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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The official campaign Day 1: The line-up for Thursday night

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  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207

    Lord A

    Con 36 (+3) Lab 34 (+1) LD 6 (-2) UKIP 10 (-2) Greens 7 (+2)

    Can we all have a "hell yeah".....
    Remind me who had the 35% strategy?

    Hell yeah!
  • PurseybearPurseybear Posts: 766
    V low for Ukip and LD's
  • So the Tories up 3 with Lord A, Populus and ComRes since the interviews.

    Dave is such a bloody asset to the Tory party.
  • weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    No doubt the BBC, Sky and Channel 4 are all prepared to analyse the Good Lord's latest offering in depth.
  • Ashcroft National Poll, 27-29 March: CON 36%, LAB 34%, LDEM 6%, UKIP 10%, GRN 7%. Full details on @ConHome, 4pm.

    National = UK? Means Labour probably ahead in England. Means EICIPM?
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    It's a good job Ed did so well in the 'debate' otherwise we'd be looking at 6-point Tory leads.
  • weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    edited March 2015
    It looks as if the blue UKIP voters fear ED more than EU. What will the red ones do? (bearing in mind that Ed Miliband is getting more pro-eu by the day.)
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    6% for the Lib Dems?!!!!
  • PurseybearPurseybear Posts: 766
    Lowest ever Ukip share with Ashcroft.
  • The comment on Saturday night's thread are hysterical, they make Sion Simon look like a seer.
  • ItwasriggedItwasrigged Posts: 154

    Scott_P said:

    Is the SNP, Stalinist or not?

    Do you get an Ice Pick if you say yes?

    Note that the motion to prevent internal criticism was accompanied by Eck calling for a state takeover of the national Broadcaster...
    As opposed to privatising it.

    No, I did not see that but it must tell everyone all there is to know about the SNP. It has moved far left and any sane centre right voter must see that.
    I knew there was a reason why I kept my ice picks after giving up Ice Climbing. I'm off to join the SNP 3:)

  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Love Ashcroft's focus groups so much:
    The UKIP house is “a bit Hyacinth Bucket” and has “a wrought iron fence all round it to keep everyone out”. There is a flagpole in the garden and the local hunt is gathering outside. The ageing residents (who “don’t get on with their neighbours because they are a different colour”) are smoking heavily and “talking about how it was in their day”. The timer on the stereo is set to play the national anthem every day at noon.
    http://lordashcroftpolls.com/2015/03/ashcroft-national-poll-con-36-lab-34-lib-dem-6-ukip-10-green-7/#more-11140
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,964
    Mr. Jonnie, bullshit in a PPB? Surely not!

    Mr. Urquhart, no. Hatred, to paraphrase Darth Vader, is powerful. I don't think people who hate Cameron will change their mind. Those who are frustrated may. UKIP's support could decline, but it'll likely still remain high enough to secure a number of seats.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,540

    MikeK said:

    GoodnightVienna ‏@CallingEngland 1m1 minute ago
    What's all this I'm hearing on the radio abt the Cons deliberately throwing Thanet South in order to hand it to Labour & oust Farage? #UKIP

    Well the Conservatives have been plastering the Constituency since the start of the weekend with vote Mackinlay boards so they are not sparing the resources.

    I will try and get an update on how the Conservatives view things so far and post it here.
    If the Conservatives were to throw in the towel in that seat, then Farage would win easily.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Now clear that Sunday's YouGov was a mirage. No Milibounce.

    HOWEVER, at the same time, Ashcroft's focus group does report there's been an improvement in underlying attitudes towards Ed (including a Labour lead over the Tories on "reasonable and sensible", for those who still inexplicably think Labour's platform is extremist left-wing), so that does atleast give him something to build on.
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012

    Lord A

    Con 36 (+3) Lab 34 (+1) LD 6 (-2) UKIP 10 (-2) Greens 7 (+2)

    Can we all have a "hell yeah".....

    On a serious note, I think what is more interesting is that Tories are now starting to hit 35-36%...that is an uptick, I think taking some votes from UKIP. The question is that all, or will a Miliband government scare more of the "I hate f##king Cameron" brigade to switch at the end?
    36 taking a pounding again.

    In see from the Telegraph the LDs seem to be travelling the country in a yellow removal van. Marginally worse than a pink transit I think.

    Meantime in more important news it also seems that leaders will be able to choose the heights of their podiums.
  • PurseybearPurseybear Posts: 766
    Baxtered with SNP on c. 38% thats only 20 shy of an outright tory majority.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    As Adlai Stevenson said, polls should be taken but not inhaled.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    What is this "phase" that is killer to the Tories image then?
  • glwglw Posts: 9,956

    On a serious note, I think what is more interesting is that Tories are now starting to hit 35-36%...that is an uptick, I think taking some votes from UKIP.

    It is starting to look like that is the case, and makes the narrative that was running in the press since Thursday's debate look a bit silly now.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    weejonnie said:

    No doubt the BBC, Sky and Channel 4 are all prepared to analyse the Good Lord's latest offering in depth.

