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SKS reaches new betting high as PM after general election – politicalbetting.com

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  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,332
    Omg these two pintxos


    On the left is a pile of baby eels - much prized slightly fake basque delicacy - with some vinegar and a curl of chili and white pepper in there? - on the night is cold brined artichoke and pine nuts on a sweetish pink salsa butter

    I mean Holy Fuck. Holy Hell

    Plus a generous glass of local Sevillean white






    MAGNIFICO. Spanish food is the best in the world right now
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727
    edited September 2022

    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    Afternoon all.


    IshmaelZ said:

    Just seen the Prince charles pengate thing.

    Seems an utterly human reaction at a very emotional and stressful time.

    Mum dead? Bully a servant. Absolutely natural.

    Then do it again 2 days later. No pattern here.
    Here's the clip. Where's the servant being bullied? I see none except in some over-vivid imaginations. It amounts to "this bloody pen".

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/09/13/charles-loses-his-temper-after-fountain-pen-leaks-on-his-finger-17368828/

    Losing your temper like that is shorthand for saying that someone has fucked up; except for John Cleese and the car people don't lose their temper with inanimate things. If you are the head honcho, the implication is that your inferior has fucked up in his duty to you. Doing it in public is a humiliation. Humiliating people is bullying them.

    look at the scowl in pengate 1 and tell me the recipient of it is not being bullied.
    King Charles snapping his leaking pen, or like Fawlty beating his non-starting Austin 1100 with a branch would confirm it is in the inanimate rather than the subservient that he is punishing.

    I suspect rather than being unhinged like Fawlty, Charles is just a bully.
    Since the very moment his mother died there has been a camera stuck up his nose. She was 96 and ill but those who have lost a parent will know that you can prepare for it all you want but when it happens it is a huge shock.

    At times just after my father died (expected but a huge shock...) there were many times I felt like picking up whatever was in front of me and throwing it through the window. The anger stage of grief I believe it's called, when you want all normal laws of everything to be suspended. But they aren't. You must carry on.

    And if you're King then you must carry on in the public gaze. Charles literally had a camera pointing up his nose. I feel better disposed towards him after seeing the incident

    My father always reacted like Charles to minor incumberances like the leaking pen. He too was pre- disposed to bullying those around him as a reaction. It is not a stress related lashing out due to grief, it is an innate character flaw.

    The Queen wouldn't have responded similarly.
    Did you see your father do it days after his mother died?

    Drawing a line from a very minor outburst of anger, grief, frustration directed to no one in particular, directly to being a bully is an extraordinary leap.
    He was like that day in day out, so it would be hard to tell.

    I don't know Charles, but we have had two loss of control moments in almost the same number of days. You may be right, but I doubt it.
    The interesting thing is Charles's father would have done this kind of thing all the time, I should think. His mother, never in public/with the cameras rolling, even in grief, I think. As a staff member I imagine how he is behind the scenes is more important - if I worked for him and he got frustrated in front of the camera, possibly at me, and then apologised for it afterwards, I'd think well of him. If he treated me great when the camera was rolling and like shit the rest of the time, I would not.

    KCIII is not QE2. That's neither a good nor a bad thing or, more precisely, it could be either and is likely to be a bit of both. I'd be inclined to wait and see for a bit before judging him in the round.

    And all the above as a committed republican (in principle, although in practice I think we've got more urgent things to worry about than how we appoint the head of state).
  • DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    Major Japanese newspaper reported MOD plans to buy UCAVs on a trial basis from 2023 and buy several hundred UCAVs, both foreign and domestic, after 2025.
    IAI and US made Kamikaze drone are candidates for the test introduction, as well as TB2 .

    https://mobile.twitter.com/GreatPoppo/status/1569880442219954176

    This is the new arms race.

    Yep, and the MBT, the champion of the battlefield since roughly 1917, is dead. Just over 100 years is a pretty good run mind you.

    The next step (a genuinely scary one) is when these drones or their successors have AI. At that point having humans on the battlefield is going to be next to suicidal.
    Not according to the Ukrainians. I’ll have to dig it out, but a serving Ukrainian officer precisely rebutted the “Tank is dead” thing, in a paper.

    As he saw it, tanks are doing more roles now than ever.

    The key is combined arms - without support tanks are dead meat. Which was also true at Cambrai in 1917.

    The Russians bizarre habit of sending single tanks, unsupported, out to star in Ukrainian YouTube videos is not how tanks were ever supposed to be used.
    I think the problem is this: air power can be used to deny an area to the opposition. To actually retake an area, you need boots on the ground. And as long as the enemy have powerful guns (or any guns...) you may need armour for protection. Hence armoured vehicles and tanks. Tanks, APCs etc will evolve, but the basic requirement won't go away.

    We are already seeing anti-UAV weapons in the theatre, and these will increase in complexity as the UAVs do; perhaps tilting the balance away from UAVs and we'll all be crying "why did we scrap all our tanks?"

    As you say, the Russians appear to have used their tanks especially stupidly. Interestingly, the Ukrainians are apparently using our Spartans in the latest attack, using their speed to get behind Russian lines.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,967
    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,568
    Have to feel a bit sorry for those Guards with no medals to parade....
  • Apparently (Google) 43% of London is white (British).
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072
    I said a couple of days back that Biden is enjoying being President way too much not to run again...

    https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1569891437780832256
    Couldn’t agree more, Rick. And if anyone else wants to read your plan to put Social Security and Medicare on the chopping block, they should go to http://joebiden.com/rickscottsplan.

    Thanks for stopping by.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    All the brown people they interview seem to be ardent monarchists!
    Astounding given the population from which they are sampling. IIRC the first in the queue was a Sri Lankan lady.

    On the wider issues, there's a piece in the Graun re India.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/sep/14/india-mourns-queen-elizabeth-apology-commonwealth
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,157
    Very impressed with people's detailed recall of what they were taught in school. I can't say with any confidence whether I was told about slavery or not, let alone in what context.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    Afternoon all.


    IshmaelZ said:

    Just seen the Prince charles pengate thing.

    Seems an utterly human reaction at a very emotional and stressful time.

    Mum dead? Bully a servant. Absolutely natural.

    Then do it again 2 days later. No pattern here.
    Here's the clip. Where's the servant being bullied? I see none except in some over-vivid imaginations. It amounts to "this bloody pen".

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/09/13/charles-loses-his-temper-after-fountain-pen-leaks-on-his-finger-17368828/

    Losing your temper like that is shorthand for saying that someone has fucked up; except for John Cleese and the car people don't lose their temper with inanimate things. If you are the head honcho, the implication is that your inferior has fucked up in his duty to you. Doing it in public is a humiliation. Humiliating people is bullying them.

    look at the scowl in pengate 1 and tell me the recipient of it is not being bullied.
    King Charles snapping his leaking pen, or like Fawlty beating his non-starting Austin 1100 with a branch would confirm it is in the inanimate rather than the subservient that he is punishing.

    I suspect rather than being unhinged like Fawlty, Charles is just a bully.
    Since the very moment his mother died there has been a camera stuck up his nose. She was 96 and ill but those who have lost a parent will know that you can prepare for it all you want but when it happens it is a huge shock.

    At times just after my father died (expected but a huge shock...) there were many times I felt like picking up whatever was in front of me and throwing it through the window. The anger stage of grief I believe it's called, when you want all normal laws of everything to be suspended. But they aren't. You must carry on.

    And if you're King then you must carry on in the public gaze. Charles literally had a camera pointing up his nose. I feel better disposed towards him after seeing the incident

    My father always reacted like Charles to minor incumberances like the leaking pen. He too was pre- disposed to bullying those around him as a reaction. It is not a stress related lashing out due to grief, it is an innate character flaw.

    The Queen wouldn't have responded similarly.
    Did you see your father do it days after his mother died?

    Drawing a line from a very minor outburst of anger, grief, frustration directed to no one in particular, directly to being a bully is an extraordinary leap.
    He was like that day in day out, so it would be hard to tell.

    I don't know Charles, but we have had two loss of control moments in almost the same number of days. You may be right, but I doubt it.
    ie it's pure supposition on your part. Thanks for clarifying.
    Indeed.

