Today was a total eff up for Labour.. several song sheets and several versions of a key policy..yet the PB lefties on here think it is all ok cos its fair..what a bunch of tossers the Labour party is
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Interesting insight into mind set - basically fascist.
So wanting elections is fascist now. Guess that's why Hitler abolished elections after he got into power - same motivation and behaviour from the British Nationalists now.
Dair, so presumably you'd be ok with the Unionists holding referendum after referendum to rejoin the Union once/if independence is achieved? Or is the right to election upon election exist only until the 'right' answer is obtained?
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Or to have no public desire for a referendum?
Opinions and desire goes up and down. So it might be delayed, maybe significantly if support falls. But that doesn't stop support going back up.
The only way to permanently stop further Referendum is a Yes vote.
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Or to have no public desire for a referendum?
Opinions and desire goes up and down. So it might be delayed, maybe significantly if support falls. But that doesn't stop support going back up.
The only way to permanently stop further Referendum is a Yes vote.
Then there'll be endless referendums about rejoining the Union, I suppose?
London Harrow East 5.5 S East Hove 5.0 N West Morecambe 4.0 N East Stockton Sth 3.0 Y+H Pudsey 2.0 N West Blackpool N 0.5 S West Gloucester 0.5 E Mids Loughborough -0.5 W Mids Kingswood -2.0
Kingswood is near Bristol so S West
Judging by these polls it'd take an absolute miracle for Lab to gain Bristol NW.
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Interesting insight into mind set - basically fascist.
So wanting elections is fascist now. Guess that's why Hitler abolished elections after he got into power - same motivation and behaviour from the British Nationalists now.
Dair, so presumably you'd be ok with the Unionists holding referendum after referendum to rejoin the Union once/if independence is achieved? Or is the right to election upon election exist only until the 'right' answer is obtained?
If they can get a plurality in the parliament they are perfectly free to do so.
For some reason there don't appear to be many examples of that.
So I've just seen the Greens PEB. That was fantastic. I almost think they shouldn't have wasted seconds with an intro to it, too many people might switch off before they get to the fun part.
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Or to have no public desire for a referendum?
The only way to permanently stop further Referendum is a Yes vote.
Brilliant, you have no idea why that's hilarious do you.
Just an observation from looking at Lord Ashcroft's numbers...
In the 4 seats where Labour is doing best (Hove, Harrow, Morecambe, Stockton) the Labour VI is buttressed to a great extent by people that didn't vote for one of the big 3 in 2010.
In other words the Labour VI may or may not be artificially inflated by people who say they will vote Labour but won't bother come 7 May.
Personally I don't think these polls make a big enough adjustment for certainty to vote, especially considering the self-styled certainty appears to be very close to general election levels. But we will see on voting day.
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Interesting insight into mind set - basically fascist.
So wanting elections is fascist now. Guess that's why Hitler abolished elections after he got into power - same motivation and behaviour from the British Nationalists now.
Wanting elections is fine - but insisting on one result is not. Hitler never won an election of course........next step for nats?
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Or to have no public desire for a referendum?
The only way to permanently stop further Referendum is a Yes vote.
Brilliant, you have no idea why that's hilarious do you.
Because you think its hypocritical and don't like logical thought.
All I see is a stark logic. I can think of only one example in history of a sovereign state Freely and Fairly electing a majority for incorporation into another state (Texas and by plularity at their assembly not by referendum). Couple other examples of vote rigging and manipulation such as the Anshluss.
But the vast majority of nations do not vote to stop being nations. It simply isn't a likely outcome, it is so rare that it is perfectly logical to expect that a Yes vote would be the final Referendum on Scotland's status with regards to the rest of the UK.
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Interesting insight into mind set - basically fascist.
So wanting elections is fascist now. Guess that's why Hitler abolished elections after he got into power - same motivation and behaviour from the British Nationalists now.
Dair, so presumably you'd be ok with the Unionists holding referendum after referendum to rejoin the Union once/if independence is achieved? Or is the right to election upon election exist only until the 'right' answer is obtained?
If they can get a plurality in the parliament they are perfectly free to do so.
For some reason there don't appear to be many examples of that.
Someone has informed you that No won the referendum, right?
Democratically people want Nationalists to run the provincial government. Democratically they also want to be part of a greater Union.
