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Election in NI. Maybe...0
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Surely direct equivalnce of salaries is only half the story. A primary school teacher salary is around £25,000 a journalist with experience our friend describes about the same, according to a website I researched. That suggests that while £30k is a bit low, £40k is more like, rather than the direct comparative figure of £75k.MattW said:
@SOSouthamObserver said:
My wife and I bought our first place in London in 1992 - a two-bedroomed flat, with garden, on St John's Way N19. It cost us £60,000. Between us we were earning around £30,000 - her as a primary school teacher in her first year of work, me as a B2B journalist with about a year's experience. The same place now would cost around £400,000, our equivalent joint income would probably be around £45,000.John_M said:
My daughter is 24. I've first hand experience of how hard it is to be young now.The_Apocalypse said:It's also nice to see some recognition on this site that being young right now is not so easy. I've seen far too many people dismiss all young people 'snowflakes'.
At the risk of being accused of 'yesbuttery', I do think that being young is always difficult, in every generation. It's the nature of the problem that varies.
When one lacks experience, assets (and often, but not always) earning power, life is tough. I shall spare you any Four Yorkshireman anecdotes from my youth (or my fathers, or his and so on).
In Leamington Spa, my eldest son, who is a 26 year-old graduate, takes home around £1,000 a month. The rent on a one bedroom flat is £600-£700 pcm.
Something will eventually give.
I think you are a long way out on your numbers.
A combined income of 30k in 1992 is worth 75k now (not 45k) on average earnings increases.
https://www.measuringworth.com/ukearncpi/
On a 400k property that would give you a potential mortgage of 350k with the Halifax, which would let you buy pretty much anywhere outside zone 1, depending on the property you wanted.
And there is Help to Buy, 5% deposits etc.
Even on the average London salary each you would have a lot of scope.0 -
A rating of 28% from ICM – under present circumstances – is not too bad for Labour and matches its highest level with this pollster since late August. Going back as far as 1997 ICM has tended to give Labour a lower rating than most pollsters – and has usually been better for the LibDems. No real sign of the latter in this poll. On the whole if ICM has Labour at 28% I would expect other pollsters to have them on 30% plus.Since late November YouGov appears to have taken up the mantle of recording the the lowest Labour vote shares – despite having been the only pollster in this Parliament to have produced a Labour lead – last April being the most recent.0
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That's far too contentious a question for me to answer in my new, very mellow 2017 mooddavid_herdson said:
This was the same Balfour of the Balfour Declaration. Was that in the 'didn't matter at all' or 'didn't matter very much' category?John_M said:
I'm afraid that I've adopted Arthur Balfour's dictum - "Nothing matters very much, and few things matter at all". It's yet another tiny storm in a minuscule teacup.The_Apocalypse said:
I said in a previous post that if a Trump supporting celeb did the same then I wouldn't criticise his right to do it.Casino_Royale said:
I think we understand the views of the liberal-Left very well on this: it's all ok because agree with them.
All other points can jog on.
. I shall borrow Mao's famous (and erroneous) quote and claim that it's too early to tell. 0 -
Well it's interesting to know there are quite a few Republicans who don't fit the stereotype. The only contact I've really had with GOPers is online and they generally fit the stereotype to some degree or another. Their views are more closely aligned with Paul Ryan then they are with Colin Powell.SouthamObserver said:West Coast Republicans are a different breed to Republicans elsewhere in my experience.
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How do I find you on Amazon?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. F, can't comment much (don't have experience of phenomenal sales) but it seems to largely be random. Do people like the cover, or the title? Does your book get bought by a lovely big mouth with a huge social circle who always bangs on about the books they buy?
Anyway, working on various novels, but after they're done I may try a serial approach. Something like bundling three chapters together for 99p, then giving three away, then three for 99p, and, at the end, releasing a full book. E-books to create downwards pricing pressure but also make serials more viable.0 -
I know what London-based B2B journos with one years experience get because I employ them! It's £22,00 to £25,000. I am guessing first year primary school teachers get about the same. Between then they definitely don't get close to £75,000.MattW said:
@SOSouthamObserver said:
My wife and I bought our first place in London in 1992 - a two-bedroomed flat, with garden, on St John's Way N19. It cost us £60,000. Between us we were earning around £30,000 - her as a primary school teacher in her first year of work, me as a B2B journalist with about a year's experience. The same place now would cost around £400,000, our equivalent joint income would probably be around £45,000.John_M said:
My daughter is 24. I've first hand experience of how hard it is to be young now.The_Apocalypse said:It's also nice to see some recognition on this site that being young right now is not so easy. I've seen far too many people dismiss all young people 'snowflakes'.
At the risk of being accused of 'yesbuttery', I do think that being young is always difficult, in every generation. It's the nature of the problem that varies.
When one lacks experience, assets (and often, but not always) earning power, life is tough. I shall spare you any Four Yorkshireman anecdotes from my youth (or my fathers, or his and so on).
In Leamington Spa, my eldest son, who is a 26 year-old graduate, takes home around £1,000 a month. The rent on a one bedroom flat is £600-£700 pcm.
Something will eventually give.
I think you are a long way out on your numbers.
A combined income of 30k in 1992 is worth 75k now (not 45k) on average earnings increases.
https://www.measuringworth.com/ukearncpi/
On a 400k property that would give you a potential mortgage of 350k with the Halifax, which would let you buy pretty much anywhere outside zone 1, depending on the property you wanted.
And there is Help to Buy, 5% deposits etc.
Even on the average London salary each you would have a lot of scope.
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Mr. Royale, right here:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Thaddeus-White/e/B008C6RU98/
Cheers. Got a short in a fantasy anthology due around 15 February, so hoping that might spur some more Kingdom Asunder sales (differently world, but still).0 -
Wasn’t the quotee Chou En Lai?John_M said:
That's far too contentious a question for me to answer in my new, very mellow 2017 mooddavid_herdson said:
This was the same Balfour of the Balfour Declaration. Was that in the 'didn't matter at all' or 'didn't matter very much' category?John_M said:
I'm afraid that I've adopted Arthur Balfour's dictum - "Nothing matters very much, and few things matter at all". It's yet another tiny storm in a minuscule teacup.The_Apocalypse said:
I said in a previous post that if a Trump supporting celeb did the same then I wouldn't criticise his right to do it.Casino_Royale said:
I think we understand the views of the liberal-Left very well on this: it's all ok because agree with them.
