politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The media narrative turns against the purples as the prospe

Bond_James_Bond · December 2014

BenM said:

FalseFlag said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Moronic article, the quality of the students is by far the biggest determinant in educational outcomes. The relentless importing of low IQ immigrants ensure we will continue to see a decline in the standard of living and a grim future.
Codswallop.

Report into the success of London primary schooling points out that the diversity of pupils is the biggest determining factor.

http://www.bris.ac.uk/news/2014/november/london-effect.html

So state schools are institutionally racist. Glad I took mine out.

Peter_the_Punter · December 2014

Sean_F said:

Bobajob_ said:
In all fairness, not sure the media ever did like Ukip did they?

Ukip if you want. The media is not for kipping.
I think the media didn't really pay much attention to UKIP till about a year ago. Most media outlets (with the exception of the Express) have been hostile since the Spring (though there individual journalists are sympathetic).

Presumably, like many posters here, they assumed UKIP would simply collapse of its own accord. Now that they show no signs of doing so and the GE is drawing near, 'something needs to be done about it'.

Expect more of the same for the next six months.

Bobajob_ · December 2014

Sean_F said:

Bobajob_ said:
In all fairness, not sure the media ever did like Ukip did they?

Ukip if you want. The media is not for kipping.
I think the media didn't really pay much attention to UKIP till about a year ago. Most media outlets (with the exception of the Express) have been hostile since the Spring (though there individual journalists are sympathetic).

Sean

I think that's about right, yes. The idea that the media narrative has somehow "turned" against a partty that was widely ignored, then openly mocked, is OGH stretching a point I think.

Moses_ · December 2014

rcs1000 said:

Indigo said:

rcs1000 said:

Paul_Mid_Beds said:

OldKingCole said:
I don’t think that some at least Kippers realise the extent to which “Brussels” is monstered in the popular British media, and how much that contributes to their popularity.

Mention of “straight bananas” for example, was for a considerable while, always good for a laugh.

Watching the Christopher Jeffries docu-drama last night underlined for me how much some parts of our media would much rather sensationalise something than look at the facts.
Occupying foreign powers are occcupying foreign powers however much you dress it up.
How many troops does the EU have stationed in the UK?
A better question is why does the EU have troops stationed anywhere since it isn't a nation state, why does it have a military staff, why does it have an external action force etc etc

"Eurocorps" is the nearest the EU has to a military force.

There's only issue with it.

It's not an EU force, and is not subordinate to the EU in any way shape or form.

In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade - The Franco-German Brigade - which could be deployed when both countries agreed.

That has since been expanded, and five states are part of Eurocorp. They are: Belgium, France, Germany, Luxemboug and Spain. In total, Eurocorp has maybe 6,000 troops associated with it. (Most of these are the original Frenco-German brigade, and are French or German.)

But Eurocorp is not an EU force.

Rapid reaction force? Though the 60,000 odd troops do remain under some control from the parent countries. No doubt an overall commander would be need to becelected to lead this force agreed by the EU. They would wear and fly the EU flag I guess .

Maybe they would even sing "ode to joy" on the eve of battle?

saddened · December 2014

BenM said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Ordinary teachers (My wife is one) defined as the blob?

.

Contender for least surprising revelation ever on P.B? I'd have bet good money that was the case.

Indigo · December 2014

BenM said:

FalseFlag said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Moronic article, the quality of the students is by far the biggest determinant in educational outcomes. The relentless importing of low IQ immigrants ensure we will continue to see a decline in the standard of living and a grim future.
Codswallop.

Report into the success of London primary schooling points out that the diversity of pupils is the biggest determining factor.

http://www.bris.ac.uk/news/2014/november/london-effect.html

I assume you didn't actually read that article, which mentions neither intelligence or IQ. Culture makes a big difference, largely its that parents of working class british kids are on the whole disinterested in education and there is very much a culture in schools of the less able trying to encourage their peers not to make any effort "Swat!" "Nerd!" etc.

In many other cultures parents from less advantaged backgrounds are heavily engaged in getting their children a better education, because in their countries there is no JSA, if you dont earn enough you are either a burden on your family or you get hungry, and a child with a good income is the best sort of security in old age in most Asian countries.

Dont bother googling more articles to spout at me, I'm not interested. I'm an educational psychologist and teacher, I part own a school in a developing country, every day I deal with poor parents who are working every hour they can to get their children the best education they can, I know how it works from experience thank you very much.

FalseFlag · December 2014

BenM said:

FalseFlag said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Moronic article, the quality of the students is by far the biggest determinant in educational outcomes. The relentless importing of low IQ immigrants ensure we will continue to see a decline in the standard of living and a grim future.
Codswallop.

Report into the success of London primary schooling points out that the diversity of pupils is the biggest determining factor.

http://www.bris.ac.uk/news/2014/november/london-effect.html

The PISA tests show that immigrants are a substantial negative drag on all Western scores.

http://www.oecd.org/pisa/keyfindings/PISA-2012-results-volume-V.pdf#page=211

"Immigrants performed poorly compared to Finnish majority population

Disparities in problem-solving between students of Finnish origin and those with an immigrant background were significant in all participating countries. In Finland the average score was 526 points among the majority population whereas the score for second-generation immigrant students was 461 points, and that for first-generation immigrants was 426 points. The disparity between immigrants and native students in Finland was wider than the average for all participating countries. Finnish-speaking and Swedish-speaking schools both performed almost equally well."

http://www.minedu.fi/OPM/Tiedotteet/2014/04/Pisa_ongelmanratkaisu.html?lang=en

OldKingCole · December 2014

Moses_ said:

BenM said:

TheWatcher said:

BenM said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Ordinary teachers (My wife is one) defined as the blob?

Really - is that what rightwing commentary has come to?

No wonder they won't vote for you.
If she shares your views, I'd plonk her firmly in the Blob.
If the Blob is defeating the gragantuanly wasteful free schools policy, I'm all for it.
Trouble is you sum up perfectly the problem. My wife and also at a school found that whatever Labour said the majority by far would welcome with open arms however stupid or whacky. On the other hand the same people would go out of their way to ensure anything the Tories put forward failed and by god they really made sure that happened.

My wife finally resigned and left as she said at the time "the children were just simply political cannon fodder to these people"

If my teacher relations are any guide the vast majority simply want to get on and teach, without a new idea thrust upon them every term.

Have the A/AS syllabi for next year been sorted out yet? Last time I asked they hadn't been.

Which means teachers don't know how they advise pupils at a crucial stage in their lives.

Peter_the_Punter · December 2014

@RCS

"In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade..."

Really?! Wow, Foch and Moltke must be whizzing round in their graves.

rcs1000 · December 2014

Moses_ said:

rcs1000 said:

Indigo said:

rcs1000 said:

Paul_Mid_Beds said:

OldKingCole said:
I don’t think that some at least Kippers realise the extent to which “Brussels” is monstered in the popular British media, and how much that contributes to their popularity.

Mention of “straight bananas” for example, was for a considerable while, always good for a laugh.

Watching the Christopher Jeffries docu-drama last night underlined for me how much some parts of our media would much rather sensationalise something than look at the facts.
Occupying foreign powers are occcupying foreign powers however much you dress it up.
How many troops does the EU have stationed in the UK?
A better question is why does the EU have troops stationed anywhere since it isn't a nation state, why does it have a military staff, why does it have an external action force etc etc

"Eurocorps" is the nearest the EU has to a military force.

There's only issue with it.

It's not an EU force, and is not subordinate to the EU in any way shape or form.

In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade - The Franco-German Brigade - which could be deployed when both countries agreed.

That has since been expanded, and five states are part of Eurocorp. They are: Belgium, France, Germany, Luxemboug and Spain. In total, Eurocorp has maybe 6,000 troops associated with it. (Most of these are the original Frenco-German brigade, and are French or German.)

But Eurocorp is not an EU force.
Rapid reaction force? Though the 60,000 odd troops do remain under some control from the parent countries. No doubt an overall commander would be need to becelected to lead this force agreed by the EU. They would wear and fly the EU flag I guess .

Maybe they would even sing "ode to joy" on the eve of battle?

The EU has no control over Eurocorp, it is controlled by the five countries who supply its troops. (And really just France and Germany who account for 80-90% of the 60,000 troops)

AlastairMeeks · December 2014

No one cares about internal party machinations except the politically obsessive. Neil Hamilton being kept out of a seat will be seen as a good thing by the few people who (a) know who Neil Hamilton is and (b) care.

Donors are entitled to express their views on whatever they like. But if Stuart Wheeler is really threatening not to give any more money over the choice of individual candidates, UKIP should ignore that type of will-shaking.

