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SystemSystem Posts: 12,687
edited September 2015 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » REVEALED: The T-shirt and slogan for the UKIP leave EU campaign

Methinks that NIGEL SAYS NO is not a good slogan for the LEAVE EU campaign
Pic via @faisalislam pic.twitter.com/EVsbN5JI3k

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Comments

  • Eh_ehm_a_ehEh_ehm_a_eh Posts: 552
    edited September 2015
    Nice, very English.
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    edited September 2015
    Second, like REMAIN

    Just back from the cinema after watching Everest. Very by-the-numbers drama but very spectacular all the same.
  • notmenotme Posts: 3,293
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2nq8DzYToE
  • MattWMattW Posts: 29,884
    third.

    Like the reciprocal of 3.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,949
    edited September 2015
    Someone needs to come in and take over the OUT campaign... Trouble is, other than Boris (and he's Pro EU) I can't think of anybody with a big enough personality to boot Farage out of the way...
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    Nigel Farage? Egotistical?

    Say it ain't so.
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    The person's reaction on the second from right sums up the t-shirt.

    Having said that political t-shirts always look rediculous.
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,850
    Do they have matching baseball caps?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    Douglas Carswell's twitter feed is interesting.
  • JEOJEO Posts: 3,656
    What a terrible slogan. Aside from the obvious disaster of involving Farage, someone that the majority of the public dislikes, using "no" doesn't make any sense. The Out campaign won a coup by getting the question changed so they didn't have to be in the position of advocating a negative. Now they're going to to do it anyway?
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    notme said:

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2nq8DzYToE

    Is it still OK to crush on Justine Deans or does that get classed as unacceptable these days?
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Douglas Carswell's twitter feed is interesting.

    Interesting in a "go and have a laugh now" sort of way, or a "wait for the papers in the morning" theme?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 130,288
    GeoffM said:

    Second, like REMAIN

    Just back from the cinema after watching Everest. Very by-the-numbers drama but very spectacular all the same.

    Indeed, I watched it last weekend, the last hour was very tense and tremendous scenery in backdrop too
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    Arron Banks looks like he could single-handedly destroy the Leave campaign's chances.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    edited September 2015
    GeoffM said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Douglas Carswell's twitter feed is interesting.

    Interesting in a "go and have a laugh now" sort of way, or a "wait for the papers in the morning" theme?
    Ferrets in a sack kinda way.

    He's fallen out with UKIP donor Aaron Banks, and the head of Banks' campaign group tweeted something derogatory about Douglas which Carswell hasn't taken very well.

    He thinks Banks will bugger up the referendum for Leave
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    Basically no one trusts a defector.

    If they can rat once, they can (re)rat again.
  • alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    Policy making by text vote

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34369166
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    edited September 2015
    Douglas Carswell
    This tweet is from the head of comms at Arron Banks' leave.eu outfit. Seriously https://t.co/lR8c02zDaL

    .@richardcalhoun it was deleted. The tweet from the head of comms for Arron Banks leave.eu outfit was so offensive, he deleted it
    MP_SE said:

    Arron Banks looks like he could single-handedly destroy the Leave campaign's chances.

  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,850
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Basically no one trusts a defector.

    If they can rat once, they can (re)rat again.

    But if he does quit, they lose all the parliamentary (and financial) bonuses that come from having an MP...

    This could get very interesting
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Is it my imagination or has the Mail held back it's front page?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    oxfordsimon said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Basically no one trusts a defector.

    If they can rat once, they can (re)rat again.

    But if he does quit, they lose all the parliamentary (and financial) bonuses that come from having an MP...

    This could get very interesting
    And the prestige both the Lib Dems* and UKIP** could lose major party status at the next election.

    *GB wide

    **England only
  • glwglw Posts: 10,523
    alex. said:

    Policy making by text vote

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34369166

    What could possibly go wrong?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    Plato_Says said:

    Is it my imagination or has the Mail held back it's front page?