All other points can jog on.. I shall borrow Mao's famous (and erroneous) quote and claim that it's too early to tell.0 -
My wife loves fantasy, but needs a love story. So she likes Secrets of Shambala (?) and Everman Saga etc.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Royale, right here:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Thaddeus-White/e/B008C6RU98/
Cheers. Got a short in a fantasy anthology due around 15 February, so hoping that might spur some more Kingdom Asunder sales (differently world, but still).
You got that in amongst beheading demons? ;-)0 -
Also, mortgage interest rates in 1992 were about 12%; today, they're about 3%. So while a £650 pm payment would service a £137k 25yr mortgage at 3%, it would only pay for a £61700 25yr mortgage at 12%.MattW said:
@SOSouthamObserver said:
My wife and I bought our first place in London in 1992 - a two-bedroomed flat, with garden, on St John's Way N19. It cost us £60,000. Between us we were earning around £30,000 - her as a primary school teacher in her first year of work, me as a B2B journalist with about a year's experience. The same place now would cost around £400,000, our equivalent joint income would probably be around £45,000.John_M said:
My daughter is 24. I've first hand experience of how hard it is to be young now.The_Apocalypse said:It's also nice to see some recognition on this site that being young right now is not so easy. I've seen far too many people dismiss all young people 'snowflakes'.
At the risk of being accused of 'yesbuttery', I do think that being young is always difficult, in every generation. It's the nature of the problem that varies.
When one lacks experience, assets (and often, but not always) earning power, life is tough. I shall spare you any Four Yorkshireman anecdotes from my youth (or my fathers, or his and so on).
In Leamington Spa, my eldest son, who is a 26 year-old graduate, takes home around £1,000 a month. The rent on a one bedroom flat is £600-£700 pcm.
Something will eventually give.
I think you are a long way out on your numbers.
A combined income of 30k in 1992 is worth 75k now (not 45k) on average earnings increases.
https://www.measuringworth.com/ukearncpi/
On a 400k property that would give you a potential mortgage of 350k with the Halifax, which would let you buy pretty much anywhere outside zone 1, depending on the property you wanted.
And there is Help to Buy, 5% deposits etc.
Even on the average London salary each you would have a lot of scope.
The fall in interest rates has prompted prices to rise to more than double what they otherwise would have been, for the same (current) affordability.0 -
Thank link suggests that overall book sales are up 30% since the collapse of the Net Book Agreement so why does that cause just 900 copies to be sold?SeanT said:
Decline in sales is the major factor. And the ending of the Net Book Agreement, which guaranteed decent royalties from quite expensive books, and kept lots of little bookshops openStark_Dawning said:
So why is that? Is no one reading them any more, or do people just by them second hand for £0.1p (+P&P) off of Amazon?SeanT said:
Average earnings for all writers - journalists to novelists - are in pretty steep decline.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. T, not checked, but my understanding is that the average earnings for writers are declining. Obviously there are successful chaps such as yourself and the odd megastar (like JK Rowling) but mostly it's very difficult indeed.
It's an unusual place to be, psychologically, when your book sales are not quite where they might be (to be polite) but the reviews are mostly 5*...
I was having this debate with a novelist friend of mine at the weekend.
It is now almost impossible to to live solely as a writer of literary fiction, unless you 1. WIN a major prize, or 2. are already famous (e.g. Ian McEwan). If you write commercial fiction you have to get your book into the supermarkets - Tesco, Asda etc. That's all there is to it. If you don't, you won't make enough money. Yes the odd miracle happens in self publishing but that's what it is: miraculous. 1 in a million.
My friend is an example. Twenty years ago she was making £30,000 a year writing literary fiction. She's good. She's been Orange shortlisted. It wasn't huge money but it was very liveable.
Her latest novel got Costa shortlisted, and it sold... 900 copies. Accruing royalties of £1000? It took her a year or two to write. No one will now publish her, even though she's very well respected. She's flat broke.
An entire artistic eco-system has crashed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_Book_Agreement
To be fair "literary" authors themselves are partly guilty. They tend to look down on plots and plotting as belonging to "genre" fiction - thrillers, detective fiction, sci fi. You can get away with a plotless novel if you are James Joyce, or maybe Martin Amis, but most writers aren't Joyce or Amis. So their plotless novels go unread.
And now I must go and do some plotting, myself.
Is it that we're reading more books but they're all from the same few authors rather than diverse ones?0 -
You're assuming interest only which is going to affect your calculation. Not that the point is affected.david_herdson said:
Also, mortgage interest rates in 1992 were about 12%; today, they're about 3%. So while a £650 pm payment would service a £137k 25yr mortgage at 3%, it would only pay for a £61700 25yr mortgage at 12%.MattW said:
@SOSouthamObserver said:
My wife and I bought our first place in London in 1992 - a two-bedroomed flat, with garden, on St John's Way N19. It cost us £60,000. Between us we were earning around £30,000 - her as a primary school teacher in her first year of work, me as a B2B journalist with about a year's experience. The same place now would cost around £400,000, our equivalent joint income would probably be around £45,000.John_M said:
My daughter is 24. I've first hand experience of how hard it is to be young now.The_Apocalypse said:It's also nice to see some recognition on this site that being young right now is not so easy. I've seen far too many people dismiss all young people 'snowflakes'.
At the risk of being accused of 'yesbuttery', I do think that being young is always difficult, in every generation. It's the nature of the problem that varies.
When one lacks experience, assets (and often, but not always) earning power, life is tough. I shall spare you any Four Yorkshireman anecdotes from my youth (or my fathers, or his and so on).
In Leamington Spa, my eldest son, who is a 26 year-old graduate, takes home around £1,000 a month. The rent on a one bedroom flat is £600-£700 pcm.
Something will eventually give.
I think you are a long way out on your numbers.
A combined income of 30k in 1992 is worth 75k now (not 45k) on average earnings increases.
https://www.measuringworth.com/ukearncpi/
On a 400k property that would give you a potential mortgage of 350k with the Halifax, which would let you buy pretty much anywhere outside zone 1, depending on the property you wanted.
And there is Help to Buy, 5% deposits etc.
Even on the average London salary each you would have a lot of scope.