I call this a people with a great sense of humour, and quite a bit of taste too: we want the noisy people to be noisy in a small talking shop in Edinburgh, but we don't want them to have anything to do with the wider economy into which we're plugged, and would like to remain plugged.
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Or to have no public desire for a referendum?
The only way to permanently stop further Referendum is a Yes vote.
Brilliant, you have no idea why that's hilarious do you.
Because you think its hypocritical and don't like logical thought.
All I see is a stark logic. I can think of only one example in history of a sovereign state Freely and Fairly electing a majority for incorporation into another state (Texas and by plularity at their assembly not by referendum). Couple other examples of vote rigging and manipulation such as the Anshluss.
But the vast majority of nations do not vote to stop being nations. It simply isn't a likely outcome, it is so rare that it is perfectly logical to expect that a Yes vote would be the final Referendum on Scotland's status with regards to the rest of the UK.
Just an observation from looking at Lord Ashcroft's numbers...
In the 4 seats where Labour is doing best (Hove, Harrow, Morecambe, Stockton) the Labour VI is buttressed to a great extent by people that didn't vote for one of the big 3 in 2010.
In other words the Labour VI may or may not be artificially inflated by people who say they will vote Labour but won't bother come 7 May.
Personally I don't think these polls make a big enough adjustment for certainty to vote, especially considering the self-styled certainty appears to be very close to general election levels. But we will see on voting day.
While true, the question is whether the rate is credible. Everyone is a first-time voter some time, and people vote for sixty to seventy years of their lives, so something like one-twelfth would seem to be the steady state first-time GE voter rate.
OT Epicure query here. Haven't eaten tongue in 40ys - I liked it until I realised what it was. Anyone eaten it recently? Never tried black pudding ever and what is chorizo?
I'm not a fan of cured meats bar ham. But have ordered some German garlic sausage as I dimly recall rather liking that too during my tongue phase. Any suggestions? I definitely don't like dried ham in any guise.
1) Labour don't lack popular policies. They lack credibility that they could competently implement them. Introducing a policy that Ed Balls months ago said was a money-loser doesn't help with that.
2) The Conservatives don't need fiscal credibility. They need to show they can relate to the concerns of ordinary folk. They didn't.
Double fail. Both sides have motivated the other's core vote.
OT Epicure query here. Haven't eaten tongue in 40ys - I liked it until I realised what it was. Anyone eaten it recently? Never tried black pudding ever and what is chorizo?
I'm not a fan of cured meats bar ham. But have ordered some German garlic sausage as I dimly recall rather liking that too during my tongue phase. Any suggestions? I definitely don't like dried ham in any guise.
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Interesting insight into mind set - basically fascist.
So wanting elections is fascist now. Guess that's why Hitler abolished elections after he got into power - same motivation and behaviour from the British Nationalists now.
Voting for Hitler was the only way to stop further elections. Voting "yes" is the only way to stop further referendums. Resistance is futile. Exterminate.... Exterminate....
1) Labour don't lack popular policies. They lack credibility that they could competently implement them. Introducing a policy that Ed Balls months ago said was a money-loser doesn't help with that.
2) The Conservatives don't need fiscal credibility. They need to show they can relate to the concerns of ordinary folk. They didn't.
Double fail. Both sides have motivated the other's core vote.
I have no idea what the Tories are up to...Today their policy was kids to resit their SATs if they fail. That is going to change the square root of f##k all votes. Teacher / teacher unions hate SATs already, so they aren't going to be won back and parents are they really going to say, wow I must vote Tory now, of course not.
The blob was out in force though on the radio. The union rep was castigating Tony Livesey for using the word fail, kids aren't allowed to be said to fail, it is a negative word, we don't like negative words, it reinforces negativity and can set kids up for a life of failure.
Yeah but what if they leave primary school being unable to read and write asks Tony...they haven't failed if they fail their SATs, that isn't what it means, and we don't fail kids, yadda yadda yadda yadda.
1) Labour don't lack popular policies. They lack credibility that they could competently implement them. Introducing a policy that Ed Balls months ago said was a money-loser doesn't help with that.
2) The Conservatives don't need fiscal credibility. They need to show they can relate to the concerns of ordinary folk. They didn't.