    Yes it is your imagination, came out over an hour ago

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CP24JlBXAAAwpjT.jpg
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    glw said:

    alex. said:

    Policy making by text vote

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34369166

    What could possibly go wrong?
    Auto-correct is such a pain
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,743
    Nigel say relax
  • Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    edited September 2015
    Just 22% of Labour supporters, and only 18% of all voters, back Jeremy Corbyn's position on scrapping the Trident nuclear weapons system, polling for The Huffington Post UK carried out by Survation has revealed.

    Ahead of a potentially fractious Labour Party conference in Brighton, the poll also reveals 24% think the new Labour leader is a threat to national security, a message that was hammered home by the Conservative Party in the aftermath of this election victory.http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/8195562?1443215784&ncid=tweetlnkushpmg00000067
  • alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    glw said:

    alex. said:

    Policy making by text vote

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34369166

    What could possibly go wrong?
    The whole thing seems set up for a massive showdown between Corbyn and the MPs, with Corbyn insisting MPs vote with "the membership" and the MPs saying they will vote in line with the platform on which they were elected at the General Election.
  • glwglw Posts: 10,523
    As to the t-shirt how about "Leave it out!"
  • isamisam Posts: 42,651
    What price this is actually the t-shirt and slogan for the UKIP leave campaign? I'd have thought they were for the Ukip conference
  • MattWMattW Posts: 29,884
    Does this mean that the Green Party £3 army get a say in the Labour policymaking process?

    *innocent face*
  • notmenotme Posts: 3,293
    Dair said:

    notme said:

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2nq8DzYToE

    Is it still OK to crush on Justine Deans or does that get classed as unacceptable these days?
    Very pretty. Just dont go stalking her facebook page.
  • isamisam Posts: 42,651
    This brings back memories... 12 years ago I was going out with a Swedish EU loving activist and she gave me a 'Ja Til Euron' t shirt that I used to wear to bed
  • alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    JEO said:

    What a terrible slogan. Aside from the obvious disaster of involving Farage, someone that the majority of the public dislikes, using "no" doesn't make any sense. The Out campaign won a coup by getting the question changed so they didn't have to be in the position of advocating a negative. Now they're going to to do it anyway?

    And surely rule number 1 is to make sure that the slogan matches the answer needed in the question? I can just imagine voters turning up and not knowing how to vote so just writing "no" ;)
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,850
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    oxfordsimon said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Basically no one trusts a defector.

    If they can rat once, they can (re)rat again.

    But if he does quit, they lose all the parliamentary (and financial) bonuses that come from having an MP...

    This could get very interesting
    And the prestige both the Lib Dems* and UKIP** could lose major party status at the next election.

    *GB wide

    **England only
    No debate places for either!
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    MyBurningEars said:

    Do UKIP actually want the UK to leave the EU?

    I mean, actually, really, deep-down want it?

    I mean this in a similar way to how, clearly, the Labour party would quite like to get back into power. It wouldn't mind it. It'd be nice. But based on the last few months - even years - it doesn't seem to have the hunger to get back into power. Didn't Tony Blair say it was easier for him because back then his party really wanted to win?

    I'm beginning to doubt UKIP's drive and determination to achieve what is allegedly their prime motivation. It's that, or they are simply suffering a short-circuit in the command and control centre. Well, there's clearly that. But if they wanted it badly enough, couldn't they pull together, work around their weaknesses and all the egomania, and actually, genuinely go for it?

    I have this theory that UKIP aren't ready for this referendum for the following reasons

    1) Like most they weren't expecting a Tory majority

    2) Dave wouldn't give a referendum

    But we are now having a referendum and they've been caught cold, we saw it in the Indyref, the Nats weren't prepared for it in some respects (mostly on the currency question) despite spending years wanting a referendum
  • isamisam Posts: 42,651
    alex. said:

    JEO said:

    What a terrible slogan. Aside from the obvious disaster of involving Farage, someone that the majority of the public dislikes, using "no" doesn't make any sense. The Out campaign won a coup by getting the question changed so they didn't have to be in the position of advocating a negative. Now they're going to to do it anyway?

    And surely rule number 1 is to make sure that the slogan matches the answer needed in the question? I can just imagine voters turning up and not knowing how to vote so just writing "no" ;)
    Ukip need to elect Steven Woolfe as leader

    'Steve says leave!'
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    oxfordsimon said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    oxfordsimon said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Basically no one trusts a defector.