OldKingCole · December 2014

Peter_the_Punter said:
@RCS

"In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade..."

Really?! Wow, Foch and Moltke must be whizzing round in their graves.

Recruited in Alsace-Lorraine?

CarlottaVance · December 2014

foxinsoxuk said:

Indigo said:

foxinsoxuk said:
Small c conservatism is indeed a defining aspect of kipper support. It is why the "back to the fifties" and Trumpton memes work so well. Small c conservatism is defined by opposition to change, even it seems from what the Dear Leader was saying on QT last night, opposition to any use of private companies in the NHS.
I think the same is true of "forward looking" parties. Just because its moving forward doesn't mean its going to be an improvement, Milibandism almost certainly won't be an improvement on where we are now, Brownism was a disaster as well. In many ways Europeanism is the ultimate conservatism, its based on the dreams and fears of old men. It has been completely contents to ignore the democratic will in two of its nations and conspire in the downfall of elected leaders and replace them with technocrats, and now we have a judge telling politicians that its there job to defeat Euroscepticism, I dont want to go back to the 50's (I'm not a kipper) but I fail to see the EU as the great leap forward, unless we are using those words in their Maoist context.
I would agree. The problem with the EU is its own small c conservatism: In particular the CAP supports 19th Century land management, and fails to recognise that agriculture is not the mainspring of the European economy

The Economist once summed up the CAP as to the French the EU's crowning glory but to the British as a protectionist monstrosity fit only for destruction......

Indigo · December 2014

rcs1000 said:

Indigo said:

rcs1000 said:

Paul_Mid_Beds said:

OldKingCole said:
I don’t think that some at least Kippers realise the extent to which “Brussels” is monstered in the popular British media, and how much that contributes to their popularity.

Mention of “straight bananas” for example, was for a considerable while, always good for a laugh.

Watching the Christopher Jeffries docu-drama last night underlined for me how much some parts of our media would much rather sensationalise something than look at the facts.
Occupying foreign powers are occcupying foreign powers however much you dress it up.
How many troops does the EU have stationed in the UK?
A better question is why does the EU have troops stationed anywhere since it isn't a nation state, why does it have a military staff, why does it have an external action force etc etc

"Eurocorps" is the nearest the EU has to a military force.

There's only issue with it.

It's not an EU force, and is not subordinate to the EU in any way shape or form.

In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade - The Franco-German Brigade - which could be deployed when both countries agreed.

That has since been expanded, and five states are part of Eurocorp. They are: Belgium, France, Germany, Luxemboug and Spain. In total, Eurocorp has maybe 6,000 troops associated with it. (Most of these are the original Frenco-German brigade, and are French or German.)

But Eurocorp is not an EU force.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EUFOR is subordinate to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_Military_Staff which is part of
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_External_Action_Service

Peter_the_Punter · December 2014

OldKingCole said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@RCS

"In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade..."

Really?! Wow, Foch and Moltke must be whizzing round in their graves.
Recruited in Alsace-Lorraine?

Jeez, there must be some interesting conversations in the mess.

Edit: I'm reminded of Rowan Atkinson's brilliant 'Welcome To Hell', where the French and Germans are required to line up alongside each other.

Bobajob_ · December 2014

saddened said:

BenM said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Ordinary teachers (My wife is one) defined as the blob?

.
Contender for least surprising revelation ever on P.B? I'd have bet good money that was the case.

Brilliant after timing. Amazing how people's instincts are proved correct when they already have the answer. I'd have put a large amount of cash on City winning two-nothing at Roma on Wednesday

[Deleted User] · December 2014

Moses_ said:

rcs1000 said:

Indigo said:

rcs1000 said:

Paul_Mid_Beds said:

OldKingCole said:
I don’t think that some at least Kippers realise the extent to which “Brussels” is monstered in the popular British media, and how much that contributes to their popularity.

Mention of “straight bananas” for example, was for a considerable while, always good for a laugh.

Watching the Christopher Jeffries docu-drama last night underlined for me how much some parts of our media would much rather sensationalise something than look at the facts.
Occupying foreign powers are occcupying foreign powers however much you dress it up.
How many troops does the EU have stationed in the UK?
A better question is why does the EU have troops stationed anywhere since it isn't a nation state, why does it have a military staff, why does it have an external action force etc etc

"Eurocorps" is the nearest the EU has to a military force.

There's only issue with it.

It's not an EU force, and is not subordinate to the EU in any way shape or form.

In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade - The Franco-German Brigade - which could be deployed when both countries agreed.

That has since been expanded, and five states are part of Eurocorp. They are: Belgium, France, Germany, Luxemboug and Spain. In total, Eurocorp has maybe 6,000 troops associated with it. (Most of these are the original Frenco-German brigade, and are French or German.)

But Eurocorp is not an EU force.
Maybe they would even sing "ode to joy" on the eve of battle?

I thought the EU anthem was now 'Owed to Germany'.

rcs1000 · December 2014

Indigo said:

rcs1000 said:

Indigo said:

rcs1000 said:

Paul_Mid_Beds said:

OldKingCole said:
I don’t think that some at least Kippers realise the extent to which “Brussels” is monstered in the popular British media, and how much that contributes to their popularity.

Mention of “straight bananas” for example, was for a considerable while, always good for a laugh.

Watching the Christopher Jeffries docu-drama last night underlined for me how much some parts of our media would much rather sensationalise something than look at the facts.
Occupying foreign powers are occcupying foreign powers however much you dress it up.
How many troops does the EU have stationed in the UK?
A better question is why does the EU have troops stationed anywhere since it isn't a nation state, why does it have a military staff, why does it have an external action force etc etc

"Eurocorps" is the nearest the EU has to a military force.

There's only issue with it.

It's not an EU force, and is not subordinate to the EU in any way shape or form.

In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade - The Franco-German Brigade - which could be deployed when both countries agreed.

That has since been expanded, and five states are part of Eurocorp. They are: Belgium, France, Germany, Luxemboug and Spain. In total, Eurocorp has maybe 6,000 troops associated with it. (Most of these are the original Frenco-German brigade, and are French or German.)

But Eurocorp is not an EU force.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EUFOR is subordinate to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_Military_Staff which is part of
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_External_Action_Service

Yes, by EUFOR has no full time troops. Its peacekeeping deployments are just seconded troops from EU countries.

rcs1000 · December 2014

rcs1000 said:

Indigo said:

rcs1000 said:

Indigo said:

rcs1000 said:

Paul_Mid_Beds said:

OldKingCole said:
I don’t think that some at least Kippers realise the extent to which “Brussels” is monstered in the popular British media, and how much that contributes to their popularity.

Mention of “straight bananas” for example, was for a considerable while, always good for a laugh.

Watching the Christopher Jeffries docu-drama last night underlined for me how much some parts of our media would much rather sensationalise something than look at the facts.
Occupying foreign powers are occcupying foreign powers however much you dress it up.
How many troops does the EU have stationed in the UK?
A better question is why does the EU have troops stationed anywhere since it isn't a nation state, why does it have a military staff, why does it have an external action force etc etc

"Eurocorps" is the nearest the EU has to a military force.

There's only issue with it.

It's not an EU force, and is not subordinate to the EU in any way shape or form.

In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade - The Franco-German Brigade - which could be deployed when both countries agreed.

That has since been expanded, and five states are part of Eurocorp. They are: Belgium, France, Germany, Luxemboug and Spain. In total, Eurocorp has maybe 6,000 troops associated with it. (Most of these are the original Frenco-German brigade, and are French or German.)

But Eurocorp is not an EU force.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EUFOR is subordinate to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_Military_Staff which is part of
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_External_Action_Service
Yes, by EUFOR has no full time troops. Its peacekeeping deployments are just seconded troops from EU countries.

If you're claiming that the EU has full time soldiers who owe their allegience to the EU rather than their host nations, then you must make pretty much the same claim about UN peacekeepers.

TGOHF · December 2014

Scrapheap_as_was said:
UKIP's logo will now raise a smile in scrap towers as I think of the nation's beloved pound shop - perhaps a sponsor they might tap up?

I should imagine the management of Poundland are looking at immediate rebranding and a new logo to avoid being tainted by association.

TheScreamingEagles · December 2014

https://twitter.com/tnewtondunn/status/543337403214491648

saddened · December 2014

Bobajob_ said:

saddened said:

BenM said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Ordinary teachers (My wife is one) defined as the blob?

