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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » August’s Ipsos Mori issues index. Immigration & Immigrants

SystemSystem Posts: 12,265
edited September 2016 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » August’s Ipsos Mori issues index. Immigration & Immigrants regains top spot

After reaching a record level of concern in July following Britain’s decision to leave the EU, fewer Britons now show concern about the EU, according to Ipsos MORI’s August Issues Index. Three in ten (31%) now say they are concerned about the EU – down 9 points from July – although it is still seen as the single most important issue (mentioned by 21% as their most concerning issue).

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • First. Oh baby.
  • philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704
    edited September 2016
    I've emigrated to this thread

    And second
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,158
    Bronze!
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,158
    I suspect it's still a big deal since nothing has been done about it, rather than due to suspicion nothing will be done about it.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,228
    edited September 2016
    RobD said:

    I suspect it's still a big deal since nothing has been done about it, rather than due to suspicion nothing will be done about it.

    It could be both, of course.

    Interesting that, of the top six issues, four are traditionally Conservative leading - exlcuding the NHS, which is traditionally Labour, and also Housing, where both parties have ballsed it up for decades.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Tin?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Is there data from the poll on people who:

    (a) ranked Europe as most important & had immigration in 2/3
    (b) ranked immigration top and had Europe 2/3

    I'd have thought that could be interesting - I suspect that it might allow tentative conclusions as to what is driving people's views on leaving Europe (i.e. to separate the @rcs1000 from the @Paul_Bedfordshire groups)
  • I think you're reading too much into this.

    We haven't left the EU nor got any sort of deal yet. You could equally say that, in this month's tracker, voters are keen to remind HMG of the importance of reform of free movement.

    Holding their feet to the fire.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,296

    I think you're reading too much into this.

    We haven't left the EU nor got any sort of deal yet. You could equally say that, in this month's tracker, voters are keen to remind HMG of the importance of reform of free movement.

    Holding their feet to the fire.

    And immigration goes beyond the EU. Probably too late for this poll, but I see that the migrant crisis in the Med is starting to get more coverage.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,239
    Are we getting less anxious? I count a -21% bias in those results. The big fall in the EU might well be from people who have found that the world did not end in July after all and I expect the knock on consequences from project fear at the time of the referendum have had this general effect.

    This may also be why the government continues to ride relatively high in the polls as we saw yesterday. Life goes on pretty much as before, people can breath again and think about more important things like how well Team GB did at the Olympics.
  • Kevin Hague, scourge of innumerate Nats, elegant demolition of Prof Haslett's letter to the FT (the one where he didn't under the difference between revenue and profit - and he's one of the Nats' "experts"!

    http://app.ft.com/cms/s/84dcec84-6ecc-11e6-9ac1-1055824ca907
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,239
    Not big on celebrity endorsements or prognostications but this shows the angst of many traditional Labour supporters well: http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/aug/31/this-isnt-bloody-funny-jk-rowling-laments-corbyns-strong-position
  • Fishing said:

    RobD said:

    I suspect it's still a big deal since nothing has been done about it, rather than due to suspicion nothing will be done about it.

    It could be both, of course.

    Interesting that, of the top six issues, four are traditionally Conservative leading - exlcuding the NHS, which is traditionally Labour, and also Housing, where both parties have ballsed it up for decades.
    I think you're being too hard on politicians on the housing question. They can't create land which doesn't exist.

  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    I wouldn't be surprised if it went higher if not for the obvious reason. The murder of the Polish guy in Harlow is of great concern and shows the mindset of some of our youths.
  • Fishing said:

    RobD said:

    I suspect it's still a big deal since nothing has been done about it, rather than due to suspicion nothing will be done about it.

    It could be both, of course.

    Interesting that, of the top six issues, four are traditionally Conservative leading - exlcuding the NHS, which is traditionally Labour, and also Housing, where both parties have ballsed it up for decades.
    I think you're being too hard on politicians on the housing question. They can't create land which doesn't exist.

    Housing is a very regional concern. Its scores by region are:

    Wales 14
    Scotland 6
    N England 14
    Midlands 17
    S E England 29
    Gtr London 44
    (No figure given for SW - 'All S England, incl GL' is 34)

    Corbyn is of course a London MP.
  • Moses_ said:
    Daily Mail writes shock "things were better in the olden days" article....
  • Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html
  • I disagree with the logic of this thread. It's not so much that immigration is rising as a concern, it isn't it has fallen as a concern. It is just everything else in proportion is falling faster. There is no major concern this month.

    Europe, NHS and the Economy last month would have all been as high or higher than immigration is this month. But the reason immigration isn't listed fourth is because concern about those fell as fast or faster than concern about immigration fell.

