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One in four support compulsory voting – politicalbetting.com

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  • FishingFishing Posts: 4,557
    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    TimS said:

    HYUFD said:

    TimS said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    Would cry* if Sunak made the NI deal a confidence matter and expelled all who didn't vote for it.
    Karma.

    * With laughter and joy of course.

    He won't, he certainly doesn't want 100 Tory MPs going to a new Boris party under FPTP and split his vote.

    He will just abandon the NI deal if he can't get it passed by most of his MPs and the DUP and leave Starmer to deal with it as the likely next PM
    Why?
    It worked for BoJo.
    Johnson got through the current deal, Sunak is trying for a softer deal he cannot sell to the ERG to remove the Irish Sea border.

    While the DUP just want the current deal too but for NI as well.

    As I said earlier only a PM Starmer could get a softer Brexit deal through the Commons with Labour having most seats, PM Sunak can't. The ERG and DUP would vote it down
    I haven't been posting much recently but I utterly despair at Johnson and his toxic band of followers who are leading the conservative party to oblivion

    It is so hard for a one nation conservative like myself to witness this public act of hari kari but the consolation will be the decimation of Johnson and his idiotic tribal followers at GE 24
    Frankly it’s hard for anyone who respects Britain’s democracy to witness Johnson and the ERG replicate the worst excesses of militant Labour in this way. But I wonder if, as with Corbyn, the only path to redemption is for him to regain the premiership then lose catastrophically in a general election.
    The way it is going the next election is already lost as are a whole bundle of right wing seats including the toxic Johnson
    Unfortunately, looking at the battleground, a lot of the fruitier members of the Parliamentary Conservative Party have got very safe seats indeed. Once the selections are in place, it will be interesting to see where the ideological centre of a Conservative party with 50/100/150/200 seats is likely to be.
    Francois, Bill Cash, Braverman, Priti Patel, Badenoch, Duddridge all have safe seats.

    Rees Mogg's is a bit more marginal but even his is not even in the top 100 Labour target seats.

    Only IDS and Steve Baker from the ERG hard right are likely to lose their seats, though Boris and Redwood are also at risk
    The way things are going no conservative will have a safe seat and deservedly so
    Another quote from that famous Kinnock conference speech:

    “Comrades, it seems to me lately that some of our number become like latter-day public school-boys. It seems it matters not whether you won or lost, but how you played the game.”

    That, I think, sums up a particular tendency within the current Tory party.
    Except of the ERG big hitters, Francois, IDS, Patel, Baker, Duddridge, Badenoch, David Davis and Raab are all state educated. Only Bill Cash, Braverman, Bernard Jenkin and John Redwood and Boris went to public school and Redwood's was only a minor public school.

    By contrast PM Sunak and Chancellor Hunt both went to major public schools and Starmer and Davey went to HMC public schools too
    Starmer went to a state school as you well know. It is hardly his fault it converted to an independent when he was there and he was then state funded.

    I am no fan of Starmer, but I won't resort to lying to make a petty point.
    It wasn't lying, Reigate Grammar is an HMC school and was an independent school before Starmer left it
    Yes you are and you know you are. You know exactly what you are doing. He was sent to a state school that converted to an independent. You are twisting facts deliberately and you should be ashamed of yourself.
    There is nothing wrong with going to public school, I did, they are excellent schools.

    Sir Keir should not be ashamed of it, nor his earlier grammar school education either.

    Indeed he still has a less posh education than Rishi and Boris at Winchester and Eton even if still a posher education than northern comprehensive educated Liz did
    You miss the point. Being a middle class lefty is all about balancing hypocrisy and self-hatred.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,842
    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    TimS said:

    HYUFD said:

    TimS said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    Would cry* if Sunak made the NI deal a confidence matter and expelled all who didn't vote for it.
    Karma.

    * With laughter and joy of course.

    He won't, he certainly doesn't want 100 Tory MPs going to a new Boris party under FPTP and split his vote.

    He will just abandon the NI deal if he can't get it passed by most of his MPs and the DUP and leave Starmer to deal with it as the likely next PM
    Why?
    It worked for BoJo.
    Johnson got through the current deal, Sunak is trying for a softer deal he cannot sell to the ERG to remove the Irish Sea border.

    While the DUP just want the current deal too but for NI as well.