    The similarity is nonetheless alarmingly uncanny. I concede you may have read the situation better than I have. We can debate this theme again in a year or two.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840
    Leon said:

    Omg these two pintxos


    On the left is a pile of baby eels - much prized slightly fake basque delicacy - with some vinegar and a curl of chili and white pepper in there? - on the night is cold brined artichoke and pine nuts on a sweetish pink salsa butter

    I mean Holy Fuck. Holy Hell

    Plus a generous glass of local Sevillean white






    MAGNIFICO. Spanish food is the best in the world right now

    Must be like being at home, elvers for a snack.
  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594
    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    From the pictures I saw, also quite female crowd. Is that your perception?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    All the brown people they interview seem to be ardent monarchists!
    Testimony to the fundamental decency of the White Man and the Colonial Enterprise.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,157
    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    Afternoon all.


    IshmaelZ said:

    Just seen the Prince charles pengate thing.

    Seems an utterly human reaction at a very emotional and stressful time.

    Mum dead? Bully a servant. Absolutely natural.

    Then do it again 2 days later. No pattern here.
    Here's the clip. Where's the servant being bullied? I see none except in some over-vivid imaginations. It amounts to "this bloody pen".

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/09/13/charles-loses-his-temper-after-fountain-pen-leaks-on-his-finger-17368828/

    Losing your temper like that is shorthand for saying that someone has fucked up; except for John Cleese and the car people don't lose their temper with inanimate things. If you are the head honcho, the implication is that your inferior has fucked up in his duty to you. Doing it in public is a humiliation. Humiliating people is bullying them.

    look at the scowl in pengate 1 and tell me the recipient of it is not being bullied.
    King Charles snapping his leaking pen, or like Fawlty beating his non-starting Austin 1100 with a branch would confirm it is in the inanimate rather than the subservient that he is punishing.

    I suspect rather than being unhinged like Fawlty, Charles is just a bully.
    Since the very moment his mother died there has been a camera stuck up his nose. She was 96 and ill but those who have lost a parent will know that you can prepare for it all you want but when it happens it is a huge shock.

    At times just after my father died (expected but a huge shock...) there were many times I felt like picking up whatever was in front of me and throwing it through the window. The anger stage of grief I believe it's called, when you want all normal laws of everything to be suspended. But they aren't. You must carry on.

    And if you're King then you must carry on in the public gaze. Charles literally had a camera pointing up his nose. I feel better disposed towards him after seeing the incident

    My father always reacted like Charles to minor incumberances like the leaking pen. He too was pre- disposed to bullying those around him as a reaction. It is not a stress related lashing out due to grief, it is an innate character flaw.

    The Queen wouldn't have responded similarly.
    Charles actually was bullied pretty brutally at Gordonstoun where his parents sent him.

    His staff however are paid to ensure he had things like pens in top condition, minor irritation if they failed to do what they are paid to do is hardly a problem
    "I hate that stinking pen" ... 😆
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,791

    IanB2 said:

    If the BBC coverage couldn't get any worse WATO have Paddy O'Connell as their on the spot reporter at Westminster Hall.

    CNN has sent Anderson Cooper over to London to report on the spot. He always seemed like a hologram invented solely for the studio.
    He is really Max Headroom reborn and I claim my 1980's inflation adjusted $5
    Coincidentally, there is a Max Headroom 'reboot' series in the works...
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,332
    Tanks driven by ACTUAL SOLDIERS are surely doomed. They are pointless, tragic deathtraps

    There will be a role for unmanned vehicles driven either entirely by AI or with the help of some guy in Swindon 3000 miles away sitting bored at a screen

    This is the future of war. Soldiers won’t die. Civilians will. At the hands of drones and ai machines
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    MISTY said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    From the pictures I saw, also quite female crowd. Is that your perception?
    I think that's right.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,362
    edited September 2022

    With both M&S and Waitrose closings on Monday there should be plenty of Yellow Labels on the shelves on Sunday afternoon..

    Maybe. Or Sunday the supermarkets could resemble Christmas Eve, completely stripped bare as people panic that they will run out of food while the supermarkets are closed for one day.

    Must remember to get my panic shop in early.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072
    (US) Producer price index looking much better than yesterday's CPI. Core index up 0.2 percent in August, a total of just 0.6 percent in the last three months https://bls.gov/news.release/ppi.nr0.htm
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    Afternoon all.


    IshmaelZ said:

    Just seen the Prince charles pengate thing.

    Seems an utterly human reaction at a very emotional and stressful time.

    Mum dead? Bully a servant. Absolutely natural.

    Then do it again 2 days later. No pattern here.
    Here's the clip. Where's the servant being bullied? I see none except in some over-vivid imaginations. It amounts to "this bloody pen".

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/09/13/charles-loses-his-temper-after-fountain-pen-leaks-on-his-finger-17368828/

    Losing your temper like that is shorthand for saying that someone has fucked up; except for John Cleese and the car people don't lose their temper with inanimate things. If you are the head honcho, the implication is that your inferior has fucked up in his duty to you. Doing it in public is a humiliation. Humiliating people is bullying them.

    look at the scowl in pengate 1 and tell me the recipient of it is not being bullied.
    King Charles snapping his leaking pen, or like Fawlty beating his non-starting Austin 1100 with a branch would confirm it is in the inanimate rather than the subservient that he is punishing.

    I suspect rather than being unhinged like Fawlty, Charles is just a bully.
    Since the very moment his mother died there has been a camera stuck up his nose. She was 96 and ill but those who have lost a parent will know that you can prepare for it all you want but when it happens it is a huge shock.

    At times just after my father died (expected but a huge shock...) there were many times I felt like picking up whatever was in front of me and throwing it through the window. The anger stage of grief I believe it's called, when you want all normal laws of everything to be suspended. But they aren't. You must carry on.

    And if you're King then you must carry on in the public gaze. Charles literally had a camera pointing up his nose. I feel better disposed towards him after seeing the incident

    My father always reacted like Charles to minor incumberances like the leaking pen. He too was pre- disposed to bullying those around him as a reaction. It is not a stress related lashing out due to grief, it is an innate character flaw.

    The Queen wouldn't have responded similarly.
    Charles actually was bullied pretty brutally at Gordonstoun where his parents sent him.

    His staff however are paid to ensure he had things like pens in top condition, minor irritation if they failed to do what they are paid to do is hardly a problem
    Being the victim of bullying is a poor mitigation for the bully.

    Why should Charles's minnions spend their lives treading on eggshells? If as you say they are "paid" to satisfy his every whim or receive thunderous abuse for their failure, he does not demonstrate the "class" of his mother. That's all I'm saying.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,286
    Isn't this all a bit over the top for just moving the body from Buckingham Palace to Westminster?

    The funeral will feel like a damp squib if they're not careful.
  • Leon said:

    Tanks driven by ACTUAL SOLDIERS are surely doomed. They are pointless, tragic deathtraps

    There will be a role for unmanned vehicles driven either entirely by AI or with the help of some guy in Swindon 3000 miles away sitting bored at a screen

    This is the future of war. Soldiers won’t die. Civilians will. At the hands of drones and ai machines

    You've been watching "Terminator" a little too often.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    Major Japanese newspaper reported MOD plans to buy UCAVs on a trial basis from 2023 and buy several hundred UCAVs, both foreign and domestic, after 2025.
    IAI and US made Kamikaze drone are candidates for the test introduction, as well as TB2 .

    https://mobile.twitter.com/GreatPoppo/status/1569880442219954176

    This is the new arms race.

    Yep, and the MBT, the champion of the battlefield since roughly 1917, is dead. Just over 100 years is a pretty good run mind you.

    The next step (a genuinely scary one) is when these drones or their successors have AI. At that point having humans on the battlefield is going to be next to suicidal.
    Not according to the Ukrainians. I’ll have to dig it out, but a serving Ukrainian officer precisely rebutted the “Tank is dead” thing, in a paper.

    As he saw it, tanks are doing more roles now than ever.

    The key is combined arms - without support tanks are dead meat. Which was also true at Cambrai in 1917.

    The Russians bizarre habit of sending single tanks, unsupported, out to star in Ukrainian YouTube videos is not how tanks were ever supposed to be used.
    I don't think that really rebuts the argument.
    Ukraine is fighting the Russian army, and most of their kit is as old as that used by the Russians. Which is in basically obsolete.
    And they have a comparative handful of military drones, plus a lot of cobbled together stuff - while the Russians have a fraction of that.

