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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The detailed data that suggests that Corbyn’s own generatio

SystemSystem Posts: 11,704
edited February 2016 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The detailed data that suggests that Corbyn’s own generation, those of 65+, appear to have given up on Labour

Amongst Corbyn's own age group, those of 65+, just 11% tell ComRes they have favourable view of LAB leader, 71% say unfavourable

Read the full story here


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  • Options
    GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    First!
  • Options
    notmenotme Posts: 3,293
    edited February 2016
    second
    (Like the Conservatives in Scotland)
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    notmenotme Posts: 3,293
    OT, this is going to have an impact in the may elections. Differential turnout is much higher amongst elderly...
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    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    edited February 2016
    Long term that could also be deadly for Labour along the lines of youngsters learn at their fathers knee how to put a red rosette on a donkey.
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    How long have I been saying that Labour is an idea whose time has gone?
  • Options
    notme said:

    OT, this is going to have an impact in the may elections. Differential turnout is much higher amongst elderly...

    Bad for Labour and bad for the Lib Dems. Both could lose councillors in the May elections. In a year when opposition parties should be making gains.
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,205
    Basically anyone who remembers the 1970s looks at Labour right now and thinks "no f****** way!"
  • Options
    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.
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    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865

    How long have I been saying that Labour is an idea whose time has gone?

    True. The only recovery I can see for them is to disband and reform as The "None of the above party" while hoping to always be on the bottom of the ballot form.

    Lots of if's though.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,144
    The elderly are those who remember when Labour was the default setting for power in the land. That they are deserting is horribly painful for Labour.

    The middle aged remember Labour under Blair. What is left now - Corbyn's Labour - looks on that era (and that coalition of voters) with contempt.

    All that remains under the fluttering, tattered standards is the Hard Left and spotty kids going with the latest Facebook fad.

    Cheerio, cheerio, cheerio....
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    John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    tlg86 said:

    Basically anyone who remembers the 1970s looks at Labour right now and thinks "no f****** way!"

    I assume the 16% who still consider voting Labour belong to the 'live and don't learn' brigade.

    These are terrible, terrible figures for Labour. The only crumb of comfort is that if May is a disaster the PLP might actually grow a pair and do something. Heh.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,144
    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
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    runnymederunnymede Posts: 2,536
    How long have I been saying that Labour is an idea whose time has gone?

    I think you are right
  • Options

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
  • Options
    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    edited February 2016
    Read another way it means that nearly 7 out of 10 over 65's who expressed a preference are sitting to the right of centre.

    Stunning. :astonished:
  • Options
    FPT:
    Pulpstar said:

    Is South Carolina WTA for the DEMs ?

    No, 35 delegates are allocated proportionately by congressional district (these vary between 3 for District 3, and 8 for District 6 - I believe the number of delegates reflects the Democrat strength in the relevant districts). On top of that, 18 delegates are essentially a WTA bonus up for grabs.
  • Options
    Moses_ said:

    Read another way it means that nearly 7 out of 10 over 65's who expressed a preference are sitting to the right of centre.

    Stunning. :astonished:

    Perhaps the next poll should ask how many of those 7 think that left-wing politics are a form of treason. Private prosecution time?

  • Options

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    Wales, possibly. Scotland, no.

    There are relatively few top-up Assembly Members in Wales so even if they lose all the constituencies - which would mean losing Bracon & Radnorshire, probably to the Tories - they might not have enough votes for list places. It's a long shot though.

    In Scotland, I'd be very surprised if they lose both Orkney and Shetland (Orkney is possible though), and amazed if they lost both seats *and* failed to win a top-up in the Highlands & Islands.
  • Options
    The danger for the blues is that they see this currently very good position and enjoy unfettered bloodletting upon themselves over the EU/leadership election.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    The latest poll for the Scotland Parliament (last week?) had them picking up two constituency seats (Orkney and Shetland) plus four top up seats.

    You'd have to reckon on those constituency seats are at risk from the Carmichael scandal, but the top up nature of the vote makes it all but impossible for them to be on zero.
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    Funny how Labour's doing so badly with the 65+'s when so many of the top hard-left are over 65 themselves.
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,205

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    Wales, possibly. Scotland, no.

    There are relatively few top-up Assembly Members in Wales so even if they lose all the constituencies - which would mean losing Bracon & Radnorshire, probably to the Tories - they might not have enough votes for list places. It's a long shot though.

    In Scotland, I'd be very surprised if they lose both Orkney and Shetland (Orkney is possible though), and amazed if they lost both seats *and* failed to win a top-up in the Highlands & Islands.
    Far more amusing for them to have just one MSP.
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    Funny how Labour's doing so badly with the 65+'s when so many of the top hard-left are over 65 themselves.

    But they're (almost) all Londoners. I was actually surprised no leftist secessionist candidate ran in this year's Mayoral election. I think it a certainty for 2020...

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    notmenotme Posts: 3,293

    notme said:

    OT, this is going to have an impact in the may elections. Differential turnout is much higher amongst elderly...

    Bad for Labour and bad for the Lib Dems. Both could lose councillors in the May elections. In a year when opposition parties should be making gains.
    Those old people might not actually stop voting, many take the responsibility very seriously, they'll just stop voting Labour... Just what the Cons need...
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    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    In Scotland, I'd be very surprised if they lose both Orkney and Shetland (Orkney is possible though), and amazed if they lost both seats *and* failed to win a top-up in the Highlands & Islands.
    The curse of Carmichael.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    tlg86 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    Wales, possibly. Scotland, no.