Double fail. Both sides have motivated the other's core vote.
Possibly accurate, but the Labour line right now is "the Tories have spent the whole day defending non-doms" which is not true
The Tories have actually spent the whole day pointing out that Labour don't know their Ed's Arse for their Ed's Elbow
Labour are saying the Tories have spent all day on point 2, when in fact they have actually spent all day on point 1, ably helped by Ed Balls (and the rest of the Labour treasury team), and that is what was leading the news for most of the day
Today was a total eff up for Labour.. several song sheets and several versions of a key policy..yet the PB lefties on here think it is all ok cos its fair..what a bunch of tossers the Labour party is
It was genuinely interesting as it plays well to both galleries. Labour: "it's not fair, and look, the Tories are on the side of the (foreign) rich", Tories: "that's not living in the real world, there's a serious danger it'll cost us all money, and Labour can't add up for toffee".
In my view a bit like gun control in the US - I wouldn't start from here given the choice, but as we can hardly tap on Pitt the Younger's shoulder in 1799 and tell him this thing he's introducing is going to cause a few issues in a couple of centuries, I think we need to reform it in a staged fashion so as not to send millions of quid fleeing for Geneva or the Cayman Islands but (very) slowly correct something that's a bit anomalous to say the least.
Presentationally, it was a dog's dinner. You can't have Ed contradicting pretty much what the other Ed said only three months ago. Forget the nuance of the exact wording - it looked like arse and elbow from two guys possibly running the country in four weeks. However, I suspect it'll just shore up core voters either way in its own tiny way.
It certainly adds to my concerns about Ed's inherent instincts in that he's got a long list of perfectly reasonable problems identified (high housing costs, high energy costs, (exploitative) ZHC, non doms, 50% tax to name some), where his solutions appear to run straight into the law of unintended consequences. It's almost like "never mind if the policy will work in practice, does it sound right in theory". If it gets him in power he might not care (fair enough that's an election), but I genuinely fear it may get sticky from there.
OT Epicure query here. Haven't eaten tongue in 40ys - I liked it until I realised what it was. Anyone eaten it recently? Never tried black pudding ever and what is chorizo?
I'm not a fan of cured meats bar ham. But have ordered some German garlic sausage as I dimly recall rather liking that too during my tongue phase. Any suggestions? I definitely don't like dried ham in any guise.
Chorizo is a spicy, greasy sausage. Black pudding is crumbly, and doesn't taste like sausage at all.
Someone has informed you that No won the referendum, right?
Democratically people want Nationalists to run the provincial government. Democratically they also want to be part of a greater Union.
People chose the SNP to run the Holyrood parliaments. It is not a "province", it is a national government.
They choose in May 2011. They will choose and may choose differently in May 2016.
People voted No in a referendum.
They made this choice in September 2014. It would see only correct and reasonable to vote again before September 2019 at the latest if parties supporting this are elected to government.
Quorn - urgh. Isn't that like tofu? All bean curd or soya masquerading as meat?
Being a child of the 70s I had enough exposure to pretend meat and chocolate flavoured coatings. Yuck.
AFAIC, being a veggie means liking vegetables not eating faux bacon et al.
I'm very fond of vegetables - I can easily double the 5 A Day notion, but they're no match for a nice bit of beef, lamb, venison, duck or chicken. Never that keen on pork myself except as bacon.
OT Epicure query here. Haven't eaten tongue in 40ys - I liked it until I realised what it was. Anyone eaten it recently? Never tried black pudding ever and what is chorizo?
I'm not a fan of cured meats bar ham. But have ordered some German garlic sausage as I dimly recall rather liking that too during my tongue phase. Any suggestions? I definitely don't like dried ham in any guise.
Today was a total eff up for Labour.. several song sheets and several versions of a key policy..yet the PB lefties on here think it is all ok cos its fair..what a bunch of tossers the Labour party is
Can you imagine if there was a big policy announcement from the Tories today which warranted a thread on here with talk from our OGH of a game changer only for an interview of Osborne to appear from three months ago with the bbc with him saying that the policy will not work. What would the reaction on here be. I have no doubt a new thread would appear with claims of Tories in chaos/ crisis etc.