    Any battlefield in five or ten years' time is going to be a much less forgiving place for MBTs.
    Any battlefield in 5-10 years is going to be a much less forgiving place for drones. This is currently the war of the drone because Russia has hee-haw to counter them. Drones are cheap and cheerful and fragile as fuck.

    Every tank is going to have an anti-drone package on top that will spot and stop any little dude flying overhead trying to drop iron bombs on them.
  • ohnotnow said:

    IanB2 said:

    If the BBC coverage couldn't get any worse WATO have Paddy O'Connell as their on the spot reporter at Westminster Hall.

    CNN has sent Anderson Cooper over to London to report on the spot. He always seemed like a hologram invented solely for the studio.
    He is really Max Headroom reborn and I claim my 1980's inflation adjusted $5
    Coincidentally, there is a Max Headroom 'reboot' series in the works...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6epzmRZk6UU
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072

    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    Afternoon all.


    IshmaelZ said:

    Just seen the Prince charles pengate thing.

    Seems an utterly human reaction at a very emotional and stressful time.

    Mum dead? Bully a servant. Absolutely natural.

    Then do it again 2 days later. No pattern here.
    Here's the clip. Where's the servant being bullied? I see none except in some over-vivid imaginations. It amounts to "this bloody pen".

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/09/13/charles-loses-his-temper-after-fountain-pen-leaks-on-his-finger-17368828/

    Losing your temper like that is shorthand for saying that someone has fucked up; except for John Cleese and the car people don't lose their temper with inanimate things. If you are the head honcho, the implication is that your inferior has fucked up in his duty to you. Doing it in public is a humiliation. Humiliating people is bullying them.

    look at the scowl in pengate 1 and tell me the recipient of it is not being bullied.
    King Charles snapping his leaking pen, or like Fawlty beating his non-starting Austin 1100 with a branch would confirm it is in the inanimate rather than the subservient that he is punishing.

    I suspect rather than being unhinged like Fawlty, Charles is just a bully.
    Since the very moment his mother died there has been a camera stuck up his nose. She was 96 and ill but those who have lost a parent will know that you can prepare for it all you want but when it happens it is a huge shock.

    At times just after my father died (expected but a huge shock...) there were many times I felt like picking up whatever was in front of me and throwing it through the window. The anger stage of grief I believe it's called, when you want all normal laws of everything to be suspended. But they aren't. You must carry on.

    And if you're King then you must carry on in the public gaze. Charles literally had a camera pointing up his nose. I feel better disposed towards him after seeing the incident

    My father always reacted like Charles to minor incumberances like the leaking pen. He too was pre- disposed to bullying those around him as a reaction. It is not a stress related lashing out due to grief, it is an innate character flaw.

    The Queen wouldn't have responded similarly.
    Charles actually was bullied pretty brutally at Gordonstoun where his parents sent him.

    His staff however are paid to ensure he had things like pens in top condition, minor irritation if they failed to do what they are paid to do is hardly a problem
    Being the victim of bullying is a poor mitigation for the bully...
    It's not infrequently a motivation for people to become bullies.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,990
    The coffin is on a gun carriage. I assumed there was some kind of mounting device, but it looks like they just ratchet strap it to the barrel
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,332
    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Omg these two pintxos


    On the left is a pile of baby eels - much prized slightly fake basque delicacy - with some vinegar and a curl of chili and white pepper in there? - on the night is cold brined artichoke and pine nuts on a sweetish pink salsa butter

    I mean Holy Fuck. Holy Hell

    Plus a generous glass of local Sevillean white






    MAGNIFICO. Spanish food is the best in the world right now

    Must be like being at home, elvers for a snack.
    The basques are OBSESSED with elvers. And this is a basque food stand (albeit from a Michelin star chef)

    The result is that real elvers are about £3m a kilo. My guess is these are the fake elvers made of real eels but sliced into tiny elvery shapes. There is an urban myth that Chinese workers are employed to paint tiny black eyes on each fake elver

    Blood great scran, any which way. Coming to a foodie part of Spain right now is like going to France four decades ago. The food is quite often on a different and higher level

  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,568
    edited September 2022
    GIN1138 said:

    Isn't this all a bit over the top for just moving the body from Buckingham Palace to Westminster?

    The funeral will feel like a damp squib if they're not careful.

    No. It is magnificent as all fuck.

    As will be the funeral.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,967
    GIN1138 said:

    Isn't this all a bit over the top for just moving the body from Buckingham Palace to Westminster?

    The funeral will feel like a damp squib if they're not careful.

    The funeral will be the biggest funeral globally since JFK's, this is just the starter
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840

    Nigelb said:

    A Russian helicopter struck a pillar of the bridge over Dnipro river, which Nazis were trying to build during WWII. They passed off this as an attack on barges with Ukrainian troops.
    https://twitter.com/bayraktar_1love/status/1570025552286810115

    Why don't they just give up and go home ?

    On that note, there are a number of unfinushed Nazi infrastructure projects in eastern Europe. Including the spectacular Borovsko Bridge, which was later partly flooded.

    https://www.dangerousroads.org/eastern-europe/czech-republic/3418-borovsko-bridge.html
    Featured on an episode of Abandoned Engineering.
    Couldn't understand why you were so excited about a boring old causeway till I realised the bridge is mostly underwater! Found an old photo ...

    https://pastvu.com/p/700638
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,967

    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    Afternoon all.


    IshmaelZ said:

    Just seen the Prince charles pengate thing.

    Seems an utterly human reaction at a very emotional and stressful time.

    Mum dead? Bully a servant. Absolutely natural.

    Then do it again 2 days later. No pattern here.
    Here's the clip. Where's the servant being bullied? I see none except in some over-vivid imaginations. It amounts to "this bloody pen".

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/09/13/charles-loses-his-temper-after-fountain-pen-leaks-on-his-finger-17368828/

    Losing your temper like that is shorthand for saying that someone has fucked up; except for John Cleese and the car people don't lose their temper with inanimate things. If you are the head honcho, the implication is that your inferior has fucked up in his duty to you. Doing it in public is a humiliation. Humiliating people is bullying them.

    look at the scowl in pengate 1 and tell me the recipient of it is not being bullied.
    King Charles snapping his leaking pen, or like Fawlty beating his non-starting Austin 1100 with a branch would confirm it is in the inanimate rather than the subservient that he is punishing.

    I suspect rather than being unhinged like Fawlty, Charles is just a bully.
    Since the very moment his mother died there has been a camera stuck up his nose. She was 96 and ill but those who have lost a parent will know that you can prepare for it all you want but when it happens it is a huge shock.

    At times just after my father died (expected but a huge shock...) there were many times I felt like picking up whatever was in front of me and throwing it through the window. The anger stage of grief I believe it's called, when you want all normal laws of everything to be suspended. But they aren't. You must carry on.

    And if you're King then you must carry on in the public gaze. Charles literally had a camera pointing up his nose. I feel better disposed towards him after seeing the incident

    My father always reacted like Charles to minor incumberances like the leaking pen. He too was pre- disposed to bullying those around him as a reaction. It is not a stress related lashing out due to grief, it is an innate character flaw.

    The Queen wouldn't have responded similarly.
    Charles actually was bullied pretty brutally at Gordonstoun where his parents sent him.

    His staff however are paid to ensure he had things like pens in top condition, minor irritation if they failed to do what they are paid to do is hardly a problem
    Being the victim of bullying is a poor mitigation for the bully.

    Why should Charles's minnions spend their lives treading on eggshells? If as you say they are "paid" to satisfy his every whim or receive thunderous abuse for their failure, he does not demonstrate the "class" of his mother. That's all I'm saying.
    If they cannot even provide the King with a non leaking pen they are lucky not to be sacked never mind just a minor tut tut
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    kinabalu said:

    Very impressed with people's detailed recall of what they were taught in school. I can't say with any confidence whether I was told about slavery or not, let alone in what context.

