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No Sh*t, Sherlock! – politicalbetting.com

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  • For the benefit of @MikeL , and anyone else interested, here is the (long) explanation of the Good Week/Bad Week Index: why it is, and what it is.

    The Good Week/Bad Week Index (GWBWI)

    Part 1...

    The Aim:

    To create a mathematically calculated index to assess each major party’s performance in the week’s council by-elections; taking out subjective views, party spin, and expectations management; and relying only on information that is consistently available for all by elections.

    Nearly every week, there are a handful of by-elections to vacant council seats. Some seats are held by the defending party, some are lost to a challenger. It should be easy to determine, across the weekly results, who has done well and who badly, but when the observers and prospective interpreters of results have an interest in portraying their own side positively and the opposition negatively, it can be a bit murky to sift the various interpretations to decide where the truth lies.

    By basing an algorithm on a standard set of quantitative data available for all by-elections, each result will yield a numerical value for each party’s performance which can be aggregated to assess the weekly performance.

    Base Data

    Four known pieces of information are used to provide a base figure to determine how ‘important’ the by-election is to each party. The first item is common to all parties:

    Council Majority – How close to a majority is the largest party

    The remaining three items are calculated separately for each party:
    Party Size – How close is the party to a council majority, or to having 0 councillors on the authority
    Vote Share – What is the party’s historic vote share
    Past Elections – What history does the party have in the ward

    Note that only normally scheduled elections are included in the base data: by-elections are strange beasts, so any previous by-elections in the ward are disregarded.

    Council Majority

    The Council Majority Index (CMI) applies equally to all parties contesting the by-election: how close is the largest party to having or losing a majority?

    Gaining and losing a majority are of equal importance, so what we are concerned with is determining how ‘far’ the largest party is from the notional point at which a majority is achieved. For example, if a council has 37 members, the minimum majority is 19 seats (a majority of 1); a party with 18 seats is 1 away from gaining a majority, a party with 19 seats is 1 away from losing it. The closer to the minimum majority, the more important it is.

    to be continued...
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,528
    Very pleased with the ULEZ extension, keep your shitty polluting cars and vans out of London please. Next step is to increment the stringency until we hit emission free vehicles only by 2035 or something.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,891
    The publication of today's @Omnisis poll sees our post-#Brexit poll of polls shift to 'In EU' 58 (+1); 'Out EU' 42 (-1). Note though that 5/6 readings are from the same company. http://bit.ly/3DbYoL4
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,353
    Scott_xP said:

    Dehenna Davison, the Red Wall poster girl of the 2019 campaign, becomes the sixth Tory MP to announce she's standing down from parliament. At 29, she's the youngest to date, following Will Wragg (34) and Chloe Smith (40) in recent days.

    NEW: And a younger Tory MP still standing down- Dehenna Davison, only elected in 2019 says she won't stand again. Feels symbolically important. Elected in Bishop Auckland, first ever Tory in the seat.

    https://twitter.com/TomSheldrickITV/status/1596171999197671425?s=20&t=svuAeCV8craJFp6h7Qxwww

    this is a bad day for politics!




    This Starmergasm is seriously pissing me off now, the damage it’s doing 😠

    I’m logging off.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,700
    edited November 2022

    Heathrow being in the ULEZ....there is going to be a lot of holiday makers getting a nasty shock when they drive to the airport.

    The bigger shock will be when they come back from their holibobs and find an £80 fine on their doormats....
    It's a lot more than £80, I think. That's the half price reduction for payment within 14 days.

    Don't go on long holidays.

    The only London driving charge I pay is the Dartford Humpbacked Bridge, and even that one caught me out once.
  • PhilPhil Posts: 2,239
    edited November 2022
    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    I think that pass was lost on this one when SPECS average speed cameras (first used in late 1990s), and whatever the traffic monitoring service was (cannot remember the name), came in and various cameras were directly linked to the PNC.

    We don't have general and constant individual vehicle monitoring yet (as far as I know :-) ), which seems to me to be the next big jump.
    You are somewhat behind the times! Every major road in the country has cameras hooked up to the PNC: https://www.npcc.police.uk/FreedomofInformation/ANPR.aspx

    13,000 camera, with data on all vehicles passing each camera stored for a year.

    It’s not quite a ubiquitous network - the cameras are restricted mostly to A-roads & motorways, with the odd mobile unit for places of particuliar interest to the police at any given time - but it probably covers the majority of the UK road using population.

    (Unless you’re referring to in-car monitoring? Which I agree is probably coming to a vehicle near you in the future...)
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586

    Damian Green was stitched up by Bob Quick was he not? I don't remember any action being taken against Mr Quick as a result. There need to be major repercussions i.e prison sentences for police officers who abuse their powers. I still don't feel enough of the general public is on board with this though. Those living in unsafe areas undoubtedly look to the police for protection.

    On the Sarah Everard policing being unlawful, from what I read this is due to the right to free speech and assembly. However when the government imposed their lockdowns (rightly or wrongly) I don't remember them pointing this out? And neither do I remember many rights enthusiasts defending Piers Corbyn when he got a £10,000 fine.

    This is the problem with our approach to the enormous plethora of rights nowadays. Clearly there are so many of them that they can't be treated as absolute. And so you have to weigh up the balance. But all that generally does is allow people to find excuses for why the things they support should be permitted and the things they don't should not be. The whole point about rights is you are supposed to support them for people you don't agree with.

    Cameron was told to his face by ACPOo that appointing Damien Green to ministerial office would be anti-police, because it would make the police look bad. They also demanded that various enquiries such as a certain one into a football stadium disaster shouldn't go ahead. For the same reason.

    The story goes that Cameron came out of the meeting asking "Who do these people think they are?"
  • The Good Week/Bad Week Index (GWBWI)

    Part 2...

    Party Size

    For the purposes of this work, a party can be defined as being ‘large’ or ‘small’ in terms of its presence on the council in which the by-election is taking place. So there is no connection to whether a party is a major or minor presence nationally. Two values are calculated for each party which has a candidate in the by-election based on its number of seats prior to the election.

    The first, which we will call the Large Party Index (LPI), is based on the assumption that the value of a seat increases as a party gets close to the minimum majority, from either direction; it is calculated similarly to the CMI, above, but substituting the party’s number of seats for LPI (of course, for the largest party the CMI and the LPI will be the same).

    The second, which we will call the Small Party Index (SPI), is based on the assumption that the smaller a party is, the more the value of each seat increases in terms of its power on the council: e.g. going from 1 seat to 2 is an increase of 100%, whereas going from 4 seats to 5 is an increase of 25%.

    The circumstances in which the SPI is used instead of the LPI are explained below.

    Vote Share

    Based on the most recent election in the ward, each party’s vote share (VS) is their vote as a percentage of the total votes cast. If the most recent election was for more than one seat, for parties with more than one candidate the average of the candidates’ votes is used. This is then adjusted for volatility using a formula based on the range in votes from the top to the bottom candidate. [Note: It has been suggested that this needs more explanation. I completely agree it’s opaque, but that’s because I don’t think anyone has come up with anything like this before, and I want to keep it to myself.]

