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Morris_Dancer
Posts: 62,450
Mr. B, aye.
"Let's make a far left nutcase PM. What could possibly go wrong?"
.....
Kudos to the Lib Dems for not going along with this madness.2 -
williamglenn
Posts: 54,681
Parliament wouldn't be dissolved immediately after the motion to approve an early election, so if the PM just banked the power to call one but decided to wait, parliament could still remove him.Chris said:
What do you mean about being VONCed? Once the date had been fixed it would be out of parliament's hands.williamglenn said:
Agreed, but there would be an immense political cost to naming a date and then postponing it after the vote. Plus the government could simply be VoNCed if they did that.Chris said:
Unfortunately, there's no mechanism for the Commons to stipulate the date of the election, so a 2/3 vote for an election would in fact and in law give him the power to choose the date.williamglenn said:
To be fair, May announced the date of the 8th of June before the vote in parliament. There's no chance Johnson could get a 2/3rds majority to give him a blank cheque to name a date afterwards.Chris said:
Such a motion - specifying a date - would have no effect under the FTPA. The motion has to be simply "That there shall be an early parliamentary general election."MikeSmithson said:
But he would have to get this through the Commons with 433 MPs voting for. That is far from certain given that this would look lie a device to avoid the CommonsGIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10.
This date is opportune for two reasons. First, Parliament would dissolve by law on September 5. This immediately eliminates the threat of MPs taking control of parliamentary time, keeping the exit date of October 31 intact.
Second, this election date comes a week before the EU Council summit. If his gamble pays off and he were to win a majority, the PM would have the strong negotiating position required to obtain a new deal. If the EU still refuses to budge, the Government could spend the final weeks passing relevant no-deal legislation to minimise disruption before Britain leaves the EU."
If we laymen are aware of the terms of the FTPA, why isn't Mr Alexander Pelling-Bruce of the Spectator? Do they not allow him Internet access at work for some reason?0 -
TGOHF
Posts: 21,633
Jezza as PM is a bigger disaster than leaving a trading cartel. And Swinson is savvy enough to realise that supporting this toxic IRA and Iran supporting old Marxist is the road to hell for the LDs.
0 -
ReggieCide
Posts: 4,312
Corbyn didn't write to everyone asking them to playGardenwalker said:Fair play to Corbyn.
He is evil and I hate him, but only the Lib Dem’s have actually told him to go do one.0 -
Nigelb
Posts: 76,381
Interesting - Warren leads in Wisconsin poll:
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign-polls/457548-warren-leads-field-by-5-points-in-wisconsin-poll
True, it comes very late in the primary cycle, but that is nonetheless a significant result, assuming it's not a rogue poll.
Also a key swing state.0 -
ReggieCide
Posts: 4,312
And Remainer MPs voted thrice to make it happenChris said:
How typical of Brexiteers to claim a mandate for No Deal on the basis that - even though they were all lying through their teeth during the referendum campaign - Philip Hammond was truthfully warning people of the very danger we're all facing now!Gardenwalker said:
I was told that was Project FEAR so I dismissed it upon the guidance of Bojo and Banks.ReggieCide said:No mandate for no deal as it was never raised as a possibility pre referendum?
https://youtu.be/zy3fPPuR9_00 -
Nigelb
Posts: 76,381
I was quite amused by that piece of sophistry, too.Chris said:
How typical of Brexiteers to claim a mandate for No Deal on the basis that - even though they were all lying through their teeth during the referendum campaign - Philip Hammond was truthfully warning people of the very danger we're all facing now!Gardenwalker said:
I was told that was Project FEAR so I dismissed it upon the guidance of Bojo and Banks.ReggieCide said:No mandate for no deal as it was never raised as a possibility pre referendum?
https://youtu.be/zy3fPPuR9_00 -
Chris
Posts: 11,899
What do you mean about being VONCed? Once the date had been fixed it would be out of parliament's hands.williamglenn said:
Agreed, but there would be an immense political cost to naming a date and then postponing it after the vote. Plus the government could simply be VoNCed if they did that.Chris said:
Unfortunately, there's no mechanism for the Commons to stipulate the date of the election, so a 2/3 vote for an election would in fact and in law give him the power to choose the date.williamglenn said:
To be fair, May announced the date of the 8th of June before the vote in parliament. There's no chance Johnson could get a 2/3rds majority to give him a blank cheque to name a date afterwards.Chris said:
Such a motion - specifying a date - would have no effect under the FTPA. The motion has to be simply "That there shall be an early parliamentary general election."MikeSmithson said:
But he would have to get this through the Commons with 433 MPs voting for. That is far from certain given that this would look lie a device to avoid the CommonsGIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10.
This date is opportune for two reasons. First, Parliament would dissolve by law on September 5. This immediately eliminates the threat of MPs taking control of parliamentary time, keeping the exit date of October 31 intact.
Second, this election date comes a week before the EU Council summit. If his gamble pays off and he were to win a majority, the PM would have the strong negotiating position required to obtain a new deal. If the EU still refuses to budge, the Government could spend the final weeks passing relevant no-deal legislation to minimise disruption before Britain leaves the EU."
If we laymen are aware of the terms of the FTPA, why isn't Mr Alexander Pelling-Bruce of the Spectator? Do they not allow him Internet access at work for some reason?0 -
Gardenwalker
Posts: 22,182
Fair play to Corbyn.
He is evil and I hate him, but only the Lib Dem’s have actually told him to go do one.0 -
Chris
Posts: 11,899
How typical of Brexiteers to claim a mandate for No Deal on the basis that - even though they were all lying through their teeth during the referendum campaign - Philip Hammond was truthfully warning people of the very danger we're all facing now!Gardenwalker said:
I was told that was Project FEAR so I dismissed it upon the guidance of Bojo and Banks.ReggieCide said:No mandate for no deal as it was never raised as a possibility pre referendum?
https://youtu.be/zy3fPPuR9_00 -
bigjohnowls
Posts: 22,924
Owen Jones reckons Chuka wouldn't let her.Yorkcity said:
Agreed.bigjohnowls said:
Bollox to stopping BrexitYorkcity said:
Swinson needs to think again.With some in her own party, the SNP, Greens,conservatives willing to consider Corbyn's proposal to stop no deal.She is trashing the stop no deal brand.TheScreamingEagles said:
Not quite the same attraction with voters methinks.