    The only increasing concerns this month are housing and defence/foreign affairs/terrorism which at +9% is quite significant.
  • Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865

    Moses_ said:
    Daily Mail writes shock "things were better in the olden days" article....
    Not an unsurprising comment from you shock.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,239
    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
  • Good morning, everyone.

    F1: rumour Canada might be scrapped for next year.

    But don't worry. Azerbaijan is safe.
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.
  • Immigration is going to be a very big issue for a very long time. People are not reacting to numbers, they are reacting to experience and perception. They will not notice the immigrants that have not come, they will only see the ones that have.
  • Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Leadership debate -- Do you fancy putting a question to Labour leadership candidates Jeremy Corbyn and Owen Smith?

    Also you can apply to join studio audience here

    http://news.sky.com/story/join-sky-news-for-labour-leadership-debate-10550949
  • eekeek Posts: 28,797

    Good morning, everyone.

    F1: rumour Canada might be scrapped for next year.

    But don't worry. Azerbaijan is safe.

    That's a problem especially as Germany can't afford their race - and most contracts have a minimum ratio of 50% of races in Europe or America.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.
    Which is why the move against Apple in Ireland is so overdue. Lets see some of the others in the dock too.
  • DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    In fairness to the EU (not something I write often....)

    In October 2015, the Commission concluded that Luxembourg and the Netherlands had granted selective tax advantages to Fiat and Starbucks, respectively. In January 2016, the Commission concluded that selective tax advantages granted by Belgium to least 35 multinationals, mainly from the EU, under its "excess profit" tax scheme are illegal under EU state aid rules. The Commission also has two ongoing in-depth investigations into concerns that tax rulings may give rise to state aid issues in Luxembourg, as regards Amazon and McDonald's.

    http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-16-2923_en.htm
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    edited September 2016
    34% in this poll put immigration as a concern, that almost completely overlaps with the 25 to 30% of voters who want hard BREXIT i.e. withdrawal from the single market and a complete end to free movement. If May compromises on that in any way at all, which she almost certainly will, then those voters will be ideal targets for UKIP as TSE correctly states
  • DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.
    Companies have a duty to their shareholders to maximise the profit they make.

    If governments are craven enough to grant them egregious taxation deals, then they have their voters to answer to.

    The issue in the Apple case is not what Apple did, but what Ireland offered them....
  • Morning all.

    Concerns regarding Foreign affairs up +3% - The Boris Johnson effect… :lol:
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    As Luxembourg is probably the most EUphile nation in the whole of Europe
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,296

    Morning all.

    Concerns regarding Foreign affairs up +3% - The Boris Johnson effect… :lol:

    Actually it's up 9%!
  • Mr. Eek, not sure that will be a problem. Azerbaijan is classed as the European Grand Prix [ha], and Russia could classified that way if it suits them.
  • Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/
  • eekeek Posts: 28,797

    Mr. Eek, not sure that will be a problem. Azerbaijan is classed as the European Grand Prix [ha], and Russia could classified that way if it suits them.

    Baku already is classified as Europe. You need to see Joe Saward's notes from Spa blog as he discusses the issue in that to see the scale of the problem and Canada wasn't a circuit he was worried about on Monday...
  • DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.

    If they were sensible they would realise large scale tax avoidance and offshoring cash are not sustainable. Just as the super-wealthy also would. Far better to sit down and work something out than leave it to countries - individually and collectively - to set the rules unilaterally.
  • weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    Patrick said:

    Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/

    Verb sap. Quoting Breitbart on here is not exactly accepted gracefully - even though the Guardian wrote a piece extolling its virtues.

    Meanwhile we have Clinton's News Network censoring an interview with a citizen who saved a young child by blurring out his Vote Trump T-Shirt.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,296

    I wouldn't be surprised if it went higher if not for the obvious reason. The murder of the Polish guy in Harlow is of great concern and shows the mindset of some of our youths.

    Worth saying that those youths have all been released on bail and have not been charged. Doesn't mean they didn't do it, of course, but if it had been a slam dunk they'd have been in the dock this week.
  • Mr. Eek, ah, didn't realise it was just the US not 'Americas' generally (so Mexico, Canada and Brazil, it seems, don't count).
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334

    Good morning, everyone.

    F1: rumour Canada might be scrapped for next year.

    But don't worry. Azerbaijan is safe.

    One of the best races of the season. Ffs, I wish Bernie would hurry up and die.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,755

    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.

