Best Of

What if…. Tommy Robinson is a political genius?

He's not.

That was my assumption until yesterday

But yesterday he managed - and it is mainly him - to get 300,000 people (my honest estimate) to march through London. Even if it was only the “110,000” that the Met claim (with dubious precision) it’s an extraordinary achievement. He’s not long out of prison


I do wonder if he has some innate genius for this. A proper working class demagogue with real skill, operating on a level we don’t always appreciate. We haven’t seen someone like this in Britain… ever? It’s a type we’ve only seen in other countries

Note that this is not some fanboi nonsense. Hitler and Goebbels were, to my mind, political geniuses

The big crowds didn't turn up for Tommeh, they turned up because they feel as though their (our) culture is under attack from the establishment and protesting is the only way to show that they won't be silenced by Starmer and his band of human rights lawyers. What started with a few people putting up flags and councils trying to take them down turned into a new nationalist/patriotic movement. I don't see that Robinson had very much to do with it.

If anything it's Nige that's the political genius, not Robinson. He's successfully harnessed these disparate movements into 34% of voting intention.

I think what's really done it recently is all of the free speech censorship, dismissal of rape and sexual abuse by asylum seekers and illegal immigrants by the state until they were forced to address it by protestors, the hotels and continued boat arrivals. But really, the first I think it what has really turned this from an anti-immigration movement into a much wider one, it's captured a lot more middle of the road people who are fed up of the censorship and being told that what they think is wrong by people who are now cheering on the death of Charlie Kirk.

As always, it's hypocrisy that voters really hate more than anything else. I don't think Robinson has really done anything on that front, the left and hard left who have lectured the world about how "being kind" is important are now dancing on the grave of a political opponent and using wokeness to censor speech is backfiring on them. Robinson just happens to be one of the more visible people on the other side. I'd say Nige has been much more important in bringing together the alliance that has added up to 34% of VI than Robinson.

I disagree. Tommy R organised this and was the driving force. I bet there were tens of thousands in the march, as you say, who actively dislike him. Yet he’s managed to harness them, as well

He is an absolute classic demagogue of the old school European tradition, right down to the history of street fighting and the criminal record. I can’t think of an equivalent in British history, all the comparisons are continental European. There are elements of Mussolini, elements of Hitler, a bit of Jean Marie Le Pen

Farage is gifted in a different way

Did the BUF not have a history of street violence following on from deliberately provocative street marches, and an aim to use it as a recruiting tool?

(Compare eg with the flag hangers hanging England flags outside Mosques, or various far right Youtubers doing public showing outside hotels used for housing asylum seekers for several years eg Alan Leggett.)

They did do that but they were never remotely as successful as Tommy R is now, in terms of capturing the zeitgeist and exploiting it

Which is my basic point. We used to piously believe Britain was immune to this kind of angry right wing populism, but such is the misgovernance of the country - by both main parties - that is no longer true

It occurs to me that Tommy is important for another reason, too. He shifts the Overton Window far to the right. When he can get Elon to talk to 300k marchers in London, then he does a very good job of making Farage look like a moderate on the centre right. Which can only aid Reform

Yes this is perceptive. Farage wouldn’t have looked out of place in a Thatcher Cabinet or as one of Major’s bar stewards. But for many years we’ve been fed the nonsense that he is “far right” or that other short hand for the wrong sort - “populist”. A characterisation that is quickly being erased.

I think he knows exactly what he’s doing electorally. Elon saw Farage’s public reticence to go hard on his core issues as “weak sauce”. But it just seems like careful political strategy far out from an election to me. Whether he’ll run an effective government is quite another question, but he’s nailing the long campaign.

From my own experience I think you are right. On PB I am probably one of the least in favour of mass immigration, and don't mind admitting I think Enoch Powell had it right. But a lot, I would say most of my friends are to the right of me on this, and the kind of people I know but aren't close friends with, are further to the right still. When I hear their views, or see their social media posts more precisely, I recoil a bit, yet don't feel that when I listen to Farage. Some are saying that he is a sell out though, I think that is madness

I think pb is really unrepresentative on this topic to be honest. It’s increasingly hard to find anyone that doesn’t think this country has gone stark raving mad in recent years with immigration. I even had a Labour Party official admit to me recently that they would be absolutely fine with a policy of net negative migration.

