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54% for rejoin is hardly a big margin for rejoining the EU especially with that vote split amongst Labour, the LDs and Greens. The 62% for having a closer relationship with the EU without rejoining it, the Single Market or Customs Union is a more supported position and also hence it is the position of Starmer

52 plays 48 is good enough, or so I am told.

Technically it isn't, MPs rejected Brexit for 3 years after 2016 and the 2017 general election produced a hung parliament so may could not deliver it. Only Boris' landslide Conservative majority at the 2019 general election delivered Brexit, not the referendum itself

If only Nick Timothy hadn't persuaded Mrs May to call an election.

It would have probably played out in much the same way. BoJo would still have been an MP and an oppotunistic shit, and a sufficient number of Conservative MPs would have followed him in demanding a more distant relationship than whatever May proposed.

The double lock- getting a majority in the Commons and also in the Conservative party- was a bit of a bugger. (And without the second of those, TMthePM gets VONC'd faster than you can say "vassal state".) The Johnson/Cummings solution, cut off the soft-Brexit voters from the Conservatives and then win a big majority in an election, was quite possibly the only thing that could work. Shame it led to a Brexit model that was so dysfunctional that it has already needed a couple of applications of gaffer tape.

The public may be less keen when they see what concessions the EU wants in return.

Stop talking the UK down.

It’ll be the easiest deal in history, the EU needs more than we need them.

TSE still bitter, ten years on...

Leave 52%

Remain 48%

[runs and hides!]

That doesn't really help.

Makes me feel better....

The Leave vote was without doubt my biggest political disappointment.

All but 25 of my 64 years have been Tory Governments, but each election disappointment "could" be rectified within five years. The Farage smoke and mirrors fiasco was for life.

It's entirely the wrong attitude to lock something in for the long-term against the wishes of British electorate.

That's the principle for which many of us voted Leave in the first place.

Be honest, what has it achieved?

Regulatory freedom, trading freedom, immigration freedom, political freedom and accountability to our own people for the decisions our government takes.

Why would you want to give that up?

Security

Which it never delivered.

The fact that's fractured at present is entirely down to our own government failing to fund our defence and security properly.

The public may be less keen when they see what concessions the EU wants in return.

Stop talking the UK down.

It’ll be the easiest deal in history, the EU needs more than we need them.

TSE still bitter, ten years on...

Leave 52%

Remain 48%

[runs and hides!]

That doesn't really help.

Makes me feel better....

The Leave vote was without doubt my biggest political disappointment.

All but 25 of my 64 years have been Tory Governments, but each election disappointment "could" be rectified within five years. The Farage smoke and mirrors fiasco was for life.

It's entirely the wrong attitude to lock something in for the long-term against the wishes of British electorate.

That's the principle for which many of us voted Leave in the first place.

Why were you lot kicking back against the Harold Wilson Referendum in '75 for the next 40 years against the wishes of the UK electorate?

Anyway it's been ten years now. If it is a once in a generation vote, by my watch we can have another in 2032.

must mean new independence one due very very soon

If Scotland wants a new vote they should have it. Given they keep voting for Sindy parties the question won't go away, even if the gov can legally ignore it.

Both Starmer and Farage have made clear they will refuse indyref2, certainly for a decade, so it won't happen whatever happens in May

Farage isnt really relevant. He has 8 MPs.

And yet is presented as the natural leader of the British right - until Kemi can claw back enough support and attention to make him be treated closer to the number of MPs he has, he will be relevant.

54% for rejoin is hardly a big margin for rejoining the EU especially with that vote split amongst Labour, the LDs and Greens. The 62% for having a closer relationship with the EU without rejoining it, the Single Market or Customs Union is a more supported position and also hence it is the position of Starmer

52 plays 48 is good enough, or so I am told.

