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  • MattWMattW Posts: 32,175

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    I wonder whether this relates to Epstein, to conduct whilst Trade Rep, to shenanigans around money grubbing as a Prince, or something else.

    QEII really should not have given him cover.
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 6,029
    Leon said:

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    Like what Mandy allegedly did?
    Yes. I fail to see a significant difference between them
    Any difference is going to be in the nature, volume and, critically, classification of documents passed. That's not going to be obvious until some way down the line.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 66,605

    ydoethur said:

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    Like what Mandy allegedly did?
    This must have been what Starmer enigmatically referred to yesterday when he said 'nobody is above the law.'
    Just seems odd that Pandy is arrested for “misconduct in public office” for the Trade Envoy emails and Mandy isn’t for the ones he allegedly sent.
    Recall, however, that the police have searched Lord Mandypants’s homes in London and Wiltshire and, if they are actually arresting the Andrew formerly known as Prince, then an arrest of Lord M may not be far away

    This isn’t going away soon, not for the royals and not for Skyr
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 35,206

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    If Andrew MbW can be done for passing information to Epstein, then Mandelson needs to lawyer up sharpish.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 60,823

    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Not concerned by the bullying allegations? Of course not, she's on your side and that kind of thing only matters when your opponents do it, right?
    Women bullying women can be viscous - I dealt with a case at a previous job.

    I was startled at the way the behaviour was defended. By other women.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 70,206
    Which will last longer? TSE's holiday or the new Cabinet Secretary?


  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 21,659
    ydoethur said:

    Still we should note that 'misconduct in public office' still means he's not being nailed for molesting girls who had been trafficked. If he did, of course.

    Al Capone and tax evasion.

    Morally, the molesting girls allegations are far worse, of course they are. And if Andrew goes to his grave without justice being served, that is a bad thing. But if this is the thing that he can be sent down for, becuase it's potentially utterly unambiguous, so be it.

    (And yes, Mandy is also potenitally in deep doodoo here. As are those who presumably knew (the Palace must have known something, surely?) but sat on the information.)
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,017
    edited 10:23AM
    Leon said:

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    Like what Mandy allegedly did?
    Yes. I fail to see a significant difference between them
    Are there still dungeony bits of the Tower?

    People would happily pay a tenner to see both of them in chains. The modern-day equivalent of Bedlam.

    Chuck in Tony Blair and make it £20...
  • MattWMattW Posts: 32,175
    stodge said:

    algarkirk said:

    Interesting polling. In all but two of the match ups (Lib Dems vs Labour or the Greens) the more left wing option is ahead.

    Yes, very interesting polling. Reform lose every contest, with the implication they have the plurality of unpopularity as well as, from current general polling, the plurality of popularity.

    So ensuring they don't form a government should be easy.

    There is one central problem, and another secondary problem, and the next election may well turn on its resolution: Firstly identifying the party in each relevant seat that can beat Reform in a world where Labour unusually hold all the seats that are most likely to change hands, but are now unloved.

    (Cumbria, apart from Farron's seat is my example but is typical: 2024: all Labour. 2019: all Tory. Projected 2029: all Reform. Which party is the tactical vote?)

    The secondary problem is how to know if voting Tory is in fact a vote for a Reform + Tory government or not.

    Indeed and this is the big question for Badenoch going forward. Whatever her public criticisms of Reform before an election, do we still think IF the numbers work for a Reform minority Government, she will offer Confidence & Supply to Farage? I suspect this is something she has been pondering - I would if I were her.

    Publicly, it will be all about maximising the Conservative vote but as we know what leaders say before the votes are cast and what they do once they are counted aren't always the same.

    Davey faces a similar dilemma - would he support a minority second term Labour Government with Confidence & Supply?

    Both Badenoch and Davey could come out before the election and say they will neither support a Reform minority nor a Labour minority but the charge then will be, as it would have for Clegg in 2010, to have been to cause chaos in the name of self indulgence.

    The test would then be whether either or both would vote down a Reform or Labour Queen's Speech and trigger a second election - I suspect they'd get little thanks from the public for that.
    I think we will see semi-official unpublicised verbal agreements to lay off certain constituencies, as we did between Lab and Lib in 1997.

    I'm not sure which parties would be involved though - perhaps the Greens as their realistic target seats will be few and far between most likely.
  • scampi25scampi25 Posts: 412
    Will he get a new home in the Tower?
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,623
    stodge said:

    algarkirk said:

    Interesting polling. In all but two of the match ups (Lib Dems vs Labour or the Greens) the more left wing option is ahead.

    Yes, very interesting polling. Reform lose every contest, with the implication they have the plurality of unpopularity as well as, from current general polling, the plurality of popularity.

    So ensuring they don't form a government should be easy.

    There is one central problem, and another secondary problem, and the next election may well turn on its resolution: Firstly identifying the party in each relevant seat that can beat Reform in a world where Labour unusually hold all the seats that are most likely to change hands, but are now unloved.

    (Cumbria, apart from Farron's seat is my example but is typical: 2024: all Labour. 2019: all Tory. Projected 2029: all Reform. Which party is the tactical vote?)

    The secondary problem is how to know if voting Tory is in fact a vote for a Reform + Tory government or not.

    Indeed and this is the big question for Badenoch going forward. Whatever her public criticisms of Reform before an election, do we still think IF the numbers work for a Reform minority Government, she will offer Confidence & Supply to Farage? I suspect this is something she has been pondering - I would if I were her.

    Publicly, it will be all about maximising the Conservative vote but as we know what leaders say before the votes are cast and what they do once they are counted aren't always the same.

    Davey faces a similar dilemma - would he support a minority second term Labour Government with Confidence & Supply?

    Both Badenoch and Davey could come out before the election and say they will neither support a Reform minority nor a Labour minority but the charge then will be, as it would have for Clegg in 2010, to have been to cause chaos in the name of self indulgence.

    The test would then be whether either or both would vote down a Reform or Labour Queen's Speech and trigger a second election - I suspect they'd get little thanks from the public for that.
    If Farage = 280 and Kemi = 50 she'll probably have to
    If Farage = 190 and Kemi = 140 he can f off
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 597

    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Not concerned by the bullying allegations? Of course not, she's on your side and that kind of thing only matters when your opponents do it, right?
    No one has been concerned by bullying allegations for 10 years

    Who the feck has she worked for on that time.

    Oh the Daily fucking Mail... Its OK for a bully to work for May, Boris, Truss Sunak no problem, give her a chance.

