No, I don't think it did. As Carlotta quoted, the Agreement was specifically referenced in the Accession Treaty in such a way that implied it not only remained in force after 1973 but overrode the normal accession arrangements.
My assumption - and this is only an assumption - is that the Agreement was never formally lapsed or abrogated as it simply became a dead letter with both states in the EEC/EC/EU. If so, it's still an active treaty and could be resurrected both in the discussions with the EU (and Dublin, as appropriate), and also with the WTO as justification for not imposing a border and customs on Ireland if no agreement is reached.
As we know, members of the customs union cannot have their own, independent FTAs.
No, I don't think it did. As Carlotta quoted, the Agreement was specifically referenced in the Accession Treaty in such a way that implied it not only remained in force after 1973 but overrode the normal accession arrangements.
My assumption - and this is only an assumption - is that the Agreement was never formally lapsed or abrogated as it simply became a dead letter with both states in the EEC/EC/EU. If so, it's still an active treaty and could be resurrected both in the discussions with the EU (and Dublin, as appropriate), and also with the WTO as justification for not imposing a border and customs on Ireland if no agreement is reached.
As we know, members of the customs union cannot have their own, independent FTAs.
I've seen it argued that as there was a previous agreement, Ireland should 'honour it'. I.e. leave the EU and recreate the status quo ante.
I won't be backing the Obamas until I've worked out the protocols for inviting former but not current presidents.
If Obama is invited, I think they have to invite Trump too. Now, the question then becomes would Trump come to England for the wedding of the sixth in line to the throne?
I suspect not, as Trump only likes to be at events where he has top billing. But he's probably worth a punt at 50-1.
@chrisshipitv: We have just been told Meghan’s ring made from 3 stones: one from Botswana (where couple holidayed recently) and 2 diamonds from his mother Diana’s personal collection
I won't be backing the Obamas until I've worked out the protocols for inviting former but not current presidents.
If Obama is invited, I think they have to invite Trump too. Now, the question then becomes would Trump come to England for the wedding of the sixth in line to the throne?
I suspect not, as Trump only likes to be at events where he has top billing. But he's probably worth a punt at 50-1.
Given what she said about Trump in the past, I am surprised he isn't on twitter denouncing her as a failed Hollywood actress....
No, I don't think it did. As Carlotta quoted, the Agreement was specifically referenced in the Accession Treaty in such a way that implied it not only remained in force after 1973 but overrode the normal accession arrangements.
My assumption - and this is only an assumption - is that the Agreement was never formally lapsed or abrogated as it simply became a dead letter with both states in the EEC/EC/EU. If so, it's still an active treaty and could be resurrected both in the discussions with the EU (and Dublin, as appropriate), and also with the WTO as justification for not imposing a border and customs on Ireland if no agreement is reached.
As we know, members of the customs union cannot have their own, independent FTAs.
That's the EU's policy but it's not that of the WTO. In any case, A50 allows the EU to make up the rules as it goes along. if they want to indulge an exceptional solution to an exceptional problem, they can.
On topic, the stand-out bet to me looks to be Boris to attend. There will probably be foreign royalty and statesmen present - certainly if it's a big scale do. I'd have thought it pretty likely that the Foreign Secretary would be in attendance in such circumstances (as well as being a major politician in his own right).
Sure, there are risks in that argument but I think it's much less than a 9/1 shot.
German update: CDU (who had dipped further after the election) and especially Greens seem to be benefiting from the current situation at the expense of AfD, though it's all very marginal: presumably a few voters are thinking "I'll vote for someone willing to sort out the mess".
I have no idea about Harry and Meghan's friends and guest lists, but I am on firmer ground with rain. It rains an average of 8 days a month in the south East of England with little seasonal variation. So no value there.
"Yeah, the US has definitely managed to round up and deport all the millions of illegals living there."