    As I said earlier only a PM Starmer could get a softer Brexit deal through the Commons with Labour having most seats, PM Sunak can't. The ERG and DUP would vote it down
    I haven't been posting much recently but I utterly despair at Johnson and his toxic band of followers who are leading the conservative party to oblivion

    It is so hard for a one nation conservative like myself to witness this public act of hari kari but the consolation will be the decimation of Johnson and his idiotic tribal followers at GE 24
    Frankly it’s hard for anyone who respects Britain’s democracy to witness Johnson and the ERG replicate the worst excesses of militant Labour in this way. But I wonder if, as with Corbyn, the only path to redemption is for him to regain the premiership then lose catastrophically in a general election.
    The way it is going the next election is already lost as are a whole bundle of right wing seats including the toxic Johnson
    Unfortunately, looking at the battleground, a lot of the fruitier members of the Parliamentary Conservative Party have got very safe seats indeed. Once the selections are in place, it will be interesting to see where the ideological centre of a Conservative party with 50/100/150/200 seats is likely to be.
    Francois, Bill Cash, Braverman, Priti Patel, Badenoch, Duddridge all have safe seats.

    Rees Mogg's is a bit more marginal but even his is not even in the top 100 Labour target seats.

    Only IDS and Steve Baker from the ERG hard right are likely to lose their seats, though Boris and Redwood are also at risk
    The way things are going no conservative will have a safe seat and deservedly so
    Another quote from that famous Kinnock conference speech:

    “Comrades, it seems to me lately that some of our number become like latter-day public school-boys. It seems it matters not whether you won or lost, but how you played the game.”

    That, I think, sums up a particular tendency within the current Tory party.
    Except of the ERG big hitters, Francois, IDS, Patel, Baker, Duddridge, Badenoch, David Davis and Raab are all state educated. Only Bill Cash, Braverman, Bernard Jenkin and John Redwood and Boris went to public school and Redwood's was only a minor public school.

    By contrast PM Sunak and Chancellor Hunt both went to major public schools and Starmer and Davey went to HMC public schools too
    Starmer went to a state school as you well know. It is hardly his fault it converted to an independent when he was there and he was then state funded.

    I am no fan of Starmer, but I won't resort to lying to make a petty point.
    It wasn't lying, Reigate Grammar is an HMC school and was an independent school before Starmer left it
    Yes you are and you know you are. You know exactly what you are doing. He was sent to a state school that converted to an independent. You are twisting facts deliberately and you should be ashamed of yourself.
    There is nothing wrong with going to public school, I did, they are excellent schools.

    Sir Keir should not be ashamed of it, nor his earlier grammar school education either.

    Indeed he still has a less posh education than Rishi and Boris at Winchester and Eton even if still a posher education than northern comprehensive educated Liz did
    Was yours a minor or a major public school though ?
  • kjhkjh Posts: 10,468
    Fishing said:

    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    TimS said:

    HYUFD said:

    TimS said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    Would cry* if Sunak made the NI deal a confidence matter and expelled all who didn't vote for it.
    Karma.

    * With laughter and joy of course.

    He won't, he certainly doesn't want 100 Tory MPs going to a new Boris party under FPTP and split his vote.

    He will just abandon the NI deal if he can't get it passed by most of his MPs and the DUP and leave Starmer to deal with it as the likely next PM
    Why?
    It worked for BoJo.
    Johnson got through the current deal, Sunak is trying for a softer deal he cannot sell to the ERG to remove the Irish Sea border.

    While the DUP just want the current deal too but for NI as well.

    As I said earlier only a PM Starmer could get a softer Brexit deal through the Commons with Labour having most seats, PM Sunak can't. The ERG and DUP would vote it down
    I haven't been posting much recently but I utterly despair at Johnson and his toxic band of followers who are leading the conservative party to oblivion

    It is so hard for a one nation conservative like myself to witness this public act of hari kari but the consolation will be the decimation of Johnson and his idiotic tribal followers at GE 24
    Frankly it’s hard for anyone who respects Britain’s democracy to witness Johnson and the ERG replicate the worst excesses of militant Labour in this way. But I wonder if, as with Corbyn, the only path to redemption is for him to regain the premiership then lose catastrophically in a general election.
    The way it is going the next election is already lost as are a whole bundle of right wing seats including the toxic Johnson
    Unfortunately, looking at the battleground, a lot of the fruitier members of the Parliamentary Conservative Party have got very safe seats indeed. Once the selections are in place, it will be interesting to see where the ideological centre of a Conservative party with 50/100/150/200 seats is likely to be.
    Francois, Bill Cash, Braverman, Priti Patel, Badenoch, Duddridge all have safe seats.