The fall in interest rates has prompted prices to rise to more than double what they otherwise would have been, for the same (current) affordability.0 -
Plus the effect of the squeeze on public sector salaries. My teacher grandson and his girlfriend, looking to buy a house this year (not in London) expect a rise of 1%. A rise in mortgage rates could quite easily become crippling.david_herdson said:
Also, mortgage interest rates in 1992 were about 12%; today, they're about 3%. So while a £650 pm payment would service a £137k 25yr mortgage at 3%, it would only pay for a £61700 25yr mortgage at 12%.MattW said:
@SOSouthamObserver said:
My wife and I bought our first place in London in 1992 - a two-bedroomed flat, with garden, on St John's Way N19. It cost us £60,000. Between us we were earning around £30,000 - her as a primary school teacher in her first year of work, me as a B2B journalist with about a year's experience. The same place now would cost around £400,000, our equivalent joint income would probably be around £45,000.John_M said:
My daughter is 24. I've first hand experience of how hard it is to be young now.The_Apocalypse said:It's also nice to see some recognition on this site that being young right now is not so easy. I've seen far too many people dismiss all young people 'snowflakes'.
At the risk of being accused of 'yesbuttery', I do think that being young is always difficult, in every generation. It's the nature of the problem that varies.
When one lacks experience, assets (and often, but not always) earning power, life is tough. I shall spare you any Four Yorkshireman anecdotes from my youth (or my fathers, or his and so on).
In Leamington Spa, my eldest son, who is a 26 year-old graduate, takes home around £1,000 a month. The rent on a one bedroom flat is £600-£700 pcm.
Something will eventually give.
I think you are a long way out on your numbers.
A combined income of 30k in 1992 is worth 75k now (not 45k) on average earnings increases.
https://www.measuringworth.com/ukearncpi/
On a 400k property that would give you a potential mortgage of 350k with the Halifax, which would let you buy pretty much anywhere outside zone 1, depending on the property you wanted.
And there is Help to Buy, 5% deposits etc.
Even on the average London salary each you would have a lot of scope.
The fall in interest rates has prompted prices to rise to more than double what they otherwise would have been, for the same (current) affordability.0 -
Mr. Royale, there's a spot of romance in Kingdom Asunder. Both straight and lesbian (because I believe in diversity). There's more treachery and murder, though, the frisky relationships are an undercurrent rather than the meat of the story.
If we're using a broad and politically incorrect definition of romance, the Adventures of Sir Edric would be the way to go. Flashman meets Blackadder in fantasyland, essentially. His long term girlfriend's an S&M enthusiast (only a brief appearance in the above book, but she'll have a major role in the next - because I support alternative lifestyles).0 -
Yes, that's a good point. Having a view is fine, but how you say it is very important if you want it to have the maximum effect in influencing others.isam said:TV and film stars are entitled to their opinions and to express them via the platforms they have. They did so before our referendum and the USA election.
But they, and those who welcome/share their views, are often the ones complaining about "divided society", and their comments don't help to heal that division. It makes me think the only options they will consider are
(a) Their vision of society (which Trump & Brexit voters have just shown to be unacceptable to them)
(b) A divided society, where they cry and moan that its not run by them anymore
Never (c) accept the decision and try to make things better
Too often I think some individuals are more interested in feeling good about themselves through demonising the other, rather than endeavouring to win others round to their point of view.0 -
*slaps forehead* of course! My apologies.OldKingCole said:
Wasn’t the quotee Chou En Lai?John_M said:
That's far too contentious a question for me to answer in my new, very mellow 2017 mooddavid_herdson said:
This was the same Balfour of the Balfour Declaration. Was that in the 'didn't matter at all' or 'didn't matter very much' category?John_M said:
I'm afraid that I've adopted Arthur Balfour's dictum - "Nothing matters very much, and few things matter at all". It's yet another tiny storm in a minuscule teacup.The_Apocalypse said:
I said in a previous post that if a Trump supporting celeb did the same then I wouldn't criticise his right to do it.Casino_Royale said:
I think we understand the views of the liberal-Left very well on this: it's all ok because agree with them.
All other points can jog on.. I shall borrow Mao's famous (and erroneous) quote and claim that it's too early to tell.0 -
I don't have Kindle. Will there be a paperback?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Royale, there's a spot of romance in Kingdom Asunder. Both straight and lesbian (because I believe in diversity). There's more treachery and murder, though, the frisky relationships are an undercurrent rather than the meat of the story.
If we're using a broad and politically incorrect definition of romance, the Adventures of Sir Edric would be the way to go. Flashman meets Blackadder in fantasyland, essentially. His long term girlfriend's an S&M enthusiast (only a brief appearance in the above book, but she'll have a major role in the next - because I support alternative lifestyles).0 -
No I'm not. They're the back-of-an-envelope repayment figures. 3% interest-only on £137k is £342 pm, though obviously that's not going to pay the mortgage off by itself unless you're relying on capital appreciation and are willing to sell at the end (which a lender won't allow for a primary residence).TheWhiteRabbit said:
You're assuming interest only which is going to affect your calculation. Not that the point is affected.david_herdson said:
Also, mortgage interest rates in 1992 were about 12%; today, they're about 3%. So while a £650 pm payment would service a £137k 25yr mortgage at 3%, it would only pay for a £61700 25yr mortgage at 12%.MattW said:
@SOSouthamObserver said:
My wife and I bought our first place in London in 1992 - a two-bedroomed flat, with garden, on St John's Way N19. It cost us £60,000. Between us we were earning around £30,000 - her as a primary school teacher in her first year of work, me as a B2B journalist with about a year's experience. The same place now would cost around £400,000, our equivalent joint income would probably be around £45,000.John_M said:
My daughter is 24. I've first hand experience of how hard it is to be young now.The_Apocalypse said:It's also nice to see some recognition on this site that being young right now is not so easy. I've seen far too many people dismiss all young people 'snowflakes'.
At the risk of being accused of 'yesbuttery', I do think that being young is always difficult, in every generation. It's the nature of the problem that varies.
When one lacks experience, assets (and often, but not always) earning power, life is tough. I shall spare you any Four Yorkshireman anecdotes from my youth (or my fathers, or his and so on).
In Leamington Spa, my eldest son, who is a 26 year-old graduate, takes home around £1,000 a month. The rent on a one bedroom flat is £600-£700 pcm.
Something will eventually give.
I think you are a long way out on your numbers.
A combined income of 30k in 1992 is worth 75k now (not 45k) on average earnings increases.
https://www.measuringworth.com/ukearncpi/
On a 400k property that would give you a potential mortgage of 350k with the Halifax, which would let you buy pretty much anywhere outside zone 1, depending on the property you wanted.
And there is Help to Buy, 5% deposits etc.
Even on the average London salary each you would have a lot of scope.
