Undefined discussion subject.
Comments
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I thought he (Hunt) did commit to that?HYUFD said:
Boris wants a Canada style FTA with the EU as I believe does Hunt (hence he tried to recruit Harper) whereas May did not. Both voted for the Withdrawal Agreement, Hunt 3 times and Boris once.TOPPING said:
It is exquisite. Hunt might actually have enough integrity to carry out his no deal threat but we know that instinctively he doesn't want no deal. Boris probably does want no deal (at least is prepared to do it more than Hunt) but probably won't have the cajones to go through with it.TheScreamingEagles said:
I’m split betweenTOPPING said:
@TSE must choose whether to cancel out Big G's vote or Mrs Big G's vote.eek said:
another vote for Boris then....TheScreamingEagles said:
I shall be voting tonight.MarqueeMark said:The ballot papers arrived this morning. Any other Conservative Party members voted yet?
1) Voting for Hunt
2) Writing a rude word or two next to Boris Johnson’s name
3) Writing ‘Bring back Dave’
4) ‘Writing’ Ken Clarke for Prime Minister’
Where's Aesop when we need him?
However Boris is clear Leave Deal or No Deal by October 31st while Hunt has not committed absolutely to that though both want to try and remove the backstop (with a possibility Boris lets NI voters decide on the backstop by referendum if the EU will not renegotiate it and agree a technical solution to avoid a hard border straight away)0 -
A difference in what? How they feel pain?TOPPING said:
There is a difference between a domesticated animal and a wild animal.OnlyLivingBoy said:
I will believe people genuinely think fox hunting isn't cruel when they choose it as a method for euthenising their pets.TOPPING said:
I have plenty of energy and blog political capital for all kinds of topics.kinabalu said:
Unless we are re-engineering the language, being chewed to death by a pack of hounds is a cruel way to go. It is cruel. A better defence would be that other feasible killing methods are also cruel. I wouldn't know. I live in Hampstead.TOPPING said:haha yes it seriously compromises the welfare of the fox. No doubt abou that. Then again, foxes are pests and you can kill them in any number of ways legally, which also, sadly for Charlie, compromises his welfare.
And yes I can reach a view - it is not cruel and it is not not cruel.
But given that fox hunting is accepted these days to be 'the unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible' (Churchill or Wilde, no doubt), it is safe to say it is never coming back. So I would drop it if I were you. You are expending a chunk of your blog political capital in the flaying of a dead horse (to continue the animal mistreatment theme). Much better to save this for the far more important matter of promoting the Withdrawal Agreement. It's just you and me now on that noble cause.
As for your point about the chewing to death that is undoubtedly the compromise of the fox's welfare. But the thing is we are talking about a fox here, not your Auntie Nellie (with all best wishes to her). A fox is first a wild animal, and is also a pest and, hugely sadly, although perhaps with less publicity, many kinds of wild animal pests are killed in all sorts of ways that you might deem cruel if applied to Auntie N. Foxes are chased, and as a wild animal that is not an unordinary experience, and then killed (or "ripped apart" if you prefer). Just like mice are by your cat.
The Burns Report as you might imagine, given it was a report into foxhunting, spent some considerable time investigating all of this and could not conclude that the death, by other animals of this animal was cruel. Hence, no, it is not cruel.
Any other questions?0 -
No, he has said if a Deal looks possible in September he might yet extend beyond October, he will only Leave with No Deal in October if a Deal looks unlikely in SeptemberTOPPING said:
I thought he (Hunt) did commit to that?HYUFD said:
Boris wants a Canada style FTA with the EU as I believe does Hunt (hence he tried to recruit Harper) whereas May did not. Both voted for the Withdrawal Agreement, Hunt 3 times and Boris once.TOPPING said:
It is exquisite. Hunt might actually have enough integrity to carry out his no deal threat but we know that instinctively he doesn't want no deal. Boris probably does want no deal (at least is prepared to do it more than Hunt) but probably won't have the cajones to go through with it.TheScreamingEagles said:
I’m split betweenTOPPING said:
@TSE must choose whether to cancel out Big G's vote or Mrs Big G's vote.eek said:
another vote for Boris then....TheScreamingEagles said:
I shall be voting tonight.MarqueeMark said:The ballot papers arrived this morning. Any other Conservative Party members voted yet?
1) Voting for Hunt
2) Writing a rude word or two next to Boris Johnson’s name
3) Writing ‘Bring back Dave’
4) ‘Writing’ Ken Clarke for Prime Minister’
Where's Aesop when we need him?
However Boris is clear Leave Deal or No Deal by October 31st while Hunt has not committed absolutely to that though both want to try and remove the backstop (with a possibility Boris lets NI voters decide on the backstop by referendum if the EU will not renegotiate it and agree a technical solution to avoid a hard border straight away)0 -
YouGov latest favourability ratings show Johnson still miles ahead of Hunt amongst 2017 Conservative voters, inferring something in the same ball park amongst Conservative members:
2017 Con voters only:
Johnson +30
Con Party +28
Brexit Party +28
Hunt +4
May +2
LDs -45
Lab Party -92
Corbyn -93
All voters:
LDs -12
Brexit Party -21
Johnson -23
Lab Party -26
Hunt -30
Con Party -35
May -36
Corbyn -51
https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/w2via7fx5g/Internal_190701_FavourabilityTrackers_w.pdf
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In what they are accustomed to. A saucer of milk on the one hand and predators on the other.OnlyLivingBoy said:
A difference in what? How they feel pain?TOPPING said:
There is a difference between a domesticated animal and a wild animal.OnlyLivingBoy said:
I will believe people genuinely think fox hunting isn't cruel when they choose it as a method for euthenising their pets.TOPPING said:
I have plenty of energy and blog political capital for all kinds of topics.kinabalu said:
Unless we are re-engineering the language, being chewed to death by a pack of hounds is a cruel way to go. It is cruel. A better defence would be that other feasible killing methods are also cruel. I wouldn't know. I live in Hampstead.TOPPING said:haha yes it seriously compromises the welfare of the fox. No doubt abou that. Then again, foxes are pests and you can kill them in any number of ways legally, which also, sadly for Charlie, compromises his welfare.