    Past Elections

    This index is based on the principle that the ‘safeness’ of a ward affects how important the seat is. In this case, ‘safeness’ is considered to be how the ward represented has varied between parties over the past four (or fewer if the ward has not been in existence for four) election cycles (see below): the more seats won by a party, the safer it is for that party. Each party will have a different Safe Ward Index (SWI) for a seat. We use a weighted sample of last four cycles: cycles are weighted 12:6:3:1, from most to least recent.

    Note on Election cycles: local elections take place on a four year cycle. Some councils elect all their seats in one year of the cycle – London boroughs, shire county councils, and some others. Generally there will be multiple members elected in each ward. Others elect a third of their members each year for three years out of the four. These are generally shire district councils, where the fourth year is the county council year. Generally one member will be elected in each year. A very small number of shire districts elect half their members in one year, and the other half two years later.


    to be continued...


  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,700
    Scott_xP said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Dehenna Davison, the Red Wall poster girl of the 2019 campaign, becomes the sixth Tory MP to announce she's standing down from parliament. At 29, she's the youngest to date, following Will Wragg (34) and Chloe Smith (40) in recent days.

    NEW: And a younger Tory MP still standing down- Dehenna Davison, only elected in 2019 says she won't stand again. Feels symbolically important. Elected in Bishop Auckland, first ever Tory in the seat.

    https://twitter.com/TomSheldrickITV/status/1596171999197671425?s=20&t=svuAeCV8craJFp6h7Qxwww

    Has she said why? Maybe she prefers being a TV presenter on GB News.
    Dehenna Davison says: "now the time feels right for me to devote more of my attention to life outside politics - mainly to my family, and helping support them as they’ve helped support me"

    Full statement here... https://twitter.com/TomSheldrickITV/status/1596171999197671425/photo/1
    I think this generation of Tories will pivot into things much like NPXMP or the one or two now festooning the BBC.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,668
    edited November 2022
    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver

    Etc

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/


    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West"


    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist


    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext
  • The Good Week/Bad Week Index (GWBWI)

    Part 3...

    Importance Index

    Once we have these four values: CMI, LPI/SPI, VS and SWI, we take an average of the four to calculate the Importance Index for each party, but only if the party is standing a candidate in the by election – otherwise the Importance Index is 0.

    Note that two versions of the Importance Index are calculated, using the LPI and SPI respectively.

    After the By-Election

    Two scores are calculated, for which we use the above factors, the result (who won), and the change in vote share for each party.

    By-Election Win

    The basic principle is that the score for a by-election result will always be positive for the party that won the by-election, and negative for all other participating parties. Two inputs are used: the Safe Ward Index and the Importance Index.

    For ‘small’ parties (where the Small Party Index is greater than the Large Party Index), the SPI version of the Importance Index is used for seats the party is defending, or that they gain in the by-election, otherwise the LPI version is used. This represents the fact that for a small party, holding or losing a defended seat is important, as is gaining one, but losing in a by-election for a seat defended by another party is not.

    For the winner, the calculation uses the inverse of the SWI: the safer the ward, the less value there is gained by in winning it. For losing parties, the calculation uses the (negative) SWI: the safer the ward was considered to be, the more value is lost by losing it.

    By-Election Vote Share Change

    For each party, the vote share in the by-election is calculated as normally, and the historical VS is subtracted to determine the vote change (VC).

    As parties may only stand sporadically in some seats, such a party may get an skewed result for VC because of missing a previous cycle. To mitigate for this, a weighting value is calculated, using the same weighting (12:6:3:1) as for the SWI above, applied to the cycles in which the party stood one or more candidates.

    Final GWBWI score

    The final score for each party is the total of these two scores: By Election Win, and By-Election Vote Share Change.


    to be continued...



  • The Good Week/Bad Week Index (GWBWI)

    Part 4...

    Some Questions and Comments

    Q, Is it right to treat all four elements of the Importance Index equally?

    A. Currently all are treated equally. It is possible that one or more should be given more weight. If so, which one(s)?

    Q. Why a total, not an average?

    A. Imagine that in a given week, party A loses one seat to Party B, getting a score of minus X. And in another week, party A loses five seats to party B, each with a score of minus X. The average would be the same (minus X), but the total of the second week would be minus 5X. It should be obvious that losing five by-elections points to a much worse performance than losing one.

    Q. What’s the range of scores?

    A. At the moment, it’s not easy to say. Once the Index has been running for a while, a range can be determined empirically.

    Q. What’s good and what’s bad?

    A. See the previous answer.

    Q. Why not use other information as factors in the calculation?

    A. It has been suggested that the reason for the by-election, the candidates standing, and the quality of the campaigns by the various parties, and other factors, could all be used as inputs to the calculation. There are a number of difficulties with such factors:

    1. Any information may well be partial, in both senses: for example, we may know how one campaign is going, but not others; and the sources for information may be inclined to give a better view of information for one party than for another.

    2. A factor might be important in one by-election and not in another: for example, having a local candidate might be important in a rural ward, and not in am urban one. Without further research, it is difficult to estimate how this might vary, and indeed how important it is overall.

    3. The subjective and non-numerical nature of such factors: it is difficult to reduce something such as the by-election cause to a numerical value without subjectivity getting in the way. Again, with a great deal of research, this might be possible.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,344

    On the no-shit-Sherlock front

    What will Eddie Izzard's pronouns be when she's acting as Sherlock?

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-11467379/Trans-star-Eddie-Izzard-lands-Sherlock-role-don-famous-sleuths-cape-new-drama-series.html

    I do wonder whether the pronouns thing will just become something we barely register in a few years time - or whether there will be a backlash and it will be seen as one of those "WTF were they all thinking?" fads. Really can't tell at this point.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    edited November 2022
    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver.

    Etc.

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/

    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4.

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West".

    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist.

    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    We're discussing ULEZ at the moment. The expansion to cover the whole of London in August next year.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,691
    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver

    Etc

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/


    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West"


    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist


    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    The closest you ever got to the East End was a trip to Lahore kebab house (We all went there and I think we were all a little disappointed - although the food was very good. The main issue was that it was bring-a-bottle and the obvious shop, over the road, had the worst selection of wines imaginable.)
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,509
    LARPing in Russia can be dangerous.

    In what may be a bizarre case of mistaken identity, the Russian FSB has killed a group of Russian people it claims are pro-Ukrainian saboteurs – but who reportedly appear to be Airsoft enthusiasts who were engaged in live-action roleplay of the S.T.A.L.K.E.R. video games.
    https://twitter.com/ChrisO_wiki/status/1596066963608178688
  • ClippPClippP Posts: 1,889
    kinabalu said:

    OT Matt Hancock is second-favourite to win I'm A Celebrity. Jill Scott is odds-on; Owen used to be favourite but has drifted badly this week.