    The minute Starmer appoints her... Oh let's spread some fucking shit

    Total hypocricicy

    Which Tory will be the attack bitch

    Pritti Patel PMSL
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 60,823

    ydoethur said:

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    Like what Mandy allegedly did?
    This must have been what Starmer enigmatically referred to yesterday when he said 'nobody is above the law.'
    Just seems odd that Pandy is arrested for “misconduct in public office” for the Trade Envoy emails and Mandy isn’t for the ones he allegedly sent.
    Random guesses (any of the following)

    1) Andrew put detailed “this is the offence and I am committing it” stuff in the emails. Thick as mince.
    2) He isn’t trying the “emails are all fake - get better proven copies” thing. Not questioning the evidence
    3) Mandy is in deeper - they are finding more and more stuff
    4) the pressure to arrest someone is immense
    5) Andrew has decided to give a full confession, sobbing everyone else in. The arrest would be part of plea bargain process.
    6) they have contrastive evidence on Andrew. Protection officers in the room?
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 21,964
    And this is why I wouldn't ever go near visiting Iran.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c747nqply93o

    Why do people take the risk?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,017

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    Imagine being on holiday when that headline came up....

    Harsh timing.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,411

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    If Andrew MbW can be done for passing information to Epstein, then Mandelson needs to lawyer up sharpish.
    He already has, Mischon de Reya for starters.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 21,659
    stodge said:

    algarkirk said:

    Interesting polling. In all but two of the match ups (Lib Dems vs Labour or the Greens) the more left wing option is ahead.

    Yes, very interesting polling. Reform lose every contest, with the implication they have the plurality of unpopularity as well as, from current general polling, the plurality of popularity.

    So ensuring they don't form a government should be easy.

    There is one central problem, and another secondary problem, and the next election may well turn on its resolution: Firstly identifying the party in each relevant seat that can beat Reform in a world where Labour unusually hold all the seats that are most likely to change hands, but are now unloved.

    (Cumbria, apart from Farron's seat is my example but is typical: 2024: all Labour. 2019: all Tory. Projected 2029: all Reform. Which party is the tactical vote?)

    The secondary problem is how to know if voting Tory is in fact a vote for a Reform + Tory government or not.

    Indeed and this is the big question for Badenoch going forward. Whatever her public criticisms of Reform before an election, do we still think IF the numbers work for a Reform minority Government, she will offer Confidence & Supply to Farage? I suspect this is something she has been pondering - I would if I were her.

    Publicly, it will be all about maximising the Conservative vote but as we know what leaders say before the votes are cast and what they do once they are counted aren't always the same.

    Davey faces a similar dilemma - would he support a minority second term Labour Government with Confidence & Supply?

    Both Badenoch and Davey could come out before the election and say they will neither support a Reform minority nor a Labour minority but the charge then will be, as it would have for Clegg in 2010, to have been to cause chaos in the name of self indulgence.

    The test would then be whether either or both would vote down a Reform or Labour Queen's Speech and trigger a second election - I suspect they'd get little thanks from the public for that.
    As Nick Clegg found out between 2010 and 2015, holding the balance of power is a lot less fun than it's made out to be. Apart from the German FDP, has anyone really thrived in the role?
  • TazTaz Posts: 25,091
    Leon said:

    ydoethur said:

    Leon said:

    It’s just depressing how brutally the UK is divided. A division mirrored on PB

    There is one way to unite the country, some kind of grand project we can all get behind. To that end I propose

    THE LEONDAMUS MEMORIAL PARK

    It should occupy the largely unnecessary green spaces that at present form Regent’s Park. Instead of the silly football fields and zoo, there would be a 8000 metre high statue of me, made from Cornish granite, serpentine, emeralds, and inexplicably radioactive Portland stone, surrounded by various pavilions inscribed with jewels spelling out some of my most famous neologisms from PB like “baxtered”, “skyr tolmakersson”, “rogerdamus”, “gaylording ponceyboots”, “eadric”, “farmy farm” and “only one photo a day”

    Various stalls would be erected season by season offering fruit ices and gummy bears with profits going to my own charity, inspired by Save the Children, which we all know as “save the really hot ones”

    Well, that would unite us all.

    In criticism of it...
    I presume you’re joking?! Or you are inadvertently proving my point. It’s cynicism like this that is polarising and enfeeblibg the nation. Why can’t we dream? Why not show some ambition?

    I’m right now at the Chiang Kai Shel memorial hall in Taipei and there are happy families and local young people gathered together picnicking and dallying and singing patriotic songs. Quite frankly it’s inspiring. Why can’t we do the same??

    A ridiculously huge statue and numbingly vast plaza dedicated entirely to me and my sayings and other things connected to me, right in the middle of London, is exactly the kind of thing we could all get behind. A focus of unity which we desperately need
    Because we’re ashamed of our past and it would offend people with they/them pronouns, pink hair wearing a keffiyeh.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,017

    And this is why I wouldn't ever go near visiting Iran.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c747nqply93o

    Why do people take the risk?

    As long as nobody asks Boris' opinion on the matter....
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 27,605

    And this is why I wouldn't ever go near visiting Iran.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c747nqply93o

    Why do people take the risk?

    Something very odd about those two.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 21,964
    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Not concerned by the bullying allegations? Of course not, she's on your side and that kind of thing only matters when your opponents do it, right?
    No one has been concerned by bullying allegations for 10 years

    Who the feck has she worked for on that time.

    Oh the Daily fucking Mail... Its OK for a bully to work for May, Boris, Truss Sunak no problem, give her a chance.

    The minute Starmer appoints her... Oh let's spread some fucking shit

    Total hypocricicy

    Which Tory will be the attack bitch

    Pritti Patel PMSL
    I'd have more respect for you if you owned it. You went nuts last week about a Tory who had allegations made sitting next to Badenoch, now you don't care about allegations.

    Never change.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 21,659

    And this is why I wouldn't ever go near visiting Iran.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c747nqply93o

    Why do people take the risk?

    As long as nobody asks Boris' opinion on the matter....
    Good advice for the ages, there.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 22,463

    algarkirk said:

    Leon said:

    It’s just depressing how brutally the UK is divided. A division mirrored on PB

    There is one way to unite the country, some kind of grand project we can all get behind. To that end I propose

    THE LEONDAMUS MEMORIAL PARK

    It should occupy the largely unnecessary green spaces that at present form Regent’s Park. Instead of the silly football fields and zoo, there would be a 8000 metre high statue of me, made from Cornish granite, serpentine, emeralds, and inexplicably radioactive Portland stone, surrounded by various pavilions inscribed with jewels spelling out some of my most famous neologisms from PB like “baxtered”, “skyr tolmakersson”, “rogerdamus”, “gaylording ponceyboots”, “eadric”, “farmy farm” and “only one photo a day”

    Various stalls would be erected season by season offering fruit ices and gummy bears with profits going to my own charity, inspired by Save the Children, which we all know as “save the really hot ones”

    We tried the national monument wheeze with the Millennium Dome and all we got out of that was Lord Mandelson.
    Odd thing about the Millennium Dome. For all the criticism and the ghastliness of the 1999 NYE party, my wife went there to the exhibition and really enjoyed it. And it then became a successful venue.
    The longer this century goes on, the more I think my 1999 NYE decision to have an early night and read The Darkling Thrush (dated 31 December 1900) was about right.