Andy Burnham's an interesting one. Quite the ideological chameleon imo. Clearly ambitious.
He'd sound like a Northerner which might be helpful against Farage. But not seen much of a program for what he'd do differently.

I thought he was weak during the Brown Government but he has reinvented himself in Manchester. He says the right things at the right time. He leads in the event of catastrophe and his comms are very good. I still don't like him but he is far less wooden than Starmer and would be quite content to call Farage to account.

"less wooden than Starmer". I mean, talk about low bars. We are in limbo territory here.

The bar is getting so low, even Warwick Davis is thinking he might struggle to limbo it.

I remember when the bar was lowered to he might have had a personality bypass, but he is honest and at least he appears to be vaguely competent.

In fact he is just a more boring form of liar without many signs of knowing what he is doing. He does always have a tidy desk though, as nothing ever f##king crosses it.

I've mentioned the two theories that have are plausible.

1) He never wanted to be an MP, the window for him becoming an MP was quite narrow so he didn't have much time to fully think it through, from retiring as DPP to deciding to stand.

and

2) Once he decided to become an MP his ambition was to be Attorney-General or Lord Chancellor but events (Corbyn and Brexit) saw him become leader.

Nobody expected him to become PM after the 2024 election given where Labour were starting from. Had Boris Johnson not had violated lockdown rules/lied about putting a sexual predator in a position of authority Boris Johnson might still be PM today/Tories still in power.

This is quite interesting. It lines up with others’ earlier analysis that even the sharp end of the spear as regards immigration concerns, will probably end up breaking for Farage rather than Advance or whatever they will go by at the next election.

https://x.com/konstantinkisin/status/1967249658146865494?s=46

Since people are asking, I went to the Unite the Kingdom rally to film interviews with people on the ground as well as Tommy and other speakers backstage. I have been to pro-Palestine, pro-Israel, climate protests etc so have a good sense of the rally in context of other events. Our film will be out soon.

My thoughts:

- The police estimate for attendance (110k) seems like a massive undercount and organiser claim of "millions" is an exaggeration. I would guess 400-600k.

- I saw no violence in the main area of the rally. Scuffles seem to have broken out on a side street away from the main protest (opposite Horse Guard) where due to large numbers of people attending many people who wanted to see the rally could not. I did not see the actual altercation but did see riot police slowly and very professionally moving back the protestors and then collecting a few dozen bottles that had clearly been thrown at them.

- Were the people in attendance "far right"? We should define "far right" which to me would be a racist party with neo-Nazi sympathies like the BNP. I obviously didn't speak to every single person there but I, a well known immigrant with Jewish ancestry, found it a challenge to walk through the crowd with dozens of people draped in England flags stopping to shake my hand and thank me for being there. I had absolutely no trouble being there and did not feel unsafe at any point. Both on stage and in the audience were many, many people of different races and colours. The day ended with a black choir signing Jerusalem.

- Among the speakers, there certainly were a few people who represent fringe parties of the European right. For someone like me who always thought a fake hatred of the French was a key part of British identity it was finny being at a patriotic British event where a speech was delivered in French by a politician (Eric Zemmour) in French. There were also speeches from the AfD, Vox and others. My sense overall was that some of the people on stage were probably far closer to being fringe rightists than those attending.

- Like every other protest I've attended, asking people what specifically they wanted to achieve did not typically produce substantive answers beyond "The politicians need to listen to the people", "We've had enough" etc. If I had to sum up the drivers of people attending, based on my conversations I would say that people's concerns centre around illegal immigration, censorship of speech and failures of integration.

Our film will be out today or tomorrow so you'll be able to watch and judge for yourself.

What if…. Tommy Robinson is a political genius?

He's not.

