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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » UKIP’s woes continue losing both by-elections they were defending on big swings to LAB

Loughborough, Shelthorpe on Charnwood (Lab defence) Result: Labour 595 (45% +5% on last time), Conservative 591 (45%, unchanged on last time), Liberal Democrat 93 (7%, no candidate last time), United Kingdom Independence Party 29 (2%, no candidate last time) No Green Party candidate this time (-15%) Labour HOLD with a majority of 4 (0%) on a swing from Con to Lab of 2.5%

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tpfkar

I post, therefore there is a new thread.

QED

tlg86

Second.

AlastairMeeks

FPT @SouthamObserver you're very close to Pheasant Island, which is a condominium, alternating between French and Spanish sovereignty every six months.

Scott_P

https://twitter.com/cemlyn/status/893170423696961536

AlastairMeeks

A good night for Labour. They seem to be following up their good performance in the general election with turning their voters out for local by-elections.

UKIP look to be in their death throes.

GIN1138

AlastairMeeks said:

UKIP look to be in their death throes.

Job Done for the Nigel Farage Party.

williamglenn

GIN1138 said:

AlastairMeeks said:

UKIP look to be in their death throes.

Job Done for the Nigel Farage Party.

Shattering the Eurosceptic consensus that reigned since the mid 90s? Juncker's little helpers.

ydoethur

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

Morris_Dancer

Good afternoon, everyone.

Finished Marc Morris' King John biography. Rather liked it, and will review in due course.

Mr. Glenn, the sceptical consensus? Was that Blair throwing away half the rebate for nothing, or Brown reneging on a referendum promise to sign away umpteen vetoes?

NickPalmer

AlastairMeeks said:

A good night for Labour. They seem to be following up their good performance in the general election with turning their voters out for local by-elections.

UKIP look to be in their death throes.

Local by-elections tend to reflect local morale and activity. There was a lot of scorn at the idea that having loads of members mattered in these electronic days, but I think we're seeing the effect in this sort of thing - one can get a by-election in Little Snoring and hey, there are a couple of Momentum activists there. What's changed is that they have got used to doing stuff instead of sitting at home sending in a Corbyn voting paper once a year.

dixiedean

Pedant's Corner.
The King's Lynn result should read swing from Con to Lab. It was a Labour defence from 2nd place in a multi member ward.

FF43

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

They are taking back control of their apostrophe.

SandyRentool

Kipper collapse going to Labour.

Does not compute!!!

Morris_Dancer

Mr. Rentool, does it not? Didn't quite a lot of people say UKIP was a worse problem for Labour than the Conservatives?

SandyRentool

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. Rentool, does it not? Didn't quite a lot of people say UKIP was a worse problem for Labour than the Conservatives?

Ergo, the collapse of UKIP is now a problem for the Conservatives.

However, that is at odds with the GE results, where there were better results for the Tories in Kippy areas.

Morris_Dancer

Mr. Rentool, well... yes. But that isn't terribly surprising.

ThreeQuidder

SandyRentool said:

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. Rentool, does it not? Didn't quite a lot of people say UKIP was a worse problem for Labour than the Conservatives?

Ergo, the collapse of UKIP is now a problem for the Conservatives.

However, that is at odds with the GE results, where there were better results for the Tories in Kippy areas.

This is because GEs and PCBEs are not the same.

AlastairMeeks

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

https://twitter.com/DavidMooney/status/892341455120891905

SandyRentool

ThreeQuidder said:

SandyRentool said:

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. Rentool, does it not? Didn't quite a lot of people say UKIP was a worse problem for Labour than the Conservatives?

Ergo, the collapse of UKIP is now a problem for the Conservatives.

However, that is at odds with the GE results, where there were better results for the Tories in Kippy areas.

This is because GEs and PCBEs are not the same.

Piezoelectric Ceramic Bimorph Elements?

Voters are basically funny buggers. Shouldn't be allowed out.

Nigelb

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

I agree entirely about Rashid. I'd move Barstow and Stokes a place up the order to accommodate him, drop Malan, and set about finding a decent 2 and 3 to replace the current (temporary) incumbents.

And Rashid can bat too, albeit a little unreliably.

(edit - The Brexit of Mean ??
What might that portend ?)

TOPPING

Why are we talking about UKIP as though it was a political party?

It was the most successful pressure group in modern political history and has achieved its aim. If you think anyone gives a flying f*ck about its Transportation and Infrastructure policy then you are labouring under a massive misapprehension.

ThreeQuidder

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

Cricinfo says the 10th Test in a row he has made at least a half-century which equals John Edrich's England record.

Richard_Nabavi

TOPPING said:

Why are we talking about UKIP as though it was a political party?

It was the most successful pressure group in modern political history and has achieved its aim. If you think anyone gives a flying f*ck about its Transportation and Infrastructure policy then you are labouring under a massive misapprehension.

Well yes, but it was taking a quite large number of votes from the main parties in both national and local elections, so its demise as an electoral force is a significant development (and a welcome one, judging by that painful apostrophe).

Nigelb

ThreeQuidder said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

Cricinfo says the 10th Test in a row he has made at least a half-century which equals John Edrich's England record.

De Kock did give him a life, though.

ThreeQuidder

Nigelb said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

Cricinfo says the 10th Test in a row he has made at least a half-century which equals John Edrich's England record.

De Kock did give him a life, though.