    The land's sharp features seemed to be
    The Century's corpse outleant,
    His crypt the cloudy canopy,
    The wind his death-lament.
    The ancient pulse of germ and birth
    Was shrunken hard and dry,
    And every spirit upon earth
    Seemed fervourless as I.
    We had gone away as a group of friends to stay in Malvern. That night we climbed the hills and was able to see fireworks going off all across the Severn valley for tens of miles. Glorious.
    Thanks to Railtrack ineptness on November 5th in the late 90s, I once spent far too long on a very windswept Peterborough railway station, which unexpectedly afforded me a view of four different firework displays.

    This experience means I can easily understand why Louise Doughty chose to set her novel Platform Seven in Peterborough.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 46,652
    I hope the forensic tents are done out in the correct shade of heraldic blue.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 31,363
    MattW said:

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    I wonder whether this relates to Epstein, to conduct whilst Trade Rep, to shenanigans around money grubbing as a Prince, or something else.

    QEII really should not have given him cover.
    ACC Oliver Wright
    "Following a thorough assessment, we have now opened an investigation into this allegation of misconduct in public office."
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 42,480
    @janinegibson.ft.com‬

    take a shot every time you hear the words "just glad the queen isn't here to see this"
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,017
    The news on Mandy can't be too far behind, surely?

    The Andy and Mandy Show. Although it probably won't go to court until 2029.

    Still, his mum must be causing the foundations of Windsor Castle to be vibrating, such will be the rate of her rotation...
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 9,909

    And this is why I wouldn't ever go near visiting Iran.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c747nqply93o

    Why do people take the risk?

    My wife (then girlfriend) tried to get a visa to visit her friend in Iran about twelve years ago. The Iranians rejected her application. I was somewhat relieved - and that was before Zaghari-Ratcliffe (I suspect she'd have had the good sense not to try of that had already happened).

    Friend also left shortly after and now holds Australian citizenship, although still with some family in Iran.
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,623
    edited 10:35AM
    We have a new BPC pollster!

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    RFM: 28% (+13)
    LAB: 21% (-14)
    CON: 20% (-4)
    GRN: 12% (+5)
    LDM: 12% (-1)
    SNP: 3% (=)

    Via @GoodGrowthFdn - New BPC pollster! - 13-16 Feb.
    Changes w/ GE2024.

    https://x.com/i/status/2024379106637345070
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 21,964
    Selebian said:

    And this is why I wouldn't ever go near visiting Iran.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c747nqply93o

    Why do people take the risk?

    My wife (then girlfriend) tried to get a visa to visit her friend in Iran about twelve years ago. The Iranians rejected her application. I was somewhat relieved - and that was before Zaghari-Ratcliffe (I suspect she'd have had the good sense not to try of that had already happened).

    Friend also left shortly after and now holds Australian citizenship, although still with some family in Iran.
    The whole thing is a game. They are just hostages by a quasi legal fiction. Starmer will almost certainly pay the money, unless regime change comes first,
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,017
    Pulpstar said:

    The BBC reckons there's no precedent for the arrest, but go back 500 years or so and they were sticking each other in the Tower of London all the time.

    If only they had banged up another Prince in the Tower...
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 22,463
    Pulpstar said:

    The BBC reckons there's no precedent for the arrest, but go back 500 years or so and they were sticking each other in the Tower of London all the time.

    I think the practice came to an end when the Stuarts replaced the Tudors. One of the traditions of the Norman/Welsh Kings of England that the Scottish and German monarchs didn't imitate.

    I suppose it rather lost its charm when Parliament started in on the imprisoning/executing Royals line of business.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 46,652
    Scott_xP said:

    @janinegibson.ft.com‬

    take a shot every time you hear the words "just glad the queen isn't here to see this"

    Indeed.

    'Fucksake, £10 million for NOTHING!'
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,017

    We have a new BPC pollster!

    Westminster Voting Intention:

    RFM: 28% (+13)
    LAB: 21% (-14)
    CON: 20% (-4)
    GRN: 12% (+5)
    LDM: 12% (-1)
    SNP: 3% (=)

    Via @GoodGrowthFdn - New BPC pollster! - 13-16 Feb.
    Changes w/ GE2024.

    https://x.com/i/status/2024379106637345070

    Labour's fall greater than Reform's rise - that's a thing to watch.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 17,816
    Scott_xP said:

    @janinegibson.ft.com‬

    take a shot every time you hear the words "just glad the queen isn't here to see this"

    That's a recipe for liver damage. Blimey, this will knock all other news off the front pages for the foreseeable.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 69,857
    The royal family face their biggest crisis since the abdication of Edward in 1936

    They are going to have the press pack hounding them whenever or wherever they appear in public

  • stjohnstjohn Posts: 1,947
    Breaking news. An unnamed man in his 60s has been arrested on the Sandringham Estate on suspicion of misconduct in public office. Wonder who that might be? Intriguing.🧐
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 17,816

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested.

    Gonna need a bigger font.
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 597

    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Not concerned by the bullying allegations? Of course not, she's on your side and that kind of thing only matters when your opponents do it, right?
    No one has been concerned by bullying allegations for 10 years

    Who the feck has she worked for on that time.

    Oh the Daily fucking Mail... Its OK for a bully to work for May, Boris, Truss Sunak no problem, give her a chance.

    The minute Starmer appoints her... Oh let's spread some fucking shit

    Total hypocricicy

    Which Tory will be the attack bitch

    Pritti Patel PMSL
    I'd have more respect for you if you owned it. You went nuts last week about a Tory who had allegations made sitting next to Badenoch, now you don't care about allegations.

    Never change.
    Romeo has been vetted and passed for senior roles under Tory PMs and passed.

    She was vetted in 2024 for this role and past.

    Bullying Allegations were made ALLEGATIONS

    Patel was found GUILTY

    No Tory PM has the backbone to remove her despite her GUILT

    You just carry on digging that hole of complete hypocrisy.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 15,208
    Selebian said:

    And this is why I wouldn't ever go near visiting Iran.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c747nqply93o

    Why do people take the risk?

    My wife (then girlfriend) tried to get a visa to visit her friend in Iran about twelve years ago. The Iranians rejected her application. I was somewhat relieved - and that was before Zaghari-Ratcliffe (I suspect she'd have had the good sense not to try of that had already happened).

    Friend also left shortly after and now holds Australian citizenship, although still with some family in Iran.
    Despite being born in India, Mrs DA is of Iranian heritage and still has family there. She won't dream of visiting, though I went in 2009ish. I would go again. No problem with a 26C passport (real soft power).
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 22,463

    Scott_xP said:

    @janinegibson.ft.com‬

    take a shot every time you hear the words "just glad the queen isn't here to see this"

    That's a recipe for liver damage. Blimey, this will knock all other news off the front pages for the foreseeable.
    It's the leading headline on the Irish Times and New York Times websites, also Bild and Le Monde.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 21,964
    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Not concerned by the bullying allegations? Of course not, she's on your side and that kind of thing only matters when your opponents do it, right?
    No one has been concerned by bullying allegations for 10 years

    Who the feck has she worked for on that time.