And yes I can reach a view - it is not cruel and it is not not cruel.
But given that fox hunting is accepted these days to be 'the unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible' (Churchill or Wilde, no doubt), it is safe to say it is never coming back. So I would drop it if I were you. You are expending a chunk of your blog political capital in the flaying of a dead horse (to continue the animal mistreatment theme). Much better to save this for the far more important matter of promoting the Withdrawal Agreement. It's just you and me now on that noble cause.
As for your point about the chewing to death that is undoubtedly the compromise of the fox's welfare. But the thing is we are talking about a fox here, not your Auntie Nellie (with all best wishes to her). A fox is first a wild animal, and is also a pest and, hugely sadly, although perhaps with less publicity, many kinds of wild animal pests are killed in all sorts of ways that you might deem cruel if applied to Auntie N. Foxes are chased, and as a wild animal that is not an unordinary experience, and then killed (or "ripped apart" if you prefer). Just like mice are by your cat.
The Burns Report as you might imagine, given it was a report into foxhunting, spent some considerable time investigating all of this and could not conclude that the death, by other animals of this animal was cruel. Hence, no, it is not cruel.
Any other questions?0 -
HYUFD said:
Not certain about that, Twickenham was an option and no PPC has been selected there yet.nichomar said:
He’s not standing in twickenham he’s staying where he is with the blessing of the previous lib dem ppcHYUFD said:
Swinson is more likely to lose her seat to the SNP than Corbyn is to lose his seat to the LDs or Boris lose his seat to Labour on current polls, even if the LDs make gains in England and Wales they are unlikely to do much more than tread water in Scotland.StuartDickson said:
And then think of the fun if the Lib Dems gain 100 seats but Jo Swinson loses hers.OldKingCole said:StuartDickson said:On-topic:
If you pump these figures into Baxter, you get this for Islington North:
Lab 38%
LD 30%
Grn 11%
Bxp 10%
Con 9%
oth 2%
If you then factor in some tactical voting by Corbyn-hating Tories and Bxp supporters, and some goodwill tactical voting by Green and Oth supporters, is a LIB DEM GAIN not becoming a possibility in this seat?
Shadsy has Lab 1/10 and LD 6/1 in Islington North.
So both Corbyn and Boris could lose their seats! That would be a turn-up!
Of course Swinson losing her seat but the LDs making gains overall (including Streatham) would be ideal for Chuka if he stands in Streatham or Twickenham as is likely
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/chuka-umunna-tipped-to-run-as-candidate-in-sir-vince-cables-twickenham-seat-after-switch-to-lib-dems-a4167536.html
Though of course Lambeth containing Streatham did vote LD in the European Parliament elections if he stays where he is0 -
Good pointOnlyLivingBoy said:
I will believe people genuinely think fox hunting isn't cruel when they choose it as a method for euthenising their pets.TOPPING said:
I have plenty of energy and blog political capital for all kinds of topics.kinabalu said:
Unless we are re-engineering the language, being chewed to death by a pack of hounds is a cruel way to go. It is cruel. A better defence would be that other feasible killing methods are also cruel. I wouldn't know. I live in Hampstead.TOPPING said:haha yes it seriously compromises the welfare of the fox. No doubt abou that. Then again, foxes are pests and you can kill them in any number of ways legally, which also, sadly for Charlie, compromises his welfare.
And yes I can reach a view - it is not cruel and it is not not cruel.
But given that fox hunting is accepted these days to be 'the unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible' (Churchill or Wilde, no doubt), it is safe to say it is never coming back. So I would drop it if I were you. You are expending a chunk of your blog political capital in the flaying of a dead horse (to continue the animal mistreatment theme). Much better to save this for the far more important matter of promoting the Withdrawal Agreement. It's just you and me now on that noble cause.
As for your point about the chewing to death that is undoubtedly the compromise of the fox's welfare. But the thing is we are talking about a fox here, not your Auntie Nellie (with all best wishes to her). A fox is first a wild animal, and is also a pest and, hugely sadly, although perhaps with less publicity, many kinds of wild animal pests are killed in all sorts of ways that you might deem cruel if applied to Auntie N. Foxes are chased, and as a wild animal that is not an unordinary experience, and then killed (or "ripped apart" if you prefer). Just like mice are by your cat.
The Burns Report as you might imagine, given it was a report into foxhunting, spent some considerable time investigating all of this and could not conclude that the death, by other animals of this animal was cruel. Hence, no, it is not cruel.
