LMAO at this idea that the Tories "defending austerity" is the key to them recovering politically and getting a majority next time.
One of May's biggest faux-pas during the campaign is precisely when she implicitly defended the Tories' economic record (the Question Time "magic money tree" moment). Sneerily telling people who want better for themselves and their families that they just need to get their heads out of the clouds is not a recipe for political success - especially when it now comes at a time when magic money trees conveniently sprout up in Belfast when the Tories' own personal claims on power are at stake
In France polls are banned in the final few days but any more than that would be unacceptable as far as I am concerned. Of course the last 2 general elections you could ignore every poll bar the final poll from Survation
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
As with every policy these days it will benefit the rich (1).
Private polling would be rampant (surely they can't ban that) and only those that could afford to commission it would benefit on the financial and betting markets.
Regulation is a very bad idea. Holding pollsters to account for so distorting our election for the second time in a row doesn't seem so unreasonable to me.
Regulation is a very bad idea. Holding pollsters to account for so distorting our election for the second time in a row doesn't seem so unreasonable to me.
Agree totally with the second part of this, David. The question is how. Any ideas?
LMAO at this idea that the Tories "defending austerity" is the key to them recovering politically and getting a majority next time.
One of May's biggest faux-pas during the campaign is precisely when she implicitly defended the Tories' economic record (the Question Time "magic money tree" moment). Sneerily telling people who want better for themselves and their families that they just need to get their heads out of the clouds is not a recipe for political success - especially when it now comes at a time when magic money trees conveniently sprout up in Belfast when the Tories' own personal claims on power are at stake
That was a function of her lack of flexible thinking and ability to show empathy, not the core message.
LMAO at this idea that the Tories "defending austerity" is the key to them recovering politically and getting a majority next time.
One of May's biggest faux-pas during the campaign is precisely when she implicitly defended the Tories' economic record (the Question Time "magic money tree" moment). Sneerily telling people who want better for themselves and their families that they just need to get their heads out of the clouds is not a recipe for political success - especially when it now comes at a time when magic money trees conveniently sprout up in Belfast when the Tories' own personal claims on power are at stake
The fact Boris Johnson, ever the populist, has come out against the public sector pay cap this week tells you everything
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
LMAO at this idea that the Tories "defending austerity" is the key to them recovering politically and getting a majority next time.
One of May's biggest faux-pas during the campaign is precisely when she implicitly defended the Tories' economic record (the Question Time "magic money tree" moment). Sneerily telling people who want better for themselves and their families that they just need to get their heads out of the clouds is not a recipe for political success - especially when it now comes at a time when magic money trees conveniently sprout up in Belfast when the Tories' own personal claims on power are at stake
With inflation rising I think the fallout from the public sector cap will increase. The fact that TM's party are divided over it also makes it worse.
LMAO at this idea that the Tories "defending austerity" is the key to them recovering politically and getting a majority next time.
One of May's biggest faux-pas during the campaign is precisely when she implicitly defended the Tories' economic record (the Question Time "magic money tree" moment). Sneerily telling people who want better for themselves and their families that they just need to get their heads out of the clouds is not a recipe for political success - especially when it now comes at a time when magic money trees conveniently sprout up in Belfast when the Tories' own personal claims on power are at stake
The fact Boris Johnson, ever the populist, has come out against the public sector pay cap this week tells you everything
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Except give up your rights as an EU citizen.
If it matters to you so much why not go and live in the EU?
Regulation is a very bad idea. Holding pollsters to account for so distorting our election for the second time in a row doesn't seem so unreasonable to me.
Agree totally with the second part of this, David. The question is how. Any ideas?
Well the embarrassment of explaining their performance in a public forum is one incentive! Mr Boon will not be looking forward to his invitation.
But I have no doubt that they were all doing their best and the filters that they used were genuinely based on their interpretation of historical data and trends. Which makes it difficult.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Except give up your rights as an EU citizen.