    If they can rat once, they can (re)rat again.

    But if he does quit, they lose all the parliamentary (and financial) bonuses that come from having an MP...

    This could get very interesting
    And the prestige both the Lib Dems* and UKIP** could lose major party status at the next election.

    *GB wide

    **England only
    No debate places for either!
    For ages we've been talking about the end of two party politics and by 2020 it might be all about just the Tories and Labour (and possibly the SNP)
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 130,288
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    oxfordsimon said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    oxfordsimon said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Basically no one trusts a defector.

    If they can rat once, they can (re)rat again.

    But if he does quit, they lose all the parliamentary (and financial) bonuses that come from having an MP...

    This could get very interesting
    And the prestige both the Lib Dems* and UKIP** could lose major party status at the next election.

    *GB wide

    **England only
    No debate places for either!
    For ages we've been talking about the end of two party politics and by 2020 it might be all about just the Tories and Labour (and possibly the SNP)
    Depends on EUref, if a narrow In is the result that will boost UKIP
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    HYUFD said:

    GeoffM said:

    Second, like REMAIN

    Just back from the cinema after watching Everest. Very by-the-numbers drama but very spectacular all the same.

    Indeed, I watched it last weekend, the last hour was very tense and tremendous scenery in backdrop too
    It would have been awesome in 3D
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    So .... nigel is not the man from Del Monte?
  • isamisam Posts: 42,651
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    MyBurningEars said:

    Do UKIP actually want the UK to leave the EU?

    I mean, actually, really, deep-down want it?

    I mean this in a similar way to how, clearly, the Labour party would quite like to get back into power. It wouldn't mind it. It'd be nice. But based on the last few months - even years - it doesn't seem to have the hunger to get back into power. Didn't Tony Blair say it was easier for him because back then his party really wanted to win?

    I'm beginning to doubt UKIP's drive and determination to achieve what is allegedly their prime motivation. It's that, or they are simply suffering a short-circuit in the command and control centre. Well, there's clearly that. But if they wanted it badly enough, couldn't they pull together, work around their weaknesses and all the egomania, and actually, genuinely go for it?

    I have this theory that UKIP aren't ready for this referendum for the following reasons

    1) Like most they weren't expecting a Tory majority

    2) Dave wouldn't give a referendum

    But we are now having a referendum and they've been caught cold, we saw it in the Indyref, the Nats weren't prepared for it in some respects (mostly on the currency question) despite spending years wanting a referendum
    Farage had, & won, two debates with Clegg last year explicitly on this subject, so difficult to believe UKIP hadn't thought it through
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    edited September 2015
    oxfordsimon said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Basically no one trusts a defector.

    If they can rat once, they can (re)rat again.

    But if he does quit, they lose all the parliamentary (and financial) bonuses that come from having an MP...

    This could get very interesting
    Were would he go this time?
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,850
    Beverley_C said:

    oxfordsimon said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Basically no one trusts a defector.

    If they can rat once, they can (re)rat again.

    But if he does quit, they lose all the parliamentary (and financial) bonuses that come from having an MP...

    This could get very interesting
    Were would he go this time?
    Sit as an independent - would be my guess. He has proven he has the personal following - and he can argue that it is UKIP that has moved away from him so wouldn't necessarily have to put himself through another by-election
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,810
    alex. said:

    glw said:

    alex. said:

    Policy making by text vote

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34369166

    What could possibly go wrong?
    The whole thing seems set up for a massive showdown between Corbyn and the MPs, with Corbyn insisting MPs vote with "the membership" and the MPs saying they will vote in line with the platform on which they were elected at the General Election.
    But on This Week Alan Johnson said he would support Labour policy - even if it included scrapping Trident / leaving NATO.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited September 2015
    isam said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    MyBurningEars said:

    Do UKIP actually want the UK to leave the EU?

    I mean, actually, really, deep-down want it?