.
Contender for least surprising revelation ever on P.B? I'd have bet good money that was the case.
Brilliant after timing. Amazing how people's instincts are proved correct when they already have the answer. I'd have put a large amount of cash on City winning two-nothing at Roma on Wednesday

I'd also have put good money on you slinking back after yet another flounce. Is that after timing or an accurate estimation of what did happen?

Indigo · December 2014

rcs1000 said:

rcs1000 said:

Indigo said:

rcs1000 said:

Indigo said:

A better question is why does the EU have troops stationed anywhere since it isn't a nation state, why does it have a military staff, why does it have an external action force etc etc

"Eurocorps" is the nearest the EU has to a military force.

There's only issue with it.

It's not an EU force, and is not subordinate to the EU in any way shape or form.

In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade - The Franco-German Brigade - which could be deployed when both countries agreed.

That has since been expanded, and five states are part of Eurocorp. They are: Belgium, France, Germany, Luxemboug and Spain. In total, Eurocorp has maybe 6,000 troops associated with it. (Most of these are the original Frenco-German brigade, and are French or German.)

But Eurocorp is not an EU force.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EUFOR is subordinate to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_Military_Staff which is part of
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_External_Action_Service
Yes, by EUFOR has no full time troops. Its peacekeeping deployments are just seconded troops from EU countries.
If you're claiming that the EU has full time soldiers who owe their allegience to the EU rather than their host nations, then you must make pretty much the same claim about UN peacekeepers.

No but since Lisbon it is clearly the intent:

“ The common security and defence policy shall include the progressive framing of the common defence policy. This will lead to a common defence, when the European Council, acting unanimously, so decides. (TEU, Article 42)

Our own Baroness Ashton was fool enough to propose that the EU should run its own military, Cameron shut her down last year, but its clearly the way the Commission is moving, so only a matter of time before it comes back again, it didn't set up all those command and control structures and intelligence and briefing facilities just to run a few of someone else troops.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/10528852/David-Cameron-flies-to-Brussels-determined-to-fight-EU-drones-programme.html

Here's the French asking for it not six months ago.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/482463/EXCLUSIVE-EU-needs-European-army-that-EXCLUDES-UK-claims-former-French-minister

Theuniondivvie · December 2014

Peter_the_Punter said:
@RCS

"In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade..."

Really?! Wow, Foch and Moltke must be whizzing round in their graves.

There are relatively recent precedents, though I dare say their battle honours haven't transferred to the new brigade.

'33rd Waffen Grenadier Division of the SS Charlemagne (1st French)'

http://tinyurl.com/7edhjw4

TGOHF · December 2014

Sad that the wiki graph of polls has been abandoned for 6 weeks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2015_United_Kingdom_general_election

Peter_the_Punter · December 2014

Theuniondivvie said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@RCS

"In 1987, the French and Germans put together a brigade..."

Really?! Wow, Foch and Moltke must be whizzing round in their graves.
There are relatively recent precedents, though I dare say their battle honours haven't transferred to the new brigade.

'33rd Waffen Grenadier Division of the SS Charlemagne (1st French)'

http://tinyurl.com/7edhjw4

Amazing.

Mind you, there are parts of France....

Sean_F · December 2014

Peter_the_Punter said:

Sean_F said:

Bobajob_ said:
In all fairness, not sure the media ever did like Ukip did they?

Ukip if you want. The media is not for kipping.
I think the media didn't really pay much attention to UKIP till about a year ago. Most media outlets (with the exception of the Express) have been hostile since the Spring (though there individual journalists are sympathetic).

Presumably, like many posters here, they assumed UKIP would simply collapse of its own accord. Now that they show no signs of doing so and the GE is drawing near, 'something needs to be done about it'.

Expect more of the same for the next six months.

Bobajob_ said:

Sean_F said:

Bobajob_ said:
In all fairness, not sure the media ever did like Ukip did they?

Ukip if you want. The media is not for kipping.
I think the media didn't really pay much attention to UKIP till about a year ago. Most media outlets (with the exception of the Express) have been hostile since the Spring (though there individual journalists are sympathetic).

Sean_F said:

Bobajob_ said:
In all fairness, not sure the media ever did like Ukip did they?

Ukip if you want. The media is not for kipping.
I think the media didn't really pay much attention to UKIP till about a year ago. Most media outlets (with the exception of the Express) have been hostile since the Spring (though there individual journalists are sympathetic).

Sean

I think that's about right, yes. The idea that the media narrative has somehow "turned" against a partty that was widely ignored, then openly mocked, is OGH stretching a point I think.

The hostility of the left-wing media, plus that section of the media that's pro-EU, is pretty much a given.

The right wing media is torn between having some sympathy for UKIP, and worries about vote-splitting.

TheWatcher · December 2014

saddened said:

Bobajob_ said:

saddened said:

BenM said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Ordinary teachers (My wife is one) defined as the blob?

.
Contender for least surprising revelation ever on P.B? I'd have bet good money that was the case.
Brilliant after timing. Amazing how people's instincts are proved correct when they already have the answer. I'd have put a large amount of cash on City winning two-nothing at Roma on Wednesday
I'd also have put good money on you slinking back after yet another flounce. Is that after timing or an accurate estimation of what did happen?

I'm sure he would have returned sooner, but for difficulties choosing another Log In name.

rcs1000 · December 2014

Indigo said:

Here's the French asking for it not six months ago.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/482463/EXCLUSIVE-EU-needs-European-army-that-EXCLUDES-UK-claims-former-French-minister

No: here's a former French minister.

That would be like me taking comments from Paul Boateng and claiming THE BRITISH WANT xxx

isam · December 2014

OldKingCole said:

FalseFlag said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Moronic article, the quality of the students is by far the biggest determinant in educational outcomes. The relentless importing of low IQ immigrants ensure we will continue to see a decline in the standard of living and a grim future.
One of my friends, who suffered a serious stroke last year, has a new, albeit temporary, carer; a young Bulgarian lady who says that she's a law graduate. Sadly, apparently, her father needs a procedure which, in Bulgaria, isn't free, so to pay for it she's working here. She can earn more as a carer in UK, apparently, than she can as a new law graduate at home.

So low IQ ...... not always.

Why doesn't the Bulgarian man come to England and have the procedure?

peter_from_putney · December 2014

Populus:

Overall, 39% of MPs agree that taxes should rise in order to reduce the structural deficit in the budget, but this includes just 2% of Conservatives. In contrast, three-quarters (74%) of Labour MPs agree with this approach.

Well there's a surprise .... NOT!

foxinsoxuk · December 2014

Sean_F said:

foxinsoxuk said:

Indigo said:

foxinsoxuk said:
Small c conservatism is indeed a defining aspect of kipper support. It is why the "back to the fifties" and Trumpton memes work so well. Small c conservatism is defined by opposition to change, even it seems from what the Dear Leader was saying on QT last night, opposition to any use of private companies in the NHS.
I think the same is true of "forward looking" parties. Just because its moving forward doesn't mean its going to be an improvement, Milibandism almost certainly won't be an improvement on where we are now, Brownism was a disaster as well. In many ways Europeanism is the ultimate conservatism, its based on the dreams and fears of old men. It has been completely contents to ignore the democratic will in two of its nations and conspire in the downfall of elected leaders and replace them with technocrats, and now we have a judge telling politicians that its there job to defeat Euroscepticism, I dont want to go back to the 50's (I'm not a kipper) but I fail to see the EU as the great leap forward, unless we are using those words in their Maoist context.
I would agree. The problem with the EU is its own small c conservatism: In particular the CAP supports 19th Century land management, and fails to recognise that agriculture is not the mainspring of the European economy. It favours old style centralism; it fails to recognise the threat to liberal social values of a liberal immigration policy etc.

But the kipper-style small c conservatism breaking out in right wing populism in Europe is at least as repellent, and also fails to engage with the modern world.

But the alternative is not much brighter: The Middle East is a basket case of islamic despotism; Russia is a kleptocracy, China is crushing dissent in Hong Kong; and even the American Dream has gone very sour. Canada and Australia are at least as troubled by multi-culturism as the UK.

Frankly, the world is in a bit of a mess; but Europe is the best and most civilised bit
What many Europeans are finding is that the modern world isn't turning out very well for them.

It is in part demographics; the white population of the world is older and less fertile. The North Asians are rapidly catching up, but even in places like Iran and Bangladesh the fertility rate is dropping rapidly and population structure is ageing.

Inevitably the European influence on the world is less than it was a century ago, but it still is a very attractive place to be. Hence the number of people wanting to migrate to Europe in general and UK in particular. What we need to do is ensure that these migrants adopt our liberal and democratic values. This is why I am less troubled by Polish migrants who integrate well than Islamic migrants who too frequently do not.

