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    antifrank said:

    I don't see how Nigel Farage could be included in the debates and representatives of the SNP, the Greens, Plaid Cymru and the various northern Irish parties could be excluded.

    A sensible compromise would be to have one debate with more party leaders and two with just the main three. I expect that something like that will happen.

    The thing is, would Ed Miliband and Labour really want a debate/debates where there's just Ed, Nick & Dave?

    Two thirds of the participants would be defending the government and attacking the legacy Labour gave them.
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    antifrank said:

    I don't see how Nigel Farage could be included in the debates and representatives of the SNP, the Greens, Plaid Cymru and the various northern Irish parties could be excluded.

    A sensible compromise would be to have one debate with more party leaders and two with just the main three. I expect that something like that will happen.

    If UKIP come top in next years EU MEP elections, it will be seen as bias if Frarage is prevented from debating the other party leaders.
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,900
    @Slackbladder

    "A great blog Mr Thomas."

    Don't humour him. One or two have been readable this was just rubbish-and boring rubbish at that. Even if you don't agree with VC at least she's readable
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,584
    edited September 2013
    The bigoted woman, Gillian Duffy speaks

    Asked whether Mr Miliband could make it to Downing Street, she says: “He’s going to have to pull his finger out, isn’t he, and get moving, get some policies out. They’ll be very lucky if they get in, Labour.

    “Ask anybody in the street, I bet they can’t name who they are. They’re not doing well up North, there’s nothing happening up here at all.”

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/andy-mcsmiths-lib-dems-conference-diary-no-bullying-but-lib-dems-talk-around-the-subject-8817993.html
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    Well done to Paddy Power

    Paddy Power ads back push to tackle homophobia in football

    Bookmaker joins forces with Stonewall for campaign that includes sending rainbow laces to top English and Scottish clubs

    http://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/sep/16/paddy-power-ads-homophobia-football?CMP=twt_fd
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    AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    Daily Mash on Lady Gaga visiting the LibDem conference:

    http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/arts-entertainment/lady-gaga-plays-to-freaks-misfits-and-outsiders-at-lib-dem-conference-2013091679479

    "POP star Lady Gaga has made a surprise appearance in Glasgow playing to shunned outcasts from society at the Lib Dem conference."
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763
    edited September 2013
    Roger said:

    @Slackbladder

    "A great blog Mr Thomas."

    Don't humour him. One or two have been readable this was just rubbish-and boring rubbish at that. Even if you don't agree with VC at least she's readable

    I read the VC article, she's a whackjob, totally confused but filling column inches for the wonga. And she wasn't actually that readable.
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    Roger said:

    @Slackbladder

    "A great blog Mr Thomas."

    Don't humour him. One or two have been readable this was just rubbish-and boring rubbish at that. Even if you don't agree with VC at least she's readable

    I partly agree with you - instead of addressing the issue (which is complex on several levels), it just reads like a luvvie-spat.

    Sorry SeanT, this was the worst of your blogs so far. But Mrs Coren-Mitchell's seemed poor as well. But as she's better-looking than you (*), so I'll favour her article. Yes, I'm that shallow.

    (*) A fact you're hopefully very glad of ...
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    AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621


    Roger said:

    @Slackbladder

    "A great blog Mr Thomas."

    Don't humour him. One or two have been readable this was just rubbish-and boring rubbish at that. Even if you don't agree with VC at least she's readable

    I read the VC article, she's a whackjob, totally confused but filling column inches for the wonga. And she wasn't actually that readable.
    She's still lovely. Damn you David Mitchell!
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    Well done to Paddy Power

    Paddy Power ads back push to tackle homophobia in football

    Bookmaker joins forces with Stonewall for campaign that includes sending rainbow laces to top English and Scottish clubs

    http://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/sep/16/paddy-power-ads-homophobia-football?CMP=twt_fd

    I'm also looking forward to the metrosexuals of the SPL wearing multi-coloured nail polish.
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    Comedian and actor Billy Connolly has had surgery for prostate cancer and has been diagnosed with Parkinson's disease.

    "The operation was a total success, and Billy is fully recovered," his spokeswoman said.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-24106842
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,900
    "And she wasn't actually that readable."