    I mean this in a similar way to how, clearly, the Labour party would quite like to get back into power. It wouldn't mind it. It'd be nice. But based on the last few months - even years - it doesn't seem to have the hunger to get back into power. Didn't Tony Blair say it was easier for him because back then his party really wanted to win?

    I'm beginning to doubt UKIP's drive and determination to achieve what is allegedly their prime motivation. It's that, or they are simply suffering a short-circuit in the command and control centre. Well, there's clearly that. But if they wanted it badly enough, couldn't they pull together, work around their weaknesses and all the egomania, and actually, genuinely go for it?

    I have this theory that UKIP aren't ready for this referendum for the following reasons

    1) Like most they weren't expecting a Tory majority

    2) Dave wouldn't give a referendum

    But we are now having a referendum and they've been caught cold, we saw it in the Indyref, the Nats weren't prepared for it in some respects (mostly on the currency question) despite spending years wanting a referendum
    Farage had, & won, two debates with Clegg last year explicitly on this subject, so difficult to believe UKIP hadn't thought it through
    Even Corbyn could "win" a debate against Clegg :p
  • Steven_WhaleySteven_Whaley Posts: 313
    alex. said:

    JEO said:



    And surely rule number 1 is to make sure that the slogan matches the answer needed in the question? I can just imagine voters turning up and not knowing how to vote so just writing "no" ;)

    Yeah, about as useful as Nigel Is Cross might be. ;)



  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    alex. said:

    glw said:

    alex. said:

    Policy making by text vote

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34369166

    What could possibly go wrong?
    The whole thing seems set up for a massive showdown between Corbyn and the MPs, with Corbyn insisting MPs vote with "the membership" and the MPs saying they will vote in line with the platform on which they were elected at the General Election.
    They are quite free to resign the Labour whip if they feel they can no longer represent party policy. If they are genuinely honourable they will also resign their seat and stand as an independent in a by-election.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Paging TSE:- does the Sunday Times have a poll this week?
  • Beverley_CBeverley_C Posts: 6,256
    oxfordsimon said:

    Beverley_C said:

    oxfordsimon said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Basically no one trusts a defector.

    If they can rat once, they can (re)rat again.

    But if he does quit, they lose all the parliamentary (and financial) bonuses that come from having an MP...

    This could get very interesting
    Were would he go this time?
    Sit as an independent - would be my guess. He has proven he has the personal following - and he can argue that it is UKIP that has moved away from him so wouldn't necessarily have to put himself through another by-election
    The joys of rationalisation. If he was my MP I would vote him out for all the messing about he has indulged in. It is getting silly
  • alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    Dair said:

    alex. said:

    glw said:

    alex. said:

    Policy making by text vote

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34369166

    What could possibly go wrong?
    The whole thing seems set up for a massive showdown between Corbyn and the MPs, with Corbyn insisting MPs vote with "the membership" and the MPs saying they will vote in line with the platform on which they were elected at the General Election.
    They are quite free to resign the Labour whip if they feel they can no longer represent party policy. If they are genuinely honourable they will also resign their seat and stand as an independent in a by-election.
    I'm not sure it actually makes sense to say that in order to be honourable someone should have to submit to a by-election to continue to advocate the policies on which they were originally elected.
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    notme said:

    Dair said:

    notme said:

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2nq8DzYToE

    Is it still OK to crush on Justine Deans or does that get classed as unacceptable these days?
    Very pretty. Just dont go stalking her facebook page.
    While I have, occasionally checked if Rachel Roberts was in any new TV or Film (she hasn't unfortunately), I can honestly say facebook stalking her has never crossed my mind.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    Danny565 said:

    Paging TSE:- does the Sunday Times have a poll this week?

    Nothing yet.
  • isamisam Posts: 42,651
    MyBurningEars said:

    isam said:

    This brings back memories... 12 years ago I was going out with a Swedish EU loving activist and she gave me a 'Ja Til Euron' t shirt that I used to wear to bed

    That's excellent!!! You lucky, lucky thing.

    There must be a market for political memorabilia from tragically failed campaigns. That's right up there with George McGovern campaign buttons.
    At the time I wasn't at all interested in politics. When she asked my opinion on the Euro and I said I didn't really care, she went mad and said she'd rather I was dead against than ambivalent.

