The country is becoming ungovernable. Both far left and far right are promising the moon on a stick . Most of the public are in denial and refuse to accept the reality . I love France and have lived there but there’s a refusal to even accept that they’re fast approaching a complete meltdown in the finances .
Race blind casting is not the only kind of woke disruption I can’t abide. Essentially any BBC (and more generally British) period drama is now thoroughly infested with a kind of weird didactic wokery that I seem to have a strong allergy to.
The recent Ruth Ellis drama was unwatchable just to name an example that springs to mind (and the lead actress was rubbish).
Compare with “The Wire”, “Shogun”, “Mad Men”, which address race and gender issues but don’t seek to blatantly re-write history or create “goodies and baddies” based on race, gender, or class.
What was the specific issue with the Ruth Ellis drama. We didn’t watch it.
Superficial and simplistic, felt like 2025 just with 1950s costumes, and as I said, the lead actress wasn’t up to it.
Much harder for actor types to get sufficiently experienced that they are up to anything high-profile. Provincial theatre is dead, as is second-tier telly drama.
Understandably so in many cases, but it does stopper the pipeline.
Has there been any detailed, electorate based, analysis of possible outcomes given the way current polling is going?
MRP-style?
I’m assuming that Reform will top the polls, but they will be far short of a majority, and a Labour/LD coalition looks most likely. But I haven’t seen any good analysis on this, only comments that say things like “Wow, Tories will lose ALL seats using this defunct swing-based web tool!”
Reform would be the biggest party, on 290 seats. An anti-Reform coalition could be put together, but it's doubtful how long-lasting it would be.
Thanks. This suggests a Reform/Con coalition or perhaps a less formal arrangement.
I still think Lab/LD is the most likely (60%) outcome right now, with all the caveats about the wild volatility we now live with, and the many years still to go.
And as a side note, SNP’s relative return to strength, and the possibility that Labour will be dependent on SNP votes, also points to Sindy being back on the agenda in in the next parliament.
But that aside, I don’t think the Establishment has yet viscerally understood that a Reform-led government looks highly possible, if not yet probable.
Why don't you think that? Labour's campaigning (inept as it is) seems primarily aimed at the threat from Reform UK, for example.
Has there been any detailed, electorate based, analysis of possible outcomes given the way current polling is going?
MRP-style?
I’m assuming that Reform will top the polls, but they will be far short of a majority, and a Labour/LD coalition looks most likely. But I haven’t seen any good analysis on this, only comments that say things like “Wow, Tories will lose ALL seats using this defunct swing-based web tool!”
Reform would be the biggest party, on 290 seats. An anti-Reform coalition could be put together, but it's doubtful how long-lasting it would be.
Thanks. This suggests a Reform/Con coalition or perhaps a less formal arrangement.
I still think Lab/LD is the most likely (60%) outcome right now, with all the caveats about the wild volatility we now live with, and the many years still to go.
And as a side note, SNP’s relative return to strength, and the possibility that Labour will be dependent on SNP votes, also points to Sindy being back on the agenda in in the next parliament.
But that aside, I don’t think the Establishment has yet viscerally understood that a Reform-led government looks highly possible, if not yet probable.
The country is becoming ungovernable. Both far left and far right are promising the moon on a stick . Most of the public are in denial and refuse to accept the reality . I love France and have lived there but there’s a refusal to even accept that they’re fast approaching a complete meltdown in the finances .
The one good thing about French politics is that it makes ours seem relatively reasonable by comparison.
Race blind casting is not the only kind of woke disruption I can’t abide. Essentially any BBC (and more generally British) period drama is now thoroughly infested with a kind of weird didactic wokery that I seem to have a strong allergy to.
The recent Ruth Ellis drama was unwatchable just to name an example that springs to mind (and the lead actress was rubbish).
Compare with “The Wire”, “Shogun”, “Mad Men”, which address race and gender issues but don’t seek to blatantly re-write history or create “goodies and baddies” based on race, gender, or class.
What was the specific issue with the Ruth Ellis drama. We didn’t watch it.
Superficial and simplistic, felt like 2025 just with 1950s costumes, and as I said, the lead actress wasn’t up to it.
This is true of most period drama in my experience. "Ha ha, look at those unenlightened idiots who live in the past, not like us clever sophisticated inhabitants of the 21st century, or at least those bits of it we approve of..." Oddly, this only seems to apply over the last thousand years - once you get beyond that the inhabitants of the past seem to get treated with a little more respect.
Medieval people get frequently depicted as clods and bigots, burning (young, sexy), witches, forcing women into prostitution (supposedly, the only occupation available to a woman other than nun or mother), and dressing like the cenobites from Hellraiser. Or else, they’re 21st century people in drag. Game of Thrones (which is fantasy, but often defended as “that’s how it was”), managed to do both.
Making the past strange, but relatable, is difficult, but a series like Wolf Hall shows it can be done.
The notion that “we” (always the current generation), are terribly enlightened, but the past was barbaric, is very wrong.
At one end there are the "Patriots" who can be satirised by pointing out that St George was probably Turkish.
A minor point, but since St. George died around 303 AD, and there were not any Turks in the area of his birth for another 700 years, it is extremely unlikely that he was Turkish. He was a Roman soldier and so far as anyone can tell, a Cappadocian Greek, though his mother was apparently from Lydda (present-day Lod, Israel), which is where he is believed to have died and where his early veneration as a saint took hold.
The country is becoming ungovernable. Both far left and far right are promising the moon on a stick . Most of the public are in denial and refuse to accept the reality . I love France and have lived there but there’s a refusal to even accept that they’re fast approaching a complete meltdown in the finances .
True for the last couple of centuries, yet they keep going.
Has there been any detailed, electorate based, analysis of possible outcomes given the way current polling is going?
MRP-style?
I’m assuming that Reform will top the polls, but they will be far short of a majority, and a Labour/LD coalition looks most likely. But I haven’t seen any good analysis on this, only comments that say things like “Wow, Tories will lose ALL seats using this defunct swing-based web tool!”
Reform would be the biggest party, on 290 seats. An anti-Reform coalition could be put together, but it's doubtful how long-lasting it would be.
Thanks. This suggests a Reform/Con coalition or perhaps a less formal arrangement.
I still think Lab/LD is the most likely (60%) outcome right now, with all the caveats about the wild volatility we now live with, and the many years still to go.
And as a side note, SNP’s relative return to strength, and the possibility that Labour will be dependent on SNP votes, also points to Sindy being back on the agenda in in the next parliament.
But that aside, I don’t think the Establishment has yet viscerally understood that a Reform-led government looks highly possible, if not yet probable.
Why don't you think that? Labour's campaigning (inept as it is) seems primarily aimed at the threat from Reform UK, for example.
Because such campaigning as there is, is half-hearted and complacent.
Has there been any detailed, electorate based, analysis of possible outcomes given the way current polling is going?
MRP-style?
I’m assuming that Reform will top the polls, but they will be far short of a majority, and a Labour/LD coalition looks most likely. But I haven’t seen any good analysis on this, only comments that say things like “Wow, Tories will lose ALL seats using this defunct swing-based web tool!”
Reform would be the biggest party, on 290 seats. An anti-Reform coalition could be put together, but it's doubtful how long-lasting it would be.
Thanks. This suggests a Reform/Con coalition or perhaps a less formal arrangement.
I still think Lab/LD is the most likely (60%) outcome right now, with all the caveats about the wild volatility we now live with, and the many years still to go.
And as a side note, SNP’s relative return to strength, and the possibility that Labour will be dependent on SNP votes, also points to Sindy being back on the agenda in in the next parliament.
But that aside, I don’t think the Establishment has yet viscerally understood that a Reform-led government looks highly possible, if not yet probable.
Why don't you think that? Labour's campaigning (inept as it is) seems primarily aimed at the threat from Reform UK, for example.
Because such campaigning as there is, is half-hearted and complacent.
Reform are an existential threat to the UK.
I think it's bad, but I don't think that proves the Establishment has not "yet viscerally understood that a Reform-led government looks highly possible". It just means Labour are bad at comms.
The country is becoming ungovernable. Both far left and far right are promising the moon on a stick . Most of the public are in denial and refuse to accept the reality . I love France and have lived there but there’s a refusal to even accept that they’re fast approaching a complete meltdown in the finances .