That's cricket...

Players with a longer streak:

de Villiers 12
Richards, Gambhir, Sehwag, Mominul Haque 11

williamglenn

Richard_Nabavi said:

TOPPING said:

Why are we talking about UKIP as though it was a political party?

It was the most successful pressure group in modern political history and has achieved its aim. If you think anyone gives a flying f*ck about its Transportation and Infrastructure policy then you are labouring under a massive misapprehension.

Well yes, but it was taking a quite large number of votes from the main parties in both national and local elections, so its demise as an electoral force is a significant development (and a welcome one, judging by that painful apostrophe).

But the dream of a reunified right becoming an unstoppable electoral force hit a brick wall in June. The lasting effect of the demise of UKIP will be more political than electoral.

ydoethur

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

I agree entirely about Rashid. I'd move Barstow and Stokes a place up the order to accommodate him, drop Malan, and set about finding a decent 2 and 3 to replace the current (temporary) incumbents.

And Rashid can bat too, albeit a little unreliably.

(edit - The Brexit of Mean ??
What might that portend ?)

You were saying? Out playing across the line to a straight one...

ydoethur

ThreeQuidder said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

Cricinfo says the 10th Test in a row he has made at least a half-century which equals John Edrich's England record.

And how many has he converted into centuries? Just two.

Even Cricinfo are saying this is an issue.

ydoethur

AlastairMeeks said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

https://twitter.com/DavidMooney/status/892341455120891905

My best effort along those lines was on the learning objectives we are supposed to put on the whiteboard because OFSTED inspectors are so thick they can't work out what we're teaching just by looking it encourages high quality learning.

I put that we would be 'describing the position of women under the Nazis.'

I did not realise what I had done until one of the filthy-minded teenagers present asked me if this was the 74th position...

ThreeQuidder

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

Cricinfo says the 10th Test in a row he has made at least a half-century which equals John Edrich's England record.

And how many has he converted into centuries? Just two.

Even Cricinfo are saying this is an issue.

Four 50 somethings, three 70 somethings and an 80 something.

ydoethur

Cricinfo comment and response:

"Not really sure why there's such an issue with Root's conversion rate. Surely anyone averaging over 50 in 100+ innings is more than doing his job for the team? The fact that he's such a solid and consistent contributor to the team is worth far more than a flash Harry who gets a run of low scores and the odd ton?" But if we are comparing with the very best, it's about scoring regular match-defining centuries.

Which is why Sachin Tendulkar or Jacques Kallis deserves to be called a great and Steve Smith is on the way there while Root isn't, yet, although he undoubtedly has the ability and still has time on his side to put it right (Chanderpaul did, after all).

Bairstow's conversion rate is much worse of course, but given he bats much lower in the order and keeps wicket too that's understandable. For a specialist batsman, Root's conversion rate isn't particularly impressive. To me it rather sums up the team: looks good, capable of magnificent performances, thrilling to watch, but quality is not sustained across the range for long enough to really hit the very top.

ThomasNashe

This picture has surely been photoshopped by an embittered remainer to make leavers look as thick as pig shit.

ThomasNashe

Or maybe it's the same group of kippers who thought Westminster Cathedral was a mosque?

Nigelb

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

Cricinfo says the 10th Test in a row he has made at least a half-century which equals John Edrich's England record.

And how many has he converted into centuries? Just two.

Even Cricinfo are saying this is an issue.

Of the top test batsmen currently playing, it's true that Smith, Kohli and Williamson have far better 'conversion' rates - but of those, only Smith averages more than Root (61 vs 53).
So yes, Smith is the better bat, so far - but remember Root is a couple of years younger.

All have played a similar number of tests, FWIW.

ThreeQuidder

ydoethur said:

Which is why Sachin Tendulkar or Jacques Kallis deserves to be called a great and Steve Smith is on the way there while Root isn't, yet, although he undoubtedly has the ability and still has time on his side to put it right (Chanderpaul did, after all).

Is it a problem if he ends up being a very, very good but not a great?

AndyJS

YouGov:

LAB 44% (+1)
CON 41% (nc)
LDEM 7% (+1)

http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/

ydoethur

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

Cricinfo says the 10th Test in a row he has made at least a half-century which equals John Edrich's England record.

And how many has he converted into centuries? Just two.

Even Cricinfo are saying this is an issue.

Of the top test batsmen currently playing, it's true that Smith, Kohli and Williamson have far better 'conversion' rates - but of those, only Smith averages more than Root (61 vs 53).
So yes, Smith is the better bat, so far - but remember Root is a couple of years younger.

All have played a similar number of tests, FWIW.

However, Smith started his Test career as a bowler, remarkable though that now seems.

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

Which is why Sachin Tendulkar or Jacques Kallis deserves to be called a great and Steve Smith is on the way there while Root isn't, yet, although he undoubtedly has the ability and still has time on his side to put it right (Chanderpaul did, after all).

Is it a problem if he ends up being a very, very good but not a great?

If it means England are weaker and lose matches they could have won if he'd stayed in (2nd Test, anybody, although admittedly he was still top scorer and others were far more culpable) yes.

Philip_Thompson

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

Cricinfo says the 10th Test in a row he has made at least a half-century which equals John Edrich's England record.

And how many has he converted into centuries? Just two.

Even Cricinfo are saying this is an issue.