    I agree. It wasn't one of her best and was confused but it's relative as I'm sure you'll agree if you've read Sean's piece in the Telegraph. Even Nabavi might want to reconsider his recent hagiography
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763
    Anorak said:


    Roger said:

    @Slackbladder

    "A great blog Mr Thomas."

    Don't humour him. One or two have been readable this was just rubbish-and boring rubbish at that. Even if you don't agree with VC at least she's readable

    I read the VC article, she's a whackjob, totally confused but filling column inches for the wonga. And she wasn't actually that readable.
    She's still lovely. Damn you David Mitchell!
    That must be one self-righteously smug household !
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763
    Roger said:

    "And she wasn't actually that readable."

    I agree. It wasn't one of her best and was confused but it's relative as I'm sure you'll agree if you've read Sean's piece in the Telegraph. Even Nabavi might want to reconsider his recent hagiography

    I've seen her several times on TV progs, I just don't think she's as funny as she thinks she is. But then I think the same about David Mitchell, I guess I just dont "get" their humour.
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    Well done to Paddy Power

    Paddy Power ads back push to tackle homophobia in football

    Bookmaker joins forces with Stonewall for campaign that includes sending rainbow laces to top English and Scottish clubs

    http://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/sep/16/paddy-power-ads-homophobia-football?CMP=twt_fd

    I'm also looking forward to the metrosexuals of the SPL wearing multi-coloured nail polish.
    As I understand it, Celtic players will paint their finger nails alternating, Green, White and Orange
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    AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621

    Anorak said:


    Roger said:

    @Slackbladder

    "A great blog Mr Thomas."

    Don't humour him. One or two have been readable this was just rubbish-and boring rubbish at that. Even if you don't agree with VC at least she's readable

    I read the VC article, she's a whackjob, totally confused but filling column inches for the wonga. And she wasn't actually that readable.
    She's still lovely. Damn you David Mitchell!
    That must be one self-righteously smug household !
    Ha! Indeed.

    Cupboards full of Fairtrade mung beans and overpriced coffee, I'm sure. Unlikely to find a copy of the Telegraph lying around (unless oh-so-very-amusingly repurposed as loo paper).
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    Roger said:

    "And she wasn't actually that readable."

    I agree. It wasn't one of her best and was confused but it's relative as I'm sure you'll agree if you've read Sean's piece in the Telegraph. Even Nabavi might want to reconsider his recent hagiography

    Yeah, I'm reconsidering. Sean's recent columns haven't lived up to the high quality of the piece I praised. The latest one just doesn't quite work, it's too contrived.
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,900
    edited September 2013

    "Seamus Heaney, the Nelson Mandela of Irish poetry, just wasn't that good. Sorry" By Sean Thomas

    I would prefer to read a piece by the commentator who said of the article

    "So says the winner of the 2002 Bad Sex in Fiction Award"
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    CCHQ Press Office @RicHolden
    1.8 m h/holds on waiting lists & 250,000 over-crowded accom it's wrong taxpayers fund 1.5m spare rooms in social housing. #SpareRoomSubsidy

    Quite.

    Politico Daily @Politico_Daily
    "Which leader would you most like to invite to your house for dinner?" Cameron 15 Miliband 11 Clegg 8 Farage 11 None 48 Don't know 7 #YouGov
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Politico Daily @Politico_Daily
    "Do you support or oppose raising the top rate of income tax from 45p to 50p? Support 68 Oppose 21 Don't know 11 #YouGov

    Labour barking up the wrong tree yet again?
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    Roger said:

    "And she wasn't actually that readable."

    I agree. It wasn't one of her best and was confused but it's relative as I'm sure you'll agree if you've read Sean's piece in the Telegraph. Even Nabavi might want to reconsider his recent hagiography

    I've seen her several times on TV progs, I just don't think she's as funny as she thinks she is. But then I think the same about David Mitchell, I guess I just dont "get" their humour.
    David Mitchell deserves a place in the comedy pantheon for the following:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MusyO7J2inM

    And Victoria Coren should be remembered for the excellent book: "Once more with feeling." Her poker one fell a bit flat for me, but then I don't play...
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763

    Roger said:

    "And she wasn't actually that readable."