Most of don't want to be EU citizens. It's why we voted to secede.
LMAO at this idea that the Tories "defending austerity" is the key to them recovering politically and getting a majority next time.
One of May's biggest faux-pas during the campaign is precisely when she implicitly defended the Tories' economic record (the Question Time "magic money tree" moment). Sneerily telling people who want better for themselves and their families that they just need to get their heads out of the clouds is not a recipe for political success - especially when it now comes at a time when magic money trees conveniently sprout up in Belfast when the Tories' own personal claims on power are at stake
With inflation rising I think the fallout from the public sector cap will increase. The fact that TM's party are divided over it also makes it worse.
The cap is one of the things keeping inflation under control to be honest. But noone is going to come out and say it.
First set to Konta but its looking seriously hard and hot work.
Her game is obviously quite effective, but it seems so ugly and lacking in flair to me.
Laura Robson was always much more enjoyable to watch I found. I suppose beggars can't be choosers though.
Indeed. Some of her groundstrokes when she gets really low and puts a lot of topspin on the ball are very impressive but she is generally functional rather than artistic or creative. Struggling again in the second set.
I think the criticism of polling companies is a bit rich. They are making adjustments for the last election for the next one, and things like the Theresa May honeymoon period where voters invest lots of things into an unknown leader distort perceptions.
LMAO at this idea that the Tories "defending austerity" is the key to them recovering politically and getting a majority next time.
One of May's biggest faux-pas during the campaign is precisely when she implicitly defended the Tories' economic record (the Question Time "magic money tree" moment). Sneerily telling people who want better for themselves and their families that they just need to get their heads out of the clouds is not a recipe for political success - especially when it now comes at a time when magic money trees conveniently sprout up in Belfast when the Tories' own personal claims on power are at stake
The fact Boris Johnson, ever the populist, has come out against the public sector pay cap this week tells you everything
It tells you he wants to be Prime Minister.
Well he did not win 2 London Mayoral elections and an EU referendum for nothing
LMAO at this idea that the Tories "defending austerity" is the key to them recovering politically and getting a majority next time.
One of May's biggest faux-pas during the campaign is precisely when she implicitly defended the Tories' economic record (the Question Time "magic money tree" moment). Sneerily telling people who want better for themselves and their families that they just need to get their heads out of the clouds is not a recipe for political success - especially when it now comes at a time when magic money trees conveniently sprout up in Belfast when the Tories' own personal claims on power are at stake
With inflation rising I think the fallout from the public sector cap will increase. The fact that TM's party are divided over it also makes it worse.
The cap is one of the things keeping inflation under control to be honest. But noone is going to come out and say it.
It may be a factor. But the fall in the pound is much stronger.
I think the criticism of polling companies is a bit rich. They are making adjustments for the last election for the next one, and things like the Theresa May honeymoon period where voters invest lots of things into an unknown leader distort perceptions.
If anything the criticism should be of journalists who keep going on about them rather than the actual issues!
Plus this time we didn't have herding, and a few of the pollsters got it pretty spot on.
Agree with TSE that it's a bad idea if it goes as far as banning polls during election periods, but a House of Lords ad hoc committee is about as influential as a PB pubmeet. It's not an unreasonable subject for such a committee to reflect upon and offer its thoughts, but I don't expect anything to happen as a result.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Except give up your rights as an EU citizen.
If it matters to you so much why not go and live in the EU?
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Except give up your rights as an EU citizen.
I never asked for it, nor do I even accept it as a concept. And I am fully satisfied with British citizenship and always have been.
People are citizens of nation states (and nation states alone) in my eyes.
I think the criticism of polling companies is a bit rich. They are making adjustments for the last election for the next one, and things like the Theresa May honeymoon period where voters invest lots of things into an unknown leader distort perceptions.