    The BBC have a dedicated poll analysis guy, who was at pains this morning to say that Labour drew level with the Tories 9 months after the election, while the Tories took 9 years after 1997

    He neglected to mention the relative size of the majorities in each case.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Ashcroft focus group on resistance to further austerity:
    But discussion about the prospect of future cuts revealed some confusion about the need for austerity, and particularly the difference between the debt and the deficit: “They have said we need to cut deeper but the national debt has gone up, apparently. So why have their been cuts? I don’t mind cuts if the debt’s not going up, but…” And if things are so good, why are they so bad? “We’re supposed to be out of recession. I don’t understand why we’ve got so much debt. They don’t explain it properly. With the taxes we pay, you think, how much do they want to drain us?”
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,173
    edited March 2015

    Ashcroft National Poll, 27-29 March: CON 36%, LAB 34%, LDEM 6%, UKIP 10%, GRN 7%. Full details on @ConHome, 4pm.

    Another rather unsubtle hint that it may well be a bad idea to take post-debate polls too seriously - be it cleggasm, milibandism or faragisto! :)
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,711
    36% again for the Tories.
  • PurseybearPurseybear Posts: 766
    TSE skewered the YG at the weekend. 5% watched the debates but 20% of YG VI did. So YG on-liners are political activists. Treat with all due caution.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,043
    I see the most noble lord has put out a poll ;)
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,711

    The comment on Saturday night's thread are hysterical, they make Sion Simon look like a seer.

    Yeah, but I was genuinely sh*tting myself. I drank half a bottle of wine and my wife had to console me by suggesting we put on my favourite Liam Neeson film.
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    Shocking poll for Labour. Look at the dependence on 18-24 year olds to bump up their numbers.

    Tories on 40 in England.
  • PurseybearPurseybear Posts: 766
    Still think the tories could've sailed away with this with a more generous budget. But maybe they're right. I've been wrong wrong wrong about Cameron and Osborne for most of two years.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,540
    Patrick said:

    Ashcroft National Poll, 27-29 March: CON 36%, LAB 34%, LDEM 6%, UKIP 10%, GRN 7%. Full details on @ConHome, 4pm.

    National = UK? Means Labour probably ahead in England. Means EICIPM?
    The English vote shares are Con 40%, Lab 34, UKIP 11%.
  • Scott_P said:

    weejonnie said:

    No doubt the BBC, Sky and Channel 4 are all prepared to analyse the Good Lord's latest offering in depth.

    The BBC have a dedicated poll analysis guy, who was at pains this morning to say that Labour drew level with the Tories 9 months after the election, while the Tories took 9 years after 1997

    He neglected to mention the relative size of the majorities in each case.
    That's a lie.

    The Tories moved ahead in Sep 2000.

    Some three years and a bit after Lab were elected.
  • FinancierFinancier Posts: 3,916
    edited March 2015

    Love Ashcroft's focus groups so much:

    The UKIP house is “a bit Hyacinth Bucket” and has “a wrought iron fence all round it to keep everyone out”. There is a flagpole in the garden and the local hunt is gathering outside. The ageing residents (who “don’t get on with their neighbours because they are a different colour”) are smoking heavily and “talking about how it was in their day”. The timer on the stereo is set to play the national anthem every day at noon.
    http://lordashcroftpolls.com/2015/03/ashcroft-national-poll-con-36-lab-34-lib-dem-6-ukip-10-green-7/#more-11140

    The Labour house is in a terrace, with the front door leading straight onto the pavement. High-vis jackets hang in the hallway, and people in the living room are watching their 50-inch plasma TV, and eating cottage pie with chips and beer. “The furniture is nice, but it’s all on HP”.
    The Conservative house has nice thick carpets and “one of those kitchen islands”. There are Hunter wellies in the hall and a “posh dog”, probably a chocolate Labrador. But “you can’t get to the door because there is an intercom at the gates” and once inside “you have to wipe your feet”.
    The Lib Dem house is in a cul-de-sac. There are sandals by the door and solar panels on the roof. This house is also home to a dog (“a mongrel from the rescue centre”) that would be allowed to jump on the sofa. The décor is either plain and beige or “quite odd”, having been chosen by “trendy intellectuals”.

    Must say that the Labour House does not appear to be the same as EdM's - his is more like the Conservative House.
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262

    Mini coup for Labour getting the Hobbit on board..the same Hobbit whose old lady has just gone bankrupt to avoid a 120k tax bill...going well so far.

    I never get why politicians feel they need to have celebrity endorsements, presumably to roll the lack of policy turd in glitter.

    Still doesn't beat Cameron's endorsement by Charlotte Crosby.
    Somehow, I can't see Martin Freeman making a similar offer to Milliband.
    I'd be more impressed at his intervention if he did. :-)
    Perhaps that's an ad Labour have lined up for the campaign.