That was my assumption until yesterday

But yesterday he managed - and it is mainly him - to get 300,000 people (my honest estimate) to march through London. Even if it was only the “110,000” that the Met claim (with dubious precision) it’s an extraordinary achievement. He’s not long out of prison


I do wonder if he has some innate genius for this. A proper working class demagogue with real skill, operating on a level we don’t always appreciate. We haven’t seen someone like this in Britain… ever? It’s a type we’ve only seen in other countries

Note that this is not some fanboi nonsense. Hitler and Goebbels were, to my mind, political geniuses

The big crowds didn't turn up for Tommeh, they turned up because they feel as though their (our) culture is under attack from the establishment and protesting is the only way to show that they won't be silenced by Starmer and his band of human rights lawyers. What started with a few people putting up flags and councils trying to take them down turned into a new nationalist/patriotic movement. I don't see that Robinson had very much to do with it.

If anything it's Nige that's the political genius, not Robinson. He's successfully harnessed these disparate movements into 34% of voting intention.

I think what's really done it recently is all of the free speech censorship, dismissal of rape and sexual abuse by asylum seekers and illegal immigrants by the state until they were forced to address it by protestors, the hotels and continued boat arrivals. But really, the first I think it what has really turned this from an anti-immigration movement into a much wider one, it's captured a lot more middle of the road people who are fed up of the censorship and being told that what they think is wrong by people who are now cheering on the death of Charlie Kirk.

As always, it's hypocrisy that voters really hate more than anything else. I don't think Robinson has really done anything on that front, the left and hard left who have lectured the world about how "being kind" is important are now dancing on the grave of a political opponent and using wokeness to censor speech is backfiring on them. Robinson just happens to be one of the more visible people on the other side. I'd say Nige has been much more important in bringing together the alliance that has added up to 34% of VI than Robinson.

I disagree. Tommy R organised this and was the driving force. I bet there were tens of thousands in the march, as you say, who actively dislike him. Yet he’s managed to harness them, as well

He is an absolute classic demagogue of the old school European tradition, right down to the history of street fighting and the criminal record. I can’t think of an equivalent in British history, all the comparisons are continental European. There are elements of Mussolini, elements of Hitler, a bit of Jean Marie Le Pen

Farage is gifted in a different way

Did the BUF not have a history of street violence following on from deliberately provocative street marches, and an aim to use it as a recruiting tool?

(Compare eg with the flag hangers hanging England flags outside Mosques, or various far right Youtubers doing public showing outside hotels used for housing asylum seekers for several years eg Alan Leggett.)

They did do that but they were never remotely as successful as Tommy R is now, in terms of capturing the zeitgeist and exploiting it

Which is my basic point. We used to piously believe Britain was immune to this kind of angry right wing populism, but such is the misgovernance of the country - by both main parties - that is no longer true

It occurs to me that Tommy is important for another reason, too. He shifts the Overton Window far to the right. When he can get Elon to talk to 300k marchers in London, then he does a very good job of making Farage look like a moderate on the centre right. Which can only aid Reform

Yes this is perceptive. Farage wouldn’t have looked out of place in a Thatcher Cabinet or as one of Major’s bar stewards. But for many years we’ve been fed the nonsense that he is “far right” or that other short hand for the wrong sort - “populist”. A characterisation that is quickly being erased.

I think he knows exactly what he’s doing electorally. Elon saw Farage’s public reticence to go hard on his core issues as “weak sauce”. But it just seems like careful political strategy far out from an election to me. Whether he’ll run an effective government is quite another question, but he’s nailing the long campaign.

From my own experience I think you are right. On PB I am probably one of the least in favour of mass immigration, and don't mind admitting I think Enoch Powell had it right. But a lot, I would say most of my friends are to the right of me on this, and the kind of people I know but aren't close friends with, are further to the right still. When I hear their views, or see their social media posts more precisely, I recoil a bit, yet don't feel that when I listen to Farage. Some are saying that he is a sell out though, I think that is madness

I think the danger for Nige is that someone like Katie Lam will become Tory leader, someone without any stink of the Boris era and completely outflank him on immigration with ILR revocation and a manifesto commitment to reach net emigration by the end of the term. She has shades of Mrs Thatcher about her IMO. It's a shame that Boris and Liz Truss left behind such a toxic legacy for the current lot to clear.