I kind of agree, but the problem is the pollsters themselves often present their polls as firm forecasts of what the election is going to be. How often did pollsters write a bit of accompanying commentary ahead of the 2015 election saying words to the effect of "a hung parliament looks almost guaranteed"? Or ahead of this year's election things like "the question is just how big Theresa May's majority will be"? That's before even getting into that moron from ICM who trash-talked any pollsters who produced better results for Labour.
If the pollsters simply presented their polls on their own, as simply snapshots of one moment in time, without trying to seem like soothsayers who are giving you a preview of the actual election results, maybe they wouldn't come in for such criticism.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
I have mixed feelings about the subjects covered. I think the BPC is working pretty well.
Banning polls during an election period might make sense. In 2010, the tracker from YouGov drowned out other polls, and had a disproportionate impact, creating news rather than reflecting views.
I share the concern implied that the powerful in politics might seek to curtail or alter the way polls are run and publicised for partisan advantage.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Except give up your rights as an EU citizen.
I never asked for it, nor do I even accept it as a concept. And I am fully satisfied with British citizenship and always have been.
People are citizens of nation states (and nation states alone) in my eyes.
So do you consider yourself a citizen of England or The United Kingdom?
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Except give up your rights as an EU citizen.
I never asked for it, nor do I even accept it as a concept. And I am fully satisfied with British citizenship and always have been.
People are citizens of nation states (and nation states alone) in my eyes.
Your particular brand of chauvinism has nothing to do with your original point that the Tories don't tell people what to do. They do.
Is he trying to out Tredeau Tredeau? I guess if he was, he would have been topless.
It does look a bit like that. Politics is very rapidly starting to look like a game show, half the buggers seem more concerned by the number of likes they get than actually doing stuff. I just hope it doesn't go down the Running Man or Long Walk path.
And seeing as I've mentioned a couple of King's novellas, I ought to say again that Trump is a very Stillson like character right out of the Dead Zone. And over here in "reality" Trump has blocked King on Twitter because he doesn't like the criticism King has dished out.
Is he trying to out Tredeau Tredeau? I guess if he was, he would have been topless.
It does look a bit like that. Politics is very rapidly starting to look like a game show, half the buggers seem more concerned by the number of likes they get than actually doing stuff. I just hope it doesn't go down the Running Man or Long Walk path.
It all about the perfect social media post, but then that is what a lot of the kidz are all about.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Theresa May's internet regulations? David Cameron and pornography? Thatcher and gay rights/Section 28?
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Except give up your rights as an EU citizen.
If it matters to you so much why not go and live in the EU?
Is he trying to out Tredeau Tredeau? I guess if he was, he would have been topless.
It does look a bit like that. Politics is very rapidly starting to look like a game show, half the buggers seem more concerned by the number of likes they get than actually doing stuff. I just hope it doesn't go down the Running Man or Long Walk path.
It all about the perfect social media post, but then that is what a lot of the kidz are all about.
Even when it is serious, it's policy at 140 characters at a time. The most complex of issues reduced to a single sentence.
I see that Reddit is now the 4th most visited web site in the US. CNN is 23rd, the NY Times 32nd. I find this quite disturbing as Reddit is a site famous for people never reading the linked articles but merely arguing about the usually misleading titles. It's the Twitter problem spreading to the web, combined with the Facebook siloing of like minded people talking to one another.
Is he trying to out Tredeau Tredeau? I guess if he was, he would have been topless.
It does look a bit like that. Politics is very rapidly starting to look like a game show, half the buggers seem more concerned by the number of likes they get than actually doing stuff. I just hope it doesn't go down the Running Man or Long Walk path.
It all about the perfect social media post, but then that is what a lot of the kidz are all about.
Even when it is serious, it's policy at 140 characters at a time. The most complex of issues reduced to a single sentence.
I see that Reddit is now the 4th most visited web site in the US. CNN is 23rd, the NY Times 32nd. I find this quite disturbing as Reddit is a site famous for people never reading the linked articles but merely arguing about the usually misleading titles. It's the Twitter problem spreading to the web, combined with the Facebook siloing of like minded people talking to one another.