    If they were sensible they would realise large scale tax avoidance and offshoring cash are not sustainable. Just as the super-wealthy also would. Far better to sit down and work something out than leave it to countries - individually and collectively - to set the rules unilaterally.
    It's better to offer something sensible than have a lot more taken from you.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,296
    MaxPB said:

    Good morning, everyone.

    F1: rumour Canada might be scrapped for next year.

    But don't worry. Azerbaijan is safe.

    One of the best races of the season. Ffs, I wish Bernie would hurry up and die.
    Not sure that would make much difference. In fact, he's probably done more to stop the flight of F1 to countries with a lot of spare cash.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,755
    O/T I'm really enjoying this Italian crime series called Gomorrah, about he Camorra. These are some extremely nasty people.
  • Sean_F said:

    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.

    If they were sensible they would realise large scale tax avoidance and offshoring cash are not sustainable. Just as the super-wealthy also would. Far better to sit down and work something out than leave it to countries - individually and collectively - to set the rules unilaterally.
    It's better to offer something sensible than have a lot more taken from you.

    Precisely.

  • Immigration is going to be a very big issue for a very long time. People are not reacting to numbers, they are reacting to experience and perception. They will not notice the immigrants that have not come, they will only see the ones that have.

    The two are linked.

    But your first sentence is prophetic, and spot on.

    If people think immigration is an issue now, they ain't seen nothing yet.
  • It appears that in 9% of the public's estimation the EU has moved to foreign affairs in the wake of the vote.
  • Weejonnie

    Indeed Breitbart is of the right. But...the article is simply pointing out that bits of the UK feel like foreign countries. Sure there's some resentment of eg Polish competing for jobs, school places, housing, etc. But the real 'foreign' - as in culturally unassimilable - remains largely Islam. The 'what the hell should we do about Islam' problem pervades the West and it needs an answer. Part of the problem is that the gut reaction of your average politician is at odds with the average gut reaction of the electorate in most of the West.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    I think action on those two is on the way, investigations ongoing. I don't think there is much for Amazon, they just have a business model not based on making money, McDonald's might be interesting, the US aren't going to be happy.

    Goldman Sachs might begin to sweat soon as well given the dodgy deal HMRC signed with them in 2009/10.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,296

    It appears that in 9% of the public's estimation the EU has moved to foreign affairs in the wake of the vote.

    That category includes terrorism, there's been a bit of it about recently, not that the media would like to talk about it.
  • Sean_F said:

    O/T I'm really enjoying this Italian crime series called Gomorrah, about he Camorra. These are some extremely nasty people.

    Just finished that, superb stuff.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,587

    I think you're reading too much into this.

    We haven't left the EU nor got any sort of deal yet. You could equally say that, in this month's tracker, voters are keen to remind HMG of the importance of reform of free movement.

    Holding their feet to the fire.

    I think that's right. Most people think nothing whatever has happened yet (they're not that far wtong).
  • glwglw Posts: 10,018
    MaxPB said:

    I think action on those two is on the way, investigations ongoing. I don't think there is much for Amazon, they just have a business model not based on making money, McDonald's might be interesting, the US aren't going to be happy.

    It is daft the way Amazon always gets lumped in with the likes of Apple and Google. It makes me wonder about the competency of the journalists and campaigners who do that. If anyone has any cause to complain about Amazon's approach to business it's the shareholders.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,797
    glw said:

    MaxPB said:

    I think action on those two is on the way, investigations ongoing. I don't think there is much for Amazon, they just have a business model not based on making money, McDonald's might be interesting, the US aren't going to be happy.

    It is daft the way Amazon always gets lumped in with the likes of Apple and Google. It makes me wonder about the competency of the journalists and campaigners who do that. If anyone has any cause to complain about Amazon's approach to business it's the shareholders.
    Looks at my last invoice from Amazon (for an ebook) yep VAT was paid in Luxembourg not Britain.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 72,169

    Morning all.

    Concerns regarding Foreign affairs up +3% - The Boris Johnson effect… :lol:

    To put foreign affairs up by 3% or 9% on his own after two months would be quick work even by Boris' standards, especially during he height of summer with all those young students flying off in search of adventure...
  • "Most people think nothing whatever has happened yet (they're not that far wtong)."
    Wait till the effects of the Austerity Budget kick in.
  • Patrick said:

    Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/

    Milo leaving the UK?

    Boo hoo.....

    Perhaps if he was a bit more up to date (he quotes a seven year old poll on UK Muslim attitudes to homosexuality.....the most recent is 4 months old...) he wouldn't be quite so worried, poor dear.