    Rees Mogg's is a bit more marginal but even his is not even in the top 100 Labour target seats.

    Only IDS and Steve Baker from the ERG hard right are likely to lose their seats, though Boris and Redwood are also at risk
    The way things are going no conservative will have a safe seat and deservedly so
    Another quote from that famous Kinnock conference speech:

    “Comrades, it seems to me lately that some of our number become like latter-day public school-boys. It seems it matters not whether you won or lost, but how you played the game.”

    That, I think, sums up a particular tendency within the current Tory party.
    Except of the ERG big hitters, Francois, IDS, Patel, Baker, Duddridge, Badenoch, David Davis and Raab are all state educated. Only Bill Cash, Braverman, Bernard Jenkin and John Redwood and Boris went to public school and Redwood's was only a minor public school.

    By contrast PM Sunak and Chancellor Hunt both went to major public schools and Starmer and Davey went to HMC public schools too
    Starmer went to a state school as you well know. It is hardly his fault it converted to an independent when he was there and he was then state funded.

    I am no fan of Starmer, but I won't resort to lying to make a petty point.
    It wasn't lying, Reigate Grammar is an HMC school and was an independent school before Starmer left it
    Yes you are and you know you are. You know exactly what you are doing. He was sent to a state school that converted to an independent. You are twisting facts deliberately and you should be ashamed of yourself.
    There is nothing wrong with going to public school, I did, they are excellent schools.

    Sir Keir should not be ashamed of it, nor his earlier grammar school education either.

    Indeed he still has a less posh education than Rishi and Boris at Winchester and Eton even if still a posher education than northern comprehensive educated Liz did
    You miss the point. Being a middle class lefty is all about balancing hypocrisy and self-hatred.
    I think you have missed the point. It is all about lying and twisting the truth, completely unnecessarily. This has nothing to do with class but honesty.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,590
    Rishi Sunak warned more than 100 Tory MPs could rebel over NI protocol deal
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/feb/19/rishi-sunak-warned-more-than-100-tory-mps-could-rebel-over-ni-protocol-deal

    It's a sign of their duplicity that the same Tories who rebelled saying that May's agreement would "trap" us forever, are the also the ones threatening rebellion to save Johnson's bill which gives us the power, in UK law, unilaterally to set aside the current agreement with the EU.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,590
    kjh said:

    Fishing said:

    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    TimS said:

    HYUFD said:

    TimS said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    Would cry* if Sunak made the NI deal a confidence matter and expelled all who didn't vote for it.
    Karma.

    * With laughter and joy of course.

    He won't, he certainly doesn't want 100 Tory MPs going to a new Boris party under FPTP and split his vote.

    He will just abandon the NI deal if he can't get it passed by most of his MPs and the DUP and leave Starmer to deal with it as the likely next PM
    Why?
    It worked for BoJo.
    Johnson got through the current deal, Sunak is trying for a softer deal he cannot sell to the ERG to remove the Irish Sea border.

    While the DUP just want the current deal too but for NI as well.

    As I said earlier only a PM Starmer could get a softer Brexit deal through the Commons with Labour having most seats, PM Sunak can't. The ERG and DUP would vote it down
    I haven't been posting much recently but I utterly despair at Johnson and his toxic band of followers who are leading the conservative party to oblivion

    It is so hard for a one nation conservative like myself to witness this public act of hari kari but the consolation will be the decimation of Johnson and his idiotic tribal followers at GE 24
    Frankly it’s hard for anyone who respects Britain’s democracy to witness Johnson and the ERG replicate the worst excesses of militant Labour in this way. But I wonder if, as with Corbyn, the only path to redemption is for him to regain the premiership then lose catastrophically in a general election.
    The way it is going the next election is already lost as are a whole bundle of right wing seats including the toxic Johnson
    Unfortunately, looking at the battleground, a lot of the fruitier members of the Parliamentary Conservative Party have got very safe seats indeed. Once the selections are in place, it will be interesting to see where the ideological centre of a Conservative party with 50/100/150/200 seats is likely to be.
    Francois, Bill Cash, Braverman, Priti Patel, Badenoch, Duddridge all have safe seats.