Any other questions?0 -
Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible0 -
Hasn't he just. What was he thinkingrottenborough said:0 -
He seems to have thought picking the day the ballots landed to bring up fox hunting was a good idea.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Hasn't he just. What was he thinkingrottenborough said:
If that's what he thinks of members I don't think it's right.0 -
If even you vote for Boris BigG it will be a Boris landslide without questionBig_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible0 -
You voted for Cameron and backed May who went much further than Hunt on fox hunting in 2015 and 2017.Big_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible0 -
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Boris also has higher favourables with All voters than Labour on that poll, both he and Hunt poll above their party, Corbyn polls below his, as now does MayWulfrun_Phil said:YouGov latest favourability ratings show Johnson still miles ahead of Hunt amongst 2017 Conservative voters, inferring something in the same ball park amongst Conservative members:
2017 Con voters only:
Johnson +30
Con Party +28
Brexit Party +28
Hunt +4
May +2
LDs -45
Lab Party -92
Corbyn -93
All voters:
LDs -12
Brexit Party -21
Johnson -23
Lab Party -26
Hunt -30
Con Party -35
May -36
Corbyn -51
https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/w2via7fx5g/Internal_190701_FavourabilityTrackers_w.pdf0 -
That is not the point. If that happened it would be by the actions of Hunt leaving me no other option as I value my vote. It would not be a vote of any enthusiasm whatsoeverHYUFD said:
If even you vote for Boris BigG it will be a Boris landslide without questionBig_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible0 -
There is a highly vocal set within the countryside who want it back. But I doubt they are in a majority even within the rural Tory membership.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Hasn't he just. What was he thinkingrottenborough said:0 -
0
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If even your pen is trembling, Big_G, over the Hunt box, then he is doomed.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Hasn't he just. What was he thinkingrottenborough said:0 -
Not that vocal tbh.rottenborough said:
There is a highly vocal set within the countryside who want it back. But I doubt they are in a majority even within the rural Tory membership.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Hasn't he just. What was he thinkingrottenborough said:0 -
Did some intern dream up the idea of Hunt proposing to bring back hunting? Maybe thinking of neat press releases:
"Hunt says let's hunt"0 -
I cannot support fox hunting. It is totemic for my family and especially my grandchildrenTheScreamingEagles said:
You voted for Cameron and backed May who went much further than Hunt on fox hunting in 2015 and 2017.Big_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible
Why Hunt raised it I do not know0 -
Only going on what a close family member tells me happens down his rural patch. Quite a lot of noisy protesting (in favour) every new-style faux hunt and especially at the bigger events e.g. boxing day.TOPPING said:
Not that vocal tbh.rottenborough said:
There is a highly vocal set within the countryside who want it back. But I doubt they are in a majority even within the rural Tory membership.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Hasn't he just. What was he thinkingrottenborough said:0 -
This reply to Dan Hodges made me laugh!rottenborough said:
https://twitter.com/ToryRevival/status/1146777316703555586?s=190 -
Yes but not more broadly.rottenborough said:
Only going on what a close family member tells me happens down his rural patch. Quite a lot of noisy protesting (in favour) every new-style faux hunt and especially at the bigger events e.g. boxing day.TOPPING said:
Not that vocal tbh.rottenborough said:
There is a highly vocal set within the countryside who want it back. But I doubt they are in a majority even within the rural Tory membership.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Hasn't he just. What was he thinkingrottenborough said:0 -
Animals chase and kill other animals, it's true, but we do not generally contrive to create or encourage the situation.TOPPING said:
I have plenty of energy and blog political capital for all kinds of topics.kinabalu said:
Unless we are re-engineering the language, being chewed to death by a pack of hounds is a cruel way to go. It is cruel. A better defence would be that other feasible killing methods are also cruel. I wouldn't know. I live in Hampstead.TOPPING said:haha yes it seriously compromises the welfare of the fox. No doubt abou that. Then again, foxes are pests and you can kill them in any number of ways legally, which also, sadly for Charlie, compromises his welfare.
And yes I can reach a view - it is not cruel and it is not not cruel.
But given that fox hunting is accepted these days to be 'the unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible' (Churchill or Wilde, no doubt), it is safe to say it is never coming back. So I would drop it if I were you. You are expending a chunk of your blog political capital in the flaying of a dead horse (to continue the animal mistreatment theme). Much better to save this for the far more important matter of promoting the Withdrawal Agreement. It's just you and me now on that noble cause.
As for your point about the chewing to death that is undoubtedly the compromise of the fox's welfare. But the thing is we are talking about a fox here, not your Auntie Nellie (with all best wishes to her). A fox is first a wild animal, and is also a pest and, hugely sadly, although perhaps with less publicity, many kinds of wild animal pests are killed in all sorts of ways that you might deem cruel if applied to Auntie N. Foxes are chased, and as a wild animal that is not an unordinary experience, and then killed (or "ripped apart" if you prefer). Just like mice are by your cat.
The Burns Report as you might imagine, given it was a report into foxhunting, spent some considerable time investigating all of this and could not conclude that the death, by other animals of this animal was cruel. Hence, no, it is not cruel.
Any other questions?
My adorable dog (see avatar) has to the best of my knowledge killed five squirrels and a bunny rabbit over the past four years. I don't approve, but it's nature and these are hardly protected species, so I see no reason to stop her chasing them. I don't encourage her though, and I certainly wouldn't turn it into a sport or spectacle for the pleasure of others. That kind of thing belongs to a bygone age.0 -
Are you supporting the bloodthirsty Hunt, @thescreamingeagles
? 0 -
Yet you voted Tory in 2015 and 2017 given the plans for fox hunting in the manifesto.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I cannot support fox hunting. It is totemic for my family and especially my grandchildrenTheScreamingEagles said:
You voted for Cameron and backed May who went much further than Hunt on fox hunting in 2015 and 2017.Big_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible
Why Hunt raised it I do not know
Can’t be that totemic.0 -
Goodbye Jeremy to our two votes and of all days, the one the ballots dropped onto our doormatPulpstar said:0 -
2017 was all about keeping Corbyn out !TheScreamingEagles said:
Yet you voted Tory in 2015 and 2017 given the plans for fox hunting in the manifesto.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I cannot support fox hunting. It is totemic for my family and especially my grandchildrenTheScreamingEagles said:
You voted for Cameron and backed May who went much further than Hunt on fox hunting in 2015 and 2017.Big_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible
Why Hunt raised it I do not know
Can’t be that totemic.0 -
You have put your finger on it. People object because foxhunters enjoyed it.Peter_the_Punter said:
Animals chase and kill other animals, it's true, but we do not generally contrive to create or encourage the situation.TOPPING said:
I have plenty of energy and blog political capital for all kinds of topics.kinabalu said:
Unless we are re-engineering the language, being chewed to death by a pack of hounds is a cruel way to go. It is cruel. A better defence would be that other feasible killing methods are also cruel. I wouldn't know. I live in Hampstead.TOPPING said:haha yes it seriously compromises the welfare of the fox. No doubt abou that. Then again, foxes are pests and you can kill them in any number of ways legally, which also, sadly for Charlie, compromises his welfare.