Flightpath · December 2014

How is a donor demanding influence on a political party some sort of ''media narrative turning against''? Its a legitimate story.

TheScreamingEagles · December 2014

Sheffield is the intellectual heart of the anti-UKIP movement. It makes me proud to live in this great city, especially after we rejected them comprehensively in the PCC election

A charitable Sheffield greengrocer has been boycotted by UKIP voters - after it put up a sign saying it disagreed with party views on immigration.

New Roots on Glossop Road, Broomhill, uses its proceeds to support homeless people and asylum seekers and displayed a poster which read ‘Farage is a banker, no to scape-goating, immigrants are welcome here’ in the window.

Volunteers received a letter saying UKIP party leader Nigel Farage ‘speaks the truth’ and voters ‘will not be visiting your shop again.’

A second letter said supporters would call in to ask for a UKIP poster to go up alongside the ‘insulting’ one.

http://www.thestar.co.uk/what-s-on/ukip-voters-boycott-sheffield-greengrocers-in-bizarre-immigration-row-1-7000862

isam · December 2014

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?

Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal

peter_from_putney · December 2014

peter_from_putney said:
Populus:

Overall, 39% of MPs agree that taxes should rise in order to reduce the structural deficit in the budget, but this includes just 2% of Conservatives. In contrast, three-quarters (74%) of Labour MPs agree with this approach.

Well there's a surprise .... NOT!

There's your big divide then for the forthcoming General Election. Never let it be said that there's no difference between the two major parties.

Sean_F · December 2014

TheScreamingEagles said:
Sheffield is the intellectual heart of the anti-UKIP movement. It makes me proud to live in this great city, especially after we rejected them comprehensively in the PCC election

A charitable Sheffield greengrocer has been boycotted by UKIP voters - after it put up a sign saying it disagreed with party views on immigration.

New Roots on Glossop Road, Broomhill, uses its proceeds to support homeless people and asylum seekers and displayed a poster which read ‘Farage is a banker, no to scape-goating, immigrants are welcome here’ in the window.

Volunteers received a letter saying UKIP party leader Nigel Farage ‘speaks the truth’ and voters ‘will not be visiting your shop again.’

A second letter said supporters would call in to ask for a UKIP poster to go up alongside the ‘insulting’ one.

http://www.thestar.co.uk/what-s-on/ukip-voters-boycott-sheffield-greengrocers-in-bizarre-immigration-row-1-7000862

Sheffield still returns more UKIP councillors than Conservative ones.

BenM · December 2014

Indigo said:

BenM said:

FalseFlag said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Moronic article, the quality of the students is by far the biggest determinant in educational outcomes. The relentless importing of low IQ immigrants ensure we will continue to see a decline in the standard of living and a grim future.
Codswallop.

Report into the success of London primary schooling points out that the diversity of pupils is the biggest determining factor.

http://www.bris.ac.uk/news/2014/november/london-effect.html
I assume you didn't actually read that article, which mentions neither intelligence or IQ. Culture makes a big difference, largely its that parents of working class british kids are on the whole disinterested in education and there is very much a culture in schools of the less able trying to encourage their peers not to make any effort "Swat!" "Nerd!" etc.

In many other cultures parents from less advantaged backgrounds are heavily engaged in getting their children a better education, because in their countries there is no JSA, if you dont earn enough you are either a burden on your family or you get hungry, and a child with a good income is the best sort of security in old age in most Asian countries.

Dont bother googling more articles to spout at me, I'm not interested. I'm an educational psychologist and teacher, I part own a school in a developing country, every day I deal with poor parents who are working every hour they can to get their children the best education they can, I know how it works from experience thank you very much.

Haha - yes don't bother with awkward things like "facts" or "research" - your dreary ill informed prejudice will do.

TheScreamingEagles · December 2014

Sean_F said:

TheScreamingEagles said:
Sheffield is the intellectual heart of the anti-UKIP movement. It makes me proud to live in this great city, especially after we rejected them comprehensively in the PCC election

A charitable Sheffield greengrocer has been boycotted by UKIP voters - after it put up a sign saying it disagreed with party views on immigration.

New Roots on Glossop Road, Broomhill, uses its proceeds to support homeless people and asylum seekers and displayed a poster which read ‘Farage is a banker, no to scape-goating, immigrants are welcome here’ in the window.

Volunteers received a letter saying UKIP party leader Nigel Farage ‘speaks the truth’ and voters ‘will not be visiting your shop again.’

A second letter said supporters would call in to ask for a UKIP poster to go up alongside the ‘insulting’ one.

http://www.thestar.co.uk/what-s-on/ukip-voters-boycott-sheffield-greengrocers-in-bizarre-immigration-row-1-7000862
Sheffield still returns more UKIP councillors than Conservative ones.

I long accepted that Sheffield would never be a Tory city.

TheScreamingEagles · December 2014

Sergio Aguero fights off thieves who viciously attacked his owner.

http://www.itv.com/news/granada/2014-12-12/sergio-the-shar-pei-fights-off-dog-thieves/

TheScreamingEagles · December 2014

Anyhoo, the big story of today.

The Battle of the Five Armies is out today, and I'm off to see it.

TGOHF · December 2014

TheScreamingEagles said:
Sheffield is the intellectual heart of the anti-UKIP movement. It makes me proud to live in this great city, especially after we rejected them comprehensively in the PCC election

So if the Blades or Wednesday draw Trumpton in the FA cup it could be a real grudge match ?

TheScreamingEagles · December 2014

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:
Sheffield is the intellectual heart of the anti-UKIP movement. It makes me proud to live in this great city, especially after we rejected them comprehensively in the PCC election

So if the Blades or Wednesday draw Trumpton in the FA cup it could be a real grudge match ?

Hell yes.

When Nottingham Forest were drawn to play Sheffield United in the FA Cup earlier on this year, the Blades fans still referred to Forest as "The Scabs", 30 years after the miners strike.

TheWatcher · December 2014

BenM said:

Indigo said:

BenM said:

FalseFlag said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Moronic article, the quality of the students is by far the biggest determinant in educational outcomes. The relentless importing of low IQ immigrants ensure we will continue to see a decline in the standard of living and a grim future.
Codswallop.

Report into the success of London primary schooling points out that the diversity of pupils is the biggest determining factor.

http://www.bris.ac.uk/news/2014/november/london-effect.html
I assume you didn't actually read that article, which mentions neither intelligence or IQ. Culture makes a big difference, largely its that parents of working class british kids are on the whole disinterested in education and there is very much a culture in schools of the less able trying to encourage their peers not to make any effort "Swat!" "Nerd!" etc.

In many other cultures parents from less advantaged backgrounds are heavily engaged in getting their children a better education, because in their countries there is no JSA, if you dont earn enough you are either a burden on your family or you get hungry, and a child with a good income is the best sort of security in old age in most Asian countries.

Dont bother googling more articles to spout at me, I'm not interested. I'm an educational psychologist and teacher, I part own a school in a developing country, every day I deal with poor parents who are working every hour they can to get their children the best education they can, I know how it works from experience thank you very much.

Haha - yes don't bother with awkward things like "facts" or "research" - your dreary ill informed prejudice will do.

Oh dear Ben. First hand experience clearly beats anecdotal 'evidence' from Blobby wife.

foxinsoxuk · December 2014

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal

The issue seems to be one of Central office vs local constituencies. Both Hamilton and Bolter were supported by HQ but rejected by the troops on the ground.

This is quite a significant disconnect between the elite and the grassroots. Now where have we seen that before? New politics? You're having a laugh!

logical_song · December 2014

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal

Let me get that straight ISAM, as a potential UKIP parliamentary candidate, you are saying that Neil Hamilton (deputy leader of UKIP according to Wikipedia) is and unsuitable Westminster candidate?
PS I liked "missing the pint (sic) completely"

TCPoliticalBetting · December 2014

Richard_Tyndall said:
Yet another reason why UKIP needs a fundamental reevaluation of its leadership. Hamilton, as someone found guilty by a Parliamentary inquiry of abuse of his position should never in a million years have been able to get to the point where he was being considered for a seat and at the same time, if true, then Farage should not be in the position where he can spike prospective candidates because of the threat to his own supremacy.
We need a complete change at the top.

UKIP needs the principles and structures that nurture good and able people. A large part of UKIP's activists came from the Conservative party because it had some failings in its democracy and respect for mainstream views. But the failings in the Conservative party are starting to look minor compared to the gross abuses at the top of UKIP.

That said this may not hamper UKIP much leading into the GE as it takes time or some massive event to reduce UKIP to a party with <10% support.