1) Labour don't lack popular policies. They lack credibility that they could competently implement them. Introducing a policy that Ed Balls months ago said was a money-loser doesn't help with that.
2) The Conservatives don't need fiscal credibility. They need to show they can relate to the concerns of ordinary folk. They didn't.
Double fail. Both sides have motivated the other's core vote.
I have no idea what the Tories are up to...Today their policy was kids to resit their SATs if you fail. That is going to change the square root of f##k all votes. Teacher / teacher unions hate SATs already, so they aren't going to be won back and parents are they really going to say, wow I must vote Tory now, of course not.
The blob was out in force though on the radio. The union rep was castigating Tony Livesey for using the word fail, kids aren't allowed to be said to fail, it is a negative word, we don't like negative words, it reinforces negativity and can set kids up for a life of failure.
Yeah but what if they leave primary school being unable to read and write asks Tony...they haven't failed if they fail their SATs, that isn't what it means, and we don't fail kids, yadda yadda yadda yadda.
It's a bloody stupid idea. SATs are to test schools, not pupils.
1) Labour don't lack popular policies. They lack credibility that they could competently implement them. Introducing a policy that Ed Balls months ago said was a money-loser doesn't help with that.
2) The Conservatives don't need fiscal credibility. They need to show they can relate to the concerns of ordinary folk. They didn't.
Double fail. Both sides have motivated the other's core vote.
I have no idea what the Tories are up to...Today their policy was kids to resit their SATs if you fail. That is going to change the square root of f##k all votes. Teacher / teacher unions hate SATs already, so they aren't going to be won back and parents are they really going to say, wow I must vote Tory now, of course not.
The blob was out in force though on the radio. The union rep was castigating Tony Livesey for using the word fail, kids aren't allowed to be said to fail, it is a negative word, we don't like negative words, it reinforces negativity and can set kids up for a life of failure.
Yeah but what if they leave primary school being unable to read and write asks Tony...they haven't failed if they fail their SATs, that isn't what it means, and we don't fail kids, yadda yadda yadda yadda.
It's a bloody stupid idea. SATs are to test schools, not pupils.
I would agree and of course the blob wants to mark their own homework.
OT Epicure query here. Haven't eaten tongue in 40ys - I liked it until I realised what it was. Anyone eaten it recently? Never tried black pudding ever and what is chorizo?
I'm not a fan of cured meats bar ham. But have ordered some German garlic sausage as I dimly recall rather liking that too during my tongue phase. Any suggestions? I definitely don't like dried ham in any guise.
Chorizo is a spicy, greasy sausage. Black pudding is crumbly, and doesn't taste like sausage at all.
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Interesting insight into mind set - basically fascist.
So wanting elections is fascist now. Guess that's why Hitler abolished elections after he got into power - same motivation and behaviour from the British Nationalists now.
Voting for Hitler was the only way to stop further elections. Voting "yes" is the only way to stop further referendums. Resistance is futile. Exterminate.... Exterminate....
Thought you miss miss the analogy, better explain.
Hitler, arguing that further elections were "divisive" and caused "instability" and "prevented a focus on government" prevented elections people (at varying points and to varying degrees) wanted.
The same arguments are used now by British Nationalists to try and prevent the demand for another Referendum in Scotland. Fortunately, it will be an unsuccessful attempt to stifle democracy.
No-one intends to prevent Unionists from arguing for and trying to get support for a new Union Treaty after the current one is Dissolved and the UK is terminated. It is just so unlikely that they would get support for such a line as to be risible.
Terrible day for Labour with this Non Dom fiasco. Balls's indiscretion has totally torpedoed what should have been Miliband's golden moment. I feared for Labour last night when I glimpsed a couple of talking heads on the box opining that Ed had been 'canny' and 'played a blinder'. It rarely ends well when such claims are made.
Ah yes how did the NATS get on when Gordon Wilson was leader 2 seats in 1983 and then 3 seats in 1987 when he lost his own! Luckily one of the three was in Banff and Buchan where a certain A Salmond then took the SNP from nothing to opposition in a Scottish Parliament then to minority Government, then to majority Government and then to within touching distance of victory in an independence referendum starting at around 30 per cent in 2011 and finishing at 45 per cent in 2014.