The one good thing about French politics is that it makes ours seem relatively reasonable by comparison.
Yes I’m afraid the French don’t want to accept that some things might have to change . And the far left and far right are busy trying to score political points and duping the public . It’s going to end in tears .
This is something I have changed my mind on to a certain extent; in the past I’d agree that using non white actors in British period pieces was ‘PC gone max’, but now I think it would be completely wrong to deny a black actor the chance to be cast in one. A multi racial school doing a play about the 1966 World Cup Final would cast all kids as players, even though all 22 on the pitch were white, and a production of Shakespeare with an entirely non white cast would be just as legitimate as any other.
Where it does seem provocative is casting title characters; you can’t have a white Mandela or black Henry VIII, although I’d probably be more ok with the latter
BBC series ‘King and Conqueror’ branded ‘woke’ and ‘historically inaccurate’ for featuring black actors playing Anglo-Saxons.
The series portrays the historical Battle of Hastings in 1066 between William, Duke of Normandy and King Harold Godwinson of England.
Only if Jenrick becomes Tory leader could there be a pact with Reform that says
The voters looked from Jenrick to Farage, and from Farage to Jenrick, and from Jenrick to Farage again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
The Telegraph article makes the Taliban sound all warm and cuddly . The main difference between the controversial German scheme and the one proposed by Farage is the former are sending back failed asylum seekers and criminals versus the latter in which all Afghans arriving by boat would be sent back .
I know we’re currently living in a climate of zero empathy or humanity but do the British public want to send people back who could be executed as soon as they arrive , are they willing to send back women to be stoned to death ?
The test of an asylum policy is what would have happened had it been applied in the 1930s. Farage would have sent Jews back to Nazi Germany.
British governments from the 1930s through to 1948 were hardly sympathetic to Jewish immigration. Their hostility contributed to the Struma disaster in February 1942.
Has there been any detailed, electorate based, analysis of possible outcomes given the way current polling is going?
MRP-style?
I’m assuming that Reform will top the polls, but they will be far short of a majority, and a Labour/LD coalition looks most likely. But I haven’t seen any good analysis on this, only comments that say things like “Wow, Tories will lose ALL seats using this defunct swing-based web tool!”
The country is becoming ungovernable. Both far left and far right are promising the moon on a stick . Most of the public are in denial and refuse to accept the reality . I love France and have lived there but there’s a refusal to even accept that they’re fast approaching a complete meltdown in the finances .
The one good thing about French politics is that it makes ours seem relatively reasonable by comparison.
Yes I’m afraid the French don’t want to accept that some things might have to change . And the far left and far right are busy trying to score political points and duping the public . It’s going to end in tears .
To be honest I don't see much difference here in the UK
The country is becoming ungovernable. Both far left and far right are promising the moon on a stick . Most of the public are in denial and refuse to accept the reality . I love France and have lived there but there’s a refusal to even accept that they’re fast approaching a complete meltdown in the finances .
True for the last couple of centuries, yet they keep going.
This time they can’t keep kicking the can down the road .
Here’s an excellent article by the wonderful French commentator Agnes Poirier .
At one end there are the "Patriots" who can be satirised by pointing out that St George was probably Turkish.
A minor point, but since St. George died around 303 AD, and there were not any Turks in the area of his birth for another 700 years, it is extremely unlikely that he was Turkish. He was a Roman soldier and so far as anyone can tell, a Cappadocian Greek, though his mother was apparently from Lydda (present-day Lod, Israel), which is where he is believed to have died and where his early veneration as a saint took hold.
In any case, he certainly wasn't an Anglo-Saxon.
Probably a fair point !
But Turkish is all Greek to me - especially since I went over the handlebars of a Brompton in Istanbul, when the tramlines (which was where I had been advised to cycle ... the other way) took my Brompton left at a set of points, and I went straight on.
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
The country is becoming ungovernable. Both far left and far right are promising the moon on a stick . Most of the public are in denial and refuse to accept the reality . I love France and have lived there but there’s a refusal to even accept that they’re fast approaching a complete meltdown in the finances .
The one good thing about French politics is that it makes ours seem relatively reasonable by comparison.
Yes I’m afraid the French don’t want to accept that some things might have to change . And the far left and far right are busy trying to score political points and duping the public . It’s going to end in tears .
To be honest I don't see much difference here in the UK
Difference here is Starmer has a big Labour majority in Parliament, while Macron faces a French Parliament where the far left have most seats but neither they, the far right nor the centre right and Macron's party combined have a majority
Only if Jenrick becomes Tory leader could there be a pact with Reform that says
The voters looked from Jenrick to Farage, and from Farage to Jenrick, and from Jenrick to Farage again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
This is something I have changed my mind on to a certain extent; in the past I’d agree that using non white actors in British period pieces was ‘PC gone max’, but now I think it would be completely wrong to deny a black actor the chance to be cast in one. A multi racial school doing a play about the 1966 World Cup Final would cast all kids as players, even though all 22 on the pitch were white, and a production of Shakespeare with an entirely non white cast would be just as legitimate as any other.
Where it does seem provocative is casting title characters; you can’t have a white Mandela or black Henry VIII, although I’d probably be more ok with the latter
BBC series ‘King and Conqueror’ branded ‘woke’ and ‘historically inaccurate’ for featuring black actors playing Anglo-Saxons.
The series portrays the historical Battle of Hastings in 1066 between William, Duke of Normandy and King Harold Godwinson of England.
If you can have actors as black Anglo Saxons you can have an actor as a white Mandela
A nicely thoughtful post there by @isam. I need to watch this as it is the 2nd one of yours I have liked today.
I disagree with you @HYUFD on Nelson Mandela and agree with @isam. Mandela being black is rather fundamental to the whole point of the story. Normans and Anglo Saxons being white is not. OK they clearly weren't black. They also have the wrong haircuts*, and speak the wrong language for the time, but we overlook that. We can overlook (with difficulty I grant you as it is obvious) black Anglo Saxons. It is a bit more difficult to overlook a white Mandela.
* A review I read said it was confusing flipping between the Norman and the Anglo Saxon locations and would have been a lot easy if they had the correct and different haircuts for the time.
It is called acting, if you can act well you should be able to convince in the part regardless of skin colour.
Otherwise if you demand historical figures are represented by actors of the same skin colour that has to apply across the board
I agree on this but it should apply equally. You don’t need to be gay to play a gay person or have killed people and put them under the patio to play Fred West, yet the trans loon lobby, of course, dunked on casting of non ‘trans’ actors in trans roles even getting a Scarlett Johansson show pulled as she backed out due to the furore from the perma-offended brigade. There was also Eddie Redmaye in that film, the Danish Girl IIRC, who got a load of flak for being in it.
I'm half and half here. I think that having had the actual experience makes a big difference, as does challenging the perceptions and assumptions of an audience around skin colour. Though an actor's skill is to understand and portray.
I would struggle to work my way into the head of someone around something as simple as tobacco addiction, for example. Or being an out gay professional footballer - aiui in the UK game we still only have one, following on from Justin Fashanu in 1990. Fashanu hanged himself in a garage in Shoreditch after he was accused of sexual assault.
With all due respect you’re not a professional actor. They immerse themselves in their roles. They inhabit the character and the role.
What you seem to imply would simply narrow the available cast. RTD selected actors on their merit for Queer as Folk, and it works fine.
I think it’s nonsensical to say only a trans actor can play a trans role or only,a straight actor can play a straight role.
..That’s one of the reasons why Kim cast Reina Hardesty, who is Japanese American, as his Korean American character’s daughter in his new Prime Video series Butterfly...
TBH, it's not great. The problem lies more with the lame script, though.
Is "Butterfly" a prequel to the Carla Lane sitcom "Butterflies"?
No, it's another generic, and poorly written, retired assassin resurfaces story.
The spin is that it's a US production using a Korean crew and filmed in Korea. Kim revisiting his roots (he was born in Busan). Sadly it's just not very good.
Only if Jenrick becomes Tory leader could there be a pact with Reform that says
The voters looked from Jenrick to Farage, and from Farage to Jenrick, and from Jenrick to Farage again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
This is something I have changed my mind on to a certain extent; in the past I’d agree that using non white actors in British period pieces was ‘PC gone max’, but now I think it would be completely wrong to deny a black actor the chance to be cast in one. A multi racial school doing a play about the 1966 World Cup Final would cast all kids as players, even though all 22 on the pitch were white, and a production of Shakespeare with an entirely non white cast would be just as legitimate as any other.
