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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The UKIP leadership race – Alastair Meeks marks your card

As Mike Smithson pointed out last week, these are fallow days for political betting. We have been spoiled in recent years with a nonstop cavalcade of elections, referendums and leadership contests. We are suffering withdrawal pangs.

Read the full story here

Scrapheap_as_was

Countdown on to fantasy football league.... reminder for anyone to sign up.

Alice_Aforethought

Supporter of right to bear arms, owner of fortified compound in Bulgaria, claimed that a homosexual donkey had tried to rape his horse.

If this one doesn't win there is no justice.

dixiedean

Alice_Aforethought said:

Supporter of right to bear arms, owner of fortified compound in Bulgaria, claimed that a homosexual donkey had tried to rape his horse.

If this one doesn't win there is no justice.

It's him or the interstellar explorer for me.

williamglenn

FPT

ThreeQuidder said:

FF43 said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

Nigelb said:

Britain was No.1 it is now, for whatever reason, No.3.

If you actually look at the report, the 'whatever reason'(s) are quite clear.
Britain has dropped in the rankings principally on its score for 'engagement'. The metrics for this are as follows:

Total overseas development aid
Overseas development aid / GNI
Number of embassies abroad
Number of embassies in the country
Number of consulates general abroad
Number of permanent missions to multilateral organisations
Membership of international organisations
Environmental treaty signatures
Asylum seekers per 1,000 people
Number of diplomatic cultural missions
Number of countries a citizen can visit visa-free
Size of Weekly Audience of State Broadcaster
Environmental Performance Index (EPI)

No prizes for guessing why our score in this category dropped.

The real question is what might happen to the rest of these measures post Brexit, and it's way too early to be certain about that. Though I'm not a massive optimist.

So we're in the top three nations still our of nearly 200 and yet are outside the "group of international movers and shakers". If number 3 isn't in the group of international movers and shakers then just who is in your eyes and why do you cut it off there?

Don't blame me guv, it's the report wot Carlotta quoted. They think that. They cite China, Europe, and the US as the nexus of such decision-making.

Edit: China, the EU, and the US.

There is no question that has been the case until now. But really your edit should have been "Germany". Or possibly "Germany and France".

Germany and to some extent France work through the EU.

Nope. The EU is Germany + France, with perhaps minor placings to those who are happy to drive along their Project.

We have spent the past 25 years being ignored because we weren't signed up to the Project.

The single market was our Project. Enlargement was accelerated at our behest and against stalling from Germany.

The Conservatives lost one argument on the design of the single currency and some of them having stopped sulking yet.

Alice_Aforethought

The second bloke from the left looks like Rodders' fat printer mate from Goodnight Sweetheart
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0570302/mediaviewer/rm4206471936

rkrkrk

Great article.

Have to admit I'm surprised how many are gay.

TOPPING

fpt

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

Nigelb said:

Britain was No.1 it is now, for whatever reason, No.3.

If you actually look at the report, the 'whatever reason'(s) are quite clear.
Britain has dropped in the rankings principally on its score for 'engagement'. The metrics for this are as follows:

Total overseas development aid
Overseas development aid / GNI
Number of embassies abroad
Number of embassies in the country
Number of consulates general abroad
Number of permanent missions to multilateral organisations
Membership of international organisations
Environmental treaty signatures
Asylum seekers per 1,000 people
Number of diplomatic cultural missions
Number of countries a citizen can visit visa-free
Size of Weekly Audience of State Broadcaster
Environmental Performance Index (EPI)

No prizes for guessing why our score in this category dropped.

The real question is what might happen to the rest of these measures post Brexit, and it's way too early to be certain about that. Though I'm not a massive optimist.

So we're in the top three nations still our of nearly 200 and yet are outside the "group of international movers and shakers". If number 3 isn't in the group of international movers and shakers then just who is in your eyes and why do you cut it off there?

Don't blame me guv, it's the report wot Carlotta quoted. They think that. They cite China, Europe, and the US as the nexus of such decision-making.

Edit: China, the EU, and the US.

There is no question that has been the case until now. But really your edit should have been "Germany". Or possibly "Germany and France".

Again, not me.

Well, whoever, it's what it means. The number of countries in the EU with influence is at most two.

So we weren't confident enough to think we could hold our own with only two other countries and shape the EU in the way we wanted it shaped so had to leave? And somehow out of the EU we'll kick their arses?

Doesn't overflow with national confidence or pride, now, does it?

That makes no sense so I can't respond to it.

No. You don't understand what I said so you can't respond to it.

dixiedean

Social Conservative /borderline racist, or small state Libertarian? It appears to be make your mind up time. Given many of the latter have gone back to the Tories, I would suggest the former will win out. Either route looks an electoral blind alley at the moment. Whittle is much too short, however, as the only one people have heard of.
Mr Bolton has an impressive back story. In another party he could have a career.

welshowl

rkrkrk said:

Great article.

Have to admit I'm surprised how many are gay.

I'm speechless with wonder at this offering of candidates. Truly gobsmacked. Just for starters, why on God's earth would you apparently come into possession of a fortified compound in Bulgaria? Why? How? When? Details??

ThreeQuidder

TOPPING said:

fpt

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

Nigelb said:

Britain was No.1 it is now, for whatever reason, No.3.

If you actually look at the report, the 'whatever reason'(s) are quite clear.
Britain has dropped in the rankings principally on its score for 'engagement'. The metrics for this are as follows:

Total overseas development aid
Overseas development aid / GNI
Number of embassies abroad
Number of embassies in the country
Number of consulates general abroad
Number of permanent missions to multilateral organisations
Membership of international organisations
Environmental treaty signatures
Asylum seekers per 1,000 people
Number of diplomatic cultural missions
Number of countries a citizen can visit visa-free
Size of Weekly Audience of State Broadcaster
Environmental Performance Index (EPI)

No prizes for guessing why our score in this category dropped.