A curtailed career at Goldmans to become a spad before the age of 30. She’s the last thing this country needs right now.

A career at Goldmans makes her the perfect candidate, one thing that they instill in their people is a unflinching view of reality. Or at least that's been my experience of working with them, they're consistently the first ones to point out the flaws in a plan/policy and able to read a situation faster than others. I don't know if that still holds currently but it was definitely the case 10 or so years ago when I started my financial career and worked with a few Goldman alumni who were senior to me. Read what she's said and written about low wage immigration, how she's dissected the situation and proposed short and long term measures to bring it back down to earth.

My point more is that she has insufficient life experience. Had she done a decent shift at GS and then something outside of politics maybe. But this hurry to get to CCHQ no longer impresses me.

To make VP in six years is a decent shift IMO and you're going to hate this but to make VP in six years as a woman at GS is in itself an extremely impressive achievement, especially during the time she was coming up when banking and finance generally mocked the idea of DEI initiatives and it was basically individual performance and backstabbing that got promotions.

More than anything else she represents a complete break from the Boris and Truss era of the Tories rather than someone like Kemi or Jenrick who sat at the table rubber stamping all the poor decisions on spending and immigration under Boris.

What if…. Tommy Robinson is a political genius?

He's not.

That was my assumption until yesterday

But yesterday he managed - and it is mainly him - to get 300,000 people (my honest estimate) to march through London. Even if it was only the “110,000” that the Met claim (with dubious precision) it’s an extraordinary achievement. He’s not long out of prison


I do wonder if he has some innate genius for this. A proper working class demagogue with real skill, operating on a level we don’t always appreciate. We haven’t seen someone like this in Britain… ever? It’s a type we’ve only seen in other countries

Note that this is not some fanboi nonsense. Hitler and Goebbels were, to my mind, political geniuses

The big crowds didn't turn up for Tommeh, they turned up because they feel as though their (our) culture is under attack from the establishment and protesting is the only way to show that they won't be silenced by Starmer and his band of human rights lawyers. What started with a few people putting up flags and councils trying to take them down turned into a new nationalist/patriotic movement. I don't see that Robinson had very much to do with it.

If anything it's Nige that's the political genius, not Robinson. He's successfully harnessed these disparate movements into 34% of voting intention.

I think what's really done it recently is all of the free speech censorship, dismissal of rape and sexual abuse by asylum seekers and illegal immigrants by the state until they were forced to address it by protestors, the hotels and continued boat arrivals. But really, the first I think it what has really turned this from an anti-immigration movement into a much wider one, it's captured a lot more middle of the road people who are fed up of the censorship and being told that what they think is wrong by people who are now cheering on the death of Charlie Kirk.

As always, it's hypocrisy that voters really hate more than anything else. I don't think Robinson has really done anything on that front, the left and hard left who have lectured the world about how "being kind" is important are now dancing on the grave of a political opponent and using wokeness to censor speech is backfiring on them. Robinson just happens to be one of the more visible people on the other side. I'd say Nige has been much more important in bringing together the alliance that has added up to 34% of VI than Robinson.

I disagree. Tommy R organised this and was the driving force. I bet there were tens of thousands in the march, as you say, who actively dislike him. Yet he’s managed to harness them, as well

He is an absolute classic demagogue of the old school European tradition, right down to the history of street fighting and the criminal record. I can’t think of an equivalent in British history, all the comparisons are continental European. There are elements of Mussolini, elements of Hitler, a bit of Jean Marie Le Pen

Farage is gifted in a different way

Did the BUF not have a history of street violence following on from deliberately provocative street marches, and an aim to use it as a recruiting tool?

(Compare eg with the flag hangers hanging England flags outside Mosques, or various far right Youtubers doing public showing outside hotels used for housing asylum seekers for several years eg Alan Leggett.)