I would rather have an issue of consistently scoring mid to high half centuries, than consistently going cheaply and getting the occasional century.

ThreeQuidder

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

Which is why Sachin Tendulkar or Jacques Kallis deserves to be called a great and Steve Smith is on the way there while Root isn't, yet, although he undoubtedly has the ability and still has time on his side to put it right (Chanderpaul did, after all).

Is it a problem if he ends up being a very, very good but not a great?

If it means England are weaker and lose matches they could have won if he'd stayed in (2nd Test, anybody, although admittedly he was still top scorer and others were far more culpable) yes.

But only if that outweighs matches they won because he got to 50+ rather than getting out for 20...?

rcs1000

AndyJS said:

YouGov:

LAB 44% (+1)
CON 41% (nc)
LDEM 7% (+1)

http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/

I think that's a few days old.

ydoethur

Philip_Thompson said:

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

Cricinfo says the 10th Test in a row he has made at least a half-century which equals John Edrich's England record.

And how many has he converted into centuries? Just two.

Even Cricinfo are saying this is an issue.

I would rather have an issue of consistently scoring mid to high half centuries, than consistently going cheaply and getting the occasional century.

Yes, but I'm greedy and want him to score half centuries all the time AND centuries far more often. Because that way, we will win matches. Or have you not noticed that nine of his twelve centuries have led to victories, three to draws and yet 11 of his 29 half centuries have come in defeats - including quite a lot in this latest run?

ydoethur

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

Which is why Sachin Tendulkar or Jacques Kallis deserves to be called a great and Steve Smith is on the way there while Root isn't, yet, although he undoubtedly has the ability and still has time on his side to put it right (Chanderpaul did, after all).

Is it a problem if he ends up being a very, very good but not a great?

If it means England are weaker and lose matches they could have won if he'd stayed in (2nd Test, anybody, although admittedly he was still top scorer and others were far more culpable) yes.

But only if that outweighs matches they won because he got to 50+ rather than getting out for 20...?

He's played in 22 victories, in 9 of which he has scored centuries, 21 defeats, 11 of which have featured 50s.

If he had a conversion rate of just under 50%, which is still not as good as Smith's and far less impressive than his record as a specialist batsman, hard not to imagine that would have been 27 victories and 16 defeats.

Philip_Thompson

ydoethur said:

Philip_Thompson said:

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

Cricinfo says the 10th Test in a row he has made at least a half-century which equals John Edrich's England record.

And how many has he converted into centuries? Just two.

Even Cricinfo are saying this is an issue.

I would rather have an issue of consistently scoring mid to high half centuries, than consistently going cheaply and getting the occasional century.

Yes, but I'm greedy and want him to score half centuries all the time AND centuries far more often. Because that way, we will win matches. Or have you not noticed that nine of his twelve centuries have led to victories, three to draws and yet 11 of his 29 half centuries have come in defeats - including quite a lot in this latest run?

Conversely 18 of his 29 half centuries have not led to defeats.

I have more of an issue with his team-mates who are not pulling their weight.

ThreeQuidder

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

Which is why Sachin Tendulkar or Jacques Kallis deserves to be called a great and Steve Smith is on the way there while Root isn't, yet, although he undoubtedly has the ability and still has time on his side to put it right (Chanderpaul did, after all).

Is it a problem if he ends up being a very, very good but not a great?

If it means England are weaker and lose matches they could have won if he'd stayed in (2nd Test, anybody, although admittedly he was still top scorer and others were far more culpable) yes.

But only if that outweighs matches they won because he got to 50+ rather than getting out for 20...?

He's played in 22 victories, in 9 of which he has scored centuries, 21 defeats, 11 of which have featured 50s.

If he had a conversion rate of just under 50%, which is still not as good as Smith's and far less impressive than his record as a specialist batsman, hard not to imagine that would have been 27 victories and 16 defeats.

I think you're comparing Root as is v hypothetical Root who reaches 50 as often but converts more of them to 100s.

I'm comparing Root as is vs a hypothetical Root who converts more of his 50s to 100s but doesn't reach 50 as often.

ydoethur

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

Which is why Sachin Tendulkar or Jacques Kallis deserves to be called a great and Steve Smith is on the way there while Root isn't, yet, although he undoubtedly has the ability and still has time on his side to put it right (Chanderpaul did, after all).

Is it a problem if he ends up being a very, very good but not a great?

If it means England are weaker and lose matches they could have won if he'd stayed in (2nd Test, anybody, although admittedly he was still top scorer and others were far more culpable) yes.

But only if that outweighs matches they won because he got to 50+ rather than getting out for 20...?

He's played in 22 victories, in 9 of which he has scored centuries, 21 defeats, 11 of which have featured 50s.

If he had a conversion rate of just under 50%, which is still not as good as Smith's and far less impressive than his record as a specialist batsman, hard not to imagine that would have been 27 victories and 16 defeats.

I think you're comparing Root as is v hypothetical Root who reaches 50 as often but converts more of them to 100s.

I'm comparing Root as is vs a hypothetical Root who converts more of his 50s to 100s but doesn't reach 50 as often.

I am making the assumption that you need to get to 50 before reaching 100.

Any other way could only be computed by Gordon Brown in one of his fits of announcing every increase in spending three times, adding them together and announcing them again, and then taking the actual funding from council tax. (Sorry, that's what I've just been writing about and I'm still fuming.)