The real question is what might happen to the rest of these measures post Brexit, and it's way too early to be certain about that. Though I'm not a massive optimist.

So we're in the top three nations still our of nearly 200 and yet are outside the "group of international movers and shakers". If number 3 isn't in the group of international movers and shakers then just who is in your eyes and why do you cut it off there?

Don't blame me guv, it's the report wot Carlotta quoted. They think that. They cite China, Europe, and the US as the nexus of such decision-making.

Edit: China, the EU, and the US.

There is no question that has been the case until now. But really your edit should have been "Germany". Or possibly "Germany and France".

Again, not me.

Well, whoever, it's what it means. The number of countries in the EU with influence is at most two.

So we weren't confident enough to think we could hold our own with only two other countries and shape the EU in the way we wanted it shaped so had to leave? And somehow out of the EU we'll kick their arses?

Doesn't overflow with national confidence or pride, now, does it?

That makes no sense so I can't respond to it.

No. You don't understand what I said so you can't respond to it.

I understand what you think you are saying but it makes no sense because it misses a fundamental point.

Now, since we're on a new thread, shall we leave it there?

Beverley_C

Having read the Thread Header ...

On second thoughts, anyone want to discuss shoes?

TOPPING

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

fpt

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

Nigelb said:

Britain was No.1 it is now, for whatever reason, No.3.

If you actually look at the report, the 'whatever reason'(s) are quite clear.
Britain has dropped in the rankings principally on its score for 'engagement'. The metrics for this are as follows:

Total overseas devrmance Index (EPI)

No prizes for guessing why our score in this category dropped.

The real question is what might happen to the rest of these measures post Brexit, and it's way too early to be certain about that. Though I'm not a massive optimist.

So we're in the top three nations still our of nearly 200 and yet are outside the "group of international movers and shakers". If number 3 isn't in the group of international movers and shakers then just who is in your eyes and why do you cut it off there?

Don't blame me guv, it's the report wot Carlotta quoted. They think that. They cite China, Europe, and the US as the nexus of such decision-making.

Edit: China, the EU, and the US.

There is no question that has been the case until now. But really your edit should have been "Germany". Or possibly "Germany and France".

Again, not me.

Well, whoever, it's what it means. The number of countries in the EU with influence is at most two.

So we weren't confident enough to think we could hold our own with only two other countries and shape the EU in the way we wanted it shaped so had to leave? And somehow out of the EU we'll kick their arses?

Doesn't overflow with national confidence or pride, now, does it?

That makes no sense so I can't respond to it.

No. You don't understand what I said so you can't respond to it.

I understand what you think you are saying but it makes no sense because it misses a fundamental point.

Now, since we're on a new thread, shall we leave it there?

I will take that as a you agree with me wholeheartedly, and are sorry you doubted me for a minute.



Meanwhile, a new thread about the UKIP leader. I know betting opportunities are few and far between atm but we might as well discuss who might be the next head of the National Trust, for all that UKIP is related to party politics.

Richard_Nabavi

The 2026 deadline in the innovative proposal of Aidan Powlesland is particularly delicious.

Nigelb

Are those who gave Cameron a tough time for his infamous UKIP quote now ready to admit he might just have had a point... ?

Nigelb

Recognises that he is an unknown, but believes that the party is dying....
... so he'd be the ideal leader ?

Jason

“It’ll be another 20 years of rape, terror, erosion of liberty before professional politicians are forced to give the principled a chance.”

It won't, because those things are already the accepted norm. 'Islamophobia' is far more insidious than blowing up school children.

TGOHF

Nigelb said:

Are those who gave Cameron a tough time for his infamous UKIP quote now ready to admit he might just have had a point... ?

Brexit killed the Kippers and the LDs.

The only hope of a revival for either party is if it doesn't happen.

ThreeQuidder

Beverley_C said:

Having read the Thread Header ...

On second thoughts, anyone want to discuss shoes?

This is the sort of bet I like. It has no importance whatsoever...!

williamglenn

TGOHF said:

Nigelb said:

Are those who gave Cameron a tough time for his infamous UKIP quote now ready to admit he might just have had a point... ?

Brexit killed the Kippers and the LDs.

The only hope of a revival for either party is if it doesn't happen.

Brexit killed the LDs? That's some revisionism... Farron may have failed to create space for a comeback, but their trajectory since Brexit has not been down.

Nigelb

In favour of electoral reform to a system called F2PTP (First Two Past The Post).

Can we have a thread on this ??

TheScreamingEagles

Can't imagine why Islamophobes are attracted to UKIP.

It has to be the asteroid miner or homosexual donkey raped my horse man for me.

Blistering brilliant piece Alastair.

ThreeQuidder

Coutinho to Barcelona, £81.6m (up to £108.8m with bonuses)

http://www.espn.co.uk/football/story/3174603/liverpool-reach-agreement-to-sell-philippe-coutinho-to-barcelona-sources

Richard_Nabavi

Are they laying on hustings for our entertainment?

ThreeQuidder

Richard_Nabavi said:

Are they laying on hustings for our entertainment?

Apparently so.

http://www.ukipdaily.com/ukip-leadership-hustings/

Nigelb

Richard_Nabavi said:

Are they laying on hustings for our entertainment?

Scratch that - can't we get Channel 4 to lend the Big Brother house for a couple of weeks ?

Alice_Aforethought

TheScreamingEagles said:

Can't imagine why Islamophobes are attracted to UKIP.

It has to be the asteroid miner or homosexual donkey raped my horse man for me.

Blistering brilliant piece Alastair.

Well, there'll always be neigh sayers trying to stirrup trouble but there's a lot more to that homosexual-donkey-raped-my-horse story than he's letting on.