If May when PM could bring herself and the government to discuss a deal with Corbyn and Labour, for weeks.
Why can't Swinson ?
Weak weak weak if true.0 -
Gardenwalker
Posts: 22,182
So quick to rage and abuse, Tyndall.Richard_Tyndall said:
Because like you he is a liar and utterly untrustworthy.Gardenwalker said:
Corbyn is suggesting a soft Brexit and a deal so why won’t you get behind him?Richard_Tyndall said:Unfortunatly this article perpetuates the myth thst the aim of an extension is to prevent No Deal. It is not. It is to allow Remainers more time to try and reverse the Brexit vote. My preferencecwss for a deal and a soft Brexit. But given the antics of Remainers over the past three years I have run out of patience and will accept whatever sort of Brexit we can get.
Did someone take a dump in your archaeology pit?0 -
Currystardog
Posts: 110
Maybe cause he voted against such a deal three times.Gardenwalker said:
Corbyn is suggesting a soft Brexit and a deal so why won’t you get behind him?Richard_Tyndall said:Unfortunatly this article perpetuates the myth thst the aim of an extension is to prevent No Deal. It is not. It is to allow Remainers more time to try and reverse the Brexit vote. My preferencecwss for a deal and a soft Brexit. But given the antics of Remainers over the past three years I have run out of patience and will accept whatever sort of Brexit we can get.
0 -
williamglenn
Posts: 54,681
Agreed, but there would be an immense political cost to naming a date and then postponing it after the vote. Plus the government could simply be VoNCed if they did that.Chris said:
Unfortunately, there's no mechanism for the Commons to stipulate the date of the election, so a 2/3 vote for an election would in fact and in law give him the power to choose the date.williamglenn said:
To be fair, May announced the date of the 8th of June before the vote in parliament. There's no chance Johnson could get a 2/3rds majority to give him a blank cheque to name a date afterwards.Chris said:
Such a motion - specifying a date - would have no effect under the FTPA. The motion has to be simply "That there shall be an early parliamentary general election."MikeSmithson said:
But he would have to get this through the Commons with 433 MPs voting for. That is far from certain given that this would look lie a device to avoid the CommonsGIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10.
This date is opportune for two reasons. First, Parliament would dissolve by law on September 5. This immediately eliminates the threat of MPs taking control of parliamentary time, keeping the exit date of October 31 intact.
Second, this election date comes a week before the EU Council summit. If his gamble pays off and he were to win a majority, the PM would have the strong negotiating position required to obtain a new deal. If the EU still refuses to budge, the Government could spend the final weeks passing relevant no-deal legislation to minimise disruption before Britain leaves the EU."
If we laymen are aware of the terms of the FTPA, why isn't Mr Alexander Pelling-Bruce of the Spectator? Do they not allow him Internet access at work for some reason?0 -
Richard_Tyndall
Posts: 33,243
Because like you he is a liar and utterly untrustworthy.Gardenwalker said:
Corbyn is suggesting a soft Brexit and a deal so why won’t you get behind him?Richard_Tyndall said:Unfortunatly this article perpetuates the myth thst the aim of an extension is to prevent No Deal. It is not. It is to allow Remainers more time to try and reverse the Brexit vote. My preferencecwss for a deal and a soft Brexit. But given the antics of Remainers over the past three years I have run out of patience and will accept whatever sort of Brexit we can get.
0 -
ReggieCide
Posts: 4,312
Who said this, and when?Scott_P said:
It was explicitly disavowed by the Brexiteers.ReggieCide said:No mandate for no deal as it was never raised as a possibility pre referendum?
They said it would not happen.0 -
Alanbrooke
Posts: 25,778
GE forecast from one of the less used sources
https://sluggerotoole.com/2019/08/15/what-would-happen-at-ge2019-if-it-is-more-like-the-2019-european-election-than-the-last-general-election/0 -
ReggieCide
Posts: 4,312
I hadn't realised that you were that gullible (I don't really think you are)Gardenwalker said:
I was told that was Project FEAR so I dismissed it upon the guidance of Bojo and Banks.ReggieCide said:No mandate for no deal as it was never raised as a possibility pre referendum?
https://youtu.be/zy3fPPuR9_00 -
Scott_P
Posts: 51,453
Apparently you had to believe the Brexiteers and vote for Brexit, while also believing that it would be a No Deal shitshow despite what they saidGardenwalker said:I was told that was Project FEAR so I dismissed it upon the guidance of Bojo and Banks.
0 -
Gardenwalker
Posts: 22,182
I was told that was Project FEAR so I dismissed it upon the guidance of Bojo and Banks.ReggieCide said:No mandate for no deal as it was never raised as a possibility pre referendum?
https://youtu.be/zy3fPPuR9_00 -
Scott_P
Posts: 51,453
It was explicitly disavowed by the Brexiteers.ReggieCide said:No mandate for no deal as it was never raised as a possibility pre referendum?
They said it would not happen.0 -
Chris
Posts: 11,899
Unfortunately, there's no mechanism for the Commons to stipulate the date of the election, so a 2/3 vote for an election would in fact and in law give him the power to choose the date.williamglenn said:
To be fair, May announced the date of the 8th of June before the vote in parliament. There's no chance Johnson could get a 2/3rds majority to give him a blank cheque to name a date afterwards.Chris said:
Such a motion - specifying a date - would have no effect under the FTPA. The motion has to be simply "That there shall be an early parliamentary general election."MikeSmithson said:
But he would have to get this through the Commons with 433 MPs voting for. That is far from certain given that this would look lie a device to avoid the CommonsGIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10.
This date is opportune for two reasons. First, Parliament would dissolve by law on September 5. This immediately eliminates the threat of MPs taking control of parliamentary time, keeping the exit date of October 31 intact.