    Rees Mogg's is a bit more marginal but even his is not even in the top 100 Labour target seats.

    Only IDS and Steve Baker from the ERG hard right are likely to lose their seats, though Boris and Redwood are also at risk
    The way things are going no conservative will have a safe seat and deservedly so
    Another quote from that famous Kinnock conference speech:

    “Comrades, it seems to me lately that some of our number become like latter-day public school-boys. It seems it matters not whether you won or lost, but how you played the game.”

    That, I think, sums up a particular tendency within the current Tory party.
    Except of the ERG big hitters, Francois, IDS, Patel, Baker, Duddridge, Badenoch, David Davis and Raab are all state educated. Only Bill Cash, Braverman, Bernard Jenkin and John Redwood and Boris went to public school and Redwood's was only a minor public school.

    By contrast PM Sunak and Chancellor Hunt both went to major public schools and Starmer and Davey went to HMC public schools too
    Starmer went to a state school as you well know. It is hardly his fault it converted to an independent when he was there and he was then state funded.

    I am no fan of Starmer, but I won't resort to lying to make a petty point.
    It wasn't lying, Reigate Grammar is an HMC school and was an independent school before Starmer left it
    Yes you are and you know you are. You know exactly what you are doing. He was sent to a state school that converted to an independent. You are twisting facts deliberately and you should be ashamed of yourself.
    There is nothing wrong with going to public school, I did, they are excellent schools.

    Sir Keir should not be ashamed of it, nor his earlier grammar school education either.

    Indeed he still has a less posh education than Rishi and Boris at Winchester and Eton even if still a posher education than northern comprehensive educated Liz did
    You miss the point. Being a middle class lefty is all about balancing hypocrisy and self-hatred.
    I think you have missed the point. It is all about lying and twisting the truth, completely unnecessarily. This has nothing to do with class but honesty.
    The point being missed is that HYUFD engages in a type of whstaboutery argument almost every time he's called out on a factual error.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,590
    That's quite clever, as it allows people to come in to back him up, without their having to support his original error.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,590
    Gloves off: Senior Tory source accuses Boris Johnson of hypocrisy over Brexit bill "great mistake" attack - saying he ditched his own hardline Internal Market Bill threat in December 2020 to unlock Brussels trade talks...
    https://mobile.twitter.com/MrHarryCole/status/1627420410949017600
  • Nigelb said:

    Rishi Sunak warned more than 100 Tory MPs could rebel over NI protocol deal
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/feb/19/rishi-sunak-warned-more-than-100-tory-mps-could-rebel-over-ni-protocol-deal

    It's a sign of their duplicity that the same Tories who rebelled saying that May's agreement would "trap" us forever, are the also the ones threatening rebellion to save Johnson's bill which gives us the power, in UK law, unilaterally to set aside the current agreement with the EU.

    That's Dudderidge ramping. I don't think the numbers are anywhere near that high.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,590
    So basically Johnson acolyte Tories are rebelling over the PM's efforts to improve an agreement which they supported at the time and which Johnson claimed was a great achievement... because the improvements aren't good enough to make their own agreement acceptable to them.

    Utterly contemptible.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 5,102
    edited February 2023
    Lockdown revealed to me how close we are at any one time to a police state. Cruella Braverman would love it.

    I refused to fill in the census: told them to fuck off. I was never fined. And after moving I took a year before registering on the electoral register. I refused to tell DVLA when I moved because I don't drive so they can fuck off. If they bring in compulsory voting I will tell them to fuck off too.

    As y'all know I use a VPN because I am wary of the sinister invasion of privacy at every juncture of our lives.

    I have a good, healthy, anarchistic streak in me. But it's about protecting our freedoms, which they wish to crush.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 5,102
    Fishing said:

    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    TimS said:

    HYUFD said:

    TimS said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    Would cry* if Sunak made the NI deal a confidence matter and expelled all who didn't vote for it.
    Karma.

    * With laughter and joy of course.

    He won't, he certainly doesn't want 100 Tory MPs going to a new Boris party under FPTP and split his vote.

    He will just abandon the NI deal if he can't get it passed by most of his MPs and the DUP and leave Starmer to deal with it as the likely next PM
    Why?
    It worked for BoJo.
    Johnson got through the current deal, Sunak is trying for a softer deal he cannot sell to the ERG to remove the Irish Sea border.