So the horse just stood there and let it happen? The supposedly straight horse? Yeah, right. I've got bad news for Rees-Evans: no way is that horse straight. It stood there and it loved it. It is a gay horse which probably causes floods.

williamglenn

Alastair Meeks said:

Both the favourite and the second favourite look set to remodel UKIP into a party familiar to the supporters of Geert Wilders and Marine Le Pen, with a strongly anti-Islam focus.

There's time for some more Judean People's Front/People's Front of Judea action with the far-right parliamentary groupings in Brussels before Brexit happens.

Perhaps they'll even start campaigning for Remain to keep their best platform alive.

foxinsoxuk

Richard_Nabavi said:

Are they laying on hustings for our entertainment?

They already have in Wales...

https://twitter.com/Cemlyn/status/893170423696961536

Nigelb

TOPPING said:

fpt

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

Nigelb said:

Britain was No.1 it is now, for whatever reason, No.3.

If you actually look at the report, the 'whatever reason'(s) are quite clear.
Britain has dropped in the rankings principally on its score for 'engagement'. The metrics for this are as follows:

Total overseas development aid
Overseas development aid / GNI
Number of embassies abroad
Number of embassies in the country
Number of consulates general abroad
Number of permanent missions to multilateral organisations
Membership of international organisations
Environmental treaty signatures
Asylum seekers per 1,000 people
Number of diplomatic cultural missions
Number of countries a citizen can visit visa-free
Size of Weekly Audience of State Broadcaster
Environmental Performance Index (EPI)

No prizes for guessing why our score in this category dropped.

The real question is what might happen to the rest of these measures post Brexit, and it's way too early to be certain about that. Though I'm not a massive optimist.

So we're in the top three nations still our of nearly 200 and yet are outside the "group of international movers and shakers". If number 3 isn't in the group of international movers and shakers then just who is in your eyes and why do you cut it off there?

Don't blame me guv, it's the report wot Carlotta quoted. They think that. They cite China, Europe, and the US as the nexus of such decision-making.

Edit: China, the EU, and the US.

There is no question that has been the case until now. But really your edit should have been "Germany". Or possibly "Germany and France".

Again, not me.

Well, whoever, it's what it means. The number of countries in the EU with influence is at most two.

So we weren't confident enough to think we could hold our own with only two other countries and shape the EU in the way we wanted it shaped so had to leave? And somehow out of the EU we'll kick their arses?

Doesn't overflow with national confidence or pride, now, does it?

That makes no sense so I can't respond to it.

No. You don't understand what I said so you can't respond to it.

You don't really understand how this human discourse thing works, do you ?

Blue_rog

I misread the last guy in the list and thought it was Marylin Manson!

Morris_Dancer

Further afield, the Catalan vote is around 1 October, isn't it? Still 1.4 for Yes on Ladbrokes (I believe someone tipped No at 2.75 some time ago).

Also, too short for me but those of you with moneybags might like 1.11 on Merkel staying Chancellor.

AlastairMeeks

I feel that I have been brief to the point of terseness in this lengthy post. I apologise for having to leave out local colour.

TOPPING

Nigelb said:

TOPPING said:

fpt

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TOPPING said:

Philip_Thompson said:

TOPPING said:

Nigelb said:

Britain was No.1 it is now, for whatever reason, No.3.

If you actually look at the report, the 'whatever reason'(s) are quite clear.
Britain has dropped in the rankings principally on its score for 'engagement'. The metrics for this are as follows:

Total overseas development aid
Overseas development aid / GNI
Number of embassies abroad
Number of embassies in the country
Number of consulates general abroad
Number of permanent missions to multilateral organisations
Membership of international organisations
Environmental treaty signatures
Asylum seekers per 1,000 people
Number of diplomatic cultural missions
Number of countries a citizen can visit visa-free
Size of Weekly Audience of State Broadcaster
Environmental Performance Index (EPI)

No prizes for guessing why our score in this category dropped.

The real question is what might happen to the rest of these measures post Brexit, and it's way too early to be certain about that. Though I'm not a massive optimist.

So we're in the top three nations still our of nearly 200 and yet are outside the "group of international movers and shakers". If number 3 isn't in the group of international movers and shakers then just who is in your eyes and why do you cut it off there?

Don't blame me guv, it's the report wot Carlotta quoted. They think that. They cite China, Europe, and the US as the nexus of such decision-making.

Edit: China, the EU, and the US.

There is no question that has been the case until now. But really your edit should have been "Germany". Or possibly "Germany and France".

Again, not me.

Well, whoever, it's what it means. The number of countries in the EU with influence is at most two.

So we weren't confident enough to think we could hold our own with only two other countries and shape the EU in the way we wanted it shaped so had to leave? And somehow out of the EU we'll kick their arses?

Doesn't overflow with national confidence or pride, now, does it?

That makes no sense so I can't respond to it.

No. You don't understand what I said so you can't respond to it.

You don't really understand how this human discourse thing works, do you ?

Sometimes life is too short.

Nigelb

Blue_rog said:

I misread the last guy in the list and thought it was Marylin Manson!

Far too staid.

JosiasJessop

Before we go too far in celebrating the strange beliefs of UKIP's candidates, it seems that, as ever, Ireland leads the way:

"Bad luck caused by disturbed fairy forts is causing dips in a major road between County Kerry and County Cork, an Irish member of parliament has said."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-40863737

williamglenn

http://news.sky.com/story/theresa-may-to-harden-up-brexit-negotiating-position-10979289

A Government source told Sky News ministers and officials have been working flat out to draw up the position papers, aware that the Brexit deadline is fast approaching.

"Position papers may determine whether or not we can move to the second stage of negotiations, work in recess is vital," said the figure.

"We never sleep."

The Government is planning a ministerial write round - where relevant ministers beyond the Cabinet are given sight of the position papers - for the week beginning 21 August, suggesting papers could be published from that week onwards.