Second, this election date comes a week before the EU Council summit. If his gamble pays off and he were to win a majority, the PM would have the strong negotiating position required to obtain a new deal. If the EU still refuses to budge, the Government could spend the final weeks passing relevant no-deal legislation to minimise disruption before Britain leaves the EU."
If we laymen are aware of the terms of the FTPA, why isn't Mr Alexander Pelling-Bruce of the Spectator? Do they not allow him Internet access at work for some reason?1 -
Yorkcity
Posts: 4,382
Agreed.bigjohnowls said:
Bollox to stopping BrexitYorkcity said:
Swinson needs to think again.With some in her own party, the SNP, Greens,conservatives willing to consider Corbyn's proposal to stop no deal.She is trashing the stop no deal brand.TheScreamingEagles said:
Not quite the same attraction with voters methinks.
If May when PM could bring herself and the government to discuss a deal with Corbyn and Labour, for weeks.
Why can't Swinson ?
0 -
rpjs
Posts: 3,787
Uh-oh https://www.cnbc.com/2019/08/15/ge-shares-drop-after-madoff-whistleblower-harry-markopolos-raises-red-flags-on-its-accounting.html
Claims "bigger fraud than Enron"0 -
ReggieCide
Posts: 4,312
No mandate for no deal as it was never raised as a possibility pre referendum?
https://youtu.be/zy3fPPuR9_0
0 -
Gardenwalker
Posts: 22,182
Corbyn is suggesting a soft Brexit and a deal so why won’t you get behind him?Richard_Tyndall said:Unfortunatly this article perpetuates the myth thst the aim of an extension is to prevent No Deal. It is not. It is to allow Remainers more time to try and reverse the Brexit vote. My preferencecwss for a deal and a soft Brexit. But given the antics of Remainers over the past three years I have run out of patience and will accept whatever sort of Brexit we can get.
0 -
Chris
Posts: 11,899
I'm not paranoid. I just don't think anyone in their right mind would trust him an inch.GIN1138 said:
Before Boris presents the bill to Parliament he will almost certainly make a speech in Downing St. naming 10th October as the day of the election (he will probably do the courtesy of informing the Queen as well I'd think)Chris said:
He's announced he wants to prevent a No Deal Brexit.Beibheirli_C said:
Why? Has Corbyn announced that he does not believe he can win?Chris said:
Maybe you haven't been following the news this time?Beibheirli_C said:
Labour were compliant enough last time. They agreed in a heartbeat.Chris said:
Which would require a 2/3 majority! Has the author read the FTPA?GIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10. ...
Under the Fixed Term Parliaments Act there is no mechanism for the Commons to vote for an election on a specified date, as suggested above. The wording of the motion is dictated by the Act - "That there shall be an early parliamentary general election".
The date of the election, if such a motion were passed, would be in the gift of the prime minister. If people weren't aware of that trap before Dominic Cummings started his vapourings, they are now. Except for the employees of the Spectator, apparently.
Now after doing all that he could do an about turn and make the election for 1st November once the bill is passed but of course he wouldn't in practice...
When the Prime Minister tells the general public we'll have an election on 10th October he's not going to go back on that.
You seem somewhat paranoid about Boris if I may say so?
0 -
williamglenn
Posts: 54,681
To be fair, May announced the date of the 8th of June before the vote in parliament. There's no chance Johnson could get a 2/3rds majority to give him a blank cheque to name a date afterwards.Chris said:
Such a motion - specifying a date - would have no effect under the FTPA. The motion has to be simply "That there shall be an early parliamentary general election."MikeSmithson said:
But he would have to get this through the Commons with 433 MPs voting for. That is far from certain given that this would look lie a device to avoid the CommonsGIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10.
This date is opportune for two reasons. First, Parliament would dissolve by law on September 5. This immediately eliminates the threat of MPs taking control of parliamentary time, keeping the exit date of October 31 intact.
Second, this election date comes a week before the EU Council summit. If his gamble pays off and he were to win a majority, the PM would have the strong negotiating position required to obtain a new deal. If the EU still refuses to budge, the Government could spend the final weeks passing relevant no-deal legislation to minimise disruption before Britain leaves the EU."
If we laymen are aware of the terms of the FTPA, why isn't Mr Alexander Pelling-Bruce of the Spectator? Do they not allow him Internet access at work for some reason?0 -
Recidivist
Posts: 4,679
Rejoiners and people who change the subject.TGOHF said:So what are the 2 groups going to be after we leave on 31/10 ?
Rejoiners
Stay outers ?0 -
Theuniondivvie
Posts: 43,203
And the jury's still out as to whether Stalin wanted to defeat Hitler until the very real possibility of Hitler defeating him. I'd accept that Corbyn & co are still in a 'Brexit an opportunity rather than a threat' phase, but that may change.david_herdson said:
Britain didn't work with him then!Theuniondivvie said:
Och, I don't know, 1939-41 could be described as a period of Corbynite constructive ambiguity.williamglenn said:
The difference between working with Stalin to defeat Hitler and working with Corbyn to stop No Deal is that Stalin wanted to defeat Hitler.TheScreamingEagles said:
Well if you get triggered by a Soviet flag then wait until see what a former Tory leader did with the Soviets.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. kinabalu, you can explain whatever you please. It doesn't justify a senior politician marching below the banner of mass murderers.
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bigjohnowls
Posts: 22,924
Chuka splinter group in LDs when Swinson caves ro the pressure to back Corbyn.0
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bigjohnowls
Posts: 22,924
Bollox to stopping BrexitYorkcity said:
Swinson needs to think again.With some in her own party, the SNP, Greens,conservatives willing to consider Corbyn's proposal to stop no deal.She is trashing the stop no deal brand.TheScreamingEagles said:
Not quite the same attraction with voters methinks.