    He's doing great apparently. And through gritted teeth you have to say it's a genuine achievement.
    But is it enough to be made the next Conservative PM?
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,691
    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver

    Etc

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/


    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West"


    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist


    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    The closest you ever got to the East End was a trip to Lahore kebab house (We all went there and I think we were all a little disappointed - although the food was very good. The main issue was that it was bring-a-bottle and the obvious shop, over the road, had the worst selection of wines imaginable.)
    Edit: My guess, not something I know.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,084
    Two more down. All the young tory MPs are quitting. They don't fancy 15 years as an Opposition rump.

    Read the runes, Mike ;)

    https://news.sky.com/story/conservative-mps-dehenna-davison-and-sir-gary-streeter-to-step-down-at-next-election-12755472
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,736
    Mortimer said:

    Chris said:

    Unfortunately people who want to police their fellow citizens are often not the best suited to do it. Though not to the same extent as people who want to rule them (aspiring politicians).

    The same could be said for the people who were constantly calling for everyone to be imprisoned in their homes during the covid overreactions. Luckily they cried wolf too often, and were eventually ignored.
    Of course it goes without saying that, while aspiring police officers and politicians are often not the best suited, people with Internet access wanting to spout their opinions will often be complete looneys.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,891
    Today I’ve announced that I will not be seeking re-election at the next general election. It has been an honour and privilege to serve the people of South West Devon and I will continue to do so until the next election. https://twitter.com/garystreeterSWD/status/1596158670487814144/photo/1
  • MattW said:

    Heathrow being in the ULEZ....there is going to be a lot of holiday makers getting a nasty shock when they drive to the airport.

    Potentially (very potentially!) y% * 80 million a year * £12.50 :smile: .

    Good for Manchester International.
    Nah, Manchester Airport is in Manchester. Birmingham Airport is within Solihull, West Midlands. Every met area is going to have its own ULEZ before too long. Though Birmingham Airport is genuinely easy to get to by train.

    Might be good for East Midlands Airport. Difficult to see an ULEZ happening in the middle of the East Midlands countryside.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,825
    I wish someone in authority would cease being surprised at these police issues, and just say we'll all have to just get used to it. Itd be more honest than endlessly producing new reports and expressing temporary outrage.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,825
    Scott_xP said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Dehenna Davison, the Red Wall poster girl of the 2019 campaign, becomes the sixth Tory MP to announce she's standing down from parliament. At 29, she's the youngest to date, following Will Wragg (34) and Chloe Smith (40) in recent days.

    NEW: And a younger Tory MP still standing down- Dehenna Davison, only elected in 2019 says she won't stand again. Feels symbolically important. Elected in Bishop Auckland, first ever Tory in the seat.

    https://twitter.com/TomSheldrickITV/status/1596171999197671425?s=20&t=svuAeCV8craJFp6h7Qxwww

    Has she said why? Maybe she prefers being a TV presenter on GB News.
    Dehenna Davison says: "now the time feels right for me to devote more of my attention to life outside politics - mainly to my family, and helping support them as they’ve helped support me"

    Full statement here... https://twitter.com/TomSheldrickITV/status/1596171999197671425/photo/1
    So being an MP was seen as a sort of temporary hiatus than a career path? I guess that's...better?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,509

    Another powerful Cyclefree broadside. It'd be great if she was appointed as one of the guardians of standards in public life, wouldn't it?

    Is the poor standard of vetting by the police a general problem or particular to the police? Politicians are subject to an army of amateur sleuths looking at everything they've said and done since they were children, but I'm not convinced that public institutions or companies bother to anything like the same extent.

    I have to be honest - I haven't read the header. I don't always read above the line, and the title offers no clue what the story is about, just tells me that someone (probably Cyclefree) is annoyed.

    I think Cyclefree has the potential to be an excellent public servant, but I'd like her to add to her repertoire of being outraged at problems, an ability to point to more solutions - simple and effective solutions based on a knowledge of human beings.
    I think you have the potential to be an excellent BTL comment, but…
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,417
    edited November 2022

    MattW said:

    Heathrow being in the ULEZ....there is going to be a lot of holiday makers getting a nasty shock when they drive to the airport.

    Potentially (very potentially!) y% * 80 million a year * £12.50 :smile: .

    Good for Manchester International.
    Nah, Manchester Airport is in Manchester. Birmingham Airport is within Solihull, West Midlands. Every met area is going to have its own ULEZ before too long. Though Birmingham Airport is genuinely easy to get to by train.

    Might be good for East Midlands Airport. Difficult to see an ULEZ happening in the middle of the East Midlands countryside.
    Birmingham already has its Clean Air Zone. Its just central at the moment, but then so was London....
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,691
    edited November 2022
    Heathener said:

    Two more down. All the young tory MPs are quitting. They don't fancy 15 years as an Opposition rump.

    Read the runes, Mike ;)

    https://news.sky.com/story/conservative-mps-dehenna-davison-and-sir-gary-streeter-to-step-down-at-next-election-12755472

    I have you mentally pencilled in as no great Labour fan. Please forgive me if I'm wrong. Anyway, if that's the case, and the Tory party is falling apart at the seams (true from my reading), what looks like the best track to you?
  • Scott_xP said:

    Dehenna Davison, the Red Wall poster girl of the 2019 campaign, becomes the sixth Tory MP to announce she's standing down from parliament. At 29, she's the youngest to date, following Will Wragg (34) and Chloe Smith (40) in recent days.

    NEW: And a younger Tory MP still standing down- Dehenna Davison, only elected in 2019 says she won't stand again. Feels symbolically important. Elected in Bishop Auckland, first ever Tory in the seat.

    https://twitter.com/TomSheldrickITV/status/1596171999197671425?s=20&t=svuAeCV8craJFp6h7Qxwww

    this is a bad day for politics!




    This Starmergasm is seriously pissing me off now, the damage it’s doing 😠

    I’m logging off.
    No Starmergasm, just Rishi ED.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,125
    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver.

    Etc.

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/

    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4.

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West".

    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist.

    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    We're discussing ULEZ at the moment. The expansion to cover the whole of London in August next year.
    Leon is just happy that his guru on all things "woke" is banning LGBT propaganda:
    https://www.reuters.com/world/russias-parliament-passes-law-banning-lgbt-propaganda-among-adults-2022-11-24/
  • Heathener said:

    Two more down. All the young tory MPs are quitting. They don't fancy 15 years as an Opposition rump.

    Read the runes, Mike ;)

    https://news.sky.com/story/conservative-mps-dehenna-davison-and-sir-gary-streeter-to-step-down-at-next-election-12755472

    Sir Gazza Streets: Born: 2 October 1955 (age 67 years), Gosport.

    He may not be the young ones very long.
  • kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231
    Nigelb said:

    Another powerful Cyclefree broadside. It'd be great if she was appointed as one of the guardians of standards in public life, wouldn't it?

    Is the poor standard of vetting by the police a general problem or particular to the police? Politicians are subject to an army of amateur sleuths looking at everything they've said and done since they were children, but I'm not convinced that public institutions or companies bother to anything like the same extent.