    True, in the most recent poll the majority of Muslims thought homosexuality should be illegal (58%, not the '100%' Milo quotes), but when you look at Muslims born in the UK nearly two thirds (64%) think it should be legal.....
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    But other countries have had tax cases brought against them and back taxes demanded to be collected. Not to the scale of 13 billion rather in the 100 of millions range. Bit then Apple is the most profitable company in the world.

    Also the Apple case hinges on the specific structure of the company and apple. All the companies using double Irish Dutch sandwich arrangements are 'fine' as they all used arrangements available to all.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,228

    Fishing said:

    RobD said:

    I suspect it's still a big deal since nothing has been done about it, rather than due to suspicion nothing will be done about it.

    It could be both, of course.

    Interesting that, of the top six issues, four are traditionally Conservative leading - exlcuding the NHS, which is traditionally Labour, and also Housing, where both parties have ballsed it up for decades.
    I think you're being too hard on politicians on the housing question. They can't create land which doesn't exist.

    We have abundant land. Politicians need to find the courage to build on a small fraction of the 89% of this country that isn't already built up, to offset the damage which their unrestricted EU immigration policies have caused.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.
    Companies have a duty to their shareholders to maximise the profit they make.

    No they don't.
  • nunununu Posts: 6,024
    Patrick said:

    Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/

    Good ridance to bad rubbish, London doesn't need him.
  • Patrick said:

    Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/

    Milo leaving the UK?

    Boo hoo.....

    Perhaps if he was a bit more up to date (he quotes a seven year old poll on UK Muslim attitudes to homosexuality.....the most recent is 4 months old...) he wouldn't be quite so worried, poor dear.

    True, in the most recent poll the majority of Muslims thought homosexuality should be illegal (58%, not the '100%' Milo quotes), but when you look at Muslims born in the UK nearly two thirds (64%) think it should be legal.....
    He says over half want it to be illegal and you retort that it's only 58%? Last I checked 58% is over half.
  • Alistair said:

    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.
    Companies have a duty to their shareholders to maximise the profit they make.

    No they don't.
    They don't?

    What are they there for then?
  • glwglw Posts: 10,018
    eek said:

    glw said:

    MaxPB said:

    I think action on those two is on the way, investigations ongoing. I don't think there is much for Amazon, they just have a business model not based on making money, McDonald's might be interesting, the US aren't going to be happy.

    It is daft the way Amazon always gets lumped in with the likes of Apple and Google. It makes me wonder about the competency of the journalists and campaigners who do that. If anyone has any cause to complain about Amazon's approach to business it's the shareholders.
    Looks at my last invoice from Amazon (for an ebook) yep VAT was paid in Luxembourg not Britain.
    That doesn't appear to help Amazon avoid any tax, or enable them to undercut rivals. VAT at 20% is still being collected on ebooks. The loophole that enabled low value items to be sold without VAT from places like Jersey ended years ago.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Alistair said:

    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.
    Companies have a duty to their shareholders to maximise the profit they make.

    No they don't.
    They don't?

    What are they there for then?
    Well for a start companies have no duty to their shareholders. Directors do.

    And if you read the companies act for the duties of directors maximising profit is not there.

    Maintaining the reputation of the company in wider society is though.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    Fishing said:

    Fishing said:

    RobD said:

    I suspect it's still a big deal since nothing has been done about it, rather than due to suspicion nothing will be done about it.

    It could be both, of course.

    Interesting that, of the top six issues, four are traditionally Conservative leading - exlcuding the NHS, which is traditionally Labour, and also Housing, where both parties have ballsed it up for decades.
    I think you're being too hard on politicians on the housing question. They can't create land which doesn't exist.

    We have abundant land. Politicians need to find the courage to build on a small fraction of the 89% of this country that isn't already built up, to offset the damage which their unrestricted EU immigration policies have caused.
    Good morning all.

    It's always good to look for silver linings. If Labour really is determined to disappear up its own fundament, then May has the opportunity to achieve things that will potentially upset her own base. As examples, airport expansion an and end to NIMBYism on housing developments.

    If she doesn't seize those opportunities that present, I'll join those who are already writing her off as Brown II.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,158
    Owen Jones latest:

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/sep/01/tories-pay-to-stay-housing-social-rents-tenants-homes

    Even by a Grauniad standards, this is particular guff...
  • nunununu Posts: 6,024
    Wow. May doesn't waste any time does she? Or I'd she taking credit for something already announced?
    http://news.sky.com/story/16335m-boost-for-car-sector-to-create-3000-jobs-in-midlands-10560773?dcmp=anther
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716

    Patrick said:

    Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/

    Milo leaving the UK?

    Boo hoo.....

    Perhaps if he was a bit more up to date (he quotes a seven year old poll on UK Muslim attitudes to homosexuality.....the most recent is 4 months old...) he wouldn't be quite so worried, poor dear.