I know a number of people who only get their news and views from reddit. Scary indeed.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Except give up your rights as an EU citizen.
I never asked for it, nor do I even accept it as a concept. And I am fully satisfied with British citizenship and always have been.
People are citizens of nation states (and nation states alone) in my eyes.
Your particular brand of chauvinism has nothing to do with your original point that the Tories don't tell people what to do. They do.
A marvellous non sequitur there.
If you view British citizenship as chauvinistic you are more than welcome to live somewhere else.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Except give up your rights as an EU citizen.
I never asked for it, nor do I even accept it as a concept. And I am fully satisfied with British citizenship and always have been.
People are citizens of nation states (and nation states alone) in my eyes.
So do you consider yourself a citizen of England or The United Kingdom?
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Theresa May's internet regulations? David Cameron and pornography? Thatcher and gay rights/Section 28?
Isolated examples, and I disagree with all three.
David Cameron scrapped ID cards, control orders and legalised gay marriage too.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Theresa May's internet regulations? David Cameron and pornography? Thatcher and gay rights/Section 28?
Isolated examples, and I disagree with all three.
David Cameron scrapped ID cards, control orders and legalised gay marriage too.
Oh FFS -- you'll set the Oxford comma mob off again.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Except give up your rights as an EU citizen.
If it matters to you so much why not go and live in the EU?
After Brexit he may not be able to!
He will be able to within the boundaries of the immigration law of the countries concerned, he just won't have an absolute right to do so.
I expect it to be as simple as moving to live in the US, Canada, Australia or NZ, or non-EU European states, and possibly even more so.
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Theresa May's internet regulations? David Cameron and pornography? Thatcher and gay rights/Section 28?
There's a general theme of the Tories trying to ban/control things that they don't understand
I think the criticism of polling companies is a bit rich. They are making adjustments for the last election for the next one, and things like the Theresa May honeymoon period where voters invest lots of things into an unknown leader distort perceptions.
I kind of agree, but the problem is the pollsters themselves often present their polls as firm forecasts of what the election is going to be. How often did pollsters write a bit of accompanying commentary ahead of the 2015 election saying words to the effect of "a hung parliament looks almost guaranteed"? Or ahead of this year's election things like "the question is just how big Theresa May's majority will be"? That's before even getting into that moron from ICM who trash-talked any pollsters who produced better results for Labour.
If the pollsters simply presented their polls on their own, as simply snapshots of one moment in time, without trying to seem like soothsayers who are giving you a preview of the actual election results, maybe they wouldn't come in for such criticism.
I agree that some pollsters need to be a bit more humble, it's just we don't know which ones. Are ICM the Gold Standard? There seem to be 2 problems. A - Getting the right sample, and B - applying the correct filters. It is a difficult balance, and after all you can get A and B wrong,or right by the wrong amount and still end up with the correct answer by luck. There are also the imponderables. For example, significant numbers of "progressive alliance" voters seemed to go for labour in June because that was the way to achieve the progressive alliance. This may not happen next time. Turnout amongst higher age voters, particularly those who vote Tory may improve next time if they don't go on about a dementia tax. I don't see how these concepts will work through into the numbers, and most certainly in all areas don't understand how state sponsorship could improve it unless an exit poll type survey was produced.
Mr. Urquhart, there's a great amount of information available, but people choose what they want, hence echo chambers.
It's a bit like a supermarket. You can have anything. Almost everybody has bread and cheese to some degree. Nectarines can be bought by anyone, but only relatively few get them.
Technology can be used to close oneself off to differing opinions, and that's something I think many people don't realise or underestimate. The ability to mute, block, silence, censor or expel people for expressing views deemed unacceptable, and actively seeking out people based on how much their views overlap with your own is an insidious aspect of the internet and, particularly, social media.