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Sandpit
Posts: 56,022
Which is fine, but Mr Streeting is a Labour MP at Mr Corbyn’s discretion.eristdoof said:
I repeat the words of Wes Streeting Labour MPSandpit said:
No it isn’t, that’s the whole point.eristdoof said:
Once a VoNC is caried then it is totally different. Voting for an emergency PM with support from all sides would not be political suicide.Sandpit said:So, if Johnson and Corbyn are both opposed to a proposed government of “unity” (sic), where do the proposers get 200 defectors from the two largest parties for their majority in a vote of confidence.
I could just about see a couple of dozen MPs willing to commit almost certain career suicide over Brexit, but there’s no chance of a couple of hundred doing so.
Johnson and Corbyn would both be very happy to expel anyone voting against their own party whip in a vote of confidence, people don’t seem to realise this.
For many MPs allowing No Deal will be political suicide.
Boris Johnson remains leader of the Conservative Party, and Jeremy Corbyn remains leader of the Labour Party.
Anyone who votes against their party whip in a vote of confidence can be expected to lose the whip, deselected at the next election and probably be expelled from the party.
Dominic Grieve might be okay with that, but I don’t think 200 current Con and Lab MPs will be.
Corbyn’s made it quite clear today, that’s either he’s the next PM or we have an election (on a date of Boris Johnson’s choosing).
Corbyn is quite happy for Brexit to happen in six weeks’ time with no deal, he’s never been a supporter of the EU and thinks he can benefit from an election at a time of considerable pressure on the government.
"The overriding priority for every Member of Parliament who doesn’t want to see [no-deal] happen, which is a clear majority of the House of Commons, must be preventing this outcome."
If Corbyn is not the next PM he will be powerless to prevent a GoNU with another PM forming.
If sh!t goes down, then he won’t be a Labour candidate at the next election.0 -
Richard_Tyndall
Posts: 33,243
Unfortunatly this article perpetuates the myth thst the aim of an extension is to prevent No Deal. It is not. It is to allow Remainers more time to try and reverse the Brexit vote. My preferencecwss for a deal and a soft Brexit. But given the antics of Remainers over the past three years I have run out of patience and will accept whatever sort of Brexit we can get.1
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Nigelb
Posts: 76,381
Well played !ydoethur said:
They don't bat deep enough to get out of this.FrancisUrquhart said:Its a good job england bat deep....
Did I say 200? If they get to 150 they'll have done well.
Time for Bairstow to make way for Foakes and Buttler or Roy for Sibley.
Have you been taking coaching from Vaughan ?0 -
TGOHF
Posts: 21,633
So what are the 2 groups going to be after we leave on 31/10 ?
Rejoiners
Stay outers ?
1 -
GIN1138
Posts: 22,827
Before Boris presents the bill to Parliament he will almost certainly make a speech in Downing St. naming 10th October as the day of the election (he will probably do the courtesy of informing the Queen as well I'd think)Chris said:
He's announced he wants to prevent a No Deal Brexit.Beibheirli_C said:
Why? Has Corbyn announced that he does not believe he can win?Chris said:
Maybe you haven't been following the news this time?Beibheirli_C said:
Labour were compliant enough last time. They agreed in a heartbeat.Chris said:
Which would require a 2/3 majority! Has the author read the FTPA?GIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10. ...
Under the Fixed Term Parliaments Act there is no mechanism for the Commons to vote for an election on a specified date, as suggested above. The wording of the motion is dictated by the Act - "That there shall be an early parliamentary general election".
The date of the election, if such a motion were passed, would be in the gift of the prime minister. If people weren't aware of that trap before Dominic Cummings started his vapourings, they are now. Except for the employees of the Spectator, apparently.
Now after doing all that he could do an about turn and make the election for 1st November once the bill is passed but of course he wouldn't in practice...
When the Prime Minister tells the general public we'll have an election on 10th October he's not going to go back on that.
You seem somewhat paranoid about Boris if I may say so? 0 -
Yorkcity
Posts: 4,382
Swinson needs to think again.With some in her own party, the SNP, Greens,conservatives willing to consider Corbyn's proposal to stop no deal.She is trashing the stop no deal brand.TheScreamingEagles said:0 -
Chris
Posts: 11,899
If Swinson had been concerned about the reaction of Tory MPs, wouldn't it have been wiser to try to gauge that reaction first, rather than publicly attacking the proposal immediately?logical_song said:
Surely this is a judgement on the best chance of getting a majority in the House. How many Tories would accept Corbyn as PM versus how many would accept anybody else as PM?Chris said:
Meanwhile on LibDemVoice:Slackbladder said:https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1162000845656993793
Trouble in the yellow peril...
If the party wants to prevent a no-deal Brexit, it is going to have to make a Hobson’s choice – prop up a temporary Corbyn government, so that he seeks an extension to Article 50 and calls a General Election or see Boris Johnson ram through no deal.
If we allow a no-deal Brexit to happen because we fail to work with other parties, then we will never be forgiven by the millions of people who voted to Remain and the tens of thousands who have joined us since the referendum.
https://www.libdemvoice.org/a-no-deal-brexit-is-irreversible-a-jeremy-corbyn-government-is-not-61739.html0 -
bigjohnowls
Posts: 22,924
Swinson made to look like a liar as well as weak caving into Chukka.Chris said:
It's not even a matter of "jumping into bed" with Corbyn. It's a matter of authorising him to ask the EU for an extension, and then cooperating in the dissolution of parliament so that there can be an election.anothernick said:
So are we to conclude that that the Lib Dems were happy to jump into bed with Cameron and Osborne (and IDS) and impose austerity, tuition fees and Universal Credit but jumping into bed with Corbyn to stop Brexit is impossible under any circumstances.Scott_P said:
Hmmmmmmm
Essentially it's just a matter of whether the Lib Dems could be trusted at all when they said they thought Brexit would be so disastrous that the result of the referendum - the referendum that they supported before they knew what the result would be - should be overturned.
If that's how bad any Brexit would be, by implication, a No Deal Brexit would be an absolute catastrophe. But now the Lib Dems tell us that Jeremy Corbyn being prime minister in name only for a few weeks would be even worse.
Perhaps we should just conclude that a No Deal Brexit will be only a mild inconvenience after all, and let Boris Johnson get on with it.