The fall in interest rates has prompted prices to rise to more than double what they otherwise would have been, for the same (current) affordability.0 -
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The kind of individuals that mock the disabled?Casino_Royale said:
Yes, that's a good point. Having a view is fine, but how you say it is very important if you want it to have the maximum effect in influencing others.isam said:TV and film stars are entitled to their opinions and to express them via the platforms they have. They did so before our referendum and the USA election.
But they, and those who welcome/share their views, are often the ones complaining about "divided society", and their comments don't help to heal that division. It makes me think the only options they will consider are
(a) Their vision of society (which Trump & Brexit voters have just shown to be unacceptable to them)
(b) A divided society, where they cry and moan that its not run by them anymore
Never (c) accept the decision and try to make things better
Too often I think some individuals are more interested in feeling good about themselves through demonising the other, rather than endeavouring to win others round to their point of view.
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I wonder if pirating is an issue. It's extremely easy to download copies of popular books online.Philip_Thompson said:
Thank link suggests that overall book sales are up 30% since the collapse of the Net Book Agreement so why does that cause just 900 copies to be sold?SeanT said:
Decline in sales is the major factor. And the ending of the Net Book Agreement, which guaranteed decent royalties from quite expensive books, and kept lots of little bookshops openStark_Dawning said:
So why is that? Is no one reading them any more, or do people just by them second hand for £0.1p (+P&P) off of Amazon?SeanT said:
Average earnings for all writers - journalists to novelists - are in pretty steep decline.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. T, not checked, but my understanding is that the average earnings for writers are declining. Obviously there are successful chaps such as yourself and the odd megastar (like JK Rowling) but mostly it's very difficult indeed.
It's an unusual place to be, psychologically, when your book sales are not quite where they might be (to be polite) but the reviews are mostly 5*...
I was having this debate with a novelist friend of mine at the weekend.
It is now almost impossible to to live solely as a writer of literary fiction, unless you 1. WIN a major prize, or 2. are already famous (e.g. Ian McEwan). If you write commercial fiction you have to get your book into the supermarkets - Tesco, Asda etc. That's all there is to it. If you don't, you won't make enough money. Yes the odd miracle happens in self publishing but that's what it is: miraculous. 1 in a million.
My friend is an example. Twenty years ago she was making £30,000 a year writing literary fiction. She's good. She's been Orange shortlisted. It wasn't huge money but it was very liveable.
Her latest novel got Costa shortlisted, and it sold... 900 copies. Accruing royalties of £1000? It took her a year or two to write. No one will now publish her, even though she's very well respected. She's flat broke.
An entire artistic eco-system has crashed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_Book_Agreement
To be fair "literary" authors themselves are partly guilty. They tend to look down on plots and plotting as belonging to "genre" fiction - thrillers, detective fiction, sci fi. You can get away with a plotless novel if you are James Joyce, or maybe Martin Amis, but most writers aren't Joyce or Amis. So their plotless novels go unread.
And now I must go and do some plotting, myself.
Is it that we're reading more books but they're all from the same few authors rather than diverse ones?0 -
I think it's a matter of discoverability. According to Wikipedia, there were 184,000 novels published in the UK in 2011. That's huge. I would never have read any of Sean's or Mr Dancer's novels had I not frequented this forum. There's simply too much choice.Philip_Thompson said:
Thank link suggests that overall book sales are up 30% since the collapse of the Net Book Agreement so why does that cause just 900 copies to be sold?SeanT said:
Decline in sales is the major factor. And the ending of the Net Book Agreement, which guaranteed decent royalties from quite expensive books, and kept lots of little bookshops openStark_Dawning said:
So why is that? Is no one reading them any more, or do people just by them second hand for £0.1p (+P&P) off of Amazon?SeanT said:
Average earnings for all writers - journalists to novelists - are in pretty steep decline.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. T, not checked, but my understanding is that the average earnings for writers are declining. Obviously there are successful chaps such as yourself and the odd megastar (like JK Rowling) but mostly it's very difficult indeed.
It's an unusual place to be, psychologically, when your book sales are not quite where they might be (to be polite) but the reviews are mostly 5*...
I was having this debate with a novelist friend of mine at the weekend.
It is now almost impossible to to live solely as a writer of literary fiction, unless you 1. WIN a major prize, or 2. are already famous (e.g. Ian McEwan). If you write commercial fiction you have to get your book into the supermarkets - Tesco, Asda etc. That's all there is to it. If you don't, you won't make enough money. Yes the odd miracle happens in self publishing but that's what it is: miraculous. 1 in a million.
My friend is an example. Twenty years ago she was making £30,000 a year writing literary fiction. She's good. She's been Orange shortlisted. It wasn't huge money but it was very liveable.
Her latest novel got Costa shortlisted, and it sold... 900 copies. Accruing royalties of £1000? It took her a year or two to write. No one will now publish her, even though she's very well respected. She's flat broke.
An entire artistic eco-system has crashed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_Book_Agreement
To be fair "literary" authors themselves are partly guilty. They tend to look down on plots and plotting as belonging to "genre" fiction - thrillers, detective fiction, sci fi. You can get away with a plotless novel if you are James Joyce, or maybe Martin Amis, but most writers aren't Joyce or Amis. So their plotless novels go unread.
And now I must go and do some plotting, myself.
Is it that we're reading more books but they're all from the same few authors rather than diverse ones?0 -
On top of that there are tons of stories published for free online and fanfictions.John_M said:
I think it's a matter of discoverability. According to Wikipedia, there were 184,000 novels published in the UK in 2011. That's huge. I would never have read any of Sean's or Mr Dancer's novels had I not frequented this forum. There's simply too much choice.Philip_Thompson said:
Thank link suggests that overall book sales are up 30% since the collapse of the Net Book Agreement so why does that cause just 900 copies to be sold?SeanT said:
Decline in sales is the major factor. And the ending of the Net Book Agreement, which guaranteed decent royalties from quite expensive books, and kept lots of little bookshops openStark_Dawning said:
So why is that? Is no one reading them any more, or do people just by them second hand for £0.1p (+P&P) off of Amazon?SeanT said:
Average earnings for all writers - journalists to novelists - are in pretty steep decline.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. T, not checked, but my understanding is that the average earnings for writers are declining. Obviously there are successful chaps such as yourself and the odd megastar (like JK Rowling) but mostly it's very difficult indeed.
It's an unusual place to be, psychologically, when your book sales are not quite where they might be (to be polite) but the reviews are mostly 5*...
I was having this debate with a novelist friend of mine at the weekend.