    There are relatively few top-up Assembly Members in Wales so even if they lose all the constituencies - which would mean losing Bracon & Radnorshire, probably to the Tories - they might not have enough votes for list places. It's a long shot though.

    In Scotland, I'd be very surprised if they lose both Orkney and Shetland (Orkney is possible though), and amazed if they lost both seats *and* failed to win a top-up in the Highlands & Islands.
    Far more amusing for them to have just one MSP.
    I'd have thought they should get two: one in Midlothian and Fife, where the SNP should take all the constituency seats, and where you therefore need about one eighth of the remaining share to get a seat (which works out as about 5% of the list vote). And then one in Highlands and Islands, where they will either get one of Orkney & Shetland or get a top up seat.
  • Options
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    The latest poll for the Scotland Parliament (last week?) had them picking up two constituency seats (Orkney and Shetland) plus four top up seats.

    You'd have to reckon on those constituency seats are at risk from the Carmichael scandal, but the top up nature of the vote makes it all but impossible for them to be on zero.
    There will be a tipping point in the % where they get no seats in the lists. The greens and nats may pick up gains.
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    runnymede said:

    How long have I been saying that Labour is an idea whose time has gone?

    I think you are right

    As long as Labour have millions of £ from the Unions they can survive. But is that wer opened up to individual member choice of which party to donate to.....
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    Moses_ said:

    Read another way it means that nearly 7 out of 10 over 65's who expressed a preference are sitting to the right of centre.

    Stunning. :astonished:

    Perhaps the next poll should ask how many of those 7 think that left-wing politics are a form of treason. Private prosecution time?

    This victim complex does you no favours.
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    To be fair, the Tories look after their client vote very well. But those are still horrible numbers for Corbyn Labour.
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    The latest poll for the Scotland Parliament (last week?) had them picking up two constituency seats (Orkney and Shetland) plus four top up seats.

    You'd have to reckon on those constituency seats are at risk from the Carmichael scandal, but the top up nature of the vote makes it all but impossible for them to be on zero.
    There will be a tipping point in the % where they get no seats in the lists. The greens and nats may pick up gains.
    That's true.

    Nevertheless, the latest opinion polls in Scotland (https://www.ipsos-mori.com/researchpublications/researcharchive/3699/SNP-remains-dominant-while-Brexit-could-swing-Scots-behind-a-second-independence-referendum-Yes-vote.aspx) put the LibDems on the same (or maybe slightly up) on where they were in 2011. Ipsos-Mori has their list vote at 8%, which would probably get them four top-up seats. If they were to get that, and hold both the Orkney and Shetland seats (no guarantee), they would actually gain seats this year.
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    Moses_ said:

    Read another way it means that nearly 7 out of 10 over 65's who expressed a preference are sitting to the right of centre.

    Stunning. :astonished:

    There isn't much that's right of centre about Tory policies for the over 65s!

  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    FTPT

    malcolmg said:

    Alistair said:

    Indigo said:

    Even in Scotland the debate is rather dull as independence is no longer a serious possibility now that everything the SNP claimed prior to the referendum has been shown to be wrong.

    Saying that should liven things up for you if that are any Nats within earshot ;)

    Its balanced out by everything Better Together said being shown to be wrong as well.
    Exactly, everything they said would happen if we voted YES has come to pass, must be getting very embarrassing for their sockpuppets in Scotland.
    However given it was muppets like Scottp ,they still whinge on about SNPBAD, unbelievable how stupid they are.
    Genuine question - what are those predictions?


    An Example
    https://twitter.com/scottishlabour/status/499542772203147264

    https://twitter.com/BBCScotlandNews/status/664767623805190145
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    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    The latest poll for the Scotland Parliament (last week?) had them picking up two constituency seats (Orkney and Shetland) plus four top up seats.

    You'd have to reckon on those constituency seats are at risk from the Carmichael scandal, but the top up nature of the vote makes it all but impossible for them to be on zero.
    There will be a tipping point in the % where they get no seats in the lists. The greens and nats may pick up gains.
    In 2011, the Lib Dems won 12.1% in Highlands & Islands. Their next best was 6.8% in the North East. It is possible that they could fail to hit threshold everywhere other the H&I but I really can't see how the end up at zero there. Indeed, it's a good deal more likely that they'll win two than zero.
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    If spuds hold this 2-1 lead, we are probably down to 3 teams fighting for the Prem. A new holder for first time in 12 years. 2mins left.
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    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    The latest poll for the Scotland Parliament (last week?) had them picking up two constituency seats (Orkney and Shetland) plus four top up seats.

    You'd have to reckon on those constituency seats are at risk from the Carmichael scandal, but the top up nature of the vote makes it all but impossible for them to be on zero.
    There will be a tipping point in the % where they get no seats in the lists. The greens and nats may pick up gains.
    In 2011, the Lib Dems won 12.1% in Highlands & Islands. Their next best was 6.8% in the North East. It is possible that they could fail to hit threshold everywhere other the H&I but I really can't see how the end up at zero there. Indeed, it's a good deal more likely that they'll win two than zero.
    It depends how damaged their brand has become after the effects of Carmichael.
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    If spuds hold this 2-1 lead, we are probably down to 3 teams fighting for the Prem. A new holder for first time in 12 years. 2mins left.

    Man C would still only be six points behind Leicester, so too early to rule them out, I think. But certainly much more likely that one of the top three will win.
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    Moses_ said:

    Read another way it means that nearly 7 out of 10 over 65's who expressed a preference are sitting to the right of centre.