They did do that but they were never remotely as successful as Tommy R is now, in terms of capturing the zeitgeist and exploiting it

Which is my basic point. We used to piously believe Britain was immune to this kind of angry right wing populism, but such is the misgovernance of the country - by both main parties - that is no longer true

It occurs to me that Tommy is important for another reason, too. He shifts the Overton Window far to the right. When he can get Elon to talk to 300k marchers in London, then he does a very good job of making Farage look like a moderate on the centre right. Which can only aid Reform

Yes this is perceptive. Farage wouldn’t have looked out of place in a Thatcher Cabinet or as one of Major’s bar stewards. But for many years we’ve been fed the nonsense that he is “far right” or that other short hand for the wrong sort - “populist”. A characterisation that is quickly being erased.

I think he knows exactly what he’s doing electorally. Elon saw Farage’s public reticence to go hard on his core issues as “weak sauce”. But it just seems like careful political strategy far out from an election to me. Whether he’ll run an effective government is quite another question, but he’s nailing the long campaign.

From my own experience I think you are right. On PB I am probably one of the least in favour of mass immigration, and don't mind admitting I think Enoch Powell had it right. But a lot, I would say most of my friends are to the right of me on this, and the kind of people I know but aren't close friends with, are further to the right still. When I hear their views, or see their social media posts more precisely, I recoil a bit, yet don't feel that when I listen to Farage. Some are saying that he is a sell out though, I think that is madness

I think the danger for Nige is that someone like Katie Lam will become Tory leader, someone without any stink of the Boris era and completely outflank him on immigration with ILR revocation and a manifesto commitment to reach net emigration by the end of the term. She has shades of Mrs Thatcher about her IMO. It's a shame that Boris and Liz Truss left behind such a toxic legacy for the current lot to clear.

A curtailed career at Goldmans to become a spad before the age of 30. She’s the last thing this country needs right now.

A career at Goldmans makes her the perfect candidate, one thing that they instill in their people is a unflinching view of reality. Or at least that's been my experience of working with them, they're consistently the first ones to point out the flaws in a plan/policy and able to read a situation faster than others. I don't know if that still holds currently but it was definitely the case 10 or so years ago when I started my financial career and worked with a few Goldman alumni who were senior to me. Read what she's said and written about low wage immigration, how she's dissected the situation and proposed short and long term measures to bring it back down to earth.

What if…. Tommy Robinson is a political genius?

He's not.

That was my assumption until yesterday

But yesterday he managed - and it is mainly him - to get 300,000 people (my honest estimate) to march through London. Even if it was only the “110,000” that the Met claim (with dubious precision) it’s an extraordinary achievement. He’s not long out of prison


I do wonder if he has some innate genius for this. A proper working class demagogue with real skill, operating on a level we don’t always appreciate. We haven’t seen someone like this in Britain… ever? It’s a type we’ve only seen in other countries

Note that this is not some fanboi nonsense. Hitler and Goebbels were, to my mind, political geniuses

The big crowds didn't turn up for Tommeh, they turned up because they feel as though their (our) culture is under attack from the establishment and protesting is the only way to show that they won't be silenced by Starmer and his band of human rights lawyers. What started with a few people putting up flags and councils trying to take them down turned into a new nationalist/patriotic movement. I don't see that Robinson had very much to do with it.

If anything it's Nige that's the political genius, not Robinson. He's successfully harnessed these disparate movements into 34% of voting intention.

I think what's really done it recently is all of the free speech censorship, dismissal of rape and sexual abuse by asylum seekers and illegal immigrants by the state until they were forced to address it by protestors, the hotels and continued boat arrivals. But really, the first I think it what has really turned this from an anti-immigration movement into a much wider one, it's captured a lot more middle of the road people who are fed up of the censorship and being told that what they think is wrong by people who are now cheering on the death of Charlie Kirk.

As always, it's hypocrisy that voters really hate more than anything else. I don't think Robinson has really done anything on that front, the left and hard left who have lectured the world about how "being kind" is important are now dancing on the grave of a political opponent and using wokeness to censor speech is backfiring on them. Robinson just happens to be one of the more visible people on the other side. I'd say Nige has been much more important in bringing together the alliance that has added up to 34% of VI than Robinson.