    I agree. It wasn't one of her best and was confused but it's relative as I'm sure you'll agree if you've read Sean's piece in the Telegraph. Even Nabavi might want to reconsider his recent hagiography

    I've seen her several times on TV progs, I just don't think she's as funny as she thinks she is. But then I think the same about David Mitchell, I guess I just dont "get" their humour.
    David Mitchell deserves a place in the comedy pantheon for the following:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MusyO7J2inM

    And Victoria Coren should be remembered for the excellent book: "Once more with feeling." Her poker one fell a bit flat for me, but then I don't play...
    Sorry JJ didn't laugh once. Too much like man dwelling up his own arse finds himself funny.
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763
    tim said:

    "Mr Cameron has installed a wind turbine in his own London home as part of a £150,000 "green makeover" of the North Kensington residence"

    Top that for smugness.

    Tony Blair tells the Sun he does it 5 times a night.

    Berlusconi says he does it eight times.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Mark Wallace @wallaceme
    RT @JoeWatts_: Oh dear, Lib Dem HQ has just accidentally emails all hacks what they want MPs to say in TV interviews. #ldconf << ouch
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,900
    @Eagle

    "The operation was a total success, and Billy is fully recovered," his spokeswoman said.

    I was waiting for the punchline......

    I went to see him a few days after the American's started bombing Afghanistan back to the stoneage. There was talk of the show being called off. He walked onto stage very glum faced to slightly muted applause and said nothing for maybe two or three minutes.

    Then "What the F*ck". Another long pause.

    "If you think they're having it bad what about me?"

    "I've Just bought a timeshare in Kabul"
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited September 2013
    Five things to remember for every interview

    This conference sees the party in a confident mood
    We have a strong record of achievement in Government
    Our priorities are jobs and easing the squeeze on household budgets
    Labour cannot be trusted to build a stronger economy
    The Conservatives on their own cannot build a fairer society

    - See more at: http://www.cityam.com/blog/1379326626/lib-dem-lines-take-interviews-full#sthash.XLvndS6N.dpuf
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    antifrank said:

    I don't see how Nigel Farage could be included in the debates and representatives of the SNP, the Greens, Plaid Cymru and the various northern Irish parties could be excluded.

    A sensible compromise would be to have one debate with more party leaders and two with just the main three. I expect that something like that will happen.

    Mischievously, you could suggest a "Prime Minister's" debate, between Miliband and Cameron, as they're the two most likely to be Prime Minister after the election, and a "Deputy Prime Minister's" debate, between Clegg, Harman and Hague, as that's the choice for deputy PM.
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,900
    @Plato

    Politico Daily @Politico_Daily
    "Do you support or oppose raising the top rate of income tax from 45p to 50p? Support 68 Oppose 21 Don't know 11 #YouGov

    "Labour barking up the wrong tree yet again?"

    Surely that IS Labour's position?
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763
    Roger said:

    @Plato

    Politico Daily @Politico_Daily
    "Do you support or oppose raising the top rate of income tax from 45p to 50p? Support 68 Oppose 21 Don't know 11 #YouGov

    "Labour barking up the wrong tree yet again?"

    Surely that IS Labour's position?

    To date labour's position is " we agree with Osborne ".
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    SeanT said:

    Roger said:

    "And she wasn't actually that readable."

    I agree. It wasn't one of her best and was confused but it's relative as I'm sure you'll agree if you've read Sean's piece in the Telegraph. Even Nabavi might want to reconsider his recent hagiography

    Yeah, I'm reconsidering. Sean's recent columns haven't lived up to the high quality of the piece I praised. The latest one just doesn't quite work, it's too contrived.
    Perhaps. I don't ask to be hagiographed! However the measure of a blog is its clickability - the share count. This one may be too obscure, but the last two have been the most shared on the Telegraph website, each time. So I'm doing exactly what the editors want. Which is, after all, my job. I'm just a blogger...
    WIth respect, you may eventually become too transparent and formulaic, like radio talk show shock jocks (read out local paper headline and propose loony right solution like hanging for traffic wardens and/or people who misuse disabled parking bays). The danger is you will get more and more clicks from fewer and fewer readers.
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    Populus ‏@PopulusPolls 4m

    New Populus Voting Intention figures: Lab 40 (-1); Cons 33 (-1); LD 11 (+1); UKIP 9 (+2); Oth 6 (-2)
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    SeanT said:

    Roger said:

    @Slackbladder

    "A great blog Mr Thomas."