    Stunning. :astonished:

    Perhaps the next poll should ask how many of those 7 think that left-wing politics are a form of treason. Private prosecution time?

    This victim complex does you no favours.
    I left the Labour Party in 1990. Why should I see myself as a victim? It's true that I would prefer politics to be based on class rather than identity, but I am wholly resigned to the fact that it isn't and isn't going to be for at least a generation, if ever.

  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    The latest poll for the Scotland Parliament (last week?) had them picking up two constituency seats (Orkney and Shetland) plus four top up seats.

    You'd have to reckon on those constituency seats are at risk from the Carmichael scandal, but the top up nature of the vote makes it all but impossible for them to be on zero.
    There will be a tipping point in the % where they get no seats in the lists. The greens and nats may pick up gains.
    In 2011, the Lib Dems won 12.1% in Highlands & Islands. Their next best was 6.8% in the North East. It is possible that they could fail to hit threshold everywhere other the H&I but I really can't see how the end up at zero there. Indeed, it's a good deal more likely that they'll win two than zero.
    6% in the list vote in some of the larger regions will almost certainly earn them up a top up seats. Given they are (apparently) on 8% across Scotland for list votes, it's probably quite likely they'll pick up 2-4 list seats across Scotland, plus whatever they get in H&I.
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    If spuds hold this 2-1 lead, we are probably down to 3 teams fighting for the Prem. A new holder for first time in 12 years. 2mins left.

    Man C would still only be six points behind Leicester, so too early to rule them out, I think. But certainly much more likely that one of the top three will win.
    I think the top 4 finish will be this top 4, just not clear what order. Looking at the fixtures I fancy Leicester to be still top at the end of March, but it is going to be entertaining!
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    The latest poll for the Scotland Parliament (last week?) had them picking up two constituency seats (Orkney and Shetland) plus four top up seats.

    You'd have to reckon on those constituency seats are at risk from the Carmichael scandal, but the top up nature of the vote makes it all but impossible for them to be on zero.
    There will be a tipping point in the % where they get no seats in the lists. The greens and nats may pick up gains.
    In 2011, the Lib Dems won 12.1% in Highlands & Islands. Their next best was 6.8% in the North East. It is possible that they could fail to hit threshold everywhere other the H&I but I really can't see how the end up at zero there. Indeed, it's a good deal more likely that they'll win two than zero.
    It depends how damaged their brand has become after the effects of Carmichael.
    Small bet on Scotland?

    0, 1, or 2 seats for the LibDems and I give you a fiver.

    3 seats we call it quits.

    More than 3, you pay me a fiver.
  • Options

    If spuds hold this 2-1 lead, we are probably down to 3 teams fighting for the Prem. A new holder for first time in 12 years. 2mins left.

    Man C would still only be six points behind Leicester, so too early to rule them out, I think. But certainly much more likely that one of the top three will win.
    Two defeats at home, for a team that used to rely on home form more than any other team. Have 2 more away games than home ones in remaining fixtures. Massive fixture list ahead in 4 tournaments. nah.
  • Options
    Well, well, well, well, well ...

    You Spurs!
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    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    The latest poll for the Scotland Parliament (last week?) had them picking up two constituency seats (Orkney and Shetland) plus four top up seats.

    You'd have to reckon on those constituency seats are at risk from the Carmichael scandal, but the top up nature of the vote makes it all but impossible for them to be on zero.
    There will be a tipping point in the % where they get no seats in the lists. The greens and nats may pick up gains.
    In 2011, the Lib Dems won 12.1% in Highlands & Islands. Their next best was 6.8% in the North East. It is possible that they could fail to hit threshold everywhere other the H&I but I really can't see how the end up at zero there. Indeed, it's a good deal more likely that they'll win two than zero.
    It depends how damaged their brand has become after the effects of Carmichael.
    Small bet on Scotland?
    0, 1, or 2 seats for the LibDems and I give you a fiver.
    3 seats we call it quits.
    More than 3, you pay me a fiver.
    rcs1000 thanks for the offer, i have not run the numbers and lack the time for next two weeks to do that - but I accept!
  • Options
    Orgasmic
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    The latest poll for the Scotland Parliament (last week?) had them picking up two constituency seats (Orkney and Shetland) plus four top up seats.

    You'd have to reckon on those constituency seats are at risk from the Carmichael scandal, but the top up nature of the vote makes it all but impossible for them to be on zero.
    There will be a tipping point in the % where they get no seats in the lists. The greens and nats may pick up gains.
    In 2011, the Lib Dems won 12.1% in Highlands & Islands. Their next best was 6.8% in the North East. It is possible that they could fail to hit threshold everywhere other the H&I but I really can't see how the end up at zero there. Indeed, it's a good deal more likely that they'll win two than zero.
    It depends how damaged their brand has become after the effects of Carmichael.
    Small bet on Scotland?
    0, 1, or 2 seats for the LibDems and I give you a fiver.
    3 seats we call it quits.
    More than 3, you pay me a fiver.
    rcs1000 thanks for the offer, i have not run the numbers and lack the time for next two weeks to do that - but I accept!
    I can't believe I'm betting on the LibDems doing well. That's so anti my normal modus operandi...
  • Options

    Moses_ said:

    Read another way it means that nearly 7 out of 10 over 65's who expressed a preference are sitting to the right of centre.

    Stunning. :astonished:

    Perhaps the next poll should ask how many of those 7 think that left-wing politics are a form of treason. Private prosecution time?