I disagree. Tommy R organised this and was the driving force. I bet there were tens of thousands in the march, as you say, who actively dislike him. Yet he’s managed to harness them, as well

He is an absolute classic demagogue of the old school European tradition, right down to the history of street fighting and the criminal record. I can’t think of an equivalent in British history, all the comparisons are continental European. There are elements of Mussolini, elements of Hitler, a bit of Jean Marie Le Pen

Farage is gifted in a different way

Did the BUF not have a history of street violence following on from deliberately provocative street marches, and an aim to use it as a recruiting tool?

(Compare eg with the flag hangers hanging England flags outside Mosques, or various far right Youtubers doing public showing outside hotels used for housing asylum seekers for several years eg Alan Leggett.)

They did do that but they were never remotely as successful as Tommy R is now, in terms of capturing the zeitgeist and exploiting it

Which is my basic point. We used to piously believe Britain was immune to this kind of angry right wing populism, but such is the misgovernance of the country - by both main parties - that is no longer true

It occurs to me that Tommy is important for another reason, too. He shifts the Overton Window far to the right. When he can get Elon to talk to 300k marchers in London, then he does a very good job of making Farage look like a moderate on the centre right. Which can only aid Reform

Yes this is perceptive. Farage wouldn’t have looked out of place in a Thatcher Cabinet or as one of Major’s bar stewards. But for many years we’ve been fed the nonsense that he is “far right” or that other short hand for the wrong sort - “populist”. A characterisation that is quickly being erased.

I think he knows exactly what he’s doing electorally. Elon saw Farage’s public reticence to go hard on his core issues as “weak sauce”. But it just seems like careful political strategy far out from an election to me. Whether he’ll run an effective government is quite another question, but he’s nailing the long campaign.

From my own experience I think you are right. On PB I am probably one of the least in favour of mass immigration, and don't mind admitting I think Enoch Powell had it right. But a lot, I would say most of my friends are to the right of me on this, and the kind of people I know but aren't close friends with, are further to the right still. When I hear their views, or see their social media posts more precisely, I recoil a bit, yet don't feel that when I listen to Farage. Some are saying that he is a sell out though, I think that is madness

I think the danger for Nige is that someone like Katie Lam will become Tory leader, someone without any stink of the Boris era and completely outflank him on immigration with ILR revocation and a manifesto commitment to reach net emigration by the end of the term. She has shades of Mrs Thatcher about her IMO. It's a shame that Boris and Liz Truss left behind such a toxic legacy for the current lot to clear.

A curtailed career at Goldmans to become a spad before the age of 30. She’s the last thing this country needs right now.

A career at Goldmans makes her the perfect candidate, one thing that they instill in their people is a unflinching view of reality. Or at least that's been my experience of working with them, they're consistently the first ones to point out the flaws in a plan/policy and able to read a situation faster than others. I don't know if that still holds currently but it was definitely the case 10 or so years ago when I started my financial career and worked with a few Goldman alumni who were senior to me. Read what she's said and written about low wage immigration, how she's dissected the situation and proposed short and long term measures to bring it back down to earth.

My point more is that she has insufficient life experience. Had she done a decent shift at GS and then something outside of politics maybe. But this hurry to get to CCHQ no longer impresses me.

To make VP in six years is a decent shift IMO and you're going to hate this but to make VP in six years as a woman at GS is in itself an extremely impressive achievement, especially during the time she was coming up when banking and finance generally mocked the idea of DEI initiatives and it was basically individual performance and backstabbing that got promotions.

More than anything else she represents a complete break from the Boris and Truss era of the Tories rather than someone like Kemi or Jenrick who sat at the table rubber stamping all the poor decisions on spending and immigration under Boris.

Her problem is that she was a SPAD during the last government, I am told her fingerprints are all over the OSA and the Boriswave.

Jeez I can’t believe I ate that

Nor can I ! I hope you made sure you mushed the maggots and they were dead before you swallowed it .

I’ve no idea. I kind of closed my eyes and prayed

I turned down a second helping

Would you drink Kopi Luwak/civet coffee?

I have, IIRC

Ugh, you sick fuck.

You literally drank shit.

Tenants?

Wouldn’t be totally surprised by rentiers drinking liquidised tenants. Still not as bad as drinking Tennents.