It is now almost impossible to to live solely as a writer of literary fiction, unless you 1. WIN a major prize, or 2. are already famous (e.g. Ian McEwan). If you write commercial fiction you have to get your book into the supermarkets - Tesco, Asda etc. That's all there is to it. If you don't, you won't make enough money. Yes the odd miracle happens in self publishing but that's what it is: miraculous. 1 in a million.
My friend is an example. Twenty years ago she was making £30,000 a year writing literary fiction. She's good. She's been Orange shortlisted. It wasn't huge money but it was very liveable.
Her latest novel got Costa shortlisted, and it sold... 900 copies. Accruing royalties of £1000? It took her a year or two to write. No one will now publish her, even though she's very well respected. She's flat broke.
An entire artistic eco-system has crashed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_Book_Agreement
And now I must go and do some plotting, myself.
Is it that we're reading more books but they're all from the same few authors rather than diverse ones?0 -
We had a two year fixed rate mortgage at 12%!! But it was interest only.david_herdson said:
Also, mortgage interest rates in 1992 were about 12%; today, they're about 3%. So while a £650 pm payment would service a £137k 25yr mortgage at 3%, it would only pay for a £61700 25yr mortgage at 12%.MattW said:
@SOSouthamObserver said:
My wife and I bought our first place in London in 1992 - a two-bedroomed flat, with garden, on St John's Way N19. It cost us £60,000. Between us we were earning around £30,000 - her as a primary school teacher in her first year of work, me as a B2B journalist with about a year's experience. The same place now would cost around £400,000, our equivalent joint income would probably be around £45,000.John_M said:
My daughter is 24. I've first hand experience of how hard it is to be young now.The_Apocalypse said:It's also nice to see some recognition on this site that being young right now is not so easy. I've seen far too many people dismiss all young people 'snowflakes'.
At the risk of being accused of 'yesbuttery', I do think that being young is always difficult, in every generation. It's the nature of the problem that varies.
When one lacks experience, assets (and often, but not always) earning power, life is tough. I shall spare you any Four Yorkshireman anecdotes from my youth (or my fathers, or his and so on).
In Leamington Spa, my eldest son, who is a 26 year-old graduate, takes home around £1,000 a month. The rent on a one bedroom flat is £600-£700 pcm.
Something will eventually give.
I think you are a long way out on your numbers.
A combined income of 30k in 1992 is worth 75k now (not 45k) on average earnings increases.
https://www.measuringworth.com/ukearncpi/
On a 400k property that would give you a potential mortgage of 350k with the Halifax, which would let you buy pretty much anywhere outside zone 1, depending on the property you wanted.
And there is Help to Buy, 5% deposits etc.
Even on the average London salary each you would have a lot of scope.
The fall in interest rates has prompted prices to rise to more than double what they otherwise would have been, for the same (current) affordability.
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I'll rely on an accountant to do the maths but that's more or less minimum wage level I'd have thought. There may be a reason for taking the job but should he be considering renting a flat on his own?SouthamObserver said:
My wife and I bought our first place in London in 1992 - a two-bedroomed flat, with garden, on St John's Way N19. It cost us £60,000. Between us we were earning around £30,000 - her as a primary school teacher in her first year of work, me as a B2B journalist with about a year's experience. The same place now would cost around £400,000, our equivalent joint income would probably be around £45,000.John_M said:
My daughter is 24. I've first hand experience of how hard it is to be young now.The_Apocalypse said:It's also nice to see some recognition on this site that being young right now is not so easy. I've seen far too many people dismiss all young people 'snowflakes'.
At the risk of being accused of 'yesbuttery', I do think that being young is always difficult, in every generation. It's the nature of the problem that varies.
When one lacks experience, assets (and often, but not always) earning power, life is tough. I shall spare you any Four Yorkshireman anecdotes from my youth (or my fathers, or his and so on).
In Leamington Spa, my eldest son, who is a 26 year-old graduate, takes home around £1,000 a month. The rent on a one bedroom flat is £600-£700 pcm.
Something will eventually give.0 -
That would explain sales being down not sales being up.Sean_F said:
I wonder if pirating is an issue. It's extremely easy to download copies of popular books online.Philip_Thompson said:
Thank link suggests that overall book sales are up 30% since the collapse of the Net Book Agreement so why does that cause just 900 copies to be sold?SeanT said:
Decline in sales is the major factor. And the ending of the Net Book Agreement, which guaranteed decent royalties from quite expensive books, and kept lots of little bookshops openStark_Dawning said:
So why is that? Is no one reading them any more, or do people just by them second hand for £0.1p (+P&P) off of Amazon?SeanT said:
Average earnings for all writers - journalists to novelists - are in pretty steep decline.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. T, not checked, but my understanding is that the average earnings for writers are declining. Obviously there are successful chaps such as yourself and the odd megastar (like JK Rowling) but mostly it's very difficult indeed.
It's an unusual place to be, psychologically, when your book sales are not quite where they might be (to be polite) but the reviews are mostly 5*...
I was having this debate with a novelist friend of mine at the weekend.
It is now almost impossible to to live solely as a writer of literary fiction, unless you 1. WIN a major prize, or 2. are already famous (e.g. Ian McEwan). If you write commercial fiction you have to get your book into the supermarkets - Tesco, Asda etc. That's all there is to it. If you don't, you won't make enough money. Yes the odd miracle happens in self publishing but that's what it is: miraculous. 1 in a million.
My friend is an example. Twenty years ago she was making £30,000 a year writing literary fiction. She's good. She's been Orange shortlisted. It wasn't huge money but it was very liveable.
Her latest novel got Costa shortlisted, and it sold... 900 copies. Accruing royalties of £1000? It took her a year or two to write. No one will now publish her, even though she's very well respected. She's flat broke.
An entire artistic eco-system has crashed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_Book_Agreement
To be fair "literary" authors themselves are partly guilty. They tend to look down on plots and plotting as belonging to "genre" fiction - thrillers, detective fiction, sci fi. You can get away with a plotless novel if you are James Joyce, or maybe Martin Amis, but most writers aren't Joyce or Amis. So their plotless novels go unread.
And now I must go and do some plotting, myself.
Is it that we're reading more books but they're all from the same few authors rather than diverse ones?0 -
The key word in my sentence was some. You conflated this to take me saying 'all'. It would prevent the need to fly off the rhetorical handle if you didn't conflate.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't agree it's an 'offence', nor that they are 'hijacking' the awards ceremony. Yes, there are plenty of ways for a celeb to express their view - but awards ceremony will obviously get their views the most attention.MarkHopkins said:
Repeating an offence doesn't make it all ok.