Philip_Thompson

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

Which is why Sachin Tendulkar or Jacques Kallis deserves to be called a great and Steve Smith is on the way there while Root isn't, yet, although he undoubtedly has the ability and still has time on his side to put it right (Chanderpaul did, after all).

Is it a problem if he ends up being a very, very good but not a great?

If it means England are weaker and lose matches they could have won if he'd stayed in (2nd Test, anybody, although admittedly he was still top scorer and others were far more culpable) yes.

But only if that outweighs matches they won because he got to 50+ rather than getting out for 20...?

He's played in 22 victories, in 9 of which he has scored centuries, 21 defeats, 11 of which have featured 50s.

If he had a conversion rate of just under 50%, which is still not as good as Smith's and far less impressive than his record as a specialist batsman, hard not to imagine that would have been 27 victories and 16 defeats.

I think you're comparing Root as is v hypothetical Root who reaches 50 as often but converts more of them to 100s.

I'm comparing Root as is vs a hypothetical Root who converts more of his 50s to 100s but doesn't reach 50 as often.

I am making the assumption that you need to get to 50 before reaching 100.

Any other way could only be computed by Gordon Brown in one of his fits of announcing every increase in spending three times, adding them together and announcing them again, and then taking the actual funding from council tax. (Sorry, that's what I've just been writing about and I'm still fuming.)

Every time you go out to bat you start at 0. If hypothetical Root changes his technique in order to reach 100 more often, then it's entirely possible that changed Root would reach 50 less often. There's no guarantee that you still get as many 50s as before.

williamglenn

ydoethur said:

I am making the assumption that you need to get to 50 before reaching 100.

Was any test batsman more consistent in getting out between 20 and 50 than Mark Ramprakash?

Nigelb

ydoethur said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

ThreeQuidder said:

Nigelb said:

ydoethur said:

If that was really their poster, they deserved to lose. What idiotic political party gets its punctuation wrong? As bad as Christopher Wormald memorably mis-spelling 'learned' while Permanent Under-Secretary at the Department for Education.

FPT - can we please play Adil Rashid next Test? He'll take wickets and it beggars belief that he'll score fewer runs than Malan (or Jennings, indeed).

You can hardly complain that Root isn't grafting this afternoon, though.

Cricinfo says the 10th Test in a row he has made at least a half-century which equals John Edrich's England record.

And how many has he converted into centuries? Just two.

Even Cricinfo are saying this is an issue.

Of the top test batsmen currently playing, it's true that Smith, Kohli and Williamson have far better 'conversion' rates - but of those, only Smith averages more than Root (61 vs 53).
So yes, Smith is the better bat, so far - but remember Root is a couple of years younger.

All have played a similar number of tests, FWIW.

However, Smith started his Test career as a bowler, remarkable though that now seems.

ThreeQuidder said:

ydoethur said:

Which is why Sachin Tendulkar or Jacques Kallis deserves to be called a great and Steve Smith is on the way there while Root isn't, yet, although he undoubtedly has the ability and still has time on his side to put it right (Chanderpaul did, after all).

Is it a problem if he ends up being a very, very good but not a great?

If it means England are weaker and lose matches they could have won if he'd stayed in (2nd Test, anybody, although admittedly he was still top scorer and others were far more culpable) yes.

But, as I said before, there are weaknesses more easily addressed - and more urgently in need of attention.
And who is to say that a Root coming in at four after a competent opening pair and number three wouldn't score a shedload more runs ?

It is, after all, a team game.

(edit... and Rabada is rather good.)

rural_voter

SandyRentool said:

Kipper collapse going to Labour.

Does not compute!!!

Old Labour -> New Labour -> Old Labour?

The 2nd. period was ~1987 to 2015, except for John Smith arguably being right-wing Old Labour and not part of the Kinnock-Blair Project.

AndyJS

rcs1000 said:

AndyJS said:

YouGov:

LAB 44% (+1)
CON 41% (nc)
LDEM 7% (+1)

http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/

I think that's a few days old.

Sorry. It was a new post on UKPR.

williamglenn

https://twitter.com/Independent/status/893524190891999235

Philip_Thompson

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/Independent/status/893524190891999235

What a weird article. Especially this final sentence: Lord Sugar left Labour in 2015 after the party shifted slightly to the left of centre under Ed Miliband

williamglenn

Philip_Thompson said:

What a weird article. Especially this final sentence: Lord Sugar left Labour in 2015 after the party shifted slightly to the left of centre under Ed Miliband

Never mind the journalism, what's significant is how quickly the leading Brexiteers have become hate figures. When was the first time a prominent person said Blair should face jail?

daodao

The loss by Labour of the St. Margaret’s with St. Nicholas seat on King’s Lynn and West Norfolk council is misleading, because it was a vote for 1 representative in a 2 member constituency. Labour were clearly in second place in the previous full election in 2015 when Con won 1 seat and Labour the second seat. Technically Labour have lost a seat, but there was a swing of 2% to Labour on this occasion.

kyf_100

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/Independent/status/893524190891999235

Why stop there? I'm sure Ken Livingstone would go further...

Norm

williamglenn said:

Philip_Thompson said:

What a weird article. Especially this final sentence: Lord Sugar left Labour in 2015 after the party shifted slightly to the left of centre under Ed Miliband

Never mind the journalism, what's significant is how quickly the leading Brexiteers have become hate figures. When was the first time a prominent person said Blair should face jail?