    I have to be honest - I haven't read the header. I don't always read above the line, and the title offers no clue what the story is about, just tells me that someone (probably Cyclefree) is annoyed.

    I think Cyclefree has the potential to be an excellent public servant, but I'd like her to add to her repertoire of being outraged at problems, an ability to point to more solutions - simple and effective solutions based on a knowledge of human beings.
    I think you have the potential to be an excellent BTL comment, but…
    I'm always happy to receive constructive feedback.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    ClippP said:

    kinabalu said:

    OT Matt Hancock is second-favourite to win I'm A Celebrity. Jill Scott is odds-on; Owen used to be favourite but has drifted badly this week.

    He's doing great apparently. And through gritted teeth you have to say it's a genuine achievement.
    But is it enough to be made the next Conservative PM?
    He's elevating above that now, I think. Winning I'm a Celeb is premier league in this day and age. The world is now his lobster.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639
    kinabalu said:

    ClippP said:

    kinabalu said:

    OT Matt Hancock is second-favourite to win I'm A Celebrity. Jill Scott is odds-on; Owen used to be favourite but has drifted badly this week.

    He's doing great apparently. And through gritted teeth you have to say it's a genuine achievement.
    But is it enough to be made the next Conservative PM?
    He's elevating above that now, I think. Winning I'm a Celeb is premier league in this day and age. The world is now his lobster.
    Don't you mean marsupial prepuce?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,865
    Not looking very good for Wales, is it?
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,134
    edited November 2022
    Ecuador score. 1-1
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    kamski said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver.

    Etc.

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/

    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4.

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West".

    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist.

    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    We're discussing ULEZ at the moment. The expansion to cover the whole of London in August next year.
    Leon is just happy that his guru on all things "woke" is banning LGBT propaganda:
    https://www.reuters.com/world/russias-parliament-passes-law-banning-lgbt-propaganda-among-adults-2022-11-24/
    Well the argument that "woke" saps the strength of a nation is not exactly being borne out by the Russian military performance in Ukraine. Perhaps Putin ought to reflect on this.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,685
    edited November 2022
    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    I think that pass was lost on this one when SPECS average speed cameras (first used in late 1990s), and whatever the traffic monitoring service was (cannot remember the name), came in and various cameras were directly linked to the PNC.

    We don't have general and constant individual vehicle monitoring yet (as far as I know :-) ), which seems to me to be the next big jump.

    I think mayor Sadiq has got the politics of expansion of the ULEZ badly wrong, as I don't see how a flat charge which equates those driving around in Z1/2 all day with those who drive from a mile inside the London boundary in Neasden or Wembley to Watford is defensible, due to the vastly different contributions they make to emissions in London.

    The analogue would be the whole of the London area being Zone 6 for fare purposes.

    To something graduated for Z2 / North-South Circular / London boundary at £15 / £10 / £5 would be far more rational.

    I'm getting a sense of resentment about 'rule for Inner London by Sadiq' about the Ulez from those ourside the N/S circular who never go into Inner London. I'm not clear whether there will be a political impact.
    Not inconceivable we start to hear more grumblings about the z6 suburbs wanting to rejoin Kent/Surrey/Essex etc.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,685
    Education, education, education indeed.
    Posh Winchester boy Sunak wants to shaft the ex-polys.....
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-63757889
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,226
    edited November 2022
    eek said:

    Dehenna Davison (Tory MP for Bishop Auckland) is standing down at the next election

    Not that she had any likelihood of winning the seat.

    Her decision but I prefer MPs who are not just glory hunters and will fight their constituency whether the general election is likely to be won or lost.

    Same for Labour MPs who have served in opposition from 2010 to.
    now or Tory MPs who served from 1997 to 2010 and are standing again in 2024 even if no prospect of a government post for any of then but constituency work and hard slog in opposition holding the government to account
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,134
    Heathener said:

    Two more down. All the young tory MPs are quitting. They don't fancy 15 years as an Opposition rump.

    Read the runes, Mike ;)

    https://news.sky.com/story/conservative-mps-dehenna-davison-and-sir-gary-streeter-to-step-down-at-next-election-12755472

    Gary Streeter has been an MP since 1992.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    Carnyx said:

    kinabalu said:

    ClippP said:

    kinabalu said:

    OT Matt Hancock is second-favourite to win I'm A Celebrity. Jill Scott is odds-on; Owen used to be favourite but has drifted badly this week.

    He's doing great apparently. And through gritted teeth you have to say it's a genuine achievement.
    But is it enough to be made the next Conservative PM?
    He's elevating above that now, I think. Winning I'm a Celeb is premier league in this day and age. The world is now his lobster.
    Don't you mean marsupial prepuce?
    I could google but as an arch conversationalist I'll ask instead - is that the scientific term for a kangeroo testicle?
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,134
    Ecuador hit the post. Netherlands suddenly having problems.
  • kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
  • Tres said:

    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    I think that pass was lost on this one when SPECS average speed cameras (first used in late 1990s), and whatever the traffic monitoring service was (cannot remember the name), came in and various cameras were directly linked to the PNC.

    We don't have general and constant individual vehicle monitoring yet (as far as I know :-) ), which seems to me to be the next big jump.

    I think mayor Sadiq has got the politics of expansion of the ULEZ badly wrong, as I don't see how a flat charge which equates those driving around in Z1/2 all day with those who drive from a mile inside the London boundary in Neasden or Wembley to Watford is defensible, due to the vastly different contributions they make to emissions in London.

    The analogue would be the whole of the London area being Zone 6 for fare purposes.

    To something graduated for Z2 / North-South Circular / London boundary at £15 / £10 / £5 would be far more rational.

    I'm getting a sense of resentment about 'rule for Inner London by Sadiq' about the Ulez from those ourside the N/S circular who never go into Inner London. I'm not clear whether there will be a political impact.
    Not inconceivable we start to hear more grumblings about the z6 suburbs wanting to rejoin Kent/Sussex/Essex etc.
    Regarding the ID/SPEC aspect, the 'human right' to go anywhere anytime without leaving a trace was first breached by vehicle registration in the 19th century. I suspect we'd have lost the war against organised crime and terrorism by now were it not for ANPR cameras linked to the Police National Database. At least they pick up entry-level hoods who are too stupid to clone their number plates. And lovesick thickos who drive from A to B to kill the object of their affection and then drive straight home again.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
  • Tres said:

    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    I think that pass was lost on this one when SPECS average speed cameras (first used in late 1990s), and whatever the traffic monitoring service was (cannot remember the name), came in and various cameras were directly linked to the PNC.

    We don't have general and constant individual vehicle monitoring yet (as far as I know :-) ), which seems to me to be the next big jump.

    I think mayor Sadiq has got the politics of expansion of the ULEZ badly wrong, as I don't see how a flat charge which equates those driving around in Z1/2 all day with those who drive from a mile inside the London boundary in Neasden or Wembley to Watford is defensible, due to the vastly different contributions they make to emissions in London.