Where it does seem provocative is casting title characters; you can’t have a white Mandela or black Henry VIII, although I’d probably be more ok with the latter
BBC series ‘King and Conqueror’ branded ‘woke’ and ‘historically inaccurate’ for featuring black actors playing Anglo-Saxons.
The series portrays the historical Battle of Hastings in 1066 between William, Duke of Normandy and King Harold Godwinson of England.
Much less of a nonsense than having another entire English army sitting on the next hill along watching the battle of Hastings but doing nothing. Which of course never happened. CBS stumped up some money but perverted the production with the usual American made-up-history.
OT - The People's Party is the obvious choice. Aligning with Corbyn's claim to be for the many not the few. Frankly I don't think they'd expect or seek too energetically the votes of too many on here. We forum folks may share Corbyn's age but his followers do not!
How about "For the Many"
"I'm voting for the many" / "vote for the many party" etc
Paul Fanning @trivet1806 At first the question 'How on earth did we get in this position?' seems fantastically disingenuous since the answer is so blindingly obvious – i.e. decades of unchecked legal and illegal immigration nobody voted for.
But then you realise that isn't what he means. He's actually asking why the government's 'messaging' on this hasn't been better.
Because, like all good Blairites, Seldon believes there is no political problem that cannot be solved by lying to the public more effectively.
On immigration problems in the US: Problems, plural.
Four examples: First, a year or so ago, there was a sophisticated scheme busted. Taking advantage of a temporary loophole, the operators brought their clients in from Canada. They were met at the border here in Washington state, provided with false IDs, given airline tickets, and transported to SeaTac, from which they flew all over the US.
Second, an agricltural worker who has been crossing the border illegally to work at large farm, for years.
Third, a "mule" who is transporting drugs for a Mexican cartel, who also crosses the border, illegally, carrying his contraband.
Fourth, a teenage girl in Central America who has been told she now belongs to a gang member, and flees to the US.
All of them, the clients, the worker, the mule, and the girl, may have broken the same law, but I think most would agree that US responses should not be the same for all of them.
(I don't know enough about immigration to the UK to say whether something similar might be true, there.)
Paul Fanning @trivet1806 At first the question 'How on earth did we get in this position?' seems fantastically disingenuous since the answer is so blindingly obvious – i.e. decades of unchecked legal and illegal immigration nobody voted for.
But then you realise that isn't what he means. He's actually asking why the government's 'messaging' on this hasn't been better.
Because, like all good Blairites, Seldon believes there is no political problem that cannot be solved by lying to the public more effectively.
Works for Farage, Putin, Modi, Orban, Xi, Trump...
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
Paul Fanning @trivet1806 At first the question 'How on earth did we get in this position?' seems fantastically disingenuous since the answer is so blindingly obvious – i.e. decades of unchecked legal and illegal immigration nobody voted for.
But then you realise that isn't what he means. He's actually asking why the government's 'messaging' on this hasn't been better.
Because, like all good Blairites, Seldon believes there is no political problem that cannot be solved by lying to the public more effectively.
Works for Farage, Putin, Modi, Orban, Xi, Trump...
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
Ofgem make Ofwat look honest and competent. It's far more likely to be about making sure their mates in the energy companies can rip us off in other ways.
This is something I have changed my mind on to a certain extent; in the past I’d agree that using non white actors in British period pieces was ‘PC gone max’, but now I think it would be completely wrong to deny a black actor the chance to be cast in one. A multi racial school doing a play about the 1966 World Cup Final would cast all kids as players, even though all 22 on the pitch were white, and a production of Shakespeare with an entirely non white cast would be just as legitimate as any other.
Where it does seem provocative is casting title characters; you can’t have a white Mandela or black Henry VIII, although I’d probably be more ok with the latter
BBC series ‘King and Conqueror’ branded ‘woke’ and ‘historically inaccurate’ for featuring black actors playing Anglo-Saxons.
The series portrays the historical Battle of Hastings in 1066 between William, Duke of Normandy and King Harold Godwinson of England.
I'm struck by a relative literalism which applies to the colour (and sex?) of actors (Mandela must be black, Nelson must be white), which does not apply to other characteristics such as sexual orientation. I need to go and see a Shakespeare with Othello played by Maxine Peake, or something similar but less extreme.
Adjacently, thinking about people such as Matt Goodwin and his thing about "White British", relying on a political stance built on colour as an important feature of race / nationality. They are going to have to go to Trumpish extremes about colour, because they will need to divert from the fictionalised version of British history they are creating.
Has anyone told them about the make up of the crew of HMS Victory (I had not learned this until this morning)?:
The Telegraph article makes the Taliban sound all warm and cuddly . The main difference between the controversial German scheme and the one proposed by Farage is the former are sending back failed asylum seekers and criminals versus the latter in which all Afghans arriving by boat would be sent back .
I know we’re currently living in a climate of zero empathy or humanity but do the British public want to send people back who could be executed as soon as they arrive , are they willing to send back women to be stoned to death ?
The test of an asylum policy is what would have happened had it been applied in the 1930s. Farage would have sent Jews back to Nazi Germany.
British governments from the 1930s through to 1948 were hardly sympathetic to Jewish immigration. Their hostility contributed to the Struma disaster in February 1942.
Indeed. I'd say British governments from the 1900s through to 1948 were unsympathetic. That's why the 1951 Refugee Convention came about. Because, thank heavens, we realised how wrong we'd been!
Paul Fanning @trivet1806 At first the question 'How on earth did we get in this position?' seems fantastically disingenuous since the answer is so blindingly obvious – i.e. decades of unchecked legal and illegal immigration nobody voted for.
But then you realise that isn't what he means. He's actually asking why the government's 'messaging' on this hasn't been better.
Because, like all good Blairites, Seldon believes there is no political problem that cannot be solved by lying to the public more effectively.
Works for Farage, Putin, Modi, Orban, Xi, Trump...
I'm particularly taken by the relative literalism which applies to the colour (and sex?) of actors (Mandela must be black, Nelson must be white.), which does not apply to other characteristics such as sexual orientation.
Adjacently, I think that if we have people such as Matt Goodwin and his thing about "White British", relying on a political stance built on colour as an important feature of race / nationality, then they are going to have to go to Trumpish extremes about colour, because they need to divert from the fictionalised version of British history they are creating.
Has anyone told them about the make up of the crew of HMS Victory (I had not learnt this until this morning)?:
This is something I have changed my mind on to a certain extent; in the past I’d agree that using non white actors in British period pieces was ‘PC gone max’, but now I think it would be completely wrong to deny a black actor the chance to be cast in one. A multi racial school doing a play about the 1966 World Cup Final would cast all kids as players, even though all 22 on the pitch were white, and a production of Shakespeare with an entirely non white cast would be just as legitimate as any other.
Where it does seem provocative is casting title characters; you can’t have a white Mandela or black Henry VIII, although I’d probably be more ok with the latter
BBC series ‘King and Conqueror’ branded ‘woke’ and ‘historically inaccurate’ for featuring black actors playing Anglo-Saxons.
The series portrays the historical Battle of Hastings in 1066 between William, Duke of Normandy and King Harold Godwinson of England.
If you can have actors as black Anglo Saxons you can have an actor as a white Mandela
A nicely thoughtful post there by @isam. I need to watch this as it is the 2nd one of yours I have liked today.
I disagree with you @HYUFD on Nelson Mandela and agree with @isam. Mandela being black is rather fundamental to the whole point of the story. Normans and Anglo Saxons being white is not. OK they clearly weren't black. They also have the wrong haircuts*, and speak the wrong language for the time, but we overlook that. We can overlook (with difficulty I grant you as it is obvious) black Anglo Saxons. It is a bit more difficult to overlook a white Mandela.
* A review I read said it was confusing flipping between the Norman and the Anglo Saxon locations and would have been a lot easy if they had the correct haircuts for the time.
All historical movies and TV shows are inaccurate to a greater or lesser degree. Mary Queen of Scots spoke with a French accent but she’s invariably given a Scottish one. Jesus of Nazareth was considerably darker than Robert Powell or indeed most of his other European and American visual representations. Picking on the skin colour of actors in history pieces set in Europe is a bit of a double standard. Suspension of disbelief is necessary in any dramatic production.