    That's because you weren't!
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,332
    I can report, however, that the oysters are merely ok. Posh Breton bivalves. Lacking sweetness. Nice size. Good with a dash of hot sauce but nothing spesh. Don’t bother with oysters in Seville

    That is my food broadcast for the day
  • MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594
    Leon said:

    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Omg these two pintxos


    On the left is a pile of baby eels - much prized slightly fake basque delicacy - with some vinegar and a curl of chili and white pepper in there? - on the night is cold brined artichoke and pine nuts on a sweetish pink salsa butter

    I mean Holy Fuck. Holy Hell

    Plus a generous glass of local Sevillean white






    MAGNIFICO. Spanish food is the best in the world right now

    Must be like being at home, elvers for a snack.
    The basques are OBSESSED with elvers. And this is a basque food stand (albeit from a Michelin star chef)

    The result is that real elvers are about £3m a kilo. My guess is these are the fake elvers made of real eels but sliced into tiny elvery shapes. There is an urban myth that Chinese workers are employed to paint tiny black eyes on each fake elver

    Blood great scran, any which way. Coming to a foodie part of Spain right now is like going to France four decades ago. The food is quite often on a different and higher level

    I like the way the Japanese do eels, smoked on a bed of rice (Unagi).
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,967
    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    Yes well London voted for Corbyn and is less monarchist than the UK overall
  • Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    Major Japanese newspaper reported MOD plans to buy UCAVs on a trial basis from 2023 and buy several hundred UCAVs, both foreign and domestic, after 2025.
    IAI and US made Kamikaze drone are candidates for the test introduction, as well as TB2 .

    https://mobile.twitter.com/GreatPoppo/status/1569880442219954176

    This is the new arms race.

    Yep, and the MBT, the champion of the battlefield since roughly 1917, is dead. Just over 100 years is a pretty good run mind you.

    The next step (a genuinely scary one) is when these drones or their successors have AI. At that point having humans on the battlefield is going to be next to suicidal.
    Not according to the Ukrainians. I’ll have to dig it out, but a serving Ukrainian officer precisely rebutted the “Tank is dead” thing, in a paper.

    As he saw it, tanks are doing more roles now than ever.

    The key is combined arms - without support tanks are dead meat. Which was also true at Cambrai in 1917.

    The Russians bizarre habit of sending single tanks, unsupported, out to star in Ukrainian YouTube videos is not how tanks were ever supposed to be used.
    I don't think that really rebuts the argument.
    Ukraine is fighting the Russian army, and most of their kit is as old as that used by the Russians. Which is in basically obsolete.
    And they have a comparative handful of military drones, plus a lot of cobbled together stuff - while the Russians have a fraction of that.

    Any battlefield in five or ten years' time is going to be a much less forgiving place for MBTs.
    The thing is, if you still need to move infantry soldiers from location A to location B, then you're still going to need armoured vehicles for them to travel in and you'll still need tanks to spearhead the movement of those armoured vehicles through defensive positions.

    Drones are going to make the battlefield a more dangerous place for tanks, just as a whole bunch of other things do, but the drones can't do what the tanks are doing on the battlefield.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840
    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    Yes well London voted for Corbyn and is less monarchist than the UK overall
    Oh, so the crowds are mostly from Epping then, not London?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072
    Alistair said:

    Nigelb said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    Major Japanese newspaper reported MOD plans to buy UCAVs on a trial basis from 2023 and buy several hundred UCAVs, both foreign and domestic, after 2025.
    IAI and US made Kamikaze drone are candidates for the test introduction, as well as TB2 .

    https://mobile.twitter.com/GreatPoppo/status/1569880442219954176

    This is the new arms race.

    Yep, and the MBT, the champion of the battlefield since roughly 1917, is dead. Just over 100 years is a pretty good run mind you.

    The next step (a genuinely scary one) is when these drones or their successors have AI. At that point having humans on the battlefield is going to be next to suicidal.
    Not according to the Ukrainians. I’ll have to dig it out, but a serving Ukrainian officer precisely rebutted the “Tank is dead” thing, in a paper.

    As he saw it, tanks are doing more roles now than ever.

    The key is combined arms - without support tanks are dead meat. Which was also true at Cambrai in 1917.

    The Russians bizarre habit of sending single tanks, unsupported, out to star in Ukrainian YouTube videos is not how tanks were ever supposed to be used.
    I don't think that really rebuts the argument.
    Ukraine is fighting the Russian army, and most of their kit is as old as that used by the Russians. Which is in basically obsolete.
    And they have a comparative handful of military drones, plus a lot of cobbled together stuff - while the Russians have a fraction of that.

    Any battlefield in five or ten years' time is going to be a much less forgiving place for MBTs.
    Any battlefield in 5-10 years is going to be a much less forgiving place for drones. This is currently the war of the drone because Russia has hee-haw to counter them. Drones are cheap and cheerful and fragile as fuck.

    Every tank is going to have an anti-drone package on top that will spot and stop any little dude flying overhead trying to drop iron bombs on them.
    Drones are indeed cheap, and mobile.
    In both cases vastly more so that an MBT. And vastly cheaper to iterate and develop for multiple roles.

    I don't fancy the chances of the MBT at all.
  • Leon said:

    Tanks driven by ACTUAL SOLDIERS are surely doomed. They are pointless, tragic deathtraps

    There will be a role for unmanned vehicles driven either entirely by AI or with the help of some guy in Swindon 3000 miles away sitting bored at a screen

    This is the future of war. Soldiers won’t die. Civilians will. At the hands of drones and ai machines

    Oh God, you're on your AI mastabatery again. There's a great trend amongst the stupid or credulous that "AI" (*) is the solution to any problem.

    It isn't. Take the above: the main purpose of a tank is to take ground off the enemy. To do that, you need infantry. They're an infantry support vehicle with an effing big gun designed to take out other infantry support vehicles with effing bug guns, hardpoints, or in Russia's case, civilian cars. They augment ground forces.

    In addition, tanks go wrong. Often. They need basic maintenance, from repairs to tracks to refuelling and rearming. Things the crew can do.

    There have been attempts at unmanned ground vehicles, but they haven't really got very far. As an example, Russia has had the Uran-9 for six years. So what are we not seeing them in Ukraine? Perhaps because they don't work very well...

    https://www.army-technology.com/projects/uran-9-unmanned-ground-combat-vehicle/

    (*) Usually a simple ML program written by a drunken undergraduate at the University of West Scotland.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,156
    edited September 2022
    This is amusing, and also true.

    "A former race adviser to Boris Johnson who is standing to be Conservative candidate for mayor of London has defended the role of diversity schemes, saying Liz Truss would not be prime minister had it not been for such a scheme."

    David Cameron's A-list , which Truss was on with Priti .
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,803
    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    What's the racial balance of those whise work commitments enable them to do this sort of thing? I would presume the retired - who are much whiter - are heavily represented.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,072
    You know your air dominance campaign is going poorly when 200+ days in, your opponent can still conduct air assault missions via rotary wing.

    “Lviv Paratroopers” presumably the 80th Air Assault Brigade (Ukraine) assaulting behind Russian lines across Kharkiv Oblast recently.

    https://twitter.com/CasualArtyFan/status/1570031629527121921
  • FossFoss Posts: 1,019
    Whoever planned that pan from George VI to the carriage did well.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    Afternoon all.


    IshmaelZ said:

    Just seen the Prince charles pengate thing.

    Seems an utterly human reaction at a very emotional and stressful time.

    Mum dead? Bully a servant. Absolutely natural.

    Then do it again 2 days later. No pattern here.
    Here's the clip. Where's the servant being bullied? I see none except in some over-vivid imaginations. It amounts to "this bloody pen".

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/09/13/charles-loses-his-temper-after-fountain-pen-leaks-on-his-finger-17368828/

    Losing your temper like that is shorthand for saying that someone has fucked up; except for John Cleese and the car people don't lose their temper with inanimate things. If you are the head honcho, the implication is that your inferior has fucked up in his duty to you. Doing it in public is a humiliation. Humiliating people is bullying them.

    look at the scowl in pengate 1 and tell me the recipient of it is not being bullied.
    King Charles snapping his leaking pen, or like Fawlty beating his non-starting Austin 1100 with a branch would confirm it is in the inanimate rather than the subservient that he is punishing.

    I suspect rather than being unhinged like Fawlty, Charles is just a bully.
    Since the very moment his mother died there has been a camera stuck up his nose. She was 96 and ill but those who have lost a parent will know that you can prepare for it all you want but when it happens it is a huge shock.

    At times just after my father died (expected but a huge shock...) there were many times I felt like picking up whatever was in front of me and throwing it through the window. The anger stage of grief I believe it's called, when you want all normal laws of everything to be suspended. But they aren't. You must carry on.