    'We, the undersigned luvvies offer to...'
    LOL

    looking at how the FT ad has been handled quite a lot of them are in for a surprise.
    'But I was only giving an endorsement, not offering to kneel down before him'
    " Sorry Ed, I was after a bigger part, there;s not much to sink my teeth in to "
    "Ed, this is how you put a piece of meat in your gob, without looking like a bell end"
    " The script for this new ad looks a bit of a mouthful - where's Roger ?"
    Roger's reputation is built not on his scriptwriting abilities, but his skills as a lighting cameraman. Making vacuum cleaners look like glossy fighter planes, that kind of thing.

    For £10K a day, he could easily make a wizened old pork and beef banger, look like an Apollo moon rocket.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Throw in!!!
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    I don't take this poll any more seriously than the YouGov on Saturday night.

    The focus groups are fascinating, however, and hilarious.
  • weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820

    Scott_P said:

    weejonnie said:

    No doubt the BBC, Sky and Channel 4 are all prepared to analyse the Good Lord's latest offering in depth.

    The BBC have a dedicated poll analysis guy, who was at pains this morning to say that Labour drew level with the Tories 9 months after the election, while the Tories took 9 years after 1997

    He neglected to mention the relative size of the majorities in each case.
    That's a lie.

    The Tories moved ahead in Sep 2000.

    Some three years and a bit after Lab were elected.
    Yes - but that was exceptional wasn't it - petrol pump prices and blockade by tanker drivers?
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,173
    edited March 2015
    Patrick said:

    Ashcroft National Poll, 27-29 March: CON 36%, LAB 34%, LDEM 6%, UKIP 10%, GRN 7%. Full details on @ConHome, 4pm.

    National = UK? Means Labour probably ahead in England. Means EICIPM?
    Wrong. Cons 6% ahead in England.
  • IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    FPT:
    MaxPB said:



    More London properties to be snapped up by foreign buyers at premium prices.

    Block the foreigners from buying. Introduce punitive taxes on non-resident owners.
    That would live about 10 seconds in the ECJ, you cant impose rules like that in the single European market, all EU citizens have to be treated the same as locals.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Hypothetically, what do consistent decent (let's say 4-5%) Tory leads later in the campaign do?

    Do they make it "safe" for ex-Tories to vote UKIP again, push a few Scottish seats back to Labour, and motivate reluctant Red Libs to return back to Cleggy?

    Or does a bandwagon effect take over for the Tories coupled with a "well I might as well vote how I think" effect on the left?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,947

    Good afternoon, everyone.

    Does the Freeman ad actually say anything beyond "Aren't Labour nice?"

    Well, it needs an actor to say it.

    Nobody who went through the last 13th years of Labour Govt. would say there was anything "nice" about "there is no money left...."

  • GrandioseGrandiose Posts: 2,323

    Grandiose said:

    @Plato - the idea that FT readers will be concerned that the Labour FT ad will affect their investments is hilarious.

    And, yes, I also believe that, unlike you, most of them will understand the point of the ad.

    If Labour were a private company, they'd be in danger of passing off by implying the parties quoted had endorsed their product rather than just the dangers of leaving the EU. I don't see why it's different here. Not also the advertising regulations. http://uk.practicallaw.com/8-521-4902

    For Labour the cost will be political, if they aren't prepared to defend their actions well.

    There is no danger in passing off when you are directly quoting someone and you are not misrepresenting what they say. There is no implication in the ad that the people concerned support Labour. There are a series of quotes from some very senior business people to the effect that the UK withdrawing from the EU would be a very bad idea. Compare and contrast with the Irvine ad

    http://www.worldtrademarkreview.com/Daily/Detail.aspx?g=ea6d6afe-b78a-440a-bb0d-18cbee9dbfaf



    We can debate the legalities, but really what's lacking is common courtesy. If you're going to use someone to endorse your position as a positive you should at least seek their agreement.
    "There is no implication in the ad that the people concerned support Labour."

    A much litigated point, not unlike defamation cases on implied meanings. If you put "Vote Labour" at the bottom it's clearly open to interpretation. And it's clear from what the business leaders have said today that they felt the implication was there.

    I don't mean to suggest that Labour are going to be sued over this. The point is the idea they are far from doing "anything wrong" is silly.
  • Greens out polling the Lib Dems. Another pollster with UKIP approaching 9%.

    I am Nostradamus
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    Tory lead is 6 without first time voters.
  • PClippPClipp Posts: 2,138
    currystar said:

    I did like martins statement that the Tories have done sod all for the young. Since 2012 we have taken on 13 apprentices all aged 16 or 17 and the government has given us £1500 for each one to help pay for their training . Interesting definition of sod all . I must ask our apprentices to see what they think.

    He was probably remembering that it was Vince Cable who really got the apprenticeship programme up and running.

    Tory governments don´t usually bother.
  • MikeK said:

    You have posted 3 times within 60 seconds. A spam block is now in effect on your account. You must wait at least 120 seconds before attempting to post again.

    This came up in brilliant red. Is this something new?