And yes I can reach a view - it is not cruel and it is not not cruel.
But given that fox hunting is accepted these days to be 'the unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible' (Churchill or Wilde, no doubt), it is safe to say it is never coming back. So I would drop it if I were you. You are expending a chunk of your blog political capital in the flaying of a dead horse (to continue the animal mistreatment theme). Much better to save this for the far more important matter of promoting the Withdrawal Agreement. It's just you and me now on that noble cause.
As for your point about the chewing to death that is undoubtedly the compromise of the fox's welfare. But the thing is we are talking about a fox here, not your Auntie Nellie (with all best wishes to her). A fox is first a wild animal, and is also a pest and, hugely sadly, although perhaps with less publicity, many kinds of wild animal pests are killed in all sorts of ways that you might deem cruel if applied to Auntie N. Foxes are chased, and as a wild animal that is not an unordinary experience, and then killed (or "ripped apart" if you prefer). Just like mice are by your cat.
The Burns Report as you might imagine, given it was a report into foxhunting, spent some considerable time investigating all of this and could not conclude that the death, by other animals of this animal was cruel. Hence, no, it is not cruel.
Any other questions?
My adorable dog (see avatar) has to the best of my knowledge killed five squirrels and a bunny rabbit over the past four years. I don't approve, but it's nature and these are hardly protected species, so I see no reason to stop her chasing them. I don't encourage her though, and I certainly wouldn't turn it into a sport or spectacle for the pleasure of others. That kind of thing belongs to a bygone age.0 -
Fox hunting is a subject that has never excited me either way.Pulpstar said:Are you supporting the bloodthirsty Hunt, @thescreamingeagles
?
So it still #HasToBeHunt.0 -
Focus on the damage Johnson can and will do.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Goodbye Jeremy to our two votes and of all days, the one the ballots dropped onto our doormatPulpstar said:0 -
At least, if there were any doubt, another nail has been hammered into the coffin of hunting.0
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#HasToBeFoxHunt I think you mean.TheScreamingEagles said:
Fox hunting is a subject that has never excited me either way.Pulpstar said:Are you supporting the bloodthirsty Hunt, @thescreamingeagles
?
So it still #HasToBeHunt.0 -
I quite understand how you cannot now vote for Hunt.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I cannot support fox hunting. It is totemic for my family and especially my grandchildrenTheScreamingEagles said:
You voted for Cameron and backed May who went much further than Hunt on fox hunting in 2015 and 2017.Big_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible
Why Hunt raised it I do not know
However, I remain somewhat puzzled that you can lend your vote to the charlatan.0 -
It took three years of utter failure to do the one job she had to get to that.. What's Corbyn's excuse?HYUFD said:
Boris also has higher favourables with All voters than Labour on that poll, both he and Hunt poll above their party, Corbyn polls below his, as now does MayWulfrun_Phil said:YouGov latest favourability ratings show Johnson still miles ahead of Hunt amongst 2017 Conservative voters, inferring something in the same ball park amongst Conservative members:
2017 Con voters only:
Johnson +30
Con Party +28
Brexit Party +28
Hunt +4
May +2
LDs -45
Lab Party -92
Corbyn -93
All voters:
LDs -12
Brexit Party -21
Johnson -23
Lab Party -26
Hunt -30
Con Party -35
May -36
Corbyn -51
https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/w2via7fx5g/Internal_190701_FavourabilityTrackers_w.pdf0 -
I know you're not a fan of Boris, but you have your principles and taking a stand against cruelty is something to be proud of. Whether you end up voting for either Boris or Hunt, or spoil your ballot, you have my respect.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Goodbye Jeremy to our two votes and of all days, the one the ballots dropped onto our doormatPulpstar said:0 -
The terriermen who razz round on quadbikes with the shovels ready to dig out a fox that goes to ground are probably the thing that repulses me the most about fox hunting.
The red coats, horses with dogs & sport aspect of hunting (heck even the horn) can all be done with a trailrunner & bloodhound pack. But the terriermen do seem to be a particularly sadistic sort :E0 -
Surely the latter part of the drawing injects at least a smidgin of doubt?TheScreamingEagles said:
Might be considered a clear preference for Boris.FrancisUrquhart said:
Whats wrong with the traditional cock and balls drawing?TheScreamingEagles said:
I’m split betweenTOPPING said:
@TSE must choose whether to cancel out Big G's vote or Mrs Big G's vote.eek said:
another vote for Boris then....TheScreamingEagles said:
I shall be voting tonight.MarqueeMark said:The ballot papers arrived this morning. Any other Conservative Party members voted yet?
1) Voting for Hunt
2) Writing a rude word or two next to Boris Johnson’s name
3) Writing ‘Bring back Dave’
4) ‘Writing’ Ken Clarke for Prime Minister’0 -
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/10117433/Lets-have-fox-hunting-in-London-says-Boris.htmlBig_G_NorthWales said:
I cannot support fox hunting. It is totemic for my family and especially my grandchildrenTheScreamingEagles said:
You voted for Cameron and backed May who went much further than Hunt on fox hunting in 2015 and 2017.Big_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible
Why Hunt raised it I do not know0 -
Way more likely Boris' cat had a fight with another cat. Cats fight all the time.IanB2 said:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/10117433/Lets-have-fox-hunting-in-London-says-Boris.htmlBig_G_NorthWales said:
I cannot support fox hunting. It is totemic for my family and especially my grandchildrenTheScreamingEagles said:
You voted for Cameron and backed May who went much further than Hunt on fox hunting in 2015 and 2017.Big_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible
Why Hunt raised it I do not know0 -
Is Boris anti fox hunting? It really has the potential to cost the tories support in an election even just the idea that support still exists for it in the party, even if they don't include a repeal in the manifesto. It also divides their support along an entirely new axis (you'll have plenty of brexiteers against, Remainers in favour etc). Truly spectacularly bad by Hunt to have allowed it to become a discussion point. Labour are too distracted to capitalise, but LDs could do well by going hard on it to attract anti fox hunting tories in home county seats etc.0
-
That article is dated June 2013 and the matter is now settled and did not need to be opened.IanB2 said:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/10117433/Lets-have-fox-hunting-in-London-says-Boris.htmlBig_G_NorthWales said:
I cannot support fox hunting. It is totemic for my family and especially my grandchildrenTheScreamingEagles said:
You voted for Cameron and backed May who went much further than Hunt on fox hunting in 2015 and 2017.Big_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible
Why Hunt raised it I do not know
Now if Boris agrees with Hunt position today then neither get my vote0 -
Here's an important tweet perhaps... https://twitter.com/sajidjavid/status/11466667722228940810
-
To those maligning cretin/wanker/relic Bill Cash for his outdated views and obsession with Germany/WW2 on the previous thread..