Morris_Dancer

Mr. Jessop, to be fair, the Roman Republic repeatedly appointed all-powerful dictators for the sole purpose of hammering in a nail to appease the gods, after which they resigned.

foxinsoxuk

AlastairMeeks said:

I feel that I have been brief to the point of terseness in this lengthy post. I apologise for having to leave out local colour.

Surely the asteroid escape vehicle is best done as a collaborative venture with the ESA?

On the other hand a massive asteroid strike destroying all higher lifeforms does put Brexit into perspective, and something to look forward to...

Nigelb

JosiasJessop said:

Before we go too far in celebrating the strange beliefs of UKIP's candidates, it seems that, as ever, Ireland leads the way:

"Bad luck caused by disturbed fairy forts is causing dips in a major road between County Kerry and County Cork, an Irish member of parliament has said."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-40863737

Along with Iceland:
http://all-that-is-interesting.com/iceland-elves

Nigelb

foxinsoxuk said:

AlastairMeeks said:

I feel that I have been brief to the point of terseness in this lengthy post. I apologise for having to leave out local colour.

Surely the asteroid escape vehicle is best done as a collaborative venture with the ESA?

On the other hand a massive asteroid strike destroying all higher lifeforms does put Brexit into perspective, and something to look forward to...

Surely Brexit makes armageddon considerably more likely, if not certain ?

foxinsoxuk

Nigelb said:

foxinsoxuk said:

AlastairMeeks said:

I feel that I have been brief to the point of terseness in this lengthy post. I apologise for having to leave out local colour.

Surely the asteroid escape vehicle is best done as a collaborative venture with the ESA?

On the other hand a massive asteroid strike destroying all higher lifeforms does put Brexit into perspective, and something to look forward to...

Surely Brexit makes armageddon considerably more likely, if not certain ?

Hence the omportance of the spaceship. Armageddon outa here...

Nigelb

One has to reflect how refreshing it is that we have at least one set of completely loopy politicians who aren't in government.

Richard_Nabavi

Nigelb said:

One has to reflect how refreshing it is that we have at least one set of completely loopy politicians who aren't in government.

We have two complete sets, although one of them could be in government next time.

Nigelb

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. Jessop, to be fair, the Roman Republic repeatedly appointed all-powerful dictators for the sole purpose of hammering in a nail to appease the gods, after which they resigned.

Good afternoon, Mr.D.
Talking of fantasy, Honda believe their engine will outperform Renault by the end of the season:
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/honda-engine-renault-target-939204/

I have not yet ruled out their achieving a podium this season - is anyone offering odds on that ?

Nigelb

Richard_Nabavi said:

Nigelb said:

One has to reflect how refreshing it is that we have at least one set of completely loopy politicians who aren't in government.

We have two complete sets, although one of them could be in government next time.

How very uncivil of you...

I once called Nick Palmer the Richard Nabavi of the Labour party; I fear the converse may no longer be true.

GeoffM

Nigelb said:

foxinsoxuk said:

AlastairMeeks said:

I feel that I have been brief to the point of terseness in this lengthy post. I apologise for having to leave out local colour.

Surely the asteroid escape vehicle is best done as a collaborative venture with the ESA?

On the other hand a massive asteroid strike destroying all higher lifeforms does put Brexit into perspective, and something to look forward to...

Surely Brexit makes armageddon considerably more likely, if not certain ?

That's right. Cameron promised us WW3 in the event of Brexit.
It's only a matter of time.

Morris_Dancer

Mr. B, I can't see that happening.

Even if we assume the reliability is, as appears to be the case, much better, that still leaves a lot of horsepower to make up.

A podium only seems credible at somewhere like Abu Dhabi (maybe) or, more likely, Singapore, but they're still going to be the 4th fastest at the absolute best.

I'd want long triple figure odds on a McLaren podium.

Richard_Nabavi

Nigelb said:

Richard_Nabavi said:

Nigelb said:

One has to reflect how refreshing it is that we have at least one set of completely loopy politicians who aren't in government.

We have two complete sets, although one of them could be in government next time.

How very uncivil of you...

I once called Nick Palmer the Richard Nabavi of the Labour party; I fear the converse may no longer be true.

It was always a silly comparison. Nick Palmer is a fan of Abba (shudder...)

rcs1000

Morris_Dancer said:

Further afield, the Catalan vote is around 1 October, isn't it? Still 1.4 for Yes on Ladbrokes (I believe someone tipped No at 2.75 some time ago).

Also, too short for me but those of you with moneybags might like 1.11 on Merkel staying Chancellor.

As an aside, I reckon there's probably free money to be had by backing "No" in massive size on the Catalan referendum, and buying out the money Put options on the IBEX.

If it's a "No", you win the bet (which will pay out more than you spent on your deeply out the money Puts), and if it's a "Yes", then the Spanish stock market trades down 15%, and you make good money there.

For the record, this is not investment advice.

Morris_Dancer

Mr. 1000, got to say that's a bit above my pay grade, as it were, but it sounds quite sly.

Morris_Dancer

Speaking of dodgy fools who shouldn't be anywhere near office, Zuma's survived his no-confidence vote:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-40869269

Anyway, I must be off.

David_Evershed

Nigelb said:

One has to reflect how refreshing it is that we have at least one set of completely loopy politicians who aren't in government.

David_Evershed

Richard_Nabavi said:

Nigelb said:

One has to reflect how refreshing it is that we have at least one set of completely loopy politicians who aren't in government.

We have two complete sets, although one of them could be in government next time.

Greens and SNP?

isam

If the leader of UKIP isn't Nigel Farage, it really doesn't matter who it is

It struck me today how quickly it will seem to future Historians that we went from "There probably wont be an EU referendum" to "Leave win the EU referendum". It seems to have caught both sides on the hop. The Remainers, who quite understandably cant seem to rationalise that the move from dismissive in 2014, to complacent in 2015, to defeat in 2016 has actually happened, and the Kippers who, in 2014, probably imagined the route to victory was achieved by making the case for Brexit gradually via gaining parliamentary seats.