When I first set up my Twitter (MorrisF1, for those interested) I deliberately followed a few people whom I knew I'd disagree with on most things. One of them, after some very civilised disagreement, became one of only two people [that I know if] to block me for reasons that are a mystery. [Another person blocked me after they tweeted about Empress Zoe for #InternationalWomensDay, and I pointed out she blinded her son so brutally he died and perhaps wasn't an optimal example of womanhood].
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Theresa May's internet regulations? David Cameron and pornography? Thatcher and gay rights/Section 28?
Isolated examples, and I disagree with all three.
David Cameron scrapped ID cards, control orders and legalised gay marriage too.
I don't doubt you oppose all 3 - but to suggest the Tories don't order people what to do is wrong. Would you like more 'isolated' examples?
Banning khat, general drugs policy, extremist disruption orders, ripping up human rights, European arrest warrant, abortion limits, assisted suicide...
Why should one be surprised at Lord Foulkes' barmy idea? There is no aspect of human activity that Labour figures don't want to impose state regulation on.
It's a harbinger of things to come once Labour regain office.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
Except give up your rights as an EU citizen.
If it matters to you so much why not go and live in the EU?
After Brexit he may not be able to!
He will be able to within the boundaries of the immigration law of the countries concerned, he just won't have an absolute right to do so.
I expect it to be as simple as moving to live in the US, Canada, Australia or NZ, or non-EU European states, and possibly even more so.
I can assure you that moving to live in the US is in no way "simple".
There is a public aspect to opinion polling. Rightly or wrongly, they influence the dynamics of politics both during an election campaign and at other times. Yet they do not have a particularly distinguished track record. It's reasonable enough for politicians to ask searching questions of a highly influential yet not very accurate industry.
Mr. Urquhart, there's a great amount of information available, but people choose what they want, hence echo chambers.
It's a bit like a supermarket. You can have anything. Almost everybody has bread and cheese to some degree. Nectarines can be bought by anyone, but only relatively few get them.
Technology can be used to close oneself off to differing opinions, and that's something I think many people don't realise or underestimate. The ability to mute, block, silence, censor or expel people for expressing views deemed unacceptable, and actively seeking out people based on how much their views overlap with your own is an insidious aspect of the internet and, particularly, social media.
No it is not like a supermarket. It is far worse and more insidious than you suggest because sites and search engines and advertising platforms will adjust automatically and without telling you to your preferences. Not because you actively declared those preferences but based on what you bought or read or watched last time and the thousand times before that.
Edit: If you read mainly right wing views, eventually you will only be shown those options.
There is a public aspect to opinion polling. Rightly or wrongly, they influence the dynamics of politics both during an election campaign and at other times. Yet they do not have a particularly distinguished track record. It's reasonable enough for politicians to ask searching questions of a highly influential yet not very accurate industry.
You could say the same about economic forecasting.
There is a public aspect to opinion polling. Rightly or wrongly, they influence the dynamics of politics both during an election campaign and at other times. Yet they do not have a particularly distinguished track record. It's reasonable enough for politicians to ask searching questions of a highly influential yet not very accurate industry.
You could say the same about economic forecasting.
Economists regularly have their work tossed and gored in Parliament.
There is a public aspect to opinion polling. Rightly or wrongly, they influence the dynamics of politics both during an election campaign and at other times. Yet they do not have a particularly distinguished track record. It's reasonable enough for politicians to ask searching questions of a highly influential yet not very accurate industry.
If there's one thing the politicians should not be in charge of it is influencing the dynamics of politics during an election campaign. The election campaign periods belong to us the voters and the politicians are seeking our votes not the other way around. They should not be in control. If we want opinion polls we should get them.
Mr. L, that's a good point. Also algorithms can artificially boost or diminish the reach of content, and the moderators of said social media have significant power.
Shameful from Mrs May, as nasty as Gordon Brown's BNP policy of British jobs for British Workers.
Citizen of the World = Meaningless bollocks.
"The World" does not provide the rights and responsibilities that are inherent with the concept of citizenship.