    And if you're King then you must carry on in the public gaze. Charles literally had a camera pointing up his nose. I feel better disposed towards him after seeing the incident

    My father always reacted like Charles to minor incumberances like the leaking pen. He too was pre- disposed to bullying those around him as a reaction. It is not a stress related lashing out due to grief, it is an innate character flaw.

    The Queen wouldn't have responded similarly.
    Did you see your father do it days after his mother died?

    Drawing a line from a very minor outburst of anger, grief, frustration directed to no one in particular, directly to being a bully is an extraordinary leap.
    Once again I can't speak for Charles, but in my own case the initial outburst would have been the precursor to blame apportionment. At the moment of the first loss of control one feels that sick pit in one's stomach before the inevitable secondary outburst which comes later.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,286

    GIN1138 said:

    Isn't this all a bit over the top for just moving the body from Buckingham Palace to Westminster?

    The funeral will feel like a damp squib if they're not careful.

    No. It is magnificent as all fuck.

    As will be the funeral.
    I mean it's a very impressive spectacle granted.... Makes you wonder what the funeral itself will be like doesn't it?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,158
    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    London is under 50% White British, it is not under 50% White.

    Unless Sky has some really amazing technology, you won't be able to tell if someone is from Manchester or Melbourne, Dulwich or Detroit, Peterborough or Prague.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,332

    Leon said:

    Tanks driven by ACTUAL SOLDIERS are surely doomed. They are pointless, tragic deathtraps

    There will be a role for unmanned vehicles driven either entirely by AI or with the help of some guy in Swindon 3000 miles away sitting bored at a screen

    This is the future of war. Soldiers won’t die. Civilians will. At the hands of drones and ai machines

    Oh God, you're on your AI mastabatery again. There's a great trend amongst the stupid or credulous that "AI" (*) is the solution to any problem.

    It isn't. Take the above: the main purpose of a tank is to take ground off the enemy. To do that, you need infantry. They're an infantry support vehicle with an effing big gun designed to take out other infantry support vehicles with effing bug guns, hardpoints, or in Russia's case, civilian cars. They augment ground forces.

    In addition, tanks go wrong. Often. They need basic maintenance, from repairs to tracks to refuelling and rearming. Things the crew can do.

    There have been attempts at unmanned ground vehicles, but they haven't really got very far. As an example, Russia has had the Uran-9 for six years. So what are we not seeing them in Ukraine? Perhaps because they don't work very well...

    https://www.army-technology.com/projects/uran-9-unmanned-ground-combat-vehicle/

    (*) Usually a simple ML program written by a drunken undergraduate at the University of West Scotland.
    Drones are taking over from planes. The same will happen in every theatre of war. It’s obvious to all but the terminally clueless
  • Cyclefree said:

    This procession down the Mall is very impressive. I know they rehearse like mad.

    But still, magnificent. A worthy honouring.

    And Princess Anne - what a trooper. The last few days cannot have been easy for her. For any of them really. But especially for her - an underrated Royal who has her mother's sense of duty and a no-nonsense feistiness. She really ought to be a Councillor of State.

    We are quite superb at pageant and this is being shown live across the globe which is a testament to the Queen who we will never see the like again

    And Princess Anne has been so devoted to her mother throughout and visibly moved on so many occasions
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727
    edited September 2022
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    Afternoon all.


    IshmaelZ said:

    Just seen the Prince charles pengate thing.

    Seems an utterly human reaction at a very emotional and stressful time.

    Mum dead? Bully a servant. Absolutely natural.

    Then do it again 2 days later. No pattern here.
    Here's the clip. Where's the servant being bullied? I see none except in some over-vivid imaginations. It amounts to "this bloody pen".

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/09/13/charles-loses-his-temper-after-fountain-pen-leaks-on-his-finger-17368828/

    Losing your temper like that is shorthand for saying that someone has fucked up; except for John Cleese and the car people don't lose their temper with inanimate things. If you are the head honcho, the implication is that your inferior has fucked up in his duty to you. Doing it in public is a humiliation. Humiliating people is bullying them.

    look at the scowl in pengate 1 and tell me the recipient of it is not being bullied.
    King Charles snapping his leaking pen, or like Fawlty beating his non-starting Austin 1100 with a branch would confirm it is in the inanimate rather than the subservient that he is punishing.

    I suspect rather than being unhinged like Fawlty, Charles is just a bully.
    Since the very moment his mother died there has been a camera stuck up his nose. She was 96 and ill but those who have lost a parent will know that you can prepare for it all you want but when it happens it is a huge shock.

    At times just after my father died (expected but a huge shock...) there were many times I felt like picking up whatever was in front of me and throwing it through the window. The anger stage of grief I believe it's called, when you want all normal laws of everything to be suspended. But they aren't. You must carry on.

    And if you're King then you must carry on in the public gaze. Charles literally had a camera pointing up his nose. I feel better disposed towards him after seeing the incident

    My father always reacted like Charles to minor incumberances like the leaking pen. He too was pre- disposed to bullying those around him as a reaction. It is not a stress related lashing out due to grief, it is an innate character flaw.

    The Queen wouldn't have responded similarly.
    Charles actually was bullied pretty brutally at Gordonstoun where his parents sent him.

    His staff however are paid to ensure he had things like pens in top condition, minor irritation if they failed to do what they are paid to do is hardly a problem
    Being the victim of bullying is a poor mitigation for the bully.

    Why should Charles's minnions spend their lives treading on eggshells? If as you say they are "paid" to satisfy his every whim or receive thunderous abuse for their failure, he does not demonstrate the "class" of his mother. That's all I'm saying.
    If they cannot even provide the King with a non leaking pen they are lucky not to be sacked never mind just a minor tut tut
    Parker Pens* might be getting the heave-ho when the Royal Warrants are reviewed :wink:

    *They hold a warrant, I don't know whether the offending item was a Parker, although one of ours did leak the other week. Unlike KCIII, my reaction wasn't to shove it into my wife's hand. Since the incident I have refused to employ any servants.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,360
    TOPPING said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    Afternoon all.


    IshmaelZ said:

    Just seen the Prince charles pengate thing.

    Seems an utterly human reaction at a very emotional and stressful time.

    Mum dead? Bully a servant. Absolutely natural.

    Then do it again 2 days later. No pattern here.
    Here's the clip. Where's the servant being bullied? I see none except in some over-vivid imaginations. It amounts to "this bloody pen".

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/09/13/charles-loses-his-temper-after-fountain-pen-leaks-on-his-finger-17368828/

    Losing your temper like that is shorthand for saying that someone has fucked up; except for John Cleese and the car people don't lose their temper with inanimate things. If you are the head honcho, the implication is that your inferior has fucked up in his duty to you. Doing it in public is a humiliation. Humiliating people is bullying them.

    look at the scowl in pengate 1 and tell me the recipient of it is not being bullied.
    King Charles snapping his leaking pen, or like Fawlty beating his non-starting Austin 1100 with a branch would confirm it is in the inanimate rather than the subservient that he is punishing.

    I suspect rather than being unhinged like Fawlty, Charles is just a bully.
    Since the very moment his mother died there has been a camera stuck up his nose. She was 96 and ill but those who have lost a parent will know that you can prepare for it all you want but when it happens it is a huge shock.

    At times just after my father died (expected but a huge shock...) there were many times I felt like picking up whatever was in front of me and throwing it through the window. The anger stage of grief I believe it's called, when you want all normal laws of everything to be suspended. But they aren't. You must carry on.

    And if you're King then you must carry on in the public gaze. Charles literally had a camera pointing up his nose. I feel better disposed towards him after seeing the incident.
    It falls into the category of very small beer.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840
    edited September 2022

    Leon said:

    Tanks driven by ACTUAL SOLDIERS are surely doomed. They are pointless, tragic deathtraps

    There will be a role for unmanned vehicles driven either entirely by AI or with the help of some guy in Swindon 3000 miles away sitting bored at a screen

    This is the future of war. Soldiers won’t die. Civilians will. At the hands of drones and ai machines

    Oh God, you're on your AI mastabatery again. There's a great trend amongst the stupid or credulous that "AI" (*) is the solution to any problem.

    It isn't. Take the above: the main purpose of a tank is to take ground off the enemy. To do that, you need infantry. They're an infantry support vehicle with an effing big gun designed to take out other infantry support vehicles with effing bug guns, hardpoints, or in Russia's case, civilian cars. They augment ground forces.