It is like a boxer, cruising towards a unanimous points victory vs an underdog, getting knocked out in the last round. He cant understand the twist at the end of the story, while victory destroyed the winner by virtue of being World Champion too early in their career.

williamglenn

isam said:

It is like a boxer, cruising towards a unanimous points victory vs an underdog, getting knocked out in the last round. He cant understand the twist at the end of the story, while victory destroyed the winner by virtue of being World Champion too early in their career.

This analogy highlights a fatal flaw in the narrative.

You see it as an internal fight between two camps in domestic politics in which one side has 'won', but unfortunately there is nobody to call time and let you savour the victory. Brexit is the beginning, not the end, and the people who fought for it have no clue how it will deliver anything other than their own self-satisfaction.

isam

williamglenn said:

isam said:

It is like a boxer, cruising towards a unanimous points victory vs an underdog, getting knocked out in the last round. He cant understand the twist at the end of the story, while victory destroyed the winner by virtue of being World Champion too early in their career.

This analogy highlights a fatal flaw in the narrative.

You see it as an internal fight between two camps in domestic politics in which one side has 'won', but unfortunately there is nobody to call time and let you savour the victory. Brexit is the beginning, not the end, and the people who fought for it have no clue how it will deliver anything other than their own self-satisfaction.

Well people who lose don't like the sound of the final whistle that's true!

But I was a kipper, and all I wanted was to win the referendum.. and we did and that's that. I am happy

The people who REALLY wanted Brexit were UKIP, even if they had to gain it with help from Conservatives who probably weren't all that bothered.

Nigelb

Richard_Nabavi said:

Nigelb said:

Richard_Nabavi said:

Nigelb said:

One has to reflect how refreshing it is that we have at least one set of completely loopy politicians who aren't in government.

We have two complete sets, although one of them could be in government next time.

How very uncivil of you...

I once called Nick Palmer the Richard Nabavi of the Labour party; I fear the converse may no longer be true.

It was always a silly comparison. Nick Palmer is a fan of Abba (shudder...)

The original comparison was prompted by your shared skill in not just defending, but positively spinning the indefensible when it came to your respective parties...

But I have no wish to reopen the great ABBA debate, so I'll drop it.

ydoethur

I haven't laughed so much since I heard Gove had been removed from education.

That's an absolutely awesome list.

But if Aiden Powlesland is Foinavon, who will be Poppam Down?

Nigelb

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. B, I can't see that happening.

Even if we assume the reliability is, as appears to be the case, much better, that still leaves a lot of horsepower to make up.

A podium only seems credible at somewhere like Abu Dhabi (maybe) or, more likely, Singapore, but they're still going to be the 4th fastest at the absolute best.

I'd want long triple figure odds on a McLaren podium.

Triple figures, I'd snap up,
McLaren Honda have the great advantage now of not really caring if they lunch a few more engines along the way, so their ability to bring engine upgrades is greater than any of the other teams. I'd want reasonably long odds, but I think there is a real chance (though not overwhelming likelihood) of a podium before the season is out.
They have what appears a very decent chassis, and one of the best drivers on the grid. They only have to get lucky once.

Charles

welshowl said:

rkrkrk said:

Great article.

Have to admit I'm surprised how many are gay.

I'm speechless with wonder at this offering of candidates. Truly gobsmacked. Just for starters, why on God's earth would you apparently come into possession of a fortified compound in Bulgaria? Why? How? When? Details??

I have a house with battlements that my Dad bought on a whim. Does that count?

welshowl

Charles said:

welshowl said:

rkrkrk said:

Great article.

Have to admit I'm surprised how many are gay.

I'm speechless with wonder at this offering of candidates. Truly gobsmacked. Just for starters, why on God's earth would you apparently come into possession of a fortified compound in Bulgaria? Why? How? When? Details??

I have a house with battlements that my Dad bought on a whim. Does that count?

Only if he has a licence to crenellate. Can't be having non standard crenellations.

Sean_F

isam said:

If the leader of UKIP isn't Nigel Farage, it really doesn't matter who it is

It struck me today how quickly it will seem to future Historians that we went from "There probably wont be an EU referendum" to "Leave win the EU referendum". It seems to have caught both sides on the hop. The Remainers, who quite understandably cant seem to rationalise that the move from dismissive in 2014, to complacent in 2015, to defeat in 2016 has actually happened, and the Kippers who, in 2014, probably imagined the route to victory was achieved by making the case for Brexit gradually via gaining parliamentary seats.

It is like a boxer, cruising towards a unanimous points victory vs an underdog, getting knocked out in the last round. He cant understand the twist at the end of the story, while victory destroyed the winner by virtue of being World Champion too early in their career.

A good analogy. I expected a hung Parliament in 2015, followed by a weak Labour-led government, with UKIP steadily gaining ground in local elections and by-elections.

Sean_F

The candidates on offer are certainly a glittering array of talent.

AlastairMeeks

For those interested in John Rees-Evans' fortified compound, more details are available here:

https://news.vice.com/article/what-an-ex-soldiers-fortified-bulgarian-compound-says-about-the-uk-independence-movement

I reluctantly decided not to include in the main article the detail about him urinating in a bottle to reduce his carbon footprint.

Charles

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

rkrkrk said:

Great article.

Have to admit I'm surprised how many are gay.

I'm speechless with wonder at this offering of candidates. Truly gobsmacked. Just for starters, why on God's earth would you apparently come into possession of a fortified compound in Bulgaria? Why? How? When? Details??

I have a house with battlements that my Dad bought on a whim. Does that count?

Only if he has a licence to crenellate. Can't be having non standard crenellations.