    True, in the most recent poll the majority of Muslims thought homosexuality should be illegal (58%, not the '100%' Milo quotes), but when you look at Muslims born in the UK nearly two thirds (64%) think it should be legal.....
    Given not only homosexuality but even sex outside of marriage is illegal in some Muslim nations those figures are not that surprising, especially with foreign born Muslims
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    tlg86 said:

    I wouldn't be surprised if it went higher if not for the obvious reason. The murder of the Polish guy in Harlow is of great concern and shows the mindset of some of our youths.

    Worth saying that those youths have all been released on bail and have not been charged. Doesn't mean they didn't do it, of course, but if it had been a slam dunk they'd have been in the dock this week.
    Well its clear that this guy was murdered by youths. We do not yet know which youths did it , but youths it was.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    nunu said:

    Wow. May doesn't waste any time does she? Or I'd she taking credit for something already announced?
    http://news.sky.com/story/16335m-boost-for-car-sector-to-create-3000-jobs-in-midlands-10560773?dcmp=anther

    It's been around a while. Piggybacking off JLR plans:

    http://cwlep.com/project/whitley-south
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    Worrying PMIs for France and Italy. Marked slowdown for Italy as well (49.8 from 51.2). Not sure what the French can do to get out of their malaise (48.3 from 48.5). The French figure is especially worrying because even after the referendum shock the UK PMI only dropped to 48.0, the French haven't had any kind of shock to cause the poor sentiment, they just have fundamentally poor conditions for manufacturing growth.
  • Alistair said:

    Alistair said:

    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.
    Companies have a duty to their shareholders to maximise the profit they make.

    No they don't.
    They don't?

    What are they there for then?
    Well for a start companies have no duty to their shareholders. Directors do.

    And if you read the companies act for the duties of directors maximising profit is not there.

    Maintaining the reputation of the company in wider society is though.
    I have a pin.

    Would you like to count the number of angels dancing on its head?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Good morning. Interesting article in the WSJ:

    "The Populist Revolt Against Failure
    What erodes faith in the ruling class are bungled wars, uneven growth and insecurity."

    http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-populist-revolt-against-failure-1472598368
  • HYUFD said:

    Patrick said:

    Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/

    Milo leaving the UK?

    Boo hoo.....

    Perhaps if he was a bit more up to date (he quotes a seven year old poll on UK Muslim attitudes to homosexuality.....the most recent is 4 months old...) he wouldn't be quite so worried, poor dear.

    True, in the most recent poll the majority of Muslims thought homosexuality should be illegal (58%, not the '100%' Milo quotes), but when you look at Muslims born in the UK nearly two thirds (64%) think it should be legal.....
    Given not only homosexuality but even sex outside of marriage is illegal in some Muslim nations those figures are not that surprising, especially with foreign born Muslims

    Yes - also the poll showed the same age skews we see in the non-muslim population on attitudes - as someone remarked a few days ago, the issue of importing spouses and families remaining forever 'first generation' is something that needs careful consideration.....
  • runnymederunnymede Posts: 2,536

    tlg86 said:

    I wouldn't be surprised if it went higher if not for the obvious reason. The murder of the Polish guy in Harlow is of great concern and shows the mindset of some of our youths.

    Worth saying that those youths have all been released on bail and have not been charged. Doesn't mean they didn't do it, of course, but if it had been a slam dunk they'd have been in the dock this week.
    Well its clear that this guy was murdered by youths. We do not yet know which youths did it , but youths it was.
    You didn't used to present the Southern TV news did you? They used to make quaint references to 'youths' all the time, 30 years or so ago.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Alistair said:

    Alistair said:

    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.
    Companies have a duty to their shareholders to maximise the profit they make.

    No they don't.
    They don't?

    What are they there for then?
    Well for a start companies have no duty to their shareholders. Directors do.

    And if you read the companies act for the duties of directors maximising profit is not there.

    Maintaining the reputation of the company in wider society is though.
    I have a pin.

    Would you like to count the number of angels dancing on its head?
    So you are agreeing there is no legal duty to maximise profit then?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited September 2016
    Sean_F said:

    O/T I'm really enjoying this Italian crime series called Gomorrah, about he Camorra. These are some extremely nasty people.

    For some reason I usually end up watching TV shows about 20 years after they were first shown. For example I watched Twin Peaks for the first time last year. This mafia series sounds interesting though.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716

    HYUFD said:

    Patrick said:

    Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/

    Milo leaving the UK?

    Boo hoo.....