TCPoliticalBetting · December 2014

isam said:

OldKingCole said:

FalseFlag said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Moronic article, the quality of the students is by far the biggest determinant in educational outcomes. The relentless importing of low IQ immigrants ensure we will continue to see a decline in the standard of living and a grim future.
One of my friends, who suffered a serious stroke last year, has a new, albeit temporary, carer; a young Bulgarian lady who says that she's a law graduate. Sadly, apparently, her father needs a procedure which, in Bulgaria, isn't free, so to pay for it she's working here. She can earn more as a carer in UK, apparently, than she can as a new law graduate at home.

So low IQ ...... not always.
Why doesn't the Bulgarian man come to England and have the procedure?

He probably will, when they figure out how to use our welfare & health systems.

Peter_the_Punter · December 2014

foxinsoxuk said:

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal
The issue seems to be one of Central office vs local constituencies. Both Hamilton and Bolter were supported by HQ but rejected by the troops on the ground.

This is quite a significant disconnect between the elite and the grassroots. Now where have we seen that before? New politics? You're having a laugh!

Enough is now known about the Bolton case for us to be sure HQ had rumbled her before she got too far.

The Hamilton affair remains a little murky and we may never know the whole truth, but at least the local constituency got its local man in the end.

Local Constituencies are very powerful and can give the HQs of all Parties considerable difficulties, if they wish. My impression is that Tory CPs tend to be more 'independent' than Labour ones, although the latter has had some well reported issues in this connection over the years.

FalseFlag · December 2014

BenM said:

FalseFlag said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Moronic article, the quality of the students is by far the biggest determinant in educational outcomes. The relentless importing of low IQ immigrants ensure we will continue to see a decline in the standard of living and a grim future.
Codswallop.

Report into the success of London primary schooling points out that the diversity of pupils is the biggest determining factor.

http://www.bris.ac.uk/news/2014/november/london-effect.html

Perhaps you should actually read what you link to.

'Previous research from CMPO showed that white British pupils achieve the lowest GCSE scores relative to their attainment at age 11, which this study confirms for 2013.'

Relative to their attainment at age 11. So immigrants do slightly better between ages 11 to 16, slightly narrowing the sizeable achievement gap to their white British peers, but as all the data otherwise shows they do substantially worse than white British students overall.

You can read Minority Ethnic Pupils in the Longitudinal Study of Young People in England (LSYPE) by Steve Strand.

Bobajob_ · December 2014

Sad

I didn't flounce - merely banned myself for having "two screen names" which is apparently illegal. I returned after a week and you are the only one dreary enough to bring it up again. Who gives a shit?

Pulpstar · December 2014

TheScreamingEagles said:
Sheffield is the intellectual heart of the anti-UKIP movement. It makes me proud to live in this great city, especially after we rejected them comprehensively in the PCC election

A charitable Sheffield greengrocer has been boycotted by UKIP voters - after it put up a sign saying it disagreed with party views on immigration.

New Roots on Glossop Road, Broomhill, uses its proceeds to support homeless people and asylum seekers and displayed a poster which read ‘Farage is a banker, no to scape-goating, immigrants are welcome here’ in the window.

Volunteers received a letter saying UKIP party leader Nigel Farage ‘speaks the truth’ and voters ‘will not be visiting your shop again.’

A second letter said supporters would call in to ask for a UKIP poster to go up alongside the ‘insulting’ one.

http://www.thestar.co.uk/what-s-on/ukip-voters-boycott-sheffield-greengrocers-in-bizarre-immigration-row-1-7000862

Broomhill ward must be one of the most left-liberal wards in the whole of the north:

https://www.sheffield.gov.uk/your-city-council/elections/election-results/2014/broomhill.html

Won by the Greens !

isam · December 2014

logical_song said:

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal
Let me get that straight ISAM, as a potential UKIP parliamentary candidate, you are saying that Neil Hamilton (deputy leader of UKIP according to Wikipedia) is and unsuitable Westminster candidate?
PS I liked "missing the pint (sic) completely"

Oops sorry for the typing error... was on the phone. Poor editing on my part.

You've done the same with "and" meaning "an" I presume,

I don't really know anything about Neil Hamilton... before this week I wouldn't have been able to tell you why he stopped being an MP in the first place. But it seems that two constituencies, (Boston & Skegness and S Bas & E Thurrock) found him unsuitable

MarqueeMark · December 2014

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal

It didn't prevent UKIP selecting a guy who one week later pleaded guilty to animal cruelty charges that saw him jailed.

Some interesting stuff floats to the top in UKIP....

isam · December 2014

Just got a call off my Dad, a teacher is Barking & Dagenham

"I know that UKIP bird!" he said

Natasha Bolter worked at his school for a while... interesting

Indigo · December 2014

FalseFlag said:

BenM said:

FalseFlag said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Moronic article, the quality of the students is by far the biggest determinant in educational outcomes. The relentless importing of low IQ immigrants ensure we will continue to see a decline in the standard of living and a grim future.
Codswallop.

Report into the success of London primary schooling points out that the diversity of pupils is the biggest determining factor.

http://www.bris.ac.uk/news/2014/november/london-effect.html
Perhaps you should actually read what you link to.

'Previous research from CMPO showed that white British pupils achieve the lowest GCSE scores relative to their attainment at age 11, which this study confirms for 2013.'

Relative to their attainment at age 11. So immigrants do slightly better between ages 11 to 16 but as all the data otherwise shows they do substantially worse than White British students overall.

You can read Minority Ethnic Pupils in the Longitudinal Study of Young People in England (LSYPE) by Steve Strand.

Students arrive from other countries with worse (often dramatically worse) education provision than ours, and its a shock that they struggle in school compared to children that grew up in our system ? British students whose parents are posted abroad for a few years often struggle to catch up. We will probably return to England somewhen in the next 18 months, it's quite likely I will have to ask for my children to enter the school year below the position they should be, so they can catch up after five years abroad.

MarqueeMark · December 2014

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:
Sheffield is the intellectual heart of the anti-UKIP movement. It makes me proud to live in this great city, especially after we rejected them comprehensively in the PCC election

So if the Blades or Wednesday draw Trumpton in the FA cup it could be a real grudge match ?
Hell yes.

When Nottingham Forest were drawn to play Sheffield United in the FA Cup earlier on this year, the Blades fans still referred to Forest as "The Scabs", 30 years after the miners strike.

But we were League and double European Cup winning scabs....which may have had more to do with the dislike. And the mighty city of Sheffield has won what?

logical_song · December 2014

isam said:

logical_song said:

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal
Let me get that straight ISAM, as a potential UKIP parliamentary candidate, you are saying that Neil Hamilton (deputy leader of UKIP according to Wikipedia) is and unsuitable Westminster candidate?
PS I liked "missing the pint (sic) completely"
Oops sorry for the typing error... was on the phone. Poor editing on my part.

You've done the same with "and" meaning "an" I presume,

I don't really know anything about Neil Hamilton... before this week I wouldn't have been able to tell you why he stopped being an MP in the first place. But it seems that two constituencies, (Boston & Skegness and S Bas & E Thurrock) found him unsuitable

Yes we all make typos, but yours was funny (UKIP, Pint - geddit?).
I'd have thought that all constituencies of all parties everywhere would have found Neil Hamilton unsuitable. Won't you get reprimanded by the UKIP high command for dissing your deputy leader?

TheWatcher · December 2014

Bobajob_ said:
Sad

I didn't flounce - merely banned myself for having "two screen names" which is apparently illegal. I returned after a week and you are the only one dreary enough to bring it up again. Who gives a shit?

Must have been a different Bobajob who fled after a contretemps with another poster.

Are there more of you?

TheScreamingEagles · December 2014

MarqueeMark said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:
Sheffield is the intellectual heart of the anti-UKIP movement. It makes me proud to live in this great city, especially after we rejected them comprehensively in the PCC election

So if the Blades or Wednesday draw Trumpton in the FA cup it could be a real grudge match ?
Hell yes.

When Nottingham Forest were drawn to play Sheffield United in the FA Cup earlier on this year, the Blades fans still referred to Forest as "The Scabs", 30 years after the miners strike.
But we were League and double European Cup winning scabs....which may have had more to do with the dislike. And the mighty city of Sheffield has won what?

Wednesday won the Rumbelows Cup in 1991.

FalseFlag · December 2014

Indigo said:

FalseFlag said:

BenM said:

FalseFlag said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Moronic article, the quality of the students is by far the biggest determinant in educational outcomes. The relentless importing of low IQ immigrants ensure we will continue to see a decline in the standard of living and a grim future.
Codswallop.