The house had them when he bought it... he didn't crenellate on a whim! He's not some kind of oddball...

ydoethur

AlastairMeeks said:

For those interested in John Rees-Evans' fortified compound, more details are available here:

https://news.vice.com/article/what-an-ex-soldiers-fortified-bulgarian-compound-says-about-the-uk-independence-movement

I reluctantly decided not to include in the main article the detail about him urinating in a bottle to reduce his carbon footprint.

Now you're just taking the piss!

welshowl

Charles said:

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

rkrkrk said:

Great article.

Have to admit I'm surprised how many are gay.

I'm speechless with wonder at this offering of candidates. Truly gobsmacked. Just for starters, why on God's earth would you apparently come into possession of a fortified compound in Bulgaria? Why? How? When? Details??

I have a house with battlements that my Dad bought on a whim. Does that count?

Only if he has a licence to crenellate. Can't be having non standard crenellations.

The house had them when he bought it... he didn't crenellate on a whim! He's not some kind of oddball...

Well that's ok then!

welshowl

AlastairMeeks said:

For those interested in John Rees-Evans' fortified compound, more details are available here:

https://news.vice.com/article/what-an-ex-soldiers-fortified-bulgarian-compound-says-about-the-uk-independence-movement

I reluctantly decided not to include in the main article the detail about him urinating in a bottle to reduce his carbon footprint.

I had no idea this reduced your carbon footprint. Save me a fortune on new a hybrid car will that advice. I can just produce the Chateau blanc de Welshowl of a morning and leave it out for the milky, and still save the planet.

AlastairMeeks

welshowl said:

AlastairMeeks said:

For those interested in John Rees-Evans' fortified compound, more details are available here:

https://news.vice.com/article/what-an-ex-soldiers-fortified-bulgarian-compound-says-about-the-uk-independence-movement

I reluctantly decided not to include in the main article the detail about him urinating in a bottle to reduce his carbon footprint.

I had no idea this reduced your carbon footprint. Save me a fortune on new a hybrid car will that advice. I can just produce the Chateau blanc de Welshowl of a morning and leave it out for the milky, and still save the planet.

This was the problem with writing this thread header. It was like tugging on a loose thread on your jumper: one unexpected piece of information led onto another.

williamglenn

AlastairMeeks said:

For those interested in John Rees-Evans' fortified compound, more details are available here:

https://news.vice.com/article/what-an-ex-soldiers-fortified-bulgarian-compound-says-about-the-uk-independence-movement

I reluctantly decided not to include in the main article the detail about him urinating in a bottle to reduce his carbon footprint.

Nigel Farage won't be needed back in frontline politics once the country gets a glimpse of this guy.

He is also extremely fit. His first marathon was at 21, he explains, with a full rucksack, when he was in the parachute regiment.

"I was young and single and I read in a book that ninjas, when they were working, would kill someone 25 miles from where they lived," he said. "So I decided that since we were in a similar profession I should do that. I substituted the killing for a visit to a bookshop. Theological books. That was the extra weight."

TheScreamingEagles

Sean_F said:

The candidates on offer are certainly a glittering array of talent.

One of my earliest memories of PB was a post of yours detailing the sexual deviancy of the British far right.

For some reason Alastair's thread reminded me of that.

Charles

AlastairMeeks said:

For those interested in John Rees-Evans' fortified compound, more details are available here:

https://news.vice.com/article/what-an-ex-soldiers-fortified-bulgarian-compound-says-about-the-uk-independence-movement

I reluctantly decided not to include in the main article the detail about him urinating in a bottle to reduce his carbon footprint.

"Instead of watching strippers we'll be throwing them out of airplanes and firing Glocks"

How did that not make the cut?

Charles

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

rkrkrk said:

Great article.

Have to admit I'm surprised how many are gay.

I'm speechless with wonder at this offering of candidates. Truly gobsmacked. Just for starters, why on God's earth would you apparently come into possession of a fortified compound in Bulgaria? Why? How? When? Details??

I have a house with battlements that my Dad bought on a whim. Does that count?

Only if he has a licence to crenellate. Can't be having non standard crenellations.

The house had them when he bought it... he didn't crenellate on a whim! He's not some kind of oddball...

Well that's ok then!

His justification was that life is like a jigsaw. Sometimes you come across a piece that is so special you pick it up and hold it in your hand until you figure out what to do with it.*

* his solution was give it to @Charles and let him deal with it!

welshowl

AlastairMeeks said:

welshowl said:

AlastairMeeks said:

For those interested in John Rees-Evans' fortified compound, more details are available here:

https://news.vice.com/article/what-an-ex-soldiers-fortified-bulgarian-compound-says-about-the-uk-independence-movement

I reluctantly decided not to include in the main article the detail about him urinating in a bottle to reduce his carbon footprint.

I had no idea this reduced your carbon footprint. Save me a fortune on new a hybrid car will that advice. I can just produce the Chateau blanc de Welshowl of a morning and leave it out for the milky, and still save the planet.

This was the problem with writing this thread header. It was like tugging on a loose thread on your jumper: one unexpected piece of information led onto another.

There's a possibly film script, if not a mini series just with the info you put in your thread header!

Sean_F

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sean_F said:

The candidates on offer are certainly a glittering array of talent.

One of my earliest memories of PB was a post of yours detailing the sexual deviancy of the British far right.

For some reason Alastair's thread reminded me of that.

Yes, that was fun.

I especially enjoyed how Colin Jordan had to resign as leader of the British Movement after shoplifting a pair of red knickers from M & S.

ydoethur

williamglenn said:

AlastairMeeks said:

For those interested in John Rees-Evans' fortified compound, more details are available here:

https://news.vice.com/article/what-an-ex-soldiers-fortified-bulgarian-compound-says-about-the-uk-independence-movement

I reluctantly decided not to include in the main article the detail about him urinating in a bottle to reduce his carbon footprint.

Nigel Farage won't be needed back in frontline politics once the country gets a glimpse of this guy.

He is also extremely fit. His first marathon was at 21, he explains, with a full rucksack, when he was in the parachute regiment.