Only in the minds of obsessive remoaners like yourself. Most people just get on with life.

As for Sugar what's the matter - upset you're losing losing a few bob on Brexit?

Allan

If pro-Brexit statements carry a risk of prison what about Osborne's lies that Brexit would by now have 1/2 million more unemployed, a recession etc etc? Lock up the Treasury and its ex bosses.

Sunil_Prasannan

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/Independent/status/893524190891999235

Bloody REMOANERS! Stealing our headbangery!

ThreeQuidder

williamglenn said:

Philip_Thompson said:

What a weird article. Especially this final sentence: Lord Sugar left Labour in 2015 after the party shifted slightly to the left of centre under Ed Miliband

Never mind the journalism, what's significant is how quickly the leading Brexiteers have become hate figures. When was the first time a prominent person said Blair should face jail?

After he won...

Sean_F

williamglenn said:

Philip_Thompson said:

What a weird article. Especially this final sentence: Lord Sugar left Labour in 2015 after the party shifted slightly to the left of centre under Ed Miliband

Never mind the journalism, what's significant is how quickly the leading Brexiteers have become hate figures. When was the first time a prominent person said Blair should face jail?

Probably Bob Marshall Andrews in 1997.

Most people will just think Sugar is bonkers

nichomar

Drinking wine listening to Dire Staights with the sound on the news turned down, bloody wonderfull

Alice_Aforethought

Enough with the fucking cricket. Stupid, tedious game that takes 4 days to achieve a draw.

Danny565

Philip_Thompson said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/Independent/status/893524190891999235

What a weird article. Especially this final sentence: Lord Sugar left Labour in 2015 after the party shifted slightly to the left of centre under Ed Miliband

What's weird about that? That's accurate.

Sunil_Prasannan

Alice_Aforethought said:

Enough with the fucking cricket. Stupid, tedious game that takes 4 days to achieve a draw.

Golf is the only "sport" more boring than Test Cricket

Sean_F

SandyRentool said:

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. Rentool, does it not? Didn't quite a lot of people say UKIP was a worse problem for Labour than the Conservatives?

Ergo, the collapse of UKIP is now a problem for the Conservatives.

However, that is at odds with the GE results, where there were better results for the Tories in Kippy areas.

About 2 m UKIP voters switched to the Conservatives, and 700,000 went Labour on June 8th. But, the proportions varied enormously in different constituencies. It looks as if they split pretty evenly in the South, but went very heavily to the Conservatives in the Midlands, and less heavily to the Conservatives in the North.

GIN1138

Looks encouraging?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/04/ireland-threatens-stall-brexit-talks-unless-border-issue-resolved/

Benpointer

GIN1138 said:

Looks encouraging?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/04/ireland-threatens-stall-brexit-talks-unless-border-issue-resolved/

Surely all he can do is stall until we drop out with no deal in March 2019?

Doesn't seem particularly encouraging to me tbh.

Benpointer

Danny565 said:

Philip_Thompson said:

williamglenn said:

https://twitter.com/Independent/status/893524190891999235

What a weird article. Especially this final sentence: Lord Sugar left Labour in 2015 after the party shifted slightly to the left of centre under Ed Miliband

What's weird about that? That's accurate.

Horse racing - half an hour of watching nags wander around aimlessly ahead of 2 minutes galloping.

Big_G_NorthWales

Have been away visiting family in Lossiemouth and Elgin and reliving my fabulous teenage years in Berwick on Tweed. (60+ years ago). Have logged in from time to time while away andI notice that the arguments for and against Brexit continue to be seriously polarised with each side failing to win the other over.

From a remain vote to supporting leave I have come to the conclusion that for piece of mind I will stay neutral believing that some form of compromise solution will come about and no one, absolutely no one, can predict the outcome at present.

I notice this month saw another 20% drop in diesel car sales. I have an eighteen month BMW 520D that has just averaged 55 miles per gallon over my 1500 mile holiday, it is a lovely vehicle in so many ways, and it will last me for many years so it's inevitable loss of value does not bother me.

However, the one person that should be really bothered is Merkel as the banning of petrol and diesell by 2040 by France and the UK is a hammer blow to the German car Industry that may come to it a lot lot sooner than anticipated

Big_G_NorthWales

Benpointer said:

GIN1138 said:

Looks encouraging?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/04/ireland-threatens-stall-brexit-talks-unless-border-issue-resolved/

Surely all he can do is stall until we drop out with no deal in March 2019?

Doesn't seem particularly encouraging to me tbh.

I think Ireland has the most to lose with a bad deal

Big_G_NorthWales

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

Enough with the fucking cricket. Stupid, tedious game that takes 4 days to achieve a draw.

Golf is the only "sport" more boring than Test Cricket

It doesn't take 4 days though my wife used to complain at the four hours it took when I played regularly

Alice_Aforethought

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

ThreeQuidder

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

Enough with the fucking cricket. Stupid, tedious game that takes 4 days to achieve a draw.

Golf is the only "sport" more boring than Test Cricket

It doesn't take 4 days though my wife used to complain at the four hours it took when I played regularly

Tournaments do...

Big_G_NorthWales

ThreeQuidder said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

Enough with the fucking cricket. Stupid, tedious game that takes 4 days to achieve a draw.