Report into the success of London primary schooling points out that the diversity of pupils is the biggest determining factor.

http://www.bris.ac.uk/news/2014/november/london-effect.html
Perhaps you should actually read what you link to.

'Previous research from CMPO showed that white British pupils achieve the lowest GCSE scores relative to their attainment at age 11, which this study confirms for 2013.'

Relative to their attainment at age 11. So immigrants do slightly better between ages 11 to 16 but as all the data otherwise shows they do substantially worse than White British students overall.

You can read Minority Ethnic Pupils in the Longitudinal Study of Young People in England (LSYPE) by Steve Strand.
Students arrive from other countries with worse (often dramatically worse) education provision than ours, and its a shock that they struggle in school compared to children that grew up in our system ? British students whose parents are posted abroad for a few years often struggle to catch up. We will probably return to England somewhen in the next 18 months, it's quite likely I will have to ask for my children to enter the school year below the position they should be, so they can catch up after five years abroad.

I would expect that to be a factor in the results shown however second generation immigrants show similarly low, but not as low, levels of achievement.

Of course I have seen similar studies where they have compared immigrants only to low income white British and also in Sweden where second generation immigrants are included in the Swedish category. It is rather shameful that academics persist in such fraud to hide results they don't like.

Indigo · December 2014

MarqueeMark said:

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal
It didn't prevent UKIP selecting a guy who one week later pleaded guilty to animal cruelty charges that saw him jailed.

Some interesting stuff floats to the top in UKIP....

Oh come off it. If we started listing all the scandals that came from the conservative and labour parties here we could be here all night, its part of the joys of politics. One could also point out there were several Tories involved in scandals in the 1990s who still managed to stay in parliament until 1997, and presumably would be there still if they hadn't lost the election. Endless fun to be found here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_scandals_in_the_United_Kingdom

Moses_ · December 2014

OldKingCole said:

Moses_ said:

BenM said:

TheWatcher said:

BenM said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Ordinary teachers (My wife is one) defined as the blob?

Really - is that what rightwing commentary has come to?

No wonder they won't vote for you.
If she shares your views, I'd plonk her firmly in the Blob.
If the Blob is defeating the gragantuanly wasteful free schools policy, I'm all for it.
Trouble is you sum up perfectly the problem. My wife and also at a school found that whatever Labour said the majority by far would welcome with open arms however stupid or whacky. On the other hand the same people would go out of their way to ensure anything the Tories put forward failed and by god they really made sure that happened.

My wife finally resigned and left as she said at the time "the children were just simply political cannon fodder to these people"
If my teacher relations are any guide the vast majority simply want to get on and teach, without a new idea thrust upon them every term.

Have the A/AS syllabi for next year been sorted out yet? Last time I asked they hadn't been.

Which means teachers don't know how they advise pupils at a crucial stage in their lives.

Absolutely, Nothing changes, briefings , meetings and teacher training days were somewhat chaotic and dwelt on targets and the next or more often..... the last OFSTED.

Sadly this still is happening as you point out.

Fenman · December 2014

UKIP's pretence at being somehow different is falling apart and with it will go the protest vote which will use this as an excuse to stay at home. Which is probably what they were going to do anyway.

Peter_the_Punter · December 2014

Indigo said:

MarqueeMark said:

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal
It didn't prevent UKIP selecting a guy who one week later pleaded guilty to animal cruelty charges that saw him jailed.

Some interesting stuff floats to the top in UKIP....

Oh come off it. If we started listing all the scandals that came from the conservative and labour parties here we could be here all night, its part of the joys of politics. One could also point out there were several Tories involved in scandals in the 1990s who still managed to stay in parliament until 1997, and presumably would be there still if they hadn't lost the election. Endless fun to be found here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_scandals_in_the_United_Kingdom

Great fun, as you say.

To me, the Expenses Scandal was one of the worst. A particularly depressing aspect was that so many offenders were re-elected at the subsequent GE.

The public really doesn't care that much.

logical_song · December 2014

Indigo said:

MarqueeMark said:

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal
It didn't prevent UKIP selecting a guy who one week later pleaded guilty to animal cruelty charges that saw him jailed.

Some interesting stuff floats to the top in UKIP....

Oh come off it. If we started listing all the scandals that came from the conservative and labour parties here we could be here all night, its part of the joys of politics. One could also point out there were several Tories involved in scandals in the 1990s who still managed to stay in parliament until 1997, and presumably would be there still if they hadn't lost the election. Endless fun to be found here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_scandals_in_the_United_Kingdom

Thanks for the link, some of the early ones I'd never heard of before.
UKIP does seem to have quite a lot of scandals for such a 'new' party though.
What were they thinking of making Neil Hamilton deputy with his history? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cash-for-questions_affair

Moses_ · December 2014

Bobajob_ said:
Sad

I didn't flounce - merely banned myself for having "two screen names" which is apparently illegal. I returned after a week and you are the only one dreary enough to bring it up again. Who gives a shit?

Post of the year. That's an absolute keeper. *shakes head*

By the way i suspect people do actually give a shit....... it is a betting site after all.

MikeK · December 2014

Hi all, just out of hospital after my delayed prostate operation. It seems to have gone well-touch wood.

However, I can't leave PB for a few days without returning to the now unceasing attacks on UKIP. Please for once, bang another drum.

isam · December 2014

logical_song said:

isam said:

logical_song said:

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal
Let me get that straight ISAM, as a potential UKIP parliamentary candidate, you are saying that Neil Hamilton (deputy leader of UKIP according to Wikipedia) is and unsuitable Westminster candidate?
PS I liked "missing the pint (sic) completely"
Oops sorry for the typing error... was on the phone. Poor editing on my part.

You've done the same with "and" meaning "an" I presume,

I don't really know anything about Neil Hamilton... before this week I wouldn't have been able to tell you why he stopped being an MP in the first place. But it seems that two constituencies, (Boston & Skegness and S Bas & E Thurrock) found him unsuitable
Yes we all make typos, but yours was funny (UKIP, Pint - geddit?).
I'd have thought that all constituencies of all parties everywhere would have found Neil Hamilton unsuitable. Won't you get reprimanded by the UKIP high command for dissing your deputy leader?

Oh Pint, yes I see

I don't think I will get reprimanded, I doubt anyone will read this! But who knows?! Maybe you can email them to get one over on me?! The high command.. ooh!

Peter_the_Punter · December 2014

MikeK said:
Hi all, just out of hospital after my delayed prostate operation. It seems to have gone well-touch wood.

However, I can't leave PB for a few days without returning to the now unceasing attacks on UKIP. Please for once, bang another drum.

Congratulations, Mike, and all the best for a swift return to full health.

And don't worry about the attacks. It shows UKIP are being seriously.

SimonStClare · December 2014

@MikeK - glad to hear your visit to matron went well and that you are back in fighting spirit.

Indigo · December 2014

FalseFlag said:

Indigo said:

FalseFlag said:

Perhaps you should actually read what you link to.

'Previous research from CMPO showed that white British pupils achieve the lowest GCSE scores relative to their attainment at age 11, which this study confirms for 2013.'

Relative to their attainment at age 11. So immigrants do slightly better between ages 11 to 16 but as all the data otherwise shows they do substantially worse than White British students overall.

You can read Minority Ethnic Pupils in the Longitudinal Study of Young People in England (LSYPE) by Steve Strand.
Students arrive from other countries with worse (often dramatically worse) education provision than ours, and its a shock that they struggle in school compared to children that grew up in our system ? British students whose parents are posted abroad for a few years often struggle to catch up. We will probably return to England somewhen in the next 18 months, it's quite likely I will have to ask for my children to enter the school year below the position they should be, so they can catch up after five years abroad.
I would expect that to be a factor in the results shown however second generation immigrants show similarly low, but not as low, levels of achievement.

Of course I have seen similar studies where they have compared immigrants only to low income white British and also in Sweden where second generation immigrants are included in the Swedish category. It is rather shameful that academics persist in such fraud to hide results they don't like.

To get a meaningful study you will need to compare immigrants brought up in a local family with local children, thereby removing cultural aspects and concentrating only on the child themselves. I doubt there are enough of those to make a useful result set. Otherwise there will be all sorts of artifacts in the test data: if the first generation immigrants tend to perform less well due to poor education in their mother country, that population will be below average education compared to the local population, and so learning they propagate to their children would be expected to be lower as well. Similarly if there are cultural or alienation based reasons for not valuing schooling or poor attendance that would knock on to the second generation as well. Adoption studies have shown that children from poor backgrounds have better developed general intelligence when adopted into well off families compared to into poor families for example, and largely immigrants start lower down the socioeconomic scale.