    The analogue would be the whole of the London area being Zone 6 for fare purposes.

    To something graduated for Z2 / North-South Circular / London boundary at £15 / £10 / £5 would be far more rational.

    I'm getting a sense of resentment about 'rule for Inner London by Sadiq' about the Ulez from those ourside the N/S circular who never go into Inner London. I'm not clear whether there will be a political impact.
    Not inconceivable we start to hear more grumblings about the z6 suburbs wanting to rejoin Kent/Sussex/Essex etc.
    Regarding the ID/SPEC aspect, the 'human right' to go anywhere anytime without leaving a trace was first breached by vehicle registration in the 19th century. I suspect we'd have lost the war against organised crime and terrorism by now were it not for ANPR cameras linked to the Police National Database. At least they pick up entry-level hoods who are too stupid to clone their number plates. And lovesick thickos who drive from A to B to kill the object of their affection and then drive straight home again.
    And take their phones with them.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,134
    HYUFD said:

    eek said:

    Dehenna Davison (Tory MP for Bishop Auckland) is standing down at the next election

    Not that she had any likelihood of winning the seat.

    Her decision but I prefer MPs who are not just glory hunters and will fight their constituency whether the general election is likely to be won or lost.

    Same for Labour MPs who have served in opposition from 2010 to.
    now or Tory MPs who served from 1997 to 2010 and are standing again in 2024 even if no prospect of a government post for any of then but constituency work and hard slog in opposition holding the government to account
    She's only 29. She can take 25 years out of politics and still be young enough to come back if she wants.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586
    Tres said:

    Education, education, education indeed.
    Posh Winchester boy Sunak wants to shaft the ex-polys.....
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-63757889

    When, under May, they talked about restricting visas to courses with actual academic institutions that had verified qualifications, the great and the good were up in arms. Why were the "Great Universities" concerned?

    Out of term time, they rent their facilities to summer schools and other..... enterprises. You can employ the hallowed halls of a Cambridge College. For a price.

    Strangely, the highest prices are offered by some really interesting characters.

    In academia, ethics and morals are at the very core of what they do. And if you object to these, they have others they can sell you. At a slightly higher price. Naturally.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,668
    Just off to buy sone food for supper. If I get knocked over, can someone chisel this epitaph on my gravestone

    VESPERTILIO VIRUS QUAEQUE ACCIDENS EX LAB

    Underneath this

    BOMB LIBERATUS EST CARRUS

    ROBOTS MOX COGITARE

    PEREGRINI VENIENT

    &

    CODA
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,583
    Just spent my £1 free bet from sky on a 1-1 draw between England and USA. The curse of ITV.
  • TheValiantTheValiant Posts: 1,873
    FPT:

    Whilst I obviously support England in preference, as a good Aberystwyth graduate I really wanted Wales to win.

    But I can't see them doing anything other than draw now. They really aren't very good.
    Five minutes (plus two hours added time) to try and get a win.........

    Why were they throwing away a powerful point chasing a win? There was outside chance of 5 points, not unrealistic chance of 3, or even qualifying with 2 if they didn’t lose this match - they threw that away taking off defensive screen for playmaking midfielder in the 75th minute.

    Wales were stupid to go so gung ho for the win. Rather than gung ho for win, a draw here would have started Wales second in group going into last match - where either a win draw or even defeat could have taken them into last 16. They didn’t back themselves to do anything against England? Even if England beat them, there was the insurance possibility of two points very possibly taking them through.
    I always find the permutations of the World Cup groups to be very interesting.
    It IS possible to fail to qualify despite getting 5 points (W-D-D), as Italy found out to their cost about a decade ago (Sweden and Denmark went through also both with 5 points). Basically the results are W-D-D for three teams and L-L-L for a whipping boy.
    It IS possible to qualify with only 2 points. Again, one team gets W-W-W and everyone else gets L-D-D. Someone has to finish second, even on 2 points and so they will go through.

    But Wales really have shit the bed now. I suppose they should've hung on for the draw, and then hoped England do them a favour next week (And England probably would've been willing to do so, especially if their qualification was already assured and they wanted to rest players).
    Now however, it's win and hope other results go their way........
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,134
    O/T

    Huge improvements in reservoir levels in southern England.

    https://www.southernwater.co.uk/water-for-life/reservoir-levels
  • northern_monkeynorthern_monkey Posts: 1,639
    edited November 2022
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
    What a shame.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,226
    Andy_JS said:

    HYUFD said:

    eek said:

    Dehenna Davison (Tory MP for Bishop Auckland) is standing down at the next election

    Not that she had any likelihood of winning the seat.

    Her decision but I prefer MPs who are not just glory hunters and will fight their constituency whether the general election is likely to be won or lost.

    Same for Labour MPs who have served in opposition from 2010 to.
    now or Tory MPs who served from 1997 to 2010 and are standing again in 2024 even if no prospect of a government post for any of then but constituency work and hard slog in opposition holding the government to account
    She's only 29. She can take 25 years out of politics and still be young enough to come back if she wants.
    A glory hunter then, come back and stand again when the Tories are likely to win a general election again in a decade or more
  • kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
    Graphite gray? Battleship is a bit Don't mention the Tirpitz.
  • Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Huge improvements in reservoir levels in southern England.

    https://www.southernwater.co.uk/water-for-life/reservoir-levels

    Room for a lot more water.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,637
    Who would make the best PM?

    🌳 Sunak 37%
    🫤 Don’t know 34%
    🥀 SKS 29%

    In a race of two, SKS comes third.

    [Omnisis]
  • HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    HYUFD said:

    eek said:

    Dehenna Davison (Tory MP for Bishop Auckland) is standing down at the next election

    Not that she had any likelihood of winning the seat.

    Her decision but I prefer MPs who are not just glory hunters and will fight their constituency whether the general election is likely to be won or lost.

    Same for Labour MPs who have served in opposition from 2010 to.
    now or Tory MPs who served from 1997 to 2010 and are standing again in 2024 even if no prospect of a government post for any of then but constituency work and hard slog in opposition holding the government to account
    She's only 29. She can take 25 years out of politics and still be young enough to come back if she wants.
    A glory hunter then, come back and stand again when the Tories are likely to win a general election again in a decade or more
    Apart from Alan Clark, are there many (any?) examples of MPs returning after choosing to leave?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    pillsbury said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
    Graphite gray? Battleship is a bit Don't mention the Tirpitz.
    I was thinking Bond. That's how Fleming described his car in the books. Battleship grey with an engine that "burbled".
  • Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Huge improvements in reservoir levels in southern England.

    https://www.southernwater.co.uk/water-for-life/reservoir-levels

    Room for a lot more water.
    Hell of an uptick though esp as the top 3 are presumably outputting more than usual to compensate for Weir Wood shutting down.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586
    kinabalu said:

    pillsbury said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
    Graphite gray? Battleship is a bit Don't mention the Tirpitz.
    I was thinking Bond. That's how Fleming described his car in the books. Battleship grey with an engine that "burbled".
    The Bentley 4.5 litre?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,700
    Phil said:

    MattW said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    I think that pass was lost on this one when SPECS average speed cameras (first used in late 1990s), and whatever the traffic monitoring service was (cannot remember the name), came in and various cameras were directly linked to the PNC.