You might all be a bit more obsessed by WW2 Germany if your father had been blown up by Nazis when you were about 4 years old. You might not, but I'm happy to give Cash a bit of leeway on that front.
And I can't imagine any of you have done anywhere near as much to modernise the world as Cash did with his Gender Equality International Development Bill in 2013/14. He deserves huge credit for that.0 -
Please do not doubt my sincerity or that of my family TSE.TheScreamingEagles said:
Yet you voted Tory in 2015 and 2017 given the plans for fox hunting in the manifesto.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I cannot support fox hunting. It is totemic for my family and especially my grandchildrenTheScreamingEagles said:
You voted for Cameron and backed May who went much further than Hunt on fox hunting in 2015 and 2017.Big_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible
Why Hunt raised it I do not know
Can’t be that totemic.
The matter was closed and belongs to yesterday.0 -
That remains to be seen. He is not my choice but Hunt has gone too farIanB2 said:
Focus on the damage Johnson can and will do.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Goodbye Jeremy to our two votes and of all days, the one the ballots dropped onto our doormatPulpstar said:0 -
My vote is precious and it is a huge unnecessary problem. I will not vote Hunt so it is Boris or I do not voteNigelb said:
I quite understand how you cannot now vote for Hunt.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I cannot support fox hunting. It is totemic for my family and especially my grandchildrenTheScreamingEagles said:
You voted for Cameron and backed May who went much further than Hunt on fox hunting in 2015 and 2017.Big_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible
Why Hunt raised it I do not know
However, I remain somewhat puzzled that you can lend your vote to the charlatan.
I do wonder how much damage Hunt has done to himself on this ill advised excursion0 -
Not really. Foxes are pests and need to be controlled.TOPPING said:
Or indeed not worry about several things and only worry about certain things. What a shame for rats and mice, for example, that there aren't a bunch of people in red coats chasing after them.NickPalmer said:
I never pay much attention to the "Why do you worry about X when you should be worrying about Y?" line. One can worry about several things without feeling any special need to sequence them.Scott_P said:
Fox hunting is a cruel, stupid and inefficient way of doing so.0 -
Boris' best move on fox hunting right now is probably one of studied silence, then once he's won the leadership contest saying though he's personally in favour he feels the issue is settled and has no plans to bring about changes.
His 2013 musings on the subject are obviously a joke - the idea of a fox hunt through London (And specifically Islington) is preposterous 0 -
That's where your squirrel and rabbit fur trimmed evening gowns come from !!Peter_the_Punter said:My adorable dog (see avatar) has to the best of my knowledge killed five squirrels and a bunny rabbit over the past four years.
0 -
Mr. Alistair, the alternatives all have problems too, though.
Lamping can, and has, lead to human fatalities. Poison and traps sometimes work, sometimes don't, can condemn the creature (not necessarily a fox) to a lingering death. Fox hunting seems superior to all those methods.
However, the most interesting post I read here on the subject was one fellow (forget who, sorry) who suggested that dogs on farms could be an effective deterrent.0 -
Friends of mine have a cat that in his younger days would fight fox cubs. This was okay until the fox cubs got big leading to many (expensive) trips to the vets.Pulpstar said:
Way more likely Boris' cat had a fight with another cat. Cats fight all the time.IanB2 said:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/10117433/Lets-have-fox-hunting-in-London-says-Boris.htmlBig_G_NorthWales said:
I cannot support fox hunting. It is totemic for my family and especially my grandchildrenTheScreamingEagles said:
You voted for Cameron and backed May who went much further than Hunt on fox hunting in 2015 and 2017.Big_G_NorthWales said:Have received our ballot papers and if Hunt had not opened fox hunting they would be back in the post with 2 votes for him
Why he wanted to raise a subject like hunting when it is no longer an active issue beggars belief and has caused a serious problem for our votes.
My wife and I will follow the narrative from Hunt over this over the weekend but if he continues, he is creating the absurd situation that we only have Boris left
The one thing that has impressed both my wife and I is Boris pledge to restore police numbers and as aside his liberal attitude to immigration is sensible
Why Hunt raised it I do not know0 -
Thank you. My family have changed over the last few years and especially my grandchildren. They are much on the side of care for the planet and all the creatures and indeed one of them is now vegan.Philip_Thompson said:
I know you're not a fan of Boris, but you have your principles and taking a stand against cruelty is something to be proud of. Whether you end up voting for either Boris or Hunt, or spoil your ballot, you have my respect.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Goodbye Jeremy to our two votes and of all days, the one the ballots dropped onto our doormatPulpstar said:
Also the image of red huntsmen 'tallyhoing' through the Countryside is so bad for a modern caring conservative party. I should say I fully support drag hunting
It is likely I will vote for Boris now but I am not at all happy about it0 -
Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.1 -
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.0 -
Mr. NorthWales, whilst the hunting issue isn't even one on my radar in terms of determining voting, I respect that. Unfortunately, the alternative candidate is a known incompetent.