    In addition, tanks go wrong. Often. They need basic maintenance, from repairs to tracks to refuelling and rearming. Things the crew can do.

    There have been attempts at unmanned ground vehicles, but they haven't really got very far. As an example, Russia has had the Uran-9 for six years. So what are we not seeing them in Ukraine? Perhaps because they don't work very well...

    https://www.army-technology.com/projects/uran-9-unmanned-ground-combat-vehicle/

    (*) Usually a simple ML program written by a drunken undergraduate at the University of West Scotland.
    I wonder what it's like to be in a 3 person tank with automated loading carousel - a good 25% smaller crew for a more complicated vehicle than a 4 person tank with human loader. Must make the nightly maintenance, reload and cook/camp that much harder/longer to do, esp. if the commander is partly away on admin and orders.

    You'd need whole lorries or APCs full of grease jockeys to follow platoons of uncrewed tanks ...
  • Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    Yes well London voted for Corbyn and is less monarchist than the UK overall
    Oh, so the crowds are mostly from Epping then, not London?
    Epping is London Zone 6 :lol:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epping_tube_station
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,360

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    All the brown people they interview seem to be ardent monarchists!
    Everyone there is likely to be a fervent monarchist.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,360
    Leon said:

    Omg these two pintxos


    On the left is a pile of baby eels - much prized slightly fake basque delicacy - with some vinegar and a curl of chili and white pepper in there? - on the night is cold brined artichoke and pine nuts on a sweetish pink salsa butter

    I mean Holy Fuck. Holy Hell

    Plus a generous glass of local Sevillean white






    MAGNIFICO. Spanish food is the best in the world right now

    I'm going to Madrid, for the first time, in October, so I'll get to try it.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,332
    This parade looks incredibly powerful on an iPad in Seville




    I’m being sincere. It really does. That soft power thing again. London looks impossibly regal
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368

    Have to feel a bit sorry for those Guards with no medals to parade....

    Imagine how Harry will feel on Monday with all his close war hero relatives like Prince Edward regaled in their military finery.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,157
    GIN1138 said:

    Isn't this all a bit over the top for just moving the body from Buckingham Palace to Westminster?

    The funeral will feel like a damp squib if they're not careful.

    Not for me because that's all I'm going to watch live.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,360
    Cookie said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    What's the racial balance of those whise work commitments enable them to do this sort of thing? I would presume the retired - who are much whiter - are heavily represented.
    I'm not sure why the ethnic origin of the crowds is of much significance.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,786
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    Afternoon all.


    IshmaelZ said:

    Just seen the Prince charles pengate thing.

    Seems an utterly human reaction at a very emotional and stressful time.

    Mum dead? Bully a servant. Absolutely natural.

    Then do it again 2 days later. No pattern here.
    Here's the clip. Where's the servant being bullied? I see none except in some over-vivid imaginations. It amounts to "this bloody pen".

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/09/13/charles-loses-his-temper-after-fountain-pen-leaks-on-his-finger-17368828/

    Losing your temper like that is shorthand for saying that someone has fucked up; except for John Cleese and the car people don't lose their temper with inanimate things. If you are the head honcho, the implication is that your inferior has fucked up in his duty to you. Doing it in public is a humiliation. Humiliating people is bullying them.

    look at the scowl in pengate 1 and tell me the recipient of it is not being bullied.
    King Charles snapping his leaking pen, or like Fawlty beating his non-starting Austin 1100 with a branch would confirm it is in the inanimate rather than the subservient that he is punishing.

    I suspect rather than being unhinged like Fawlty, Charles is just a bully.
    Since the very moment his mother died there has been a camera stuck up his nose. She was 96 and ill but those who have lost a parent will know that you can prepare for it all you want but when it happens it is a huge shock.

    At times just after my father died (expected but a huge shock...) there were many times I felt like picking up whatever was in front of me and throwing it through the window. The anger stage of grief I believe it's called, when you want all normal laws of everything to be suspended. But they aren't. You must carry on.

    And if you're King then you must carry on in the public gaze. Charles literally had a camera pointing up his nose. I feel better disposed towards him after seeing the incident

    My father always reacted like Charles to minor incumberances like the leaking pen. He too was pre- disposed to bullying those around him as a reaction. It is not a stress related lashing out due to grief, it is an innate character flaw.

    The Queen wouldn't have responded similarly.
    Charles actually was bullied pretty brutally at Gordonstoun where his parents sent him.

    His staff however are paid to ensure he had things like pens in top condition, minor irritation if they failed to do what they are paid to do is hardly a problem
    Being the victim of bullying is a poor mitigation for the bully.

    Why should Charles's minnions spend their lives treading on eggshells? If as you say they are "paid" to satisfy his every whim or receive thunderous abuse for their failure, he does not demonstrate the "class" of his mother. That's all I'm saying.
    If they cannot even provide the King with a non leaking pen they are lucky not to be sacked never mind just a minor tut tut
    It wasn't a minor tut tut. Their reaction was as if they were in fear of him, which is not a good look.. It really didn't look good at all.

    I have been impressed with the entire organisation of the all the events. The only negatives have been his two hissy fits which were embarassing
  • Leon said:

    This parade looks incredibly powerful on an iPad in Seville




    I’m being sincere. It really does. That soft power thing again. London looks impossibly regal

    Did you use your keyboard as your napkin?
  • Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Tanks driven by ACTUAL SOLDIERS are surely doomed. They are pointless, tragic deathtraps

    There will be a role for unmanned vehicles driven either entirely by AI or with the help of some guy in Swindon 3000 miles away sitting bored at a screen

    This is the future of war. Soldiers won’t die. Civilians will. At the hands of drones and ai machines

    Oh God, you're on your AI mastabatery again. There's a great trend amongst the stupid or credulous that "AI" (*) is the solution to any problem.

    It isn't. Take the above: the main purpose of a tank is to take ground off the enemy. To do that, you need infantry. They're an infantry support vehicle with an effing big gun designed to take out other infantry support vehicles with effing bug guns, hardpoints, or in Russia's case, civilian cars. They augment ground forces.

    In addition, tanks go wrong. Often. They need basic maintenance, from repairs to tracks to refuelling and rearming. Things the crew can do.

    There have been attempts at unmanned ground vehicles, but they haven't really got very far. As an example, Russia has had the Uran-9 for six years. So what are we not seeing them in Ukraine? Perhaps because they don't work very well...

    https://www.army-technology.com/projects/uran-9-unmanned-ground-combat-vehicle/

    (*) Usually a simple ML program written by a drunken undergraduate at the University of West Scotland.
    I wonder what it's like to be in a 3 person tank with automated loading carousel - a good 25% smaller crew for a more complicated vehicle than a 4 person tank with human loader. Must make the nightly maintenance, reload and cook/camp that much harder/longer to do, esp. if the commander is partly away on admin and orders.

    You'd need whole lorries or APCs full of grease jockeys to follow platoons of uncrewed tanks ...
    Apparently the Russian autoloaders are a good way to end up with people with only three fingers. Looking at videos of the autoloaders being used, I'm not surprised. Quite vicious mechanisms...
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,360

    Leon said:

    This parade looks incredibly powerful on an iPad in Seville




    I’m being sincere. It really does. That soft power thing again. London looks impossibly regal

    Like a Seville Orange Parade?
    Stephen Milligan turned out to be a real orangeman.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,967

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    Yes well London voted for Corbyn and is less monarchist than the UK overall
    Oh, so the crowds are mostly from Epping then, not London?
    Epping is London Zone 6 :lol:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epping_tube_station
    Epping is Essex not London
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,332
    A lot of crying people there
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,863
    Cyclefree said:

    This procession down the Mall is very impressive. I know they rehearse like mad.

    But still, magnificent. A worthy honouring.

    And Princess Anne - what a trooper. The last few days cannot have been easy for her. For any of them really. But especially for her - an underrated Royal who has her mother's sense of duty and a no-nonsense feistiness. She really ought to be a Councillor of State.

    CNN making the point that women aren’t normally allowed to march in these parades; the rest are in the cars following behind
  • kinabalu said:

    Very impressed with people's detailed recall of what they were taught in school. I can't say with any confidence whether I was told about slavery or not, let alone in what context.