Funny thing about that example is that giving Marie Stuart a French accent would help drive home the degree of the split between her and very many Scots. A chance being missed there. But perhaps the emphasis in many productions is on Elizabeth Tudor, so it is thought that having MS a la francaise would confuse the viewer.
There was literally a BBC version of Mary Queen of Scots/James VI/I bio made two decades ago with a French actress playing Mary.
Interesting - that makes sense as it would be very much against a Scottish background, in contrast to the usual Mary and Elizabeth stuff foregrounded south of the border.
Paul Fanning @trivet1806 At first the question 'How on earth did we get in this position?' seems fantastically disingenuous since the answer is so blindingly obvious – i.e. decades of unchecked legal and illegal immigration nobody voted for.
But then you realise that isn't what he means. He's actually asking why the government's 'messaging' on this hasn't been better.
Because, like all good Blairites, Seldon believes there is no political problem that cannot be solved by lying to the public more effectively.
Works for Farage, Putin, Modi, Orban, Xi, Trump...
I do think Blair belongs in that list.
And Johnson.
He was one I thought about adding, but he did rather test that theory to destruction...
Race blind casting is not the only kind of woke disruption I can’t abide. Essentially any BBC (and more generally British) period drama is now thoroughly infested with a kind of weird didactic wokery that I seem to have a strong allergy to.
The recent Ruth Ellis drama was unwatchable just to name an example that springs to mind (and the lead actress was rubbish).
Compare with “The Wire”, “Shogun”, “Mad Men”, which address race and gender issues but don’t seek to blatantly re-write history or create “goodies and baddies” based on race, gender, or class.
What was the specific issue with the Ruth Ellis drama. We didn’t watch it.
Superficial and simplistic, felt like 2025 just with 1950s costumes, and as I said, the lead actress wasn’t up to it.
Much harder for actor types to get sufficiently experienced that they are up to anything high-profile. Provincial theatre is dead, as is second-tier telly drama.
Understandably so in many cases, but it does stopper the pipeline.
From a Hollywood perspective the issue is that there is very little real opportunities for quality work. As a result you are seeing A listers doing TV movies, streaming etc. just to keep busy. this forces the second tier of up and coming actors further down the food chain / means that they don’t have the opportunity to gain experience
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
Effectively a poll tax I think
If we want maximum NHS savings by an increased heart attack rate, we need the BBC licence fee attached to the Electricity Standing Charge.
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
Hmm. I wonder; son-in-law has just put his house on the market. At a price that, for the area, doesn't look too bad to me.
I'm particularly taken by the relative literalism which applies to the colour (and sex?) of actors (Mandela must be black, Nelson must be white.), which does not apply to other characteristics such as sexual orientation.
Adjacently, I think that if we have people such as Matt Goodwin and his thing about "White British", relying on a political stance built on colour as an important feature of race / nationality, then they are going to have to go to Trumpish extremes about colour, because they need to divert from the fictionalised version of British history they are creating.
Has anyone told them about the make up of the crew of HMS Victory (I had not learnt this until this morning)?:
I think we perhaps need more black history, not less, so we can understand who we actually are. No wonder Farage and co want to suppress it .
Bloody French, they just had to find a way to be on the winning side.
Mind, anything was better than being in the prison hulks or prison camps. Which also had an amazing mix of nationalities (apart from the British in French service, who tended to get the court martial and yardarm treatment; and those Americans who couldn't prove they weren't really British were a problem too).
Starmer's "Island of Strangers" speech was the start of all this. Permission to the racists to go after people with brown skin.
So what is the alternative? Because it seems to me that Labour either need to be far more effective in tackling illegal migration and bringing numbers down and to be seen to be effective at doing so or they need to fix the asylum system but make a strong argument that there’s no problems with immigration/migration and a compassionate asylum policy. They cant pick and choose. Indeed, Starmer’s speech is a perfect example of this because he then rowed it all back and blamed his speechwriter and said he was a bit tired that day and didn’t mean to say it - hence deriving absolutely zero benefit from anything he pronounced on the subject at all.
As it is, Russia soon won't have any hydrocarbons to sell India. The Ukrainians are demosnstrating how fragile the Russian economy is. Just wait until they hit a few more refineries, and the people of Moscow and St. Petersburg spend all day queuing to fill their cars.
Putin will have an appointment with the oligarchs on the 8th floor.
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
Hmm. I wonder; son-in-law has just put his house on the market. At a price that, for the area, doesn't look too bad to me.
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
There is a complication about empty homes but otherwise, strongly agree. It massively reduces the incentive to reduce energy use and penalises those of us who don't use much. It's roughly 50% for me too.
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
I agree too. A lot of for sale signs round my neck of the woods for properties that 12 months ago people would be fighting to get offers in for and would sell within the week. Now completely sticking at what I’d say aren’t grossly inflated prices for the area, considering what people were paying.
The market is gumming up I think as people feel less financially secure, and I think there might be a marked decline in prices over winter and into the new year.
I'm particularly taken by the relative literalism which applies to the colour (and sex?) of actors (Mandela must be black, Nelson must be white.), which does not apply to other characteristics such as sexual orientation.
Adjacently, I think that if we have people such as Matt Goodwin and his thing about "White British", relying on a political stance built on colour as an important feature of race / nationality, then they are going to have to go to Trumpish extremes about colour, because they need to divert from the fictionalised version of British history they are creating.
Has anyone told them about the make up of the crew of HMS Victory (I had not learnt this until this morning)?:
I think we perhaps need more black history, not less, so we can understand who we actually are. No wonder Farage and co want to suppress it .
Bloody French, they just had to find a way to be on the winning side.
Mind, anything was better than being in the prison hulks or prison camps. Which also had an amazing mix of nationalities (apart from the British in French service, who tended to get the court martial and yardarm treatment; and those Americans who couldn't prove they weren't really British were a problem too).
Why? Did they count as small boat refugees and cause some 19th Century Farage (as it might be, Lord Eldon) to start behaving like an utter loon?
Because if so, some things never change...
(Yes, I do know what the issue was, but I was hoping to make a neat joke at Farage's expense.)
Regarding race blind casting, there has been some tutting locally over the fact that the actor cast as "Hamlet" in a Chichester Minerva Theatre production due to open next month is black. I am more concerned over the fact that he is nearer 50 than 40, which I feel is too old to play Hamlet.
Starmer's "Island of Strangers" speech was the start of all this. Permission to the racists to go after people with brown skin.
So what is the alternative? Because it seems to me that Labour either need to be far more effective in tackling illegal migration and bringing numbers down and to be seen to be effective at doing so or they need to fix the asylum system but make a strong argument that there’s no problems with immigration/migration and a compassionate asylum policy. They cant pick and choose. Indeed, Starmer’s speech is a perfect example of this because he then rowed it all back and blamed his speechwriter and said he was a bit tired that day and didn’t mean to say it - hence deriving absolutely zero benefit from anything he pronounced on the subject at all.
Two topics getting conflated: migration being out of control, and brown people being strangers.
The problem we now have is that racists have been empowered to hate muslims and anyone they think is muslim. All women and girls now need to carry a machete or they will definitely get raped by a muslim - this is the language being used. Farage says deport 600k illegals. No, says Lowe and Habib and Two-Names, deport all brown people.
"Island of Strangers" says that migrants can only ever be strangers, It has done colossal damage to our politics.
Starmer's "Island of Strangers" speech was the start of all this. Permission to the racists to go after people with brown skin.
So what is the alternative? Because it seems to me that Labour either need to be far more effective in tackling illegal migration and bringing numbers down and to be seen to be effective at doing so or they need to fix the asylum system but make a strong argument that there’s no problems with immigration/migration and a compassionate asylum policy. They cant pick and choose. Indeed, Starmer’s speech is a perfect example of this because he then rowed it all back and blamed his speechwriter and said he was a bit tired that day and didn’t mean to say it - hence deriving absolutely zero benefit from anything he pronounced on the subject at all.
I think you celebrate what immigrants bring to the country and say we want a compassionate asylum system, but it's important for all to have a fair system that works for everyone, which the Tories failed on. Then you note that immigration is well down under Labour, deportations are up, asylum hotels are down, say a new deal with France is working.