TheScreamingEagles · December 2014

MikeK said:
Hi all, just out of hospital after my delayed prostate operation. It seems to have gone well-touch wood.

However, I can't leave PB for a few days without returning to the now unceasing attacks on UKIP. Please for once, bang another drum.

Glad it went well old bean

Moses_ · December 2014

MikeK said:
Hi all, just out of hospital after my delayed prostate operation. It seems to have gone well-touch wood.

However, I can't leave PB for a few days without returning to the now unceasing attacks on UKIP. Please for once, bang another drum.

Really Hope all turns out well for you.

I will not refer to UKIP today to aid your convalescence.

TheScreamingEagles · December 2014

Latest Populus VI: Lab 35 (-1), Con 34 (+1), LD 9 (+1), UKIP 14 (-1), Oth 7 (-1). Tables here: http://popu.lu/s_vi141212

Paul_Mid_Beds · December 2014

It is fairly obvious from the media and not least posts and comments here that the principal divide in UK politics is between lablibcon and the two large nationalist parties SNP and UKIP.

The big three parties by chasing the centre have unintentionally allied themselves with each other on far too many issues and on the principal political issues of the day found themselves all on the same side.

Imagine how well the SDP would have done in 1983 if both Tories and Labour favoured unilateral nuclear disarmament and EU withdrawal.

Indeed, if Cameron had been elected leader in 1974 he would probably have made tory policy unilateral disarmament, greater powers to the unions and wholesale nationalisation in an attempt to win the 79 election by winning over guardian reading labour voting middle classes, failed to get a majority and ended up in a coalition with David Steels liberals with Cyril Smith ending up as Education Secretary.

HurstLlama · December 2014

MikeK said:
Hi all, just out of hospital after my delayed prostate operation. It seems to have gone well-touch wood.

However, I can't leave PB for a few days without returning to the now unceasing attacks on UKIP. Please for once, bang another drum.

Good to see you back, Mr. K, and glad thing seem to have gone well. Best wishes for a full and early recovery.

logical_song · December 2014

Paul_Mid_Beds said:
It is fairly obvious from the media and not least posts and comments here that the principal divide in UK politics is between lablibcon and the two large nationalist parties SNP and UKIP.

The big three parties by chasing the centre have unintentionally allied themselves with each other on far too many issues and on the principal political issues of the day found themselves all on the same side.

Imagine how well the SDP would have done in 1983 if both Tories and Labour favoured unilateral nuclear disarmament and EU withdrawal.

Indeed, if Cameron had been elected leader in 1974 he would probably have made tory policy unilateral disarmament, greater powers to the unions and wholesale nationalisation in an attempt to win the 79 election by winning over guardian reading labour voting middle classes, failed to get a majority and ended up in a coalition with David Steels liberals with Cyril Smith ending up as Education Secretary.

I disagree with your main divide opinion.
The counterfactuals seem extremely unlikely. Cameron in favour of unilateral disarmament, doesn't make any sense at all.

TGOHF · December 2014

TheScreamingEagles said:
Latest Populus VI: Lab 35 (-1), Con 34 (+1), LD 9 (+1), UKIP 14 (-1), Oth 7 (-1). Tables here: http://popu.lu/s_vi141212

Populus not showing much green support if others = 7%.

TheScreamingEagles · December 2014

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:
Latest Populus VI: Lab 35 (-1), Con 34 (+1), LD 9 (+1), UKIP 14 (-1), Oth 7 (-1). Tables here: http://popu.lu/s_vi141212
Populus not showing much green support if others = 7%.

Greens on 4%

isam · December 2014

MikeK said:
Hi all, just out of hospital after my delayed prostate operation. It seems to have gone well-touch wood.

However, I can't leave PB for a few days without returning to the now unceasing attacks on UKIP. Please for once, bang another drum.

If they weren't worried we were taking their votes they wouldn't bother. Take it as a compliment

Hope the op went well

logical_song · December 2014

isam said:

logical_song said:

isam said:

logical_song said:

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal
Let me get that straight ISAM, as a potential UKIP parliamentary candidate, you are saying that Neil Hamilton (deputy leader of UKIP according to Wikipedia) is and unsuitable Westminster candidate?
PS I liked "missing the pint (sic) completely"
Oops sorry for the typing error... was on the phone. Poor editing on my part.

You've done the same with "and" meaning "an" I presume,

I don't really know anything about Neil Hamilton... before this week I wouldn't have been able to tell you why he stopped being an MP in the first place. But it seems that two constituencies, (Boston & Skegness and S Bas & E Thurrock) found him unsuitable
Yes we all make typos, but yours was funny (UKIP, Pint - geddit?).
I'd have thought that all constituencies of all parties everywhere would have found Neil Hamilton unsuitable. Won't you get reprimanded by the UKIP high command for dissing your deputy leader?
Oh Pint, yes I see

I don't think I will get reprimanded, I doubt anyone will read this! But who knows?! Maybe you can email them to get one over on me?! The high command.. ooh!

Hey, that wasn't sarcasm was it?
Seriously, aren't you a bit worried by Neil Hamilton being your deputy leader?

Flightpath · December 2014

Paul_Mid_Beds said:
It is fairly obvious from the media and not least posts and comments here that the principal divide in UK politics is between lablibcon and the two large nationalist parties SNP and UKIP.

The big three parties by chasing the centre have unintentionally allied themselves with each other on far too many issues and on the principal political issues of the day found themselves all on the same side.

Imagine how well the SDP would have done in 1983 if both Tories and Labour favoured unilateral nuclear disarmament and EU withdrawal.

Indeed, if Cameron had been elected leader in 1974 he would probably have made tory policy unilateral disarmament, greater powers to the unions and wholesale nationalisation in an attempt to win the 79 election by winning over guardian reading labour voting middle classes, failed to get a majority and ended up in a coalition with David Steels liberals with Cyril Smith ending up as Education Secretary.

It is not 'failrly obvious' at all. It is pretty obvious that you do not like the cult following which you favour coming under proper scrutiny.
The party led by Cameron is presiding over an economic policy designed to bring public spending down to 35% of GDP. It is cutting public secor employment by hundreds of thousands. Guardian readers are spitting feathers. The govt despite being a coalition with the LDs is already spending money ready to upgrade Trident.
Your fantasies are exposed.
But its good to see you admit that UKIP is another contemptable Nationalsit Party.

Indigo · December 2014

logical_song said:

Indigo said:

MarqueeMark said:

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal
It didn't prevent UKIP selecting a guy who one week later pleaded guilty to animal cruelty charges that saw him jailed.

Some interesting stuff floats to the top in UKIP....

Oh come off it. If we started listing all the scandals that came from the conservative and labour parties here we could be here all night, its part of the joys of politics. One could also point out there were several Tories involved in scandals in the 1990s who still managed to stay in parliament until 1997, and presumably would be there still if they hadn't lost the election. Endless fun to be found here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_scandals_in_the_United_Kingdom
Thanks for the link, some of the early ones I'd never heard of before.
UKIP does seem to have quite a lot of scandals for such a 'new' party though.
What were they thinking of making Neil Hamilton deputy with his history? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cash-for-questions_affair

Matthew Parris, a man for which I largely have very little time, wrote a good book called "Great Parliamentary Scandals", which goes all the way back to Francis Bacon in 1621, and is well worth a read, maybe see if you can find a second hand copy, Mr Parris doesn't deserve any extra money after some of this recent outpourings

I think actually the voters should be trusted, if UKIP are stupid enough to select Hamilton, and the electors are stupid enough to vote for him, we clearly deserve the politicians we elect.

logical_song · December 2014

TheScreamingEagles said:
Latest Populus VI: Lab 35 (-1), Con 34 (+1), LD 9 (+1), UKIP 14 (-1), Oth 7 (-1). Tables here: http://popu.lu/s_vi141212

Con/Lab and LD/UKIP crossovers imminent?

isam · December 2014

logical_song said:

isam said:

logical_song said:

isam said:

logical_song said:

isam said:

Peter_the_Punter said:
@The Watcher

But neither Bolter nor Hamilton were selected, so the system worked.

Other Parties have not always been successful in stopping unsuitable types from becoming candidates, despite greater experience and resources. You can probably think of as many unfortunate examples as me.

In alphetical order, we can start with Archer and Aitken. How many do you think we'll have by the time we get to Z?
Great answer

It says it all doesn't it? People on PB will criticise Ukip for anything, no matter what

Ukip prevents two unsuitable people making the candidate list... And people say 'what happened to the great vetting system?" thinking they've made a killer point, despite missing the pint completely. Unreal
Let me get that straight ISAM, as a potential UKIP parliamentary candidate, you are saying that Neil Hamilton (deputy leader of UKIP according to Wikipedia) is and unsuitable Westminster candidate?
PS I liked "missing the pint (sic) completely"
Oops sorry for the typing error... was on the phone. Poor editing on my part.