    Oh the Daily fucking Mail... Its OK for a bully to work for May, Boris, Truss Sunak no problem, give her a chance.

    The minute Starmer appoints her... Oh let's spread some fucking shit

    Total hypocricicy

    Which Tory will be the attack bitch

    Pritti Patel PMSL
    I'd have more respect for you if you owned it. You went nuts last week about a Tory who had allegations made sitting next to Badenoch, now you don't care about allegations.

    Never change.
    Romeo has been vetted and passed for senior roles under Tory PMs and passed.

    She was vetted in 2024 for this role and past.

    Bullying Allegations were made ALLEGATIONS

    Patel was found GUILTY

    No Tory PM has the backbone to remove her despite her GUILT

    You just carry on digging that hole of complete hypocrisy.
    Who mentioned Patel? You were wibbling about a male Tory MP last week.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 15,208

    The royal family face their biggest crisis since the abdication of Edward in 1936

    They are going to have the press pack hounding them whenever or wherever they appear in public

    Yeah, King Prince Charles is going to have to constantly answer questions about what he knew and when. I suspect his preening self-regard will prevent him from chucking the towel and letting the Baldy Basketcase have go to establish a clean break with the sordid past.
  • MustaphaMondeoMustaphaMondeo Posts: 486
    Leon said:

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    Like what Mandy allegedly did?
    Yes. I fail to see a significant difference between them

    Andy is thick and was appallingly brought up.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 69,857
    Watching this media 'fest' goodness only knows what happens if and when Mandelson is also arrested

  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 21,964
    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Not concerned by the bullying allegations? Of course not, she's on your side and that kind of thing only matters when your opponents do it, right?
    No one has been concerned by bullying allegations for 10 years

    Who the feck has she worked for on that time.

    Oh the Daily fucking Mail... Its OK for a bully to work for May, Boris, Truss Sunak no problem, give her a chance.

    The minute Starmer appoints her... Oh let's spread some fucking shit

    Total hypocricicy

    Which Tory will be the attack bitch

    Pritti Patel PMSL
    I'd have more respect for you if you owned it. You went nuts last week about a Tory who had allegations made sitting next to Badenoch, now you don't care about allegations.

    Never change.
    Romeo has been vetted and passed for senior roles under Tory PMs and passed.

    She was vetted in 2024 for this role and past.

    Bullying Allegations were made ALLEGATIONS

    Patel was found GUILTY

    No Tory PM has the backbone to remove her despite her GUILT

    You just carry on digging that hole of complete hypocrisy.
    Wasn't Mandelson also vetted and approved?
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,496

    Watching this media 'fest' goodness only knows what happens if and when Mandelson is also arrested

    Hopefully, everyone will breathe a sigh of relief and then get on with whatever it was they were doing.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,651
    stodge said:

    algarkirk said:

    Interesting polling. In all but two of the match ups (Lib Dems vs Labour or the Greens) the more left wing option is ahead.

    Yes, very interesting polling. Reform lose every contest, with the implication they have the plurality of unpopularity as well as, from current general polling, the plurality of popularity.

    So ensuring they don't form a government should be easy.

    There is one central problem, and another secondary problem, and the next election may well turn on its resolution: Firstly identifying the party in each relevant seat that can beat Reform in a world where Labour unusually hold all the seats that are most likely to change hands, but are now unloved.

    (Cumbria, apart from Farron's seat is my example but is typical: 2024: all Labour. 2019: all Tory. Projected 2029: all Reform. Which party is the tactical vote?)

    The secondary problem is how to know if voting Tory is in fact a vote for a Reform + Tory government or not.

    Indeed and this is the big question for Badenoch going forward. Whatever her public criticisms of Reform before an election, do we still think IF the numbers work for a Reform minority Government, she will offer Confidence & Supply to Farage? I suspect this is something she has been pondering - I would if I were her.

    Publicly, it will be all about maximising the Conservative vote but as we know what leaders say before the votes are cast and what they do once they are counted aren't always the same.

    Davey faces a similar dilemma - would he support a minority second term Labour Government with Confidence & Supply?

    Both Badenoch and Davey could come out before the election and say they will neither support a Reform minority nor a Labour minority but the charge then will be, as it would have for Clegg in 2010, to have been to cause chaos in the name of self indulgence.

    The test would then be whether either or both would vote down a Reform or Labour Queen's Speech and trigger a second election - I suspect they'd get little thanks from the public for that.
    Yes. Largely agree. It seems to me the Tories may find themselves in a unique situation, for which the name is Zugzwang. As things stand we know that no other significant party will touch Reform with a bargepole. The 'left of centre' grouping (Lab, LD, G, PC, SNP) has an unambiguous nature.

    Obvs the Tories may or may not deal with Reform. Some will only vote for them if they will, some (including me) will only vote for them if the won't. The remaining group who don't care either way exists but isn't a lots of seats winning sized group.

    Only three courses are open to them, and it isn't possible to opt out, as one of the courses is doing and saying nothing:

    Yes we would.
    No we won't.
    Do and say nothing/ambiguity/we decide after the election/we are going to win it doesn't arise. These are identical.

    Each course, as things stand now, is damaging.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 22,463

    The royal family face their biggest crisis since the abdication of Edward in 1936

    They are going to have the press pack hounding them whenever or wherever they appear in public

    For more than 22 years Andrew was second-in-line to the throne. It's bad, but it's out of their hands now. Not sure whether it's better for them to see him convicted, and housed at His Majesty's Pleasure somewhere less comfortable than Sandringham, or not.
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 2,343
    Dura_Ace said:

    The royal family face their biggest crisis since the abdication of Edward in 1936

    They are going to have the press pack hounding them whenever or wherever they appear in public

    Yeah, King Prince Charles is going to have to constantly answer questions about what he knew and when. I suspect his preening self-regard will prevent him from chucking the towel and letting the Baldy Basketcase have go to establish a clean break with the sordid past.
    Careful, speculation on King BB the first of Great Britain could result in some on PB exploding with delighted excitement.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 15,052
    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Good day to bury bad news.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 126,411

    Watching this media 'fest' goodness only knows what happens if and when Mandelson is also arrested

    A Prince outranks a former cabinet minister in the fest stakes.

    In my lifetime at least two former cabinet ministers have served prison time, zero Princes.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 21,659

    Watching this media 'fest' goodness only knows what happens if and when Mandelson is also arrested

    Rather less, I'd have thought.

    Partly, the former Grand Old Duke of Yuck was in the queue to be King, which Mandelson wasn't.

    Partly, whilst the allegations against Mandy are very very bad, the ones against Andy are worse- all the same bad stuff, plus Actually Doing It with people who he shouldn't have.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 37,502

    Watching this media 'fest' goodness only knows what happens if and when Mandelson is also arrested

    The arrest of Labour Grandee Mandelson will not be as newsworthy as the arrest of Labour Grandee Andrew Mountbatten -Windsor.