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
Hmm. I wonder; son-in-law has just put his house on the market. At a price that, for the area, doesn't look too bad to me.
Maybe he’s priced it competively. If a house is not selling it’s either overpriced or there an issue.
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
But you have to admit that it is bollocks-mongering. Over lunch I heard GB News fulminating about a price HIKE !!!.
2% is not a hike when inflation is higher. As the Times puts it in the text:
The rising cost of paying wind farms to switch themselves off has contributed to a 2 per cent increase in household energy prices from October, taking a typical annual bill to £1,755.
Ofgem, the energy regulator, said that the bigger-than-expected £35-a-year rise in the price cap for the final three months of the year was “driven by an increase in electricity balancing costs”, accounting for £15 of the rise.
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
I agree too. A lot of for sale signs round my neck of the woods for properties that 12 months ago people would be fighting to get offers in for and would sell within the week. Now completely sticking at what I’d say aren’t grossly inflated prices for the area, considering what people were paying.
The market is gumming up I think as people feel less financially secure, and I think there might be a marked decline in prices over winter and into the new year.
It’s less,of an issue here but I suspect given the stuff from the govt on changes to stamp duty people are wary about committing too.
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
There is a complication about empty homes but otherwise, strongly agree. It massively reduces the incentive to reduce energy use and penalises those of us who don't use much. It's roughly 50% for me too.
It's also how they recover the money lost on the collapsed companies, so people who didn't qualify for the cheap tariffs are having to cover the cost of those tariffs being uneconomic. The poor subsidising the well-off.
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
Ofgem make Ofwat look honest and competent. It's far more likely to be about making sure their mates in the energy companies can rip us off in other ways.
It's because we don't have regional pricing and keep building them miles away from the population/industry centres as a result. They literally admit to it in this article - https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cde35zd88n1o
Regarding race blind casting, there has been some tutting locally over the fact that the actor cast as "Hamlet" in a Chichester Minerva Theatre production due to open next month is black. I am more concerned over the fact that he is nearer 50 than 40, which I feel is too old to play Hamlet.
I remember PAtrick Stewart complained, while playing Polonius opposite Tennant's Hamlet aged about 65, that he found it annoying he finally had the depth, maturity and range to play Hamlet but would never be looked at for it as he was too old.
Sarah Bernhardt of course played Hamlet in her 50s (and that begs other questions around gender/race casting that have been raised on this thread)!
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
Hmm. I wonder; son-in-law has just put his house on the market. At a price that, for the area, doesn't look too bad to me.
Maybe he’s priced it competively. If a house is not selling it’s either overpriced or there an issue.
And the longer one faffs around there are insurance, maintenance, repairs and possibly council tax to pay (discounted here if the house is genuinely on the market, interestingly, and they do check carefully).
Plus the interest on the price. It's alll very well waiting a year to get an extra 25K but when the above are factored in as well as the CGT on the uplift over probate (some of which is just inflation anyway) ...
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
There is a complication about empty homes but otherwise, strongly agree. It massively reduces the incentive to reduce energy use and penalises those of us who don't use much. It's roughly 50% for me too.
It's also how they recover the money lost on the collapsed companies, so people who didn't qualify for the cheap tariffs are having to cover the cost of those tariffs being uneconomic. The poor subsidising the well-off.
Although many of those on collapsed companies suffer fates worse than bankruptcy anyway.
Look at Rebel Energy customers, forced to sign up for British Gas whether they like it or not.
Regarding race blind casting, there has been some tutting locally over the fact that the actor cast as "Hamlet" in a Chichester Minerva Theatre production due to open next month is black. I am more concerned over the fact that he is nearer 50 than 40, which I feel is too old to play Hamlet.
I remember PAtrick Stewart complained, while playing Polonius opposite Tennant's Hamlet aged about 65, that he found it annoying he finally had the depth, maturity and range to play Hamlet but would never be looked at for it as he was too old.
Sarah Bernhardt of course played Hamlet in her 50s (and that begs other questions around gender/race casting that have been raised on this thread)!
It's the Juliet problem. By the time an actor has the experience and maturity to play the part, they are too old for it.
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
Hmm. I wonder; son-in-law has just put his house on the market. At a price that, for the area, doesn't look too bad to me.
Maybe he’s priced it competively. If a house is not selling it’s either overpriced or there an issue.
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
But you have to admit that it is bollocks-mongering. Over lunch I heard GB News fulminating about a price HIKE !!!.
2% is not a hike when inflation is higher. As the Times puts it in the text:
The rising cost of paying wind farms to switch themselves off has contributed to a 2 per cent increase in household energy prices from October, taking a typical annual bill to £1,755.
Ofgem, the energy regulator, said that the bigger-than-expected £35-a-year rise in the price cap for the final three months of the year was “driven by an increase in electricity balancing costs”, accounting for £15 of the rise.
Problem is the public's perception which sees another energy price hike
Regarding race blind casting, there has been some tutting locally over the fact that the actor cast as "Hamlet" in a Chichester Minerva Theatre production due to open next month is black. I am more concerned over the fact that he is nearer 50 than 40, which I feel is too old to play Hamlet.
I remember PAtrick Stewart complained, while playing Polonius opposite Tennant's Hamlet aged about 65, that he found it annoying he finally had the depth, maturity and range to play Hamlet but would never be looked at for it as he was too old.
Sarah Bernhardt of course played Hamlet in her 50s (and that begs other questions around gender/race casting that have been raised on this thread)!
It's the Juliet problem. By the time an actor has the experience and maturity to play the part, they are too old for it.
Apart from all the much better roles that weren't written by Shakespeare.
Regarding race blind casting, there has been some tutting locally over the fact that the actor cast as "Hamlet" in a Chichester Minerva Theatre production due to open next month is black. I am more concerned over the fact that he is nearer 50 than 40, which I feel is too old to play Hamlet.
I remember PAtrick Stewart complained, while playing Polonius opposite Tennant's Hamlet aged about 65, that he found it annoying he finally had the depth, maturity and range to play Hamlet but would never be looked at for it as he was too old.
Sarah Bernhardt of course played Hamlet in her 50s (and that begs other questions around gender/race casting that have been raised on this thread)!
I saw that production (Tennant, not Bernhardt). It was .. OK.
Starmer's "Island of Strangers" speech was the start of all this. Permission to the racists to go after people with brown skin.
So what is the alternative? Because it seems to me that Labour either need to be far more effective in tackling illegal migration and bringing numbers down and to be seen to be effective at doing so or they need to fix the asylum system but make a strong argument that there’s no problems with immigration/migration and a compassionate asylum policy. They cant pick and choose. Indeed, Starmer’s speech is a perfect example of this because he then rowed it all back and blamed his speechwriter and said he was a bit tired that day and didn’t mean to say it - hence deriving absolutely zero benefit from anything he pronounced on the subject at all.
I think you celebrate what immigrants bring to the country and say we want a compassionate asylum system, but it's important for all to have a fair system that works for everyone, which the Tories failed on. Then you note that immigration is well down under Labour, deportations are up, asylum hotels are down, say a new deal with France is working.
I think that’s right. Pausing for a second to say of course the jury is out on how well these things will work, but there is at least a consistency to it and a message that the party will feel comfortable selling. The problem is that I think the Labour leadership are stuck in a kind of interia on the topic - not sure if they need to be trying to call out Farage or agree with him. It is, like all their messaging, muddled.
On energy prices, I've just had my "your price fix is coming to an end" from Octopus, so I need to re-understand all their (at least five) export tariffs , and there's something about the export tariff changing to being a variable something something something.
I hope she enjoyed owning the Libs . Another example of a Trump voter who was happy to see others lives destroyed but is now in tears and shocked that her Venezuelan boyfriend and father of her child is going to be shipped off .
She’s also doing the rounds on Tik tok begging Trump and his loathsome children for help .
Starmer's "Island of Strangers" speech was the start of all this. Permission to the racists to go after people with brown skin.
So what is the alternative? Because it seems to me that Labour either need to be far more effective in tackling illegal migration and bringing numbers down and to be seen to be effective at doing so or they need to fix the asylum system but make a strong argument that there’s no problems with immigration/migration and a compassionate asylum policy. They cant pick and choose. Indeed, Starmer’s speech is a perfect example of this because he then rowed it all back and blamed his speechwriter and said he was a bit tired that day and didn’t mean to say it - hence deriving absolutely zero benefit from anything he pronounced on the subject at all.