    Don't humour him. One or two have been readable this was just rubbish-and boring rubbish at that. Even if you don't agree with VC at least she's readable

    I partly agree with you - instead of addressing the issue (which is complex on several levels), it just reads like a luvvie-spat.

    Sorry SeanT, this was the worst of your blogs so far. But Mrs Coren-Mitchell's seemed poor as well. But as she's better-looking than you (*), so I'll favour her article. Yes, I'm that shallow.

    (*) A fact you're hopefully very glad of ...
    Lol. I shall not repine. The good thing about blogs is that they are like days, if you don't like this one, there will surely be another along tomorrow.

    Flattered to hear that Roger is an avid consumer of my blogs. Perhaps he just happens upon them in Patisserie Valerie.
    Where the f have Patisserie Valerie come from? The one in Cambridge opened a few years ago, and ever since I've had people from all corners of the country telling me about this lovely patisserie that's opened in their area.

    Are they going to be another Starbucks-style phenomena, or just a victim of another rushed-expansion bubble?
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    Roger said:

    @Eagle

    "The operation was a total success, and Billy is fully recovered," his spokeswoman said.

    I was waiting for the punchline......

    I went to see him a few days after the American's started bombing Afghanistan back to the stoneage. There was talk of the show being called off. He walked onto stage very glum faced to slightly muted applause and said nothing for maybe two or three minutes.

    Then "What the F*ck". Another long pause.

    "If you think they're having it bad what about me?"

    "I've Just bought a timeshare in Kabul"

    That man has always made me laugh.
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    Plato said:

    Politico Daily @Politico_Daily
    "Do you support or oppose raising the top rate of income tax from 45p to 50p? Support 68 Oppose 21 Don't know 11 #YouGov

    Labour barking up the wrong tree yet again?

    If the Conservatives wish to put income tax back up, why doesn't George just do it?
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    Battle of the Telegraph bloggers

    Dan Hodges vs SeanT

    The debate about Muslim women wearing veils is not complex. This is Britain, and in Britain you can wear what you want

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100236076/the-debate-about-muslim-women-wearing-veils-is-not-complex-this-is-britain-and-in-britain-you-can-wear-what-you-want/
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    "YouGov-Cambridge
    @YouGovCam
    YouGov President Peter Kellner predicts that UKIP will come first in the 2014 EU elections on 30%, Labour 25%, Con 18%, LD 8% #YGCam"

    twitter.com/YouGovCam/status/378454377855737856

    This was mentioned the other day, but now seems to be official.

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    I see The Daily Mash have hired Morris Dancer

    Clegg fires 2015 election pledges into the sun

    THE Liberal Democrats’ 2015 election promises have been put into a metal tube and blasted into the heart of the solar system.

    http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/politics/clegg-fires-2015-election-pledges-into-the-sun-2013091679484
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002

    Roger said:

    "And she wasn't actually that readable."

    I agree. It wasn't one of her best and was confused but it's relative as I'm sure you'll agree if you've read Sean's piece in the Telegraph. Even Nabavi might want to reconsider his recent hagiography

    I've seen her several times on TV progs, I just don't think she's as funny as she thinks she is. But then I think the same about David Mitchell, I guess I just dont "get" their humour.
    David Mitchell deserves a place in the comedy pantheon for the following:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MusyO7J2inM

    And Victoria Coren should be remembered for the excellent book: "Once more with feeling." Her poker one fell a bit flat for me, but then I don't play...
    Whatever else Vicky Cohen is - she is a very good poker player.
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    TSE "You can wear what you like" no matter how sinister, strange,alien, stupid .downtrodden or medieval you look..
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    "YouGov-Cambridge ‏@YouGovCam 13 Sep
    @Nigel_Farage “It is by winning at local level, that is the way UKIP can succeed in 2015”"

    twitter.com/YouGovCam/status/378442336839405568
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    Hopefully we should be getting the Guardian/ICM poll today
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    FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,060

    Battle of the Telegraph bloggers

    Dan Hodges vs SeanT

    The debate about Muslim women wearing veils is not complex. This is Britain, and in Britain you can wear what you want

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100236076/the-debate-about-muslim-women-wearing-veils-is-not-complex-this-is-britain-and-in-britain-you-can-wear-what-you-want/

    I thought the point about banning it in schools was bold. After all there is nothing unusual about restrictions in dress inside the school gate as many of us have found out to our cost over the years. What I found strange was the idea that it should be banned in public places. Whilst it may be a denial of freedom that leads to the veil being worn in the first place, this is hard to prove and generally we're the sort of liberal society that says people can wear what they want.