But if it turns out to be a catastrophe, Swinson will have to bear her full share of the responsibility.
Welcome back to Labour Remainers.0 -
Stereotomy
Posts: 4,092
Endillion said:
They seem to be profiting greatly from Disorganised Labour!Stereotomy said:
Do the lib dems show any sign of caring about organised labour?Anorak said:Is there any union associated with the LibDems?
Is there any prospect of them attracting one? Would they want to? A large union, frustrated with JC and the threat to its members from No Deal, moving allegiance would be a game-changer, IMHO.
I await a slew of responses explaining why this is a non-starter!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvVOXKQ57a4ydoethur said:
Well, they've just rejected working with disorganised Labour. Does that count?Stereotomy said:
Do the lib dems show any sign of caring about organised labour?Anorak said:Is there any union associated with the LibDems?
Is there any prospect of them attracting one? Would they want to? A large union, frustrated with JC and the threat to its members from No Deal, moving allegiance would be a game-changer, IMHO.
I await a slew of responses explaining why this is a non-starter!0 -
david_herdson
Posts: 18,214
Britain didn't work with him then!Theuniondivvie said:
Och, I don't know, 1939-41 could be described as a period of Corbynite constructive ambiguity.williamglenn said:
The difference between working with Stalin to defeat Hitler and working with Corbyn to stop No Deal is that Stalin wanted to defeat Hitler.TheScreamingEagles said:
Well if you get triggered by a Soviet flag then wait until see what a former Tory leader did with the Soviets.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. kinabalu, you can explain whatever you please. It doesn't justify a senior politician marching below the banner of mass murderers.
0 -
Recidivist
Posts: 4,679
What does the ML stand for? Manual Labourers? Merton and Leyton? Marxism Lenninism?Dura_Ace said:
The CPGB(ML) are right up your street as they are leavers who don't care for identity politics.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Rentool, if a Conservative attended a rally where people had swastikas galore and some banners of Hitler, Eichmann, and Heydrich, would you shrug it off?
https://twitter.com/syd_viciously/status/8726160863483535360 -
bigjohnowls
Posts: 22,924
PM Corbyn bouncefelix said:I note - alone on here - that sterling has recovered all of its losses from the other week against the Euro. Interestingly it does not feature at all on any of the news channels or among the myriad of people on here who were so worried when its decline was heralded as the ruination of all foreign holidays as well as forcing elderly Brits in Europe back to blighty pronto. Funny that....
0 -
Theuniondivvie
Posts: 43,203
Och, I don't know, 1939-41 could be described as a period of Corbynite constructive ambiguity.williamglenn said:
The difference between working with Stalin to defeat Hitler and working with Corbyn to stop No Deal is that Stalin wanted to defeat Hitler.TheScreamingEagles said:
Well if you get triggered by a Soviet flag then wait until see what a former Tory leader did with the Soviets.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. kinabalu, you can explain whatever you please. It doesn't justify a senior politician marching below the banner of mass murderers.
0 -
logical_song
Posts: 10,028
Surely this is a judgement on the best chance of getting a majority in the House. How many Tories would accept Corbyn as PM versus how many would accept anybody else as PM?Chris said:
Meanwhile on LibDemVoice:Slackbladder said:https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1162000845656993793
Trouble in the yellow peril...
If the party wants to prevent a no-deal Brexit, it is going to have to make a Hobson’s choice – prop up a temporary Corbyn government, so that he seeks an extension to Article 50 and calls a General Election or see Boris Johnson ram through no deal.
If we allow a no-deal Brexit to happen because we fail to work with other parties, then we will never be forgiven by the millions of people who voted to Remain and the tens of thousands who have joined us since the referendum.
https://www.libdemvoice.org/a-no-deal-brexit-is-irreversible-a-jeremy-corbyn-government-is-not-61739.html0 -
anothernick
Posts: 3,591
Probably a reaction to Corbyn's "stop Brexit" offer. Whoever thought the prospect of a Corbyn premiership would be positive for sterling....DavidL said:
I think that that is a slight overstatement. But it has been a much better day for Sterling.felix said:I note - alone on here - that sterling has recovered all of its losses from the other week against the Euro. Interestingly it does not feature at all on any of the news channels or among the myriad of people on here who were so worried when its decline was heralded as the ruination of all foreign holidays as well as forcing elderly Brits in Europe back to blighty pronto. Funny that....
0 -
Theuniondivvie
Posts: 43,203
Come on, Cameron very obviously had no ego, so no problemo.anothernick said:
So are we to conclude that that the Lib Dems were happy to jump into bed with Cameron and Osborne (and IDS) and impose austerity, tuition fees and Universal Credit but jumping into bed with Corbyn to stop Brexit is impossible under any circumstances.Scott_P said:
Hmmmmmmm0 -
Chris
Posts: 11,899
The extreme Brexiteers seem to be adopting a strategy of just making stuff up these days. Particularly about the exchange rate. It seems pretty stupid, because everyone has access to data about the exchange rate. Yet only a few days ago somebody posted completely false figures about the change in the value of sterling over the last ten years, as though they expected everyone to swallow them without even checking.FeersumEnjineeya said:
No, it hasn't. Still another 1.5 cents to go before it gets back to pre-Boris levels.felix said:I note - alone on here - that sterling has recovered all of its losses from the other week against the Euro. Interestingly it does not feature at all on any of the news channels or among the myriad of people on here who were so worried when its decline was heralded as the ruination of all foreign holidays as well as forcing elderly Brits in Europe back to blighty pronto. Funny that....
0 -
Theuniondivvie
Posts: 43,203
I have to break it to you that MD is not one to give up a trope lightly, even after it's been taken round the block repeatedly.kinabalu said:
I explained at some length, when you said this last time, why it is highly inappropriate to liken Corbyn to a Nazi sympathizer.Morris_Dancer said:Good afternoon, everyone.
Corbyn remains a far left wretch. Would you put into power someone who happily marches beneath Hitler banners? Whose right hand man openly describes himself as a fascist?