    EU directive against freedom of kippering
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012



    Meanwhile in France,
    ''French politics went from ding to dong on Sunday. One side, the dingers, was cock-a-hoop. The others, the dongers, swore they would be back next time.
    Both the conservative dingers and Socialist dongers agreed on one thing, though. Thank goodness they had once again kept out those nasty upstarts, the clangers of the National Front.''

    At least the French see that 'ding dong' is better than 'ting tong'.

    That obscure post is reporting the second round of the French local elections, which were interesting, because despite the refusal of the centre-right (Sarkozy) to agree a common front against the National Front, the voters did it anyway. The FN actually lost ground (by 3%) compared with the first round, winning only five councils out of 278 on a slightly higher turnout.

    That appears to suggest a ceiling to the FN vote - they are able to get a quarter of the vote, but the other three quarters are generally hostile enough to vote for traditional rivals in order to keep them out.
    It was obscure enough to be from the BBC to which I apologise for not linking to it.
    However I am grateful to you for repeating what it and I said using quite different words. Such is the richness of the English Language.

  • frpenkridgefrpenkridge Posts: 670
    I've just been canvassed for the first time ever. I was out.
  • antifrank said:

    I don't take this poll any more seriously than the YouGov on Saturday night.

    The focus groups are fascinating, however, and hilarious.

    That's the best bit about Lord A's polling.

    Essentially like YouGov this indicates neck and neck.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,387
    edited March 2015



    I am Nostradamus

    More like Rogerdarmus...

  • weejonnie said:

    Scott_P said:

    weejonnie said:

    No doubt the BBC, Sky and Channel 4 are all prepared to analyse the Good Lord's latest offering in depth.

    The BBC have a dedicated poll analysis guy, who was at pains this morning to say that Labour drew level with the Tories 9 months after the election, while the Tories took 9 years after 1997

    He neglected to mention the relative size of the majorities in each case.
    That's a lie.

    The Tories moved ahead in Sep 2000.

    Some three years and a bit after Lab were elected.
    Yes - but that was exceptional wasn't it - petrol pump prices and blockade by tanker drivers?
    Yup. The People's Fuel Lobby
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    How would you feel if you read this about the pilot of a plane you'd just got on?

    'Andreas Lubitz, who deliberately crashed the Germanwings Airbus into the French Alps, was in therapy for suicidal tendencies before getting his pilot's licence, Germany's state prosecutor has said.'

    http://bit.ly/1HWZ0UL
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    Greens out polling the Lib Dems. Another pollster with UKIP approaching 9%.

    I am Nostradamus

    Not Rogerdamus :D ?
  • Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Plato said:

    With respect, that's wishing well cobblers.

    Labour have screwed up badly with their FT ad. Of course, in general it wouldn't matter a hoot what quotes they take out of context and use without permission - the average voter will not notice, and wouldn't care anyway.

    However, there is one important group who will both notice and care, and that is the type of person who reads the FT. Since presumably this is precisely the group whom Labour were trying to reach, it looks like a very silly, and expensive, own-goal.

    I doubt it. Those who read the FT are sophisticated enough to understand that the ad does not mean the companies concerned are endorsing Labour and that the companies themselves were bound to react. They'll also notice that none has actually disowned the quotes. None of this will come as a surprise to Labour. Instead, it looks to me like Labour is using the FT name itself, as well as the companies concerned, to counter the Tory charge that the party is anti-business among voters as a whole. Whether that will be successful and whether the money could have been better spent elsewhere are, of course, different matters entirely.

    @Plato - the idea that FT readers will be concerned that the Labour FT ad will affect their investments is hilarious.

    And, yes, I also believe that, unlike you, most of them will understand the point of the ad.

    Except for 4 of the 6 that were quoted ....they didn't understand it and are mightily peeded off about it.

    Other than that spot on post. You really do try to defend the indefensible sometimes
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,135

    Lord A

    Con 36 (+3) Lab 34 (+1) LD 6 (-2) UKIP 10 (-2) Greens 7 (+2)

    Hell, no! I mean Yes!
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,947

    Hypothetically, what do consistent decent (let's say 4-5%) Tory leads later in the campaign do?

    Do they make it "safe" for ex-Tories to vote UKIP again, push a few Scottish seats back to Labour, and motivate reluctant Red Libs to return back to Cleggy?

    Or does a bandwagon effect take over for the Tories coupled with a "well I might as well vote how I think" effect on the left?

    It will never, ever, be safe to have even a 0.0000000001% chance of Ed Miliband as Prime Minister.

    The final week of the campaign will involve Tory activists delivering blue nosepegs for polling day....

  • felixfelix Posts: 15,173

    antifrank said:

    I don't take this poll any more seriously than the YouGov on Saturday night.

    The focus groups are fascinating, however, and hilarious.

    That's the best bit about Lord A's polling.

    Essentially like YouGov this indicates neck and neck.
    Hmmmm probably but that's 3 polls in a row today with the Tories up 3% in each.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    isam said:

    How would you feel if you read this about the pilot of a plane you'd just got on?