I can't be sure about this but my understanding is that Gordon Wilson wanted the NATS to campaign AGAINST the Parliament in 1997 - clearly a master of strategy!
1) Labour don't lack popular policies. They lack credibility that they could competently implement them. Introducing a policy that Ed Balls months ago said was a money-loser doesn't help with that.
2) The Conservatives don't need fiscal credibility. They need to show they can relate to the concerns of ordinary folk. They didn't.
Double fail. Both sides have motivated the other's core vote.
I have no idea what the Tories are up to...Today their policy was kids to resit their SATs if they fail. That is going to change the square root of f##k all votes. Teacher / teacher unions hate SATs already, so they aren't going to be won back and parents are they really going to say, wow I must vote Tory now, of course not.
The blob was out in force though on the radio. The union rep was castigating Tony Livesey for using the word fail, kids aren't allowed to be said to fail, it is a negative word, we don't like negative words, it reinforces negativity and can set kids up for a life of failure.
Yeah but what if they leave primary school being unable to read and write asks Tony...they haven't failed if they fail their SATs, that isn't what it means, and we don't fail kids, yadda yadda yadda yadda.
Yes agreed, Cons seem invisible in making any chunky announcements. Ditto the Lib Dems, it all feels "SNP and Labour" in the news. Ok Labour don't help the cause when one Ed's playing football and the other one thinks it's rugby but at least they're on the pitch in fairness, even if they have no idea if they're trying to kick it under or over the bar.
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Interesting insight into mind set - basically fascist.
So wanting elections is fascist now. Guess that's why Hitler abolished elections after he got into power - same motivation and behaviour from the British Nationalists now.
Voting for Hitler was the only way to stop further elections. Voting "yes" is the only way to stop further referendums. Resistance is futile. Exterminate.... Exterminate....
Thought you miss miss the analogy, better explain.
Hitler, arguing that further elections were "divisive" and caused "instability" and "prevented a focus on government" prevented elections people (at varying points and to varying degrees) wanted.
The same arguments are used now by British Nationalists to try and prevent the demand for another Referendum in Scotland. Fortunately, it will be an unsuccessful attempt to stifle democracy.
No-one intends to prevent Unionists from arguing for and trying to get support for a new Union Treaty after the current one is Dissolved and the UK is terminated. It is just so unlikely that they would get support for such a line as to be risible.
Thought I'd jump in here, but nothing to do with Hitler.
The reason that the rest of Britain can say No to another referendum, is that having lots is destabilising to the whole country. Will she, won't she? Again and again.
It's fine to have the IndyRef, but after a No vote, there needs to be a reasonable pause; once a generation for something like this. It's not just about what the SNP want - the rest of us are impacted too.
That doesn't make it seem more appetising. I love mushrooms of all varieties, but fungi masquerading as something else or shaped into cubes et al just looks so synthetic.
I never recovered from Cadbury selling tins of soya beef mince in a gloopy gravy as a kid. I know this was 1975 but just urgh.
Dair If the SNP call a vote now and lose it, even if they get 49%, it will be dead as an issue, as in Quebec, which is why Gordon Wilson, former SNP leader, today said another referendum must not be held until Yes was certain of victory
It doesn't matter how badly you want something to be true, there is nothing you can do to stop Refendum after Referendum after Referendum.
The only way to stop any further Referendum is to vote Yes.
Interesting insight into mind set - basically fascist.
So wanting elections is fascist now. Guess that's why Hitler abolished elections after he got into power - same motivation and behaviour from the British Nationalists now.
Voting for Hitler was the only way to stop further elections. Voting "yes" is the only way to stop further referendums. Resistance is futile. Exterminate.... Exterminate....
Thought you miss miss the analogy, better explain.
Hitler, arguing that further elections were "divisive" and caused "instability" and "prevented a focus on government" prevented elections people (at varying points and to varying degrees) wanted.
The same arguments are used now by British Nationalists to try and prevent the demand for another Referendum in Scotland. Fortunately, it will be an unsuccessful attempt to stifle democracy.
No-one intends to prevent Unionists from arguing for and trying to get support for a new Union Treaty after the current one is Dissolved and the UK is terminated. It is just so unlikely that they would get support for such a line as to be risible.
Thought I'd jump in here, but nothing to do with Hitler.