    It may seem crass politics but from Ed Miliband's point of view, being seen as a vacillating politician without strength could be an image considerably enhanced by calling for a ban on the veil inside schools.
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    The vice-president of the European Commission has reiterated that any part of an EU member state which secedes from that state automatically leaves the EU.
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    "YouGov today undertook a dial test of Nigel Farage’s address to the YouGov-Cambridge forum, looking at how the UKIP leader’s detractors and supporters changed their views of him as a result of watching the speech

    38% of detractors had a more favourable view of Nigel Farage after watching the speech"

    http://cambridge.yougov.com/news/2013/09/13/dial-testing-speech-nigel-farage/
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    FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,060

    Hopefully we should be getting the Guardian/ICM poll today

    Is it that time of the month?
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    The vice-president of the European Commission has reiterated that any part of an EU member state which secedes from that state automatically leaves the EU.

    Interesting.
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    Hopefully we should be getting the Guardian/ICM poll today

    Is it that time of the month?
    My PB Diary says so.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Dylan Sharpe @dylsharpe
    Lib Dem lines continued: Lembit Opik: "is he still around?" House of Lords: "archaic, 'cept when we're packing it with Grender, Paddick etc"
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,369

    Battle of the Telegraph bloggers

    Dan Hodges vs SeanT

    The debate about Muslim women wearing veils is not complex. This is Britain, and in Britain you can wear what you want

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100236076/the-debate-about-muslim-women-wearing-veils-is-not-complex-this-is-britain-and-in-britain-you-can-wear-what-you-want/

    Brilliant piece. Sound fellow, this Hodges. What else does he write about? Oh...
    Plato said:

    Politico Daily @Politico_Daily
    "Do you support or oppose raising the top rate of income tax from 45p to 50p? Support 68 Oppose 21 Don't know 11 #YouGov

    Labour barking up the wrong tree yet again?

    Eh? 68-21 seems a decent margin.
    antifrank said:

    I don't see how Nigel Farage could be included in the debates and representatives of the SNP, the Greens, Plaid Cymru and the various northern Irish parties could be excluded.

    A sensible compromise would be to have one debate with more party leaders and two with just the main three. I expect that something like that will happen.

    The German solution was to have two debates on successive days, one between the Big Two (CDU/SPD) and one between the Smaller 3 (FDP/Greens/Left). Both of equal length but the first obviously more focused on what sort of government they'd want, the latter more on what sort of policies they like. I can see Tories and Labour liking that for different reasons, and UKIP and the Greens might buy it as better than nothing, but presumably Clegg wouldn't fancy it much.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,584
    edited September 2013
    Interesting polling information (note clicking the link below is not advisable if you're at work)

    Lib Dems are finally showing support for Page 3 - after nearly half rejected barmy calls for a ban.

    Some 46 per cent of 580 party councillors believe it would be WRONG to outlaw our most popular page.

    Only a third want a ban while 18 per cent are undecided, a ComRes poll for BBC1's Sunday Politics found.

    http://www.page3.com/incoming/lib-dems-bust-wishes-72413.html
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    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    "Do you agree that people other than you should pick up the tab for the nation's bills ? "

    Lolzpoll

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    felixfelix Posts: 15,125

    The vice-president of the European Commission has reiterated that any part of an EU member state which secedes from that state automatically leaves the EU.

    Interesting.
    I'd be happy for Scotland to secede unless there is v.strong support to stay in the union. A half-hearted, carping we want more handouts meme would do none of us any good. Re the EU - they'd sure;y be allowed in although i think they may have to take the Euro.
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    FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,060
    felix said:

    The vice-president of the European Commission has reiterated that any part of an EU member state which secedes from that state automatically leaves the EU.