    This is even bigger than Currygate.

    Thank goodness TSE is not on his holibobs.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 42,480
    @fleetstreetfox

    As the Contempt of Court Act is now in effect with regard to allegations of misconduct by the former prince, the reporting free-for-all will have to calm down a bit. I am sure this has not occurred to any of the courtiers and relatives who had to give the nod to this.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 69,857
    Sky saying max penalty is life imprisonment

  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 17,816

    Watching this media 'fest' goodness only knows what happens if and when Mandelson is also arrested

    I suspect it will struggle to find airtime TBH. Nothing can compete with the arrest of the King's brother. I suspect this is a lucky break for Starmer, even if it does suggest a Mandy nicking is also incoming.
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 597

    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Not concerned by the bullying allegations? Of course not, she's on your side and that kind of thing only matters when your opponents do it, right?
    No one has been concerned by bullying allegations for 10 years

    Who the feck has she worked for on that time.

    Oh the Daily fucking Mail... Its OK for a bully to work for May, Boris, Truss Sunak no problem, give her a chance.

    The minute Starmer appoints her... Oh let's spread some fucking shit

    Total hypocricicy

    Which Tory will be the attack bitch

    Pritti Patel PMSL
    I'd have more respect for you if you owned it. You went nuts last week about a Tory who had allegations made sitting next to Badenoch, now you don't care about allegations.

    Never change.
    Romeo has been vetted and passed for senior roles under Tory PMs and passed.

    She was vetted in 2024 for this role and past.

    Bullying Allegations were made ALLEGATIONS

    Patel was found GUILTY

    No Tory PM has the backbone to remove her despite her GUILT

    You just carry on digging that hole of complete hypocrisy.
    Wasn't Mandelson also vetted and approved?
    Not the level of vetting Romeo has had on 4 occasions

    The allegations in 2016 were fully investigated and turfed out, no case to answer.

    May be you should be asking May, Boris, Truss and Sunak why they were happy to have her.?

    MAY BE you should also ask Sunak and Badenoch why they work with a BULLY found GUILTY by the Independent assessor

  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 13,437
    edited 10:56AM
    Brixian59 said:

    Odds on Mandy being arrested also within 48 hours I reckon

    Dunno. Mandelson is about 100x smarter than Andrew, so the evidence is likely much harder to dig up.

    At Police Scotland speed I'd give it about 2 years.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,017

    The royal family face their biggest crisis since the abdication of Edward in 1936

    They are going to have the press pack hounding them whenever or wherever they appear in public

    For more than 22 years Andrew was second-in-line to the throne. It's bad, but it's out of their hands now. Not sure whether it's better for them to see him convicted, and housed at His Majesty's Pleasure somewhere less comfortable than Sandringham, or not.
    Having a lag in the family would show the common touch...
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 597

    Watching this media 'fest' goodness only knows what happens if and when Mandelson is also arrested

    I suspect it will struggle to find airtime TBH. Nothing can compete with the arrest of the King's brother. I suspect this is a lucky break for Starmer, even if it does suggest a Mandy nicking is also incoming.
    No Emmerdale or Coronation Street for weeks... ITN will go in to meltdown
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 39,347

    Leon said:

    It’s just depressing how brutally the UK is divided. A division mirrored on PB

    There is one way to unite the country, some kind of grand project we can all get behind. To that end I propose

    THE LEONDAMUS MEMORIAL PARK

    It should occupy the largely unnecessary green spaces that at present form Regent’s Park. Instead of the silly football fields and zoo, there would be a 8000 metre high statue of me, made from Cornish granite, serpentine, emeralds, and inexplicably radioactive Portland stone, surrounded by various pavilions inscribed with jewels spelling out some of my most famous neologisms from PB like “baxtered”, “skyr tolmakersson”, “rogerdamus”, “gaylording ponceyboots”, “eadric”, “farmy farm” and “only one photo a day”

    Various stalls would be erected season by season offering fruit ices and gummy bears with profits going to my own charity, inspired by Save the Children, which we all know as “save the really hot ones”

    We tried the national monument wheeze with the Millennium Dome and all we got out of that was Lord Mandelson.
    Odd thing about the Millennium Dome. For all the criticism and the ghastliness of the 1999 NYE party, my wife went there to the exhibition and really enjoyed it. And it then became a successful venue.
    I agree with her. The Dome was fantastic. I went there about 4 times during 2000. The media didn't like it because on 31st December 1999 they were left out in the cold by a fire alert at Stratford tube station. It's a long story.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 15,052

    Watching this media 'fest' goodness only knows what happens if and when Mandelson is also arrested

    Mandelson wont be arrested. The Security Services wont allow it.
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 597

    Sky saying max penalty is life imprisonment

    He'll be OK he has his own Tower
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 9,909

    Watching this media 'fest' goodness only knows what happens if and when Mandelson is also arrested

    A Prince outranks a former cabinet minister in the fest stakes.

    In my lifetime at least two former cabinet ministers have served prison time, zero Princes.
    Technically, this would be "The Andrew Formerly Known As Prince"?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,017

    The royal family face their biggest crisis since the abdication of Edward in 1936

    They are going to have the press pack hounding them whenever or wherever they appear in public

    Like they ever needed an excuse.

    But now they have one.
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 7,921

    Sky saying max penalty is life imprisonment

    It is, I believe MIPO is one of those common law crimes with no basis in legislation.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 13,242

    Sky saying max penalty is life imprisonment

    That just means its a common law offence, meaning not one defined in legislation, so Parliament has not set a maximum penalty for it. The offence is due to be replaced by some statutory gubbins this Parliament sometime.

    Fill your boots on the detail -

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/prosecution-guidance/misconduct-public-office
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 8,362
    Scott_xP said:

    @fleetstreetfox

    As the Contempt of Court Act is now in effect with regard to allegations of misconduct by the former prince, the reporting free-for-all will have to calm down a bit. I am sure this has not occurred to any of the courtiers and relatives who had to give the nod to this.

    Sounds like the kind of sneaky advice Mandelson might give.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 16,118

    Morning all.
    The Standard has a piece up digging muvh too deeply and earnestly into the London subsample of this polling suggesting Reform will get shut out (they weirdly seem to suggest zero Reform seats at a GE in London)
    Not suggesting we take that at face value but it mentions areas like Bexley snd Bromley swinging behind the Tories to stop Reform.
    We have a good test of that theory coming up........

    As far as Bromley goes, Reform narrowly took Bromley Common at near the height of their popularity in July and the bottom of the Tories and there is 32% Lab LD to 'squeeze' (if we follow the Standard). Bromley will be, i think, a good test of the Tory firewall

    Sub samples? I was told off for using a sub sample of England VI and a weighted vote of 2000 yet the Standard is probably playing guesswork with much smaller numbers.