My wife comes originally from a country that supplies the UK with immigrants, some of them illegal. She, of course, is here legally. But, since she runs a shop in a London market, she frequently encounters people who are not. Most of these people are economic migrants. They have usually entered the country legally - on tourist visas or perhaps as domestic workers with foreign employers. They work cash in hand in small restaurants, as domestic cleaners or as labourers for small builders. In general their compatriots are sympathetic to the plight of those without papers, the last thing they would do is report them to the authorities, and a bounty system would not change these attitudes.
Occasionally illegals are reported by someone with a grudge - this sometimes results in UKBA taking action but it's rare for this to result in deportation, illegals will perhaps claim to be in a relationship with someone here legally or they will find other obstacles to throw in the way of the process. It's impossibly expensive to keep them in custody while their cases are resolved and the police have far more urgent things to do - they are not interested in pursuing people unless more serious crime is involved. So people just move on somewhere else. They live in houses rented by people who are here legally - as long as rents are paid landlords are unlikely to take an interest and if they do ask they will just be told that so and so is staying for a few weeks.
Work and accommodation is found through word of mouth networks which operate in London and, no doubt, other big cities. It's more difficult now that the rules have been tightened but by no means impossible. This kind of thing has been going on for decades and it won't be stopping any time soon.
"Yeah, the US has definitely managed to round up and deport all the millions of illegals living there."
My wife comes originally from a country that supplies the UK with immigrants, some of them illegal. She, of course, is here legally. But, since she runs a shop in a London market, she frequently encounters people who are not. Most of these people are economic migrants. They have usually entered the country legally - on tourist visas or perhaps as domestic workers with foreign employers. They work cash in hand in small restaurants, as domestic cleaners or as labourers for small builders. In general their compatriots are sympathetic to the plight of those without papers, the last thing they would do is report them to the authorities, and a bounty system would not change these attitudes.
Occasionally illegals are reported by someone with a grudge - this sometimes results in UKBA taking action but it's rare for this to result in deportation, illegals will perhaps claim to be in a relationship with someone here legally or they will find other obstacles to throw in the way of the process. It's impossibly expensive to keep them in custody while their cases are resolved and the police have far more urgent things to do - they are not interested in pursuing people unless more serious crime is involved. So people just move on somewhere else. They live in houses rented by people who are here legally - as long as rents are paid landlords are unlikely to take an interest and if they do ask they will just be told that so and so is staying for a few weeks.
Work and accommodation is found through word of mouth networks which operate in London and, no doubt, other big cities. It's more difficult now that the rules have been tightened but by no means impossible. This kind of thing has been going on for decades and it won't be stopping any time soon.
Of course nothing will change if nothing is actually done about it.
Can't keep track of the royals. Do many people really care who this fellow Harry marries, apart from just nebulously thinking "That's nice"?
Much more than that? Not many, but that’s kind of the point - plenty are vaguely interested, and that’s more than most. (And it’s not just a case of it being forced on us - sure, that happens, but every time I walk past one of the celeb gossip rags Kate MIddleton appears to be on the cover, and has done for years, so presumably there are a lot of people for whom this sort of story, and other much more minor titbits, is just what they want. Whether that is good for monarchy long term when there are no interesting or attractive royals I don’t know, because someone else may not be able to get away with the Queen’s studious boringness.)
Days like today bring out my inner republican. Time to find a nuclear shelter to sit out the next few days' fawning.
I like Prince Harry, and today's brought out my inner monarchist.
... an updated avatar in the offing?
Yup, just changed my profile pic to celebrate this momentous day.
Oh you cheeky bugger.
I'm in mourning too, this means Meghan Markle and Patrick J. Adams are leaving Suits.
Good show, for the most part. If they are gone the show will have to as well, the whole premise is based around Mike’s journey and his relationships, even if others have their own stories too.
Days like today bring out my inner republican. Time to find a nuclear shelter to sit out the next few days' fawning.
I like Prince Harry, and today's brought out my inner monarchist.
... an updated avatar in the offing?
Yup, just changed my profile pic to celebrate this momentous day.
Oh you cheeky bugger.
I'm in mourning too, this means Meghan Markle and Patrick J. Adams are leaving Suits.
Good show, for the most part. If they are gone the show will have to as well, the whole premise is based around Mike’s journey and his relationships, even if others have their own stories too.