    Interesting.
    I'd be happy for Scotland to secede unless there is v.strong support to stay in the union. A half-hearted, carping we want more handouts meme would do none of us any good. Re the EU - they'd sure;y be allowed in although i think they may have to take the Euro.
    On the issue of the Euro, it would be a commitment in the longer run to join (which basically means nothing). Salomnd could spin it and say it means keeping the option open. Poland, Czechs etc are in the same position but no-one expects them to join the Euro anytime soon.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    @NickPalmer - your interweb irony chip is malfunctioning. I'm observing that Labour are onto something here for a change.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    TGOHF said:

    "Do you agree that people other than you should pick up the tab for the nation's bills ? "

    Lolzpoll

    I vote for that!
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    Battle of the Telegraph bloggers

    Dan Hodges vs SeanT

    The debate about Muslim women wearing veils is not complex. This is Britain, and in Britain you can wear what you want

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100236076/the-debate-about-muslim-women-wearing-veils-is-not-complex-this-is-britain-and-in-britain-you-can-wear-what-you-want/

    I thought the point about banning it in schools was bold. After all there is nothing unusual about restrictions in dress inside the school gate as many of us have found out to our cost over the years. What I found strange was the idea that it should be banned in public places. Whilst it may be a denial of freedom that leads to the veil being worn in the first place, this is hard to prove and generally we're the sort of liberal society that says people can wear what they want.

    It may seem crass politics but from Ed Miliband's point of view, being seen as a vacillating politician without strength could be an image considerably enhanced by calling for a ban on the veil inside schools.
    The other evening I mentioned the uncomfortable position such a rule put on Mrs J when she taught in a Turkish university. Whether to report a woman for wearing a ḥijāb, and potentially stop her getting any further education, or ignore it and run the moral and legal implications of allowing someone in class to wear it.

    One potential side effect of a ban in schools would be parents removing children from school to self-teach, and the consequent problems of social exclusion that leads to.

    It's a complex issue.
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    felix said:

    The vice-president of the European Commission has reiterated that any part of an EU member state which secedes from that state automatically leaves the EU.

    Interesting.
    I'd be happy for Scotland to secede unless there is v.strong support to stay in the union. A half-hearted, carping we want more handouts meme would do none of us any good. Re the EU - they'd sure;y be allowed in although i think they may have to take the Euro.
    I've always thought the more elegant solution was that were Scotland to vote for Independence, the remainder of the UK secedes, so Scotland is the successor state.

    So Scotland remains in the EU, whilst England et al leave the EU, everyone's a winner.
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    The English plotting Scotland's escape

    The referendum on Scottish independence is just a year away and, as Neil Tweedie discovers, there are many people from south of the border who want to live in a new country to the north

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scotland/scottish-politics/10311224/The-English-plotting-Scotlands-escape.html
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    dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,290
    I'm more green than you are smugness - this pure unadulterated taurean waste from the person formally known as Prime Minister Brown.

    http://www.businessgreen.com/bg/news/1801994/gordon-brown-ive-solar-panel-house
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited September 2013
    felix said:

    The vice-president of the European Commission has reiterated that any part of an EU member state which secedes from that state automatically leaves the EU.

    Interesting.
    I'd be happy for Scotland to secede unless there is v.strong support to stay in the union. A half-hearted, carping we want more handouts meme would do none of us any good. Re the EU - they'd sure;y be allowed in although i think they may have to take the Euro.
    Erm....isn't being forced into not being part of the EU or accepting the Euro a wee bit important for the Scottish independence debate? The Scottish share of the UK's national debt is (and will still be) denominated in Sterling. But their tax flows and servicing ability would be in Euros. If, as seems hugely likely, the Euro declines vs the Pound (they want the Euro to weaken) then they'd find themselves heading for a default. This would be a pretty good reason for not admitting Scotland to the EU, as a bankrupt Scotland could kick off a wave of defaults around the Eurozone - until they meet a sustained period of entry conditions qualification. So would Scotland find itself not part of the single market? Yet another unanswered question as the vote nears. Ho hum.
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,369
    Plato said:

    @NickPalmer - your interweb irony chip is malfunctioning. I'm observing that Labour are onto something here for a change.