    On other sites, there are all sorts of analyses and predictions about London right down to Ward level. In truth, no one, except those very close to a particular area, knows for sure and that's the fascination. I can make some informed predictions on Newham but I could very easily be wrong.

    A lot will depend on the candidates and the extent to which, for example, Reform fields full slates or whether in their weaker areas, both the Labour and Conservative parties will struggle to find candidates.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 16,118
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    It’s just depressing how brutally the UK is divided. A division mirrored on PB

    There is one way to unite the country, some kind of grand project we can all get behind. To that end I propose

    THE LEONDAMUS MEMORIAL PARK

    It should occupy the largely unnecessary green spaces that at present form Regent’s Park. Instead of the silly football fields and zoo, there would be a 8000 metre high statue of me, made from Cornish granite, serpentine, emeralds, and inexplicably radioactive Portland stone, surrounded by various pavilions inscribed with jewels spelling out some of my most famous neologisms from PB like “baxtered”, “skyr tolmakersson”, “rogerdamus”, “gaylording ponceyboots”, “eadric”, “farmy farm” and “only one photo a day”

    Various stalls would be erected season by season offering fruit ices and gummy bears with profits going to my own charity, inspired by Save the Children, which we all know as “save the really hot ones”

    We tried the national monument wheeze with the Millennium Dome and all we got out of that was Lord Mandelson.
    Odd thing about the Millennium Dome. For all the criticism and the ghastliness of the 1999 NYE party, my wife went there to the exhibition and really enjoyed it. And it then became a successful venue.
    I agree with her. The Dome was fantastic. I went there about 4 times during 2000. The media didn't like it because on 31st December 1999 they were left out in the cold by a fire alert at Stratford tube station. It's a long story.
    Have to say I went twice and thought it was marvellous and a real triumph.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 58,017

    Watching this media 'fest' goodness only knows what happens if and when Mandelson is also arrested

    Mandelson wont be arrested. The Security Services wont allow it.
    He knows a lot more dirt than Andrew for sure...
  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 2,343

    Leon said:

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    Like what Mandy allegedly did?
    Yes. I fail to see a significant difference between them

    Andy is thick and was appallingly brought up.
    Also the leaked info he leaked was sh*t, Mandy's was potentially highly lucrative.

    If the Royals are playing their usual role of media cover, then Mandy may be attending a voluntary interview somewhere on the quiet. A bit less pleasant for them than the usual "is her bump showing yet? Kate looks radiant", but former Prince "paedo" arrested for misconduct does the job.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 8,362
    DougSeal said:

    Sky saying max penalty is life imprisonment

    That just means its a common law offence, meaning not one defined in legislation, so Parliament has not set a maximum penalty for it. The offence is due to be replaced by some statutory gubbins this Parliament sometime.

    Fill your boots on the detail -

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/prosecution-guidance/misconduct-public-office
    Wouldn't his first line of defence be that he wasn't in public office? He wasn't paid to be Trade Envoy, for example.
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 597

    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Not concerned by the bullying allegations? Of course not, she's on your side and that kind of thing only matters when your opponents do it, right?
    No one has been concerned by bullying allegations for 10 years

    Who the feck has she worked for on that time.

    Oh the Daily fucking Mail... Its OK for a bully to work for May, Boris, Truss Sunak no problem, give her a chance.

    The minute Starmer appoints her... Oh let's spread some fucking shit

    Total hypocricicy

    Which Tory will be the attack bitch

    Pritti Patel PMSL
    I'd have more respect for you if you owned it. You went nuts last week about a Tory who had allegations made sitting next to Badenoch, now you don't care about allegations.

    Never change.
    Romeo has been vetted and passed for senior roles under Tory PMs and passed.

    She was vetted in 2024 for this role and past.

    Bullying Allegations were made ALLEGATIONS

    Patel was found GUILTY

    No Tory PM has the backbone to remove her despite her GUILT

    You just carry on digging that hole of complete hypocrisy.
    Who mentioned Patel? You were wibbling about a male Tory MP last week.
    Yes the one who cannot be named...

    I call him cedilla man
  • TazTaz Posts: 25,091

    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Not concerned by the bullying allegations? Of course not, she's on your side and that kind of thing only matters when your opponents do it, right?
    No one has been concerned by bullying allegations for 10 years

    Who the feck has she worked for on that time.

    Oh the Daily fucking Mail... Its OK for a bully to work for May, Boris, Truss Sunak no problem, give her a chance.

    The minute Starmer appoints her... Oh let's spread some fucking shit

    Total hypocricicy

    Which Tory will be the attack bitch

    Pritti Patel PMSL
    I'd have more respect for you if you owned it. You went nuts last week about a Tory who had allegations made sitting next to Badenoch, now you don't care about allegations.

    Never change.
    When it is chatting about Brum, food, Blues and stuff Brixian is sound but the tribal stuff is just way too much.
  • MustaphaMondeoMustaphaMondeo Posts: 486
    MattW said:

    stodge said:

    algarkirk said:

    Interesting polling. In all but two of the match ups (Lib Dems vs Labour or the Greens) the more left wing option is ahead.

    Yes, very interesting polling. Reform lose every contest, with the implication they have the plurality of unpopularity as well as, from current general polling, the plurality of popularity.

    So ensuring they don't form a government should be easy.

    There is one central problem, and another secondary problem, and the next election may well turn on its resolution: Firstly identifying the party in each relevant seat that can beat Reform in a world where Labour unusually hold all the seats that are most likely to change hands, but are now unloved.

    (Cumbria, apart from Farron's seat is my example but is typical: 2024: all Labour. 2019: all Tory. Projected 2029: all Reform. Which party is the tactical vote?)

    The secondary problem is how to know if voting Tory is in fact a vote for a Reform + Tory government or not.

    Indeed and this is the big question for Badenoch going forward. Whatever her public criticisms of Reform before an election, do we still think IF the numbers work for a Reform minority Government, she will offer Confidence & Supply to Farage? I suspect this is something she has been pondering - I would if I were her.

    Publicly, it will be all about maximising the Conservative vote but as we know what leaders say before the votes are cast and what they do once they are counted aren't always the same.

    Davey faces a similar dilemma - would he support a minority second term Labour Government with Confidence & Supply?

    Both Badenoch and Davey could come out before the election and say they will neither support a Reform minority nor a Labour minority but the charge then will be, as it would have for Clegg in 2010, to have been to cause chaos in the name of self indulgence.

    The test would then be whether either or both would vote down a Reform or Labour Queen's Speech and trigger a second election - I suspect they'd get little thanks from the public for that.
    I think we will see semi-official unpublicised verbal agreements to lay off certain constituencies, as we did between Lab and Lib in 1997.

    I'm not sure which parties would be involved though - perhaps the Greens as their realistic target seats will be few and far between most likely.
    Greens came second in 40 seats in 2024
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,651

    Pulpstar said:

    The BBC reckons there's no precedent for the arrest, but go back 500 years or so and they were sticking each other in the Tower of London all the time.