There's a spin off featuring Jessica in the works.
German update: CDU (who had dipped further after the election) and especially Greens seem to be benefiting from the current situation at the expense of AfD, though it's all very marginal: presumably a few voters are thinking "I'll vote for someone willing to sort out the mess".
Germans not a fan of instability regretting their contribution to it perhaps? How different from our own public - voting in ways designed to cause persistent instability.
Days like today bring out my inner republican. Time to find a nuclear shelter to sit out the next few days' fawning.
I like Prince Harry, and today's brought out my inner monarchist.
... an updated avatar in the offing?
Yup, just changed my profile pic to celebrate this momentous day.
Oh you cheeky bugger.
I'm in mourning too, this means Meghan Markle and Patrick J. Adams are leaving Suits.
Good show, for the most part. If they are gone the show will have to as well, the whole premise is based around Mike’s journey and his relationships, even if others have their own stories too.
There's a spin off featuring Jessica in the works.
Yeah, but her leaving made sense and she left the city setting, no way all the others do that, and if in the same place I cannot see it working. This isn’t The Closer ‘spin off’ ing into Major Crimes (all they did was change the so called main character, but it was the same cast doing the same thing other than that)
I'd say 8/1 might be more realistic. You might laugh, but this is a UK-US thing and including him might be the diplomatic thing to do <1 year from Brexit.
Can't keep track of the royals. Do many people really care who this fellow Harry marries, apart from just nebulously thinking "That's nice"?
Harry is, as I have said before on here, hot. And now, sadly, unavailable.
It is nice to have a bit of good news. Weddings are always fun.
To be a tiny bit serious, though, there is some symbolic value in the fact that someone who is part African-American, part Irish is marrying into the Royal Family. It reflects the way society increasingly is these days. It shows an openness which is welcome. And the fact that Harry has been so critical of the racist abuse that his fiancé received is also a good symbol, much as his mother's willingness to touch Aids victims was, long before this became fashionable.
The general over-the-top wedding bollocks we will be subjected to is tiresome. But nice for Harry and for his family / friends that he has found someone he loves who seems lovely and intelligent and not simply a simpering clothes horse.
And if it gives those who are interested a bit of a cheer in gloomy days, what's the problem?
Better this than reading about middle aged men sweating over porn or leering at young employees.
German update: CDU (who had dipped further after the election) and especially Greens seem to be benefiting from the current situation at the expense of AfD, though it's all very marginal: presumably a few voters are thinking "I'll vote for someone willing to sort out the mess".
Perhaps it's also a consequence of the loss of their (edit: the AfD's) figurehead Frauke Petry, who resigned from the party (to form her own party) after the election. The AfD is riven with internal turmoil and leadership struggles, much like other far-right parties one could mention.
Mr. Royale, I'm not so sure about Trump getting an invite. If the future Princess Meghan doesn't like him, that's a big problem for him. And if Obama didn't get an invite, that's a recent precedent.
Plus the order, I think, of importance in guests is: British royalty foreign royalty British politicians foreign politicians
So Trump's a disliked member of the least prestigious category.
I'd say 8/1 might be more realistic. You might laugh, but this is a UK-US thing and including him might be the diplomatic thing to do <1 year from Brexit.</p>
Invite? Possibly. But would he attend an event where he'd be a bit-part player and where protocol would determine that he'd be lower down the pecking order than any crowned head attending, never mind the principals. Besides, I suspect the US Secret Service would have a fit about the security implications.
Can't keep track of the royals. Do many people really care who this fellow Harry marries, apart from just nebulously thinking "That's nice"?
fantastically misunderestimating the British people, there, Nick.
Hard to disagree with your response there.
Though I do think that the tabloids using occasions like this to needle Corbyn on his republican views will fall flat, which would have been unimaginable 30 years ago.
Mr. Royale, I'm not so sure about Trump getting an invite. If the future Princess Meghan doesn't like him, that's a big problem for him. And if Obama didn't get an invite, that's a recent precedent.