    Her English was too good... When I said 'give us a ring later' she said 'us? You and who else?!' Etc

    It got right on my nerves!
  • BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,492
    glw said:

    As to the t-shirt how about "Leave it out!"

    Just had a thought, the leave side Could use 'Its time to Leave' as there slogan, and in the campaign have all the posters, and leaflets, and especially the broadcasts based around a battered wife, depicting a (British) woman being told want they can to do, who they can be friends with..... and in particular having her handbag emptied of money by a (European) man, who then goes on to tell her that she should be grateful to be with him and grateful of the pittance he gives back to her.

    Could be considered bad taste but It could also be powerful and in a referendum campaign could be powerful.
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    alex. said:

    JEO said:

    What a terrible slogan. Aside from the obvious disaster of involving Farage, someone that the majority of the public dislikes, using "no" doesn't make any sense. The Out campaign won a coup by getting the question changed so they didn't have to be in the position of advocating a negative. Now they're going to to do it anyway?

    And surely rule number 1 is to make sure that the slogan matches the answer needed in the question? I can just imagine voters turning up and not knowing how to vote so just writing "no" ;)
    Didn't someone post that UKIP had already ordered all this No crap ages ago for their conference and decided to use it anyway after the EC ruling?
  • isamisam Posts: 42,651
    BigRich said:

    glw said:

    As to the t-shirt how about "Leave it out!"

    Just had a thought, the leave side Could use 'Its time to Leave' as there slogan, and in the campaign have all the posters, and leaflets, and especially the broadcasts based around a battered wife, depicting a (British) woman being told want they can to do, who they can be friends with..... and in particular having her handbag emptied of money by a (European) man, who then goes on to tell her that she should be grateful to be with him and grateful of the pittance he gives back to her.

    Could be considered bad taste but It could also be powerful and in a referendum campaign could be powerful.
    I was all for 'just say no' by the Grange Hill kids as the out anthem

    But Will Young 'leave right now' seems to fit better with the new question
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 130,288
    GeoffM said:

    HYUFD said:

    GeoffM said:

    Second, like REMAIN

    Just back from the cinema after watching Everest. Very by-the-numbers drama but very spectacular all the same.

    Indeed, I watched it last weekend, the last hour was very tense and tremendous scenery in backdrop too
    It would have been awesome in 3D
    Yes, was 3D in the Odeon I watched it in, was very good
  • alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    Royals won't have done their popularity any harm in Wales this evening :)
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    alex. said:

    Dair said:

    alex. said:

    glw said:

    alex. said:

    Policy making by text vote

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34369166

    What could possibly go wrong?
    The whole thing seems set up for a massive showdown between Corbyn and the MPs, with Corbyn insisting MPs vote with "the membership" and the MPs saying they will vote in line with the platform on which they were elected at the General Election.
    They are quite free to resign the Labour whip if they feel they can no longer represent party policy. If they are genuinely honourable they will also resign their seat and stand as an independent in a by-election.
    I'm not sure it actually makes sense to say that in order to be honourable someone should have to submit to a by-election to continue to advocate the policies on which they were originally elected.
    The electorate should be given the chance to decide if the individual's personal policies are agreeable to them. There is no guarantee that their personal political view is in tune with the voters, even if some of it matches their previous party allegiance.

    For example Iain Murray won't vote to replace Trident but as a Labour MP he was elected on a Labour mandate including a commitment to replace Trident.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    alex. said:

    Royals won't have done their popularity any harm in Wales this evening :)

    I'm ready to support a law that makes Prince Harry the successor to Her Majesty.
  • isamisam Posts: 42,651
    MyBurningEars said:

    isam said:

    MyBurningEars said:

    isam said:

    This brings back memories... 12 years ago I was going out with a Swedish EU loving activist and she gave me a 'Ja Til Euron' t shirt that I used to wear to bed

    That's excellent!!! You lucky, lucky thing.

    There must be a market for political memorabilia from tragically failed campaigns. That's right up there with George McGovern campaign buttons.
    At the time I wasn't at all interested in politics. When she asked my opinion on the Euro and I said I didn't really care, she went mad and said she'd rather I was dead against than ambivalent.