    We don't have general and constant individual vehicle monitoring yet (as far as I know :-) ), which seems to me to be the next big jump.
    You are somewhat behind the times! Every major road in the country has cameras hooked up to the PNC: https://www.npcc.police.uk/FreedomofInformation/ANPR.aspx

    13,000 camera, with data on all vehicles passing each camera stored for a year.

    It’s not quite a ubiquitous network - the cameras are restricted mostly to A-roads & motorways, with the odd mobile unit for places of particuliar interest to the police at any given time - but it probably covers the majority of the UK road using population.

    (Unless you’re referring to in-car monitoring? Which I agree is probably coming to a vehicle near you in the future...)
    My first ref was to the roots of ANPR, when they started out using 4 characters iirc.

    My individual monitoring was a reference to a potential unit in each car, as part of a road pricing continuous movement monitoring.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,637
    SKS is a Spectator in the race for best PM

    https://twitter.com/Omnisis/status/1596168730031292422
  • kinabalu said:

    pillsbury said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
    Graphite gray? Battleship is a bit Don't mention the Tirpitz.
    I was thinking Bond. That's how Fleming described his car in the books. Battleship grey with an engine that "burbled".
    Correct. remains of a Bentley that "some rich idiot had married to a lamp post," supercharger driven by magnetic clutch (apparently an utterly terrible idea irl, but Fleming never knew anything about the stuff he sounded authoritative about), coachwork by Mulliner Ward.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    Cookie said:

    Just spent my £1 free bet from sky on a 1-1 draw between England and USA. The curse of ITV.

    1-1 is always a live proposition. No easy games in international football.
  • SKS is a Spectator in the race for best PM

    https://twitter.com/Omnisis/status/1596168730031292422

    Pretty poor for SKS. Sunak is no Truss, sure, but he really isn't all that.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,583
    kinabalu said:

    pillsbury said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
    Graphite gray? Battleship is a bit Don't mention the Tirpitz.
    I was thinking Bond. That's how Fleming described his car in the books. Battleship grey with an engine that "burbled".
    Running the same car for 29 years is astonishing. How many miles did you do in that time?
  • Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver

    Etc

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/


    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West"


    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist


    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    The closest you ever got to the East End was a trip to Lahore kebab house (We all went there and I think we were all a little disappointed - although the food was very good. The main issue was that it was bring-a-bottle and the obvious shop, over the road, had the worst selection of wines imaginable.)
    True fact - I used to live opposite the Lahore Kebab House. Our living room had direct line of sight into the gent's toilets. That didn't encourage me to eat there, although it always smelled amazing.
  • Leon said:

    Just off to buy sone food for supper. If I get knocked over, can someone chisel this epitaph on my gravestone

    VESPERTILIO VIRUS QUAEQUE ACCIDENS EX LAB

    Underneath this

    BOMB LIBERATUS EST CARRUS

    ROBOTS MOX COGITARE

    PEREGRINI VENIENT

    &

    CODA

    ECCE HOMO QUI EST FABA
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    pillsbury said:

    kinabalu said:

    pillsbury said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
    Graphite gray? Battleship is a bit Don't mention the Tirpitz.
    I was thinking Bond. That's how Fleming described his car in the books. Battleship grey with an engine that "burbled".
    Correct. remains of a Bentley that "some rich idiot had married to a lamp post," supercharger driven by magnetic clutch (apparently an utterly terrible idea irl, but Fleming never knew anything about the stuff he sounded authoritative about), coachwork by Mulliner Ward.
    Yes, he rather "burbled" on himself. And without a shadow of a doubt would have voted for Brexit. Still, soft spot for those books. I had every one and devoured them all.
  • Leon said:

    Just off to buy sone food for supper. If I get knocked over, can someone chisel this epitaph on my gravestone

    VESPERTILIO VIRUS QUAEQUE ACCIDENS EX LAB

    Underneath this

    BOMB LIBERATUS EST CARRUS

    ROBOTS MOX COGITARE

    PEREGRINI VENIENT

    &

    CODA

    ECCE HOMO QUI EST FABA
    Faba humana sum, nihil fabae a me alienum puto.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    edited November 2022
    Cookie said:

    kinabalu said:

    pillsbury said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
    Graphite gray? Battleship is a bit Don't mention the Tirpitz.
    I was thinking Bond. That's how Fleming described his car in the books. Battleship grey with an engine that "burbled".
    Running the same car for 29 years is astonishing. How many miles did you do in that time?
    A touch over 107k. Pretty light overall. 3k a year average. Highly skewed by the last 15 years or so of not driving that much. Beforehand, far more active. Like in everything else, come to think of it.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,637
    pillsbury said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
    Graphite gray? Battleship is a bit Don't mention the Tirpitz.
    The day of the Tirpitz?

    Sea water and all
  • Leon said:

    Just off to buy sone food for supper. If I get knocked over, can someone chisel this epitaph on my gravestone

    VESPERTILIO VIRUS QUAEQUE ACCIDENS EX LAB

    Underneath this

    BOMB LIBERATUS EST CARRUS

    ROBOTS MOX COGITARE

    PEREGRINI VENIENT

    &

    CODA

    Can you give us the what.three.words reference for the location of your gravesite.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947

    kinabalu said:

    pillsbury said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
    Graphite gray? Battleship is a bit Don't mention the Tirpitz.
    I was thinking Bond. That's how Fleming described his car in the books. Battleship grey with an engine that "burbled".
    The Bentley 4.5 litre?
    That was it, yes. Became a DB7 on film.
  • Jim_MillerJim_Miller Posts: 2,955
    Three thoughts from afar: After the death of George Floyd, there were again calls in the US for weakening standards for police officers -- so more of the "right" minorities coudl join the police forces.

    And in Massachusetts (and probably other states) even officers who are fired for cause in one town, sometimes find a job in another. Example: https://www.wbur.org/news/2022/11/20/massachusetts-police-jobs-departments-accusations (I have no idea how common this "officer shuffle" is.)

    Meanwhile, the city of Seattle is finding it so hard to hire that it is offering substantial bonuses:
    "The plan calls for a hiring bonus of $30,000 for a lateral transfer of an experienced officer into the department, and up to a maximum of $7,500 for a new recruit.

    City employees with a referral of a lateral hire or new recruit could receive up to a $1,000 referral bonus."
    source: https://www.q13fox.com/news/city-council-approves-seattle-police-hiring-incentives

    Many other police forces in the area have similar programs.