You've done the same with "and" meaning "an" I presume,

I don't really know anything about Neil Hamilton... before this week I wouldn't have been able to tell you why he stopped being an MP in the first place. But it seems that two constituencies, (Boston & Skegness and S Bas & E Thurrock) found him unsuitable
Yes we all make typos, but yours was funny (UKIP, Pint - geddit?).
I'd have thought that all constituencies of all parties everywhere would have found Neil Hamilton unsuitable. Won't you get reprimanded by the UKIP high command for dissing your deputy leader?
Oh Pint, yes I see

I don't think I will get reprimanded, I doubt anyone will read this! But who knows?! Maybe you can email them to get one over on me?! The high command.. ooh!
Hey, that wasn't sarcasm was it?
Seriously, aren't you a bit worried by Neil Hamilton being your deputy leader?

I don't know what you're referring to re sarcasm. But I am not worried about who is deputy leader, no.

taffys · December 2014

Watching US oil crash thru 60 a barrel.

How cheap is petrol going to get in the coming months?

Cameron is a lucky general.

MarqueeMark · December 2014

AndyJS said:
It's slightly bizarre that people are talking about Hamilton and Farage rather than Cameron and Miliband with less than 20 weeks to go to polling day.

Not really. People are grubbing around looking for an alternative to Deadward and the underwhelming Cameron. But one of the two will be Prime Minister in mid May and that will inevitably provide focus for the election campaign.

CD13 · December 2014

MikeK,

"Hi all, just out of hospital after my delayed prostate operation. It seems to have gone well-touch wood."

Best wishes for a full recovery.

My Ukip prediction for May 2015 (based on a gut feeling only) - 4 to 6 seats.

I see BenM is taking some of the ant-Kipper abuse, but I don't think posters should have a go at his wife. Leave Mrs Blobby alone! Sorry, Ben, I couldn't resist that.

I've just seen the clip of QT where the woman in the audience rants and shouts racist at the man defending Farage. It reminded me of a bad Jeremy Kyle show, where shouting and screaming abuse wins you the argument. Hmm .. it makes you feel better but that's a different thing.

No wonder Nigel was smiling. Ooops - that should be "smirking" for the anti-kippers.

MarqueeMark · December 2014

TheScreamingEagles said:

MarqueeMark said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:
Sheffield is the intellectual heart of the anti-UKIP movement. It makes me proud to live in this great city, especially after we rejected them comprehensively in the PCC election

So if the Blades or Wednesday draw Trumpton in the FA cup it could be a real grudge match ?
Hell yes.

When Nottingham Forest were drawn to play Sheffield United in the FA Cup earlier on this year, the Blades fans still referred to Forest as "The Scabs", 30 years after the miners strike.
But we were League and double European Cup winning scabs....which may have had more to do with the dislike. And the mighty city of Sheffield has won what?

Wednesday won the Rumbelows Cup in 1991.

How gloriously quaint. Was it rented?

FrankBooth · December 2014

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:
Latest Populus VI: Lab 35 (-1), Con 34 (+1), LD 9 (+1), UKIP 14 (-1), Oth 7 (-1). Tables here: http://popu.lu/s_vi141212
Populus not showing much green support if others = 7%.
Greens on 4%

How much support is Labour losing to the Greens and where are they losing it? My guess is the Greens are now getting some of the Lib>Lab switchers, but will they in the marginals. I've always thought it unwise to think the Lib>Lab switchers were Labour voters coming home (if I vote Labour I'll only be lending them my vote) but I still think they may be fairly solid in the marginals next year.

isam · December 2014

CD13 said:
MikeK,

"Hi all, just out of hospital after my delayed prostate operation. It seems to have gone well-touch wood."

Best wishes for a full recovery.

My Ukip prediction for May 2015 (based on a gut feeling only) - 4 to 6 seats.

I see BenM is taking some of the ant-Kipper abuse, but I don't think posters should have a go at his wife. Leave Mrs Blobby alone! Sorry, Ben, I couldn't resist that.

I've just seen the clip of QT where the woman in the audience rants and shouts racist at the man defending Farage. It reminded me of a bad Jeremy Kyle show, where shouting and screaming abuse wins you the argument. Hmm .. it makes you feel better but that's a different thing.

No wonder Nigel was smiling. Ooops - that should be "smirking" for the anti-kippers.

That was the best bit of the show... an old woman with dyed blue hair, a former SWP nutter, attacking UKIP and supporting Brand. Perfect

Flightpath · December 2014

MikeK said:
Hi all, just out of hospital after my delayed prostate operation. It seems to have gone well-touch wood.

However, I can't leave PB for a few days without returning to the now unceasing attacks on UKIP. Please for once, bang another drum.

Good wishes are due but I'm not sure what you expect people to do (apart from kiss Farage's backside) when he blames M4 congestion on immigrants and its most senior paid official uses his power to get, by his own admission, into bed with a female prospectivecandidate. Its not any observers fault that UKIPs major donor who wants to select candidates.
Should the media have ignored Blunket and his nannys passport? Mandelson and his loan?

felix · December 2014

logical_song said:

TheScreamingEagles said:
Latest Populus VI: Lab 35 (-1), Con 34 (+1), LD 9 (+1), UKIP 14 (-1), Oth 7 (-1). Tables here: http://popu.lu/s_vi141212
Con/Lab and LD/UKIP crossovers imminent?

For a while Populus diverged from the others over the past couple of weeks - it's now re-joined the herd and it's back to near level. Will one or the other break free in the New year?

TGOHF · December 2014

taffys said:
Watching US oil crash thru 60 a barrel.

How cheap is petrol going to get in the coming months?

Cameron is a lucky general.

Not hearing much about the "cost of living crisis".

Once this feeds through to more general food prices then inflation could be sub 1% if not negative - who will be the first to call that out as a bad thing ?

Charles · December 2014

Moses_ said:

TheScreamingEagles said:
From this week we've learnt that if you want to become a UKIP candidate, it will help if you have either some knee pads or a rich donor sugar daddy.
Just wondering why this particular "Sugar Daddy" is so keen to see Hamiliton elected even to the point of imploding a party he is actually a major donor to?

Wheeler isn't a great judge of character (it's part of the reason why he was pushed out of IG Index).

But I wouldn't be surprised if the fact pattern is something like this (all assumptions):

- Farage spikes Hamilton's candidacy because he perceives him as a threat

- Wheeler says that Farage needs to stop behaving like that: not Hamilton specific, but generally he can't behave like he used to when UKIP was a small organisation (with a threat of stopping donations)

- Farage leaks a slightly inaccurate version of the story - that is close enough to the truth to get away with it - to damage Wheeler

AlastairMeeks · December 2014

For those that think that LibLabCon are all the same, this article on commentisfree is a bracing corrective:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/dec/12/modern-britain-good-tories-food-banks-poverty

The article itself is odd enough, but some of the comments below the line read like spoofs or the ramblings of those in need of psychiatric assistance.

MikeK · December 2014

Thanks to all you well wishers. I'm going to take it easy for a couple of weeks and then hope to be fighting fit for the all the excitement of the election battle. It will be an arduous 4 months for all of us, no matter which party is supported.

If the kippers do well, i,e, more than 20 seats. Then its a round of drinks on me at the next DD or wherever we may gather.

Charles · December 2014

Indigo said:

Patrick said:
An excellent DT article about education reform:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/11288932/The-Blob-gobbled-up-Michael-Gove-now-its-coming-for-David-Cameron.html

If this country is to make way in a very very competitive world in the future we absolutely need to ensure we have a genuinely well educated workforce. The educational establishment is dead against this. Defeating the Blob is a matter of national importance. Really. The Blob poses a greater risk to our national future than terrorism.
Since Gove was replaced by Nicky "We need to promote tolerance of beliefs and ideas even if we strongly disapprove of them." Morgan the conservatives have given up on education. Gove it seems was too ambitious for British children, he didn't understand that the education system was there to be run for the benefit of teachers.

I wouldn't be surprised - assuming that the Tories are in government in some form after the election - if Gove gets his job back...

I think the reshuffle was to reduce the salience of the issue ahead of the GE.

OldKingCole · December 2014

Glad all’s going well, Mr K.

Can’t though resist the comment that the euphoria of the anaesthetic hasn’t worn off. Do you know if they used ketamine?
UKIP doing well ..... more thasn 20 seats indeed!

UKIP doing well = 2 or 3 seats.

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