Technically it isn't, MPs rejected Brexit for 3 years after 2016 and the 2017 general election produced a hung parliament so may could not deliver it. Only Boris' landslide Conservative majority at the 2019 general election delivered Brexit, not the referendum itself

And our current pious PM ran in 2017 on a pledge to implement the referendum result, spent two years as Shadow Brexit Secretary blocking every deal, then demanded a second go at it

The public may be less keen when they see what concessions the EU wants in return.

Stop talking the UK down.

It’ll be the easiest deal in history, the EU needs more than we need them.

TSE still bitter, ten years on...

Leave 52%

Remain 48%

[runs and hides!]

That doesn't really help.

Makes me feel better....

The Leave vote was without doubt my biggest political disappointment.

All but 25 of my 64 years have been Tory Governments, but each election disappointment "could" be rectified within five years. The Farage smoke and mirrors fiasco was for life.

Me too. Felt sick. My top 5 sickeners in order of nausea intensity as below:

1. Trump2
2. 1992 Con win
3. Brexit
4. 2015 Con win
5. Trump1

Why did you have so much hate for John Major?

I didn't. But I'd had tory government my whole adult life and was sick of it. It looked like it was finally over and then - belly punch - it wasn't. It felt like a one party state, like they'd never go. I mean, if not now, when? So that was dark. Plus I was working on a city trading floor surrounded by wankers celebrating. Felt so alone.

BREAKING

I can report that Whitstable is rather charming, in the mild spring sunshine. In a gritty, authentic English coastal way

We holidayed there in 2022. Had a bad oyster.

Well, I’ve just ordered nine rocks and natives at the Royal Whitstable Oyster Company, so I’m hoping you’re wrong!

It’s a really pleasant gaff, like a really good oyster bar in Brittany mixed with a Cornish gastropub. But in Kent

I might come to Whitstable more often

I'm from Whitstable, well the nearby village of Blean anyway, and am typing this from the family beach hut just past the Hotel Continental over on Tankerton Slopes. I'd give you directions and offer you a beer but I guess I'm in at least the bottom 3 of PBers you'd want to meet in person.

In case of interest, you're next door to where I lost my virginity, back of the Whitstable umbrella, in May 1990. Good times

Should we petition for a blue plaque to be erected there to commemorate the happy event?

The public may be less keen when they see what concessions the EU wants in return.

Stop talking the UK down.

It’ll be the easiest deal in history, the EU needs more than we need them.

TSE still bitter, ten years on...

Leave 52%

Remain 48%

[runs and hides!]

That doesn't really help.

Makes me feel better....

The Leave vote was without doubt my biggest political disappointment.

All but 25 of my 64 years have been Tory Governments, but each election disappointment "could" be rectified within five years. The Farage smoke and mirrors fiasco was for life.

It's entirely the wrong attitude to lock something in for the long-term against the wishes of British electorate.

That's the principle for which many of us voted Leave in the first place.

I agree - I never understood why people got so upset at Cameron for holding the referendum, and the fact Leave won entirely vindicated his policy.

But by the same token we should probably be thinking about another referendum. 20 point gap at the moment - I think at 30 points (and 15 year wait. so 2030 onward), you'd have to support another referendum to avoid being a hypocrite.

Or, we could all agree full EU membership wasn't (and never will be) the right model for British involvement in European politics in the long-term, and find a hybrid that would instead.

Then, we'd have peace.

Sure.

But would you vote against another referendum on those terms? 2030s, re-join consistently showing 30-point leads?

There are no circumstances under which I'd accept rejoining the EU.

You need to accept that, and that you can't bounce the country into it.

That doesn't make sense. If you are right the Wilson vote should have been the last Referendum on EU membership. I'll concede a vote on Maastricht if you like. A vote Major would have won.

There was over 40 years after Wilson's vote until the next one.

What this is about for you is finding a ripe time to hold your referendum so you can "win" it and then use it to silence any further dissent for decades, by which you think the country would be so unrecognisable that it'd never be the same again. Which is why we'd fight you tooth and nail.

Do you think we're stupid?

You voted for Brexit thinking it would achieve anything positive, so... yes.