    Her English was too good... When I said 'give us a ring later' she said 'us? You and who else?!' Etc

    It got right on my nerves!
    That's pretty funny.

    IIRC Lucian Fletcher (who hasn't posted on here for ages, come back, I know you're lurking sometimes!) had a theory about Sweden from his visits there. The young blondes were stunning, though if you were surrounded by them it all got a bit samey; the middle-aged and older ladies were actually rather plain. His conclusion was not that Swedes were getting better-looking from generation to generation, but rather that if you fell for one then you were "marrying a timebomb".
    She was quite striking but I was never that bothered about her... Prob why she was interested! If only you could feign that indifference when you fall for someone
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,949
    I thought they'd be quite a bit of polling this week to continue to heap the misery on Lab just as their conference is starting...

    But so far, NADA! :(
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 123,816
    GIN1138 said:

    I thought they'd be quite a bit of polling this week to continue to heap the misery on Lab just as their conference is starting...

    But so far, NADA! :(

    I think they'll wait until after Corbyn's given his speech.
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    MyBurningEars said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    MyBurningEars said:

    Do UKIP actually want the UK to leave the EU?

    I mean, actually, really, deep-down want it?

    I mean this in a similar way to how, clearly, the Labour party would quite like to get back into power. It wouldn't mind it. It'd be nice. But based on the last few months - even years - it doesn't seem to have the hunger to get back into power. Didn't Tony Blair say it was easier for him because back then his party really wanted to win?

    I'm beginning to doubt UKIP's drive and determination to achieve what is allegedly their prime motivation. It's that, or they are simply suffering a short-circuit in the command and control centre. Well, there's clearly that. But if they wanted it badly enough, couldn't they pull together, work around their weaknesses and all the egomania, and actually, genuinely go for it?

    I have this theory that UKIP aren't ready for this referendum for the following reasons

    1) Like most they weren't expecting a Tory majority

    2) Dave wouldn't give a referendum

    But we are now having a referendum and they've been caught cold, we saw it in the Indyref, the Nats weren't prepared for it in some respects (mostly on the currency question) despite spending years wanting a referendum
    I'd agree they aren't ready. That their planning/strategy is so awful (guys, stop spending money/your limited media coverage on driving forward a "NO" campaign, when you already won the battle to make it the "LEAVE" campaign!) seems worse than that though: it suggests even if they tried to prepare, they wouldn't do a good job of it.

    Also, they seem utterly unable to spot glaring flaws. Walking talking flaws, with fag and beer in hand, for one thing. Any serious strategic planning for political campaign would surely, at an early stage, by running polling and focus groups to identify strong approaches they could take, the demographics they need to sway, etc. They can't have done that if they're going for the Nigel Strategy. They can't even have looked at the polls that have already been done.
    A whole bunch of PR/advertising/campaign specialists were meant to have been hired......
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    MyBurningEars said:


    I'd agree they aren't ready. That their planning/strategy is so awful (guys, stop spending money/your limited media coverage on driving forward a "NO" campaign, when you already won the battle to make it the "LEAVE" campaign!) seems worse than that though: it suggests even if they tried to prepare, they wouldn't do a good job of it.

    Also, they seem utterly unable to spot glaring flaws. Walking talking flaws, with fag and beer in hand, for one thing. Any serious strategic planning for political campaign would surely, at an early stage, by running polling and focus groups to identify strong approaches they could take, the demographics they need to sway, etc. They can't have done that if they're going for the Nigel Strategy. They can't even have looked at the polls that have already been done.

    You're talking about UKIP.

    Of course they are going for the Nigel strategy. Of course they have done no research. Of course they are incompetent.

    UKIP is not about the EU, nor immigration, nor anything except Nigel.
  • MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    MyBurningEars said:

    MP_SE said:

    MyBurningEars said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    MyBurningEars said:

    Do UKIP actually want the UK to leave the EU?

    I mean, actually, really, deep-down want it?