    'Andreas Lubitz, who deliberately crashed the Germanwings Airbus into the French Alps, was in therapy for suicidal tendencies before getting his pilot's licence, Germany's state prosecutor has said.'

    http://bit.ly/1HWZ0UL

    I would, of course, be heartily glad that his freedom to pursue his chosen career had not been infringed by his mental health issues.
  • The comment on Saturday night's thread are hysterical, they make Sion Simon look like a seer.

    I think that thread should be repeated as an entertaining read - perhaps along with tonight's YouGov as an update?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    SkyBet has moved their UKIP line in from 7.5 to 4.5 now.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Spot on.

    Moses_ said:

    Chuka Umunna: It’s no different from Sky News quoting a business leader.

    Adam Boulton: Except yours says ‘VOTE LABOUR’ at the bottom.

    Hat tip guido

    I love it when campaigns start and the media get rightly arsey with the politicians. Serves them right. None of them are now MPs and they're called to account.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,947
    felix said:

    antifrank said:

    I don't take this poll any more seriously than the YouGov on Saturday night.

    The focus groups are fascinating, however, and hilarious.

    That's the best bit about Lord A's polling.

    Essentially like YouGov this indicates neck and neck.
    Hmmmm probably but that's 3 polls in a row today with the Tories up 3% in each.
    YouGov tonight could be informative....
  • Am I right in reading the Ashcroft poll shows only 1 voter in Scotland admitting the intention of voting LibDem?
  • GrandioseGrandiose Posts: 2,323
    Re the above spreadbet - surely there's a difference between coming second and being the second-most thought winner. One to watch out for.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    edited March 2015

    Scott_P said:

    weejonnie said:

    No doubt the BBC, Sky and Channel 4 are all prepared to analyse the Good Lord's latest offering in depth.

    The BBC have a dedicated poll analysis guy, who was at pains this morning to say that Labour drew level with the Tories 9 months after the election, while the Tories took 9 years after 1997

    He neglected to mention the relative size of the majorities in each case.
    That's a lie.

    The Tories moved ahead in Sep 2000.

    Some three years and a bit after Lab were elected.

    It was a dramatic swing and then a fairly dramatic swing back - a 15 point Average LAbour Lead in the preceding 7 polls, a 3 point Average Con lead over the mid september polls and then back to a 4 point average Labout lead that then stretched out to a 10 point and then 14 point Average Lab lead over the next sets of polls.

    I'm rubbish at remembering stuff was their a significant event then that caused the poll swingage?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,135

    Greens out polling the Lib Dems. Another pollster with UKIP approaching 9%.

    I am Nostradamus

    Greens have been well below the LibDems of late in ELBOW

    https://twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/582186238930731009
  • welshowlwelshowl Posts: 4,464
    Danny565 said:

    Ashcroft focus group on resistance to further austerity:

    But discussion about the prospect of future cuts revealed some confusion about the need for austerity, and particularly the difference between the debt and the deficit: “They have said we need to cut deeper but the national debt has gone up, apparently. So why have their been cuts? I don’t mind cuts if the debt’s not going up, but…” And if things are so good, why are they so bad? “We’re supposed to be out of recession. I don’t understand why we’ve got so much debt. They don’t explain it properly. With the taxes we pay, you think, how much do they want to drain us?”
    God help us all!
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,540
    weejonnie said:

    Scott_P said:

    weejonnie said:

    No doubt the BBC, Sky and Channel 4 are all prepared to analyse the Good Lord's latest offering in depth.

    The BBC have a dedicated poll analysis guy, who was at pains this morning to say that Labour drew level with the Tories 9 months after the election, while the Tories took 9 years after 1997

    He neglected to mention the relative size of the majorities in each case.
    That's a lie.

    The Tories moved ahead in Sep 2000.

    Some three years and a bit after Lab were elected.
    Yes - but that was exceptional wasn't it - petrol pump prices and blockade by tanker drivers?
    It's hard to make a like for like comparison, as polling techniques were different.

    IIRC, the Conservatives occasionally began to post leads in 2003 (fuel strike excepted).
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,387

    felix said:

    antifrank said:

    I don't take this poll any more seriously than the YouGov on Saturday night.

    The focus groups are fascinating, however, and hilarious.

    That's the best bit about Lord A's polling.

    Essentially like YouGov this indicates neck and neck.
    Hmmmm probably but that's 3 polls in a row today with the Tories up 3% in each.
    YouGov tonight could be informative....
    I'm sensing a Con/Lab tie with YouGov but Con may be up 2-3% from Saturday, perhaps 35/35?

  • Alistair said:

    Scott_P said:

    weejonnie said:

    No doubt the BBC, Sky and Channel 4 are all prepared to analyse the Good Lord's latest offering in depth.

    The BBC have a dedicated poll analysis guy, who was at pains this morning to say that Labour drew level with the Tories 9 months after the election, while the Tories took 9 years after 1997

    He neglected to mention the relative size of the majorities in each case.
    That's a lie.