May was absolutely right to say what she said. "Citizen of the World" is a meaningless concept in practice except for the ultra rich who can, to a large extent, afford to ignore the existence of states.
There is a public aspect to opinion polling. Rightly or wrongly, they influence the dynamics of politics both during an election campaign and at other times. Yet they do not have a particularly distinguished track record. It's reasonable enough for politicians to ask searching questions of a highly influential yet not very accurate industry.
If there's one thing the politicians should not be in charge of it is influencing the dynamics of politics during an election campaign. The election campaign periods belong to us the voters and the politicians are seeking our votes not the other way around. They should not be in control. If we want opinion polls we should get them.
I agree.
Politicians can still have a look at why opinion polls in Britain have been of such mediocre quality in the last two general elections.
The Corbyn lustre fades gradually. Brexit goes through and the UK economy begins to bounce. The deficit is dealt with (if not removed) and, most importantly of all, the May camp learn from the awful mistakes of this last election campaign.
Worth betting on a Conservative victory in 2022?
Better than evens on Tories getting most seats would be the bet I'd go for. Doubt May will be leader though in 2022.
As an aside - I doubt the economy will bounce from Brexit. The short term risk is downside. A transitional deal would avoid that but it won't cause a bounce.
Just came from a really really downbeat economic briefing...
FPT. Do your clients know you're the bank who said YES YES YES?
(If I'd voted Leave I wouldn't even get a tampax ad!)
Shameful from Mrs May, as nasty as Gordon Brown's BNP policy of British jobs for British Workers.
Identities can be complex, but I think it's legitimate to raise an eyebrow at those who loudly profess no loyalty or affinity to the nation whose citizenship they hold, but enjoy all its benefits and privileges. Yet alone those who actively sneer at and deride it.
A politician could quite reasonably point out that such behaviour can be both selfish and hypocritical.
There is a public aspect to opinion polling. Rightly or wrongly, they influence the dynamics of politics both during an election campaign and at other times. Yet they do not have a particularly distinguished track record. It's reasonable enough for politicians to ask searching questions of a highly influential yet not very accurate industry.
You could say the same about economic forecasting.
Economists regularly have their work tossed and gored in Parliament.
Over the next few months and years, I think a lot of economists are going to have great big fuck off I told you so looks on their faces. This guy helped to put together the £4,300 figure used in the Brexit debate.
The interesting paradox he describes is that a worse trading position post-Brexit is supposed to be a price worth paying for Brexiters, and yet the whole point about the many and various trade agreements we will apparently be free to make (which of course require a surrender of sovereigny, almost by definition), is, so the very same Brexiters tell us, to make us better off.
Comments
It's people's fault for believing polls... And I wager most voters don't anyway.
Also - first?
LMAO at this idea that the Tories "defending austerity" is the key to them recovering politically and getting a majority next time.
One of May's biggest faux-pas during the campaign is precisely when she implicitly defended the Tories' economic record (the Question Time "magic money tree" moment). Sneerily telling people who want better for themselves and their families that they just need to get their heads out of the clouds is not a recipe for political success - especially when it now comes at a time when magic money trees conveniently sprout up in Belfast when the Tories' own personal claims on power are at stake
Private polling would be rampant (surely they can't ban that) and only those that could afford to commission it would benefit on the financial and betting markets.
Plus it's just not British (2).
(1) © Mr. J. Corbyn.
(2) © Mr. N. Farage.
Laura Robson was always much more enjoyable to watch I found. I suppose beggars can't be choosers though.
The Tories may be many things, but they don't try and order you what to do.
The fact that TM's party are divided over it also makes it worse.
But I have no doubt that they were all doing their best and the filters that they used were genuinely based on their interpretation of historical data and trends. Which makes it difficult.
On further thought: nothing is so useless that state interference cannot make it worse.
Conclusion: clip their wings - have French type rules about publication in the last week of campaigning.
But the fall in the pound is much stronger.
https://twitter.com/EmmanuelMacron/status/882294413296369665
Plus this time we didn't have herding, and a few of the pollsters got it pretty spot on.