    I mean this in a similar way to how, clearly, the Labour party would quite like to get back into power. It wouldn't mind it. It'd be nice. But based on the last few months - even years - it doesn't seem to have the hunger to get back into power. Didn't Tony Blair say it was easier for him because back then his party really wanted to win?

    I'm beginning to doubt UKIP's drive and determination to achieve what is allegedly their prime motivation. It's that, or they are simply suffering a short-circuit in the command and control centre. Well, there's clearly that. But if they wanted it badly enough, couldn't they pull together, work around their weaknesses and all the egomania, and actually, genuinely go for it?

    I have this theory that UKIP aren't ready for this referendum for the following reasons

    1) Like most they weren't expecting a Tory majority

    2) Dave wouldn't give a referendum

    But we are now having a referendum and they've been caught cold, we saw it in the Indyref, the Nats weren't prepared for it in some respects (mostly on the currency question) despite spending years wanting a referendum
    I'd agree they aren't ready. That their planning/strategy is so awful (guys, stop spending money/your limited media coverage on driving forward a "NO" campaign, when you already won the battle to make it the "LEAVE" campaign!) seems worse than that though: it suggests even if they tried to prepare, they wouldn't do a good job of it.

    Also, they seem utterly unable to spot glaring flaws. Walking talking flaws, with fag and beer in hand, for one thing. Any serious strategic planning for political campaign would surely, at an early stage, by running polling and focus groups to identify strong approaches they could take, the demographics they need to sway, etc. They can't have done that if they're going for the Nigel Strategy. They can't even have looked at the polls that have already been done.
    A whole bunch of PR/advertising/campaign specialists were meant to have been hired......
    Have they been? If so, I missed it. (Genuine question. I thought UKIP had been downsizing since the GE, rather than gearing up for their "Big Fight".)
    Not sure what UKIP have been doing staff wise but Leave.eu have been on a spending spree. I believe a call centre with up to 100 members of staff was going to be created. An advertising agency were working on the campaign and campaign specialists from the US were recently hired. It sounded pretty professional, lets hope it can return to being professional.
  • PAWPAW Posts: 1,074
    A few days ago, I think, Southam Observer asked if there was a general slow down - what I have noticed is strong interest in manufacturing for improving business processes, in fact we are being pushed - I think it must mean that the general level of activity is busying middle management out.
  • isamisam Posts: 42,651
    Ch117 London live. The struggle to get nighthawks made
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    edited September 2015
    alex. said:

    Royals won't have done their popularity any harm in Wales this evening :)

    Going by the Daily Mail comments William is now fatally compromised in England. Mail readers are the core Royalist support.

    The express article doesn't even mention that Wills and Kate were supporting Wales. Though does mention Kate "cheered on the England team at the opening ceremony".
  • corporealcorporeal Posts: 2,549
    Why are posts about politics being allowed. Why are my 700 rugby articles going unpublished.

    The entirety of wales is partying


    (And prince williams fist pumps at welsh scores drew loud cheers)
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/Jeremy_Corbyn/11893986/Jeremy-Corbyns-top-team-encouraged-street-riots.html

    This is Labour today
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    MyBurningEars said:

    corporeal said:

    Why are posts about politics being allowed. Why are my 700 rugby articles going unpublished.

    The entirety of wales is partying


    (And prince williams fist pumps at welsh scores drew loud cheers)

    There was some argument on PB in the build-up to the RWC about whether rugby is, in fact, a terribly boring middle-class sport and why anyone would want to watch it. Sadly you weren't around to evangelise.

    Anyway, I hope a few of the sceptics were watching today - at least for Canada/Italy, if not for England/Wales. Or that they might have caught Japan/South Africa.

    Have a good one.
    Of course Rugby Union is a boring middle-class sport. You don't play it unless you go to private school (in most instances).

    The very fact that League is not the dominant form of rugby just shows how a certain elite control the choices of people in this country. When a boring sport where the refereeing decisions are not only bizarre but often indecypherable, you know you;re being sold a pup.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Disasterous shirt from Whoever thought it up.

    Why anyone thinks the goons who could not get anyone other than Carshole elected in May are to be listened to is beyond me.
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    TGOHF said:

    Disasterous shirt from Whoever thought it up.