I think you celebrate what immigrants bring to the country and say we want a compassionate asylum system, but it's important for all to have a fair system that works for everyone, which the Tories failed on. Then you note that immigration is well down under Labour, deportations are up, asylum hotels are down, say a new deal with France is working.
I think that’s right. Pausing for a second to say of course the jury is out on how well these things will work, but there is at least a consistency to it and a message that the party will feel comfortable selling. The problem is that I think the Labour leadership are stuck in a kind of interia on the topic - not sure if they need to be trying to call out Farage or agree with him. It is, like all their messaging, muddled.
@bondegezou last sentence may well be Labour's line, but it simply is not cutting through as Farage runs amoke
I saw a Labour advert yesterday with Farage on one side and Starmer the other quoting some figures
Why on earth is Starmer headlining an advert featuring Farage
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
Hmm. I wonder; son-in-law has just put his house on the market. At a price that, for the area, doesn't look too bad to me.
Maybe he’s priced it competively. If a house is not selling it’s either overpriced or there an issue.
And the longer one faffs around there are insurance, maintenance, repairs and possibly council tax to pay (discounted here if the house is genuinely on the market, interestingly, and they do check carefully).
Plus the interest on the price. It's alll very well waiting a year to get an extra 25K but when the above are factored in as well as the CGT on the uplift over probate (some of which is just inflation anyway) ...
All good points. Very well could be throwing good money after bad.
On immigration problems in the US: Problems, plural.
Four examples: First, a year or so ago, there was a sophisticated scheme busted. Taking advantage of a temporary loophole, the operators brought their clients in from Canada. They were met at the border here in Washington state, provided with false IDs, given airline tickets, and transported to SeaTac, from which they flew all over the US.
Second, an agricltural worker who has been crossing the border illegally to work at large farm, for years.
Third, a "mule" who is transporting drugs for a Mexican cartel, who also crosses the border, illegally, carrying his contraband.
Fourth, a teenage girl in Central America who has been told she now belongs to a gang member, and flees to the US.
All of them, the clients, the worker, the mule, and the girl, may have broken the same law, but I think most would agree that US responses should not be the same for all of them.
(I don't know enough about immigration to the UK to say whether something similar might be true, there.)
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
I agree too. A lot of for sale signs round my neck of the woods for properties that 12 months ago people would be fighting to get offers in for and would sell within the week. Now completely sticking at what I’d say aren’t grossly inflated prices for the area, considering what people were paying.
The market is gumming up I think as people feel less financially secure, and I think there might be a marked decline in prices over winter and into the new year.
Where I am looking in South Ayrshire they are selling like hot cakes and well above valuation, mental.
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
Hmm. I wonder; son-in-law has just put his house on the market. At a price that, for the area, doesn't look too bad to me.
Yeah, but will he get any takers?
The estate agent is confident, but then of course he would be! Particularly just having had the instruction.
Starmer's "Island of Strangers" speech was the start of all this. Permission to the racists to go after people with brown skin.
So what is the alternative? Because it seems to me that Labour either need to be far more effective in tackling illegal migration and bringing numbers down and to be seen to be effective at doing so or they need to fix the asylum system but make a strong argument that there’s no problems with immigration/migration and a compassionate asylum policy. They cant pick and choose. Indeed, Starmer’s speech is a perfect example of this because he then rowed it all back and blamed his speechwriter and said he was a bit tired that day and didn’t mean to say it - hence deriving absolutely zero benefit from anything he pronounced on the subject at all.
I think you celebrate what immigrants bring to the country and say we want a compassionate asylum system, but it's important for all to have a fair system that works for everyone, which the Tories failed on. Then you note that immigration is well down under Labour, deportations are up, asylum hotels are down, say a new deal with France is working.
I think that’s right. Pausing for a second to say of course the jury is out on how well these things will work, but there is at least a consistency to it and a message that the party will feel comfortable selling. The problem is that I think the Labour leadership are stuck in a kind of interia on the topic - not sure if they need to be trying to call out Farage or agree with him. It is, like all their messaging, muddled.
Yeah. I don't know if the France deal will actually work, but at this early stage, it makes sense for the Govt to claim it's working. Overall immigration is going to be way down on the Boriswave, so they can talk about that. You take figure 2 at https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/long-term-international-migration-flows-to-and-from-the-uk/ , you add a shaded area for "pandemic", and another one labelled "Boris" and point to how the numbers have fallen hugely under Labour.
"Immigration is way down after the mistakes made by the Conservatives, but we very much welcome the people that are coming to our country, like Kateryna, who fled the fighting in Ukraine and is now working as a nurse."
If Reform wanted an actual issue of salience to campaign on, rather than their manufactured obsession with small boats, one cause they could do a lot worse than adopt is the abolition of standing charges for gas and electricity.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
But you have to admit that it is bollocks-mongering. Over lunch I heard GB News fulminating about a price HIKE !!!.
2% is not a hike when inflation is higher. As the Times puts it in the text:
The rising cost of paying wind farms to switch themselves off has contributed to a 2 per cent increase in household energy prices from October, taking a typical annual bill to £1,755.
Ofgem, the energy regulator, said that the bigger-than-expected £35-a-year rise in the price cap for the final three months of the year was “driven by an increase in electricity balancing costs”, accounting for £15 of the rise.
I was explaining to Mrs. F earlier that wholesale energy prices had fallen, and that the increase was due to energy companies’ increased costs. Her reaction was “so it’s going to pay shareholders dividends”.
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
Hmm. I wonder; son-in-law has just put his house on the market. At a price that, for the area, doesn't look too bad to me.
Maybe he’s priced it competively. If a house is not selling it’s either overpriced or there an issue.
On energy prices, I've just had my "your price fix is coming to an end" from Octopus, so I need to re-understand all their (at least five) export tariffs , and there's something about the export tariff changing to being a variable something something something.
In early August EDF offered to renew the same fixed tariff I am on until 1st October until 1st October 2026 which I accepted
Also EDF provide periods of free electricity which is very welcome
Regarding race blind casting, there has been some tutting locally over the fact that the actor cast as "Hamlet" in a Chichester Minerva Theatre production due to open next month is black. I am more concerned over the fact that he is nearer 50 than 40, which I feel is too old to play Hamlet.
I remember PAtrick Stewart complained, while playing Polonius opposite Tennant's Hamlet aged about 65, that he found it annoying he finally had the depth, maturity and range to play Hamlet but would never be looked at for it as he was too old.
Sarah Bernhardt of course played Hamlet in her 50s (and that begs other questions around gender/race casting that have been raised on this thread)!
It's the Juliet problem. By the time an actor has the experience and maturity to play the part, they are too old for it.
Apart from all the much better roles that weren't written by Shakespeare.
I also need to go and see the Handlebards, who transport themselves and their Shakespeare sets by bicycle.
This is something I have changed my mind on to a certain extent; in the past I’d agree that using non white actors in British period pieces was ‘PC gone max’, but now I think it would be completely wrong to deny a black actor the chance to be cast in one. A multi racial school doing a play about the 1966 World Cup Final would cast all kids as players, even though all 22 on the pitch were white, and a production of Shakespeare with an entirely non white cast would be just as legitimate as any other.
Where it does seem provocative is casting title characters; you can’t have a white Mandela or black Henry VIII, although I’d probably be more ok with the latter
BBC series ‘King and Conqueror’ branded ‘woke’ and ‘historically inaccurate’ for featuring black actors playing Anglo-Saxons.
The series portrays the historical Battle of Hastings in 1066 between William, Duke of Normandy and King Harold Godwinson of England.
Much less of a nonsense than having another entire English army sitting on the next hill along watching the battle of Hastings but doing nothing. Which of course never happened. CBS stumped up some money but perverted the production with the usual American made-up-history.
Set a few hundred years later, and the Americans would have been riding in to save the English.
No sympathy for people inheriting such properties. I have noticed the market round where I live is stagnant. A lot of properties listed and not selling. Yes, again, people wanting too much for them, but it does feel like we're reaching a bit of a crunch with house prices.
Same here and I suspect you are right on property prices.
I agree too. A lot of for sale signs round my neck of the woods for properties that 12 months ago people would be fighting to get offers in for and would sell within the week. Now completely sticking at what I’d say aren’t grossly inflated prices for the area, considering what people were paying.