    This victim complex does you no favours.
    I left the Labour Party in 1990. Why should I see myself as a victim? It's true that I would prefer politics to be based on class rather than identity, but I am wholly resigned to the fact that it isn't and isn't going to be for at least a generation, if ever.

    It's the notion that you repeatedly return to that Tories, or a large number of them, regard left-of-centre politics as treasonable and to be suppressed by all means necessary. I don't think I've ever met any Conservative who's advocated bans of that nature. On the contrary, it's usually those who are left-of-centre who are keenest on bans, no-platforming, prosecuting people for things they've said, written, drawn or whatever, and so on.
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    Orgasmic

    So you saw the Villa v Liverpool match ?
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    dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,291
    Must be a while since Spurs were looking down on Arsenal, City, United, Liverpool et al.
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    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    The latest poll for the Scotland Parliament (last week?) had them picking up two constituency seats (Orkney and Shetland) plus four top up seats.

    You'd have to reckon on those constituency seats are at risk from the Carmichael scandal, but the top up nature of the vote makes it all but impossible for them to be on zero.
    There will be a tipping point in the % where they get no seats in the lists. The greens and nats may pick up gains.
    In 2011, the Lib Dems won 12.1% in Highlands & Islands. Their next best was 6.8% in the North East. It is possible that they could fail to hit threshold everywhere other the H&I but I really can't see how the end up at zero there. Indeed, it's a good deal more likely that they'll win two than zero.
    It depends how damaged their brand has become after the effects of Carmichael.
    Small bet on Scotland?
    0, 1, or 2 seats for the LibDems and I give you a fiver.
    3 seats we call it quits.
    More than 3, you pay me a fiver.
    rcs1000 thanks for the offer, i have not run the numbers and lack the time for next two weeks to do that - but I accept!
    I can't believe I'm betting on the LibDems doing well. That's so anti my normal modus operandi...
    In no normal universe would winning four seats be described as 'doing well'.
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    Moses_ said:

    Read another way it means that nearly 7 out of 10 over 65's who expressed a preference are sitting to the right of centre.

    Stunning. :astonished:

    Perhaps the next poll should ask how many of those 7 think that left-wing politics are a form of treason. Private prosecution time?

    This victim complex does you no favours.
    I left the Labour Party in 1990. Why should I see myself as a victim? It's true that I would prefer politics to be based on class rather than identity, but I am wholly resigned to the fact that it isn't and isn't going to be for at least a generation, if ever.

    It's the notion that you repeatedly return to that Tories, or a large number of them, regard left-of-centre politics as treasonable and to be suppressed by all means necessary. I don't think I've ever met any Conservative who's advocated bans of that nature. On the contrary, it's usually those who are left-of-centre who are keenest on bans, no-platforming, prosecuting people for things they've said, written, drawn or whatever, and so on.
    ...or relationships with Conservatives.
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    On topic Labour are screwed* under Corbyn aren't they ?

    *I'd use stronger language but I'm no potty mouth.
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    Innocent_AbroadInnocent_Abroad Posts: 3,294
    edited February 2016

    Moses_ said:

    Read another way it means that nearly 7 out of 10 over 65's who expressed a preference are sitting to the right of centre.

    Stunning. :astonished:

    Perhaps the next poll should ask how many of those 7 think that left-wing politics are a form of treason. Private prosecution time?

    This victim complex does you no favours.
    I left the Labour Party in 1990. Why should I see myself as a victim? It's true that I would prefer politics to be based on class rather than identity, but I am wholly resigned to the fact that it isn't and isn't going to be for at least a generation, if ever.

    It's the notion that you repeatedly return to that Tories, or a large number of them, regard left-of-centre politics as treasonable and to be suppressed by all means necessary. I don't think I've ever met any Conservative who's advocated bans of that nature. On the contrary, it's usually those who are left-of-centre who are keenest on bans, no-platforming, prosecuting people for things they've said, written, drawn or whatever, and so on.
    ...or relationships with Conservatives.
    Look. If someone says they want to kill me (and both Tory Party members and black radicals have - in times gone by - said just that) I believe them. Sane people don't issue murder threats for fun. I do my accusers the courtesy of assuming that they are sane.

    I am not accountable for the behaviour of Trotskyist idiots, either.

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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    dr_spyn said:

    Must be a while since Spurs were looking down on Arsenal, City, United, Liverpool et al.

    audere est facere - forever 10th.

    But no longer, perhaps...
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    On topic as mentioned above, they're all metropolitan london lefties who have never bothered to engage with the wider world. Unlike most over-65s.
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    On topic Labour are screwed* under Corbyn aren't they ?
    *I'd use stronger language but I'm no potty mouth.

    A party loses an election because their Leader was not considered Prime ministerial enough. So they go out and select a chap who is rated even more terrible PM material ......
    Must have a death wish.
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    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Alistair said:

    FTPT

    malcolmg said:

    Alistair said:

    Indigo said:

    Even in Scotland the debate is rather dull as independence is no longer a serious possibility now that everything the SNP claimed prior to the referendum has been shown to be wrong.

    Saying that should liven things up for you if that are any Nats within earshot ;)

    Its balanced out by everything Better Together said being shown to be wrong as well.
    Exactly, everything they said would happen if we voted YES has come to pass, must be getting very embarrassing for their sockpuppets in Scotland.
    However given it was muppets like Scottp ,they still whinge on about SNPBAD, unbelievable how stupid they are.
    Genuine question - what are those predictions?


