve is "unprintable" words.

    One of Tory rebels is my MP. Lot of phone calls to Chairman about de-selecting him. Remainer MPs will be sacrificed on Tory and Labour side.
    May will only fall if the letters go in and she loses the confidence vote. If there's one thing she's been most consistent on, it's her willingness to sacrifice anything and everything to stay in number 10 for one more day
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,269

    Cyclefree said:

    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea. And, yes, I know we do it with alcohol. But just because we do does not mean that we should double up. After all, heroin and cocaine were (may well still be) used for pain relief (the Brompton cocktail) but that doesn’t mean we should decriminalise those.
    So you'd support making alcohol illegal?
    No. As my post made clear.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Can't see England beating Belgium with this sort of performance.
  • StereotomyStereotomy Posts: 4,092
    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea. And, yes, I know we do it with alcohol. But just because we do does not mean that we should double up. After all, heroin and cocaine were (may well still be) used for pain relief (the Brompton cocktail) but that doesn’t mean we should decriminalise those.
    So you'd support making alcohol illegal?
    No. As my post made clear.
    Did it? I thought you were saying we shouldn't double up on the mistake of making alcohol legal? So why -do- you think one should be legal and not the other?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,026
    Alistair said:

    TGOHF said:

    LOLZA - another chance to laugh at yesterday's thread header.

    https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1008751906842464256

    I realise you struggle with dates more recent than 1690 but that poll was taken before the events of last Wednesday, so quite how you tie it into my thread header is beyond me.

    TGOHF said:

    LOLZA - another chance to laugh at yesterday's thread header.

    https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1008751906842464256

    I realise you struggle with dates more recent than 1690 but that poll was taken before the events of last Wednesday, so quite how you tie it into my thread header is beyond me.
    A staunch No voter of my acquaintance just had a conversion moment post Wednesday and now believes, with regret, that Independence may be the only answer.
    Answer to what?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    I see my England as Carthage analogy from this morning is proving to be be true.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Cyclefree said:



    kyf_100 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    DavidL said:

    I cannot help but think of hard cases make bad law.

    There's a lot of truth in that maxim. But in this case the correct answer is that the law is wrong and this is just a particularly vivid example of it. Legalise marijuana completely and the issue of medicinal use exemption no longer arises. We can then do proper trials as to whether it is really helping people with this condition, MS, chronic pain, etc etc and decide when, if ever, it should be available on the NHS.
    Really David: that is just too trite. There is evidence that cannabis seriously harms the brains of developing adolescents and can be linked to mental health conditions such as schizophrenia.

    One sick boy apparently benefiting from cannabis oil proves nothing and is certainly no basis for decriminalisation.

    By all means study whether cannabis may have some medicinal use and, if proven, use it. But permitting a potentially very harmful substance to be sold to the young without controls is a bloody daft idea. And, yes, I know we do it with alcohol. But just because we do does not mean that we should double up. After all, heroin and cocaine were (may well still be) used for pain relief (the Brompton cocktail) but that doesn’t mean we should decriminalise those.
    If tomorrow I decided to commit suicide, take heroin, etc, so be it. It's when I decide to off myself by driving my car in front of a train, or snatch an old lady's purse to buy heroin that it becomes society's problem. It should never be the government's role to police what we can and can't do with our own bodies.
    Given the concern there rightly is about mental health problems in the young I am not as sanguine as you about legalising a substance where there is credible evidence linking it to very serious - and lifelong - mental illnesses when it is consumed by the young.

    The drug laws are a mess and inconsistent. A proper study is needed. But the effect of drugs on the young brain are pretty harmful - not just some youth being a bit spaced out at a party. And that harm needs to be taken pretty seriously, not dismissed or minimised just because decriminalisation is now the coming fashionable option.
    "Research over the last 10 years has suggested that it can have serious consequences for people, such as the development of an enduring psychotic illness, particularly in those who are genetically vulnerable."

    https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/mentalhealthinfo/problems/alcoholanddrugs/cannabisandmentalhealth.aspx
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830

    I see my England as Carthage analogy from this morning is proving to be be true.

    Why is Ashley Young taking free kicks. Is that the best the team has
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    edited June 2018
    Has Theresa May been coaching the England team?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,995
    Captain Kane has gone missing this half.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    tlg86 said:

    Captain Kane has gone missing this half.

    He's overrated.
This discussion has been closed.