Plus the order, I think, of importance in guests is: British royalty foreign royalty British politicians foreign politicians
So Trump's a disliked member of the least prestigious category.
Put commonwealth politicians between the British and foreign ones, and he’s even lower down.
German update: CDU (who had dipped further after the election) and especially Greens seem to be benefiting from the current situation at the expense of AfD, though it's all very marginal: presumably a few voters are thinking "I'll vote for someone willing to sort out the mess".
Perhaps it's also a consequence of the loss of their (edit: the AfD's) figurehead Frauke Petry, who resigned from the party (to form her own party) after the election. The AfD is riven with internal turmoil and leadership struggles, much like other far-right parties one could mention.
I wouldn't describe the Conservatives as 'far-right'.
Mr. Royale, I'm not so sure about Trump getting an invite. If the future Princess Meghan doesn't like him, that's a big problem for him. And if Obama didn't get an invite, that's a recent precedent.
Plus the order, I think, of importance in guests is: British royalty foreign royalty British politicians foreign politicians
So Trump's a disliked member of the least prestigious category.
Put commonwealth politicians between the British and foreign ones, and he’s even lower down.
Mr. Royale, I'm not so sure about Trump getting an invite. If the future Princess Meghan doesn't like him, that's a big problem for him. And if Obama didn't get an invite, that's a recent precedent.
Plus the order, I think, of importance in guests is: British royalty foreign royalty British politicians foreign politicians
So Trump's a disliked member of the least prestigious category.
Put commonwealth politicians between the British and foreign ones, and he’s even lower down.
Turnbull.....if he's still PM.......
Robert Mugabe - he’s officially an elder statesman now.
For those thinking of betting on this market- there’s a good wiki article on guests to the last royal wedding. Hague went so I would think Boris is a good bet.
Inviting Barack but not Trump would be quite a snub (and I think certain he would take it personally) for this reason I think Trump is a better bet than Obama.
Can't keep track of the royals. Do many people really care who this fellow Harry marries, apart from just nebulously thinking "That's nice"?
Harry is, as I have said before on here, hot. And now, sadly, unavailable.
It is nice to have a bit of good news. Weddings are always fun.
To be a tiny bit serious, though, there is some symbolic value in the fact that someone who is part African-American, part Irish is marrying into the Royal Family. It reflects the way society increasingly is these days. It shows an openness which is welcome. And the fact that Harry has been so critical of the racist abuse that his fiancé received is also a good symbol, much as his mother's willingness to touch Aids victims was, long before this became fashionable.
The general over-the-top wedding bollocks we will be subjected to is tiresome. But nice for Harry and for his family / friends that he has found someone he loves who seems lovely and intelligent and not simply a simpering clothes horse.
And if it gives those who are interested a bit of a cheer in gloomy days, what's the problem?
Better this than reading about middle aged men sweating over porn or leering at young employees.
That is a good point. We have come a long way since the establishment was shuddering at the prospect of Diana marrying a muslim.
I'd say 8/1 might be more realistic. You might laugh, but this is a UK-US thing and including him might be the diplomatic thing to do <1 year from Brexit.</p>
Invite? Possibly. But would he attend an event where he'd be a bit-part player and where protocol would determine that he'd be lower down the pecking order than any crowned head attending, never mind the principals. Besides, I suspect the US Secret Service would have a fit about the security implications.
I think he’d go. He likes events and royal wedding is prestigious. He will find a way to make it about him either way. I’d suggest he avoids any close interactions with the bride though...
Mr. Royale, I'm not so sure about Trump getting an invite. If the future Princess Meghan doesn't like him, that's a big problem for him. And if Obama didn't get an invite, that's a recent precedent.
Plus the order, I think, of importance in guests is: British royalty foreign royalty British politicians foreign politicians
So Trump's a disliked member of the least prestigious category.
Put commonwealth politicians between the British and foreign ones, and he’s even lower down.
I think it's foreign heads of state second, whether Kings or Presidents.
Can't keep track of the royals. Do many people really care who this fellow Harry marries, apart from just nebulously thinking "That's nice"?
Harry is, as I have said before on here, hot. And now, sadly, unavailable.