If the actor wants to make an announcement, they have plenty of ways to do that. Hijacking a ceremony because they feel entitled to do so, is not a pleasant way to do it.
@SeanT I shouldn't be surprised that dating millennials is the way you've managed to hear of the obstacles facing young people! But it was interesting to hear about your experience when you were young. Sounds pretty exciting!
@Mortimer I don't agree that this generation has a 'snowflakeness' when it comes to politics. As someone who graduated from uni this year, hardly anyone I knew seriously talked about safe spaces or triggering. Most on political issues - during seminars or outside of uni - were a genuine debate with a range of views expressed. I have Conservatives in my own family and I don't tell them that I need a safe space every time I disagree with them.
A few young people in the headlines don't represent us all. When you look at the Labour leadership election last year for example, Owen Smith actually won 18-24 group - which rather disproves the idea that every young person is the Corbyn supporting tumblr cliche.
As an example of my 'some' argument, when I was at Oxford (05-08) the Rhodes Must Fallers would have been laughed out of town. Not taken as seriously as they were just last year.
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It is the 'hardly anyone I knew' comment that worries me.MattW said:
That is very fair comment.The_Apocalypse said:
@Mortimer I don't agree that this generation has a 'snowflakeness' when it comes to politics. As someone who graduated from uni this year, hardly anyone I knew seriously talked about safe spaces or triggering. Most on political issues - during seminars or outside of uni - were a genuine debate with a range of views expressed. I have Conservatives in my own family and I don't tell them that I need a safe space every time I disagree with them.
Safe space trigger happies are funny, but if I have a serious concern it is with the academics and university leaderships who are willing to pander to them.
The caving in of Oxford University to the Rhodes Must Fall goofballs was just embarrassing.
I'm only a few (well, maybe a few^3) years older than Ms Apocalypse, and when I was at Uni no-one i knew talked about safe spaces or triggering. We had actual debate, all the time. If you didn't like it, you left the room. You didn't shout down others.0 -
Looks like a free £11 for those who wont miss £1200 for the next 5 years or so.. or are already heavily involved in the market in which case the funds are already tied up I guessMikeSmithson said:0 -
POLL: Public opinion strengthens in favour of border controls as a priority over free trade;
http://www.orb-international.com/perch/resources/ombrexit-jan17.pdf
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Otherwise known as an expensive £11.isam said:
Looks like a free £11 for those who wont miss £1200 for the next 5 years or so..MikeSmithson said:0 -
Hannan as next leader would require:MikeSmithson said:
(a) TMay in post long enough for him to enter Parliament at a GE or BE, presumably after him losing the MEP gig.
(b) Hannan to want to carry on in politics.
(c) Brexit to go well enough that an arch Eurosceptic could win.
Plenty on here will doubt (c) in particular, but none of it is impossible.0 -
(Almost) apropos of nothing. One of my favourite writers (Peter Watts) has his entire backlist up on his website (rifters.com), simply because no one will publish a mid-list author's previous efforts. It does work for him commercially, as it drives sales of his current output.Sean_F said:
On top of that there are tons of stories published for free online and fanfictions.John_M said:
I think it's a matter of discoverability. According to Wikipedia, there were 184,000 novels published in the UK in 2011. That's huge. I would never have read any of Sean's or Mr Dancer's novels had I not frequented this forum. There's simply too much choice.Philip_Thompson said:
Thank link suggests that overall book sales are up 30% since the collapse of the Net Book Agreement so why does that cause just 900 copies to be sold?SeanT said:
Decline in sales is the major factor. And the ending of the Net Book Agreement, which guaranteed decent royalties from quite expensive books, and kept lots of little bookshops openStark_Dawning said:
So why is that? Is no one reading them any more, or do people just by them second hand for £0.1p (+P&P) off of Amazon?SeanT said:
Average earnings for all writers - journalists to novelists - are in pretty steep decline.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. T, not checked, but my understanding is that the average earnings for writers are declining. Obviously there are successful chaps such as yourself and the odd megastar (like JK Rowling) but mostly it's very difficult indeed.
It's an unusual place to be, psychologically, when your book sales are not quite where they might be (to be polite) but the reviews are mostly 5*...
I was having this debate with a novelist friend of mine at the weekend.
An entire artistic eco-system has crashed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_Book_Agreement
And now I must go and do some plotting, myself.
Is it that we're reading more books but they're all from the same few authors rather than diverse ones?
I will say that Mr Watts is pretty bleak - if you need cheering up, do avoid!0 -
Yes it was my favourite cartoon this year but still a long way short of Wall-ee and Belleville Rendez-VousSeanT said:
Moana was excellent - the animation is dazzling. As ever, the cartoons are best.Roger said:
I don't think you have. It's one of the thinnest years I can remember. I did enjoy Patterson though. The four or five films I liked best are unlikely to be contenders and unlike others I didn't much like 'Arrival'. I found Amy Adam's simpering performance disappointing though I liked her in Tom Ford's 'Nocturnal Animals' and I liked the film. I haven't seen La la Land yet but I like Emma Stone and Ryan Gosling and musicals so I'm hopeful. My single favourite film was Almodovar's 'Julieta' which isn't likely to win anything followed by 'Childhood of a Leader' which also isn't. Scorcese's 'Silence' was so disappointing. He forgot that watching torture isn't enough. It needs a story too!MarqueeMark said:
Roger, off topic (but on-topic for you), not looking like much to touch La La Land at the Oscars. Not seen it yet, though I have now seen most of the other films around. What a crap year! Very few films or performances of note, IMHO. I've probably enjoyed many more of the documentaries this year than the drama. Not even occasional off-beat gems that you usually find in-amongst. I watched Paterson and thought "This is exactly the same Jim Jarmusch movie I was watching 30 years ago!" I made about 40 minutes of Silence - unremittingly bleak (it starts with Jesuit priests being tortured at a natural hot-springs, and gets even bleaker after that. Why was this a Scorcese passion-project for 30 years?).Roger said:
No because I don't believe it will happen in the form she suggests. As the country starts coming apart at the seams wiser council will take control and the wise folk from Hartlepool will be sidelinedCasino_Royale said:
It's going to be a long 28 months for you, isn't it?Roger said:FPT. As everyone knows the £ has dropped another 1% (infact slightly more) against both the $ and the Euro. Mrs May was never meant to be a leader. She neither prepared for it nor is she up to it.