    While the DUP just want the current deal too but for NI as well.

    As I said earlier only a PM Starmer could get a softer Brexit deal through the Commons with Labour having most seats, PM Sunak can't. The ERG and DUP would vote it down
    I haven't been posting much recently but I utterly despair at Johnson and his toxic band of followers who are leading the conservative party to oblivion

    It is so hard for a one nation conservative like myself to witness this public act of hari kari but the consolation will be the decimation of Johnson and his idiotic tribal followers at GE 24
    Frankly it’s hard for anyone who respects Britain’s democracy to witness Johnson and the ERG replicate the worst excesses of militant Labour in this way. But I wonder if, as with Corbyn, the only path to redemption is for him to regain the premiership then lose catastrophically in a general election.
    The way it is going the next election is already lost as are a whole bundle of right wing seats including the toxic Johnson
    Unfortunately, looking at the battleground, a lot of the fruitier members of the Parliamentary Conservative Party have got very safe seats indeed. Once the selections are in place, it will be interesting to see where the ideological centre of a Conservative party with 50/100/150/200 seats is likely to be.
    Francois, Bill Cash, Braverman, Priti Patel, Badenoch, Duddridge all have safe seats.

    Rees Mogg's is a bit more marginal but even his is not even in the top 100 Labour target seats.

    Only IDS and Steve Baker from the ERG hard right are likely to lose their seats, though Boris and Redwood are also at risk
    The way things are going no conservative will have a safe seat and deservedly so
    Another quote from that famous Kinnock conference speech:

    “Comrades, it seems to me lately that some of our number become like latter-day public school-boys. It seems it matters not whether you won or lost, but how you played the game.”

    That, I think, sums up a particular tendency within the current Tory party.
    Except of the ERG big hitters, Francois, IDS, Patel, Baker, Duddridge, Badenoch, David Davis and Raab are all state educated. Only Bill Cash, Braverman, Bernard Jenkin and John Redwood and Boris went to public school and Redwood's was only a minor public school.

    By contrast PM Sunak and Chancellor Hunt both went to major public schools and Starmer and Davey went to HMC public schools too
    Starmer went to a state school as you well know. It is hardly his fault it converted to an independent when he was there and he was then state funded.

    I am no fan of Starmer, but I won't resort to lying to make a petty point.
    It wasn't lying, Reigate Grammar is an HMC school and was an independent school before Starmer left it
    Yes you are and you know you are. You know exactly what you are doing. He was sent to a state school that converted to an independent. You are twisting facts deliberately and you should be ashamed of yourself.
    There is nothing wrong with going to public school, I did, they are excellent schools.

    Sir Keir should not be ashamed of it, nor his earlier grammar school education either.

    Indeed he still has a less posh education than Rishi and Boris at Winchester and Eton even if still a posher education than northern comprehensive educated Liz did
    Being a middle class lefty is all about [...] self-hatred.
    A very, very, silly comment.

    You should get out and mix more. Middle class lefties generally love the word and love life. If they hate anyone it's sleaze bag corrupt tories who line their own pockets whilst stamping on others.

    But most of us have a faint smile on our faces. We know your game is up.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 61,590

    Nigelb said:

    Rishi Sunak warned more than 100 Tory MPs could rebel over NI protocol deal
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/feb/19/rishi-sunak-warned-more-than-100-tory-mps-could-rebel-over-ni-protocol-deal

    It's a sign of their duplicity that the same Tories who rebelled saying that May's agreement would "trap" us forever, are the also the ones threatening rebellion to save Johnson's bill which gives us the power, in UK law, unilaterally to set aside the current agreement with the EU.

    That's Dudderidge ramping. I don't think the numbers are anywhere near that high.
    That's clear from the story - Dudderidge's statement is muddled in its claims, and he's a well known bullshitter, just like his master.

    Sunak ought to face them down. There is no agreement to be made with the awkward squad, as they've time and again demonstrated.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 5,102
    It's entirely voluntary for you to stay on this thread, of course, but there's a new one in case you fancy something alternative.

    xx
  • A Labour MP tweets:

    "As Barnes makes perfectly clear, this isn’t a culture war story. This is a medical scandal, the full consequences of which may only be understood in many years’ time..." Review of @hannahsbee' book by
    @MsRachelCooke


    https://twitter.com/RosieDuffield1/status/1627277869461262338?s=20
This discussion has been closed.