    The Tories moved ahead in Sep 2000.

    Some three years and a bit after Lab were elected.

    It was a dramatic swing and then a fairly dramatic swing back - a 15 point Average LAbour Lead in the preceding 7 polls, a 3 point Average Con lead over the mid september polls and then back to a 4 point average Labout lead that then stretched out to a 10 point and then 14 point Average Lab lead over the next sets of polls.

    I'm rubbish at remembering stuff was their a significant event then that caused the poll swingage?
    The fuel blockade
  • welshowlwelshowl Posts: 4,464
    edited March 2015
    Alistair said:

    Scott_P said:

    weejonnie said:

    No doubt the BBC, Sky and Channel 4 are all prepared to analyse the Good Lord's latest offering in depth.

    The BBC have a dedicated poll analysis guy, who was at pains this morning to say that Labour drew level with the Tories 9 months after the election, while the Tories took 9 years after 1997

    He neglected to mention the relative size of the majorities in each case.
    That's a lie.

    The Tories moved ahead in Sep 2000.

    Some three years and a bit after Lab were elected.

    It was a dramatic swing and then a fairly dramatic swing back - a 15 point Average LAbour Lead in the preceding 7 polls, a 3 point Average Con lead over the mid september polls and then back to a 4 point average Labout lead that then stretched out to a 10 point and then 14 point Average Lab lead over the next sets of polls.

    I'm rubbish at remembering stuff was their a significant event then that caused the poll swingage?
    Petrol tanker drivers' strike.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    isam said:

    How would you feel if you read this about the pilot of a plane you'd just got on?

    'Andreas Lubitz, who deliberately crashed the Germanwings Airbus into the French Alps, was in therapy for suicidal tendencies before getting his pilot's licence, Germany's state prosecutor has said.'

    http://bit.ly/1HWZ0UL

    I would, of course, be heartily glad that his freedom to pursue his chosen career had not been infringed by his mental health issues.
    I hope you're mucking about

    Id be getting off the plane

    It's like a teacher having treatment for wanting to have sex with children
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,043
    I listened to the spectator podcast yesterday and they were going in about the 4% poll lead for labour, as were the rest of the media. Egg on face.
  • Leftie's don't like irony.


    Dan Hodges retweeted
    Steve hawkes‏@steve_hawkes·10 mins10 minutes ago
    Hollywood star Martin Freeman champions Labour's compassion and decency - partner Amanda Abbington tweets "#proud #fucktheTories ..."
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Alistair said:

    Scott_P said:

    weejonnie said:

    No doubt the BBC, Sky and Channel 4 are all prepared to analyse the Good Lord's latest offering in depth.

    The BBC have a dedicated poll analysis guy, who was at pains this morning to say that Labour drew level with the Tories 9 months after the election, while the Tories took 9 years after 1997

    He neglected to mention the relative size of the majorities in each case.
    That's a lie.

    The Tories moved ahead in Sep 2000.

    Some three years and a bit after Lab were elected.

    It was a dramatic swing and then a fairly dramatic swing back - a 15 point Average LAbour Lead in the preceding 7 polls, a 3 point Average Con lead over the mid september polls and then back to a 4 point average Labout lead that then stretched out to a 10 point and then 14 point Average Lab lead over the next sets of polls.

    I'm rubbish at remembering stuff was their a significant event then that caused the poll swingage?
    The fuel blockade
    Ah, of course - that changed my daily newspaper preference from the Scotsman to the Herald. The Scotsmen had been going down the tubes since he Barclay Brother/Andrew Neil takeover and their fuel blockade reportage was the straw that broke the camel's back.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,043

    Greens out polling the Lib Dems. Another pollster with UKIP approaching 9%.

    I am Nostradamus

    Greens have been well below the LibDems of late in ELBOW
    If I wasn't on my phone, you know what I'd be posting! ;)
  • FalseFlagFalseFlag Posts: 1,801
    edited March 2015



    Meanwhile in France,
    ''French politics went from ding to dong on Sunday. One side, the dingers, was cock-a-hoop. The others, the dongers, swore they would be back next time.
    Both the conservative dingers and Socialist dongers agreed on one thing, though. Thank goodness they had once again kept out those nasty upstarts, the clangers of the National Front.''

    At least the French see that 'ding dong' is better than 'ting tong'.

    That obscure post is reporting the second round of the French local elections, which were interesting, because despite the refusal of the centre-right (Sarkozy) to agree a common front against the National Front, the voters did it anyway. The FN actually lost ground (by 3%) compared with the first round, winning only five councils out of 278 on a slightly higher turnout.

    That appears to suggest a ceiling to the FN vote - they are able to get a quarter of the vote, but the other three quarters are generally hostile enough to vote for traditional rivals in order to keep them out.
    I suppose that is one way to spin the FN's best ever result in local elections where their share of the vote rose sharply as did their number of councillors (2 to 90?).
  • welshowlwelshowl Posts: 4,464
    edited March 2015

    Am I right in reading the Ashcroft poll shows only 1 voter in Scotland admitting the intention of voting LibDem?