    I think the practice came to an end when the Stuarts replaced the Tudors. One of the traditions of the Norman/Welsh Kings of England that the Scottish and German monarchs didn't imitate.

    I suppose it rather lost its charm when Parliament started in on the imprisoning/executing Royals line of business.
    This is part of what makes 17th century British history so amazing. In 1599 we still lived in the world of killing royals and catholics, religious wars across Europe and absolute monarchs. By 1699 we were in the world of Lockean liberalism, The Toleration Act, and parliament deciding who the monarch was and how the succession worked, and no-one being killed for believing something a bit odd.

    (The last was 1697, Thomas Akenhead, hanged in Edinburgh for blasphemy.)
  • DoctorGDoctorG Posts: 506
    Ian Hyslop seems fairly sure of what's going to happen to Mandy, I agree with him

    https://youtu.be/7CyDNxPnvhw?si=l2geig-XHvPQapGd
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,623
    They do say out west in the county where the great ones gather....... beware the turnip truncheon, bor
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 7,536
    Eabhal said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Odds on Mandy being arrested also within 48 hours I reckon

    Dunno. Mandelson is about 100x smarter than Andrew, so the evidence is likely much harder to dig up.

    At Police Scotland speed I'd give it about 2 years.
    I assume if Andy M-W doesn’t have to attend court before the elections, the Tories will shout “corruption”
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 69,857
    edited 11:05AM
    Police issue state that this case is sub judice and warned the media accordingly
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 597
    Taz said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Not concerned by the bullying allegations? Of course not, she's on your side and that kind of thing only matters when your opponents do it, right?
    No one has been concerned by bullying allegations for 10 years

    Who the feck has she worked for on that time.

    Oh the Daily fucking Mail... Its OK for a bully to work for May, Boris, Truss Sunak no problem, give her a chance.

    The minute Starmer appoints her... Oh let's spread some fucking shit

    Total hypocricicy

    Which Tory will be the attack bitch

    Pritti Patel PMSL
    I'd have more respect for you if you owned it. You went nuts last week about a Tory who had allegations made sitting next to Badenoch, now you don't care about allegations.

    Never change.
    When it is chatting about Brum, food, Blues and stuff Brixian is sound but the tribal stuff is just way too much.
    Labour appoint a woman who has held 3 key private secretary posts under Tory Governments...

    Nothing tribal from me.

    It's not like they've appointed Jack Grealish as Minister for Sport

    The only tribality is from the Tories, OK for them, a bully suddenly for us
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 21,964
    carnforth said:

    DougSeal said:

    Sky saying max penalty is life imprisonment

    That just means its a common law offence, meaning not one defined in legislation, so Parliament has not set a maximum penalty for it. The offence is due to be replaced by some statutory gubbins this Parliament sometime.

    Fill your boots on the detail -

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/prosecution-guidance/misconduct-public-office
    Wouldn't his first line of defence be that he wasn't in public office? He wasn't paid to be Trade Envoy, for example.
    He was paid his money for being Royal. Where did that come from?
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 16,651

    Watching this media 'fest' goodness only knows what happens if and when Mandelson is also arrested

    I suspect it will struggle to find airtime TBH. Nothing can compete with the arrest of the King's brother. I suspect this is a lucky break for Starmer, even if it does suggest a Mandy nicking is also incoming.
    It's also an airtime challenge, as the story is unmissable but actually there is nothing of substance you can say.

  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,623
    stodge said:

    Morning all.
    The Standard has a piece up digging muvh too deeply and earnestly into the London subsample of this polling suggesting Reform will get shut out (they weirdly seem to suggest zero Reform seats at a GE in London)
    Not suggesting we take that at face value but it mentions areas like Bexley snd Bromley swinging behind the Tories to stop Reform.
    We have a good test of that theory coming up........

    As far as Bromley goes, Reform narrowly took Bromley Common at near the height of their popularity in July and the bottom of the Tories and there is 32% Lab LD to 'squeeze' (if we follow the Standard). Bromley will be, i think, a good test of the Tory firewall

    Sub samples? I was told off for using a sub sample of England VI and a weighted vote of 2000 yet the Standard is probably playing guesswork with much smaller numbers.

    On other sites, there are all sorts of analyses and predictions about London right down to Ward level. In truth, no one, except those very close to a particular area, knows for sure and that's the fascination. I can make some informed predictions on Newham but I could very easily be wrong.

    A lot will depend on the candidates and the extent to which, for example, Reform fields full slates or whether in their weaker areas, both the Labour and Conservative parties will struggle to find candidates.
    500 odd. So, yes, much smaller numbers
    It is indeed fascinating. The by elections since last May at least give us the kernel of an idea
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 8,362
    Politico: Chagos deal legislation delayed.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/uk-to-pause-for-thought-on-chagos-islands-deal-after-us-donald-trump-blast/

    "Keir Starmer’s administration will “pause for thought” on plans to bring legislation underpinning the deal back to the House of Lords, a senior U.K. government official briefed on the plans and granted anonymity because they are not authorized to speak on the record, said."
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 15,623

    Police issue state that this case is sub judice and warned the media accordingly

    Good luck with that, plod
    But a timely remindrr here to be careful
  • TazTaz Posts: 25,091
    Leon said:

    ydoethur said:

    Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office, BBC understands

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c70kjr9wjw0t

    Like what Mandy allegedly did?
    This must have been what Starmer enigmatically referred to yesterday when he said 'nobody is above the law.'
    Just seems odd that Pandy is arrested for “misconduct in public office” for the Trade Envoy emails and Mandy isn’t for the ones he allegedly sent.
    Recall, however, that the police have searched Lord Mandypants’s homes in London and Wiltshire and, if they are actually arresting the Andrew formerly known as Prince, then an arrest of Lord M may not be far away

    This isn’t going away soon, not for the royals and not for Skyr
    Given the govt has commissioned a report into foreign interference in UK politics, timed just to come out before the locals, and ostensibly to label Reform fully pro Russian do you really expect they will allow Mandelson with the Russian, and other, allegations plaguing him to be arrested and interviewed about it ?

    If it happens it will be post May.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,496
    Brixian59 said:

    Taz said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Brixian59 said:

    Dame Antonia Romeo appointed Cabinet Secretary

    Great move

    A real achiever who delivers.

    Breaks the men's CLUB mantra

    Excellent service and widely respected by successive Tory Governments

    Let's cut the bullshit of a few mysoginst old duffers who have tried to smear her. If the Right Wing media attack her there will be hundreds of positive quotes from previous Tory Ministers she's worked for.

    Not concerned by the bullying allegations? Of course not, she's on your side and that kind of thing only matters when your opponents do it, right?
    No one has been concerned by bullying allegations for 10 years

    Who the feck has she worked for on that time.

    Oh the Daily fucking Mail... Its OK for a bully to work for May, Boris, Truss Sunak no problem, give her a chance.