I sympathise with your dilemma.0 -
I'd have thought Tory members would want a Con majority Gov't - so what a potential PM plans to do with that majority is important.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
0 -
Mr. Pulpstar, any majority requires an election, and the manifesto for said election can be used to judge voting at that time.
If Hunt wins (unlikely as that is) he will have no majority until and unless he holds and wins a General Election.
Shame he's made such a damned silly mistake, and one that was so obviously foolish, particularly given the timing.0 -
The image of city folk telling people in the country how to run their lives is not Conservative either. There has been huge amounts of disinformation about hunting. Sorry to hear you and your family have swallowed it. I personally think veganism is potentially damaging to children's health. Not in favour of banning it though. Banning things we don't approve of is for lefties and right wing zealots, and is the antithesis of being Conservative.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Thank you. My family have changed over the last few years and especially my grandchildren. They are much on the side of care for the planet and all the creatures and indeed one of them is now vegan.Philip_Thompson said:
I know you're not a fan of Boris, but you have your principles and taking a stand against cruelty is something to be proud of. Whether you end up voting for either Boris or Hunt, or spoil your ballot, you have my respect.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Goodbye Jeremy to our two votes and of all days, the one the ballots dropped onto our doormatPulpstar said:
Also the image of red huntsmen 'tallyhoing' through the Countryside is so bad for a modern caring conservative party. I should say I fully support drag hunting
It is likely I will vote for Boris now but I am not at all happy about it0 -
Oh my goodness, that last comment, who ever said it, really does show the ignorance of those who have never genuinely lived in the countrysideMorris_Dancer said:Mr. Alistair, the alternatives all have problems too, though.
Lamping can, and has, lead to human fatalities. Poison and traps sometimes work, sometimes don't, can condemn the creature (not necessarily a fox) to a lingering death. Fox hunting seems superior to all those methods.
However, the most interesting post I read here on the subject was one fellow (forget who, sorry) who suggested that dogs on farms could be an effective deterrent.0 -
Mr. Foremain, many here comment on things of which they have more knowledge/experience than others. If you know better, then by all means explain.0
-
Even with a majority, there would be a number of Conservative MPs who would have committed to vote against repeal (as indeed I did in 2017). It's a complete non-starter and as a pledge is essentially performative. I do wonder in which direction (if any) the net effect for Hunt will actually be, though.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Pulpstar, any majority requires an election, and the manifesto for said election can be used to judge voting at that time.
If Hunt wins (unlikely as that is) he will have no majority until and unless he holds and wins a General Election.
Shame he's made such a damned silly mistake, and one that was so obviously foolish, particularly given the timing.0 -
Boris is trolling the evil Tories who cut 20,000 bobbies in the first place.Pulpstar said:Here's an important tweet perhaps... https://twitter.com/sajidjavid/status/1146666772222894081
0 -
Are you an expert on the topic then, do you have opinions to the contrary. More than 50% want a referendum, Scottish Government has the mandate for one, it is guaranteed that EU people would be more likely to vote Yes as only way to get back to EU than under the previous unionist lies. I say you are talking out of your whatsit and talking Yes down.JBriskinindyref2 said:
I think you're exaggerating and ramping Yesmalcolmg said:
Though it does tip the scales and will almost certainly mean all EU residents likely to vote YES rather than NO this time.JBriskinindyref2 said:
I think the Brexit/Scottish independence link is overplayed.TheScreamingEagles said:
No sympathy for him.williamglenn said:At the start of this process who'd have thought Liam Fox would emerge as the only remaining sane Brexiteer?
https://twitter.com/DavidHenigUK/status/1146764158974791680
When David Cameron and others said in 2016 that Brexit might lead to No Deal, Scottish independence, a hard border in Ireland, and maybe even Irish unity, Fox said those were “hysterical prophecies of doom.”
This is your shit show Liam, own it.
For whatever reason SNP poll consistently 40pc and this wasn't going to change simply cus of a lost referendum.
With a separatist majority in Holyrood, indyref2 was always going to be on the cards whatever the Brexit vote.
Last vote was won by people born outside Scotland voting No.0 -
In your opinion and that of the League Against Cruel Sports, who are not exactly neutral on the subject. The most stupid thing about it is that there is a debate on a subject that many of those who express an opinion are so ignorant of the countryside that they wouldn't know the difference between a hare and a rabbit, or barley and wheat. Parliament has decided once that it would waste huge amounts of time on the subject, it is unlikely it will again. Jeremy Hunt answered honesty, Boris Johnson will no doubt lie, but I doubt he is a bunny hugger.Alistair said:
Not really. Foxes are pests and need to be controlled.TOPPING said:
Or indeed not worry about several things and only worry about certain things. What a shame for rats and mice, for example, that there aren't a bunch of people in red coats chasing after them.NickPalmer said:
I never pay much attention to the "Why do you worry about X when you should be worrying about Y?" line. One can worry about several things without feeling any special need to sequence them.Scott_P said:
Fox hunting is a cruel, stupid and inefficient way of doing so.0 -
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?0 -
He is a donkey , thinking is not his strong point. Ran out of unicorns and had tossup between fox hunting and hanging.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Hasn't he just. What was he thinkingrottenborough said:0 -
IndeedTissue_Price said:
That depends, many Tory Leave voters in the seat will vote Tory or Brexit Party this time rather than tactically vote for a diehard Remainer like Swinson again even if she is pro Unioneek said:
Swinson, as newly elected LD leader in a strongly No constituency, is not going to be losing her seat to the SNP.Tissue_Price said:Swinson is more likely to lose her seat to the SNP than Corbyn is to lose his seat to the LDs or Boris lose his seat to Labour on current polls, even if the LDs make gains in England and Wales they are unlikely to do much more than tread water in Scotland.