    I do remember my school days vividly. I can tell you pretty much what the individual topics were for everyone of my 'O' and 'A' levels.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,332

    Leon said:

    This parade looks incredibly powerful on an iPad in Seville




    I’m being sincere. It really does. That soft power thing again. London looks impossibly regal

    Did you use your keyboard as your napkin?
    Basically yeah. I’m amazed this iPad survives the many places I take it. It’s a genuine credit to Apple tech
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,157

    kinabalu said:

    Very impressed with people's detailed recall of what they were taught in school. I can't say with any confidence whether I was told about slavery or not, let alone in what context.

    That's because you weren't!
    Could be the answer yes. I seem to have drawn most of my teenage history from tv drama. I Claudius for ancient Rome. Roots for slavery. Can't recall school contributing.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,156
    edited September 2022
    rcs1000 said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    London is under 50% White British, it is not under 50% White.

    Unless Sky has some really amazing technology, you won't be able to tell if someone is from Manchester or Melbourne, Dulwich or Detroit, Peterborough or Prague.
    I always find that actually quite recent and misguided census category, "White British" as if one depended on the other, very odd, and potentially, actually disastrously divisive.

    "British" is a recent civic category, only used since 1707, and hasn't made sense as any sort of meaningfully ethnic category for about 1300 years. It should be "White English/Scottish/Welsh/Northern Irish/Cornish".

    London and the big cities in England have quite a lot of both white and brown people who consider themselves British rather than English, which is their perfect right and fine.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,967
    edited September 2022
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    Yes well London voted for Corbyn and is less monarchist than the UK overall
    Oh, so the crowds are mostly from Epping then, not London?
    Only 51% of Londoners are monarchists compared to 64% of the UK as a whole and 71% in the South outside London
    https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2022/09/13/how-have-britons-reacted-queen-elizabeth-iis-death.

    Islington London snobs think the monarchy is an out of date relic
  • IanB2 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    This procession down the Mall is very impressive. I know they rehearse like mad.

    But still, magnificent. A worthy honouring.

    And Princess Anne - what a trooper. The last few days cannot have been easy for her. For any of them really. But especially for her - an underrated Royal who has her mother's sense of duty and a no-nonsense feistiness. She really ought to be a Councillor of State.

    CNN making the point that women aren’t normally allowed to march in these parades; the rest are in the cars following behind
    #Everyday-ishSexism
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,486
    King Charles is going to be bloody apoplectic when he realises they didn’t put the coffin on the gun carriage straight.
  • Leon said:

    Leon said:

    This parade looks incredibly powerful on an iPad in Seville




    I’m being sincere. It really does. That soft power thing again. London looks impossibly regal

    Did you use your keyboard as your napkin?
    Basically yeah. I’m amazed this iPad survives the many places I take it. It’s a genuine credit to Apple tech
    I'm a big Apple fan
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,158
    edited September 2022
    Monarchies will - I suspect - eventually die.

    Not in my lifetime, or my childrens, or probably the next couple of hundred years.

    But I do see only one way traffic. Monarchies become Republics after the elevation of a terrible King or Queen, or a revolution, or a war, or independence, or the severing of colonial ties.

    Republics - except, I guess the Socialist pseudo Republics like North Korea - don't pick out some random person and say, "hey, you and your descendants get to be heads of State."

    It's a bit sad. And a bit inevitable.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,332
    Feargal Keane is brilliantly saying nothing

    “The time honoured sound of people stepping, by left and by right, and over head the birds, traditionally flying with their wings. As the sun shines, and then shines some more”
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Sean_F said:

    Cookie said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    What's the racial balance of those whise work commitments enable them to do this sort of thing? I would presume the retired - who are much whiter - are heavily represented.
    I'm not sure why the ethnic origin of the crowds is of much significance.
    It's a mildly interesting test of the unity of the nation given that HMQ is probably meant to be the thing that unites us most, after of course the NHS.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840

    Carnyx said:

    Leon said:

    Tanks driven by ACTUAL SOLDIERS are surely doomed. They are pointless, tragic deathtraps

    There will be a role for unmanned vehicles driven either entirely by AI or with the help of some guy in Swindon 3000 miles away sitting bored at a screen

    This is the future of war. Soldiers won’t die. Civilians will. At the hands of drones and ai machines

    Oh God, you're on your AI mastabatery again. There's a great trend amongst the stupid or credulous that "AI" (*) is the solution to any problem.

    It isn't. Take the above: the main purpose of a tank is to take ground off the enemy. To do that, you need infantry. They're an infantry support vehicle with an effing big gun designed to take out other infantry support vehicles with effing bug guns, hardpoints, or in Russia's case, civilian cars. They augment ground forces.

    In addition, tanks go wrong. Often. They need basic maintenance, from repairs to tracks to refuelling and rearming. Things the crew can do.

    There have been attempts at unmanned ground vehicles, but they haven't really got very far. As an example, Russia has had the Uran-9 for six years. So what are we not seeing them in Ukraine? Perhaps because they don't work very well...

    https://www.army-technology.com/projects/uran-9-unmanned-ground-combat-vehicle/

    (*) Usually a simple ML program written by a drunken undergraduate at the University of West Scotland.
    I wonder what it's like to be in a 3 person tank with automated loading carousel - a good 25% smaller crew for a more complicated vehicle than a 4 person tank with human loader. Must make the nightly maintenance, reload and cook/camp that much harder/longer to do, esp. if the commander is partly away on admin and orders.

    You'd need whole lorries or APCs full of grease jockeys to follow platoons of uncrewed tanks ...
    Apparently the Russian autoloaders are a good way to end up with people with only three fingers. Looking at videos of the autoloaders being used, I'm not surprised. Quite vicious mechanisms...
    To be fair all tanks are, in their ways - I read an reminiscence of a Chieftain tank crewman who put his mug of char momentarily on the breech of the 120mm cannon, then took his hand away. A split second later the [gun elevation] stabiliser suddenly actuated and slammed the breech up against the turret roof armour, leaving the mug pressure-joined to the roof, and very, very flat. .
  • HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    Yes well London voted for Corbyn and is less monarchist than the UK overall
    Oh, so the crowds are mostly from Epping then, not London?
    Epping is London Zone 6 :lol:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epping_tube_station
    Epping is Essex not London
    London Underground Zone 6, NOT "Essex Underground".
  • HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    Yes well London voted for Corbyn and is less monarchist than the UK overall
    Oh, so the crowds are mostly from Epping then, not London?
    Epping is London Zone 6 :lol:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epping_tube_station
    Epping is Essex not London
    When London declares its independence we are claiming Epping Forest. Epping itself can be no mans land.
  • I could pop over and see you on the Central Line HYUFD
  • Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Tanks driven by ACTUAL SOLDIERS are surely doomed. They are pointless, tragic deathtraps

    There will be a role for unmanned vehicles driven either entirely by AI or with the help of some guy in Swindon 3000 miles away sitting bored at a screen

    This is the future of war. Soldiers won’t die. Civilians will. At the hands of drones and ai machines

    Oh God, you're on your AI mastabatery again. There's a great trend amongst the stupid or credulous that "AI" (*) is the solution to any problem.

    It isn't. Take the above: the main purpose of a tank is to take ground off the enemy. To do that, you need infantry. They're an infantry support vehicle with an effing big gun designed to take out other infantry support vehicles with effing bug guns, hardpoints, or in Russia's case, civilian cars. They augment ground forces.

    In addition, tanks go wrong. Often. They need basic maintenance, from repairs to tracks to refuelling and rearming. Things the crew can do.

    There have been attempts at unmanned ground vehicles, but they haven't really got very far. As an example, Russia has had the Uran-9 for six years. So what are we not seeing them in Ukraine? Perhaps because they don't work very well...

    https://www.army-technology.com/projects/uran-9-unmanned-ground-combat-vehicle/

    (*) Usually a simple ML program written by a drunken undergraduate at the University of West Scotland.
    Drones are taking over from planes. The same will happen in every theatre of war. It’s obvious to all but the terminally clueless
    You are Duncan Sandys and I demand my five-pound note.

    (As you won't know, Duncan Sandys was the Minister of Defence who scrapped loads of the UK's plane projects in favour of missiles and unmanned systems, which were 'obviously' better. That was in 1957. We still have manned planes 65 years later.)
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,157
    Leon said:

    Tanks driven by ACTUAL SOLDIERS are surely doomed. They are pointless, tragic deathtraps

    There will be a role for unmanned vehicles driven either entirely by AI or with the help of some guy in Swindon 3000 miles away sitting bored at a screen

    This is the future of war. Soldiers won’t die. Civilians will. At the hands of drones and ai machines

    Hopefully after seeing Russia's ROI for this absurd undertaking the future of war will be severely compromised.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,360
    rcs1000 said:

    Monarchies will - I suspect - eventually die.