The market is gumming up I think as people feel less financially secure, and I think there might be a marked decline in prices over winter and into the new year.
Where I am looking in South Ayrshire they are selling like hot cakes and well above valuation, mental.
A relative’s daughter has just sold her flat in Glasgow for 15% over the asking price.
This is something I have changed my mind on to a certain extent; in the past I’d agree that using non white actors in British period pieces was ‘PC gone max’, but now I think it would be completely wrong to deny a black actor the chance to be cast in one. A multi racial school doing a play about the 1966 World Cup Final would cast all kids as players, even though all 22 on the pitch were white, and a production of Shakespeare with an entirely non white cast would be just as legitimate as any other.
Where it does seem provocative is casting title characters; you can’t have a white Mandela or black Henry VIII, although I’d probably be more ok with the latter
BBC series ‘King and Conqueror’ branded ‘woke’ and ‘historically inaccurate’ for featuring black actors playing Anglo-Saxons.
The series portrays the historical Battle of Hastings in 1066 between William, Duke of Normandy and King Harold Godwinson of England.
If you can have actors as black Anglo Saxons you can have an actor as a white Mandela
A nicely thoughtful post there by @isam. I need to watch this as it is the 2nd one of yours I have liked today.
I disagree with you @HYUFD on Nelson Mandela and agree with @isam. Mandela being black is rather fundamental to the whole point of the story. Normans and Anglo Saxons being white is not. OK they clearly weren't black. They also have the wrong haircuts*, and speak the wrong language for the time, but we overlook that. We can overlook (with difficulty I grant you as it is obvious) black Anglo Saxons. It is a bit more difficult to overlook a white Mandela.
* A review I read said it was confusing flipping between the Norman and the Anglo Saxon locations and would have been a lot easy if they had the correct and different haircuts for the time.
It is called acting, if you can act well you should be able to convince in the part regardless of skin colour.
Otherwise if you demand historical figures are represented by actors of the same skin colour that has to apply across the board
I agree on this but it should apply equally. You don’t need to be gay to play a gay person or have killed people and put them under the patio to play Fred West, yet the trans loon lobby, of course, dunked on casting of non ‘trans’ actors in trans roles even getting a Scarlett Johansson show pulled as she backed out due to the furore from the perma-offended brigade. There was also Eddie Redmaye in that film, the Danish Girl IIRC, who got a load of flak for being in it.
I'm half and half here. I think that having had the actual experience makes a big difference, as does challenging the perceptions and assumptions of an audience around skin colour. Though an actor's skill is to understand and portray.
I would struggle to work my way into the head of someone around something as simple as tobacco addiction, for example. Or being an out gay professional footballer - aiui in the UK game we still only have one, following on from Justin Fashanu in 1990. Fashanu hanged himself in a garage in Shoreditch after he was accused of sexual assault.
With all due respect you’re not a professional actor. They immerse themselves in their roles. They inhabit the character and the role.
What you seem to imply would simply narrow the available cast. RTD selected actors on their merit for Queer as Folk, and it works fine.
I think it’s nonsensical to say only a trans actor can play a trans role or only,a straight actor can play a straight role.
It is literally the entire point of acting, to play a role that is not your own.
Sheldon: You can't be Professor Proton. You're not a scientist. Wil Wheaton: Well, I was never on a starship, but pretending I was bought me this house. And if I'd pretended a little longer, it would have a swimming pool
Isn’t it a conversation Sir John Gielgud had with Dustin Hoffman? “ it’s called acting dear boy”
Starmer's "Island of Strangers" speech was the start of all this. Permission to the racists to go after people with brown skin.
So what is the alternative? Because it seems to me that Labour either need to be far more effective in tackling illegal migration and bringing numbers down and to be seen to be effective at doing so or they need to fix the asylum system but make a strong argument that there’s no problems with immigration/migration and a compassionate asylum policy. They cant pick and choose. Indeed, Starmer’s speech is a perfect example of this because he then rowed it all back and blamed his speechwriter and said he was a bit tired that day and didn’t mean to say it - hence deriving absolutely zero benefit from anything he pronounced on the subject at all.
I think you celebrate what immigrants bring to the country and say we want a compassionate asylum system, but it's important for all to have a fair system that works for everyone, which the Tories failed on. Then you note that immigration is well down under Labour, deportations are up, asylum hotels are down, say a new deal with France is working.
I think that’s right. Pausing for a second to say of course the jury is out on how well these things will work, but there is at least a consistency to it and a message that the party will feel comfortable selling. The problem is that I think the Labour leadership are stuck in a kind of interia on the topic - not sure if they need to be trying to call out Farage or agree with him. It is, like all their messaging, muddled.
The catch is that under Johnson/Truss/Sunak, the system basically collapsed until all they had left was impotent shouting.
Until some sort of order is restored (and that was never going to happen instantly) the government also only really have shouting available, and they're less good at it.
(It's probably also the case that the people responsible for Labour party messaging need to be sent on a fact-finding mission to the surface of the Sun. Goodbye, not au revoir.)
Liberal Democrat MP Mike Martin has written to the UK Home Secretary calling for an investigation into whether Reform’s Zia Yusuf has broken terrorism laws.
"Fertility rate hits record low in England, Scotland and Wales Last year’s total fertility rate of 1.41 for England and Wales was lowest since comparable data was first collected in 1938, ONS says"
This is something I have changed my mind on to a certain extent; in the past I’d agree that using non white actors in British period pieces was ‘PC gone max’, but now I think it would be completely wrong to deny a black actor the chance to be cast in one. A multi racial school doing a play about the 1966 World Cup Final would cast all kids as players, even though all 22 on the pitch were white, and a production of Shakespeare with an entirely non white cast would be just as legitimate as any other.
Where it does seem provocative is casting title characters; you can’t have a white Mandela or black Henry VIII, although I’d probably be more ok with the latter
BBC series ‘King and Conqueror’ branded ‘woke’ and ‘historically inaccurate’ for featuring black actors playing Anglo-Saxons.
The series portrays the historical Battle of Hastings in 1066 between William, Duke of Normandy and King Harold Godwinson of England.
If you can have actors as black Anglo Saxons you can have an actor as a white Mandela
A nicely thoughtful post there by @isam. I need to watch this as it is the 2nd one of yours I have liked today.
I disagree with you @HYUFD on Nelson Mandela and agree with @isam. Mandela being black is rather fundamental to the whole point of the story. Normans and Anglo Saxons being white is not. OK they clearly weren't black. They also have the wrong haircuts*, and speak the wrong language for the time, but we overlook that. We can overlook (with difficulty I grant you as it is obvious) black Anglo Saxons. It is a bit more difficult to overlook a white Mandela.
* A review I read said it was confusing flipping between the Norman and the Anglo Saxon locations and would have been a lot easy if they had the correct and different haircuts for the time.
It is called acting, if you can act well you should be able to convince in the part regardless of skin colour.
Otherwise if you demand historical figures are represented by actors of the same skin colour that has to apply across the board
I agree on this but it should apply equally. You don’t need to be gay to play a gay person or have killed people and put them under the patio to play Fred West, yet the trans loon lobby, of course, dunked on casting of non ‘trans’ actors in trans roles even getting a Scarlett Johansson show pulled as she backed out due to the furore from the perma-offended brigade. There was also Eddie Redmaye in that film, the Danish Girl IIRC, who got a load of flak for being in it.
I'm half and half here. I think that having had the actual experience makes a big difference, as does challenging the perceptions and assumptions of an audience around skin colour. Though an actor's skill is to understand and portray.
I would struggle to work my way into the head of someone around something as simple as tobacco addiction, for example. Or being an out gay professional footballer - aiui in the UK game we still only have one, following on from Justin Fashanu in 1990. Fashanu hanged himself in a garage in Shoreditch after he was accused of sexual assault.
With all due respect you’re not a professional actor. They immerse themselves in their roles. They inhabit the character and the role.
What you seem to imply would simply narrow the available cast. RTD selected actors on their merit for Queer as Folk, and it works fine.
I think it’s nonsensical to say only a trans actor can play a trans role or only,a straight actor can play a straight role.
It is literally the entire point of acting, to play a role that is not your own.