    The minute Starmer appoints her... Oh let's spread some fucking shit

    Total hypocricicy

    Which Tory will be the attack bitch

    Pritti Patel PMSL
    I'd have more respect for you if you owned it. You went nuts last week about a Tory who had allegations made sitting next to Badenoch, now you don't care about allegations.

    Never change.
    When it is chatting about Brum, food, Blues and stuff Brixian is sound but the tribal stuff is just way too much.
    Labour appoint a woman who has held 3 key private secretary posts under Tory Governments...

    Nothing tribal from me.

    It's not like they've appointed Jack Grealish as Minister for Sport

    The only tribality is from the Tories, OK for them, a bully suddenly for us
    Come off it. Jack would be great in that role - and England duties are unlikely to interfere any time soon.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 8,362

    carnforth said:

    DougSeal said:

    Sky saying max penalty is life imprisonment

    That just means its a common law offence, meaning not one defined in legislation, so Parliament has not set a maximum penalty for it. The offence is due to be replaced by some statutory gubbins this Parliament sometime.

    Fill your boots on the detail -

    https://www.cps.gov.uk/prosecution-guidance/misconduct-public-office
    Wouldn't his first line of defence be that he wasn't in public office? He wasn't paid to be Trade Envoy, for example.
    He was paid his money for being Royal. Where did that come from?
    You said it yourself: for being royal.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 80,574
    edited 11:09AM
    Women's curling:

    Canada vs Korea is a straight shoot out, winner goes through, loser goes home.
    We need to win and the USA to lose for team GB to go through.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,100
    Scott_xP said:

    @janinegibson.ft.com‬

    take a shot every time you hear the words "just glad the queen isn't here to see this"

    That she isn't here might be a factor in it happening.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 15,208
    Mandelson should do a Ronnie Biggs and scarper to Rio while he can.

    Nothing became his life like the leaving of it... Macbeth
  • MattWMattW Posts: 32,175

    MattW said:

    stodge said:

    algarkirk said:

    Interesting polling. In all but two of the match ups (Lib Dems vs Labour or the Greens) the more left wing option is ahead.

    Yes, very interesting polling. Reform lose every contest, with the implication they have the plurality of unpopularity as well as, from current general polling, the plurality of popularity.

    So ensuring they don't form a government should be easy.

    There is one central problem, and another secondary problem, and the next election may well turn on its resolution: Firstly identifying the party in each relevant seat that can beat Reform in a world where Labour unusually hold all the seats that are most likely to change hands, but are now unloved.

    (Cumbria, apart from Farron's seat is my example but is typical: 2024: all Labour. 2019: all Tory. Projected 2029: all Reform. Which party is the tactical vote?)

    The secondary problem is how to know if voting Tory is in fact a vote for a Reform + Tory government or not.

    Indeed and this is the big question for Badenoch going forward. Whatever her public criticisms of Reform before an election, do we still think IF the numbers work for a Reform minority Government, she will offer Confidence & Supply to Farage? I suspect this is something she has been pondering - I would if I were her.

    Publicly, it will be all about maximising the Conservative vote but as we know what leaders say before the votes are cast and what they do once they are counted aren't always the same.

    Davey faces a similar dilemma - would he support a minority second term Labour Government with Confidence & Supply?

    Both Badenoch and Davey could come out before the election and say they will neither support a Reform minority nor a Labour minority but the charge then will be, as it would have for Clegg in 2010, to have been to cause chaos in the name of self indulgence.

    The test would then be whether either or both would vote down a Reform or Labour Queen's Speech and trigger a second election - I suspect they'd get little thanks from the public for that.
    I think we will see semi-official unpublicised verbal agreements to lay off certain constituencies, as we did between Lab and Lib in 1997.

    I'm not sure which parties would be involved though - perhaps the Greens as their realistic target seats will be few and far between most likely.
    Greens came second in 40 seats in 2024
    That looks like a good basis for a negotiation - a decent number of targets to ask another party to leave alone, or to agree to leave alone.

    I call it for 5-10 Green seats in 2029 !
  • stodgestodge Posts: 16,118
    algarkirk said:

    stodge said:

    algarkirk said:

    Interesting polling. In all but two of the match ups (Lib Dems vs Labour or the Greens) the more left wing option is ahead.

    Yes, very interesting polling. Reform lose every contest, with the implication they have the plurality of unpopularity as well as, from current general polling, the plurality of popularity.

    So ensuring they don't form a government should be easy.

    There is one central problem, and another secondary problem, and the next election may well turn on its resolution: Firstly identifying the party in each relevant seat that can beat Reform in a world where Labour unusually hold all the seats that are most likely to change hands, but are now unloved.

    (Cumbria, apart from Farron's seat is my example but is typical: 2024: all Labour. 2019: all Tory. Projected 2029: all Reform. Which party is the tactical vote?)

    The secondary problem is how to know if voting Tory is in fact a vote for a Reform + Tory government or not.

    Indeed and this is the big question for Badenoch going forward. Whatever her public criticisms of Reform before an election, do we still think IF the numbers work for a Reform minority Government, she will offer Confidence & Supply to Farage? I suspect this is something she has been pondering - I would if I were her.

    Publicly, it will be all about maximising the Conservative vote but as we know what leaders say before the votes are cast and what they do once they are counted aren't always the same.

    Davey faces a similar dilemma - would he support a minority second term Labour Government with Confidence & Supply?

    Both Badenoch and Davey could come out before the election and say they will neither support a Reform minority nor a Labour minority but the charge then will be, as it would have for Clegg in 2010, to have been to cause chaos in the name of self indulgence.

    The test would then be whether either or both would vote down a Reform or Labour Queen's Speech and trigger a second election - I suspect they'd get little thanks from the public for that.
    Yes. Largely agree. It seems to me the Tories may find themselves in a unique situation, for which the name is Zugzwang. As things stand we know that no other significant party will touch Reform with a bargepole. The 'left of centre' grouping (Lab, LD, G, PC, SNP) has an unambiguous nature.

    Obvs the Tories may or may not deal with Reform. Some will only vote for them if they will, some (including me) will only vote for them if the won't. The remaining group who don't care either way exists but isn't a lots of seats winning sized group.

    Only three courses are open to them, and it isn't possible to opt out, as one of the courses is doing and saying nothing:

    Yes we would.
    No we won't.
    Do and say nothing/ambiguity/we decide after the election/we are going to win it doesn't arise. These are identical.

    Each course, as things stand now, is damaging.
    Yes and the LDs, who have had much more experience of this, called it "equidistance" and that policy served them well until 2010. If, of course, Reform or Labour win an outright majority, it won't matter and both Badenoch and Davey will probably and quietly breathe a sigh of relief.

    The other "hope" for Badenoch is Restore Britain - if, pace Referendum in 1997, Lowe's party has the funds to put up a candidate in every seat, they will likely draw 2-4% away from Reform which could make all the difference.

    Should we start saying "Vote Lowe, Get Starmer" ?
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