Of course Swinson losing her seat but the LDs making gains overall (including Streatham) would be ideal for Chuka if he stands in Streatham or Twickenham as is likely
UK GE 2017, in Scotland, was primarily decided by No-to-Indy supporters voting tactically for the strongest No candidate. In East Dunbartonshire this was Jo Swinson. She benefited hugely from Con, Lab and UKIP supporters lending their votes.
While SLab voters will almost certainly stick with Swinson (indeed, there might even be even stronger tactical SLD voting from this group), the SCon tactical votes for SLD candidates will heavily unwind. East Dunbartonshire is jam-packed full of people who in England would be solid Tory voters, but due to Scottish circumstances have rarely voted for their true first preference.
This makes East Dunbartonshire vulnerable to an SNP re-gain. It will also affect the outcome in many other Scottish seats.0 -
Isn't he acting on his principles here?Benpointer said:
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?0 -
Winning a majority is one thing. Just suppose we have a GE and the Conservatives do win a majority. The fact of a majority won't do away with the division in the party over Brexit. PM Hunt or Johnson could have 600 MPs and it won't help at all if he finds that they're still split 50/50.Pulpstar said:
I'd have thought Tory members would want a Con majority Gov't - so what a potential PM plans to do with that majority is important.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Good evening, everyone.0 -
By the way, Mr Dancer, poisoning of foxes is not legal, and quite rightly so. Poisoning of rats is legal. No one seems to care quite so much about Mr Rattus Norvegicus as they do about Mr Charlie Vulpus. Not as apparently cuddly. I would love to see a city person try and cuddle a real one though.Nigel_Foremain said:
Oh my goodness, that last comment, who ever said it, really does show the ignorance of those who have never genuinely lived in the countrysideMorris_Dancer said:Mr. Alistair, the alternatives all have problems too, though.
Lamping can, and has, lead to human fatalities. Poison and traps sometimes work, sometimes don't, can condemn the creature (not necessarily a fox) to a lingering death. Fox hunting seems superior to all those methods.
However, the most interesting post I read here on the subject was one fellow (forget who, sorry) who suggested that dogs on farms could be an effective deterrent.0 -
Been superseded by a higher principle, by the sound of it.Benpointer said:
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?0 -
So if this "makes East Dunbartonshire vulnerable to an SNP re-gain" why won't the "No-to-Indy supporters [be] voting tactically for the strongest No candidate" next time?StuartDickson said:
IndeedTissue_Price said:
That depends, many Tory Leave voters in the seat will vote Tory or Brexit Party this time rather than tactically vote for a diehard Remainer like Swinson again even if she is pro Unioneek said:
Swinson, as newly elected LD leader in a strongly No constituency, is not going to be losing her seat to the SNP.Tissue_Price said:Swinson is more likely to lose her seat to the SNP than Corbyn is to lose his seat to the LDs or Boris lose his seat to Labour on current polls, even if the LDs make gains in England and Wales they are unlikely to do much more than tread water in Scotland.
Of course Swinson losing her seat but the LDs making gains overall (including Streatham) would be ideal for Chuka if he stands in Streatham or Twickenham as is likely
UK GE 2017, in Scotland, was primarily decided by No-to-Indy supporters voting tactically for the strongest No candidate. In East Dunbartonshire this was Jo Swinson. She benefited hugely from Con, Lab and UKIP supporters lending their votes.
While SLab voters will almost certainly stick with Swinson (indeed, there might even be even stronger tactical SLD voting from this group), the SCon tactical votes for SLD candidates will heavily unwind. East Dunbartonshire is jam-packed full of people who in England would be solid Tory voters, but due to Scottish circumstances have rarely voted for their true first preference.
This makes East Dunbartonshire vulnerable to an SNP re-gain. It will also affect the outcome in many other Scottish seats.0 -
Personally I can't get excited about foxhunting and I generally frown upon governments banning things.
My take is that if rich people want to get dolled up like a ploughmans lunch and go galloping across the fields with their hounds on a Saturday afternoon then who am I to judge.
However, repealling the hunting ban in clearly a "second term" project if/when the Tories win a large or landslide majority.
Until that point they should stay well clear of the whole subject... Especially after the 2017 election disaster...
It's a major slip up from Hunt.0 -
Not really, he voted Tory in 2015 and 2017 which included this manifesto commitment in 2015.RobD said:
Isn't he acting on his principles here?Benpointer said:
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?
'[To] give Parliament the opportunity to repeal the Hunting Act on a free vote, with a government bill in government time.'0 -
Yet Big_G was presumably happy to vote Conservative in 2017 despite their manifesto including a further vote to repeal the hunting ban.Endillion said:
Been superseded by a higher principle, by the sound of it.Benpointer said:
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?0 -
Animal welfare isn't an issue of principle?Benpointer said:
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?0 -
-
The distant past.TheScreamingEagles said:
Not really, he voted Tory in 2015 and 2017 which included this manifesto commitment in 2015.RobD said:
Isn't he acting on his principles here?Benpointer said:
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?
'[To] give Parliament the opportunity to repeal the Hunting Act on a free vote, with a government bill in government time.'
0 -
Hunt has really blown it hasn't he.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Thank you. My family have changed over the last few years and especially my grandchildren. They are much on the side of care for the planet and all the creatures and indeed one of them is now vegan.Philip_Thompson said:
I know you're not a fan of Boris, but you have your principles and taking a stand against cruelty is something to be proud of. Whether you end up voting for either Boris or Hunt, or spoil your ballot, you have my respect.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Goodbye Jeremy to our two votes and of all days, the one the ballots dropped onto our doormatPulpstar said:
Also the image of red huntsmen 'tallyhoing' through the Countryside is so bad for a modern caring conservative party. I should say I fully support drag hunting
It is likely I will vote for Boris now but I am not at all happy about it
Although I would say that almost none of the stuff either candidate talks about will happen. Not only do they not have the votes in a hung HoC, but their entire time will spent on No Deal and then a GE.0 -
The ‘burning injustice’ of people not being allowed to get food poisoning.
https://twitter.com/trussliz/status/1146755827006627840?s=210 -
RobD said:
Isn't he acting on his principles here?Benpointer said:
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?