"I was young and single and I read in a book that ninjas, when they were working, would kill someone 25 miles from where they lived," he said. "So I decided that since we were in a similar profession I should do that. I substituted the killing for a visit to a bookshop. Theological books. That was the extra weight."

Having cycled up a hill carrying Raymond Brown's Inteoduction to the New Testament, C. H. Dodd's Historical Tradition in the Fourth Gospel and a (mercifully abridged) copy of Matthew Henry's Commentaries, I can understand how they made good ballast.

I just can't see the link to ninjas assassinating people. Did he used to hit random people with his rucksack?

williamglenn

Mr Rees-Evens thinks he's already an acronym. This looks and sounds like a weak pitch on Dragons' Den rather than a political leader in the making.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8ZiiHYHtdE

welshowl

Charles said:

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

rkrkrk said:

Great article.

Have to admit I'm surprised how many are gay.

I'm speechless with wonder at this offering of candidates. Truly gobsmacked. Just for starters, why on God's earth would you apparently come into possession of a fortified compound in Bulgaria? Why? How? When? Details??

I have a house with battlements that my Dad bought on a whim. Does that count?

Only if he has a licence to crenellate. Can't be having non standard crenellations.

The house had them when he bought it... he didn't crenellate on a whim! He's not some kind of oddball...

Well that's ok then!

His justification was that life is like a jigsaw. Sometimes you come across a piece that is so special you pick it up and hold it in your hand until you figure out what to do with it.*

* his solution was give it to @Charles and let him deal with it!

Does it now "fit"? Or you still looking for another bit with a straight edge and a similar pattern to match it with to start things off?

Beverley_C

Nigelb said:

Richard_Nabavi said:

Nigelb said:

Richard_Nabavi said:

Nigelb said:

One has to reflect how refreshing it is that we have at least one set of completely loopy politicians who aren't in government.

We have two complete sets, although one of them could be in government next time.

How very uncivil of you...

I once called Nick Palmer the Richard Nabavi of the Labour party; I fear the converse may no longer be true.

It was always a silly comparison. Nick Palmer is a fan of Abba (shudder...)

The original comparison was prompted by your shared skill in not just defending, but positively spinning the indefensible when it came to your respective parties...

But I have no wish to reopen the great ABBA debate, so I'll drop it.

"Steps" have a very ABBA sound and are great to dance to....

Sean_F

Alice_Aforethought said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Can't imagine why Islamophobes are attracted to UKIP.

It has to be the asteroid miner or homosexual donkey raped my horse man for me.

Blistering brilliant piece Alastair.

Well, there'll always be neigh sayers trying to stirrup trouble but there's a lot more to that homosexual-donkey-raped-my-horse story than he's letting on.

So the horse just stood there and let it happen? The supposedly straight horse? Yeah, right. I've got bad news for Rees-Evans: no way is that horse straight. It stood there and it loved it. It is a gay horse which probably causes floods.

He says the donkey *tried* to rape his horse.

Hopefully, the horse defended his honour.

Beverley_C

Sean_F said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sean_F said:

The candidates on offer are certainly a glittering array of talent.

One of my earliest memories of PB was a post of yours detailing the sexual deviancy of the British far right.

For some reason Alastair's thread reminded me of that.

Yes, that was fun.

I especially enjoyed how Colin Jordan had to resign as leader of the British Movement after shoplifting a pair of red knickers from M & S.

I wonder what he intended use he planned for his "acquisition"?

I cannot see a pair of plan cotton knickers in red, so I would think it likely that these were the lacy, stringy kind that are OK to wear for about 2 hours and after that you want to rip them off before you sweaty-itch to death.

foxinsoxuk

williamglenn said:

AlastairMeeks said:

For those interested in John Rees-Evans' fortified compound, more details are available here:

https://news.vice.com/article/what-an-ex-soldiers-fortified-bulgarian-compound-says-about-the-uk-independence-movement

I reluctantly decided not to include in the main article the detail about him urinating in a bottle to reduce his carbon footprint.

Nigel Farage won't be needed back in frontline politics once the country gets a glimpse of this guy.

He is also extremely fit. His first marathon was at 21, he explains, with a full rucksack, when he was in the parachute regiment.

"I was young and single and I read in a book that ninjas, when they were working, would kill someone 25 miles from where they lived," he said. "So I decided that since we were in a similar profession I should do that. I substituted the killing for a visit to a bookshop. Theological books. That was the extra weight."

18% of the vote is not to be sneezed at. In such a crowded FPTP system, donkey may be the winner!

Penddu

Do UKIP have a 3 quid option? I want to join and vote for the Welsh candidate....not because I am Welsh but because of the comedy possibilities...

ydoethur

Penddu said:

Do UKIP have a 3 quid option? I want to join and vote for the Welsh candidate....not because I am Welsh but because of the comedy possibilities...

The implication of that comment is that at least one of the others would NOT have comedy value.

Although I appreciate the donkey man is something a bit special.

williamglenn

ydoethur said:

Penddu said:

Do UKIP have a 3 quid option? I want to join and vote for the Welsh candidate....not because I am Welsh but because of the comedy possibilities...

The implication of that comment is that at least one of the others would NOT have comedy value.

Although I appreciate the donkey man is something a bit special.

UKIP: Liars led by donkeys.

Charles

Sean_F said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Can't imagine why Islamophobes are attracted to UKIP.

It has to be the asteroid miner or homosexual donkey raped my horse man for me.

Blistering brilliant piece Alastair.

Well, there'll always be neigh sayers trying to stirrup trouble but there's a lot more to that homosexual-donkey-raped-my-horse story than he's letting on.

So the horse just stood there and let it happen? The supposedly straight horse? Yeah, right. I've got bad news for Rees-Evans: no way is that horse straight. It stood there and it loved it. It is a gay horse which probably causes floods.

He says the donkey *tried* to rape his horse.