But surely among her vast army of civil servants there must be someone senior enough to warn her that now she's PM the briefest of burps can sent our flimsy currency flailing so why can't she just keep her big trap shut?
Be interested to hear if I have missed something!0 -
If you were entering the mkt for the first time the yes, but not if you already had a book with some big redswilliamglenn said:
Otherwise known as an expensive £11.isam said:
Looks like a free £11 for those who wont miss £1200 for the next 5 years or so..MikeSmithson said:0 -
0
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Interesting! Will fly the kite and see what happens;-)Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Royale, there's a spot of romance in Kingdom Asunder. Both straight and lesbian (because I believe in diversity). There's more treachery and murder, though, the frisky relationships are an undercurrent rather than the meat of the story.
If we're using a broad and politically incorrect definition of romance, the Adventures of Sir Edric would be the way to go. Flashman meets Blackadder in fantasyland, essentially. His long term girlfriend's an S&M enthusiast (only a brief appearance in the above book, but she'll have a major role in the next - because I support alternative lifestyles).0 -
@ the booktrade
No, I think people simply read less. I spent 20 years travelling on public transport around London and the change from people reading print to staring at smartphones was marked. There are outlier books but simply less interest. It's not helped by the collapse of retail bookstores. I dont lament the loss of the independent bookselller. I'm sure there were some who weren't sneering, patronising and otherwise customer unfriendly but they were a minority. However, in the 1990s one had Waterstones, Dillon's and Ottakars as national chains. The demise of the NBA changed the landscape - it stopped the subsidising of literary works by the Shades of Grey - and so did the rise of Amazon but simpler we appear to s becoming a post-literary (and, one feels at times, literate, society).0 -
Way back when (99-02ish) we had a group in OUSU known as the Loons who stood for elections to vaguely mock the more precious wing of left wing Oxford politics, to little effect.Mortimer said:
The key word in my sentence was some. You conflated this to take me saying 'all'. It would prevent the need to fly off the rhetorical handle if you didn't conflate.The_Apocalypse said:
I don't agree it's an 'offence', nor that they are 'hijacking' the awards ceremony. Yes, there are plenty of ways for a celeb to express their view - but awards ceremony will obviously get their views the most attention.MarkHopkins said:
Repeating an offence doesn't make it all ok.
If the actor wants to make an announcement, they have plenty of ways to do that. Hijacking a ceremony because they feel entitled to do so, is not a pleasant way to do it.
@SeanT I shouldn't be surprised that dating millennials is the way you've managed to hear of the obstacles facing young people! But it was interesting to hear about your experience when you were young. Sounds pretty exciting!
@Mortimer I don't agree that this generation has a 'snowflakeness' when it comes to politics. As someone who graduated from uni this year, hardly anyone I knew seriously talked about safe spaces or triggering. Most on political issues - during seminars or outside of uni - were a genuine debate with a range of views expressed. I have Conservatives in my own family and I don't tell them that I need a safe space every time I disagree with them.
A few young people in the headlines don't represent us all. When you look at the Labour leadership election last year for example, Owen Smith actually won 18-24 group - which rather disproves the idea that every young person is the Corbyn supporting tumblr cliche.
As an example of my 'some' argument, when I was at Oxford (05-08) the Rhodes Must Fallers would have been laughed out of town. Not taken as seriously as they were just last year.
I do think said wing took a bit of a punch to the chin when we had the pro-test shenanigans - a small but vocal minority in positions in OUSU found themselves very much in the minority in a referendum we had on animal testing at the university.
The only thing I can vaguely find concerning the Loons is this: http://www.geocities.ws/cl_o_t_s/minutes.html
Yeah. I remember them being slightly funnier.
Anyway, I agree with Mortimer.0 -
Long read by Dom Cummings on how DC and GO blew the referendum (LOOOONG read)
https://dominiccummings.wordpress.com/2017/01/09/on-the-referendum-21-branching-histories-of-the-2016-referendum-and-the-frogs-before-the-storm-2/
"Further, it was clear that Cameron/Osborne intended to run a campaign based on hysterical warnings and bogus arguments/figures while ignoring the big questions about how the EU works and its trajectory. No10 tried to turn the whole complex issue into a question about whether the economy would grow a little bit slower over the next few years – a trivial issue relative to the significance of the overall question. They are not a duo who have ever engaged the public on a serious matter in a serious way."0 -
Most of the people I know who moved to London in the late 90s/early 00s had to spend a couple of years living in what can only be described as ghettos. Swings and roundabouts.0
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Mr. F, yes, but because sales of paperbacks are, er, even worse (and margins are really tight) it'll be a little while yet. If you go for non-Kindle e-books, alternative formats are available here:
https://www.smashwords.com/profile/view/Thaddeus6th
[That's only my self-published stuff, but the traditional ones have physical formats available on Amazon anyway].
Mr. Royale, huzzah!
Edited extra extra bit: just to elaborate on margins, when Sir Edric's Temple [now contained within The Adventures...] was self-published, the e-book was $2.99 and the paperback about $8.99. I made more per copy on the e-book.0 -
1% for 5 years is not exactly excitingisam said:
Looks like a free £11 for those who wont miss £1200 for the next 5 years or so.. or are already heavily involved in the market in which case the funds are already tied up I guessMikeSmithson said:0 -
And I said that that was my exact experience at uni. I wasn't shouted down, and neither was anyone who had a diametric POV to my own. In my last year, most of my friends knew that I disliked Corbyn. And one of my friends who is a Corbynista, never shouted me down (unlike Corbynistas on twitter). Also I don't see why the Rhodes thing was so unreasonable. He's a fairly controversial figure. Certainly as someone who is a person of colour, I don't view him as 'great' by any means.Mortimer said:
It is the 'hardly anyone I knew' comment that worries me.MattW said:
That is very fair comment.The_Apocalypse said:
@Mortimer I don't agree that this generation has a 'snowflakeness' when it comes to politics. As someone who graduated from uni this year, hardly anyone I knew seriously talked about safe spaces or triggering. Most on political issues - during seminars or outside of uni - were a genuine debate with a range of views expressed. I have Conservatives in my own family and I don't tell them that I need a safe space every time I disagree with them.
Safe space trigger happies are funny, but if I have a serious concern it is with the academics and university leaderships who are willing to pander to them.
The caving in of Oxford University to the Rhodes Must Fall goofballs was just embarrassing.