    Perhaps if he was a bit more up to date (he quotes a seven year old poll on UK Muslim attitudes to homosexuality.....the most recent is 4 months old...) he wouldn't be quite so worried, poor dear.

    True, in the most recent poll the majority of Muslims thought homosexuality should be illegal (58%, not the '100%' Milo quotes), but when you look at Muslims born in the UK nearly two thirds (64%) think it should be legal.....
    Given not only homosexuality but even sex outside of marriage is illegal in some Muslim nations those figures are not that surprising, especially with foreign born Muslims

    Yes - also the poll showed the same age skews we see in the non-muslim population on attitudes - as someone remarked a few days ago, the issue of importing spouses and families remaining forever 'first generation' is something that needs careful consideration.....
    Yes, as the more immigrant communities are integrated, the more they adopt western attitudes
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,654
    Alistair said:

    Alistair said:

    Alistair said:

    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.
    Companies have a duty to their shareholders to maximise the profit they make.

    No they don't.
    They don't?

    What are they there for then?
    Well for a start companies have no duty to their shareholders. Directors do.

    And if you read the companies act for the duties of directors maximising profit is not there.

    Maintaining the reputation of the company in wider society is though.
    I have a pin.

    Would you like to count the number of angels dancing on its head?
    So you are agreeing there is no legal duty to maximise profit then?
    Well the business of business is making money..

    The Apple interview on the radio this morning though - seriously "foreign to our values". This is Apple, the $0.5T behemoth, made me want to puke !
  • Alistair said:

    Alistair said:

    Alistair said:

    DavidL said:

    Moses_ said:

    Oops..!

    "EU chief Jean-Claude Juncker faces embarrassment over sweetheart tax deals signed by Luxembourg with Amazon and McDonald's when he was prime minister.

    Amazon faces similar claims that it lowered its tax bill by making sales to European customers through an arm of the company in Luxembourg. In 2014, the online retailer’s UK business paid £11.9million in tax on £5.3billion of sales to British shoppers. McDonald’s and Amazon both deny any wrongdoing."

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3768140/Juncker-s-tax-deals-Amazon-McDonald-s-EU-chief-facing-embarrassment-arrangements-PM-Luxembourg.html

    Really the point I made the other day. The EU picks on Ireland but there are many and more egregious examples in Luxembourg which seem to be left alone. I wonder why....
    Some of these global companies stink. It seems that they think that avoiding tax is the be all and end all of their existence.
    Companies have a duty to their shareholders to maximise the profit they make.

    No they don't.
    They don't?

    What are they there for then?
    Well for a start companies have no duty to their shareholders. Directors do.

    And if you read the companies act for the duties of directors maximising profit is not there.

    Maintaining the reputation of the company in wider society is though.
    I have a pin.

    Would you like to count the number of angels dancing on its head?
    So you are agreeing there is no legal duty to maximise profit then?
    I didn't write 'legal' duty......
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    edited September 2016
    Boom. 53.3, what a bounceback. Sterling up to $1.32, time to reverse the rate cut Mr. Carney!
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    edited September 2016
    https://www.markiteconomics.com/Survey/PressRelease.mvc/b2d9d18dacd14cb3a1c6b7836894b80f (Opens a PDF)

    The release for anyone who wants to read it.

    "Improved sales volumes to markets such as the USA, Europe, China, South-East Asia, the MiddleEast and Norway led to a further increase in new export business during August. Moreover, the rate of growth accelerated to a 26-month high. The depreciation of the sterling currency was by far the main factor manufacturers cited as supporting the upswing in new export work."
  • runnymederunnymede Posts: 2,536
    MaxPB said:

    Boom. 53.3, what a bounceback. Sterling up to $1.32, time to reverse the rate cut Mr. Carney!

    Presumably we won't have lots of uninformed Remainers hysterically poring over this survey like we did last month's, when 'the PMI' suddenly became part of their vocabulary.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,654
    MaxPB said:

    Boom. 53.3, what a bounceback. Sterling up to $1.32, time to reverse the rate cut Mr. Carney!

    Hopefully he will, borrowers really don't need it as low as 0.25.
    I think next month it will be held steady with a couple of votes to go up.
  • Fishing said:

    Fishing said:

    RobD said:

    I suspect it's still a big deal since nothing has been done about it, rather than due to suspicion nothing will be done about it.

    It could be both, of course.

    Interesting that, of the top six issues, four are traditionally Conservative leading - exlcuding the NHS, which is traditionally Labour, and also Housing, where both parties have ballsed it up for decades.
    I think you're being too hard on politicians on the housing question. They can't create land which doesn't exist.