Then why contemplate it for Stalin and Marxist, the far left equivalents?
Disappointed, therefore, to see it make another outing.0 -
williamglenn
Posts: 54,681
What do you want the news to say? Sterling is below where it was a month ago.felix said:I note - alone on here - that sterling has recovered all of its losses from the other week against the Euro. Interestingly it does not feature at all on any of the news channels or among the myriad of people on here who were so worried when its decline was heralded as the ruination of all foreign holidays as well as forcing elderly Brits in Europe back to blighty pronto. Funny that....
0 -
FeersumEnjineeya
Posts: 4,744
No, it hasn't. Still another 1.5 cents to go before it gets back to pre-Boris levels.felix said:I note - alone on here - that sterling has recovered all of its losses from the other week against the Euro. Interestingly it does not feature at all on any of the news channels or among the myriad of people on here who were so worried when its decline was heralded as the ruination of all foreign holidays as well as forcing elderly Brits in Europe back to blighty pronto. Funny that....
0 -
TheScreamingEagles
Posts: 121,543
Real patriots, a bit like those patriots who proposed a Franco-British Union in 1940.RobD said:
Those remainer Tories would do anything to remain in the EU at this point.anothernick said:
But some remainer Tories have agreed to talk to him. And the other minor parties have made non-committal responses.Scott_P said:
Yes.anothernick said:So are we to conclude that that the Lib Dems were happy to jump into bed with Cameron and Osborne (and IDS) and impose austerity, tuition fees and Universal Credit but jumping into bed with Corbyn to stop Brexit is impossible under any circumstances.
Corbyn is just that toxic.0 -
Chris
Posts: 11,899
Such a motion - specifying a date - would have no effect under the FTPA. The motion has to be simply "That there shall be an early parliamentary general election."MikeSmithson said:
But he would have to get this through the Commons with 433 MPs voting for. That is far from certain given that this would look lie a device to avoid the CommonsGIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10.
This date is opportune for two reasons. First, Parliament would dissolve by law on September 5. This immediately eliminates the threat of MPs taking control of parliamentary time, keeping the exit date of October 31 intact.
Second, this election date comes a week before the EU Council summit. If his gamble pays off and he were to win a majority, the PM would have the strong negotiating position required to obtain a new deal. If the EU still refuses to budge, the Government could spend the final weeks passing relevant no-deal legislation to minimise disruption before Britain leaves the EU."
If we laymen are aware of the terms of the FTPA, why isn't Mr Alexander Pelling-Bruce of the Spectator? Do they not allow him Internet access at work for some reason?0 -
Theuniondivvie
Posts: 43,203
I can think of another UK politician who's enthusiastically ridden the chaos wave.geoffw said:Bernard Connolly spells out @MarqueeMark's observation that Corbyn wants power through chaos.
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/how-to-make-sense-of-jeremy-corbyns-pitch-to-remainers/
I buy this argument. Only a politician steeped in Marxist thinking would have the patience to pursue it.
Edit: actually a few, but only one who is indubitably in power.0 -
anothernick
Posts: 3,591
Certainly, I understand their position. I thought the Lib Dems shared it, but it seems not.RobD said:
Those remainer Tories would do anything to remain in the EU at this point.anothernick said:
But some remainer Tories have agreed to talk to him. And the other minor parties have made non-committal responses.Scott_P said:
Yes.anothernick said:So are we to conclude that that the Lib Dems were happy to jump into bed with Cameron and Osborne (and IDS) and impose austerity, tuition fees and Universal Credit but jumping into bed with Corbyn to stop Brexit is impossible under any circumstances.
Corbyn is just that toxic.0 -
DavidL
Posts: 55,097
I think that that is a slight overstatement. But it has been a much better day for Sterling.felix said:I note - alone on here - that sterling has recovered all of its losses from the other week against the Euro. Interestingly it does not feature at all on any of the news channels or among the myriad of people on here who were so worried when its decline was heralded as the ruination of all foreign holidays as well as forcing elderly Brits in Europe back to blighty pronto. Funny that....
0 -
RobD
Posts: 60,330
Those remainer Tories would do anything to remain in the EU at this point.anothernick said:
But some remainer Tories have agreed to talk to him. And the other minor parties have made non-committal responses.Scott_P said:
Yes.anothernick said:So are we to conclude that that the Lib Dems were happy to jump into bed with Cameron and Osborne (and IDS) and impose austerity, tuition fees and Universal Credit but jumping into bed with Corbyn to stop Brexit is impossible under any circumstances.
Corbyn is just that toxic.0 -
Chris
Posts: 11,899
He's announced he wants to prevent a No Deal Brexit.Beibheirli_C said:
Why? Has Corbyn announced that he does not believe he can win?Chris said:
Maybe you haven't been following the news this time?Beibheirli_C said:
Labour were compliant enough last time. They agreed in a heartbeat.Chris said:
Which would require a 2/3 majority! Has the author read the FTPA?GIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10. ...
Under the Fixed Term Parliaments Act there is no mechanism for the Commons to vote for an election on a specified date, as suggested above. The wording of the motion is dictated by the Act - "That there shall be an early parliamentary general election".
The date of the election, if such a motion were passed, would be in the gift of the prime minister. If people weren't aware of that trap before Dominic Cummings started his vapourings, they are now. Except for the employees of the Spectator, apparently.1 -
felix
Posts: 15,180
I note - alone on here - that sterling has recovered all of its losses from the other week against the Euro. Interestingly it does not feature at all on any of the news channels or among the myriad of people on here who were so worried when its decline was heralded as the ruination of all foreign holidays as well as forcing elderly Brits in Europe back to blighty pronto. Funny that....1
-
anothernick
Posts: 3,591
But some remainer Tories have agreed to talk to him. And the other minor parties have made non-committal responses.Scott_P said:
Yes.anothernick said:So are we to conclude that that the Lib Dems were happy to jump into bed with Cameron and Osborne (and IDS) and impose austerity, tuition fees and Universal Credit but jumping into bed with Corbyn to stop Brexit is impossible under any circumstances.