I'm only a few (well, maybe a few^3) years older than Ms Apocalypse, and when I was at Uni no-one i knew talked about safe spaces or triggering. We had actual debate, all the time. If you didn't like it, you left the room. You didn't shout down others.0 -
Laying David Miliband at 20 for next Labour leader is a far better bet and would pay out in 3.5 years at most.isam said:
If you were entering the mkt for the first time the yes, but not if you already had a book with some big redswilliamglenn said:
Otherwise known as an expensive £11.isam said:
Looks like a free £11 for those who wont miss £1200 for the next 5 years or so..MikeSmithson said:
But I'm not tempted to do that either as i think i can put my money to better use elsewhere.0 -
Well I am not exactly calling it the best bet of all time, as evidenced by the fact that it is still there, hence I haven't taken it!malcolmg said:
1% for 5 years is not exactly excitingisam said:
Looks like a free £11 for those who wont miss £1200 for the next 5 years or so.. or are already heavily involved in the market in which case the funds are already tied up I guessMikeSmithson said:0 -
Of course, those who want to take a volatile approach to money can follow Morris Dancer's 2017 F1 tips. Last year saw losses at almost every race. And a 250/1 winner.0
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I am not sure that it is wise to buy *that* quickly. Primary Teacher in London is 26-28k minimum starting salary.SouthamObserver said:
I know what London-based B2B journos with one years experience get because I employ them! It's £22,00 to £25,000. I am guessing first year primary school teachers get about the same. Between then they definitely don't get close to £75,000.MattW said:
@SOSouthamObserver said:
My wife and I bought our first place in London in 1992 - a two-bedroomed flat, with garden, on St John's Way N19. It cost us £60,000. Between us we were earning around £30,000 - her as a primary school teacher in her first year of work, me as a B2B journalist with about a year's experience. The same place now would cost around £400,000, our equivalent joint income would probably be around £45,000.John_M said:
My daughter is 24. I've first hand experience of how hard it is to be young now.The_Apocalypse said:It's also nice to see some recognition on this site that being young right now is not so easy. I've seen far too many people dismiss all young people 'snowflakes'.
At the risk of being accused of 'yesbuttery', I do think that being young is always difficult, in every generation. It's the nature of the problem that varies.
When one lacks experience, assets (and often, but not always) earning power, life is tough. I shall spare you any Four Yorkshireman anecdotes from my youth (or my fathers, or his and so on).
In Leamington Spa, my eldest son, who is a 26 year-old graduate, takes home around £1,000 a month. The rent on a one bedroom flat is £600-£700 pcm.
Something will eventually give.
I think you are a long way out on your numbers.
A combined income of 30k in 1992 is worth 75k now (not 45k) on average earnings increases.
https://www.measuringworth.com/ukearncpi/
On a 400k property that would give you a potential mortgage of 350k with the Halifax, which would let you buy pretty much anywhere outside zone 1, depending on the property you wanted.
And there is Help to Buy, 5% deposits etc.
Even on the average London salary each you would have a lot of scope.
But ~25k each in London still puts a 200k mortgage and £250k+ property within reach, and there are plenty of those.
I think we have both made our points anyway.0 -
NEW THREAD
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£150,000 is to £75,000 as £60,000 was to £30,000 (Double the income)MattW said:
I am not sure that it is wise to buy *that* quickly. Primary Teacher in London is 26-28k minimum starting salary.SouthamObserver said:
I know what London-based B2B journos with one years experience get because I employ them! It's £22,00 to £25,000. I am guessing first year primary school teachers get about the same. Between then they definitely don't get close to £75,000.MattW said:
@SOSouthamObserver said:
My wife and I bought our first place in London in 1992 - a two-bedroomed flat, with garden, on St John's Way N19. It cost us £60,000. Between us we were earning around £30,000 - her as a primary school teacher in her first year of work, me as a B2B journalist with about a year's experience. The same place now would cost around £400,000, our equivalent joint income would probably be around £45,000.John_M said:
My daughter is 24. I've first hand experience of how hard it is to be young now.The_Apocalypse said:It's also nice to see some recognition on this site that being young right now is not so easy. I've seen far too many people dismiss all young people 'snowflakes'.
At the risk of being accused of 'yesbuttery', I do think that being young is always difficult, in every generation. It's the nature of the problem that varies.
When one lacks experience, assets (and often, but not always) earning power, life is tough. I shall spare you any Four Yorkshireman anecdotes from my youth (or my fathers, or his and so on).
In Leamington Spa, my eldest son, who is a 26 year-old graduate, takes home around £1,000 a month. The rent on a one bedroom flat is £600-£700 pcm.
Something will eventually give.
I think you are a long way out on your numbers.
A combined income of 30k in 1992 is worth 75k now (not 45k) on average earnings increases.
https://www.measuringworth.com/ukearncpi/
On a 400k property that would give you a potential mortgage of 350k with the Halifax, which would let you buy pretty much anywhere outside zone 1, depending on the property you wanted.
And there is Help to Buy, 5% deposits etc.
Even on the average London salary each you would have a lot of scope.
But ~25k each in London still puts a 200k mortgage and £250k+ property within reach, and there are plenty of those.
I think we have both made our points anyway.
~
Just because interest rates are lower, the fundamental value of the property is still there. Unless people only ever consider... the repayment - if thats the case, and it is the only way I can work out the property market then what happens when rates head back up ?0 -
That was very, very long and very, very worthwhile. Thanks for highlighting it here, I found it fascinating.TGOHF said:Long read by Dom Cummings on how DC and GO blew the referendum (LOOOONG read)
https://dominiccummings.wordpress.com/2017/01/09/on-the-referendum-21-branching-histories-of-the-2016-referendum-and-the-frogs-before-the-storm-2/
"Further, it was clear that Cameron/Osborne intended to run a campaign based on hysterical warnings and bogus arguments/figures while ignoring the big questions about how the EU works and its trajectory. No10 tried to turn the whole complex issue into a question about whether the economy would grow a little bit slower over the next few years – a trivial issue relative to the significance of the overall question. They are not a duo who have ever engaged the public on a serious matter in a serious way."0 -
Even Paul Ryan is a bit too much of a RINO for the present Trump crowdThe_Apocalypse said:
Well it's interesting to know there are quite a few Republicans who don't fit the stereotype. The only contact I've really had with GOPers is online and they generally fit the stereotype to some degree or another. Their views are more closely aligned with Paul Ryan then they are with Colin Powell.SouthamObserver said:West Coast Republicans are a different breed to Republicans elsewhere in my experience.
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This discussion has been closed.