    Sorry plato!
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    All hotting up

    Martin Evans @evansma
    Judge Murphy says it is unfair to ask a witness to give evidence against someone they cannot see.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    LOL

    Nick Boles @GeneralBoles
    Clegg The Barbarian for @jameskirkup #LDconf pic.twitter.com/AxO2QJyPJe
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    A smart article in commentisfree on the ideological crisis on the left:

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/sep/16/left-new-party-ideas

    The author identifies lots of problems but no solutions.
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    felix said:

    The vice-president of the European Commission has reiterated that any part of an EU member state which secedes from that state automatically leaves the EU.

    Interesting.
    I'd be happy for Scotland to secede unless there is v.strong support to stay in the union. A half-hearted, carping we want more handouts meme would do none of us any good. Re the EU - they'd sure;y be allowed in although i think they may have to take the Euro.
    I've always thought the more elegant solution was that were Scotland to vote for Independence, the remainder of the UK secedes, so Scotland is the successor state.

    So Scotland remains in the EU, whilst England et al leave the EU, everyone's a winner.
    I've mentioned this before but if instead of leaving, England etc agree to become part of Gibraltar, they can stay in the EU but get out of all the stuff Gibraltar is opted out of, like the CAP.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Tom Newton Dunn @tnewtondunn
    So after all that, at 11th hour Vince Cable fell into line and voted with @nick_clegg on every part of the Libs conference economy vote.
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    felix said:

    The vice-president of the European Commission has reiterated that any part of an EU member state which secedes from that state automatically leaves the EU.

    Interesting.
    I'd be happy for Scotland to secede unless there is v.strong support to stay in the union. A half-hearted, carping we want more handouts meme would do none of us any good. Re the EU - they'd sure;y be allowed in although i think they may have to take the Euro.
    I've always thought the more elegant solution was that were Scotland to vote for Independence, the remainder of the UK secedes, so Scotland is the successor state.

    So Scotland remains in the EU, whilst England et al leave the EU, everyone's a winner.
    I've mentioned this before but if instead of leaving, England etc agree to become part of Gibraltar, they can stay in the EU but get out of all the stuff Gibraltar is opted out of, like the CAP.
    That's an even better solution.
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    JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,017
    edited September 2013
    (Deleted repetitive post about Populus poll)
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    Interesting polling information (note clicking the link below is not advisable if you're at work)

    Lib Dems are finally showing support for Page 3 - after nearly half rejected barmy calls for a ban.

    Some 46 per cent of 580 party councillors believe it would be WRONG to outlaw our most popular page.

    Only a third want a ban while 18 per cent are undecided, a ComRes poll for BBC1's Sunday Politics found.

    http://www.page3.com/incoming/lib-dems-bust-wishes-72413.html

    My word... the lib dems actually being liberal. Who would have thought it..
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    New Thread
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    Battle of the Telegraph bloggers


    Dan Hodges vs SeanT

    The debate about Muslim women wearing veils is not complex. This is Britain, and in Britain you can wear what you want

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100236076/the-debate-about-muslim-women-wearing-veils-is-not-complex-this-is-britain-and-in-britain-you-can-wear-what-you-want/

    I thought the point about banning it in schools was bold. After all there is nothing unusual about restrictions in dress inside the school gate as many of us have found out to our cost over the years. What I found strange was the idea that it should be banned in public places. Whilst it may be a denial of freedom that leads to the veil being worn in the first place, this is hard to prove and generally we're the sort of liberal society that says people can wear what they want.

    It may seem crass politics but from Ed Miliband's point of view, being seen as a vacillating politician without strength could be an image considerably enhanced by calling for a ban on the veil inside schools.
    The other evening I mentioned the uncomfortable position such a rule put on Mrs J when she taught in a Turkish university. Whether to report a woman for wearing a ḥijāb, and potentially stop her getting any further education, or ignore it and run the moral and legal implications of allowing someone in class to wear it.

    One potential side effect of a ban in schools would be parents removing children from school to self-teach, and the consequent problems of social exclusion that leads to.