    An Example
    https://twitter.com/scottishlabour/status/499542772203147264

    https://twitter.com/BBCScotlandNews/status/664767623805190145
    Mmmmmm....I know we bung them billions in tax but are we outsourcing the collection of it as well?
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    Orgasmic

    So you saw the Villa v Liverpool match ?
    That too, you should be safe now... Big 6 pointer.
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    Moses_ said:

    Read another way it means that nearly 7 out of 10 over 65's who expressed a preference are sitting to the right of centre.

    Stunning. :astonished:

    Perhaps the next poll should ask how many of those 7 think that left-wing politics are a form of treason. Private prosecution time?

    This victim complex does you no favours.
    I left the Labour Party in 1990. Why should I see myself as a victim? It's true that I would prefer politics to be based on class rather than identity, but I am wholly resigned to the fact that it isn't and isn't going to be for at least a generation, if ever.

    It's the notion that you repeatedly return to that Tories, or a large number of them, regard left-of-centre politics as treasonable and to be suppressed by all means necessary. I don't think I've ever met any Conservative who's advocated bans of that nature. On the contrary, it's usually those who are left-of-centre who are keenest on bans, no-platforming, prosecuting people for things they've said, written, drawn or whatever, and so on.
    ...or relationships with Conservatives.
    Look. If someone says they want to kill me (and both Tory Party members and black radicals have - in times gone by - said just that) I believe them. Sane people don't issue murder threats for fun. I do my accusers the courtesy of assuming that they are sane.
    I am not accountable for the behaviour of Trotskyist idiots, either.
    Were the threats real and to your face? I have been threatened in other countries, in person, not pleasant and not something I would joke about.
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    Moses_ said:

    Read another way it means that nearly 7 out of 10 over 65's who expressed a preference are sitting to the right of centre.

    Stunning. :astonished:

    Perhaps the next poll should ask how many of those 7 think that left-wing politics are a form of treason. Private prosecution time?

    This victim complex does you no favours.
    I left the Labour Party in 1990. Why should I see myself as a victim? It's true that I would prefer politics to be based on class rather than identity, but I am wholly resigned to the fact that it isn't and isn't going to be for at least a generation, if ever.

    It's the notion that you repeatedly return to that Tories, or a large number of them, regard left-of-centre politics as treasonable and to be suppressed by all means necessary. I don't think I've ever met any Conservative who's advocated bans of that nature. On the contrary, it's usually those who are left-of-centre who are keenest on bans, no-platforming, prosecuting people for things they've said, written, drawn or whatever, and so on.
    ...or relationships with Conservatives.
    Look. If someone says they want to kill me (and both Tory Party members and black radicals have - in times gone by - said just that) I believe them. Sane people don't issue murder threats for fun. I do my accusers the courtesy of assuming that they are sane.
    I am not accountable for the behaviour of Trotskyist idiots, either.
    Were the threats real and to your face? I have been threatened in other countries, in person, not pleasant and not something I would joke about.
    Yes they were, one in the workplace and the other in a public meeting. I agree they are not things to joke about.

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    TOPPING said:

    On topic as mentioned above, they're all metropolitan london lefties who have never bothered to engage with the wider world. Unlike most over-65s.

    There's nothing metropolitan about Labour's leadership. It's hard left.

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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,401


    There are relatively few top-up Assembly Members in Wales so even if they lose all the constituencies - which would mean losing Bracon & Radnorshire, probably to the Tories - they might not have enough votes for list places. It's a long shot though.

    I will go further and say it is more likely the Conservatives will lead the next executive than that the Oranges are blanked in Wales. Even if they lose Brecon and Radnor, they would be guaranteed a list seat based on their strength in Ceredigion and Powys.

    Less than 4 would be a shockingly bad result for them if, as expected, Labour slip back substantially outside the valleys. The real issue in Wales is that with two parties of roughly equal strength who hate each other fighting for second, it's very hard to see how Labour could be removed from power, something that is desperately needed for both Wales and Welsh Labour.
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    Evening all.

    Must admit to being mighty surprised to see Labour drop 2% points in the last ComRes VI online poll, when all media attention appeared fixed on the EU negotiations fall-out and Jeremy Corbyn seemed to have a breather from attack. – If he can’t rally the polls during the good times, when can he?
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited February 2016

    How long have I been saying that Labour is an idea whose time has gone?

    They're going the same way as the Swedish Social Democrats who've just registered their lowest ever opinion poll rating, 21.1%.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swedish_general_election,_2018#Poll_results
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    RoyalBlueRoyalBlue Posts: 3,223
    Is the real battle in Wales not for third place? The Tories seem to have pulled clear of Plaid in recent polling and at the General Election.
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    Just watched Steve Crabb on QT. Not impressed at all, I think he is a very poor speaker. He couldn't think fast enough on his feet, or sitting down I should say.
    I noticed Nigel Farage is trying to tone down his rhetoric and appear more statesmanlike.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,401
    On topic, if this is the way numbers are breaking for Corbyn, perhaps we should seriously consider the possibility of another party challenging them for second in the popular vote if this continues? After all, the only people who appear to like Corbyn and say they will vote for him are the ones who never actually vote.

    OK, it worked for Obama, but the Jezziah is not the Obamessiah. He is too old, too dull, too stupid and too tainted by decades of dubious contacts.

    If the long shot came in and say, UKIP took second in the vote but still only 40-50 seats to Labour's 150, what would that do to the debate on reform.

    (PS on drugs - don't forget cannabis is a powerful and effective painkiller. Queen Victoria used it for period pain, for example. Lots of elderly people with crippling arthritis might be interested in obtaining and using it legally. This isn't quite such a stupid policy, aimed at the toots, as it may seem.)
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    On topic Labour are screwed* under Corbyn aren't they ?