The reason that the rest of Britain can say No to another referendum, is that having lots is destabilising to the whole country. Will she, won't she? Again and again.
It's fine to have the IndyRef, but after a No vote, there needs to be a reasonable pause; once a generation for something like this. It's not just about what the SNP want - the rest of us are impacted too.
Nats couldn't care less about the rest of us. The clue's in the name. Selfish ideology.
OT Epicure query here. Haven't eaten tongue in 40ys - I liked it until I realised what it was. Anyone eaten it recently? Never tried black pudding ever and what is chorizo?
I'm not a fan of cured meats bar ham. But have ordered some German garlic sausage as I dimly recall rather liking that too during my tongue phase. Any suggestions? I definitely don't like dried ham in any guise.
Chorizo is a spicy, greasy sausage. Black pudding is crumbly, and doesn't taste like sausage at all.
The white bits are pork fat. If you fry it in slices these melt, making the pudding moist and tasty.
It is a strong rich flavour, excellent as part of a cooked breakfast, rather like a stronger version of Haggis and also best as an accompaniment rather than a main dish.
For vegetarians I would strongly recommend Linda McCartneys products. Much tastier than any other vege burgers and sausages. She may have contributed to the worlds best band breaking up, but she knows how to cook!
Thought I'd jump in here, but nothing to do with Hitler.
The reason that the rest of Britain can say No to another referendum, is that having lots is destabilising to the whole country. Will she, won't she? Again and again.
It's fine to have the IndyRef, but after a No vote, there needs to be a reasonable pause; once a generation for something like this. It's not just about what the SNP want - the rest of us are impacted too.
Which is where the wonderful unwritten constitution of the United Kingdom comes into play. A precedent once established in UK Constitutional Law is very hard to break. It has now been established that a plurality of representation in a devolved assembly can demand and be given a legally binding Referendum.
The only way for Westminster to now change this would be to bring forward Primary legislation to effectively outlaw this. That would have pretty severe consequences for the authority of Westminster over the devolved assemblies.
Comments
The only way to permanently stop further Referendum is a Yes vote.
Live Tweeting here:
https://twitter.com/helenpidd
https://twitter.com/helenpidd/status/585871658524680193
For some reason there don't appear to be many examples of that.
In the 4 seats where Labour is doing best (Hove, Harrow, Morecambe, Stockton) the Labour VI is buttressed to a great extent by people that didn't vote for one of the big 3 in 2010.
In other words the Labour VI may or may not be artificially inflated by people who say they will vote Labour but won't bother come 7 May.
Personally I don't think these polls make a big enough adjustment for certainty to vote, especially considering the self-styled certainty appears to be very close to general election levels. But we will see on voting day.
All I see is a stark logic. I can think of only one example in history of a sovereign state Freely and Fairly electing a majority for incorporation into another state (Texas and by plularity at their assembly not by referendum). Couple other examples of vote rigging and manipulation such as the Anshluss.
But the vast majority of nations do not vote to stop being nations. It simply isn't a likely outcome, it is so rare that it is perfectly logical to expect that a Yes vote would be the final Referendum on Scotland's status with regards to the rest of the UK.
Democratically people want Nationalists to run the provincial government. Democratically they also want to be part of a greater Union.
I call this a people with a great sense of humour, and quite a bit of taste too: we want the noisy people to be noisy in a small talking shop in Edinburgh, but we don't want them to have anything to do with the wider economy into which we're plugged, and would like to remain plugged.
I'm not a fan of cured meats bar ham. But have ordered some German garlic sausage as I dimly recall rather liking that too during my tongue phase. Any suggestions? I definitely don't like dried ham in any guise.
1) Labour don't lack popular policies. They lack credibility that they could competently implement them. Introducing a policy that Ed Balls months ago said was a money-loser doesn't help with that.
2) The Conservatives don't need fiscal credibility. They need to show they can relate to the concerns of ordinary folk. They didn't.
Double fail. Both sides have motivated the other's core vote.
Quorn?
The blob was out in force though on the radio. The union rep was castigating Tony Livesey for using the word fail, kids aren't allowed to be said to fail, it is a negative word, we don't like negative words, it reinforces negativity and can set kids up for a life of failure.