    We have abundant land. Politicians need to find the courage to build on a small fraction of the 89% of this country that isn't already built up, to offset the damage which their unrestricted EU immigration policies have caused.
    Yes we have abundant land. Much of it is farmland.But the vast majority is in the Pennines, Wales and the Highlands of Scotland.

    You can prove anything with statistics..
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,296
    runnymede said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boom. 53.3, what a bounceback. Sterling up to $1.32, time to reverse the rate cut Mr. Carney!

    Presumably we won't have lots of uninformed Remainers hysterically poring over this survey like we did last month's, when 'the PMI' suddenly became part of their vocabulary.
    No live blog on the Guardian. *Innocent Face*
  • weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    Fishing said:

    Fishing said:

    RobD said:

    I suspect it's still a big deal since nothing has been done about it, rather than due to suspicion nothing will be done about it.

    It could be both, of course.

    Interesting that, of the top six issues, four are traditionally Conservative leading - exlcuding the NHS, which is traditionally Labour, and also Housing, where both parties have ballsed it up for decades.
    I think you're being too hard on politicians on the housing question. They can't create land which doesn't exist.

    We have abundant land. Politicians need to find the courage to build on a small fraction of the 89% of this country that isn't already built up, to offset the damage which their unrestricted EU immigration policies have caused.
    Presumably from someone who doesn't know that the reason we have fields is to grow food - you don't get much from concreted-over land.
  • HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Patrick said:

    Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/

    Milo leaving the UK?

    Boo hoo.....

    Perhaps if he was a bit more up to date (he quotes a seven year old poll on UK Muslim attitudes to homosexuality.....the most recent is 4 months old...) he wouldn't be quite so worried, poor dear.

    True, in the most recent poll the majority of Muslims thought homosexuality should be illegal (58%, not the '100%' Milo quotes), but when you look at Muslims born in the UK nearly two thirds (64%) think it should be legal.....
    Given not only homosexuality but even sex outside of marriage is illegal in some Muslim nations those figures are not that surprising, especially with foreign born Muslims

    Yes - also the poll showed the same age skews we see in the non-muslim population on attitudes - as someone remarked a few days ago, the issue of importing spouses and families remaining forever 'first generation' is something that needs careful consideration.....
    Yes, as the more immigrant communities are integrated, the more they adopt western attitudes
    The problem there is the assumption that immigrant communities become more integrated with time. I would suggest that Bangladeshis coming to UK now can live in a community that is entirely Bangladeshi in terms of food, church, language and dress with no need to adapt to anything but the weather. 50 years ago, a Bangladeshi would have more need to adapt to British ways.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Patrick said:

    Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/

    Milo leaving the UK?

    Boo hoo.....

    Perhaps if he was a bit more up to date (he quotes a seven year old poll on UK Muslim attitudes to homosexuality.....the most recent is 4 months old...) he wouldn't be quite so worried, poor dear.

    True, in the most recent poll the majority of Muslims thought homosexuality should be illegal (58%, not the '100%' Milo quotes), but when you look at Muslims born in the UK nearly two thirds (64%) think it should be legal.....
    Given not only homosexuality but even sex outside of marriage is illegal in some Muslim nations those figures are not that surprising, especially with foreign born Muslims

    Yes - also the poll showed the same age skews we see in the non-muslim population on attitudes - as someone remarked a few days ago, the issue of importing spouses and families remaining forever 'first generation' is something that needs careful consideration.....
    Yes, as the more immigrant communities are integrated, the more they adopt western attitudes
    In that case why do more Muslim women in Britain wear headscarfs today than they did 40 years ago?
  • runnymederunnymede Posts: 2,536
    MaxPB said:

    https://www.markiteconomics.com/Survey/PressRelease.mvc/b2d9d18dacd14cb3a1c6b7836894b80f (Opens a PDF)

    The release for anyone who wants to read it.

    "Improved sales volumes to markets such as the USA, Europe, China, South-East Asia, the MiddleEast and Norway led to a further increase in new export business during August. Moreover, the rate of growth accelerated to a 26-month high. The depreciation of the sterling currency was by far the main factor manufacturers cited as supporting the upswing in new export work."

    Of course if you read the comments on here you will learn that depreciation never boosts exports.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    edited September 2016
    As many here commented, Carney's a daft sod. The cut did nothing except harm savers and play into the 'we're in a mess so something must be done' narrative.

    Edited extra bit: perhaps a shade over the top initially. Changed to 'daft sod'.
  • runnymederunnymede Posts: 2,536
    AndyJS said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Patrick said:

    Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/

    Milo leaving the UK?

    Boo hoo.....