    *I'd use stronger language but I'm no potty mouth.

    Naught but PB Tory propaganda! :lol:
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,401
    RoyalBlue said:

    Is the real battle in Wales not for third place? The Tories seem to have pulled clear of Plaid in recent polling and at the General Election.

    More likely fourth between UKIP and the LDs.

    Whatever Farage says, however, it will be a very great surprise if UKIP get more than one seat (a list seat in Monmouthshire being the likeliest path).

    The outcome will therefore almost certainly be a Labour/Plaid coalition. The question might be whether Leanne Wood might try and either take the first ministership herself or find a reasonably moderate figure from one party or the other to head it. She wouldn't find that easy, but I wouldn't put it past her to try.
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    notmenotme Posts: 3,293

    Evening all.

    Must admit to being mighty surprised to see Labour drop 2% points in the last ComRes VI online poll, when all media attention appeared fixed on the EU negotiations fall-out and Jeremy Corbyn seemed to have a breather from attack. – If he can’t rally the polls during the good times, when can he?

    things do take time to feed through, but yes like you, I was expecting a bit of a drop for the tories following the mauling that Cameron has had and the contemptuous way he is being spoke about.
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    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,205
    ydoethur said:

    RoyalBlue said:

    Is the real battle in Wales not for third place? The Tories seem to have pulled clear of Plaid in recent polling and at the General Election.

    More likely fourth between UKIP and the LDs.

    Whatever Farage says, however, it will be a very great surprise if UKIP get more than one seat (a list seat in Monmouthshire being the likeliest path).

    The outcome will therefore almost certainly be a Labour/Plaid coalition. The question might be whether Leanne Wood might try and either take the first ministership herself or find a reasonably moderate figure from one party or the other to head it. She wouldn't find that easy, but I wouldn't put it past her to try.
    My favourite stat from the General Election is that Ukip got more votes in Wales than Plaid did. I doubt, however, that they'd be able to do so in the Assembly election.
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    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,422
    edited February 2016
    ydoethur said:


    There are relatively few top-up Assembly Members in Wales so even if they lose all the constituencies - which would mean losing Bracon & Radnorshire, probably to the Tories - they might not have enough votes for list places. It's a long shot though.

    I will go further and say it is more likely the Conservatives will lead the next executive than that the Oranges are blanked in Wales. Even if they lose Brecon and Radnor, they would be guaranteed a list seat based on their strength in Ceredigion and Powys.

    Less than 4 would be a shockingly bad result for them if, as expected, Labour slip back substantially outside the valleys. The real issue in Wales is that with two parties of roughly equal strength who hate each other fighting for second, it's very hard to see how Labour could be removed from power, something that is desperately needed for both Wales and Welsh Labour.
    I didn't realise UKIP were doing that well?

    Edit - I know they're not. They seem to have even more of a death wish than, well, every other party at the moment.
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Apart from reading the howling here re Carmichael, I've paid little attention to him. Will his legacy really make a difference? I'm wary given how often voters disregard issues that seem to us quite bad.

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I wonder if the new pot head policy of Farron will affect the votes of the over 65s?
    Innocent face.

    He's hoping to affect their short term memory...
    Best hope for the LibDems :lol:
    Their long term memory of the LibDems is what need erasing.....
    Could we see zero Lib Dems in the Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly?
    What Mr Senior would call an impossible wet dream.
    The latest poll for the Scotland Parliament (last week?) had them picking up two constituency seats (Orkney and Shetland) plus four top up seats.

    You'd have to reckon on those constituency seats are at risk from the Carmichael scandal, but the top up nature of the vote makes it all but impossible for them to be on zero.
    There will be a tipping point in the % where they get no seats in the lists. The greens and nats may pick up gains.
    In 2011, the Lib Dems won 12.1% in Highlands & Islands. Their next best was 6.8% in the North East. It is possible that they could fail to hit threshold everywhere other the H&I but I really can't see how the end up at zero there. Indeed, it's a good deal more likely that they'll win two than zero.
    It depends how damaged their brand has become after the effects of Carmichael.
    Small bet on Scotland?
    0, 1, or 2 seats for the LibDems and I give you a fiver.
    3 seats we call it quits.
    More than 3, you pay me a fiver.
    rcs1000 thanks for the offer, i have not run the numbers and lack the time for next two weeks to do that - but I accept!
    I can't believe I'm betting on the LibDems doing well. That's so anti my normal modus operandi...
    In no normal universe would winning four seats be described as 'doing well'.
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    Evening all.

    Must admit to being mighty surprised to see Labour drop 2% points in the last ComRes VI online poll, when all media attention appeared fixed on the EU negotiations fall-out and Jeremy Corbyn seemed to have a breather from attack. – If he can’t rally the polls during the good times, when can he?

    Alastair might be right, few people give a stuff about the EU, hence the Tory share remaining the same/going up with YouGov and ComRes since the deal was announced.
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    ydoethur said:

    (PS on drugs - don't forget cannabis is a powerful and effective painkiller. Queen Victoria used it for period pain, for example. Lots of elderly people with crippling arthritis might be interested in obtaining and using it legally. This isn't quite such a stupid policy, aimed at the toots, as it may seem.)

    My libertarian side kind of agrees but the politics are against it in the short term.
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,449
    edited February 2016

    Just watched Steve Crabb on QT. Not impressed at all, I think he is a very poor speaker. He couldn't think fast enough on his feet, or sitting down I should say.
    I noticed Nigel Farage is trying to tone down his rhetoric and appear more statesmanlike.