Yeah but what if they leave primary school being unable to read and write asks Tony...they haven't failed if they fail their SATs, that isn't what it means, and we don't fail kids, yadda yadda yadda yadda.
The Tories have actually spent the whole day pointing out that Labour don't know their Ed's Arse for their Ed's Elbow
Labour are saying the Tories have spent all day on point 2, when in fact they have actually spent all day on point 1, ably helped by Ed Balls (and the rest of the Labour treasury team), and that is what was leading the news for most of the day
In my view a bit like gun control in the US - I wouldn't start from here given the choice, but as we can hardly tap on Pitt the Younger's shoulder in 1799 and tell him this thing he's introducing is going to cause a few issues in a couple of centuries, I think we need to reform it in a staged fashion so as not to send millions of quid fleeing for Geneva or the Cayman Islands but (very) slowly correct something that's a bit anomalous to say the least.
Presentationally, it was a dog's dinner. You can't have Ed contradicting pretty much what the other Ed said only three months ago. Forget the nuance of the exact wording - it looked like arse and elbow from two guys possibly running the country in four weeks. However, I suspect it'll just shore up core voters either way in its own tiny way.
It certainly adds to my concerns about Ed's inherent instincts in that he's got a long list of perfectly reasonable problems identified (high housing costs, high energy costs, (exploitative) ZHC, non doms, 50% tax to name some), where his solutions appear to run straight into the law of unintended consequences. It's almost like "never mind if the policy will work in practice, does it sound right in theory". If it gets him in power he might not care (fair enough that's an election), but I genuinely fear it may get sticky from there.
They choose in May 2011. They will choose and may choose differently in May 2016.
People voted No in a referendum.
They made this choice in September 2014. It would see only correct and reasonable to vote again before September 2019 at the latest if parties supporting this are elected to government.
Being a child of the 70s I had enough exposure to pretend meat and chocolate flavoured coatings. Yuck.
AFAIC, being a veggie means liking vegetables not eating faux bacon et al.
I'm very fond of vegetables - I can easily double the 5 A Day notion, but they're no match for a nice bit of beef, lamb, venison, duck or chicken. Never that keen on pork myself except as bacon.
You have identified the problem, Ed M believes that theory works in practice. He's wrong.
Hitler, arguing that further elections were "divisive" and caused "instability" and "prevented a focus on government" prevented elections people (at varying points and to varying degrees) wanted.
The same arguments are used now by British Nationalists to try and prevent the demand for another Referendum in Scotland. Fortunately, it will be an unsuccessful attempt to stifle democracy.
No-one intends to prevent Unionists from arguing for and trying to get support for a new Union Treaty after the current one is Dissolved and the UK is terminated. It is just so unlikely that they would get support for such a line as to be risible.
Ah yes how did the NATS get on when Gordon Wilson was leader 2 seats in 1983 and then 3 seats in 1987 when he lost his own! Luckily one of the three was in Banff and Buchan where a certain A Salmond then took the SNP from nothing to opposition in a Scottish Parliament then to minority Government, then to majority Government and then to within touching distance of victory in an independence referendum starting at around 30 per cent in 2011 and finishing at 45 per cent in 2014.
I can't be sure about this but my understanding is that Gordon Wilson wanted the NATS to campaign AGAINST the Parliament in 1997 - clearly a master of strategy!
Thought I'd jump in here, but nothing to do with Hitler.
The reason that the rest of Britain can say No to another referendum, is that having lots is destabilising to the whole country. Will she, won't she? Again and again.
It's fine to have the IndyRef, but after a No vote, there needs to be a reasonable pause; once a generation for something like this. It's not just about what the SNP want - the rest of us are impacted too.
I never recovered from Cadbury selling tins of soya beef mince in a gloopy gravy as a kid. I know this was 1975 but just urgh.
new thread
Selfish ideology.
It is a strong rich flavour, excellent as part of a cooked breakfast, rather like a stronger version of Haggis and also best as an accompaniment rather than a main dish.
For vegetarians I would strongly recommend Linda McCartneys products. Much tastier than any other vege burgers and sausages. She may have contributed to the worlds best band breaking up, but she knows how to cook!
The only way for Westminster to now change this would be to bring forward Primary legislation to effectively outlaw this. That would have pretty severe consequences for the authority of Westminster over the devolved assemblies.