    It's a complex issue.
    Thats the trouble with rules and laws in general in that you more you have the more you can mess up peoples lives by reporting /arresting them for it. A lot of time that is worse than the original intention to prevent something happening. Not that politicians accept this with ever increasing rules,regulations and things to consider banning - As an example its rather depressing that a significant number of so called liberal democrats want to ban page 3 FGS
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    FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,060
    TSE - Regarding the successor state surely the big question is who gets to keep the Pound? Now the SNP have changed their mind and decided they want to keep it (for now) would they have any right to a say about Monetary policy having decided to leave the UK?
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    The other evening I mentioned the uncomfortable position such a rule put on Mrs J when she taught in a Turkish university. Whether to report a woman for wearing a ḥijāb, and potentially stop her getting any further education, or ignore it and run the moral and legal implications of allowing someone in class to wear it.

    One potential side effect of a ban in schools would be parents removing children from school to self-teach, and the consequent problems of social exclusion that leads to.

    It's a complex issue.

    Thats the trouble with rules and laws in general in that you more you have the more you can mess up peoples lives by reporting /arresting them for it. A lot of time that is worse than the original intention to prevent something happening. Not that politicians accept this with ever increasing rules,regulations and things to consider banning - As an example its rather depressing that a significant number of so called liberal democrats want to ban page 3 FGS
    Yep. Another point is the question I often ask: "What problem is the proposed law trying to solve?", and its follow-up: "What are the side effects?"

    One of the reasons I'm currently against the Royal Mail sale is that no-one has really explained the reason they want to sell it: the only example given on here was an EU regulation. Not good enough.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    The veil/niqab shows us how an interpretation of a religious text can become a cultural norm no matter how extreme. The text in the qu'ran referred to as justification is "to draw their cloaks (veils) over their bodies", however two alternate translations simply refer to 'over-garments' - One could argue that simply mean women should wear clothes in public to avoid harrasment (A sensible enough thing to say) !

    Now I'm not sure how many rights women had in 6th Century Mecca, but the world has 'moved on' since then. As ever one can interpret an old religious text any which way but loose - it is unfortunate for Islam that alot of their most 'respected' scholars/leaders and so forth seem to be stuck in 7th century ways of thinking.
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    fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,279
    edited September 2013
    Daily Mail - 'Ridiculous' Vince Cable falls into line to back Nick Clegg as Lib Dems are warned they cannot be 'bashful' about the recovery
    Plato said:

    Tom Newton Dunn @tnewtondunn
    So after all that, at 11th hour Vince Cable fell into line and voted with @nick_clegg on every part of the Libs conference economy vote.

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    Pulpstar said:

    The veil/niqab shows us how an interpretation of a religious text can become a cultural norm no matter how extreme. The text in the qu'ran referred to as justification is "to draw their cloaks (veils) over their bodies", however two alternate translations simply refer to 'over-garments' - One could argue that simply mean women should wear clothes in public to avoid harrasment (A sensible enough thing to say) !

    Now I'm not sure how many rights women had in 6th Century Mecca, but the world has 'moved on' since then. As ever one can interpret an old religious text any which way but loose - it is unfortunate for Islam that alot of their most 'respected' scholars/leaders and so forth seem to be stuck in 7th century ways of thinking.

    I guess the same is true about eating pork. In hot countries in times gone by not eating pork was very sensible as measly pork could kill. Today, in the age of international refrigerated distribution, it's meaningless. But religions aren't very good at letting changing circumstances seep into their ideology very fast. Look how long it took Christianity to come around very reluctantly to the idea that the earth goes around the sun. The human rights / personal freedoms angle on 'wear / don't wear what you like' is going to take a LONG time to seep into Islam. The Christian church is not there yet on homosexuality. It will eventually.

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    One potential side effect of a ban in schools would be parents removing children from school to self-teach, and the consequent problems of social exclusion that leads to.

    And it could - potentially - cover up child-abuse and Female-Genital-Mutilation. What should society do to remedy such evils? Ignore (in the belief that Keir Starmer knows best)...?

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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    "YouGov-Cambridge
    @YouGovCam
    YouGov President Peter Kellner predicts that UKIP will come first in the 2014 EU elections on 30%, Labour 25%, Con 18%, LD 8% #YGCam"

    twitter.com/YouGovCam/status/378454377855737856

    This was mentioned the other day, but now seems to be official.

    Yes, and all the more reason that Farage or whoever is leading UKIP at the time, should have equal billing with the other party leaders in any pre election debate on TV.
This discussion has been closed.