Golf is the only "sport" more boring than Test Cricket

It doesn't take 4 days though my wife used to complain at the four hours it took when I played regularly

Tournaments do...

Good point but it was only 4 hours a day and depends on the cut

JosiasJessop

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Have been away visiting family in Lossiemouth and Elgin and reliving my fabulous teenage years in Berwick on Tweed. (60+ years ago). Have logged in from time to time while away andI notice that the arguments for and against Brexit continue to be seriously polarised with each side failing to win the other over.

From a remain vote to supporting leave I have come to the conclusion that for piece of mind I will stay neutral believing that some form of compromise solution will come about and no one, absolutely no one, can predict the outcome at present.

I notice this month saw another 20% drop in diesel car sales. I have an eighteen month BMW 520D that has just averaged 55 miles per gallon over my 1500 mile holiday, it is a lovely vehicle in so many ways, and it will last me for many years so it's inevitable loss of value does not bother me.

However, the one person that should be really bothered is Merkel as the banning of petrol and diesell by 2040 by France and the UK is a hammer blow to the German car Industry that may come to it a lot lot sooner than anticipated

" ... is a hammer blow to the German car Industry that may come to it a lot lot sooner than anticipated"

Why? AIUI the big three German auto makers are all investing in hybrid and electric cars, and hold many patents that will be useful to others. Yes, it'll be a disruption, but it's an unhurried one.

Like automation, Tesla grab all the headlines with their electric cars, whilst the work of the major manufacturers goes mostly unremarked.

Allan

Big_G_NorthWales said:

However, the one person that should be really bothered is Merkel as the banning of petrol and diesell by 2040 by France and the UK is a hammer blow to the German car Industry that may come to it a lot lot sooner than anticipated

Diesel car sales are likely to fall off a cliff especially if Hammond sets out a planned set of increases in fuel tax on filthy diesel (with some cuts on petrol) over I suggest a 5 year period. Heart of stone for the german car industry. Any weakening in demand that is already underway will weaken the German resolve to back the EU in their unconstructive approach to the negotiations.

Richard_Tyndall

OT. Big Solar Storm hitting at the moment and mobile phone systems including emergency service systems down across Eastern Canada.

Big_G_NorthWales

JosiasJessop said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Have been away visiting family in Lossiemouth and Elgin and reliving my fabulous teenage years in Berwick on Tweed. (60+ years ago). Have logged in from time to time while away andI notice that the arguments for and against Brexit continue to be seriously polarised with each side failing to win the other over.

From a remain vote to supporting leave I have come to the conclusion that for piece of mind I will stay neutral believing that some form of compromise solution will come about and no one, absolutely no one, can predict the outcome at present.

I notice this month saw another 20% drop in diesel car sales. I have an eighteen month BMW 520D that has just averaged 55 miles per gallon over my 1500 mile holiday, it is a lovely vehicle in so many ways, and it will last me for many years so it's inevitable loss of value does not bother me.

However, the one person that should be really bothered is Merkel as the banning of petrol and diesell by 2040 by France and the UK is a hammer blow to the German car Industry that may come to it a lot lot sooner than anticipated

" ... is a hammer blow to the German car Industry that may come to it a lot lot sooner than anticipated"

Why? AIUI the big three German auto makers are all investing in hybrid and electric cars, and hold many patents that will be useful to others. Yes, it'll be a disruption, but it's an unhurried one.

Like automation, Tesla grab all the headlines with their electric cars, whilst the work of the major manufacturers goes mostly unremarked.

My point is that it seems to be happening now to diesel cars

Sunil_Prasannan

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

More of a train man, myself

Big_G_NorthWales

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

More of a train man, myself

Just spent the week overlooking the Border Bridge in Berwick with so many trains crossing 24/7.
It used to be a magnificient sight in the days of steam

Allan

Big_G_NorthWales said:

JosiasJessop said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Have been away visiting family in Lossiemouth and Elgin and reliving my fabulous teenage years in Berwick on Tweed. (60+ years ago). Have logged in from time to time while away andI notice that the arguments for and against Brexit continue to be seriously polarised with each side failing to win the other over.

From a remain vote to supporting leave I have come to the conclusion that for piece of mind I will stay neutral believing that some form of compromise solution will come about and no one, absolutely no one, can predict the outcome at present.

I notice this month saw another 20% drop in diesel car sales. I have an eighteen month BMW 520D that has just averaged 55 miles per gallon over my 1500 mile holiday, it is a lovely vehicle in so many ways, and it will last me for many years so it's inevitable loss of value does not bother me.

However, the one person that should be really bothered is Merkel as the banning of petrol and diesell by 2040 by France and the UK is a hammer blow to the German car Industry that may come to it a lot lot sooner than anticipated

" ... is a hammer blow to the German car Industry that may come to it a lot lot sooner than anticipated"

Why? AIUI the big three German auto makers are all investing in hybrid and electric cars, and hold many patents that will be useful to others. Yes, it'll be a disruption, but it's an unhurried one.

Like automation, Tesla grab all the headlines with their electric cars, whilst the work of the major manufacturers goes mostly unremarked.

My point is that it seems to be happening now to diesel cars

People are expecting a loading of tax in some form onto diesel. Also i suspect that some potential owners that care about pollution would now never buy diesel.