    Couldn't believe seeing Nige on George Galloway's "Sputnik" programme yesterday :)
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    SeanT said:

    But, oh dear, she's not happy now. "Cameron was doing so well, now he's lying to us about Europe. He's gone all weak. I don't understand it".

    If he's losing soft centrist voters like my Mum he is in trouble

    Is she going to vote for Corbyn?

    Moving on...
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002

    Evening all.

    Must admit to being mighty surprised to see Labour drop 2% points in the last ComRes VI online poll, when all media attention appeared fixed on the EU negotiations fall-out and Jeremy Corbyn seemed to have a breather from attack. – If he can’t rally the polls during the good times, when can he?

    Alastair might be right, few people give a stuff about the EU, hence the Tory share remaining the same/going up with YouGov and ComRes since the deal was announced.
    Or the Doctors.....
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    I saw the Etihad Stadium on Friday.... from the Tram :)
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    MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,316
    Lord Avebury (Eric Lubbock) has died today.

    So the LDs in the Lords are down three Peers in the last four days - with Shirley Williams and Baroness Linklater having retired on Thursday and Friday.

    Avebury hadn't been voting recently - whereas Shirley and Linklater had been regular attendees.

    New State of the Parties will be:

    Con 250, Lab 213, LD 108, Crossbench 178
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,401


    I didn't realise UKIP were doing that well?

    Edit - I know they're not. They seem to have even more of a death wish than, well, every other party at the moment.

    UKIP and Labour slugging it out for second would be almost as funny as watching a Republican trying to explain the latest outburst from Sarah Palin.

    But alas, it will never happen.
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    Alistair said:

    FTPT

    malcolmg said:

    Alistair said:

    Indigo said:

    Even in Scotland the debate is rather dull as independence is no longer a serious possibility now that everything the SNP claimed prior to the referendum has been shown to be wrong.

    Saying that should liven things up for you if that are any Nats within earshot ;)

    Its balanced out by everything Better Together said being shown to be wrong as well.
    Exactly, everything they said would happen if we voted YES has come to pass, must be getting very embarrassing for their sockpuppets in Scotland.
    However given it was muppets like Scottp ,they still whinge on about SNPBAD, unbelievable how stupid they are.
    Genuine question - what are those predictions?


    An Example
    https://twitter.com/scottishlabour/status/499542772203147264

    https://twitter.com/BBCScotlandNews/status/664767623805190145
    I walked past that HMRC sign in Downing Street this afternoon - was after attending the Chinese New Year festivities in Trafalgar Square.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Orgasmic

    I still instinctively start by looking in the middle of the league when I check them in the papers ;)
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763
    Scott_P said:

    SeanT said:

    But, oh dear, she's not happy now. "Cameron was doing so well, now he's lying to us about Europe. He's gone all weak. I don't understand it".

    If he's losing soft centrist voters like my Mum he is in trouble

    Is she going to vote for Corbyn?

    Moving on...
    Last time I looked Cameron wasn't planning to stand again. But he has a referendum coming up,,,,,

    moving on.
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    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    Scott_P said:

    SeanT said:

    But, oh dear, she's not happy now. "Cameron was doing so well, now he's lying to us about Europe. He's gone all weak. I don't understand it".

    If he's losing soft centrist voters like my Mum he is in trouble

    Is she going to vote for Corbyn?

    Moving on...
    Cameron can't use one of his main selling points in the referendum (not being Corbyn, Miliband or Salmond), and its an open goal without any risk of those gents taking the top job.
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    ydoethur said:


    There are relatively few top-up Assembly Members in Wales so even if they lose all the constituencies - which would mean losing Bracon & Radnorshire, probably to the Tories - they might not have enough votes for list places. It's a long shot though.

    I will go further and say it is more likely the Conservatives will lead the next executive than that the Oranges are blanked in Wales. Even if they lose Brecon and Radnor, they would be guaranteed a list seat based on their strength in Ceredigion and Powys.

    Less than 4 would be a shockingly bad result for them if, as expected, Labour slip back substantially outside the valleys. The real issue in Wales is that with two parties of roughly equal strength who hate each other fighting for second, it's very hard to see how Labour could be removed from power, something that is desperately needed for both Wales and Welsh Labour.
    I didn't realise UKIP were doing that well?

    Edit - I know they're not. They seem to have even more of a death wish than, well, every other party at the moment except for Corbynite Labour.
    Slight correction there, David :lol:

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    AndyJS said:

    How long have I been saying that Labour is an idea whose time has gone?

    They're going the same way as the Swedish Social Democrats who've just registered their lowest ever opinion poll rating, 21.1%.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swedish_general_election,_2018#Poll_results
    The Dutch situation is even more stark, with Geert Wilders' Party for Freedom hitting 41-42% six times in opinion polls taken in the last month, taking 20%+ leads, and the Dutch Labour party often in *single* figures:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Next_Dutch_general_election

    But this is what happens when parties refuse to adapt and change, and instead react by barely concealing the fact they hold the bulk of their voters (and their views) in disdain.
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    Evening all.

    Must admit to being mighty surprised to see Labour drop 2% points in the last ComRes VI online poll, when all media attention appeared fixed on the EU negotiations fall-out and Jeremy Corbyn seemed to have a breather from attack. – If he can’t rally the polls during the good times, when can he?