  • DriverDriver Posts: 4,780
    Bye-bye, Qatar.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,691

    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver

    Etc

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/


    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West"


    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist


    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    The closest you ever got to the East End was a trip to Lahore kebab house (We all went there and I think we were all a little disappointed - although the food was very good. The main issue was that it was bring-a-bottle and the obvious shop, over the road, had the worst selection of wines imaginable.)
    True fact - I used to live opposite the Lahore Kebab House. Our living room had direct line of sight into the gent's toilets. That didn't encourage me to eat there, although it always smelled amazing.
    It was a place of legend (no idea if it's still going). There was another amazing place - called something like 'the India Club' - on the East end of the Strand. It seems perhaps that it's still going. Anyway, you could experience adequate curries with Indian levels of flies.
  • kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    pillsbury said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    Tres said:

    two-thirds of respondents to the consultation were opposed to Ulez expansion. Mr Khan had promised to drop his plans if there was “overwhelming opposition” when the consultation was launched.

    ....

    Whole of London to be hit by new Ulez expansion ordered by Sadiq Khan
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/11/25/whole-london-hit-ulez-expansion-ordered-sadiq-khan/

    Always find it interesting that some of the talking heads very quick to always talk about any other tax rises as regressive, never say anything about this. Yes a lot of poor people use public transport, but there is also a big chunk who need a car (especially now we aren't just talking central London) and can't afford a new one. Where as rich people, likely to use things like leasing, so they turn them over every 2-3 years.

    any petrol car built since 2006 should fit the standards.
    So the sweet avoidance spot is an ultra low emissions 2008 petrol Vauxhall Corsa (cough) , or a 2017 Euro 6
    Wandering off at a tangent and with half a mind on our recent ID card debate, the ulez zone will presumably mean yet another bureaucratic database of who went where when (and in what car).
    Ulez has just consigned the car I've had for 30 years to the scrapheap. It's a measure I support but wish hadn't come in.
    Just hang on in there. Once your old jalopy passes its 40th birthday it qualifies for historic status and will be except from ULEZ and the Congestion Charge.

    https://classicandsportscar.com/features/london-ulez-9-things-classic-car-drivers-need-know

    I wouldn't drive to London any more because all my favourite rat-runs have been blocked off in favour of permajams, but if I had to I'd use my MGB. Not on a hot day, though.
    I'm afraid it went yesterday. A sad sad day. I was 33 when I got it and I'm 62 now. It was - quite literally - the car of my life.
    What was it?
    Merc C class Auto. Battleship grey.
    Graphite gray? Battleship is a bit Don't mention the Tirpitz.
    I was thinking Bond. That's how Fleming described his car in the books. Battleship grey with an engine that "burbled".
    The Bentley 4.5 litre?
    That was it, yes. Became a DB7 on film.
    He drove a Bentley MkIV in From Russia With Love
  • Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver

    Etc

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/


    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West"


    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist


    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    The closest you ever got to the East End was a trip to Lahore kebab house (We all went there and I think we were all a little disappointed - although the food was very good. The main issue was that it was bring-a-bottle and the obvious shop, over the road, had the worst selection of wines imaginable.)
    True fact - I used to live opposite the Lahore Kebab House. Our living room had direct line of sight into the gent's toilets. That didn't encourage me to eat there, although it always smelled amazing.
    It was a place of legend (no idea if it's still going). There was another amazing place - called something like 'the India Club' - on the East end of the Strand. It seems perhaps that it's still going. Anyway, you could experience adequate curries with Indian levels of flies.
    I know the India Club well! Really old school with pictures of Nehru on the walls. You could imagine all the Indian students at the LSE gathering there in the thirties and forties dreaming of independence.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,736

    Who would make the best PM?

    🌳 Sunak 37%
    🫤 Don’t know 34%
    🥀 SKS 29%

    In a race of two, SKS comes third.

    [Omnisis]

    Probably in much the same way that if people are asked what is the best software to correct their English they will say Grammarly.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,773
    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Huge improvements in reservoir levels in southern England.

    https://www.southernwater.co.uk/water-for-life/reservoir-levels

    The wettest November since records began will tend to do that
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,773

    Leon said:

    Just off to buy sone food for supper. If I get knocked over, can someone chisel this epitaph on my gravestone

    VESPERTILIO VIRUS QUAEQUE ACCIDENS EX LAB

    Underneath this

    BOMB LIBERATUS EST CARRUS

    ROBOTS MOX COGITARE

    PEREGRINI VENIENT

    &

    CODA

    Can you give us the what.three.words reference for the location of your gravesite.
    Offensive.credulous.twat
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,736
    Driver said:

    Bye-bye, Qatar.

    Is Qatar actually playing in the World Cup?

    I had assumed all their efforts were being directed towards the suppression of sexual perversion.
  • Leon said:

    Just off to buy sone food for supper. If I get knocked over, can someone chisel this epitaph on my gravestone

    VESPERTILIO VIRUS QUAEQUE ACCIDENS EX LAB

    Underneath this

    BOMB LIBERATUS EST CARRUS

    ROBOTS MOX COGITARE

    PEREGRINI VENIENT

    &

    CODA

    Can you give us the what.three.words reference for the location of your gravesite.
    Would W3W work better if the words were in Latin?

    I don't know, I went to a comprehensive.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,134

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Huge improvements in reservoir levels in southern England.

    https://www.southernwater.co.uk/water-for-life/reservoir-levels

    Room for a lot more water.
    Not in Weir Wood reservoir, which has gone from 58% to 100% in a few weeks. Let's hope the same thing happens elsewhere.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,865

    Three thoughts from afar: After the death of George Floyd, there were again calls in the US for weakening standards for police officers -- so more of the "right" minorities coudl join the police forces.

    And in Massachusetts (and probably other states) even officers who are fired for cause in one town, sometimes find a job in another. Example: https://www.wbur.org/news/2022/11/20/massachusetts-police-jobs-departments-accusations (I have no idea how common this "officer shuffle" is.)

    Meanwhile, the city of Seattle is finding it so hard to hire that it is offering substantial bonuses:
    "The plan calls for a hiring bonus of $30,000 for a lateral transfer of an experienced officer into the department, and up to a maximum of $7,500 for a new recruit.

    City employees with a referral of a lateral hire or new recruit could receive up to a $1,000 referral bonus."
    source: https://www.q13fox.com/news/city-council-approves-seattle-police-hiring-incentives

    Many other police forces in the area have similar programs.

    US policing is pretty fucked up.