It is nice to have a bit of good news. Weddings are always fun.
To be a tiny bit serious, though, there is some symbolic value in the fact that someone who is part African-American, part Irish is marrying into the Royal Family. It reflects the way society increasingly is these days. It shows an openness which is welcome. And the fact that Harry has been so critical of the racist abuse that his fiancé received is also a good symbol, much as his mother's willingness to touch Aids victims was, long before this became fashionable.
The general over-the-top wedding bollocks we will be subjected to is tiresome. But nice for Harry and for his family / friends that he has found someone he loves who seems lovely and intelligent and not simply a simpering clothes horse.
And if it gives those who are interested a bit of a cheer in gloomy days, what's the problem?
Better this than reading about middle aged men sweating over porn or leering at young employees.
That is a good point. We have come a long way since the establishment was shuddering at the prospect of Diana marrying a muslim.
If someone in line to the throne looked like they’d plan to, I wouldn’t be surprised to see a shudder return.
Can't keep track of the royals. Do many people really care who this fellow Harry marries, apart from just nebulously thinking "That's nice"?
Harry is, as I have said before on here, hot. And now, sadly, unavailable.
It is nice to have a bit of good news. Weddings are always fun.
To be a tiny bit serious, though, there is some symbolic value in the fact that someone who is part African-American, part Irish is marrying into the Royal Family. It reflects the way society increasingly is these days. It shows an openness which is welcome. And the fact that Harry has been so critical of the racist abuse that his fiancé received is also a good symbol, much as his mother's willingness to touch Aids victims was, long before this became fashionable.
The general over-the-top wedding bollocks we will be subjected to is tiresome. But nice for Harry and for his family / friends that he has found someone he loves who seems lovely and intelligent and not simply a simpering clothes horse.
And if it gives those who are interested a bit of a cheer in gloomy days, what's the problem?
Better this than reading about middle aged men sweating over porn or leering at young employees.
That is a good point. We have come a long way since the establishment was shuddering at the prospect of Diana marrying a muslim.
The suggestion that she was even considering it was in the fevered imagination of Dodi's Dad, I suspect. The establishment shuddering was more at Diana's general behaviour rather than at who she might have married - a stable and happy marriage is exactly what that poor woman needed.
For those thinking of betting on this market- there’s a good wiki article on guests to the last royal wedding. Hague went so I would think Boris is a good bet.
Inviting Barack but not Trump would be quite a snub (and I think certain he would take it personally) for this reason I think Trump is a better bet than Obama.
Both might be invited. They might not be equally likely to attend.
Donald Trump, like Teddy Roosevelt, wants to be the bride at every wedding and the corpse at every funeral. I can't see him wanting to sit in the third row mutely. He won't attend whether or not invited.
Mr. Royale, I'm not so sure about Trump getting an invite. If the future Princess Meghan doesn't like him, that's a big problem for him. And if Obama didn't get an invite, that's a recent precedent.
Plus the order, I think, of importance in guests is: British royalty foreign royalty British politicians foreign politicians
So Trump's a disliked member of the least prestigious category.
Put commonwealth politicians between the British and foreign ones, and he’s even lower down.
I think it's foreign heads of state second, whether Kings or Presidents.
Really? Well what’s even the point of being a royal if your fellow royals don’t given you preference at such events? They are a diminishing breed (in name anyway, plenty of pseudo-monarchies out there).
Days like today bring out my inner republican. Time to find a nuclear shelter to sit out the next few days' fawning.
I like Prince Harry, and today's brought out my inner monarchist.
I have no objection to Prince Harry. It's the cringing deference to the news that irks me.
It's more about "it" than it is about them, although as celebrities, it's also about him and her.
Royal weddings act as milestone markers in our national story that all can unite, celebrate and reflect around.
Also the fawning and deference is massively lower than it was in the 1980s. I remember watching both the Charles-Diana and Andrew-Fergie weddings at school, look at the footage again and it is far more toe curling than today. The royal divorces, the annus horribilis and the death of Diana seem to have killed off the old level of deference, and good thing too. These days I don't think it's any more than showing courteous respect to the royal family and, of course, feeding the celebrity obsessed culture we live in.