Benpointer

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Benpointer said:

GIN1138 said:

Looks encouraging?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/04/ireland-threatens-stall-brexit-talks-unless-border-issue-resolved/

Surely all he can do is stall until we drop out with no deal in March 2019?

Doesn't seem particularly encouraging to me tbh.

I think Ireland has the most to lose with a bad deal

Maybe, but little muscle to ensure a good one.

Sunil_Prasannan

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

More of a train man, myself

Just spent the week overlooking the Border Bridge in Berwick with so many trains crossing 24/7.
It used to be a magnificient sight in the days of steam

I visited Berwick station back in March (stayed in Newcastle), and saw the Bridge from below along the River Tweed, still a magnificent sight!

OK, here's a strange statistic for you: for various reasons, July 2017 was the first month since March 2015 that I didn't add any territory to my railway adventures. Broke the duck by doing Spa Valley on August 1st.

Benpointer

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

How old is your diesel Alice? Modern ones don't clatter or smell in my exprerience.

Big_G_NorthWales

Allan said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

JosiasJessop said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Have been away visiting family in Lossiemouth and Elgin and reliving my fabulous teenage years in Berwick on Tweed. (60+ years ago). Have logged in from time to time while away andI notice that the arguments for and against Brexit continue to be seriously polarised with each side failing to win the other over.

From a remain vote to supporting leave I have come to the conclusion that for piece of mind I will stay neutral believing that some form of compromise solution will come about and no one, absolutely no one, can predict the outcome at present.

I notice this month saw another 20% drop in diesel car sales. I have an eighteen month BMW 520D that has just averaged 55 miles per gallon over my 1500 mile holiday, it is a lovely vehicle in so many ways, and it will last me for many years so it's inevitable loss of value does not bother me.

However, the one person that should be really bothered is Merkel as the banning of petrol and diesell by 2040 by France and the UK is a hammer blow to the German car Industry that may come to it a lot lot sooner than anticipated

" ... is a hammer blow to the German car Industry that may come to it a lot lot sooner than anticipated"

Why? AIUI the big three German auto makers are all investing in hybrid and electric cars, and hold many patents that will be useful to others. Yes, it'll be a disruption, but it's an unhurried one.

Like automation, Tesla grab all the headlines with their electric cars, whilst the work of the major manufacturers goes mostly unremarked.

My point is that it seems to be happening now to diesel cars

People are expecting a loading of tax in some form onto diesel. Also i suspect that some potential owners that care about pollution would now never buy diesel.

If I was in the market I would buy petrol or a hybrid and as more move over to electric or hybrid the prices will reduce.

Big_G_NorthWales

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

More of a train man, myself

Just spent the week overlooking the Border Bridge in Berwick with so many trains crossing 24/7.
It used to be a magnificient sight in the days of steam

I visited Berwick station back in March (stayed in Newcastle), and saw the Bridge from below along the River Tweed, still a magnificent sight!

OK, here's a strange statistic for you: for various reasons, July 2017 was the first month since March 2015 that I didn't add any territory to my railway adventures. Broke the duck by doing Spa Valley on August 1st.

Berwick is a hidden gem in north Northumberland

Benpointer

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

More of a train man, myself

Now diesel trains really are noisy and smelly! SouthWest Trains - I'm talking about yours!

Sunil_Prasannan

Benpointer said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

How old is your diesel Alice? Modern ones don't clatter or smell in my exprerience.

Call that a diesel?

Now that's a diesel!

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Loco_70014_at_Coventry.jpg

Big_G_NorthWales

Benpointer said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Benpointer said:

GIN1138 said:

Looks encouraging?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/04/ireland-threatens-stall-brexit-talks-unless-border-issue-resolved/

Surely all he can do is stall until we drop out with no deal in March 2019?

Doesn't seem particularly encouraging to me tbh.

I think Ireland has the most to lose with a bad deal

Maybe, but little muscle to ensure a good one.

Nuclear - leave the EU and join UK in free trade area (unlikely but the EU want to equalise tax rates and Dublin's 12.5% would have to go)

Big_G_NorthWales

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Benpointer said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

How old is your diesel Alice? Modern ones don't clatter or smell in my exprerience.

Call that a diesel?

Now that's a diesel!

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Loco_70014_at_Coventry.jpg

Absolutely

welshowl

GIN1138 said:

Looks encouraging?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/04/ireland-threatens-stall-brexit-talks-unless-border-issue-resolved/

Sounds like the new Irish PM is a bit frustrated with lack of progress and possibly getting a tad concerned. Some of his compromise suggestions sound as if they're in the right direction. Hopefully behind closed doors similar noises are being made to Barnier.

Thinking aloud, if there's no deal and on March 30th 2019 we say "ok as you were, no tariffs, no nothing in terms of restrictions as far as we are concerned with EU trade", does it not put the onus on the EU either likewise to do nothing or erect a border of sorts themselves across Ireland that's their doing not ours?

welshowl

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

More of a train man, myself

Just spent the week overlooking the Border Bridge in Berwick with so many trains crossing 24/7.
It used to be a magnificient sight in the days of steam

I visited Berwick station back in March (stayed in Newcastle), and saw the Bridge from below along the River Tweed, still a magnificent sight!

OK, here's a strange statistic for you: for various reasons, July 2017 was the first month since March 2015 that I didn't add any territory to my railway adventures. Broke the duck by doing Spa Valley on August 1st.