    Why anyone thinks the goons who could not get anyone other than Carshole elected in May are to be listened to is beyond me.

    They are run by Nigel Farage.

    What more does one need to understand what they are and how they work?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,422
    You'd need a heart of stone not to laugh.....when "no" isn't on the ballot! "Nigel says something irrelevant"

    No, I don't think we should "Leave"......
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 27,230
    That seems a very silly t shirt for a number of reasons. Right now the best thing the Leave side have going for them is Angela Merkel.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    That's just terrible. It's appalling. And idiotic. Who the heck thought it was a good idea?

    And I'm not just talking about the pose of the on the right of the picture as you look at it...
  • blackburn63blackburn63 Posts: 4,492
    There's no point denying there are problems within ukip, that's the nature of political parties, they are rarely united as enormous egos vie for position. But these tshirts are simply intended for the party faithful at the conference, it was a PR attempt to show ukip united with other OUT campaigns. Nigel's popularity within the party is embarrassingly messianic for some, did anybody see the woman who'd had his photo tattooed on her arm? Crazy.

    Have to say it must be a quiet time for news and debate if some teenagers wearing tshirts at a party conference is a thread header.
  • saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245
    Dair said:

    MyBurningEars said:

    corporeal said:

    Why are posts about politics being allowed. Why are my 700 rugby articles going unpublished.

    The entirety of wales is partying


    (And prince williams fist pumps at welsh scores drew loud cheers)

    There was some argument on PB in the build-up to the RWC about whether rugby is, in fact, a terribly boring middle-class sport and why anyone would want to watch it. Sadly you weren't around to evangelise.

    Anyway, I hope a few of the sceptics were watching today - at least for Canada/Italy, if not for England/Wales. Or that they might have caught Japan/South Africa.

    Have a good one.
    Of course Rugby Union is a boring middle-class sport. You don't play it unless you go to private school (in most instances).

    The very fact that League is not the dominant form of rugby just shows how a certain elite control the choices of people in this country. When a boring sport where the refereeing decisions are not only bizarre but often indecypherable, you know you;re being sold a pup.
    Something else you appear to know nothing about.

    On topic. Putting Farage, as the front man is disastrous for out. The true believers already believe, the people he needs to attract, he repels. Until recently I was a definite in, I'm now hovering over out, but Farage is a massive obstacle to overcome, if he's for it, instinctively, I'm against it.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    tlg86 said:

    That seems a very silly t shirt for a number of reasons. Right now the best thing the Leave side have going for them is Angela Merkel.

    I'd vote for Angela Merkel , a Christian Democrat, on the list system.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Dair said:

    alex. said:

    Royals won't have done their popularity any harm in Wales this evening :)

    Going by the Daily Mail comments William is now fatally compromised in England. Mail readers are the core Royalist support.

    The express article doesn't even mention that Wills and Kate were supporting Wales. Though does mention Kate "cheered on the England team at the opening ceremony".
    It's all a bloody stunt from the firm ! Who supports Scotland ? The Board worked that out too. Anne. Her son even played for Scotland on the grounds that he was educated in Scotland.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    MyBurningEars said:

    Dair said:



    You're talking about UKIP.

    Of course they are going for the Nigel strategy. Of course they have done no research. Of course they are incompetent.

    UKIP is not about the EU, nor immigration, nor anything except Nigel.

    That's not entirely true, UKIP has been quite a mixed coalition, though Farage has acquired a totemic and apparently unassailable position at the head of it. The libertarian-minded free-marketeers, once a substantial segment of UKIP membership, were not All About The Nige (their influence seems to have been diluted by the increase in membership, and their waning influence in the party must have persuaded many of them to leave, but if they hadn't been there I don't think Carswell would have been so interested in joining). Carswell is not AATN either. The "Red UKIP" faction aren't AATN (they seem to have been decapitated lately but looks like some of their ideas are making a late comeback).
    Like Alan Sked

  • kle4kle4 Posts: 99,414
    How long before we find out that the t-shirts were made by child slaves or something, the everyone has to act surprised hat a lot of our clothes are made that way so UKIP can be condemned for not checking?
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