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I suspect not, as Trump only likes to be at events where he has top billing. But he's probably worth a punt at 50-1.
Sure, there are risks in that argument but I think it's much less than a 9/1 shot.
EDIT - I see rcs1000 has already made the point.
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/935150368207654912
http://www.wahlrecht.de/umfragen/
*innocent face*
I mean I absolutely love the constant freezing of apps and the fact it now doesn't realign itself properly if I rotate the screen.
Just rejoice at that news....
HHemmelig said:
"Yeah, the US has definitely managed to round up and deport all the millions of illegals living there."
My wife comes originally from a country that supplies the UK with immigrants, some of them illegal. She, of course, is here legally. But, since she runs a shop in a London market, she frequently encounters people who are not. Most of these people are economic migrants. They have usually entered the country legally - on tourist visas or perhaps as domestic workers with foreign employers. They work cash in hand in small restaurants, as domestic cleaners or as labourers for small builders. In general their compatriots are sympathetic to the plight of those without papers, the last thing they would do is report them to the authorities, and a bounty system would not change these attitudes.
Occasionally illegals are reported by someone with a grudge - this sometimes results in UKBA taking action but it's rare for this to result in deportation, illegals will perhaps claim to be in a relationship with someone here legally or they will find other obstacles to throw in the way of the process. It's impossibly expensive to keep them in custody while their cases are resolved and the police have far more urgent things to do - they are not interested in pursuing people unless more serious crime is involved. So people just move on somewhere else. They live in houses rented by people who are here legally - as long as rents are paid landlords are unlikely to take an interest and if they do ask they will just be told that so and so is staying for a few weeks.
Work and accommodation is found through word of mouth networks which operate in London and, no doubt, other big cities. It's more difficult now that the rules have been tightened but by no means impossible. This kind of thing has been going on for decades and it won't be stopping any time soon.
A royal gyno checkup before vows ?
I'd say 8/1 might be more realistic. You might laugh, but this is a UK-US thing and including him might be the diplomatic thing to do <1 year from Brexit.
It is nice to have a bit of good news. Weddings are always fun.
To be a tiny bit serious, though, there is some symbolic value in the fact that someone who is part African-American, part Irish is marrying into the Royal Family. It reflects the way society increasingly is these days. It shows an openness which is welcome. And the fact that Harry has been so critical of the racist abuse that his fiancé received is also a good symbol, much as his mother's willingness to touch Aids victims was, long before this became fashionable.
The general over-the-top wedding bollocks we will be subjected to is tiresome. But nice for Harry and for his family / friends that he has found someone he loves who seems lovely and intelligent and not simply a simpering clothes horse.
And if it gives those who are interested a bit of a cheer in gloomy days, what's the problem?
Better this than reading about middle aged men sweating over porn or leering at young employees.
Chill, Alastair. There is an "off" button on the radio/TV.
The nuclear bunker will be needed - along with all the dried and non-perishable food to be stored in there - in March 2019.
Plus the order, I think, of importance in guests is:
British royalty
foreign royalty
British politicians
foreign politicians
So Trump's a disliked member of the least prestigious category.
Though I do think that the tabloids using occasions like this to needle Corbyn on his republican views will fall flat, which would have been unimaginable 30 years ago.
Royal weddings act as milestone markers in our national story that all can unite, celebrate and reflect around.
Inviting Barack but not Trump would be quite a snub (and I think certain he would take it personally) for this reason I think Trump is a better bet than Obama.
But in any case if this does turn out to be the case I just want you to note that you heard it here first from me.
PS Pretty much everything about the Royals strikes me as camp as Xmas so it seems to me miraculous that any of them are straight but there you go.
He will find a way to make it about him either way. I’d suggest he avoids any close interactions with the bride though...
Donald Trump, like Teddy Roosevelt, wants to be the bride at every wedding and the corpse at every funeral. I can't see him wanting to sit in the third row mutely. He won't attend whether or not invited.
US ambassador went though.