Berwick is a hidden gem in north Northumberland

Great walls. Odd accent! Neither one thing nor the other to my ears.

Nigelb

Alice_Aforethought said:

Enough with the fucking cricket. Stupid, tedious game that takes 4 days to achieve a draw.

The possibility of achieving a draw despite being comprehensively outplayed is one of the things which gives cricket its charm.
Perhaps think of it as an extended exercise in deferred gratification ?

Benpointer

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Benpointer said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Benpointer said:

GIN1138 said:

Looks encouraging?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/04/ireland-threatens-stall-brexit-talks-unless-border-issue-resolved/

Surely all he can do is stall until we drop out with no deal in March 2019?

Doesn't seem particularly encouraging to me tbh.

I think Ireland has the most to lose with a bad deal

Maybe, but little muscle to ensure a good one.

Nuclear - leave the EU and join UK in free trade area (unlikely but the EU want to equalise tax rates and Dublin's 12.5% would have to go)

The past 400 years of history mitigates against Ireland aligning itself with Britain in any significant way imo

welshowl

Alice_Aforethought said:

Enough with the fucking cricket. Stupid, tedious game that takes 4 days to achieve a draw.

4! 5 please.

Cricket is all about having a few pints with your mates with some entertainment in the background, the volume of which you can turn up and down as you feel fit.

Big_G_NorthWales

welshowl said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

More of a train man, myself

Just spent the week overlooking the Border Bridge in Berwick with so many trains crossing 24/7.
It used to be a magnificient sight in the days of steam

I visited Berwick station back in March (stayed in Newcastle), and saw the Bridge from below along the River Tweed, still a magnificent sight!

OK, here's a strange statistic for you: for various reasons, July 2017 was the first month since March 2015 that I didn't add any territory to my railway adventures. Broke the duck by doing Spa Valley on August 1st.

Berwick is a hidden gem in north Northumberland

Great walls. Odd accent! Neither one thing nor the other to my ears.

It is a mixture of Scots and Geordie and I spoke it as a teenager

Big_G_NorthWales

Benpointer said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Benpointer said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Benpointer said:

GIN1138 said:

Looks encouraging?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/04/ireland-threatens-stall-brexit-talks-unless-border-issue-resolved/

Surely all he can do is stall until we drop out with no deal in March 2019?

Doesn't seem particularly encouraging to me tbh.

I think Ireland has the most to lose with a bad deal

Maybe, but little muscle to ensure a good one.

Nuclear - leave the EU and join UK in free trade area (unlikely but the EU want to equalise tax rates and Dublin's 12.5% would have to go)

The past 400 years of history mitigates against Ireland aligning itself with Britain in any significant way imo

Billions at stake concentrates minds

welshowl

Big_G_NorthWales said:

welshowl said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

More of a train man, myself

Just spent the week overlooking the Border Bridge in Berwick with so many trains crossing 24/7.
It used to be a magnificient sight in the days of steam

I visited Berwick station back in March (stayed in Newcastle), and saw the Bridge from below along the River Tweed, still a magnificent sight!

OK, here's a strange statistic for you: for various reasons, July 2017 was the first month since March 2015 that I didn't add any territory to my railway adventures. Broke the duck by doing Spa Valley on August 1st.

Berwick is a hidden gem in north Northumberland

Great walls. Odd accent! Neither one thing nor the other to my ears.

It is a mixture of Scots and Geordie and I spoke it as a teenager

Yes that's right. Isn't Berwick still at war with Russia, because some treaty missed it out, or is that a myth?

Benpointer

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Benpointer said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Benpointer said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Benpointer said:

GIN1138 said:

Looks encouraging?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/04/ireland-threatens-stall-brexit-talks-unless-border-issue-resolved/

Surely all he can do is stall until we drop out with no deal in March 2019?

Doesn't seem particularly encouraging to me tbh.

I think Ireland has the most to lose with a bad deal

Maybe, but little muscle to ensure a good one.

Nuclear - leave the EU and join UK in free trade area (unlikely but the EU want to equalise tax rates and Dublin's 12.5% would have to go)

The past 400 years of history mitigates against Ireland aligning itself with Britain in any significant way imo

Billions at stake concentrates minds

Ha! If Brexit has taught me anything, it's that when you have economics versus emotion, emotion is gonna win!

Big_G_NorthWales

welshowl said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

welshowl said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Big_G_NorthWales said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

I've got a petrol Mercedes convertible and these seem to be extraordinarily rare. At the moment there are 69 automatics for sale within 50 miles of me, of which 65 are diesels. I find that quite surreal. They clatter, they smell and with the roof down you are horribly exposed to both.

More of a train man, myself

Just spent the week overlooking the Border Bridge in Berwick with so many trains crossing 24/7.
It used to be a magnificient sight in the days of steam

I visited Berwick station back in March (stayed in Newcastle), and saw the Bridge from below along the River Tweed, still a magnificent sight!

OK, here's a strange statistic for you: for various reasons, July 2017 was the first month since March 2015 that I didn't add any territory to my railway adventures. Broke the duck by doing Spa Valley on August 1st.

Berwick is a hiddeun gem in north Northumberland

Great walls. Odd accent! Neither one thing nor the other to my ears.

It is a mixture of Scots and Geordie and I spoke it as a teenager

Yes that's right. Isn't Berwick still at war with Russia, because some treaty missed it out, or is that a myth?

Yes and it is not a myth