Did he act on the same principles in the 2017 GE?0 -
How about 2017 which had a similar manifesto commitment?RobD said:
The distant past.TheScreamingEagles said:
Not really, he voted Tory in 2015 and 2017 which included this manifesto commitment in 2015.RobD said:
Isn't he acting on his principles here?Benpointer said:
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?
'[To] give Parliament the opportunity to repeal the Hunting Act on a free vote, with a government bill in government time.'0 -
So his principles require him to rank as follows:Benpointer said:
Yet Big_G was presumably happy to vote Conservative in 2017 despite their manifesto including a further vote to repeal the hunting ban.Endillion said:
Been superseded by a higher principle, by the sound of it.Benpointer said:
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?
May -> Corbyn and Johnson (in some order) -> Hunt
What's the problem? I don't understand it (at all), but it seems at least logically coherent, if not easily explicable without (presumably) some missing context that seems to be none of our business.0 -
'These are my principles - if you don't like them, I have others.'RobD said:
The distant past.TheScreamingEagles said:
Not really, he voted Tory in 2015 and 2017 which included this manifesto commitment in 2015.RobD said:
Isn't he acting on his principles here?Benpointer said:
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?
'[To] give Parliament the opportunity to repeal the Hunting Act on a free vote, with a government bill in government time.'
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Boris needs to be a bit careful here, hunting is still going to be popular with plenty of Tory members I think. OTOH to the wider electorate it's an absolubte no no.0
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I think it is fine for people to change their minds.Benpointer said:
'These are my principles - if you don't like them, I have others.'RobD said:
The distant past.TheScreamingEagles said:
Not really, he voted Tory in 2015 and 2017 which included this manifesto commitment in 2015.RobD said:
Isn't he acting on his principles here?Benpointer said:
Sadly Big_G, it feels like you have been softening your line on Boris for weeks and this is just the excuse you need to vote for him.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I dont disagree with any of that but Hunt has lost my voteMorris_Dancer said:Mr. NorthWales, I'd just say that Hunt's comments (foolish as they were) only apply if the Conservatives have a majority. And they don't.
Boris is an incompetent who breaks promises at will, whose ambition and ego is the sun around which everything else revolves. He was an utter failure as a Cabinet minister and there's no reason to think he'll be other than horrendous as PM.
How many times have you posted on here that you and Mrs G would never vote for him?... and yet now you are going to.
What's happened to your principles?
'[To] give Parliament the opportunity to repeal the Hunting Act on a free vote, with a government bill in government time.'0 -
Wow. Boris is p*ssing all over Theresa's legacy, but it just shows that he's politically invincible. This is no different to Cameron saying he'd re-nationalize BT. The difference being that the membership would have strung Dave up; with Boris they adore him even more for it.DecrepitJohnL said:
Boris is trolling the evil Tories who cut 20,000 bobbies in the first place.Pulpstar said:Here's an important tweet perhaps... https://twitter.com/sajidjavid/status/1146666772222894081
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And yet in Telegraph:
"This contest is closer than you think, as Tory members switch to Jeremy Hunt"
(Rob Wilson) https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/07/04/contest-closer-think-tory-members-switch-jeremy-hunt/0 -
Mr. Glenn, I've heard some people order medium rare because they actually want rare but they also want some margin of error in case the chef cocks it up.
Morris Dancer's food is usually carbonised. Charcoal makes us stronger.0 -
My main point is about who tweeted it, the Saj with a clear signal for Boris there.Stark_Dawning said:
Wow. Boris is p*ssing all over Theresa's legacy, but it just shows that he's politically invincible. This is no different to Cameron saying he'd re-nationalize BT. The difference being that the membership would have strung Dave up; with Boris they adore him even more for it.DecrepitJohnL said:
Boris is trolling the evil Tories who cut 20,000 bobbies in the first place.Pulpstar said:Here's an important tweet perhaps... https://twitter.com/sajidjavid/status/1146666772222894081
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Tally Ho!0
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Because, since 2017, Jo Swinson has evolved from the Better Together candidate to the Bollocks To Brexit candidate. While some of her Tory tactical supporters may tolerate that, most will not.Benpointer said:
So if this "makes East Dunbartonshire vulnerable to an SNP re-gain" why won't the "No-to-Indy supporters [be] voting tactically for the strongest No candidate" next time?StuartDickson said:
IndeedTissue_Price said:
That depends, many Tory Leave voters in the seat will vote Tory or Brexit Party this time rather than tactically vote for a diehard Remainer like Swinson again even if she is pro Unioneek said:
Swinson, as newly elected LD leader in a strongly No constituency, is not going to be losing her seat to the SNP.Tissue_Price said:Swinson is more likely to lose her seat to the SNP than Corbyn is to lose his seat to the LDs or Boris lose his seat to Labour on current polls, even if the LDs make gains in England and Wales they are unlikely to do much more than tread water in Scotland.
Of course Swinson losing her seat but the LDs making gains overall (including Streatham) would be ideal for Chuka if he stands in Streatham or Twickenham as is likely
UK GE 2017, in Scotland, was primarily decided by No-to-Indy supporters voting tactically for the strongest No candidate. In East Dunbartonshire this was Jo Swinson. She benefited hugely from Con, Lab and UKIP supporters lending their votes.
While SLab voters will almost certainly stick with Swinson (indeed, there might even be even stronger tactical SLD voting from this group), the SCon tactical votes for SLD candidates will heavily unwind. East Dunbartonshire is jam-packed full of people who in England would be solid Tory voters, but due to Scottish circumstances have rarely voted for their true first preference.
This makes East Dunbartonshire vulnerable to an SNP re-gain. It will also affect the outcome in many other Scottish seats.0 -
Just voted for Ed Davey, 1ST Preference.0