    Yes. He's the lighthouse keeper on Muckle Flugga north of Unst. Nobody's been able to communicate with him for six months due to the dark and the weather, but now the clocks have gone forward there's some hope he'll be brought up to speed and will come to his senses ;-)
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,043

    Leftie's don't like irony.


    Dan Hodges retweeted
    Steve hawkes‏@steve_hawkes·10 mins10 minutes ago
    Hollywood star Martin Freeman champions Labour's compassion and decency - partner Amanda Abbington tweets "#proud #fucktheTories ..."

    Wonderful!
  • Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865

    The comment on Saturday night's thread are hysterical, they make Sion Simon look like a seer.

    I fear Smurkersh will need some counselling......
  • GrandioseGrandiose Posts: 2,323
    Betting question.

    Ladbrokes have UKIP @ 3.50 in the 5-10 % and @ 2.37 10-15%.

    I want to even out my potential gain in the 5-15% band.

    What ratio should I bet as between the two?
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    edited March 2015
    RobD said:

    Leftie's don't like irony.


    Dan Hodges retweeted
    Steve hawkes‏@steve_hawkes·10 mins10 minutes ago
    Hollywood star Martin Freeman champions Labour's compassion and decency - partner Amanda Abbington tweets "#proud #fucktheTories ..."

    Wonderful!
    Is she the woman who didn't pay her taxes?

    Presumably, they're only things that the little people pay.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,173

    Am I right in reading the Ashcroft poll shows only 1 voter in Scotland admitting the intention of voting LibDem?

    Isn't that an improvement. :)
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,947

    Leftie's don't like irony.


    Dan Hodges retweeted
    Steve hawkes‏@steve_hawkes·10 mins10 minutes ago
    Hollywood star Martin Freeman champions Labour's compassion and decency - partner Amanda Abbington tweets "#proud #fucktheTories ..."

    Probably also tweeted "#proud #fuckthetaxsystem...."

  • felixfelix Posts: 15,173

    Leftie's don't like irony.


    Dan Hodges retweeted
    Steve hawkes‏@steve_hawkes·10 mins10 minutes ago
    Hollywood star Martin Freeman champions Labour's compassion and decency - partner Amanda Abbington tweets "#proud #fucktheTories ..."

    Hypocricy, hypocricy, hypocricy - it's what Labour does.
  • GrandioseGrandiose Posts: 2,323
    Grandiose said:

    Betting question.

    Ladbrokes have UKIP @ 3.50 in the 5-10 % and @ 2.37 10-15%.

    I want to even out my potential gain in the 5-15% band.

    What ratio should I bet as between the two?


    OK, answered my own question (basically 40:60). Never mind.

    But a return of 40% does seem like good value.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,043

    RobD said:

    Leftie's don't like irony.


    Dan Hodges retweeted
    Steve hawkes‏@steve_hawkes·10 mins10 minutes ago
    Hollywood star Martin Freeman champions Labour's compassion and decency - partner Amanda Abbington tweets "#proud #fucktheTories ..."

    Wonderful!
    Is she the lady who didn't pay her taxes?
    That'd be the proverbial cherry on top.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Grandiose said:

    Betting question.

    Ladbrokes have UKIP @ 3.50 in the 5-10 % and @ 2.37 10-15%.

    I want to even out my potential gain in the 5-15% band.

    What ratio should I bet as between the two?

    1:1.47. You need to equalise the returns.

    e.g. £20 @ 5/2 returns £70
    £29.50 @ 11/8 returns £70.06

    Total stake is £49.50 to win £20.50 i.e. just a fraction better than 2/5.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,964
    Mr. Felix, outrageous post. You should know better.

    Hypocrisy*
  • New thread.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,540
    FalseFlag said:



    Meanwhile in France,
    ''French politics went from ding to dong on Sunday. One side, the dingers, was cock-a-hoop. The others, the dongers, swore they would be back next time.
    Both the conservative dingers and Socialist dongers agreed on one thing, though. Thank goodness they had once again kept out those nasty upstarts, the clangers of the National Front.''

    At least the French see that 'ding dong' is better than 'ting tong'.

    That obscure post is reporting the second round of the French local elections, which were interesting, because despite the refusal of the centre-right (Sarkozy) to agree a common front against the National Front, the voters did it anyway. The FN actually lost ground (by 3%) compared with the first round, winning only five councils out of 278 on a slightly higher turnout.

    That appears to suggest a ceiling to the FN vote - they are able to get a quarter of the vote, but the other three quarters are generally hostile enough to vote for traditional rivals in order to keep them out.
    I suppose that is one way to spin the FN's best ever result in local elections where their share of the vote rose sharply.
    Plenty of left wing French voters will vote UMP/UDI to keep out FN, but I don't think UMP/UDI voters are willing to vote Left to keep out FN to anything like the same extent.