People are citizens of nation states (and nation states alone) in my eyes.
If the pollsters simply presented their polls on their own, as simply snapshots of one moment in time, without trying to seem like soothsayers who are giving you a preview of the actual election results, maybe they wouldn't come in for such criticism.
I have mixed feelings about the subjects covered. I think the BPC is working pretty well.
Banning polls during an election period might make sense. In 2010, the tracker from YouGov drowned out other polls, and had a disproportionate impact, creating news rather than reflecting views.
I share the concern implied that the powerful in politics might seek to curtail or alter the way polls are run and publicised for partisan advantage.
And seeing as I've mentioned a couple of King's novellas, I ought to say again that Trump is a very Stillson like character right out of the Dead Zone. And over here in "reality" Trump has blocked King on Twitter because he doesn't like the criticism King has dished out.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_subject
David Cameron and pornography?
Thatcher and gay rights/Section 28?
I see that Reddit is now the 4th most visited web site in the US. CNN is 23rd, the NY Times 32nd. I find this quite disturbing as Reddit is a site famous for people never reading the linked articles but merely arguing about the usually misleading titles. It's the Twitter problem spreading to the web, combined with the Facebook siloing of like minded people talking to one another.
If you view British citizenship as chauvinistic you are more than welcome to live somewhere else.
Vince Cable: Theresa May’s Tory conference speech “could have been taken out of Mein Kampf”
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/07/vince-cable-theresa-may-s-tory-conference-speech-could-have-been-taken-out-mein?amp
David Cameron scrapped ID cards, control orders and legalised gay marriage too.
I expect it to be as simple as moving to live in the US, Canada, Australia or NZ, or non-EU European states, and possibly even more so.
Mr. Urquhart, it perplexes me. But then, people who don't read classical history perplex me too.
Shameful from Mrs May, as nasty as Gordon Brown's BNP policy of British jobs for British Workers.
It's a bit like a supermarket. You can have anything. Almost everybody has bread and cheese to some degree. Nectarines can be bought by anyone, but only relatively few get them.
Technology can be used to close oneself off to differing opinions, and that's something I think many people don't realise or underestimate. The ability to mute, block, silence, censor or expel people for expressing views deemed unacceptable, and actively seeking out people based on how much their views overlap with your own is an insidious aspect of the internet and, particularly, social media.
When I first set up my Twitter (MorrisF1, for those interested) I deliberately followed a few people whom I knew I'd disagree with on most things. One of them, after some very civilised disagreement, became one of only two people [that I know if] to block me for reasons that are a mystery. [Another person blocked me after they tweeted about Empress Zoe for #InternationalWomensDay, and I pointed out she blinded her son so brutally he died and perhaps wasn't an optimal example of womanhood].
Would you like more 'isolated' examples?
Banning khat, general drugs policy, extremist disruption orders, ripping up human rights, European arrest warrant, abortion limits, assisted suicide...
Would Tories have got a majority in 2015 without all the polls showing it TCTC for example.
Edit: If you read mainly right wing views, eventually you will only be shown those options.
"The World" does not provide the rights and responsibilities that are inherent with the concept of citizenship.
May was absolutely right to say what she said. "Citizen of the World" is a meaningless concept in practice except for the ultra rich who can, to a large extent, afford to ignore the existence of states.
Politicians can still have a look at why opinion polls in Britain have been of such mediocre quality in the last two general elections.
(If I'd voted Leave I wouldn't even get a tampax ad!)
A politician could quite reasonably point out that such behaviour can be both selfish and hypocritical.
ukandeu.ac.uk/brexit-fork-in-the-road/
The interesting paradox he describes is that a worse trading position post-Brexit is supposed to be a price worth paying for Brexiters, and yet the whole point about the many and various trade agreements we will apparently be free to make (which of course require a surrender of sovereigny, almost by definition), is, so the very same Brexiters tell us, to make us better off.