Corbyn is just that toxic.0 -
Blue_rog
Posts: 2,019
Freedom for TootingGardenwalker said:
Translation: I’ve given up on Scotland and can live with a socialist paradise in England only (and perhaps Wales but if push comes to shove I can live without that as well).Scott_P said:
0 -
rkrkrk
Posts: 8,626
5/7 batsmen are the same as those who won the world cup.ydoethur said:
Well the last time THIS England team won anything was last summer against India.rkrkrk said:
Yeah this England team is rubbish. When's the last time they won anything?ydoethur said:Dear England selectors.
There are 17 first class counties - not including Middlesex - who have an average of 20 players on their books.
Out of that, is it really asking too fecking much for you to find six batsman who are just about capable of holding a bat the right way up?
A radically different England team - different captain, different bowlers, different batsman and a different wicket keeper - did win another tournament recently, but it was in hit and giggle not proper cricket.
I'd suggest they actually might know how to hold a bat the right way up.0 -
RobD
Posts: 60,330
What's wrong with going to the people? I suppose they might give the wrong answerMikeSmithson said:
But he would have to get this through the Commons with 433 MPs voting for. That is far from certain given that this would look lie a device to avoid the CommonsGIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10.
This date is opportune for two reasons. First, Parliament would dissolve by law on September 5. This immediately eliminates the threat of MPs taking control of parliamentary time, keeping the exit date of October 31 intact.
Second, this election date comes a week before the EU Council summit. If his gamble pays off and he were to win a majority, the PM would have the strong negotiating position required to obtain a new deal. If the EU still refuses to budge, the Government could spend the final weeks passing relevant no-deal legislation to minimise disruption before Britain leaves the EU."
1 -
Chris
Posts: 11,899
It's not even a matter of "jumping into bed" with Corbyn. It's a matter of authorising him to ask the EU for an extension, and then cooperating in the dissolution of parliament so that there can be an election.anothernick said:
So are we to conclude that that the Lib Dems were happy to jump into bed with Cameron and Osborne (and IDS) and impose austerity, tuition fees and Universal Credit but jumping into bed with Corbyn to stop Brexit is impossible under any circumstances.Scott_P said:
Hmmmmmmm
Essentially it's just a matter of whether the Lib Dems could be trusted at all when they said they thought Brexit would be so disastrous that the result of the referendum - the referendum that they supported before they knew what the result would be - should be overturned.
If that's how bad any Brexit would be, by implication, a No Deal Brexit would be an absolute catastrophe. But now the Lib Dems tell us that Jeremy Corbyn being prime minister in name only for a few weeks would be even worse.
Perhaps we should just conclude that a No Deal Brexit will be only a mild inconvenience after all, and let Boris Johnson get on with it.
But if it turns out to be a catastrophe, Swinson will have to bear her full share of the responsibility.0 -
Beibheirli_C
Posts: 8,192
Why? Has Corbyn announced that he does not believe he can win?Chris said:
Maybe you haven't been following the news this time?Beibheirli_C said:
Labour were compliant enough last time. They agreed in a heartbeat.Chris said:
Which would require a 2/3 majority! Has the author read the FTPA?GIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10. ...
We may not think that The Cult can win, but I am sure The Cult thinks they can win.
It is Corbyn's last shot. He has to try. If he declines the chance then what is the point?0 -
SandyRentool
Posts: 22,649
Is that a trick question, and the answer is Churchill?MarqueeMark said:
Who killed most - Hitler, Stalin or Mao?kinabalu said:
I didn't seek to justify that. I explained to you why it is deeply inappropriate to draw an equivalence between hard left political views (offensive as one may find them) and the Nazi ideology of Adolf Hitler and the 3rd Reich.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. kinabalu, you can explain whatever you please. It doesn't justify a senior politician marching below the banner of mass murderers.
And I thought you had processed and understood. Hence the disappointment.0 -
Slackbladder
Posts: 9,795
Labour are not going to be turning down a GE thats true.Beibheirli_C said:
Labour were compliant enough last time. They agreed in a heartbeat.Chris said:
Which would require a 2/3 majority! Has the author read the FTPA?GIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10. ...0 -
MikeSmithson
Posts: 7,382
But he would have to get this through the Commons with 433 MPs voting for. That is far from certain given that this would look lie a device to avoid the CommonsGIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10.
This date is opportune for two reasons. First, Parliament would dissolve by law on September 5. This immediately eliminates the threat of MPs taking control of parliamentary time, keeping the exit date of October 31 intact.
Second, this election date comes a week before the EU Council summit. If his gamble pays off and he were to win a majority, the PM would have the strong negotiating position required to obtain a new deal. If the EU still refuses to budge, the Government could spend the final weeks passing relevant no-deal legislation to minimise disruption before Britain leaves the EU."0 -
ydoethur
Posts: 73,248
I shall look for it as well with interest. I have to go off as well now but I am intrigued as to your views on this.kinabalu said:
OK. More likely you missed it. Fair enough.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. kinabalu, hmm. It's possible I've genuinely forgotten, as that doesn't ring a bell.
[NB I need to get a spot of work done just now. I will be checking the thread but if I'm a shade slow, that'll be why. If you prefer to message me, or post in the thread, that's cool].
I'll try and do it again - or similar - and post at some point when you're around.0 -
david_herdson
Posts: 18,214
It shouldn't do. Japan's war was in progress before Hitler's and while their strategy might have been informed by events in Europe, the US sanctions on Japanese access to raw materials would likely have produced something of a similar grand strategy even without Hitler (after all, Tokyo had no pressing need to strike the US when it did).MarqueeMark said:
Does that include the deaths caused by the Japanese waging war in the Pacific as events caused by Hitler's doing?ydoethur said:
Depends on what you mean by 'killed.' If you mean 'killed directly,' Mao. If you mean 'died as a wider result of events they caused,' Hitler would probably just have the edge.MarqueeMark said:
Who killed most - Hitler, Stalin or Mao?kinabalu said:
I didn't seek to justify that. I explained to you why it is deeply inappropriate to draw an equivalence between hard left political views (offensive as one may find them) and the Nazi ideology of Adolf Hitler and the 3rd Reich.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. kinabalu, you can explain whatever you please. It doesn't justify a senior politician marching below the banner of mass murderers.