    FN won 62 seats, up from one last time, although that's still only 1.5% of the total. But, there were quite a lot of other victorious candidates who were pretty much on the same wavelength as FN, even if they aren't in the party, such as Jaques Bompard in Vaucleuse.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,027

    TSE skewered the YG at the weekend. 5% watched the debates but 20% of YG VI did. So YG on-liners are political activists. Treat with all due caution.

    Pretty sure that was me. Having said that @ASJohnstone then made a good point that 100% do not vote so it was a higher percentage of the politically involved who watched the debates. Still a fairly significant over representation though.

    The problem is that Mike made another good point today in that phone polls are reliant on landlines who are willing to answer a number they don't recognise. The risk factors for all pollsters are going up and up and they are all having to make ever more courageous assumptions about the similarities between those that are willing to speak to them and the rest of us.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,135
    Yet again, His Lordship publishes a LibDem figure at variance from what's in his tables. I make the LibDems on 7, like the Greens.
  • GrandioseGrandiose Posts: 2,323

    Grandiose said:

    Betting question.

    Ladbrokes have UKIP @ 3.50 in the 5-10 % and @ 2.37 10-15%.

    I want to even out my potential gain in the 5-15% band.

    What ratio should I bet as between the two?

    1:1.47. You need to equalise the returns.

    e.g. £20 @ 5/2 returns £70
    £29.50 @ 11/8 returns £70.06

    Total stake is £49.50 to win £20.50 i.e. just a fraction better than 2/5.
    Thanks Tissue_Price.

    You vastly over-estimate by bets though! I'm placing a few small bets for entertainment on the night.
  • nigel4englandnigel4england Posts: 4,800
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    Leftie's don't like irony.


    Dan Hodges retweeted
    Steve hawkes‏@steve_hawkes·10 mins10 minutes ago
    Hollywood star Martin Freeman champions Labour's compassion and decency - partner Amanda Abbington tweets "#proud #fucktheTories ..."

    Wonderful!
    Is she the lady who didn't pay her taxes?
    That'd be the proverbial cherry on top.
    Yep, she went bankrupt owing £120,000 to the taxman while her partner and father of her two kids has a £10m fortune.

    We're all in it together?

    Not if you are hypocritical Socialist scumbag.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,387

    Leftie's don't like irony.


    Dan Hodges retweeted
    Steve hawkes‏@steve_hawkes·10 mins10 minutes ago
    Hollywood star Martin Freeman champions Labour's compassion and decency - partner Amanda Abbington tweets "#proud #fucktheTories ..."

    Didn't 2010 prove that celebrity endorsements for political parties is probably a net turn-off in the end?

    I mean, who can forget Elvis coming out for El Gord....

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-uokKdI7Kc

    Not so much "hell yeah" as "hells bells..."
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,947
    GIN1138 said:

    felix said:

    antifrank said:

    I don't take this poll any more seriously than the YouGov on Saturday night.

    The focus groups are fascinating, however, and hilarious.

    That's the best bit about Lord A's polling.

    Essentially like YouGov this indicates neck and neck.
    Hmmmm probably but that's 3 polls in a row today with the Tories up 3% in each.
    YouGov tonight could be informative....
    I'm sensing a Con/Lab tie with YouGov but Con may be up 2-3% from Saturday, perhaps 35/35?

    A Con lead would consign the Sunday Times front page into the chip wrappers of history....

  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,135
    ELBOWing ComRes, Populus and Ashcroft puts the Tories 1.3% ahead (was 1.1% with just ComRes and Populus).

    Hell no! I mean Yes!
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    GIN1138 said:

    felix said:

    antifrank said:

    I don't take this poll any more seriously than the YouGov on Saturday night.

    The focus groups are fascinating, however, and hilarious.

    That's the best bit about Lord A's polling.

    Essentially like YouGov this indicates neck and neck.
    Hmmmm probably but that's 3 polls in a row today with the Tories up 3% in each.
    YouGov tonight could be informative....
    I'm sensing a Con/Lab tie with YouGov but Con may be up 2-3% from Saturday, perhaps 35/35?

    If it is that then the Sunday Times headline will be looking a bit sick.
    It would also mean that the attack by the crack 1930th Spending Scare Division was beaten back with heavy loss.
    If the defenders of 36 really are starving and reduced to drinking their own urine from discarded Labour campaign mugs, then we could see a 37 flag being waved by a yougov Forlorn Hope outlier
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,387

    ELBOWing ComRes, Populus and Ashcroft puts the Tories 1.3% ahead (was 1.1% with just ComRes and Populus).

    Hell no! I mean Yes!

    Looks like ARSE and ELBOW are starting to align...

  • tysontyson Posts: 6,117
    I can't believe I've reduced myself to such a level of geeky, autistic, obsessive, male dominated behaviour (which befits the vast majority of my comrades on pbCOM) but looking at the longer term trends of the polls shows the Tory doing significantly better using weekend samples.

    Do these make these polls more accurate? I really don't know- perhaps Tories are more likely to be at home then, which sadly, means that perhaps they are more realistic than the weekly polls when Labour do better.
This discussion has been closed.