    Alastair might be right, few people give a stuff about the EU, hence the Tory share remaining the same/going up with YouGov and ComRes since the deal was announced.
    LEAVE = The Resistance
    EU = The First Order
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763
    Indigo said:

    Scott_P said:

    SeanT said:

    But, oh dear, she's not happy now. "Cameron was doing so well, now he's lying to us about Europe. He's gone all weak. I don't understand it".

    If he's losing soft centrist voters like my Mum he is in trouble

    Is she going to vote for Corbyn?

    Moving on...
    Cameron can't use one of his main selling points in the referendum (not being Corbyn, Miliband or Salmond), and its an open goal without any risk of those gents taking the top job.
    a double open goal since they;ll ask us to vote again if we get the "wrong" answer.
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    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/eureferendum/12156106/The-quiet-rebellion-of-Conservative-England.html
    Among the early daffodils and neatly trimmed hedges of the Tory heartlands, grassroots party members are growing angry at David Cameron over Europe
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,584
    edited February 2016

    Scott_P said:

    SeanT said:

    But, oh dear, she's not happy now. "Cameron was doing so well, now he's lying to us about Europe. He's gone all weak. I don't understand it".

    If he's losing soft centrist voters like my Mum he is in trouble

    Is she going to vote for Corbyn?

    Moving on...
    Last time I looked Cameron wasn't planning to stand again. But he has a referendum coming up,,,,,

    moving on.
    During the EURef, Ozzybordias, King of Kings, will be warning about the economic dangers of Brexit, as we saw last May, the country trusts him on the economy, that's why the Tories won a majority.
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763

    Scott_P said:

    SeanT said:

    But, oh dear, she's not happy now. "Cameron was doing so well, now he's lying to us about Europe. He's gone all weak. I don't understand it".

    If he's losing soft centrist voters like my Mum he is in trouble

    Is she going to vote for Corbyn?

    Moving on...
    Last time I looked Cameron wasn't planning to stand again. But he has a referendum coming up,,,,,

    moving on.
    During the EURef, Ozzybordias, King of Kings, will be warning about the economic dangers of Brexit, as we saw last May, the country trusts him on the economy, that's why the Tories won a majority.
    tsk, the quality of click bait has really gone down on this site.

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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    It was 80 years ago this week that the two million acre constituency of Ross and Cromarty in the Scottish Highlands was the scene of one of the most farcical by-elections of the 20th Century.

    The National Government had just won the general election, and Malcolm MacDonald, son of former Prime Minister Ramsay, had lost his seat - but not his place in the cabinet - so he needed to get back to the Commons as quickly as possible...
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35543194
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    Scott_P said:

    SeanT said:

    But, oh dear, she's not happy now. "Cameron was doing so well, now he's lying to us about Europe. He's gone all weak. I don't understand it".

    If he's losing soft centrist voters like my Mum he is in trouble

    Is she going to vote for Corbyn?

    Moving on...
    Last time I looked Cameron wasn't planning to stand again. But he has a referendum coming up,,,,,

    moving on.
    During the EURef, Ozzybordias, King of Kings, will be warning about the economic dangers of Brexit, as we saw last May, the country trusts him on the economy, that's why the Tories won a majority.
    tsk, the quality of click bait has really gone down on this site.

    Wait until you see my thread next week, is especially for you.
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,974
    ydoethur said:

    RoyalBlue said:

    Is the real battle in Wales not for third place? The Tories seem to have pulled clear of Plaid in recent polling and at the General Election.

    More likely fourth between UKIP and the LDs.

    Whatever Farage says, however, it will be a very great surprise if UKIP get more than one seat (a list seat in Monmouthshire being the likeliest path).

    The outcome will therefore almost certainly be a Labour/Plaid coalition. The question might be whether Leanne Wood might try and either take the first ministership herself or find a reasonably moderate figure from one party or the other to head it. She wouldn't find that easy, but I wouldn't put it past her to try.
    Current polling suggests UKIP will win 13-17% of the List vote in Wales. If so, they'll win a whole chunk of List seats.
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Evening all.

    Must admit to being mighty surprised to see Labour drop 2% points in the last ComRes VI online poll, when all media attention appeared fixed on the EU negotiations fall-out and Jeremy Corbyn seemed to have a breather from attack. – If he can’t rally the polls during the good times, when can he?

    Alastair might be right, few people give a stuff about the EU, hence the Tory share remaining the same/going up with YouGov and ComRes since the deal was announced.
    Then what explains Cameron's decline? After all most of the Kippers/committed-Outers already (presumably) had unfavourable views of him. Hence the movement must have been previously positive responders rating him more negatively.

    Tories up, based on unpalatableness of alternative
    Cameron down, possibly hinting at a a shift in the balance of the Tories

    They are actually measuring two different things - and you can't draw any conclusions on salience of the EU as a result
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    SeanT said:

    AndyJS said:

    How long have I been saying that Labour is an idea whose time has gone?

    They're going the same way as the Swedish Social Democrats who've just registered their lowest ever opinion poll rating, 21.1%.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swedish_general_election,_2018#Poll_results
    The Dutch situation is even more stark, with Geert Wilders' Party for Freedom hitting 41-42% six times in opinion polls taken in the last month, taking 20%+ leads, and the Dutch Labour party often in *single* figures:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Next_Dutch_general_election

    But this is what happens when parties refuse to adapt and change, and instead react by barely concealing the fact they hold the bulk of their voters (and their views) in disdain.
    Good god. I hadn't seen that Dutch polling. Wilders on 41%????
    He's not.

    That's 41 seats out of 150.
This discussion has been closed.