And I thought you had processed and understood. Hence the disappointment.
That said, Hitler was in power for a lot less time than either Stalin or Mao.0 -
ydoethur
Posts: 73,248
Well the last time THIS England team won anything was last summer against India.rkrkrk said:
Yeah this England team is rubbish. When's the last time they won anything?ydoethur said:Dear England selectors.
There are 17 first class counties - not including Middlesex - who have an average of 20 players on their books.
Out of that, is it really asking too fecking much for you to find six batsman who are just about capable of holding a bat the right way up?
A radically different England team - different captain, different bowlers, different batsman and a different wicket keeper - did win another tournament recently, but it was in hit and giggle not proper cricket.0 -
Chris
Posts: 11,899
Maybe you haven't been following the news this time?Beibheirli_C said:
Labour were compliant enough last time. They agreed in a heartbeat.Chris said:
Which would require a 2/3 majority! Has the author read the FTPA?GIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10. ...0 -
Scott_P
Posts: 51,453
Yes.anothernick said:So are we to conclude that that the Lib Dems were happy to jump into bed with Cameron and Osborne (and IDS) and impose austerity, tuition fees and Universal Credit but jumping into bed with Corbyn to stop Brexit is impossible under any circumstances.
Corbyn is just that toxic.
0 -
Big_G_NorthWales
Posts: 64,989
Gibraltar release Grace 1. Good news for Iran but US going to be very annoyed.0 -
Beibheirli_C
Posts: 8,192
Labour were compliant enough last time. They agreed in a heartbeat.Chris said:
Which would require a 2/3 majority! Has the author read the FTPA?GIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10. ...0 -
ydoethur
Posts: 73,248
No.MarqueeMark said:
Does that include the deaths caused by the Japanese waging war in the Pacific as events caused by Hitler's doing?ydoethur said:
Depends on what you mean by 'killed.' If you mean 'killed directly,' Mao. If you mean 'died as a wider result of events they caused,' Hitler would probably just have the edge.MarqueeMark said:
Who killed most - Hitler, Stalin or Mao?kinabalu said:
I didn't seek to justify that. I explained to you why it is deeply inappropriate to draw an equivalence between hard left political views (offensive as one may find them) and the Nazi ideology of Adolf Hitler and the 3rd Reich.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. kinabalu, you can explain whatever you please. It doesn't justify a senior politician marching below the banner of mass murderers.
And I thought you had processed and understood. Hence the disappointment.0 -
anothernick
Posts: 3,591
So are we to conclude that that the Lib Dems were happy to jump into bed with Cameron and Osborne (and IDS) and impose austerity, tuition fees and Universal Credit but jumping into bed with Corbyn to stop Brexit is impossible under any circumstances.Scott_P said:
Hmmmmmmm0 -
rkrkrk
Posts: 8,626
Yeah this England team is rubbish. When's the last time they won anything?ydoethur said:Dear England selectors.
There are 17 first class counties - not including Middlesex - who have an average of 20 players on their books.
Out of that, is it really asking too fecking much for you to find six batsman who are just about capable of holding a bat the right way up?1 -
kinabalu
Posts: 44,607
OK. More likely you missed it. Fair enough.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. kinabalu, hmm. It's possible I've genuinely forgotten, as that doesn't ring a bell.
[NB I need to get a spot of work done just now. I will be checking the thread but if I'm a shade slow, that'll be why. If you prefer to message me, or post in the thread, that's cool].
I'll try and do it again - or similar - and post at some point when you're around.0 -
MarqueeMark
Posts: 54,398
Does that include the deaths caused by the Japanese waging war in the Pacific as events caused by Hitler's doing?ydoethur said:
Depends on what you mean by 'killed.' If you mean 'killed directly,' Mao. If you mean 'died as a wider result of events they caused,' Hitler would probably just have the edge.MarqueeMark said:
Who killed most - Hitler, Stalin or Mao?kinabalu said:
I didn't seek to justify that. I explained to you why it is deeply inappropriate to draw an equivalence between hard left political views (offensive as one may find them) and the Nazi ideology of Adolf Hitler and the 3rd Reich.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. kinabalu, you can explain whatever you please. It doesn't justify a senior politician marching below the banner of mass murderers.
And I thought you had processed and understood. Hence the disappointment.0 -
TOPPING
Posts: 43,658
What a patronising twat you sound.kinabalu said:
I didn't seek to justify that. I explained to you why it is deeply inappropriate to draw an equivalence between hard left political views (offensive as one may find them) and the Nazi ideology of Adolf Hitler and the 3rd Reich.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. kinabalu, you can explain whatever you please. It doesn't justify a senior politician marching below the banner of mass murderers.
And I thought you had processed and understood. Hence the disappointment.0 -
GIN1138
Posts: 22,827
If the election is held of 10th Ocotber (21 days before 31st October) why would extension of A50 be an issue unless the Opposition are going into the election expecting to lose?Scott_P said:
The opposition agrees to the election only if BoZo extends Article 50...GIN1138 said:This is what I've been saying would happen:
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/why-october-10th-is-boris-johnsons-best-bet-for-a-snap-election/
Boris does a Theresa and calls a general election on the day Parliament returns on 4th September.
"Johnson, however, can pre-empt such manoeuvres on September 4 when Parliament returns by tabling a motion for an early general election, to be held on October 10.
This date is opportune for two reasons. First, Parliament would dissolve by law on September 5. This immediately eliminates the threat of MPs taking control of parliamentary time, keeping the exit date of October 31 intact.
Second, this election date comes a week before the EU Council summit. If his gamble pays off and he were to win a majority, the PM would have the strong negotiating position required to obtain a new deal. If the EU still refuses to budge, the Government could spend the final weeks passing relevant no-deal legislation to minimise disruption before Britain leaves the EU." 0