Sheldon: You can't be Professor Proton. You're not a scientist. Wil Wheaton: Well, I was never on a starship, but pretending I was bought me this house. And if I'd pretended a little longer, it would have a swimming pool
Isn’t it a conversation Sir John Gielgud had with Dustin Hoffman? “ it’s called acting dear boy”
Laurence Olivier in Marathon Man. After Hoffman had run three times around the studio to appear suitably breathless, he said, 'Why not try acting, dear boy?'
Comments
Understandably so in many cases, but it does stopper the pipeline.
Making the past strange, but relatable, is difficult, but a series like Wolf Hall shows it can be done.
The notion that “we” (always the current generation), are terribly enlightened, but the past was barbaric, is very wrong.
In any case, he certainly wasn't an Anglo-Saxon.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDTU7qJgVWY
Top hedge-fund manager Jacob Rees-Mogg opines.
Reform are an existential threat to the UK.
Times Radio Politics"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmEJQbyfVOY
https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/52437-first-yougov-mrp-since-2024-election-shows-a-hung-parliament-with-reform-uk-as-largest-party
Nowcast latest forecast has Reform 339, Labour 112, LDs 77, SNP 46, Tories 35, Plaid 6, Greens 5
https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast
Here’s an excellent article by the wonderful French commentator Agnes Poirier .
https://web-cdn.bsky.app/profile/agnescpoirier.bsky.social
Scroll down and you’ll see “ French in denial about the size of their debt “.
But Turkish is all Greek to me - especially since I went over the handlebars of a Brompton in Istanbul, when the tramlines (which was where I had been advised to cycle ... the other way) took my Brompton left at a set of points, and I went straight on.
They have absolutely skyrocketed under the price cap nonsense and under Labour despite previous promises to offer other options are still going up.
They are also the most inequitable part of the bill because you have to pay them and there's almost no variation between companies.
I will admire that as they make up around 50% of my annual energy bill I find them especially aggravating but they are a monstrous imposition.
The spin is that it's a US production using a Korean crew and filmed in Korea. Kim revisiting his roots (he was born in Busan).
Sadly it's just not very good.
"I'm voting for the many" / "vote for the many party" etc
Nothing to do with the house being overpriced, of course.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15038661/Terry-Wogans-son-hits-Rachel-Reeves-unable-sell-parents-mansion.html
Paul Fanning
@trivet1806
At first the question 'How on earth did we get in this position?' seems fantastically disingenuous since the answer is so blindingly obvious – i.e. decades of unchecked legal and illegal immigration nobody voted for.
But then you realise that isn't what he means. He's actually asking why the government's 'messaging' on this hasn't been better.
Because, like all good Blairites, Seldon believes there is no political problem that cannot be solved by lying to the public more effectively.
Four examples: First, a year or so ago, there was a sophisticated scheme busted. Taking advantage of a temporary loophole, the operators brought their clients in from Canada. They were met at the border here in Washington state, provided with false IDs, given airline tickets, and transported to SeaTac, from which they flew all over the US.
Second, an agricltural worker who has been crossing the border illegally to work at large farm, for years.
Third, a "mule" who is transporting drugs for a Mexican cartel, who also crosses the border, illegally, carrying his contraband.
Fourth, a teenage girl in Central America who has been told she now belongs to a gang member, and flees to the US.
All of them, the clients, the worker, the mule, and the girl, may have broken the same law, but I think most would agree that US responses should not be the same for all of them.
(I don't know enough about immigration to the UK to say whether something similar might be true, there.)
Energy bills to rise to fund cost of switching off wind farms https://share.google/6HOfRmVhrFowVLMcR
I'm struck by a relative literalism which applies to the colour (and sex?) of actors (Mandela must be black, Nelson must be white), which does not apply to other characteristics such as sexual orientation. I need to go and see a Shakespeare with Othello played by Maxine Peake, or something similar but less extreme.
Adjacently, thinking about people such as Matt Goodwin and his thing about "White British", relying on a political stance built on colour as an important feature of race / nationality. They are going to have to go to Trumpish extremes about colour, because they will need to divert from the fictionalised version of British history they are creating.
Has anyone told them about the make up of the crew of HMS Victory (I had not learned this until this morning)?:
515 English, 88 Irish, 67 Scottish, 50 Welsh, 1 African, 1 Brazilian, 2 Danish, 4 French, 2 Indian, 6 Maltese, 1 Portuguese, 2 Swiss, 22 American, 2 Canadian, 7 Dutch, 2 German, 1 Jamaican, 2 Norwegian, 4 Swedish, 4 West Indian, 48 Unknown.
https://dalyhistory.wordpress.com/2010/07/10/the-crew-of-hms-victory-at-trafalgar/
I think we perhaps need more black history, not less, so we can understand who we actually are. No wonder Farage and co want to suppress it
Channel 4 News"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ry_AwxwfwNg
As it is, Russia soon won't have any hydrocarbons to sell India. The Ukrainians are demosnstrating how fragile the Russian economy is. Just wait until they hit a few more refineries, and the people of Moscow and St. Petersburg spend all day queuing to fill their cars.
Putin will have an appointment with the oligarchs on the 8th floor.
The market is gumming up I think as people feel less financially secure, and I think there might be a marked decline in prices over winter and into the new year.
Because if so, some things never change...
(Yes, I do know what the issue was, but I was hoping to make a neat joke at Farage's expense.)
The problem we now have is that racists have been empowered to hate muslims and anyone they think is muslim. All women and girls now need to carry a machete or they will definitely get raped by a muslim - this is the language being used. Farage says deport 600k illegals. No, says Lowe and Habib and Two-Names, deport all brown people.
"Island of Strangers" says that migrants can only ever be strangers, It has done colossal damage to our politics.
Meanwhile a 60% reduction
https://x.com/moving_charlie/status/1960627254624485464?s=61
2% is not a hike when inflation is higher. As the Times puts it in the text:
The rising cost of paying wind farms to switch themselves off has contributed to a 2 per cent increase in household energy prices from October, taking a typical annual bill to £1,755.
Ofgem, the energy regulator, said that the bigger-than-expected £35-a-year rise in the price cap for the final three months of the year was “driven by an increase in electricity balancing costs”, accounting for £15 of the rise.
It's driving me insane.
Sarah Bernhardt of course played Hamlet in her 50s (and that begs other questions around gender/race casting that have been raised on this thread)!
Plus the interest on the price. It's alll very well waiting a year to get an extra 25K but when the above are factored in as well as the CGT on the uplift over probate (some of which is just inflation anyway) ...
Look at Rebel Energy customers, forced to sign up for British Gas whether they like it or not.
Do you suppose the first advert was aimed at Yanks wanting a bolthole?
On Wogan MInor, don't you get 10 years to pay some taxes? Wogan Major died in 2016.
It was .. OK.
It's a really hard play to do justice to.
She’s also doing the rounds on Tik tok begging Trump and his loathsome children for help .
So for my fellow anti Trumpers , enjoy .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEWIWhQXnpw
I just can’t muster any empathy or sympathy for Trump voters who are getting what they voted for and now whining about it .
I saw a Labour advert yesterday with Farage on one side and Starmer the other quoting some figures
Why on earth is Starmer headlining an advert featuring Farage
No 10's comms are terrible
However, son-in-law is not in any hurry.
"Immigration is way down after the mistakes made by the Conservatives, but we very much welcome the people that are coming to our country, like Kateryna, who fled the fighting in Ukraine and is now working as a nurse."
Also EDF provide periods of free electricity which is very welcome
https://www.handlebards.com/about-us/
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15039019/Riots-erupt-Swiss-city-migrant-teen-killed-scooter-crash-fleeing-police.html
Until some sort of order is restored (and that was never going to happen instantly) the government also only really have shouting available, and they're less good at it.
(It's probably also the case that the people responsible for Labour party messaging need to be sent on a fact-finding mission to the surface of the Sun. Goodbye, not au revoir.)
Liberal Democrat MP Mike Martin has written to the UK Home Secretary calling for an investigation into whether Reform’s Zia Yusuf has broken terrorism laws.
https://bsky.app/profile/chadbourn.bsky.social/post/3lxf6u4yjms2l
Last year’s total fertility rate of 1.41 for England and Wales was lowest since comparable data was first collected in 1938, ONS says"
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2025/aug/27/england-and-wales-fertility-rate-falls-for-third-consecutive-year