    Perhaps if he was a bit more up to date (he quotes a seven year old poll on UK Muslim attitudes to homosexuality.....the most recent is 4 months old...) he wouldn't be quite so worried, poor dear.

    True, in the most recent poll the majority of Muslims thought homosexuality should be illegal (58%, not the '100%' Milo quotes), but when you look at Muslims born in the UK nearly two thirds (64%) think it should be legal.....
    Given not only homosexuality but even sex outside of marriage is illegal in some Muslim nations those figures are not that surprising, especially with foreign born Muslims

    Yes - also the poll showed the same age skews we see in the non-muslim population on attitudes - as someone remarked a few days ago, the issue of importing spouses and families remaining forever 'first generation' is something that needs careful consideration.....
    Yes, as the more immigrant communities are integrated, the more they adopt western attitudes
    In that case why do more Muslim women in Britain wear headscarfs today than they did 40 years ago?
    Because communities are not becoming more integrated. And one reason for that is the relentless flow of new immigrants, including via the marriage route.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 72,169

    As many here commented, Carney's a daft sod. The cut did nothing except harm savers and play into the 'we're in a mess so something must be done' narrative.

    Edited extra bit: perhaps a shade over the top initially. Changed to 'daft sod'.

    Bother, I was going to ask if he was a 29-inch cock or just a very average cock.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    runnymede said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boom. 53.3, what a bounceback. Sterling up to $1.32, time to reverse the rate cut Mr. Carney!

    Presumably we won't have lots of uninformed Remainers hysterically poring over this survey like we did last month's, when 'the PMI' suddenly became part of their vocabulary.
    I'm honestly looking forward to seeing how Samuel Tombs spins this as negative data.
    Pulpstar said:

    MaxPB said:

    Boom. 53.3, what a bounceback. Sterling up to $1.32, time to reverse the rate cut Mr. Carney!

    Hopefully he will, borrowers really don't need it as low as 0.25.
    I think next month it will be held steady with a couple of votes to go up.
    Yes, that's probably right. I do think the chance of further action is now severely diminished. There has been too much positive data over the last couple of weeks. I'd like for interest rates to be around 1.5-2% by the time we actually leave the EU, because we may actually need serious monetary and fiscal stimulus around that time if it is an acrimonious break up.
  • AndyJS said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Patrick said:

    Maybe this sort of thing is why people feel so strongly about it:

    http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2016/08/31/london-is-gone/

    Milo leaving the UK?

    Boo hoo.....

    Perhaps if he was a bit more up to date (he quotes a seven year old poll on UK Muslim attitudes to homosexuality.....the most recent is 4 months old...) he wouldn't be quite so worried, poor dear.

    True, in the most recent poll the majority of Muslims thought homosexuality should be illegal (58%, not the '100%' Milo quotes), but when you look at Muslims born in the UK nearly two thirds (64%) think it should be legal.....
    Given not only homosexuality but even sex outside of marriage is illegal in some Muslim nations those figures are not that surprising, especially with foreign born Muslims

    Yes - also the poll showed the same age skews we see in the non-muslim population on attitudes - as someone remarked a few days ago, the issue of importing spouses and families remaining forever 'first generation' is something that needs careful consideration.....
    Yes, as the more immigrant communities are integrated, the more they adopt western attitudes
    In that case why do more Muslim women in Britain wear headscarfs today than they did 40 years ago?
    It might simply be a question of asserting identity. A bit like how beards and tattoos are now flavour of the month. People want to be different, and noticed, not to 'blend in' as such.

    But it could also be a sign of increasing religiousity.

    It's probably a bit of both.
  • Is there a place for betting whether any other country uses Article 50 before the UK? The Republic of Ireland for instance?
  • I wonder how the Remoaner news will report a PMI of 53.3? When it dipped, predictably, after Brexit they were all doom and gloom. I hope the BBC will now lead the cheering and point out that Project Fear has now pretty much completely unravelled.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    runnymede said:

    MaxPB said:

    https://www.markiteconomics.com/Survey/PressRelease.mvc/b2d9d18dacd14cb3a1c6b7836894b80f (Opens a PDF)

    The release for anyone who wants to read it.

    "Improved sales volumes to markets such as the USA, Europe, China, South-East Asia, the MiddleEast and Norway led to a further increase in new export business during August. Moreover, the rate of growth accelerated to a 26-month high. The depreciation of the sterling currency was by far the main factor manufacturers cited as supporting the upswing in new export work."

    Of course if you read the comments on here you will learn that depreciation never boosts exports.
    Well just a note of caution, input prices are rising quite rapidly as well, so this is a sugar rush rather than a long term gain, unless we are able to onshore a lot of semi-manufactured goods production.
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