Hopefully, the horse defended his honour.

There was a rather good radio play a few years ago comprising love letters between Marengo (Napoleon's horse) and Copenhagen (Wellington's horse)

tlg86

Penddu said:

Do UKIP have a 3 quid option? I want to join and vote for the Welsh candidate....not because I am Welsh but because of the comedy possibilities...

I don't know, but I do have a vote in this election so if anyone would like buy my vote, PM me.

Charles

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

rkrkrk said:

Great article.

Have to admit I'm surprised how many are gay.

I'm speechless with wonder at this offering of candidates. Truly gobsmacked. Just for starters, why on God's earth would you apparently come into possession of a fortified compound in Bulgaria? Why? How? When? Details??

I have a house with battlements that my Dad bought on a whim. Does that count?

Only if he has a licence to crenellate. Can't be having non standard crenellations.

The house had them when he bought it... he didn't crenellate on a whim! He's not some kind of oddball...

Well that's ok then!

His justification was that life is like a jigsaw. Sometimes you come across a piece that is so special you pick it up and hold it in your hand until you figure out what to do with it.*

* his solution was give it to @Charles and let him deal with it!

Does it now "fit"? Or you still looking for another bit with a straight edge and a similar pattern to match it with to start things off?

If you're trying to sell me another castle I think I'm good for now!

(we use it as a museum and charitable venue as as the HQ for both Bulldog and The Fore Trusts, any other ideas gratefully received)

ydoethur

williamglenn said:

ydoethur said:

Penddu said:

Do UKIP have a 3 quid option? I want to join and vote for the Welsh candidate....not because I am Welsh but because of the comedy possibilities...

The implication of that comment is that at least one of the others would NOT have comedy value.

Although I appreciate the donkey man is something a bit special.

UKIP: Liars led by donkeys.

welshowl

Charles said:

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

Charles said:

welshowl said:

rkrkrk said:

Great article.

Have to admit I'm surprised how many are gay.

I'm speechless with wonder at this offering of candidates. Truly gobsmacked. Just for starters, why on God's earth would you apparently come into possession of a fortified compound in Bulgaria? Why? How? When? Details??

I have a house with battlements that my Dad bought on a whim. Does that count?

Only if he has a licence to crenellate. Can't be having non standard crenellations.

The house had them when he bought it... he didn't crenellate on a whim! He's not some kind of oddball...

Well that's ok then!

His justification was that life is like a jigsaw. Sometimes you come across a piece that is so special you pick it up and hold it in your hand until you figure out what to do with it.*

* his solution was give it to @Charles and let him deal with it!

Does it now "fit"? Or you still looking for another bit with a straight edge and a similar pattern to match it with to start things off?

If you're trying to sell me another castle I think I'm good for now!

(we use it as a museum and charitable venue as as the HQ for both Bulldog and The Fore Trusts, any other ideas gratefully received)

No, lots of castles in Wales. None are mine to sell. Must be a big responsibility to own one.

ydoethur

tlg86 said:

Penddu said:

Do UKIP have a 3 quid option? I want to join and vote for the Welsh candidate....not because I am Welsh but because of the comedy possibilities...

I don't know, but I do have a vote in this election so if anyone would like buy my vote, PM me.

You have my sympathy, trying to choose between that.

I'd seriously consider voting for Corbyn ahead of any of them.

Not Macdonnell or Gove, obviously, but Corbyn - well, on a forced choice it would be possible.

Penddu

williamglenn said:

ydoethur said:

Penddu said:

Do UKIP have a 3 quid option? I want to join and vote for the Welsh candidate....not because I am Welsh but because of the comedy possibilities...

The implication of that comment is that at least one of the others would NOT have comedy value.

Although I appreciate the donkey man is something a bit special.

UKIP: Liars led by donkeys.

Liars seduced by donkeys....

tlg86

ydoethur said:

tlg86 said:

Penddu said:

Do UKIP have a 3 quid option? I want to join and vote for the Welsh candidate....not because I am Welsh but because of the comedy possibilities...

I don't know, but I do have a vote in this election so if anyone would like buy my vote, PM me.

You have my sympathy, trying to choose between that.

I'd seriously consider voting for Corbyn ahead of any of them.

Not Macdonnell or Gove, obviously, but Corbyn - well, on a forced choice it would be possible.

To be honest, I really couldn't care less. I think there probably is a place for another party that questions mainstream politics from the right, but I can't see Ukip doing that effectively any more.

DavidL

I really would like to believe that Alastair was making some of this up.

Mortimer

AlastairMeeks said:

welshowl said:

AlastairMeeks said:

For those interested in John Rees-Evans' fortified compound, more details are available here:

https://news.vice.com/article/what-an-ex-soldiers-fortified-bulgarian-compound-says-about-the-uk-independence-movement

I reluctantly decided not to include in the main article the detail about him urinating in a bottle to reduce his carbon footprint.

I had no idea this reduced your carbon footprint. Save me a fortune on new a hybrid car will that advice. I can just produce the Chateau blanc de Welshowl of a morning and leave it out for the milky, and still save the planet.

This was the problem with writing this thread header. It was like tugging on a loose thread on your jumper: one unexpected piece of information led onto another.

Can we be assured that not too many keyboards and monitors were ruined by spluttered coffee in the making of this header?

GeoffM

It's a bit dusty in here tonight.

Where is everybody?

Penddu

Seriously.....this is all true? Politics was never this interesting when I was young....even in Jezza Thorpes days with the shot dog....

AlastairMeeks

GeoffM said:

It's a bit dusty in here tonight.

Where is everybody?

Looking for gay donkeys.

And now you've turned up.

williamglenn

https://twitter.com/mathieuvonrohr/status/895006439038742529

JosiasJessop

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/mathieuvonrohr/status/895006439038742529

The context is that it sounds as though NK has weaponised a nuclear warhead, the ultimate aim of their program.