    Not in my lifetime, or my childrens, or probably the next couple of hundred years.

    But I do see only one way traffic. Monarchies become Republics after the elevation of a terrible King or Queen, or a revolution, or a war, or independence, or the severing of colonial ties.

    Republics - except, I guess the Socialist pseudo Republics like North Korea - don't pick out some random person and say, "hey, you and your descendants get to be heads of State."

    It's a bit sad. And a bit inevitable.

    OTOH, there will always be monarchies that call themselves republics.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,863
    edited September 2022

    Leon said:

    This parade looks incredibly powerful on an iPad in Seville




    I’m being sincere. It really does. That soft power thing again. London looks impossibly regal

    Did you use your keyboard as your napkin?
    He has at least and at last realised that while he’s talking about his mid-morning boozy meal, everyone else is talking about the rather more significant event that’s on TV
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,332
    IshmaelZ said:

    Sean_F said:

    Cookie said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    HYUFD said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    The UK is still 87% white
    That crowd is 98%. And London is under 50%.
    What's the racial balance of those whise work commitments enable them to do this sort of thing? I would presume the retired - who are much whiter - are heavily represented.
    I'm not sure why the ethnic origin of the crowds is of much significance.
    It's a mildly interesting test of the unity of the nation given that HMQ is probably meant to be the thing that unites us most, after of course the NHS.

    I believe you are wrong, factually, and that royalism is quite evenly divided by race in the UK

    Remember a lot of migrants come to the UK because they feel it is a stable safe place, and that image of continuing safety is closely attached to long-continuing royalty
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,103
    IanB2 said:

    kjh said:

    The dog has just eaten my pineapple (1/2 a pineapple actually).

    This is an outrage of some sort, that's somehow similar to how the Italians feel about pineapple pizza.
    Yesterday I had the option of a pizza with macaroni on it. I think pineapple might be better than that? (Pineapple was also an option)
    The greatest thing about pizza is its versatility, screw the traditionalists.
  • paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,507
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Very impressed with people's detailed recall of what they were taught in school. I can't say with any confidence whether I was told about slavery or not, let alone in what context.

    That's because you weren't!
    Could be the answer yes. I seem to have drawn most of my teenage history from tv drama. I Claudius for ancient Rome. Roots for slavery. Can't recall school contributing.
    I think we've found how we can cut the education budget.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,157
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MattW said:

    Afternoon all.


    IshmaelZ said:

    Just seen the Prince charles pengate thing.

    Seems an utterly human reaction at a very emotional and stressful time.

    Mum dead? Bully a servant. Absolutely natural.

    Then do it again 2 days later. No pattern here.
    Here's the clip. Where's the servant being bullied? I see none except in some over-vivid imaginations. It amounts to "this bloody pen".

    https://metro.co.uk/2022/09/13/charles-loses-his-temper-after-fountain-pen-leaks-on-his-finger-17368828/

    Losing your temper like that is shorthand for saying that someone has fucked up; except for John Cleese and the car people don't lose their temper with inanimate things. If you are the head honcho, the implication is that your inferior has fucked up in his duty to you. Doing it in public is a humiliation. Humiliating people is bullying them.

    look at the scowl in pengate 1 and tell me the recipient of it is not being bullied.
    King Charles snapping his leaking pen, or like Fawlty beating his non-starting Austin 1100 with a branch would confirm it is in the inanimate rather than the subservient that he is punishing.

    I suspect rather than being unhinged like Fawlty, Charles is just a bully.
    Since the very moment his mother died there has been a camera stuck up his nose. She was 96 and ill but those who have lost a parent will know that you can prepare for it all you want but when it happens it is a huge shock.

    At times just after my father died (expected but a huge shock...) there were many times I felt like picking up whatever was in front of me and throwing it through the window. The anger stage of grief I believe it's called, when you want all normal laws of everything to be suspended. But they aren't. You must carry on.

    And if you're King then you must carry on in the public gaze. Charles literally had a camera pointing up his nose. I feel better disposed towards him after seeing the incident

    My father always reacted like Charles to minor incumberances like the leaking pen. He too was pre- disposed to bullying those around him as a reaction. It is not a stress related lashing out due to grief, it is an innate character flaw.

    The Queen wouldn't have responded similarly.
    Charles actually was bullied pretty brutally at Gordonstoun where his parents sent him.

    His staff however are paid to ensure he had things like pens in top condition, minor irritation if they failed to do what they are paid to do is hardly a problem
    Being the victim of bullying is a poor mitigation for the bully.

    Why should Charles's minnions spend their lives treading on eggshells? If as you say they are "paid" to satisfy his every whim or receive thunderous abuse for their failure, he does not demonstrate the "class" of his mother. That's all I'm saying.
    If they cannot even provide the King with a non leaking pen they are lucky not to be sacked never mind just a minor tut tut
    Damn thing spurted all over the place. Went everywhere but on the page.
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    Cyclefree said:

    This procession down the Mall is very impressive. I know they rehearse like mad.

    But still, magnificent. A worthy honouring.

    And Princess Anne - what a trooper. The last few days cannot have been easy for her. For any of them really. But especially for her - an underrated Royal who has her mother's sense of duty and a no-nonsense feistiness. She really ought to be a Councillor of State.

    Shame she wasn't the firstborn. She would have been an outstanding monarch.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727

    I could pop over and see you on the Central Line HYUFD

    Central? I suspect you'd miss each other. You'd be to his left, he'd be to your right.

    (Although, bizarrely enough, that would imply that you'd both be headed in the same direction)
  • kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Tanks driven by ACTUAL SOLDIERS are surely doomed. They are pointless, tragic deathtraps

    There will be a role for unmanned vehicles driven either entirely by AI or with the help of some guy in Swindon 3000 miles away sitting bored at a screen

    This is the future of war. Soldiers won’t die. Civilians will. At the hands of drones and ai machines

    Hopefully after seeing Russia's ROI for this absurd undertaking the future of war will be severely compromised.
    I've been saying that from the beginning of this sad venture. Russia losing is the best way to dissuade other belligerent nations that, however good they think their militaries are, attacking warfare nowadays is a risky business. And even if you do conquer a territory, keeping it is another matter (see Afghanistan).

    I can imagine China sees many potential advantages in the current situation. But I bet it's made them a little more concerned over trying to take Taiwan.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,360
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Tanks driven by ACTUAL SOLDIERS are surely doomed. They are pointless, tragic deathtraps

    There will be a role for unmanned vehicles driven either entirely by AI or with the help of some guy in Swindon 3000 miles away sitting bored at a screen

    This is the future of war. Soldiers won’t die. Civilians will. At the hands of drones and ai machines

    Hopefully after seeing Russia's ROI for this absurd undertaking the future of war will be severely compromised.
    It's surprising how few wars of aggression have actually succeeded, since 1940.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    edited September 2022
    ...
    Leon said:

    Feargal Keane is brilliantly saying nothing

    “The time honoured sound of people stepping, by left and by right, and over head the birds, traditionally flying with their wings. As the sun shines, and then shines some more”

    Bloody Feinians!
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,332
    Sean_F said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Monarchies will - I suspect - eventually die.

    Not in my lifetime, or my childrens, or probably the next couple of hundred years.

    But I do see only one way traffic. Monarchies become Republics after the elevation of a terrible King or Queen, or a revolution, or a war, or independence, or the severing of colonial ties.

    Republics - except, I guess the Socialist pseudo Republics like North Korea - don't pick out some random person and say, "hey, you and your descendants get to be heads of State."

    It's a bit sad. And a bit inevitable.

    OTOH, there will always be monarchies that call themselves republics.
    M


    Spain is a striking counter example to @rcs1000’s thesis. A successful prosperous democracy which deliberately became a monarchy again. And it has worked despite the old king being a sordid old fuck

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,103
    IshmaelZ said:

    Very white crowd. Sky finding the odd brown person but I think they are looking for them.

    Isnt 85% of the country white? Woukdnt we expect a very white crowd?

    I may need a % estimate before I draw conclusions.
This discussion has been closed.