    This article about a CIA agent who becomes a cop is well worth reading: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/05/07/the-spy-who-came-home
  • Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver

    Etc

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/


    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West"


    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist


    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    The closest you ever got to the East End was a trip to Lahore kebab house (We all went there and I think we were all a little disappointed - although the food was very good. The main issue was that it was bring-a-bottle and the obvious shop, over the road, had the worst selection of wines imaginable.)
    True fact - I used to live opposite the Lahore Kebab House. Our living room had direct line of sight into the gent's toilets. That didn't encourage me to eat there, although it always smelled amazing.
    It was a place of legend (no idea if it's still going). There was another amazing place - called something like 'the India Club' - on the East end of the Strand. It seems perhaps that it's still going. Anyway, you could experience adequate curries with Indian levels of flies.
    On the subject of famous old London eateries, anyone else remember Centrale at Cambridge Circus? Famously name checked in a Pogues song, and the best pasta for under £5. I walked past its old spot last night and got quite nostalgic.
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,006

    SKS is a Spectator in the race for best PM

    https://twitter.com/Omnisis/status/1596168730031292422

    Strange how you seem to have lost interest in the Labour Party's opinion poll ratings now that they no longer fit your agenda.
  • Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver

    Etc

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/


    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West"


    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist


    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    The closest you ever got to the East End was a trip to Lahore kebab house (We all went there and I think we were all a little disappointed - although the food was very good. The main issue was that it was bring-a-bottle and the obvious shop, over the road, had the worst selection of wines imaginable.)
    True fact - I used to live opposite the Lahore Kebab House. Our living room had direct line of sight into the gent's toilets. That didn't encourage me to eat there, although it always smelled amazing.
    It was a place of legend (no idea if it's still going). There was another amazing place - called something like 'the India Club' - on the East end of the Strand. It seems perhaps that it's still going. Anyway, you could experience adequate curries with Indian levels of flies.
    I know the India Club well! Really old school with pictures of Nehru on the walls. You could imagine all the Indian students at the LSE gathering there in the thirties and forties dreaming of independence.
    We went there something like 20 years ago, but had to order more biryani because their portions were so small!
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,691

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver

    Etc

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/


    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West"


    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist


    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    The closest you ever got to the East End was a trip to Lahore kebab house (We all went there and I think we were all a little disappointed - although the food was very good. The main issue was that it was bring-a-bottle and the obvious shop, over the road, had the worst selection of wines imaginable.)
    True fact - I used to live opposite the Lahore Kebab House. Our living room had direct line of sight into the gent's toilets. That didn't encourage me to eat there, although it always smelled amazing.
    It was a place of legend (no idea if it's still going). There was another amazing place - called something like 'the India Club' - on the East end of the Strand. It seems perhaps that it's still going. Anyway, you could experience adequate curries with Indian levels of flies.
    On the subject of famous old London eateries, anyone else remember Centrale at Cambridge Circus? Famously name checked in a Pogues song, and the best pasta for under £5. I walked past its old spot last night and got quite nostalgic.
    There was an Italian just off Cambridge Circus (I think Old Compton St) that was really good, but had the most amazginly rude staff (perhaps just one lady).
  • Andy_JS said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Huge improvements in reservoir levels in southern England.

    https://www.southernwater.co.uk/water-for-life/reservoir-levels

    Room for a lot more water.
    Not in Weir Wood reservoir, which has gone from 58% to 100% in a few weeks. Let's hope the same thing happens elsewhere.
    It says in the blurb they turn WW off in periods of drought which gives it a head start
  • Talking of the India Club, had the pleasure once to have afternoon tea at the Gymkhana Club in Delhi… guest of Habans Singh, a community leader in Ealing who happened to be visiting Delhi at the same time; I was working with his son at the time - an interesting chap who had starred in Grange Hill and his brother was in Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom (the young Prince)… the Gymkhana Club was fascinating…
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639
    kinabalu said:

    Carnyx said:

    kinabalu said:

    ClippP said:

    kinabalu said:

    OT Matt Hancock is second-favourite to win I'm A Celebrity. Jill Scott is odds-on; Owen used to be favourite but has drifted badly this week.

    He's doing great apparently. And through gritted teeth you have to say it's a genuine achievement.
    But is it enough to be made the next Conservative PM?
    He's elevating above that now, I think. Winning I'm a Celeb is premier league in this day and age. The world is now his lobster.
    Don't you mean marsupial prepuce?
    I could google but as an arch conversationalist I'll ask instead - is that the scientific term for a kangeroo testicle?
    Nope. Foreskin of a kangaroo or indeed any of the large category of related pouched mammals to which it belongs. So anything from a honey possum to a giant wombat+.

    + = extinct, alas.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    Carnyx said:

    kinabalu said:

    Carnyx said:

    kinabalu said:

    ClippP said:

    kinabalu said:

    OT Matt Hancock is second-favourite to win I'm A Celebrity. Jill Scott is odds-on; Owen used to be favourite but has drifted badly this week.

    He's doing great apparently. And through gritted teeth you have to say it's a genuine achievement.
    But is it enough to be made the next Conservative PM?
    He's elevating above that now, I think. Winning I'm a Celeb is premier league in this day and age. The world is now his lobster.
    Don't you mean marsupial prepuce?
    I could google but as an arch conversationalist I'll ask instead - is that the scientific term for a kangeroo testicle?
    Nope. Foreskin of a kangaroo or indeed any of the large category of related pouched mammals to which it belongs. So anything from a honey possum to a giant wombat+.

    + = extinct, alas.
    The things you learn on PB...
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    edited November 2022
    pillsbury said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    Huge improvements in reservoir levels in southern England.

    https://www.southernwater.co.uk/water-for-life/reservoir-levels

    Room for a lot more water.
    Not in Weir Wood reservoir, which has gone from 58% to 100% in a few weeks. Let's hope the same thing happens elsewhere.
    It says in the blurb they turn WW off in periods of drought which gives it a head start
    Severn Trent reservoir levels up 50% in two months.

    Still only 60% capacity, mind you, but that's a lot better than 40% and there's hopefully still three months of rain to come.

    https://www.stwater.co.uk/about-us/reservoir-levels/
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,865
    Andy_JS said:

    Ecuador score. 1-1

    Must admit, I thought Ecuador was the better team.

    Still: the Netherlands won't struggle against Qatar in the last game of their group, and I can't see Ecuador not managing at least a draw, so I'd reckon it'll be Netherlands followed by Qatar in Group A.

  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,865
    kinabalu said:

    kamski said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    Well I never Knock me dahn wiv a fevver.

    Etc.

    "New emails show UK and US science officials helped shut down lab leak days after being told it was a real possibility.

    @sarahknapton
    and me in
    @Telegraph"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/11/24/top-virologists-betrayed-science-covid-lab-leak-cover-up/

    One of the best bits is Jeremy Farrar's incredulity at leaning the Chinese were dojng their dodgy research in a BSL2 lab, much lower than the required BSL4.

    His reaction is to call this "Wild West".

    Yet about ten days later he co-signed the Lancet letter which said that even discussing the mere possibility of a lab leak is a conspiracy - and probably racist.

    :https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30418-9/fulltext

    We're discussing ULEZ at the moment. The expansion to cover the whole of London in August next year.
    Leon is just happy that his guru on all things "woke" is banning LGBT propaganda:
    https://www.reuters.com/world/russias-parliament-passes-law-banning-lgbt-propaganda-among-adults-2022-11-24/
    Well the argument that "woke" saps the strength of a nation is not exactly being borne out by the Russian military performance in Ukraine. Perhaps Putin ought to reflect on this.
    On the contrary, Russia's poor performance comes from them being excessively woke.
This discussion has been closed.